Tim and Sid: Fans stuck in middle of Flames' divisive arena situation
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- čas přidán 12. 09. 2017
- Tim and Sid discuss the complicated and divisive situation in Calgary where the team and city are not on the same page of getting a new arena built. Money, hockey, tax payers, and politics make for a thrilling debate.
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"Public money has been used to build every stadium since 1999."
True fact.. and that is utter horseshit in my opinion when these stadium & teams are owned by the richest people in the country.. and then you go there and they have the balls to charge $25 for a 16oz beer and a pretzel..
I just wanna say when you can have Flames, Canucks, and Oilers fans all united on one issue, keeping the Flames in Calgary, then there should be no question. Both parties need to figure out a deal.
Habs fans are backing this
I think half of the costs should be paid by Ken King. It minimizes public funding, and King gets his money back from ticket sales. If the whole arena is paid off by public funding, then they're just making a rich guy richer.
I'm an Oiler fan, and I think Calgary fan's are great, very passionate. We need Calgary in the NHL. They deserve a new arena.
Kelly Thornton I wish more fans like you existed.
Thank you so much for speaking out, and standing up for our great city and fans! Much appreciated
As an Oilers fan... I wouldn't want the flames to move
Bayver 9729 the battle of Alberta would be gone. 😕😕
Exactly. Who the hell would you hate?
he should hate himself for being an oilers fan duh
As a Oiler fan , The Flames must stay. How else can you have the battle of Alberta 😁😁😁😁
It should be no chance, nothing zero. The public should pay nothing. The A's just announced a privately financed ballpark city is paying nothing. The new Islanders arena will be completely privately funded the Seattle arena will be completely privately funded. Economic impact is always over estimated.
Maple Leafs group is getting 800 million dollars over 20 years just for the naming rights to the ACC, rogers place was built for less than 500 million. not saying the naming right to a new Calgary arena would be anywhere near ACC numbers but when you look at those numbers it does make it hard to justify making tax payers pay for the arena
The Flames don't want to pay property tax, and that's a main sticking point. The Flames need to understand that if the city gives money, they need to be able to get it back, even if it's not a loan.
Thank you Sidney for mentioning the Flames fans ....may not be the loudest fans ..but they've have supported this team since 1980
I wouldn't have an issue with taxpayers' money paying for 1/2 to 2/3 of these arenas if it didn't cost $150+ for nosebleeds, beers were $20, etc. If it was $100 to sit behind the glass and free parking, that sounds like a fairer deal.
I think Nenshi's plan to pay 1/3 of it makes sense as it's part of expanding the Stampede grounds (which is heavily used, even when disregarding the Calgary Stampede which is one of the biggest events in the city). This also means an expanded BMO center which is used for huge events like The Comic Book Expo (which runs at near capacity every year and is getting more and more tourist attention) and the Auto show among other big shows.
The Flames owners want more than a new Flames rink, they want the city to chip in on a stadium for the Stampeders as well, and that complicates everything. Nenshi's vision is of an entertainment district like in Edmonton, and not just a sports haven that is barren on non-game days. Downtown Calgary has this problem where it is mostly dead during non-work hours, and they don't want to repeat that.
So I don't mind Nenshi's offer as my tax dollars will go to something that I'd use even if I didn't attend one Flames game (I'm an Oilers fan so I try to hit up at least on BoA every season though). The Comic Book Expo, the Auto Show, the Bridal show, the Stampede...a ton of Calgarians check those out.
Also, I like this offer because it remains close to 17th Ave (the Red Mile). The Flames ownership want to build something in the middle of no where and it will hurt the city more than help it.
Whatever happens, I just hope the Flames stay in Calgary!!!!
the real timing issue is that the economy just took a big hit. The Edmonton arena was started and financed while times were good, and things declined as it was being built.
To me, the Flames should just wait this out in the Saddledome for maybe 5 more years. The economy should be better then.
Overall, the Edmonton deal was a big win for the city, even with so much public funds. Just remember that even if the Flames didn't exist, they'd still need an arena for other things, and it would likely be mostly public funds in that case.
Oh boy... Sid's NHL in Seattle take has not aged well.
That was awesome Sid.....Calgary loves hockey and if the Flames ever move .....there may be a riot lol .....
jason forward I don’t even live there and I will come over and riot
i've been to the saddledome a few times in recent years. I dont see what's wrong with it? they dont mention in thiss video.
Even if the owner ship will not care about the hockey team the fans will for sure there is a lot of people that like sports in Seattle
Really sad these billionaires taking advantage of Canadians love of hockey by making them pay for the arenas. Greed!!
hockyjocky4 sadly it's not Canadians too.
All stadiums in North America have had some public money thrown in starting in the 1990s. It's horseshit
jonah hoff yeah I should have been more generalized in my response, just the conversation was towards Calgary. Rich Canadian oil men taking advantage like American corporate greed. So sad and makes me angry but if the owners bring a winning team all is forgiven
While I'd love to see a team in Seattle, send the Flames there would be just plain wrong.
The city of Calgary should do whatever they can to keep the Flames. The NHL needs Calgary. Those are passionate fans win or lose.
The taxes collected from the players' salaries go to the provincial and the federal government, the municipal government of the city of Calgary doesn't get a dime from the players' salaries.
26,000 Season ticket deposits taken in the first two hours of the Seattle season ticket drive. Sid's comments about hockey in Seattle sure look dumb now.
Love watching Sim & Tid
#KeepTheFlamesInCalgary
Watching this before the 24 playoff bracket in 2020 knowing the flames are getting a new stadium in a few years has me blessed. Calgary = blessed.
Sid's Seattle mini-rant has NOT aged well.
Calgary should definitely stay put. Sucks when teams move especially for the fans. It's not hockey but there's a great documentary called Sonicsgate about the NBA's Seattle Supersonics move to OKC. It's impossible to watch that documentary and not feel bad for Sonics fans. Hopefully Calgary will get the arena situation figured out.
I presume the costs of those other venues are in Canadian dollars, and not US?
Sid you're wrong about seattle not wanting a team
Seattle doesn't care about hockey, huh?
The Seattle Kraken have entered the chat
whats wrong with the saddledome to begin with?
concerts and other events don't even want to go there, because the unorthodox architecture creates problems. Modern buildings also have an emphasis on luxury boxes, which gives big revenue. I don't see why it has to go NOW, but maybe there's some keeping up with the Joneses going on, and Edmonton's arena is doing well.
Thomas H teams are just whiners....like the Arizona Diamondbacks....they have beautiful ballpark and the fans love it....yet they want a new stadium just because the other teams have them
Utter nonsense from Sid regarding Seattle.
Already confirmed today the NHL is going to Seattle next as the NHL owners want to divide that very pricey expansion fee among themselves.
Seattle will play in the NHL in 2020 and their first regular season game will almost for sure be against the Vancouver Canucks.
QC got the double fleece. Public built arena and an empty promise from Bettman. Ouch.
I think in a place like Calgary it should be 50\50 the team and the city. Paying for a new building. But if this was a Arizona team it would be only public money. Would want my taxes to go up for some thing I'm not going to watch in the Desert.
To answer your question Tim and to put it simply - The answer is no! Public funds should not be used to build arenas for teams that are privately owned. The biggest myth is that sports teams belong to an actual city when really they don't, they belong to the league and the owners. But with all that said do i believe there will be no arena...Probably not, Nenshi is only holding out until the election is over and i believe negotiations will start up again closer to the years end. Calgary will go hard for the Olympics and for that they will need new facilities.
Sid is 100% right
Ok there are die hard hockey fans in Seattle. Don't generalize the whole population down to some hockey-dumb Seahawks fan, some people want a hockey team BEFORE the NBA. Love the show and watch it from Seattle but I didn't agree with that portion.
As a Seattle resident, I agree. I can't stand the NBA, I want the NHL here. Granted, I am a Canucks fan. But still, our city has been disrespected with sports, and it's pathetic. These guys will make excuses for the Senators not selling out, but will disrespect US markets.
Christian C he us Canadian abd don't know better
Proto Man sid is a dumb canuck
Listening to this in 2023 is hilarious. Sid's take on Seattle aged so poorly as the Kraken are killing it in Seattle.
You got that right. He was way off base saying that. And they are getting the Winter Classic next year to top it off.
I do think public money should be used. But only for season tickets holers. The rest no. Because you know there fans. The rest will say they don't watch hockey so why should they have a tax increase to pay for it.. it might not be a lot of money but it's a start
13:11
Tim: "Hey, I watch KING Sports too...."
Sid: "The Q!!!"
Tim: "I watch KOMO too!"
Sid: "KOMO AT 6!!!!!"
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
No.
Everyone saying the public shouldn't have to pay to build an arena is wrong. You go to the games you watch them on t.v. you government can't just give out favours for the sake of giving favours.
Payback plus interest sid. Thats the difference. The nice white spot places? What does that even mean?
Nenshi is the man, hes not giving in to a bunch of billionaires looking for corporate welfare.
calgary fans are great
Public money taxes should not be used for Sport Arena unless everybody in the city gets they share worth in free games , like what is the average person in a city in this case Calgary getting out it ?? Does the city get some ticket revenue?
Wouldn't taxes payed by the players on the team be closer to 25 million as when they play road games they pay taxes in the city they play in?
I believe the city should be paying part of it. Certainly not most or even half, but some. A new arena and a new entertainment district like Nenshi wants is going to bring a lot of money into Calgary. Right now a lot of concerts are skipping over Calgary completely because they don't have a suitable venue. There are benefits to the city here. I think Nenshi is also being pretty arrogant, especially if he wants an entire area of the city revamped along with an arena.
That said, King is being a greedy ass, too. He's disgracing this fanbase and giving the team a bad image. But, I don't think he's moving. He'd be a dumbass to take a team out of a top 10 Market in the League into an unproven market. The Flames make a lot of money. He knows he'll get more money here than he will anywhere he could possibly move to. This is all just politics.
Both sides need to stop being the arrogant assholes they have been and get this deal done. The Flames do need a new rink and I believe both sides want them there. It'll happen.
looking back at this video it is painfully obvious it's as much a propaganda play as bettman telling us who to vote for. That they comment "let's tell the story" but don't mention property tax at all is so disappointing.
2nd
Tim is dumb he kept interrupting Sid
Go the Green Bay Packers route, publicly paid for and publicly owned.
There is no reason why calgarians should pay for this. There isn't anything wrong with the saddledome. The reason that they want a new arena is that they want more high priced lower bowl tickets. I'd rather go see the flames at the saddledome and pay less. Its not sold out every night, there is no reason to replace the saddledome. Let them move the team, we'll get another one. Nenshi is the best mayor in the country, he isn't going to let a bunch of billionaires raise our taxes. Bettman and Calgary Sports and Entertainment are villains in this story and Nenshi is the hero.
So does the city of Calgary pay for Art galleries, Museums, or other such facilities? Because it's hypocritical to be willing to invest in some but not others, especially when the Flames are popular in the community.
rivahkillah art galleries, museums, theatres are not primarily rented out at minuscule rates to for-profit businesses. Let the owners pay for the stadium, or at least most of it as they are the ones reaping all of the monetary benefits.
I could be wrong, but I don't think all of the museums in Calgary combined have received the 200 million dollars the Flames want.
Those facilities need money because they aren't popular with most people, and they get money because the they are popular amongst the upper class. If they were as popular (and created as much downstream revenue) they'd be able to support themselves. That's why it makes sense to contribute. If the city disagrees, then they can't complain when/if the franchise leaves.
I could be wrong, but I don't think that all the museums in Calgary contribute economically a fraction of what the Flames contribute.
The idea that Sports arenas provide money to the community is a myth: archive.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/publicly-funded-sports-arenas-add-little-to-local-economy-report-says-cc9ehcj-201706591.html .
However, I think the city should put arena funding up to a vote and let the citizens decide if they want to pay higher property taxes for the next 50 years so the Flames can have an arena.
The Coyotes won't leave Arizona....the NHL will keep them there even if it's on life support the yotes have had to file bankruptcy twice and the nhl won't get it
Letting the Flames leave would not only be a slap in the face to the super loyal fan base, but removing EDM's and VAN's biggest geographical rivals. It would be pretty brutal for all three teams for the first couple years, finding their footing, and I truly hope this is indeed just a scare tactic in attempt to get the city to budge more. I personally think their current idea of paying for 1/3rd of it is fair, but whatever keeps my Flames in Calgary, man.
I think they should just move to Kansas City. They have a ready Areana just need owner ship.. what will happen is Calgary will see all the money they will lose. And then try to get a team back in. Calgary doesn't know what they have in till they loes it
R&M Gagnon Does Kansas City want a hockey team though?
Listen here for a minute, the City of Calgary blows a lot of money on things that they consider "art" (look up bowfort towers or Calgary Airport ring) BUT the Flames owners want the arena to be like 75% public money or something like that
To me that cannot and will not happen, don't get me wrong, the Flames NEED a new arena but both sides are being pretty arrogant, more so the Flames.
The league has stopped multiple far smaller market teams from moving, there is no way they can justify moving a VERY profitable team with a VERY loyal fanbase to an untested market OUT OF A CANADIAN CITY
If Nenshi is Re-elected the Flames will have no choice but to go back and talk with him, this is nothing more than a scheme to get fans to vote someone else in that will approve the lucrative public funding plan
Katz did the same thing when his plan was initally rejected,for the Oilers new rink he even flew down to Seattle and met with people there
They need to have a plan of getting some public funding but the owners have to be willing to spend more money themselves, its complicated and I have faith that a new building in Calgary will get done
First
Jesse Boston no one cares
Let the Flames move. New owners ACTUALLY WILLING TO PAY FOR AN ARENA will eventually come in and rebrand the Flames just like the Jets. Taxpayers benefit because they dont bow down to an ownership that feels they should not pay for their own business.
calgaryherald.com/news/local-news/a-look-at-canadian-stadiums-built-with-public-funds
Taxpayers were on the hook for $40M of the $135M price tag
I really hope they stay tbh
Flames out first round. Sid is clueless. They got the experience. Sid is a hypocrite. Leafs fans show up and are laughed and demonized by sid, but the flames fans arent?
If you think this is a problem now, just wait til 2028, when all the big market cities are in this position. Congress had better sign a bill that bans taxpayer money to subsidize stadiums. If the original 6 teams could last as long as they did in their old arenas, the rest of the league could with theirs. Those old "cathedrals" survived 2 world wars, uncertainty, the Great Depresssion, not to mention the 60s social movements, civil rights, etc. What have these new arenas been thru?
Sid always chooses a very dramatic view on issues
i don't like the flames
Have you been to Rogers arena? It’s built in a slum! I’m scared to take my family there! It’s full of drug addicts