The REAL Difference between Stock and FACTORY Bikes!
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- čas přidán 28. 06. 2024
- Enjoy this behind the scenes tour from Anaheim Supercross as we explore the real differences between stock and factory dirt bikes. We talk with Supercross / motocross legend and Factory KTM Team Manager Roger Decoster, longtime time technician and mechanic for Marvin Musquin, Frank Latham and Jacob Price of the Madd Parts Kawasaki Privateer team to get an explanation of these factory and heavily modified Supercross racing machines.
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I started crying at 13 minutes in. That my fur l first motocross hero right there, Roger DeCoster... He traveled the world back in the day showing MOTOCROSS to the whole world. I'm 62 now and have been his fan since I was 15.
As a former top journalist for Cycle News and MX East, I've interviewed Rider many times. I still have the Trans AMA flying I asked him to sign at the 1979 Unadilla Trans AMA race, "Never give up."
He asked me, "What eez zis four?" What is this for?
"Inspiration!" He smiled and signed it, NEVER GIVE UP, R.DECOSTER.
I'm like the little girls who cried when they saw the Beatles even I see Roger, I just want to HUG HIM and tell him THANK YOU for being the hero you are and for giving a Black kid from the burbs a reason to live, a role model to emulate, and hero to try and become like.
BRAAAP 💪🏻😎🏁😃💪🏾
I raced from 1988 to 2001..road raced 1 year an then switched to motocross our stock bikes were junk in the 90s...i retired but got to ride a 07 honda 450 CRF stock....an just laughed at how much power it has...2019 i heard most pros say that their 450s had plenty of power they just made minor tuning adjustments start modes ...changed the power map for low or more top...but factory u have know their suspension is dial a lot better...but light weight...exotics....saving 15 pound off the bike really feels like a lot
Really appreciate you showing us the different kinds motorcycle racing Jack. Roger De Coster was my hero in the 70s. I had his poster on my bedroom wall.
Same here, then it was Marty. RIP.
These modern motocross bikes have incredible engineering and it is so good that you are featuring these on the channel as well
When comparing the newer Stock bikes to newer factory Race bikes, they're much closer in performance than were the old school bikes of the 80's-90's. I raced my 1981 Honda 750F in the AFM for two years with only 70 hp, while the HRC factory inline 750's made 150 hp. When I got my Pro card, I had to make a change because my 750 was really slow. But, in 1983 when Honda began using the VFR 750 Interceptor, I bought an over the counter HRC factory support inline 750 engine.
Different than the HRC factory engines, the support engines didn't have a dry clutch or dry sump oiling but the power was still amazing... but required a change in riding style.
Top speed at Willow Springs went up from 144 mph to 175 ..and the bike would always strain for rear grip ..while raising the front tire.
IMO all these guys should be forced to have an even playing field with these bikes.
@@markalan4026I think the premier class should be open like it is now but the lite class should be 100% stock or have open classes and stock classes
Roger is looking great! Best riding I have seen, ever!! Thank you for great memories Mr. DeCoster.
A True Legend for sure. In 1979 I watched Roger on his Suzuki at his home track Namur in Belgium, he was untouchable (untill he got a puncture ) He had already won his 5 Championships by then, but was still the coolest looking dude in his riding gear and his style.
Cycle drag my favorite channel now you are touching on the dirt bikes awesome work man
I started MX as a kid of about 9 on a Hodaka Super Rat. I was raised on a very large ranch/farm in S. Idaho during 60’s, 70’s until 81. I made it to 250 expert class on a KX250. Loved riding dirt bikes but, joined the military for the next 21 years. Two years ago I bought a KTM300XCW and love being back in the dirt. When I was a kid I had my heroes…Lackey, Hannah, Howerton, DeCoster, Bell and always wanted to try super cross and had a sponsor for several years as an expert but, never got to ride with my heroes. My body feels all the years of motocross as well as the life in the military (21 years, four Navy and 17 Army) but, would not have changed any of it. 🤙🤙🤙
Sounds like a hell of a life. Cheers to ya
Roger is so humble. His is the only autograph that I possess.
I had the privilege to see Roger DeCoster riding a factory Suzuki at Elkhorn Lake, Wisc back in the very early 70s( ish) It was him and two other euro teammates . Suzuki buried the competition that day . Of course , as always Roger was “ fast and smooth” . Roger DeCoster truly is a legend 👍
Very good interview. Good questions asked.
Roger D...the man!!!!
****Suspension suspension suspension****
that’s what really separating the top teams from the rest. You can but a factory bike but you will never get your hands on the personalized suspension that the top riders used
Great job Jack! Keep up the great work. That was some really good stuff there!
Thank you for watching! I’d like to see you tear up the woods on one of these KTMs. Let’s go to Daytona!
Easiest way to explain it is that it kinda like going to a Tailor shop and getting suit made just for you. It is going to fit better and made with better materials.
Thanks so much. That was one of the best and most interesting videos I've seen in awhile.
There’s a photo of Roger on the wall of my shop. I took it at the Trans AMA race in Tulsa Oklahoma in 1971. I guess that makes me old!
Decoster was my childhood hero, living legend. The 2 most important parts to racing motocross are the rider and the suspension.
i think there is more to it than they'll ever tell but who knows. nice video bro.
Cool detailed video, would be cool to see more like these with other motorsports.
ALWAYS quality vids from cycledrag🤟💯🇬🇧❤💪🇺🇸
Excellent video brother Jack. Up close and personal with the top teams and The legendary Roger Decoster. Great stuff 👍👍
Roger still kickin it, I remember he was pretty much unbeatable when he came to America! ;)
He's a legend !Thanks so much for watching. Who is your favorite motorcycle manufacturer? Please share this video with a friend who loves motorcycles.
Roger towing the company line - "it's just the suspension . . . . . Classic! There isn't one damn thing on that factory bike you can buy off a shelf. Hell, even the fork guards are likely made of some element derived from the excrement of a leprechaun. Truly great seeing him though, he's looking great!
I agree with Jacob Price about MxTech suspension. I had FastLap Suspension do my suspension and had MXTech huck valves and compression adjuster's installed and couldn't be happier. Also gotta give Steve Hollingsworth from FastLap huge thanks because he is incredible and works tirelessly to get your suspension dialed in. Phone calls, text's, email's he always answer's and treats everyone the same be they trail riders or racers. I'm also not affiliated in any way with FastLap, I just think they deserve all the recognition they can get. I was at the point of getting rid of my 450s and getting less tiring bikes and Steve wanted to set-up my suspension first and I'm so glad I did that. Yes you still have to get in shape but suspension setup correctly makes a huge difference. I realize everyone wants the big,well known companies.But you are sacrificing one on one support and customer service. I know because I did the same thing before I used FastLap. Give em a chance you won't regret it.
Awesome Video this is what I'm talking about
Thanks Jack your always busy whether it's Knobby's or Slicks your showing us the tricks .
Wow,scored an interview with RD👍
From Sweden great overview Jack👍
Thank you! What do you ride?
A while back Roger D was simply referred to as THE MAN
No one seems to want to give a straight answer. I'm from PA as well. Steeler fan for life.
Wow the bikes have changed over the years, they look so nice now! I still love the bikes from 30 years ago, they have their own look of awsome:) Love your channel Jack and thank you for the hard work you do:)
Thanks so much for watching! What do you ride?
@@cycledragI did ride and still have my baby, old 300 KTM MTX, my knees are shot, can't kick start her anymore:(
@@brian70Cuda invest in a new one, they all got eletric start, not to mention how much more advanced overall they are. be safe bro
Great Job Bro
I LOVE Cycledrad IS THE BEST EVER ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !
Blush! Thanks so much for watching. Who is your favorite motorcycle manufacturer? Please share this video with a friend who loves motorcycles.
great video
Now I know what factory bike is.. Anyway good video and information about factory bike and stock bike 👍😊😍🔥🔥🔥
The BEST interviewer in the business, now apparently in all cycle disciplines. Great stuff man, keep it up, I like all of your content. I learn things, feel like I get an "insider view" at times, and pick up on your enthusiasm for the sport.
That is much appreciated! Blush. Where are you watching from Greg?
What an outstanding video… The edit on this is great. #Videogoals
Thank you very much
I was so impressed with this video that I subscribed. This is my first time watching your channel and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I would have to agree that suspension and weight (do to the trick parts) would be the biggest thing. Yes, testing, testing, testing is huge as well. Thanks for the great video/interviews.
Great Job Jack. See ya the drag strips this Summer.
Looking forward to it! Thanks so much for watching. Who is your favorite motorcycle manufacturer? Please share this video with a friend who loves motorcycles.
@@cycledrag I love Hondas. But gotta cheer for Cooper and KTM.
The bikes need to be made very loud. Loud enough that when they come off the line it’s breathtaking. The other thing is they need to make the power in the high rpm’s so the bikes have to scream and not in the low end. They way they are now it just seems like their cruising around the track relaxed and we want to see the bike on the ragged edge. This is what the fans want. It’s very important to reach the kids and the sound will attract the kids. They have to sound like racing machines and not lawnmowers
this years A1 will be my first sx race, my first mx race was in the 105 degrees at fox raceway when eli won the championship at the last round
Great overview, thanks Jack!! Maybe i'll see you in Daytona!
That would be awesome! Hit me up! Thanks so much for watching. Who is your favorite motorcycle manufacturer? Please share this video with a friend who loves motorcycles.
@@cycledrag You know i have a soft spot for the blue guys, Yamaha and Sherco!
Love the off-road bike content
When teams are changing oil to look for metal content between race days means they’ve FULLY engineered the motor. #Facts
I do that on my corolla. Lol
Look at the Deegans and why they put up such a stink when Hayden's bike was claimed. 9000 for a show room floor bike and 60K worth of mods in an amateur class...NOT FAIR!!!!
You're a loser still talking about it. You probably think it's all in the bike too. Even though he just beat out many other factory bikes to get on the podium.
No kidding…Yamaha did that kid dirty
'Cept the bike wasn't claimed...Deegans will never live that down.
@@outlaw7x77 which is perfectly acceptable given his engine builder orchestrated the whole thing, learned a valuable lesson about people using uou in this industry.
That was his bike he kept racing for awhile and it was in the next day or two he needed the bike to do some more races. And they didn't have a backup race bike for him. So from that perspective I get it. All this extra hassle for what?
They have cnc machines and the Fork Fluid has a tube with holes they can make the holes as small or Large as the rider is pleased Engines are Bad Do a roll on drag with a showroom Bike The factory bike will leave you in the dust ? They are not going to Give up any info .
I remember back in the 1970s factory guys working out of a van and the rider was helping, no showers between motos no trainers I think factory riders are spoiled now and the privateers are trying so hard to make it
Basically the difference is fancy expensive parts.
in mxgp the bikes are prototypes
After seeing the fuss Yamaha and Deegan made over the claim of Deegans factory bike, I don't but thus. If the engine was stock, Deegan team wouldn't have said parts weren't available for it. The engines are just as
modified as the rest of a "factory" bike.
Do they have works bikes again? I thought they did away with factory works bikes
each bike has to be worth north of 250k if you factor everything, once dialed they can reproduce it lot easier........more so its time spent customizing it for each rider.........imagine if you had technicians and tuners spending months tuning and adjusting your bike to get it perfect, still wouldnt be much faster, but for sure alot more comfortable, lol......sending your suspension out to get tuned would just be considered a baseline setting......than tuners take that and dial it in further to get it perfect
You should have a ride on One of the bikes jack
Starting in 1986 the race bikes had to be real close to the factory bikes. This was mandated by the AMA.
What’s that for a handle bar on musquin bike? It’s really high
"$9 beers at at the stadium" actually cost $17.50 LOL
17:00 The problem is that it is the law of diminishing returns, the first 10k you spend will make quite a difference, the second 10k less so. by the time you are on the 5th 10k it makes hardly any difference. Some teams can afford to and will spend that 5th 10k whilst others just cannot afford it. It has always been this way in motorsport. A few years ago I road raced F1 sidecars, it was the same back then, its very annoying when you are giving it 110% but someone just seems to breeze past you on the straight because their engine is worth more than your whole outfit! Being "not that far back" on lap times at best means that you finish second, and as we all know second place is just 'first loser'
At the end of the year, after my friend won our class championship, he finally let me ride his bike. Pro circuit did the motor and suspension on his yz125. I had a cr125 with pro-action suspension and bolt-on motor parts.
I was never more impressed with a bike than when I rode his. Power everywhere, smooth suspension, no vibration like mine, good brakes (about he same as mine), a complete package. It made going fast easy.
No matter how fast or improve the bikes the teams always find a way to make them better these people need to work in the development team at KTM for the production bike
How do the teams get higher compression ratio's for there race bikes???
Theres a reason why theres rules like the claiming rule for the sport and everyone who races. That would suck having to race against a bike thats twice as powerful as yours and suspension worth more than 2 brand new bikes. If there werent rules like this wed all be racing with big big bore kits and motor swaps.
These bikes have 5 grand worth of suspension mods done in house. Mostly the weekend warriors have to send their suspension out. Most amateur guys will waste money on graphics and shifting levers.
Susspension would be the main key . brakes are fantastic stock .
Would Supercross be better if everyone had to ride off the showroom floor stock bikes?
Yes but when they race/test modified parts they eventually flow onto the basis of the next production bike.
They cannot tell you that.
Muquins mechanic should be called "Easy Frank"
What town in Pittsburgh are you from? S hills here...
What was that it looked like a concrete pad to me but I doubt it was concrete?
How do KTM raise the compression ratio OF THE FACTORY Bikes
I wanna Kno who the hell is factory spec brand? Anyone. Ran into some pretty good parts but haven't a clue who makes them
as everyone here told you there is no difference between stock and factory mx bikes ...the technology peaked out about 40 years ago jack right after the ama limited the suspension travel
Come by Paul lees put in Phoenix ask for Nick Holm so I can meet you please!
Mike iaconelli of motocross
so basically a factory bike has all the improvements that a stock bike is shit at doing well , like suszuki suspension or cylinder head upgrades or maybe stronger pistons who really knows , i once talked to a mecahnic who built james stewarts yzf back in 2009 and the things he mentioned like lighter buckets cams waterpums anything making the motor revv and so on
$15-20k he’s a little out of touch! 🤣 Especially on the 250 side! Just a stock bike with MX-Tech suspension is $17k.
Full Exhaust, clamps and clutch puts you at $20k easy on stock engine 450. Mod 250 engine plus little bits like ECU, engine hangers, skid plates, start device, footpegs, Ti bolts, tires, bars, linkage, on and on, etc.., etc.. you’re EASILY REACHING $35,000. And that’s just to get to one race!
Hell, a full set of graphics + plastic and a pail of race fuel is $450+, but when you’ve never had to buy them every weekend… you wouldn’t know that 😂
Had to turn off no 2 stokes
Humans are insane. Instead of allowing any mods (that would lower cost so much) they say hey u can do everything aslong as it's still a 250/450 🤣🤦🏻 we could make faster bikes for waaaaay cheaper but obvi that wouldn't be an advantage lol so they make super technical rules so only expensive ass factory teams can have the advantage due to massive revenue pumping into r and d it's so corny what our sport has become. I love it but politics ruined motocross straight up
My question to Frank is why shouldn't the sport insist on stock bikes. Shouldn't it be about the rider?
Whoah! $15 to 20 grand?!! That a whole lot of money!!! Ask the winners purse...lol
I'd say the amateurs are like that for the most part. Put once you get the factories involved, forget about. There isn't a part they won't touch to gain a competitive advantage. A factory bike is valued at over $100K for all the one-off parts.
Kinda like how he hesitant on naming stuff that in bike they are no we're close to stock bike I have a stock 450 and we rode a fully race 450 pro bike power totally diff so they are very diff
Mx was so much better in the 60s 70s and 80s. No where near the money involved.. more talent had a chance. Less rules. Riders were the mechanics. Tracks were more natural and rougher. Just a different time . And far better watching in my opinion.. get most these mx guys in the woods and they just can’t hang. And the bikes I’m riding are 40+ years old. Funny to watch a guy spend 7g on a brand new 450 and I rip him on a 86 Yamaha tt350.
I bought my son a used factory ktm 250 ,it was owned 12:27 by Troy Lee Designs .It's #25 Ryan Martin practice bike.Marvin Musquin name was on the shocks tubes.Any idea of the worth....
That mechanic position would suck: on one end, ya got a whole bunch of political shit making changes and the other end, dealing with a hormonal rich kid that throws a tantrum anytime something doesn’t go his way. These are blanket statements though. Of course one could lucky and have a superior who genuinely cares and a rider who’s deeply appreciative for their blessed position
They shouldn't have bullied that young man that brought his money and the rule book
mechanics avoiding every question, no new information here
Closely guarded factory secrets will remain just that . Not getting any info. It would be nice if youtube would recommend videos made in the present day.
About 10000 dollars.
Cool video, factories are for sure tight lipped, but tbh they got one of custom spec parts internal and as usual the ignition and the endless justabilites with map tuning wich sure privater can get good versions, but Yeah the factories unlocks features a mortal would die for, but Yeah they need it because their riders is on top, anyway Roger is honest and cool, but if there is one thing that 450f has that is trick is the conrod in that engine, (Pankl) probably the trickest thing they have, r&d that has gone into those is next level Formula 1 level.
But one thing that is interesting, many factories has through time outsourced their main program, such as Star Yamaha, privater effort with factory support, those guys choose whatever they prefer the engine, break lose thos ties the japanese may have not allowed their riders to use because they have constrictions on certain relationships with sponsors, supported factory teams can pick and choose whatever company they feel have the best part for the job.
So a factory team might not always be the best for the best riders if they feel limited with trying parts outside the box.
But yeah custom transmission, cdi tuning, custom ti footpegs, factory forks, custom spec engines + spec fuel. Bits and pieces that definitly sets a factory bike a part. But the gap is definitly not as huge as back in the two stroke days.
Anyway solid video, this is stuff people want to see and know more about.
Why so secretive about bike builds. It’s just a piece of metal and a machine .
Competition
More pictures of bikes and there parts instead of people as we know who your talking to.
hellyeah
Thanks so much for watching. Who is your favorite motorcycle manufacturer? Please share this video with a friend who loves motorcycles.
$$$$
Big Time! Thanks so much for watching. Who is your favorite motorcycle manufacturer? Please share this video with a friend who loves motorcycles.
Well that revealed absolutely nothing about the difference between stock and factory. Just blah blah.
How a mechanic can be a liar...
Unobtainable parts
Are wheels lol we don't care about wheels we want to hear about the motors flat out lol don't beat around the bush talking about wheels lol
"Dude....pop that gargantuan blackhead in your right ear!!!!"
The stock frame rule is not what it might seem. They can add material to strengthen certain areas but cannot remove material to make it lighter.
in the new interview with own roczens day he actually says chase sexton was using tim gaisers mxgp frame in outdoors against tomac . kenny wanted the frame but only chase got to ride it . check it out .
@@jacobshred67 Ya I saw that. I figure they are adding material in some areas to strengthen the frame and limit how much it flexes . Teams shouldn't give one rider something and deny it to others riders in the team . Why wouldn't they want all the riders on the best they can give them.
The audio suck. Can’t hear shit. But basically we all know it’s the suspension .
These 4 strokes are time bombs when you start messing with them