Let's Overanalyze Mask Maker
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- čas přidán 30. 05. 2024
- The Mask Maker has been avoiding my videos for a while now, but their time is up. Hopefully I was able to make some sort of sense in this video. A lot more speculation than usual.
Link to script:
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Translate this video into another language through Amara:
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Video Chapters
0:00 Spoiler Warning
0:10 Introduction
0:54 Who wears a mask?
1:51 Masks and Sentience
3:58 Quirrel comic
5:26 Mask shenanigans
6:04 Original mind destroyed
7:38 King's Brand and Shade Cloak
9:58 Mask Maker and Void
11:49 Conclusion - Hry
10:16 Big whoops here. The black particles that can be seen here can be found in several rooms in the game, including Nailmaster's Mato's hut and even the stag station in Dirtmouth. This was serious tunnel vision on my part, so sorry for that. I still think the void is involve. But these particles are not a part of it.
Maybe if the particles are smaller there is less void, if they’re larger there is more void
Actually, that doesn't mean these particles aren't signs of void. Remember, Confessor Jiji refers to your shade (and possibly to the void as a whole) both as a "darkness" and as "stains of regret", meaning that void itself could possibly have some connection to the regrets of bugs. And here's the thing, while this could be written off at first as her misunderstanding the nature of void, once you pay attention to the fact that she can manipulate the stuff to the point of grabbing your shade from anywhere in the map and fast travelling it right to her hut, it's clear that she's on to something. This would kind of explain why the Palace Grounds and its surroundings, which were once lit up with soul, are now almost as thick with void as the abyss itself. Not only that, this would also explain why not only Mato, but also Sly have a few void particles floating around in their huts, since if there are any bugs in Hallownest that have a lot of regret in their past, it's them. I don't really think that void 100% the regrets of bugs, as Jiji would put it, but I do think it has some connection to it, which is why some characters with notable past regrets have small amounts of void around them even though they don't actively use it.
Mask maker and Mr. Mushroom have the same eyes
I know this is late, but I wanted to point out that the mask makers limbs are the pure void black. As far as I know, no non-void bugs share this trait. I think the mask maker is actually similar to the hollow knight in nature, but the mask maker was created by the ancient civilization instead of by the pale king. It would make sense considering they "worshipped the void" and would need some source of sentience (the masks) to create a proper civilization
Edit: sorry, other bugs DO have black limbs, but the mask maker's seem to be thicker than most if not all of those other cases. Other bugs with that much thickness in the limbs have colors
@@augustovasconcellos7173 Is it possible, if void is actually a little everywhere, that the Pale King did something horrible in the Abyss so it would fill with void in order for him create the knight? And it would keep filling everytime he discarded a child due to failure? I mean... We need the Kingsoul to reach the Voidhearth... So... Or maybe he did something terrible elsewhere, which created the Voidhearth and he later brought it to the Abyss?
"The egg inside the Temple of the Black Egg"
So... the Black Egg?
No the yellow one!
@@olirougelikesundmehr4257 o okey
@@CatShapedDonut O-okayyyyyyer!
Eggception
Nah the one inside the temple
I always thought it would be cool if you could go to him and change your mask. You know, like a little customization shop
Add little accessories too!
As fun as that sounds, an important distinction to note is that the vessel’s head isn’t a mask, it’s a shell. This may seem like semantics, but it’s actually a pretty important distinction. As we can see in the death animation and the game’s “true” ending, the shell is actually a sort of container for the void that the vessels consist of, like all of the Pale King’s other creations. While their are other variations that vessels can have for their horns and such, it’d get pretty muddled on how a transformation like that would even be possible or what that would mean for the game’s lore. It would also kind of go against the mask maker’s whole deal of giving masks to bugs who don’t already have faces and such other circumstances like that.
@@raggedymuffinz well the mask could just go on the shell for real. And if it is just a shell, then it's not really a face...
Thats in hollow knight 2
Would be cool if you could at least decorate your shell for a head. Like a few markings and designs to make yourself distinct.
"...she (no eyes) seems like a reasonable woman"
She literally had her and all her followers rip their eyes out to prevent the infection. Seems about right.
She might have been on to something, almost every time you talk or dream nail someone who is heavily influenced by the infection they talk about a Light and how bright it is. So maybe No Eyes though that would be spared of the infection if they could not see the Light.
@@zero69kage I mean
Her and the eyeless corpses aren't infected so... she might be right
look, it seemed like a good idea at the time, okay?
seems legit
She and her followers died of a plague separate to the infection, didn't they? Unless they're using two different words to refer to the same thing here.
Elder bug younger than Hornet?
Mossbag, you can’t just say that and immediately move on. I need more d e t a i l s
It will be a 15 part series, don't worry.
Maybe Elder bug is a species, not an age. The're all born elderly.
Manored that’s not possible cause in the early stage of development you can see the young elder bug
@@Zotemann If its not in the game anymore, its not canon =)
Maybe Elderbug’s kind just have shorter lifespans.
12 min is the perfect amount of time for me to wait for my delicious meal from Domino's Pizza.
So...how was it?
@@DanielGonzalezL He said delicious, clearly he has food-related precognitive powers.
@@ManoredRed seems logical to me!
Domino pizza is clearly the secret behind Team Cherry's intelligence.
False. Dominoes and delicious don't add up
You can't overanalyze my waifu
*_older than the elder bug_*
@@nomanshell2529 age is just a number son
That sounds like a challenge.
@@nomanshell2529 The fact that Elderbug was born after the fall of Hallownest and is already an elder, while many characters older than himself are still young, is an interesting tidbit of information when you think about it. It seems higher beings/powerful bugs live much longer than ordinary bugs, perhaps forever.
Maybe he aged faster because he spent his live outside? Like, most creatures are living underground and they're in some sort of stasis, so maybe Dirtmouth, which is on the surface has survived the stasis and all the bugs in it are normally aging? That wouldn't explain the eternal night, but it may be worth some thinking
I think that it’s possible that masks are actually not what gives bugs sentience, but what helps sentient bugs differ themselves from the mindless ones.
Good theory
Yeah, Cornifer and Iselda do not wear masks and they were definitely sentient before coming to Hallownest. Furthermore the Mask Maker says he helps the ones without a face, not everybody.
@@TheJadeknight7 they both have 'faces' however and are presumably naturally sentient bugs (being as they come from a place far from hollownest so can't derive their sentience from the paleking). As the mask maker says not all bugs have faces, implying that some do. So the mask maker just makes masks (ie grants sentience) to the bugs that do not naturally have it.
I mean all the bugs look exactly like a member of their species so the masks would differentiate themselves
That makes sense. The bugs in deepnest all wear masks covering some fairly ugly faces. The same goes for the godseeker whos face most likely looks like the faces of the creatures in the land of storms in godhome. It seems that most creatures who wear masks use it to cover their unappealing appearance.
I believe the bugs in the colosium of fools are all masked, due to the hunter's notes for the Battle Obble. He writes "They have crafted a tiny mask for it! Is such an extravagance practical I wonder?". If they would go to the effort (or "extravagance") of masking these mostly docile and seemingly mindless creatures I assume they do so for all combatants.
That's a very interesting observation! Thanks for sharing
Maybe that's how they control themselves, even when infected.
Yes
I think the extravagance was specifically for the tiny bug like why make such a small mask for such a small bug and not for all the masks
@@thecrimsonaxe6037 Hm. Come to think of it, Sly appears to have no mask on, and is starting to turn in his hut as you first meet him. He has masks in his shop, but never put one on himself. The other Nailmasters, though, seem to each have masks, and have remained safe from infection, although they’ve also moved to very remote locations.
On top of all that, your life meter is increased by collecting Mask Shards. It kinda makes sense, then, that the Mask Maker is so busy making all these masks, if the Pale King had arranged for Hera to aid the kingdom in sealing the infection. Perhaps the knight’s “shell” actually is a mask, designed to contain void for the direct purpose of giving it the focus to hunt the Radiance. “Void given focus.”
It also seems rather important that Quirrel never puts Monomon’s mask over his face; only on top of his head like a helmet. Has Monomon never had the mask until Quirrel delivered it? Perhaps Monomon, slumbering inside a sealed tube full of acid(?), didn’t need the mask until it had been ready to break?
Furthermore, the Nailmasters shout “Queso!” as they teach you or prepare to fight you. Perhaps this is a reference to Milo’s affinity for cheese in the historical recreation movie, The Mask, starring Jim Carrey as himself.
I think rather than sentience, intelligence would be a more apt term to use. Boon showed sentience outside of Hallownest without a mask, but not much intelligence. The bugs are all sentient, but with the King's influence they became far more intelligent or even civilized. It brought together and gave culture to bugs that usually wouldn't stick together in nature, and without that it most likely would not have even become a kingdom to rule. Idk, just throwing stuff out there I suppose.
I agree with your interpretation about what they mean by "mind".
Yeah the lore tablet says “mind expanded” so the bugs already had minds just not as developed as they were with the kings help
Its kinda vague since intellect leads to sentience
I'm late to the party, but _"sapience"_ may be the exact word we're looking for.
_Sentience_ is the ability to perceive/react to sensations/stimuli. Speaking technically, all animals have sentience.
But _Sapience_ is the ability to think and reason and reflect upon decision. You could say it is interchangeable with intelligence, but I think the meaning of the word "intelligence" is more subjective. You could argue an octopus is "intelligent," yet lacks sapience, since it functions purely on instinct.
_
This is all semantics, though. I think we're all on the same page that the Pale King gave bugs the ability to act beyond base instinct.
@@Graphomite Yeah that's definitely a better word to use. I was thinking of reasoning and things like that but couldn't think of a better term at the time. (Of course anytime I forget a word and try to recall it I come up completely blank and it is erased from my memory forever lmao)
I love the animation for the mask maker. His long arms and his endless crafting look stunningly great.
Demented Duskull
he looks like the collector
@@Zotemann right
i dont think mask maker has a canon gender, so it would be their.
@@bread5795
Hmmm
@@bread5795 can we just not do this
I interpreted the masks as helping bugs “without face” tame their instinctive nature on their own, like Midwife, her true face is revealed when she is overwhelmed by hunger.
"It's more of a metaphorical thing, like when you say "break a leg" or "I don't have any STDs" " omfg that cracked me up
elsv ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Honestly the best hollow knight youtuber
It's not a contest, but thank you!
Along with perpetual noob and the superforge
Honestly, I thought he is the ONLY Hollow Knight youtuber.
SuperForge is Trash honestly
i dont know about the perpetual noob
Verulean is cool too
I think the Maskmaker's commentary is a bit more metaphorical-- the masks don't necessarily have a literal magical effect, but in crafting a new face for those "without", it grants them a sense of identity, a center for them to base their identity on. To wear another 'mask', another identity, slowly erodes your ability to remember and return to the person you used to be.
There seems to be a repeated theme of the 'recognized self'. The Hollow Knight was chosen as a vessel because the Pale King perceived it as empty, but it failed because there WAS a unique identity inside, despite being made of the Void. The Pale King only chose to shed his Wyrm form and become 'like the bugs of Hallownest' because he recognized them as having potential, and then granted them sapience and craftsmanship in exchange for worship. Others, the Spiders and the Mantis Clan, rejected the Pale King and were outcast from the City's civilization, their intelligence unrecognized by those within its halls. The Midwife refers to the spiders as the most intelligent species of bug, despite the comparable achievements of the City's bugs. The different species each see the others as foreign, unrecognizable, inferior, or dangerous-- or all of the above. The Radiance only caused the Infection because she was forgotten and abandoned, and sought to be recognized once more. The Grey Mourner says she was rejected by the Traitor Mantis Clan because of her 'other-ness', though what that specifically meant is left ambiguous. The White Lady, if you return to her after having unlocked Voidheart, says that she cannot tell if the Knight feels triumph or hate over what it has learned.
The disconnect is in recognizing other forms of intelligence and emotion. The actions you can perform as the Knight-- saving bugs, meditating with the Swordmasters, delivering the Grey Mourner's flower and carrying more flowers to other characters-- are clearly acts of kindness, not necessary and not self-serving, but still the White Lady and everyone else sees your literal mask and calls the Knight stoic and unfeeling, because its 'face'-- its mask-- does not change.
Wearing a Mask like the ones the Mask-maker creates would give a bug a recognizable Face in the style of the White King, the Knights, and the White Lady-- white, with dark eyes. Maybe that would be the only way 'lower' bug life could have their intelligence recognized. Additionally, a mask is literally a way of 'wearing' another identity; maybe for those without distinct identities, like a bee or a minor grub, wearing a mask would give you an identity you can focus on, an identity that is comprehensible to the 'intelligent' bugs around. In gaining that intelligence, however, you would lose whatever priorities and sense of self you had before-- a grub previously only concerned with food and shelter may no longer be content with that, etc.
In connection to your Void theory, it's possible that the Mask-Maker is also something born out of the Void, an intelligence that tried to give itself shape with a constructed identity in the form of a Mask. Maybe it now thinks it's better off for it, and tries to spread the masks around, but it only works for some bugs. I'm not sure.
Great comment
It is a travesty that you have not yet overanalyzed mosscreep or mosskin! What the hell, mossbag?
"Time is convoluted in lordran"
"Time in hallownest is weird as *FUCK* "
7:32 Quirrel avoids VOILENCE
this must be a large part to the lore, please look into Quirrels inability to say VIOLENCE
Does it require sentience to say *violence* correctly?
He avoids even the correct spelling for violence, thats how much he wants to avoid it. Thats dedication, good on you Quirrell my man
voilence sounds like violence but british. IS QUIRREL BRITISH?? holy shit /j
QUIRREL CANONNICALLY DISLEXIC????????? 👀👀👀👀👀👀👀👀👀
I literally made and ate a bowl of cereal so I could watch your video in a comfy mood. Love you mossbag
What a wholesome comment.
As opposed to figuratively?
Nope Nope I imagined making mine
Eat your cereal
@@thunderlemon6876 He uploaded. I will now commence cereal consumption.
I don’t think the masks LITERALLY grant bugs sentience. It’s more like they give poorer or less intelligent bugs an identity. They must wear a mask to blend in with the other bugs. They won’t lose their mind without a mask, but rather other bugs can finally see them as they truly are without one.
1. I feel like if the masks give you an identity, it would make you distinct from otger people instead of blending in
2. But I kinda agree on the "identity" thing. If masks are for the faceless ones, they're a replacement face, an identity, something to stand out for the mass
Well good to hear that HK isn't over for u
Never!
hornet dlc
@@spiritdorkrai5741 Ha ha
@Spirit Dorkrai DLC? No, it’s a game now!
@@PlayMorePlease game? No, it's the reincarnation of goddes radiance herself now!
When I first saw MM, I thought he was a way to change your mask to another shape, like a character customization option, and that you could spend the rest of the game looking like Zote.
I was deeply troubled.
6:03 I believe that this dialogue is in reference to the Hollow Knight. "To conceal ones face fully within another" refers to the Radiance being concealed beneath the mask of the Hollow Knight. The sacrifice is that the Hollow Knight goes insane but as we can see from him assisting the Pure Vessel in his own defeat, some of his own will still shines through. Could also be referring to Radiance's ceasing to exist until someone visited the shrine at the crystal peak, allowing a sliver of herself to gain a foothold in their mind and spread once again.
I have the same opinion
Nice one. "Those of striking will may still retain a sliver of that concealed self". This is how the hollow knight still retained a small sense of identity, when he tries to weaken himself during the fight and when he helps you defeat the radiance in the end.
vessels are agender so dont use male pronouns for them
@@bread5795 lol
@@bread5795 they don't exist🗿
Oh, by the way. On more than one occasion, the Pale King is stated to have 'prescience', or knowledge of the future. The Fungal Wastes hive-mind throws its lot in with the Pale King because it trusts this ability. Yet even still the King fails at what seems to be his goal. The Radiance is not contained, Hallownest is reduced to a ruin of wandering husks, and the King himself seems to have perished. So the question remains: Why? Was this the outcome he foresaw? Or is this all within the bounds of his plan? Do his machinations stretch so far into the future that we couldn't possibly comprehend?
Many questions indeed.
I believe it was all part of his plan and that everything he did went accordingly.
Well, in the end his vessels did 'defeat' Radiance, so... (and I think he is not dead and his corpse is just his hollow shell)
"What good to foresee what can't be avoided?" dreams the mushroom. The Pale King postponed the return of the Radiance, maybe he foresaw as far as the Knight vainquishing it? Wyrm knew that his kingdom would be destroyed, and he knew almost nothing would stop it. But his prescience told him how to contain the Radiance. You can see that across Hallownest, Wyrm didn't spearhead any other try at resisting the infection, apart from the vessels (the soul sanctum was created long after)? Wyrm did what was best, or rather the only thing that could prevent the infection. And he also knew that he wouldn't be able to prevent himself from bonding with Hollow Knight, hence creating a way for the Radiance to infect it, that is why he had so much regret in his throne room. But he knew that one day the Knight would come and finish his job.
His machinations lay undetected for years.
Or, y'know, maybe he lied.
I've never clicked a video so fast. Love you mossbag!
agreed
Great name I loved that game
I hated this video.
Soul Master why
Because it’s mossbag.
Maybe the Mask Maker himself *is* a void creature? And he is actually wearing two masks, one you knock off and another that his void-y being is seeping through
i dont think mask maker has a canon gender, so it would be themself and they.
@@bread5795 Nobody cares
Random thought, but could it be possible that the mask maker resides in a prototype of the black egg? Left unfinished when deepnest refused to become part of the kingdom?
I was under the impression the black eggs were an ancient kingdom thing not a hollownest thing. Just something the pale king used (like most of the void tech) not something he invented.
Imo it makes more sense the mask make has been living in that thing since well before the pale King.
@@CM-db5cg i think the temple of the black egg is the corpse of an ancient beeing, therefore older than hallownest, we don´t know about the egg itself tho
was so excited to see the notification, a great video again!
even though we might not get some coherent explanation to a mystery but discussing it is still fun~!
My guess for that whole "Is Hornet older than Elderbug?" thing is that the sealing spell on the Black Egg included a sort of preservative magic to keep the Dreamers from just up and dying in their sleep from dehydration/starvation, but it accidentally leaked out into the surrounding environment and put a good portion of the underground parts of the kingdom in stasis. Time passed normally, but those living down there didn't experience a whole lot of change to use as a reference point; no day/night cycle to count days or months, bodies don't seem to decay as quickly as they should (though you could chalk it up to bug anatomy being different), and bugs like Hornet didn't age as they should. All they know is that it's been "a long ass time" since the kingdom fell, but Elderbug, who's not subject to that stasis by virtue of being up in Dirtmouth, feels time like it should.
It'd certainly explain why Emilitia, a noble-born socialite who probably hasn't cooked or cleaned for herself her whole life, is capable of living alone and sealed off in her home without wasting away.
Hornet _is_ a demigod though. Maybe that's the reason?
This actually gives a lot of weight to the Radiant difficulty Void Idol, and the other name of the God of Gods, Void Given Focus. Based on this, maybe the King wanted to give the Shade a goal without giving it "enough" sentience so that the Radiance could corrupt their dreams. Ironic that the Void took its own focus as it grew in tune with the gods.
It's also very cool that in the Lord of Shades ending (base game true ending), the Void absorbs the Radiance, completing the stasis the Pure Vessel could not, and that in Godmaster the Void destroys the Radiance outright.
the base game ending where you defeat the radiance is called "dream no more"
*DEFAULT DANCE*
is... this a heart?
Yes
No
6:41
It may also be meant philosophically, if you hide behind a persona for long enough you may forget who you were all along, the persona becomes personality. In pretending to be someone else you'll forget who you were.
want to hear something sad?
mossbag has no one supporting him on patreon
become a certified sucker today
EDIT: We have done it, we have a whopping 5 patrons. This is truly amazing.
Sucker?
>sucker
Nice Freudian slip there.
😱
@@Godzilla-se8in Not sure if I should direct you to mossbag's patreon page and risk getting r/woooosh ed
Jack Wu woooosh ed, my favourite school.
Hi
Hi
Hi
Oh hi Mark
Hi
Hi
if you look closely, you will see that he paints the masks with the white color. The mask are made of VOID.
Richard Douglas mossbag subs are so quick to pull out the v card
( but actually this is a great idea)
I honestly think the masks are just a traditional thing for some of the bugs cultures. You mainly see bugs of the same type and same location wearing masks which shows that it could be culture based. Also alot of the bugs in deep nest where masks for defense showing that it has other purposes. Also bugs in deep nest such as the midwife use their mask to hide their true appearance so that also might've been a purpose for the masks.
The second I thought about rewatching some of your other hollow knight videos I saw the notification pop up. Your hollow knight stuff keeps me playing the game
When I saw the line “to focus” my first thought was the focusing mechanic in the game. Like, I’m pretty sure it’s a given that the mask maker made the masks for the knight, and all the other vessels too. So maybe the mask has something to do with the knights soul abilities? Or the ability to focus?
And it also seemed like to me that the mask maker was made out of void, possibly another construct like the collector. But then it wouldn’t make sense how it leaks like that. Idk
Anyone: *What's this game all about?*
Me: 05:12
I kind of love how well the Mask Maker's speech parallels the philosophy of Emmanuel Lévinas. For Lévinas, the recognition of a face is what establishes one as a person and an agent who bears moral responsibility for an other beyond oneself.
Cheers for the video, interesting as always, but one thing to point out.
On the matter of concealing a mask within another. Maskmaker is fairly unambigous on it being the inner (concealed) face being destroyed.
This leads to two interesting possibilities. Perhaps the shell serves to dampen the ferocity of the void (it does seem quite aggressive after all). This could explain the shades hostility against the shell.
Or perhaps this destruction is why emptiness is so imperative for the vessel. As to not overwrite the void it is meant to hold with its own identity, and thus give the radiance no purchase.
Also, when you first encounter the Radiance, she's disguised as the goddamn sun. I think its pretty obvious that there's a connection between her and the sun.
Notice how it always seem to be night on the surface. This might be because the sandstorm perpetually blocks out the sun, or because the devs didn't see reason to implement a day/night cycle... but it could also be because the literal sun goddess has been sealed away and as such there's no sun anymore. It fits thematically because with the sun absent, there's no way to tell the passage of days. Sealing away the sun goddess is indeed sealing away time.
In fact, the infection looks a little like a decomposition process, with bugs gradually breaking down into an orange goop as their minds unravel. Maybe there's some overlap between the infection/Radiance and the simple passage of time. Nothing lasts forever: in time every living thing dies, every mind goes senile, every building crumbles, every Kingdom runs off the rails and falls to ruin. Which is a problem if you're a god wanting to live forever and build an everlasting kingdom, aka the Pale King.
What if the infection isn't exactly the Radiance's doing, but rather a kind of backlash for attempting to defy time? The Pale King essentially attempted to give eternal youth to himself and all in his realm, in time this unnatural state of being started to fail catastrophically: bugs went insane from living too long, their bodies broke down violently from trying to function too long, forming the orange goop.
Aka, the Radiance might not only be the goddess of the sun, but also the goddess of time. There's a connection between the two, since the sun has always been humanity's primary tool for measuring the passage of time.
This could explain why so many strong bugs seem to have lived such long lives, spawning the Kingdom's entire history: whatever the Pale King did to "stop time" is still sustaining their lives. But unlike most other bugs, the're strong enough to withstand the "backslash", at least for now.
I'm not saying we all interpreted the lore wrong, rather there might be yet another layer of meaning to it... this game's amazing.
I just love your videos. Your calm voice in combination with your humour is quite unique and really entertaining
OOOOOOOYYYY!
There's a third egg! It's where you find hornet for the first time in greenpath, and there's a vessel in there too! There may be more, but this seems to be important. It's also worth noting that all of the most powerful creatures wear masks. The dreamers, quarral, weavers(if midwife is anything to go by).
Nosk's chamber has what looks like a black egg nestled into a small inner chamber. It's where you get the pale ore after your fight with the spindly thing. Makes you wonder if Nosk is like a Vessel gone horribly wrong or something.
@@IronianKnight Interesting, I'll have to check it out. I get the feeling that Nosk is just using the knights form, but he certainly may have found it in there.
That could also explain why Hornet 1 is significantly weaker. Being weakened in the egg, combined with her holding back and the Knight being surprisingly powerful, wouldn't exactly lead to victory.
OY!
Hornet 1 isn't weaker because of the egg, I think-it's unreasonable to assume that all eggs make non-vessels or non-void creatures weaker. I'm almost certain Hornet Protector is just holding back.
The Mask Maker is flipping fascinating. My own theory, as (briefly) related here, is as follows:
The reason the Mask Maker is in Deepnest is because it served the previous civilization of Void-worshipping bugs, long before the Wyrm crashed into the far edge of the kingdom. It is (or was) the primeval source for masks/intelligence. Then the Radiance and its moths came, and trashed the Void. It forbade the Mask Maker from plying its trade, wanting to keep power and intelligence only disbursed among its followers (i.e., the moths). This would explain why the Seer is so regretful when she talks about the Radiance - the moths were Radiance's clique and got all the best stuff, and still turned their backs on her when the Pale King showed up.
The Pale King shows up and imprisons the Radiance, using his own power as a buffer to stop it from retaliating. He may or may not have made use of the Mask Maker immediately, but given mossbag's explanation, I would imagine that masks were something of a luxury for bugs at this point, as long as the King was there to smarten them up.
The rest is pretty obvious, although I do wonder if the Mask Maker had any part in the Pale King's plan of containment.
The black swirls in Mask Maker's eyes reminds me of The Knight's eyes in The Hollow Knight ending where we absorb the Radiance. The knight's eyes seem similar with the Radiance being sealed within the void.
I would like to add that the black streaks coming from the eyes is also seen on the bug holding the love key, with the dream dialogue "too long... spent together". Stronger proof that void creates those black tears
Dude mossbag videos are like comfort food for me, it doesn't matter what the video is about, I keep coming back!
Overanalyzing things is fun.
This is probably because we humans have feeling that deep down, we really know nothing. To make up for that, we try to find deep and meaningful answers in the smallest things. Figuring things out, even though said things are inconsiquential, makes us feel in control. We just want to know something, for sure.
Did you just describe perfectly the human condition? I was staring at the blank wall for like 5 min and thinking about your comment after reading it xD
you just overanalyzed overanilyzation
thank you for these videos. this game's lore is so deep it never stops surprising me! when i played the game, i took it as kind of an "enlightenment vs religion" thing, since the radiance is mad about being forgotten/ignored (petty aren't we) and brainwashes bugs by infecting them with her "light" and turning them into a hivemind (this theme is further reinforced through stuff like the moss prophet preaching about the light), as the pale king struggles to keep her in her place. to me the pale king, the white lady and hallownest in general kinda represent enlightenment, breaking free from mind corruption and ascending to higher intelligence and knowledge (using void against light, that's kinda like saying atheism against religion).
the king is definitely portayed in a more sympathetic light than the radiance, we clearly play as a knight of the pale king and go against the radiance who ruined his beautiful kingdom, thanks to being beings of void and being immune to the radiance's corruption. but now i'm starting to think there's even more to it than that: the light-radiance void-pale king duality never seemed quiiite right to me, even just because of the color coding (the pale king being all about white and the void all about black). if you think about it, the pale king didn't reaaally respect the void either, i mean just look at how he used the abyss for his goals and the countless vessels created and sacrificed. sure the the void is against the radiance too (i mean look at how fiercely the god of gods attacks the radiance in the final battle, and the radiance calling it an "ancient enemy") but it probably wasn't too pleased to be used by the king either (the void tendrils being all mad and stuff, and the king sealing the entrance to the abyss). when you think about it, what the king and the white lady did was truly horrible. the lady in particular refers to a big mistake she's ashamed of... maybe indicating that going to the extremes of pure reason, and ignoring morals, is just as bad as ignoring reason.
anyway, i think being the most powerful entity around (if we ignore the mindfuckery that was the delicate flower ending), not having emotions but still kinda sorta having a mind, the void is the closest thing we have to a true deity we have in hollow knight (being referred as the god of gods and all), being ultimately almost neutral to the king-radiance rivalry. it kind of resembles a pantheistic god, or the greek concept of the arche, underlying but with no will. and the ancient bugs who worshipped it were the ones in the right all along. assuming the game even takes a stance on what factions are right or wrong, which i'm not even sure of anymore lol ... damn this game is deep. if team cherry wanted to keep people thinking and losing themselves in philosophical questions, i'd say they did it! this "little" game is probably my favorite of 2017, which was a GREAT year for video games.
i'm still completely dumbfounded on what the delicate flower is supposed to be.
EDIT: wait! since the delicate flower emits a "pale glow", it must be related to the pale king, right? maybe the delicate flower in the d.f. ending didn't stop the void, it just teleported the godseekr into a dream! that's probably how the pale king transferred the white palace into a dream when the infection showed up!
I guess my idea of the mask maker making mask for those 'who need it' was that bugs tend to look pretty similar and perhaps as a result of gaining sentience some bugs might desire a mask as a means of making themselves more unique and individual. Like a tripcode. They could, of course, also want masks as they lose their sentience as a means to try and hold into their identity, which would make sense given the Mask Maker's location.
Probably also worth noting that he's in the way of the construction of the failed tramway. That at least suggests he didn't set up at that location until the construction had stopped.
What if the mask maker HAS to be in the egg to make the masks? As in, outside of the egg, making such a mask would have no effect, compared to the additional intelligence it supposedly gives. What I think, is that the Void seeps into the masks, much like it does to the mask maker himself, and this small bit of void is what grants a bug extra intelligence. The void could also be all be in the back of the mask, so that wearing it provides direct contact with the void. You can see the void dripping out of the eyes of many bugs, and that could actually be the void that used to be inside the mask, but now 'escapes' their mask because it's no longer under control of a bug.
mossbag videos make my day
Glad to see a new video from you. It's always a joy! Thank you!
That is the most sense I've seen made of the Mask Maker that I've seen. Thanks, this guys has always been an enigma for me.
It makes sense that a mask would grant some sense of sapence if it is used to Focus Soul. The White King probably kickstarted the process and then they figured out Masks to maintain the effect.
Well, masks are the vessels that can contain soul, and the soul is most probably the thing that provides consciousness. I think that maybe we should take it as an energy-like manifestation of buggos inner selves, memories and so on.
- This soul...Is it my own?
...This power...What did it cost?
These skills...No training I recall...
~Soul warrior dream nail dialouge
The vessel have no soul of its own, but also
"No mind to think* -Maybe canonically our buggo is being pushed around by the will of the void?
EDIT: Just realized that I swapped vessels and masks in my logic, goddamnit DON't COMMENT AFTER 7HOURS OF CHEMISTRY KIDS
Another example of creatures "accepting" void would be the vessels. Originally born out of PK and WL, it is seen that void is being injected into the eggs in the abyss, and the result that hatches out is a vessel.
I think Quirrel's memories were sealed away as a third layer of security for Monomon's slumber- he was called back when Monomon believed it was time to break their seal, after all.
Honestly I feel he is just an Easter egg because the artist for HK is Ari, just like Mask Maker. and, as you said, Ari is the voice for Mask Maker.
DEEP Speculation in DEEPnest good one
Another very interesting video from you! Whether or not the speculations are true, it's still fun to hear you speculate. I'd be really interested in an eventual video on the ancient civilization, since you said you had so much information on them.
I think I can make some sense of the Mask Maker’s dialogue. The face is usually treated as the essence of one’s identity, which is why faces are censored to protect people’s identities, or why it can be difficult to recognize someone when you only see half their face. If the face is the identity, then one needs a face “to define, to focus, to exist.”
I think that the most interesting dialogue from the Mask Maker is “To change a face; to conceal it fully within another… a powerful protection that is, but one with sad consequence. The original mind is destroyed, though those of striking will might still retain a sliver of that concealed self.” I think this dialogue is more general than referring to the Knight specifically. If the face is the identity, then the mask provides another identity layered on top of the first. If you wear the mask all the time, you start to identify with the mask and forget the person you were without it, until your original self is gone. For an in-game example, consider Brumm, who identifies with the Grimm Troupe to the point where he doesn’t really remember who he was before them, only that he and the other cult members are slaves to the Nightmare’s Heart. When the mask is removed, he becomes his old self again (presumably) and barely remembers the Grimm Troupe at all. (For the record, we don’t know that Grimm’s mask isn’t his actual face. It might be. It’s possible that all the cult members wear masks to resemble Grimm’s face.) I don’t think that Monomon’s mask works this way for Quirrel; if anything, it’s a reminder of his identity rather than a concealer of it, which might be why he wears it as a hat instead of over his face.
One more thing - I’m pretty sure the “ancient caste” that the Mask Maker says attempted to rule the vast whole refers to the Wyrms, not to the Ancient Civilization. The Pale King did attempt to colonize Deepnest (the failed tram), but failed. Hence, “Hallownest’s ruin reflects well those failed attempts.” Hallownest’s ruin is a result of the King’s failure to rule everything. We also know from Mister Mushroom that there were other Wyrms and that building kingdoms is what Wyrms do, so that may be why the Mask Maker refers to them as an “ancient caste.”
This is all just my interpretation.
bugs probably just look to simmilar so they need masks to act as faces to reconise each other
a mask, as in a mask one wears when talking with others a persona.
A persona to give you identity,
for those who lack it mask maker will provide.
I appreciate your love for this game man. I just played it and I swear it's the best game I've ever played in my life. And I couldn't have picked a better time to pick it up.
I heard from a lore CZcamsr that the soul totems were made before the kingdom of hallownest. I just noticed that the soul totems are also sometimes in the shapes of certain masks. This gives a bit of extra insight on the world before the kingdom. It seems they were able to understand the powers of soul and void long before the kingdom.
You also forgot that, until Quirrel gave her mask back, Monomon had no mind and was essentially in stasis. That's also proof towards the "Masks give mind" theory.
well if it isn't a mossbag video at 10pm i suppose sleep can wait
I think that Quirrel retained most of his mind for the simple fact that he left the kingdom wearing two masks. If one mask gives a bug consciousness without the influence of the Pale King, two can only do it better. But as the Maskmaker said, there is a problem with wearing more than one mask. It's almost as if each additional mask granted a bug a new layer of consciousness that overshadows the ones below. This quote wasn't so much about the Shades as it was regarding people like Quirrel. By placing the second mask upon him, his previous mind, that Quirrel lived during Hallownest's prime, was veiled and suspended by the Monomon mask. The latter in turn gave Quirrel a new life to start over and to rediscover Hallownest in awe. It was only upon removing the second mask, in order to help the Ghost break Monomon's seal, that Quirrel's first life was uncovered, which allowed him to recall why he parted, during the Kingdom's collapse. This dark realization brought him to commit suicide, for his mission was fulfilled, and he could no longer enjoy the world in which he had already lived twice.
On the other hand, the Maskmaker is likely to be a "living" relic of the ancient caste. A bug that was perserved through void, as a means of automating the task of selflessly crafting masks forever, with the endgoal of securing sentience in the realm, independently of the presence or eventual absence of higher beings willing to do the same through different means.
Removing his masks has no effect on him, because he may not have a mind in the first place.
Mask maker says masks are a source of focus. Maybe by that he means the ability to use soul? Remember in the beginning of the game when you are taught to heal it says to hold a button to focus. Heck there are two healing charms with the word focus in there name, quick focus and deep focus. Also the item description of a mask shard reads as follows " A shard of an ancient mask, worn to protect oneself from harm" and the item description of a full mask reads "A complete mask. When whole, a mask protects its wearer, shielding the true form beneath"
Before king:
Without mask: somewhat sentient. Lower grade mind ultimately
With mask: as strong a mind they have now
During/after king: sentient, Higher grade minds
For a second i thought the intro was serious xD
It was
Great video, as always
All of the theories sounded pretty legit, and the humor was spot on.
I'm so glad i found this channel. Now that we're in a Vaati dry spell for Dark Souls Lore, I need some of that sweet, sweet Hollow Knight lore.
10:08 Swirling void maybe, but perhaps layers of masks stacked atop one another?
wow. maskception. jokes aside, i just got mindblown
"If there is anything *blantantly* wrong"
from no eyes lines its safe to assume that removing your eyes prevents or at least makes its harder to get taken over by the radiance.
the bugs that have their eyes removed this way have black lines very similar to the mask makers black lines under his eyes. perhaps something he has done made him resistant to the radiance without removing his eyes fully (be that related or not to void).
"At age of 6 i was born without a face." - unknown grumpy bug of hallownest
I want a Hollow knight chess set.
*YES*
could the mask maker be a void beeing?
The bugs in the ancient basin have been there for far less time than mask maker and they are dead. Why didnt mask maker die like them.
That is pretty unlikely, or only a husk with a void heart, like the vessels (you can see the joints on his arms when he works, and void beings do not have those, just look at the collector). Most likely a bug from the ancient cvilisation, seeing as he is enormous, not the size of some ancient bugs but much larger than all bugs of Hallownest, and with knowledge of ancient times.
@@benikujaku4567 Small late correction, you can see joints in the Hollow Knight's arms and legs, especially in Pure Vessel's statue.
@@petruciosxd1374 Yeah, I was talking about pure void creatures, without even a shell like the vessels. I have also since rethought my opinion, and now think that Maskmaker is indeed a void creature, or at least a creature linked to the void (as we know the ancient civilisation worshipped the void, maybe they infused themselves with it). This is because the Maker is inside something that very much looks like the Black Egg. And as far as we know, the Black Egg can "drain" non-void beings (Hornet says that) and void beings can be contained in them (THK).
@@benikujaku4567 Ah, I get ya. All makes sense.
Confessor Jiji and Steel Soul Jinn also seem to be connected to the void in some way, with their masters, whoever they are, also Steel Assassin Sharpe seemingly being made of void, that void tendril proboscis is definitely something, and Sharpe is clearly related to Jinn along with its other steely companions.
Maybe void consumes soul and that's why people are drained? We see corpses that seem to have died specifically from being around the void, but still with their bodies mostly in tact, with void dripping from their eyes, so maybe when there's no life juice left, the void's done? That is unless there's enough void to just consume the person whole, and the only character (as far as I remember and my memory's pretty bad, so feel more than free to correct me on that) we see completely consumed by the void is the Godseeker and she was consumed from inside her dream by the Shade Lord.
I swear I remember something in the game calling you "eater of soul" or something like that (not thinking of the Soul Eater charm, but the name might be influencing whatever I'm thinking of since I'm just paraphrasing), but then again there's two whole charms to get more soul on hit (the first half of the description is sort of ambiguous, though)+ the weaverlings getting soul with grubsong, as well as Hornet being able to get her silky soul stuff from hitting people, so it might have nothing to do with the void after all, still I truly don't remember anything else being shown or said to take soul in that way, aside from those two things. I mean, there's some ways to gather soul outside of hitting enemies, and they're all have pretty different ways of doing so, like using the totems, the jars and the soul vessels as a way to contain soul, hitting something with the Dream Nail, hot springs, Grubsong, Kingsoul, Deep Focus's description, Salubra's Blessing, and finally the Soul Sanctum, who used machinery to extract all soul from a bug, but they wanted to do that for various reasons, so it doesn't disprove them being able to gather soul on their own at all. Maybe being able to take soul is a trait found in higher beings or with the Pale King and his offspring, the vessels are the only ones being shown focusing soul to heal their shells, after all, although if that's it then it has nothing to do with the void draining people anymore, and I mean, that could be it, but I might just not be remembering the game's text.
@@petruciosxd1374 About Jiji and Jinn, I'm not so sure. Jiji seems to be afraid of the Void (she hides immediately after summoning your shade, and when Dream Nailed, dreams "if I sleep again, will this darkness consume me too?". So even though she has some power over the Void, I don't think it is much above what Snail wizards can do. Steel Soul Jinn and Steel Assassin Sharpe are more suspicious, although it is not cut and clear. Juste because Sharpe has black husk and white eyes doesn't mean he's Void. The proboscis may very well be just a proboscis. But yeah, for him, I too tend to agree to the Void theory. It would mean the three other steel-protected characters are too, in the same way as Wingsmould. However, I'm not too fond of the "everyone is void" theories, so I'll not speak further about that before we have other elements to work with.
There are lots of characters who were deeply consumed by the Void. In the dream world, the Radiance was, and in the Abyss, the bugs around the Pale King's fountain, the Love Tower's Caretaker, the Godseeker.... I don't think the Void only consumes Soul. It consumes everything that is not Void itself, while letting things that are mostly Void not be consumed. (The Pure Vessel gives off Soul, and Hornet says about the Black Egg that it was built to sustain "your likes" and would drain her. The Black Egg is made of Void, as seen in the Dream No More ending, so only the Vessels could fight in there.) The Pale King also says that the Void is "the Power opposed" and that "only one Light shall shine against the dark". So the Void doesn't just oppose the Pale King (representing Soul with the Kingsoul), but the Essence of the Radiance too.
It's the Godseeker that calls you Eater of soul with awe. I believe it is not an ability of all Higher Beings, or the Pale King would have written about it in the tablets in the start area. He only wrote about manipulating Soul. I think "true" Higher Beings, such as the Pale King and the White Lady, actually produce Soul within themselves and can manipulate it to cast spells (similar to how Kingsoul functions). The Vessels are Higher Beings, being able to read the tablets in King's Pass and manipulate Soul, but as they are not fully alive, maybe they can't produce it without robbing other bugs of it. Maybe they use their Void part to contain Soul, as when a part of their Void isn't in their body (shade), they can contain less Soul.
About the process of infection with Void, it seems that Void can first infect one's mind, such as the bug in the Lighthouse, then their body, finally fusing with them (as demonstrated by the Tower of Love's caretaker's dream "too long spent together, we became as one"). But the caretaker was killed by fusing with the Void , whereas the vessels, possibly due to their Higher status, could be totally infected and fused with Void without losing their life and their will.
I think the reason Quirrel was able to keep his sentience when outside Hallownest was because the masks that were made for each of the vessels were made by the mask maker, and that they too could make bugs intelligent, but not on the level of the pale king, which caused him to only lose his sentience and keep his mind.
Love these vids! Funny, makes sense, and full of theories!
still waiting on that grimm troupe lore video :hollowdab:
lolthe1st sumwan and mola are working on an updated one, iirc
The Mask Maker is a liar! My Ibiscus flower has no face but it exists and has a fulfilling life!
When the radiance dream nail dialogue said "I DO NOT FEAR YOU" all I could think of is the newest ending with the shade lord and thought well you should!
It's also worth noting that the God Seeker's mask entry specifications about what its design implies, also hints towards masks and their design/construction having function as opposed to just form. It may be that different masks grant different qualities.
I *mask* all my feelings with puns
what if the mask maker is a void boi and the egg he's in is 'sustaining' him like hornet said
Awesome lore video! I have no idea what is correct etc but its alot of fun speculating 😍
I don’t know how I was never hip to hollow knight CZcams when I was playing the game. mossbag you are quickly becoming one of my favorite content creators. Gonna have to replay HK
okay you actually touched on something that I can't stop thinking about now. Is The Radiance actually the literal sun of this world? It's always night time in Hollow Knight. She says "Dawn will break" in the dream nail dialogue, and obviously appears as the sun when you first enter her boss room. I mean it seems unlikely since the Pale King was able to make everyone forget about her and later stuff her inside of the Hollow Knight, but maybe...
Mossbag said at some point that the whole game was one long night. What if the void is the moon and the radiance is the sun? So the civilization that worshipped the void representated the night and the radiance was supposed to come after it and make it day but the pale king tried to keep it night aslong as possible. This would explain the line "dawn will break" because the radiance needs to continue the cycle of night and day. This is why the radiance got so mad. It infected the bugs to try to stop or scare away the pale king so it could become day, as it was supposed to
You know what I think?
I think that team cherry is yet to finish the lore since the game hasn't concluded officially. I get that all of your videos are mere speculation, but damn is your analysis accurate.
Also
*DON'T JUDGE MY USERNAME*
Logan paul? Oh no not him!
*Judges*
Get judged.
i gotta say, insane dedication to larping for these bugs to change identities completely whenever they put on a mask. respect 🙏
By "they need a face to exist" is probably a overstatement meaning they need a face to have a mind.
#Sponsored by Domino's Pizza
3:24 are those Zote heads in the background?!
There's a theory that the Knight is the Shade Lord. Maybe the "focus" the Void is given is bestowed through the Knight and its mask?
The knight or the unison of the shades are definitely a shade lord
@@gabedresen592 Then in that case the idea that masks give focus and mind could be applied to the Shade Lord.
Yea that theory could hold some merit, I theorize that the lord of shades is a title. A shade lord “occurs” when void is given form, focus, and (whatever the third thing stated in Godhome at the knights statue was.) We know from the ancient bug corpse or statue in the abyss that there must have been a shade lord in ancient hallownest because of his dream nail dialogue. The knight has unlocked the full potential of the void.
@@gabedresen592 That's definitely possible. Although, I personally think that the Shade Lord isn't a "title" but rather a Higher Being itself; an old being worshipped by Hallownest's predecessor. The Knight does indeed become one with the Shade Lord, implying that there may be a connection between the two. The Shade Lord may very well be a unison of the Void, awoken by some primal force the Knight has.
Love your videos, your interpretations and humor!
It's hard not to chip in with my views on the lore. I think you are hitting the nail on the head in this video, and think you kan hit it even harder.
To me, the most important word is Focus. Like the Mask Maker says "you need a Face/Mask to focus" I think co-relates alot to the godmaster dlc where the statue says: Void given focus.
The Void and the Light when we first see them are chaotic forces. That's until you face the Radiance. Then it's clear that the light has a purpose and a mind. Throug the battles in Godmaster you atune the Void so that in itself is given focus/purpose, and afterwards reveals the radiance counterpart: The Void Monster... thing...
It's either that, or I'm just full of bullshit...
One thing's for certan though!
Now I'm hungry for Dominos...
Maaaaaan I’ve been waiting for more lore on the mask maker. Can’t wait.