A 9 Year Old Hotend Unlocked my Mk4
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- čas přidán 8. 06. 2024
- 00:00 - What are we doing?
00:23 - The Triad of Speed
01:51 - 11 minute benchy on a Mk3
02:15 - Why the Nextruder fails
02:54 - How are we gonna fix it?
04:03 - Yep. It's way better.
- - - - - - - Parts for this Mod - - - - - - -
Nozzle adapter V6 to Nextruder - prusa3d.com/en/product/nextru...
Heater - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DE9...
Volcano block with sock and nozzle - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_Dcy...
OR
volcano block - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DmE...
Sock - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DkI...
volcano Brass nozzle - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DBm...
Volcano Copper Nozzle - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DDs...
Volcano Steel Nozzle - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DBg...
Nozzle spacer ( to use V6 nozzles) - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DBqSyw9
Volcano Fan Duct - printables.com/model/833907-v...
- - - - - - - Old Faithful - - - - - - -
Great, cheap PETG - amzn.to/4aloImv
No enclosure, high flow ABS - amzn.to/3PQdpur
- - - - - - Who actually clicks these links? - - - - - -
Prusa Mk4: bit.ly/3nvPq8t
Prusa MK3.5 upgrade kit: bit.ly/3KfAB2F
Prusa MK3.9 upgrade kit: bit.ly/3TWF1Ph
Prusa MK4 upgrade kit: bit.ly/3Kk5JhG
#prusa #mk4 #3dprinting #3dprinter - Věda a technologie
##### FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS #####
1: Settings you need to change (When I get some time I'll upload some configs - keep your eye on this comment)
REQUIRED
* Printer settings -> General -> Max print height : change this from 220mm to 210mm
RECOMMENDED
* Filament settings -> advanced -> Max volumetric Speed:
PETG: 13 if you want a perfectly uniform gloss finish or crank it up to 20 if you're feeling impatient
ABS: 25 to be conservative and up to 35 for speed benchy
PLA: 25 to 35? I don't print PLA anymore, sorry.
* Cooling: You'll need to tune these yourself but a good starting point is to add 50% to the max fan speed
* Retraction length: increase this by 50% to start and increase up to 100% if stringing becomes an issue
OPTIONAL
* Speeds: you can basically crank these up as much as you want - add cooling as necessary.
* Accelerations: Play with these! Push it (under close supervision) and have fun!
95% original quality - External perimeters: 4k, Top solid infill: 5k, Perimeters: 8k, Infill: 10k, Travel: 10k, Bridge: 2.5k
90% original quality - External perimeters: 6k, Top solid infill: 8k, Perimeters: 10k, Infill: 10k, Travel: 10k, Bridge: 2.5k
2: Yes! I did try a CHT first 😏 Sorry that I didn't mention it in the video! The problem is that the heater isn't powerful enough to feed it which is the main reason that you need to upgrade to a 50W heater.
Thank you for including data! I love these types of scientific investigations and problem solving 🥰
I am reminded of the recent-ish CNC Kitchen "Volcano hotend is obsolete - JUST USE NUTS" :D
I will give it a try. Thanx for sharing. See you an a month, when the things arrive.
I don't even have an MK4 yet, but this has to be tried once i get one :D Great work !
Wow! This is amazing. My mk4 runs well now that I’m almost afraid to do anything to it 😂 but this is very tempting
Preach! I still have an unadulterated, circa 2017, mk3 on my desk. It works every single time so I'm not about to get in the middle of that 😆
This is exactly my experience with my MK4. and makes me wonder if I need another one only to try stuff like this while the stock one simply works.
Thank you for posting this. I'm pretty new to printing, just started with a Sovol SV07+, and it took me awhile to figure out that in stock form it has substandard parts cooling. The directional curtain fan on the back of the X crossbar is part of the problem - it creates differential cooling zones across the width (X) of the plate as well as by exposure time, with the -Y areas of the plate getting the effect continuously and the +Y areas not getting enough. This leads to differential layer heights if you're running the thing at speed, then the nozzle starts knocking on them, etc.
Finally worked out a design for dual 5015 blowers to ride on the print head. Seems to have solved all of the problems. Curtain fan is now removed. Also the overhangs look much much better now :) Anyway it's up on printables if anyone else has a SV07+ with the same problem.
Please keep it going with more challenging prints!
YOURE ALIVE!!!
I'M BACK BABY! ❤
@@fail_fast Did you ever upload a video of a car accident? I might be going nuts but I thought I saw something like that on your channel before you disappeared
Great video! I might give this a try.
I think the MK3.5 is also a very interesting candidate for high speed printing, as you can easily install any hotend, such as Revo HF with 50W heatercore, Phaetus Rapido or Goliath.
I speculate you could have similar results using a CHT nozzle with the stock heatblock. Thanks for showing this off!
I wonder if this would be workable with the MMU3
Thanks for doing this! Did you change any other settings in the slicer or on the printer other than the ones mentioned in the video?
Yes! check out my pinned comment
In your triad, I would replace melt with "extrusion system". Even with plenty melt capability, without the filament grip and extrusion force to overcome backpressure, you won't get high flow.
with Volcano + MK3S the firmware modification for Z-height was necessary, what about with the MK4?
Could you please describe the settings you made in prusa slicer? Did you just change the max volumetric speed?
I also think you forgot the thermistor in your list. :)
Do you use a 0.4mm Nozzle?
you can use the same thermistor!
Basically all you need to do is bump up the flow rate, you can start with increasing it by 50% but I've been able to push it up to 100% when I want a part done RIGHT. NOW. You'll want to increasing your part cooling fan as well. After this, you can basically increase your speeds and accelerations to whatever you want. I've pushed it up to 500mm/s and 15k but I haven't run it for hours on end.
yep, 0.4mm
Yes! check out my pinned comment
Not sure about combination “aluminum block + 24v/50w heater”. Safer option will be 40w heater on aluminum or 50w with brass/copper block.
Finally? That odd cus last i check i had inputshaping on my prusa for over 5months. Besides that point the rest of your videos really good
Like it, bring any mod you got for prusa.
Do you have a video showing how to assmable the nozzzle after purchasing all materials ? If not , can you make one ?
Does a Revo handle this better with HF?
Why dont you run a v6 bamboostyle on the mk3 theyr cheap and with chbclone nozzle really good
I have always thought the cooling on my mk3 was not good enough. Has that changed on the mk4? Clearly it is going to be more important with your volcano mod. I would love to see a video comparing stock cooling vs upgraded.
That would be the matter of material choice wouldn't it? PLA has a really low Tg so it takes a fair bit of effort to get it to solidify; PETG though and especially Styrene polymers (ABS, ASA, HIPS) don't need much effort at all.
I have a DIY printer not a Prusa and i have a Sunon maglev 5015 part cooling fan... it was a mistake, the maglev bearing really hates vibration so i converted it afterwards, and it has another issue with PWM control as well, it just goes crazy, which i had to work around with a DIY pi filter, but the fan does differ from ones usually supplied for 3D printing by being a fair bit more powerful. I can get a lot of air in.
But i heard the commonly sold used Delta 5015 fan rips even harder. I should try it. DBB is the right bearing type for machine.
By the way i can really recommend HIPS. Matte, little shrinkage and warpage, open printable, good cohesion, cheap, high temperature capable, very smooth and controllable flow, lightweight, less degradation in the nozzle than ABS, less styrene vapour emission by an order of magnitude. Still poisonous though.
CHT nozzle can easily get 35mm3/s without a noticeable drop in quality/adhesion with just the V6 adapter (from my own flow tests - I use orcaslicer's flow test to determine this), so I'm not sure why yours is so low.
Different filament brands/colors, different testing methods, and different environmental factors all can add up to that. For instance, I use CNC Kitchen's method and occasionally use orcaslicer's flow test and get different results. Not a big fan of orcaslicer's method, even if it's faster, as it's harder to quantify scientifically compared to weighing blobs. Still, clearly practical as it's popular.
@@applepiesapricots3109 Orcaslicer's method I prefer because its far more rooted in how it actually looks in a real printing situation, and you can also determine part strength etc. too.
Also to add - put x/y jerk to 30 and watch it go brrrr
That and CHT nozzle = it's now actually a little faster than my P1S and print quality is still exactly the same lol - maybe I'll tweak the P1S next as I have the Obxidian CHT nozzle in it
why didn't you test the CHT nozzle on the nextruder? If the V6 results are anything to go by, it would be VERY close to the volcano results, without needing the larger heater block. More powerful heater might still be needed, though.
The CHT was the first thing that I tried even though I didn't mention it in the video. The heater was underpowered and couldn't feed the CHT nozzle. One of the main reasons I went for a volcano is because mk4 uses a custom length heater cartridge and 50w heaters aren't available in that size (or they weren't 6 months ago)
@@fail_fast Interesting. That would have been a very interesting curve to see on the graph with the V6, V6 CHT, Nextruder, and Nextruder/volcano.
Does anyone have good settings for the MK4?
The links in the description for the parts don't work. They go to a broken Aliexpress URL.
Thanks for letting me know. I'll fix that
strange, I just checked them and they're all working for me. Maybe somebody else can weigh in on this and confirm that they're broken
I'm also getting 404 errors for all the AliExpress links
@@fail_fast They are all working here for me right now
Actual link works for me, but don't ship to my location unfortunately :(
Very interesting comparison.
How about a Nextruder with CHT Nozzle? If normal Nextruder is better then V6+CHT how about Tuning the Nextruder-Block with the CHT Nozzle?
I should have mentioned it in the video. I tested a CHT first but the heater didn't have enough power. The nextruder uses a custom sized heater and they aren't available in higher wattages. The real reason for moving up to the volcano was that we could use standard length cartridges heaters which are available up to 70w
@@fail_fast interesting that the heater of the nextruder is not sufficient for the cht nozzle. I am using a cht in my mk3s+ and have no problem going up to 25 mm³/s. I was hoping that the nextruder can bring it at least to 30mm³/s.
I mean, in the end most of the filaments that I use aren't made to be printed that fast so it is not necessary for me, but it is always good to know your system, right?
Firstly, that's a low blow at IS. MK4 has had IS for so long now that some people wouldn't even know if didn't exist.
Secondly did you have to modify the firmware to enable this hotend? Did it mess up the thermal profile prusa set in FW for runaway?
I also wonder how this mod affects IS as your adding a fair chuck of weight.
No FW changes needed. I've been running this mod since IS was released - it just took me forever to make the video 😅. No issues with the stock thermal profiles.
It only adds a couple grams of mass to the entire 500 gram nextruder assembly so IS is unchanged.
I just gave a friend my volcano... i wish i had considered this
Love it: - that's how you beat any other "speed-heavy" printers out there!! :D
On that note, I wouldn't overdo it with PETG : )
Nice. Don't you think that Prusa knows the "secrets" of higher flow though?
Unfortunately not all of the projects are "open". It would be much easier for everyone - including Prusa - if more manufacturers cared more about open source like Prusa does. In fact, the Prusa nozzle technically is not proprietary.
There is a quite good reason why to set lower limit for PET even when the nozzle can melt more (see Prusa and Bambu printers for example). So comparing 9.5 vs 20 may not make much sense.
Why actually?
I mean i have noticed that PETG "likes" being printed at consistent speeds, with not too much retraction and non-print moves and not too much acceleration deceleration in the extrusion, and the higher you set your speed, the more real speed variance you're going to get, but i don't understand why this filament behaves the way it appears to, what the underlying cause is.
There are people doing 70-100 to PETG. Even TPU.
But the best reason is layer adhesion. Slower generally means better adhesion.
I don't believe the melt zone length Logic. I think the bottleneck is almost always motor torque, especially if your using a CHT.
You can have a ton of motor torque, it's easy. What's not so easy is transferring all that force onto the filament without it slipping back.
That being said the MK4 with its giant extrusion gear and two idlers should have the least issue doing just that?
Part of the "ghosting" comes from the fact most slicers do a super crap job of using arcs. Running through arc welder can drastically what appears to be ghosting on curved walls.
Arc welder is obsolete. Slicers like orca slicer can generate arcs as well.
Not that it would concern me, but wouldn't it be more practical to have the Nextruder Adapter act as the Volcano Part ( longer thread portion ) thus enabling the use of _actual_ nonproprietary Nozzles instead of like this requiring _somewhat_ proprietary Volcano Nozzles? 🤔🤨
I get what you mean! I use a nozzle spacer to accomplish this (see the link in video description) it allows me to use standard length V6 nozzles with the volcano block
You shopping list does not include a volcano sock.
I had to double check - it comes as a "free gift" with the volcano block that I linked
@@fail_fast I see. Maybe I should cancel the purchase of the sock. But it is in black the one I ordered. Which I like more than orange.
Need to try this with the XL eventually
crank the voltage baby and push it to 100k accel lmao
This is interesting, but if it won't produce equal part strength and print quality to going normal speed it isn't of much value to me. We want the best quality these machines can make. Even input shaping speeds often reduce overall quality compared to going a bit slower.
All your graphics have x axis leyend wrong, it is (mm3/s) not (mm/s3)
FFS I just sold my nextruder nozzle adapter *face palm*, 50% is too much to pass up!
This is an interesting mod and I like the theory and quantification you presented, but both of these Benchys look terrible in my opinion - at least on camera. Admittedly, this is in the spirit of your channel name, but it's useless for any real-life printing scenarios. People want to print the same quality more quickly or a better quality in the same amount of time. Nobody wants quick failures.
Just a thought: If you think the hotend is limiting the rest of the machine, why not decrease nozzle diameter instead of increasing heat output? This won't improve printing time, but it'll improve printing time per quality.
try a bambulabs clone
Forgive if im being pedantic, but "finally has input shaping" seems off-base to me. IS was available for the mk4 starting 5 months after its intitial release, meaning that for over half the time the mk4 has existed, IS has been available. Im not sure what you expect it to add to the discussion here, but it's rather irritating that this line keeps being included in mk4 discussions.
Imagine defending a product thats main new exciting feature wasn't implemented fully until 5 months after initial buyers paid for it lol.
@@leadmuffins7565 To be fair, it was never the main selling point.
@@AshBashVids It absolutely was and is. Regardless Prusa is outdated and not worth buying as of now unless you're a fan boy. Prusa has become the apple of 3d printers without the reliability and ease of use.
@@leadmuffins7565 I'd probably compare Bambu to Apple rather than Prusa, being just as proprietary. Prusa is just really behind and for some reason determined to stay that way apparently, whereas Apple is at least innovating recently. Perhaps Prusa is banking on its industry acceptance as a printer that "just werks"?
@@leadmuffins7565 I own a P1S and while its nice, I still think the Mk4 is a great machine. I much prefer it for printing TPU or PCCF over my P1S and... it's not even that much slower, especially with a CHT nozzle.
Also without the reliability? This sounds like you were schlubbed. Prusa's KNOWN for reliability LOL
What has the Biggest Numbers™ != the reason why sane people pick 3D printers.
Dude prusa just keeps giving themselves the L's