GCN Tech Asks The Pros | How Do You Choose Your Stem Length?
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 5. 02. 2018
- Pros always seem to have super long stems on their bikes, but how do they choose which length to go for? Do they just choose the smallest frame with the longest stem they can handle? Or do they get a proper bike fit? Jon talked to some pros in Dubai to find out.
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Do you go as long and as low as possible? Or are you a bike fit believer? Let us know in the comments down below đ
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Why do Pros slam their stems? gcntech.co/slamstems đč
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Let us know your thoughts on stem length in the comments below đ
go big or go home :D
110mm currently, but my handlebar has awufully short reach, so it works somehow, but i will change to 120mm soon. 17° flipped of course
Obsession over a slammed stem is silly. Just find the position that is best for you in terms of comfort and efficiency and go with it.
you don't have to be obsessed about it. Sometimes ya get faster simply because you THINK that slammed is faster. Also, one can get used to these crazy setups quite easy. I had a 90mm 7° uprise before that and the current setup 110mm 17° down became comfortable after the 3rd ride
They do say that... 1:50 and 3:50
Bram Tankink - living legend
Niels Heldens and plugging LA, no less!
He must have seen a lot of different stem length suggestions during his 18 years. Conclusion: f**k it.
Yeah legend haha
Bram Tankink, what a legend
I think it is clear that JC is an excellent addition to the GCN team.
Michael McDermott thanks
mathew toplis thanks for your support.
Is that Connor at 7:18, pre-GCN days?
How bout' the dude in the back ground doing hand stands on the cross bars (6:50 mark). Legend!
I went 20mm shorter last week and canât believe how much more comfortable it is.
Same
Fred
so now what is ur current stem length
Just bought a 500mm stem and can't wait to try it out.
Letâs see Paul Allenâs stem.
Lmao đ
You have two top tubes basically
Bram! great response
I have used 130mm. I have looong arms. Then at the end of last year I got bought a Madone 9.9 built for someone else which has a 110mm equivalent (integrated handlebar/stem). It made up to 10% difference in increased average speed and I felt so much more comfortable. I have changed stem length on my other bikes and would not go back to that stretched-out position, Bram (a legend!) made a very valid comment in that I too have also moved my saddle forward meaning my top arms are closer to vertical. I get back in after a long (+4 hrs) ride and my shoulders do not ache as they did before.
that stem length chart assumes that your top tube has been optimized for the rider. With today's "molded" frames the stem length is used to compensate for lack of top tube length choices.
When I had a custom ti frame I used a 59 cm TT and 12 cm stem. Perfect. Today I use anything from 56.5 to 57.5 and I try to make up the extra reach with the stem. I have 13, 14 and 15 cm stems sitting around.
Handlebar reach can also affect stem length. My current handlebar has quite a long reach, so I'm using a stem 1 cm shorter in order to get the same position. Like Bram, I too prefer my seat slightly forward rather than pushed way back on the rails. Great vid!
My 56cm/22" bike came with a 110cm stem. The bike felt small to me (used to ride a 23" frame as a teenager) but the flat cross bar felt an inch too high (oversize aluminium tubes), owch. The seat tube is steeper than normal, so the top tube is shorter than normal; designed for American criteron racing perhaps? In the 1990s I used it for Triathlon, with clip-on aerobars, grip-shift and seat forward, I ended up fitting a 140mm long stem to make it more comfortable and aero. Now (c. 2017-2019), 25 years later, I use the same bike for recreational riding: I moved the new, longer railed seat back, moved the grip-shift to the handlebar end, removed the aerobars and, later, reduced the stem length to 120mm to ease acute neck pain (it worked). I might move back to the standard 110mm stem one day, as closer seems more comfortable to the older me and it feels like I am bringing the bike back into the balance the designer intended.
It'd be interesting to see the data on how tall the riders are in comparison to the size bike they're riding and subsequent stem length. My guess is that most pro riders are riding smaller bikes and stretching out their cockpits to make room.
Could you do a video about handlebar width?
Two years ago I shortened my crank length and found it made a big positive difference when spinning fast, more comfort and less bobbing up and down. Last year I shortened my stem length and found myself for the first time riding more and comfortably in the drops. I think less flexibility or my bigger belly as I get older may have had something to do with it or it may have just been a better fit over all.
Drew Cama I know a lot of fixed gear riders (track, crit, street) use 165mm crank arms, and that helps with getting a high saddle position.
Same for me ;)
Got a Cheap 165mm Crank on my Entry Level Fixed Gear...
As I upgraded the Build and going with another Frame and Parts I tried a 172,5mm Crank because i had a chance for grab them dirt cheap in the neighborhood.
Felt "OK" and a tiny bit better than my 165mm BUT yes.. it was too long.
So I ordered online a 170mm Crank ( same BCD to continue riding my beautiful Sugino Chainring đ ) .
And boy !! THATS the correct length !! On Point !
For the Stem I used nearly the same Method...
The standard on the bike was 80mm
WAAAY to short !!
90mm felt better and I would say it's the best length for All-round use..
But 100mm is for me the best for my type of riding ..
Bit sprinting and beeing in the Drops for long periods of time... Long distance riding on the hoods is better with 90mm but then it feel a bit "wrong" in die Drops đ€·đ»ââïž
I thought I knew my bikes and specs but apparently during some turnover in the fleet I had missed a change in crank lengths. A few months ago I was realizing that my 35 year old Specialized was easier, more comfortable and more efficient, to use a higher cadence and higher cruise speed than my other much newer bikes. The other two have 175 cranks the old bike has 170 cranks. Funny how all the other tech, materials, and modern design advantages washed out compared to simply having a crank length optimal for me.
I can see going for a smaller frame if you want to get lower than slamming your stem will allow but I've never understood the stiffness argument. a smaller frame by itself will be lighter and stiffer, but a longer stem and seat post will be less stiff. I would bet there's actually more flex overall in a longer stem and seat post and a smaller frame than in a larger frame with a shorter stem and seat post.
I think the key here is that pros tend to ride smaller frames than the public, therefore necessitating longer stems. But, whatever is comfortable. I think in regards to putting power through the pedals, that saddle position has a greater effect.
only been riding about 11 years but new road bikes do seem to be getting a higher stack so that most club and recreational riders don't have loads of spacers. Consequently even non-pro riders who want to get the front low have to size down and go for a longer stem. Not all brands and models but definitely quite a few.
I couldn't help but notice the guy exercising in the background during Bram's interview. That upper body strength is superb.
The shortest one that still fits a fully wired 4-Port Junction Box for the Shimano XTR Di2 System - In my case, a 90mm PRO Tharsis =)
Great study, very interesting
I use a 140mm. It's nice if I need to stop a go fishing before the end of my ride.
I'm 178 cm (5'10") and using size 54 bike. At first, I used the standard 90 mm stem that came with the bike. Then I thought it was a bit short because I felt my riding position was too high. So I bought a 100 mm stem. Felt really good, until a friend of mine gave me her 110 mm stem because it was too long for her. I swapped it, and boy did feel way more comfortable. And I can go faster too.
Now I'm curious about changing to even longer stem, 120 or 130 stem.
Go 300mm
Too short go for 130
Can i ask what bike are you riding? And what is your top tube height?
this depending on body length etc different stroke for different folks.
Love the acrobatics in the background at 6:42!
damn aqua blue sport looking aesthetic af with that kit and ride
I'd be curious about saddle to handlebar drop too
I never got a bike fitting stemlengt is personal .morf in to your bike good one j.pat from Belgium đČ
i think an accompanying question that should of been answered with the data would be "how many of those riders surveyed were on bike frames were on recommended sized bikes, and how many were on one or two-sizes smaller frames"
chickenpoodl GMS agreed. That chart with the standard stem length they displayed at the start was pointless to compare anything to as none of them were riding the "standard" size for their height. Kinda makes the question pointless. They probably have the same overall reach they'd have if they rode the bigger frame so kinda mute
yeap, but like dowsett said theyd be higher up and a larger frame weighs more and isnt as stiff! not pointless at all! cav used to, not sure if he still is and well he cant stay on the bike right now anyway, be on a 49 and i believe hes 5'9". at 5'7 i feel super cramped on a 49 with a normal stem but a good solid 140 can make it work!
why do bikefits actualy recomend those big frames anyways? 90% of the amateurs ride way too upright in a mountainbike position
Interesting comments on riding smaller frame sizes to get the trade off of running a slammed stem.
Can you do a segment on spindly length.
Downsized frame and short slammed stem for me please.
Also while cruising I typically place my hands right next to the stem, I actually still achieve quite a good aero tuck on the horns by cramming my elbows into my gut.
Oh, I don't have drops, I'm rockin bullbars.
Anyone notice connor boy at 7:18?
Need stem setup advice... I currently have a 110mm stem with a +6deg setup (as purchased on my Giant TCR Advanced), but have recently purchased a Vision Metron handlebar with a slightly forward sweeping bar (Metron 4D). My son thinks a +6 deg stem looks ridiculous and thinks I need to slam it like his -17 deg setup. He thinks a flat stem, no spacers look is the only way to go. But at 47 yrs old, my back might not be so pleased. Given the new Vision bars, is it OK to use a 100mm -10 deg stem, and leave spacers under the stem to keep my bar height agreeable with my back, but end up with a slightly flatter stem look?
It would be interesting to know the average seat/handle bar drop of pros.
I am on a 60cm Lemond frame and use a 120mm stem. Long legs and shorter torso lol
6:45 That moment when you realize there's a guy standing on his arms in the background.
Does it matter whether youre a climber or a sprinter?
At my 178 cm , my top tube is 570mm , i have a 110 steam but i don't stay confortable, so i go over 90 mm steam.
My general rule is, establish your back angle and saddle setback for power and balance over the bottom bracket, and find a handlebar and stem that puts your hands where they want to be. Now I've noticed many pros riding with almost extreme forward saddle positions, and I'm a little puzzled. These must be the really skinny guys without a lot of torso to support.
I ride a recommended 120mm stem. But I had my frame lengthened instead.
You know your body and the position you feel comfortable in it. Find what is best for you and forget about the look, sometimes bike fittings are wrong too.
So what's the longest one in the Pro peloton at the moment and what is the longest available in the shops to mere mortals?
Good use of statistical data.đ
Great Video
I would be very interested in repeating these for the ladies tour. Interesting to see if they follow suit
The ladies always seem to have their handlebars too wide. Its a bit like the elephant in the room is cycling in the ladies peleton
Good call, do some vids with the ladies' peloton, compare and contrast?
Yes... we have wider bars lol. Same with saddles, typically wider because of wider hips, and we have chests that get in the way
Ladies love their long stems ( ͥ° ÍÊ ÍĄÂ°)
@HenriK Hald What kind of question is that and why are you asking about my body? What does my body have anything remotely to do with my statement- which was about women.
Is the average pro riding a smaller bike today vs. past riders making the total distance from seat tip to handlebar roughly the same? Is the top tube length + stem length relative to rider height the same, longer, or shorter than riders of yesterday?
Stem length seems like a personal question. Seems to vary based on the temperature.
Never, never follow what the Pros do. They are all about aero dynamics and that's not for the rest of us. They ride frames that are to small for one thing. I go by my comfort level and also what will not cause my hands to go numb. Generally my position on a proper fitted bike if I look down at the handle bars with an imaginary line I should not be able to see the front wheel hub, that's with my hands on the levers not in the drops. So most common length for me is a 110 mm. I have use 120 mm in my younger years but I'm more comfortable with the shorter stem now.
Shout out to the dudes with T-rex arms like myself.
What kind of material thatâs yâall clothes made of? If I may ask
These stems are long, but those riders could be riding a frame thatâs 1 or 2 sizes smaller.
I have never quite understood why stem length changes with frame size. Surely the stem length needed will depend where a rider fits in on the reach range for each bike size. I am often between bike sizes. If I choose the smaller bike size I would need a longer stem to get my correct position not a shorter one and if I picked the larger frame I would need a shorter stem not the other way around. If my ideal reach (frame + stem) is 475mm I could pick the smaller frame with 375mm and fit a 100mm stem or the larger frame with 385mm and 90mm stem. Instead the stem options will be the other way around. I think brands should supply shops with stems unattached so they can fit the right one. You would think it should roughly workout.
Conor Dunne @7:18! Doubt he had any idea he'd end up at GCN himself đ
I just use what they say on the bike fit who am I to question someone with 20+ years knowledge. Also fair play to the guy behind bram doing the leg extensions upside down đđ»
Depends on how many vertebrae one has.
That's what I'm talking about!! Love some good tech. I thought the trend was for riders to have a smaller sized bike? Odd seeing so many 56cm.
Trifit racing they must be tall chaps
I believe - according to a GCN vid - Chris Froome rides a 53cm frame. He's 6' 1"!! I ride a 53 and I'm 5' 9".
Stem length is only one part of the equation... handlebar reach as to be taken into account. If they have ergo, classic or compact handlebars... it changes the reach, therefore the stem length
If they ride smaller frames, then seat angle would get steeper and top tube would get shorter. So thus you would have to move saddle back, in order to keep the knee in same position relative to the bottom bracket on a smaller frame then when sitting on a larger frame bike. Feel of bike would change as more weight is over front wheel on a smaller framed bike with longer stem.
Yes it's because they are long and low, but they also put their saddle as far forward as possible. #MatginalAero/PowerGains
Stem length mainly depends on your arm/torso length relative to your legs length.
I have extremely long legs and a rather short torso, so, combined with a Caad12 which has a long top tube, I have to use a 80 mm stem to control my steering.
So you have wrong frame size. You need smaller frame
Kalookaloo kaloo In case of a smaller frame my seatpost would have a ridiculous length.
Well, in summary, The Pros like them long and stiff.
Still most people like Sagan. Clearly, it's not about length, it's about what one can do with it.
@@koko-lores that's what people with short stems say
@@ProWeAreSo đđđ
Also, the old "fit" traditions assumed that you had to breathe properly first and then arm and back comfort came next. After a generation of wind tunnel testing it has been validated that where you place your arms is very important if you want to go on a flyer and stay away. Therefore a lot of riders in the peloton not only experiment with TT bike positioning but they also find better results by erring on the side of a longer cockpit. Not exactly Boardman's "superman" position but successful for the same reason.
Check out those acrobatics behind Bram Tankink, impressive!!!!
I seem to recall from a previous GCN video that Steve Cummings runs a 17cm, 17 degree stem.
Yeah but he's...nuts
Nice one
0:29: 2 and a half GCN presenters in one shot!
Does the data suggest that pros are riding frames a bit on the small side and compensating with longer stems?
I'm seeing a lot of 140mm stems but most companies only offer 130mm........ please let me know if I'm wrong. I would like a longer stem with integrated bar/stem.
No questions about angle ? Only Adam B. said that he has -17° . I have 120 mm with -12° angle on a 54 cc top tube. Next q&a : seat angle within the peloton. Ciao !
Me sentindo inspirado a trocar o suporte de guidĂŁo de 100 para 110mmđȘđŸđ€©đđŸđŁïžđŽđœââïžđ„đ„đ„đš
you cant change canyon stems right?
What size frame is it?
6:17 you know its life!! " that momentan when stel length Gould change the life of some individuals
I must be the 1% with a 45mm stem length, 49cm top tube.
Freud would be happy watching this :)
bram tanking ,,, the funniest pro rider !!!!!!
Years ago? How many years ago? In the era of steel frames when TT length was custom the average stem length was 100-110. Occasional 120 and nothing above that.
I run on 121.5mm stem on my F10. I wish..
perfekt stem length is a bit shorter than when your back and neck hurts.
Ianis Caratti Exactly I even have a 14 cm -14 degree drop stem on my commuter, but then again Iâm 194cm.
daAnder71 what?
What if I already have a short stem(less than 50mm I think) and my upper back and neck still hurts? What should I do? 52cm top tube and 50 seat tube, I'm 5'7. But my drop bars are 440mm, I'm thinking of getting a 400mm or 380mm drop bar hoping it'll solve the hurting problem in my upper back and neck. Else if not then I'll be getting a new stem(100mm)
@@renrewheisenberg7634 get a bike fit
@darkrainne 679 Thanks for your input but I changed my dropbar to 400mm and my stem to 100mm +7deg and installed it on my bike, the pain I'm encountering are gone and just appears after riding 100km+ which is I think is expected when compared to my previous setup which I'm feeling the pain after just a 60km ride.
One thing I noticed is that the guys that chose a longer stem appeared to also ride a smaller sized bike.
I imagine most non professional cyclists could watch this and conclude they are using too short a stem, but I wonder how bike sizing differs from professional to non professional riders? It seems the pros use longer stems because of their frame size choices, whereas most non professionals are probably sized to a frame that is more suited to them. I ride a 56 frame but have a 90mm stem, any longer and I feel stretched out and it irritates my lower back, but at 6ft tall I do feel my stem seems too short!
I think you should put 10mm and move your saddel forward. If you use 90mm then your size probably is somewhere 175cm / 54cm frame size.
Good to see that you checked a large set of bikes rather than the GCN unscientific usual of 5
When Jon measured the stems, did he notice that the 3t stems measured +5mm compared to their listed length? I know my 110mm actually measures at 115mm. Are there any other brands with a similar issue?
My 120 is actual 125 3ttt doric team.
My 3T stem is 100mm, as advertised.
Guy in background at 6:55 experimenting with a few different positions..... #isthatcipollini
54 cm top tube and 110 mm stem for me.
150mm with -7°
He must have one hell of a long pair of arms
Or a hell of a tiny stiff frame!
or he is just a poseur?
It was -17°
or bike is 3 sizes too small
the frame is short less weight
We can't keep our handlebar straight all the time so any tiny movement will travel longer distance than a straight line. A longer stem requires more circumference to turn 1 degree than a shorter stem so it would draw a smaller zig zag line than a shorter stem.
How about for mtb? I'll use my mtb for road only(criterium)not for the mountains...
Iâm still waiting for someone to say, âitâs not the length of your stem that matters, itâs how you use itâ. I mean, it doesnât get teed up for that joke any better than this....
7:20 mark. I just noticed thatâs Connor! Whoah đł
I wonder if their non race bikes, personal bikes have the same set up?
10MIL Phil they probably only have their race bikes
it really depends, but he was right in saying a lot of pros only ride the team bikes. so for training theyll have the same position. and for the most part theyll prob keep it similar across the range cuz theyre used to being in that position, but when they retire they typically sit up a bit more
I've had huge problems with my position on one of my bikes until I went from a high 120 mill stem to a slammed 70 mm stem, which is insanely short, but for some weird reason it works for me on that particular bike. Before I tried to lift and slam it, moved the saddle back and forth up and down - everything to no avail. Interestingly the frame should be my size (I've got a triathlon bike of that size and it works great with a longer stem - the usual position is very different though).
Most of their bars has small reach so the stem can be long isn't it?
Im so glad and I havenât noticed till this time of the year. My Uncle whoâs with the Trek Segafredo group pic âwearing red jersey at the very left of the screenâ and im shocked that heâs included in the GCNâs Content.
Show us those sandals!!!!đșđ»
I always though girth was more important
random handstand at 6:12
7:18 future GCN presenter in this time :D
Conor Dunne!