Are we (collectively) stupid? | Brett Hennig | TEDxLakeComo
Vložit
- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- On the stage of TEDxLakeComo, Brett made a compelling case that by randomly selecting their representatives humans can find smarter collective solutions for the problems in their community. We will only achieve true progress in collective decision making when we manage to root our decisions on empathy and understanding of other people’s problems through an informed dialogue, in search of a truly common good.
Brett is co-founder and director of the Sortition Foundation, a body that promotes the adoption of random and layered selection in the choice of governments. He holds a doctorate in astrophysics, and he wore a wide variety of hats: He was a taxi driver, software engineer, social justice activist, math tutor. After spending years defining discouragement in civil society and political organizations, inspired by the trilogy of political philosophy of Michael Hardt and Antonio Negri, he began to look for forms of network democracy. His book, "The End of Politicians: Time for a Real Democracy," is "a book for visionaries" and "a powerful criticism and a provocative alternative."
This talk was given at a TEDx event using the TED conference format but independently organized by a local community. Learn more at www.ted.com/tedx
"In all the universe, across all scales, from atomic to astronomical, I have never seen anything else as amazing as the sheer extent of human stupidity" ...
- Ultimus Of Asgardia
LOL
Me neither..
stupidity is a greater force than gravity ...
you don't think stupidity can crash planets as large as mars at a speed of 15 kilometers per second. Do you?
@@selimvergili7001
Humans: _makes device that can crash planets as large as Mars at a speed of 15 kilometers per second_
If you've ever worked in retail, you'll know the answer is yes without even watching it
Nevermind that, if you've lived for over a millisecond then the answer is yes without even watching it.
Amen and rude its exhausting my dad used to say "don't go around making everyone else miserable "
if you've ever left the house even once and or had a 5 conversations 😂
THE SMARTEST PEOPLE ISOLATE THEMSELVES FROM SOCIETY TO SOME DEGREE
Absolutely.
I don't blame them!!!!!
This is incredible, I believe that everyday, wherever we are, we must get together and have projects, to help our community, and then grow that community into a better world.
Here is the problem: there will always be more charismatic people good at rhetoric and argumenting. This means than even in this assembly, people could be manipulated, specially if they don't have a lot of background information on the subjects, or if they are not used to debate. Therefore, in the end people in the citizen assemblies will follow the best speakers' ideas in the exact same way as we do with the current democratic system. To have a fair understanding of today's challenges, we need experts that are specialist of the subject and not random people like me that know nothing on such subject. We are the people and we are not aware of all the information because this required a large knowledge, a lot of work and a lot of time. Also as human we are not better than others and we will always think about our condition first. Our decision will always be biased whether it's in a citizen assembly or to vote to elect a president.
He talked about that struggle in the in depth steps of how it would work. He referred to professional in the a certain field will inform the civilian Senate so they have all the knowledge to discuss and provide their answer without being swayed by one leader.
He keeps saying it's been "successfully implemented" but doesn't give examples nor how those areas are performing overall. That would help to see if truly there strength to his suggedtion. Otherwise this is not a case for but a idea suggestion without evidence. He is basically talking about a jury....but that doesn't come out fair either. there is to many variables. What if we find ourselves limiting performance because of a large circle of uninformed thinking they know but more going on how they feel but now in that random selection leads to a decision that becomes dependent on a sample that may have insufficient knowledge. there is no perfect system but inevitably even in this we will still find ourselves with similar problems. Bad decisions. "I'm not going to talk about it but it has been done." Wtf? That's playing with people's feelings with a bit of truth to make them consider something without a full picture.
This is the reason functional democracies have check and balances, to protect people against themselves. In fact, the main struggle of democracies is avoiding that their people destroy their own freedom.
@@giyuu9929 What happens if/when the assembly cannot come to an agreement?
Don’t even need to watch it. The answer is yes
Right!
You are so sure and safe in your propaganda! I mean you don't even have to Think anymore at this point right? Kudos to You!
Funny enough he is his own evidence
@@jimsherwood9639 Probably the wrong use of the word propaganda there, son. Sorry
Noah, you didn't miss anything.
Did he just spoil the end of GoT?
GoT?
@@kintamas4425 Game of Thrones
Was thinking the same!
I would have rather have just heard his summary of the ending than actually watch those episodes
Wow. This completely changed the way I look at the way we can govern. I never even knew there was a system of government that was structured like this.
Never heard of jury duty? It's kind of a lottery.
you have not taken into account how difficult is for average people to understand information and even more difficult it is nowadays to get a coherent explanation of their thoughts. It is my experience as university professor for many years
Given the freedom (to think) a diet affords its likely a sufficient amount of education can stabilise the system to be worth the try.
Me: Scrolling down the recommended
Also me: Every recommended is a TEDx talk
Again me: Cannot stop adding every video to watch later
Sadly me: Doesn't know what to click after the recommended videos stop loading
Wow, we need to to this! Replace elections with sortitions!!!
Way to go!! Those who benefiting under the present system wouldn't be happy if this Sortition system gained ground ...
I would like to hear Jordan Peterson's ideas about this
And the average intelligence of the citizen assembly will be an IQ of 100 as it will follow the standard normal distribution. (Half of them will be below that.) This puts them at a disadvantage relative to the politicians, who will be significantly above average in intelligence to have got where they are, and cunning with it. So the citizen assembly will be easily manipulated by arguments appealing to emotions and prejudices, and incapable of understanding the kind of complex arguments they would need to understand to make sound decisions. So, good luck with that.
My take could be criticised based on the fact that the public in general are allowed to vote, after all. There are no educational requirements for voting. (And none for politicians, for that matter.) Nor do I propose that there should be restrictions on voters. But nevertheless, maybe the poor ability of voters has to do with the mess we are in.
And why is that ability poor? Because of poor education. Why do schools not teach critical thinking? Because it is to the advantage of the politicians, and the teachers' unions, that they do not. So that pupils can be more easily manipulated, distracted, and kept compliant.
fully agree!
Hm. Power-hungry people of 180 IQ (and probably sub50 EQ) in office for 4 years and mostly working for themselves OR 100 IQ (and hopefully 100 EQ) people who aren't in office long enough to a) get used to (and become drunk by) being in power b) to make decisions only in their favour and put their friends in key positions. I don't know about you, but I would rather try something new than what we had until now... (which has worked so well, right?)
well politics is not a binary system where you either manipulate or get manipulated, people may have less IQ points but they can collectively stand for themselves. People with lower incomes might have lower IQ points for not having as much education, but they are the ones that will vote for accessible universities for example, so the system yields results for the majority of people, not the people with power
@@ggyshay7687 If universities would be tickets to power, then you would be right. Sadly that's not the case at all.
We need more Independent thinkers not parrots and mere Followers who just want to get positions of influence and suggestions.
Don't forget the part where the primary motivation for heating the planet to our own extinction is for a ficticious thing of value that we call currency.
Capitalism is eternal slavery that creates bigger imaginary numbers to the one percent bank accounts to the distruction of the planet.
Yes.
Thank for coming to my TED talk.
This man is actually on to something! One of the best TED talks that I've heard in a while.
On something. Communist manifesto.
I am all alone and clapping - I have been working on a social media project on similar lines.
Hey! How about we collectively agree that Weather Modification & "Rogue" Geoengineering are a real bad idea. First step is understanding that both are long ongoing (an ungoverned) practices.
Jim Sherwood good to see an aware person on here. 😊
Very true. This aussie commie doesn't like the idea of waiting for a decision though, he honestly thinks that random collectives of people making decisions will somehow stop us coming out of the ice age. 🙄
I can tell you why that is. Existence is pathetic and wanting to survive takes stupidity.
That damn Information step is so susceptible to human fuckery though
Bravo. This is the same principle behind juries. Sortition is the way that they are elected, then they get filtered for partiality. Without impartiality, the process is contaminated and sectarian interests dominate.
Although this is the most democratic and the most probable way of arriving at good collective decisions, it is not infallible and juries continue to be necessary when collective force needs to be used.
Those sortitioned assemblies need to be recycled often to prevent corruption and the information "fed" to them needs to come from all sides of the issue to be deliberated, otherwise the results will be tilted towards the perspective of those providing the information. You can bet that the usual suspects will try to tilt the results in their favor.
A very interesting and smart idea! Great delivery by the speaker
The idea is nice but the speaker is a trainwreck. Bad voice and feels like he is about to cry
I'm not joking he is my uncle
My name is John Hennig he is my uncle
The speaker touched on this, but the most difficult part is figuring out how to choose unbiased information to give to these stratified elections. Misleading media is part of the way of life in this society, and if you let the government decide what information is being presented, then you have defeated the purpose of the citizen's assembly.
On the surface this seems like a good idea but it's certainly not perfect, as this system can easily be corrupted at many stages in order to manipulate the desired result.
A good observation, but one that might also be made about elections.
@@NajwaLaylah Agreed, there is no perfect system for democracy, it's all corruptible.
Naaa just make a robot president
It is not perfect but it is better. As we move along we figure whats better
@@robpalwrites You can just make a rule that everybody who is selected is not allowed to get money from companies or other donations.
It sounds pretty good, in fact in a way is like before, citizens can actually take important part of the decisions
It isn't so much about collective decisions, it is about determining immediate Vs long term threats. Humanity is extremely good at dealing with short term threats but is totally hopeless at dealing with long term ones. I believe this comes about because of our roots. It only mattered for survival that you recognised and dealt with an immediate danger. If you survived enough short term threats you probably passed your genes on to the next generation and then it didn't really matter what happened to you. The way our minds have evolved is all about short term decision making. We have never had to deal with long term threats in any meaningful way until now and we have not (collectively) got the kind of minds that are good at solving problems that are years or decades in the making. The one thing we need to respond to in terms of elections is the entrenched oligarchy, the trouble is, the vested interests of the rich are all tied up with the current system and they do not want it to change.
I'm glad I decided to watch this. Amazing video I agree with what you're saying. I'll look more into sortition it sould like a great idea
Kind of agree. Though you'll have to educate those random people on all relevant topics if they are not already educated, even if by "experts", and then the ones who make the educational tools/chooses experts will have the real power. So it's sadly not that simple.
Sounds like a jury in a court of law.
Except in USA its called a jury of peers. Technically that should mean that a doctor on trial would have a jury of doctors, and a murderer on trial would have a jury of his peers, more murderers.. facetious, I know
if you put constraints on the random selection, it's not random anymore
there are not equal amounts of men and women or young and old
and those that would go to the meetings most likely have different (maybe very different) opinions than those that won't
you'd have to force the randomly selected people to go to the meeting and say their opinion
in the end, no human reign was actually good, and this wouldn't be any different
If you've been in a city or a public restroom you know the answer immediately.
Mindful stupidity is REAL stupidity!
While i appreciate the analogy of game of thrones, those guys laughed at the idea of democracy as a ruling system in the final episode 🤣
I'd love to see this working in practice, although when you talk about random sampling followed by making sure there is an equal number of men and women, the latter means it is no longer a random sample, it is an adjusted sample to ensure adequate representation across a spectrum of diversity.
I quite like the citizens' assembly concept. In the US, replacing elected politicians with such a council would require a handful of amendments to the Constitution, changes which the current elected politicians would never support. It could be done by a convention of the states, but even that would be hard to accomplish because states with powerful, senior, experienced idiots in the House and the Senate would not like giving up that leverage.
The stupidity is believing there is such a thing as a collective decision.
According to Einstein, yes.
He also told us everything he knew, so how qualified was he really? However, he was right in other instances. If you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree it will live it's whole life wondering what's wrong. Or something of that nature.
If you want to improve your health, if you are sick, if you face a life threatening decision, what do you do? You want to gather people around and vote on it? Or, you leave the decision making to professionals? To me, it is just too obvious. I recommend to make such decision making as a true scientific profession.
Guess which country is already doing this? Have you seen the results? Some times, your "firm" believes are holding you/whole country back.
Daaamn!!.. That was kind of a revelation.. Sooo many problems solved just like that
Also really ashamed as a greek that I had to learn what democracy is by a ted talk..
That question is rambling in my mind for a long time. Thanks for that TEDx
Thank you for this 🙏 It needed to be said.
No one would agree to breathing polluted air yet we all do, proof of collective stupidity and incoherence. If we are to save ourselves from ourselves sorition is the way it will unfold! Thank you thank you very much!
Please give with English subtitle
Dear Razaul,
together with the TED Translator community we are working on this. FYI all subtitles for the 12 talks of TEDxLakeComo 2019 are ready, but publishing them takes time.
Thank you for your understanding!
Best,
Roberto
on behalf of TEDxLakeComo
Dear stranger!
The English subtitles are available as of now.
really solid talk.
YES. I work at the airport
Watching the 2020 election in the US rings so true with what he is saying here
I don't think this title is the best way to introduce what he's speaking on. Because his focus was less on stupidity and more on history, politics, and social economic/social interactions. Intelligence was a a good talking point regarding climate, but other than that seemed somewhat out of place, to me at least. I feel a better title would be "Elections are not the fair cornerstone of democracy we think they are, " or something to that note
Yes.
He mentioned that this has been used over and over again and has worked. Where?
Really interesting talk!
the most capable should be in office, not most cunning and not inexperienced.
Yes we are.
I like this guy!
Yes!
We manufactured stupidity, it critical thinking being taught as a basic responsibility for being human and having intellect? NO. Even hear he is mixing greed and total lack of empathy for stupidity, both things need to be delt with because both are extremely harmful.
All I have viewed in 2019, proves stupidity overpowers intelligence.
It is when intelligent people manage to avoid being wiped out by the seething masses (and leaders seeking to maintain their power) who see their ideas as a threat, that great breakthroughs are made.
@@dakrontu SIR ISAAC NEWTON was a GOD
He was also genius to keep his work secret to avoid getting interfered
Any statistics to compare average utility of decisions made by "sortitions" vs "elections"? So far it sounds like an unproven call for a leap of faith, faith in some magic sortitions.
@YoshiPeach Mario You still did not provide a link to prove your claim that sorties decisions "on average" are better.
@@MathAtFA
Becourse the quality of the elections to compare them to varies a lot.
Switzerland has much more representative results than North Korea and both hold "elections".
im pretty sure that human stupidity fuels the expansion of the universe
we're talking real talk right here
True step forward thank you😃
A step forward off a cliff, maybe. Sortitions don't stop us coming out of the ice age. We should be accommodating climate change, not thinking arrogantly that we can engineer it without far worse repercussions.
Well corporates are more responsible rather than average people
Nice topic
An important point he should have stressed - properly done, this would ELIMINATE POLITICIANS! As a sociological aside, I wonder what those poor bastards would do. Would we have a sudden influx of bogus tradespeople?
About time honestly
Great idea! Surprised to hear that sortitions have already been employed in many places in the world. I agree that such an organ needs to exist, at least (maybe at first) together with democratically elected people.
*_Y E S_*
Yes
Yup.
Politics and religion. Get rid of those two CULTS and humans might have a chance of advancing to being intelligent species. Maybe.
Ted Talks are an open forum for ideas as long as you believe in global warming. Also you must mention global warming somehow with in your presentation.
This is a great idea. One question.
What is the ideal ratio between the number in the citizen's assembly and the whole population?
Thumbnail made me think this was Jim Gaffigan.
We are witnessing depopulation worldwide
Not in Africa...
Good
You see dead people?
My 6th sense says otherwise.
the answer is clearly yes.
the question is why?
Without seeing/hearing anything, the anser is YES
TRUMPED (I saw this NY license plate)
How can we overcome TRUMPISM and save the USA from destruction?
Perhaps this video can help. Can we have IDEA CONTESTS on saving us from TRUMPISM?
=========================================================================
How many from eu here?
Were all believe it or not on a...idk a collective “wavelength” that’s all I can say
Yes. Next Ted talk
Humanity are zombies who believe everything on the television and think they are free thinkers
If we had to judge by Ted Talks, probably yes...
As above, so below ... Engage! 😉
It's very nice 👌 👌👌 👌
"intelligence ignorance!"
The world shall not Burn, 1000 years after teh second coming, it shall be tera formed by GOD for us, the good and saved
No views and 30 likes
CZcams'S DRUNK AGAIN !
Shower me some love ❤️
How about we try to make this a THING ?
¿Cómo aparecen los subtítulos antes de que termine de hablar? No veo que siga un guión predeterminado.
Ameno
Yes...
yes. thank you.
Aristotles was murdered by the stupidity of the system he supported. Hence Plato had quite other ideas on governance..
25/12/19*** Very interesting; Now Iknow I'm in the correct dirention of where This Human Kind of Ours is Going, if We don't start Wking up of the"Brain Wash" We all in this Planet are been put. Rich..rich...Greed...and all for the Just a couple of Hundreth Billionaires Owner of the Planet Earth. What a World... There will Always be Miser, Poverty and so on undefind social clases the are been growing out ofAll this Fu:;\=king Politicians and Billionaires Owner of this Planet. But then, there is the Such call Democracy the Platon, teacher of Aristotles, new it Was Something very Complicated among the Humans.
Clearly thumbs downed by the 116 rich people watching who want to continue exploiting the poor.
100% support the citizen assembly ... but how will ppl leave their jobs ?
Our jobs will soon be mostly gone anyway.
This is something I've been saying for years when armchair philosophising. It is a little bit terrifying, until you remember by whom legislation is currently done. Another idea, to help ensure more capable selection - in the first round, the people selected receive a form on which to list say, 3 people, who they know personally, who they believe are capable of making the fairest, reasoned decisions. Then you send invitations to people from those responses, maybe anyone who is mentioned multiple times, something like that.
That high pitch in the bg is so distracting DX
You're right, but it only lasts 1 minute. We're really sorry :(