Debunking the Theory of the Twin being the 3rd Descender | Genshin Impact Lore
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- čas přidán 7. 06. 2024
- Debunking the theory of the twin being the 3rd descender with ingame proofs
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Timestamps:
0:00 The Third Descender
0:24 Explaing why people believe in the theory
0:52 The Debunk
1:44 Fake Twin Theory
2:05 Conclusion
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Tags:
#genshin #genshinimpact #genshinimpactlore #genshinimpacttheory #genshinlore #genshintheory #aether #lumine #gnosis #celestia #unknowngod #heavenlyprinciples #archon #cataclysm #nahida #skirk #abyss
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this video has ai voice from capcut - Hry
![[v4.2] Who is the THIRD DESCENDER [Genshin Impact Lore and Theory] (Celestia Week Part 2)](/img/n.gif)
The sibling is from another world like we are. The only reason they are not the 3rd descender is because they don't have the will or power to rival the entire world (just as that one world quest said in 4.2)
Thank you I'm glad someone finally payed attention to the world quest
The twin in a way is a descender but not enough will to gain a title. The third descender might not be the twin but it doesn't change the possibility that the twin is actually dead due to her existence in the Irminsul.
As one comment suggested, she/he might have been sent into the past or the start of a new cycle after death, born in Khaenriah via alchemy, with her/his past memory and the guidance of the abyss order, that her/his hometown is destroyed, hence why she/he has irminsul records (depending on who the player picks).
It makes sense as there are artificial life instances creates, namely Albedo and Fontainians.
Saying that the sibling is the 3rd descender is the most stupid theory since the game's release.
We know for a FACT that the sibling is NOT considered a descender, we know for a FACT that the sibling is ALIVE (remains are something left behind from someone that has DIED).
How did this stupid and completely out of touch theory that is going against known FACTS even came up is beyond me. At this point some people are stretching to find things just for views/likes.
nah the stupidest theory award goes to "paimon will betray us", at least this theory requires you to read the story to debunk.
You think so? Just for your information, jf our twin were to be recreated using the art of Khemia like Albedo, they would be registered in Irminsul. You know, our twin calls Khaenri'ah "my homeland" but everyone seems to forget about that. If that's our twin from start to finish, how come they were born in Khaenri'ah while we were not?
Did they fall asleep during the Sumeru AQ lol.
Dottore outright says (to Nahida, in exchange for the Dendro Gnosis) the abyss twin is a part of Teyvat as far as Irminsul is concerned, anyway. And whilst Irminsul memory can indeed be corrupted, we see from that interlude that it is not easy to do so, in fact, it proves quite difficult to alter fate and time (that is what makes descenders such remarkable beings, not merely being an alien lifeform.)
So, the abyss twin could not be a descender, as far as Teyvat is concerned, s/he is as much a part of its cycles as a native lifeform, and subject to the will of Fate.
look at wei's theory that Nibellung is the 3rd descender.... it makes actually sense
It doesn't, because Nibelung was there before the first.
@@IkikuroKidenaithey mean the nibelung *after* being corrupted by forbidden knowledge from the abyss and deformed beyond recognition, thus everyone else mistook the corrupted nibelung who *returned* to teyvat as the 3rd descender
@@aeternasomniam still makes no sense because otherwise Childe would be a descender too. And so would Apep.
@@aeternasomniam actually, to be fair, EVERYONE FROM KHAENRI'AH would be a descender. The theory about Nibelung makes no sense at all.
@@IkikuroKidenaiidk why you keep saying it doesn’t make sense- the theory states (if I remember correctly) that Nibelung left the world and then came back (changed) -> like a Nibelung 2.0- Since that version of him is from outside this world, having gained “the power to change the will of the world” (or something like that), by definition alone Nibelung could be considered a descender. But it’s only a theory so we actually can’t say for sure..
The theory just asks the question “what if Nibelung left teyvat and came back with new power? Would he be considered a descender since he CAME back from the outer world” and I think that question makes perfect sense
Wait until someone from Natlan reveals something about our twin.
🙂 I think the 3rd descender is that guy who fell in love with the seelie.
I think his name starts with the letter B-
That person doesnt have a name i think, they're only said to be a traveler from afar
It matches up with the timeline however i'm sure it said they were stripped of their memories not destroyed and all the seelies were cursed, nabu malikata is the only one who seemed to avoid this fate she had her memories.
Here is my theory that explains this contradiction…Samsara cycles and rebirth.
1) We know Teyvat works in samsaras not only in dreams, its even mentioned in the fontaine world quest.
2) Abyss sibling would have no reason to be weaker mentally or physically than the traveler thus debunking that they arent a descender.
3) The abyss sibling is known to have helped Khanriah advance, we can assume that she may have died or had her powers extracted through some means thus ridding her of descender status and thus her power becoming the “remains of the 3rd descender”.
4) Once the new samsara cycle has started and the Abyss sibling is weakened or maybe its related to when she woke up she was already in teyvat thus becoming part of teyvat as she was there from the start of the new samsara.
5) Nahida says there’s nothing about us in irminsul but that’s complete bs, Mona actually first met us by divination which uses the stars which as irminsul’s fruit. If what Nahida says is true then this wouldnt be the case, she also likely didnt predict it was paimon due to her special properties as well as Mona CLEARLY waiting for the traveler.
6) All in all this would explain why the abyss sibling does not use the light element but rather the abyss as her powers just like the traveler was taken, she still remembers what happened just like the traveler knows of the previous dendro archon, once the new samsara cycle happens new stars for each person are made as we can see that the traveler is having their actions to some degree recorded and in the next cycle could then become bound to irminsul as well unless they gain their powers back.
MY SHORTCOMINGS:
1) Does not explain why the siblings remember stuff despite being bound to irminsul, are they similar to shades and cant have their memory affected but are still recorded?
2) What are the “remains”? we JUST learned of them so its unfair to talk about in full.
3). The connection of being awake and who gets sent into a samsara cycle. Do you actually need to move around and do stuff for the god of fate to weave you a constellation for you to follow? Is that what rhukka meant in her death cutscene?
Thanks for reading all the way through
It would make no sense for Abyss Sibling to be the 3rd since aren't a Descender as Nahida stated. It would also contradict the timeline knowledge we have now up to the present date since our twins came due to responding to the summons to the Heavens. If you notice all Descenders seem to have very heavy themes of the sun and suns are worshiped in almost every ancient mythology on the planet alongside the moon. But if star goes supernova and dies it explodes becoming a blackhole swollowing everything(like a curse you could say) solar eclipses are also seen as ill omens of doom and disaster in many ancient cultures. These Descenders also have themes of major stars such as Polaris, Sirius, and so on. As a result it far more likely the 3rd Descender is the Light Prince in Six Pygmies that traveled with a Moon Princess at his side across Teyvet's human and void realms until they were betrayed by the 1st and 2nd Descenders gang.
Weird then that Lumine and Aether have swords resembling sun and moon.
Both twins came to Teyvat 500 years ago, but we have already seen a thing done in one moment impacting the past (Sakura tree). So, with the help of Istaroth the twin can be the 3d descender
Read some theories that either Nibelung the dragon king was the 3rd descender or Dainsleif is the 3rd descender.
The traveler woke up around the cataclysm as the sibling awoken them to escape the world however then stopped by an unknown god who sent traveler back to sleep for 500 years
These theories are so good ✨
:>
So what were Gnoses' original form without the frame made from 3rd Descender? As we know Phanes took an amount of Sovereign Dragons' power so it must be contained in a original shape. The bones of the 3rd that turned into outside frame for Gnoses, as Skirk said, it would make the chosen Archons suffer for a long time. In my view, Gnoses without the frame might've been a crystal, or a power-limited Herrscher core
She is dead but her memory of who she was before Khaenri'ah is trying to alter fate. That is why she says "my war is with destiny and the thrones in heaven" Nahida can't sense that Lumine is a descender because her authority is in the Gnosis. Lumine knows that she is dead that is why she says "we have always had enough time brother". Hoyo chose these lines to hint at the fact that she is dead otherwise it makes no sense why would they have limitless time on the contrary they have very little time and the world is about to end, so why would she say that? Genshin as it is currently working takes memories from the Old World and makes them real through Irminsul but these are still memories and memories are forgotten with time, this is referred to in game as erosion, time is Theyvats biggest enemy. However it is very much debateable how "real" Theyvat actually is, and the game is questioning this constantly.
In order for Lumine to change the future she needs to alter the past. And since Theyvat is reborn in cycles this becomes complicated. Basically the sustainer sent her down in the past of her future to alter fate and this works that is why she is dead and can be "alive" at the same time. Now this has already started to happen that is why Paimon is gradually losing her memory. Because Paimon exists only in this reality, she will seize to exist if the traveller successfully changes the world fate. Paimon was a consequence of the creator having to diminish herself in order to save Theyvat, but if that future no longer exist, Paimon never existed either. Paimon is far from stupid, she has started to figure out how these things are connected, she says things like "are you going to miss Paimon?" What would you do without Paimon? Paimon is in a complicated situation the further they come to alter world fate the closer Paimon is to dying. However Paimon's reason for living is to guide the traveller one could argue that she would have no purpose outside that. It comes down to Paimon understanding that she was always meant to be sacrificed at the end.
I'd killed the 3rd Descenders (I'm the Second throne.)
Who does bro think he is🤦♂️⁉️
@@kim_genshin fr
This isn't really a good debunking since there's multiple things in play like Istaroth that can mess with time, she literally helped Ei and Makoto plant a seed 500 years into the future that would save them during the cataclysm. We can also theorize that the twins are definitely from the unified civilization since they activated teleporters that no one knew about or even how to activate them. And also the fact that apparently the twins were summoned, and they answered the call. The twins are sus af and I doubt they've actually been traveling to different worlds.
The fact that the abyss twin saw the cataclysm doesn't mean they arrived at that time. The abyss twin woke up in Khaenri'ah and she has completed a journey (Cycle) in Teyvat. According to Yae Miko life is separated by cycles and by finishing a cycle one's information will be recorded in Irminsul. That's why Nahida said she belongs to this world.
The whole idea of descenders is based on Irminsul.
So there is no fake abyss twin and the third descendant is Nebilung.
The first story of traveler literally says that the cataclysm was the thing they saw after arriving to teyvat, they arrived at the same time too no one came to teyvat first before the other
@@kim_genshin I don't remember the traveler mentioning Khaenri'ah or the cataclysm back then. Can you tell me where was it ?
But the traveler obviously said when I woke up I was alone.
Btw I didn't say they didn't arrive at the same time, I said at that time.
@@thelostyaksha 0:56
"You were a pair of traveling twins, passing through countless worlds during your journey. Descending upon a continent named Teyvat, you hoped that you would be able to enjoy your time here. But as you awoke among the falling stars, you saw the world in turmoil, a cataclysm raging across the land... You sought to leave this place and move on to the next world, but then an unknown god stood before you, barring the way." (traveler character story 1)
From this and the cutscene we learn that the twins came to teyvat when the cataclysm was happening which we know was 500 years ago -> they tried to escape but were stopped by the unknown god -> traveler was put to sleep by the unknown god for a long period of time while the other twin "suddenly appeared in khaenriah" -> while traveler was asleep, the other twin met dainsleif and traveled the entire teyvat together -> 500 years later the traveler woke up from the deep slumber -> some time after that he met paimon
@@kim_genshin hmmm... Since no one talks about the beginning of the Travelers journey and we don't have any quest about it, I had totally forgotten about this. Thanks.
@@thelostyaksha your welcome
I think the 3rd descender must be the light prince from pale princess and six pygmies book
@_@ maybe the one we have seen in the quest is not our sibling...
I notice why aether was hoyo chosen lore/story traveler because of the Male character card official introduction his very fit to be the 4th descender.
Lumine was fit to be a princess because of her Female character card official introduction being the descender is not fit to her. But still both of them have a candidate to be ascend.
Omg i never noticed
The recent Narssizenkruiz quests also helps explain why the twin is not a descender and I believe that it might be the reason
I havent done that quest yet can u explain to me
@@kim_genshin There's a note left behind by The Master aka Narzissenkreuz which partly goes as follows:
"(...) This, too, is my goal, for not all that comes from beyond may be as one that "descends." That title belongs only to wills that can rival an entire world.
That is what I seek, the way to become just such a will, one that can protect the world, sustain the world, destroy the world, and create the world."
- Basically he means that for a person who comes from beyond to count as a "Descender", they have to have a will strong enough to protect, sustain, destroy and/or create a world.
- While the twins are both from beyond, only 1 of them have the will that is capable of changing the world and defying fate.
- Also a fun throwback to this piece of dialouge with the Melusine Canotila:
Canotila: "Yes... And just what does (Traveler) look like to your eyes, Paimon?"
Paimon: "Uh... Of course, Paimon's golden-haired traveling companion! Don't tell Paimon you see something else."
Canotila: "What I see... If I really must say, then I see a monster that looks like it could swallow the whole world in a single bite."
@@mahlium thank you so much!
Not necessarily, not everything Narzissenkreuz says is correct and nothing is immutable thanks to Irminsul manipulation. Until we get an actual concrete information on who it is or at least, what happened to the Sibling upon their emergence in Khaenri'ah, we cannot say anything. I am not sold on any of the theories about the Sibling or Nibelung being the 3rd Descender for now but the reality is, until we get concrete proof, we cannot say anything for certain.
Just to muddy the waters even further, Neuvillette after receiving his authorities was also described as being capable of rivalling the human realm and he's not ever described being a Descender and any one of the siblings can be Traveller depending on player choice. Essentially, everyone who is saying they are or aren't for certain, is just jumping the gun, because even now, we don't have enough to go on.
What if the third decender is the traveler's parents😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱
Looks like I got hit by this one😅, but yeah really the timeline makes this theory crumble. They both experienced the cataclysm before trying to escape only means this happens around 500 years ago...
Speaking of decender theories....
How do you define the word "comperable to gods"? Just asking cuz I've been arguing a lot with people saying Capitano is stronger than all of the archons...even extreme is stronger than sovereigns when Nahida only said "comperable" meaning equal. And Capitano is said to be the strongest human (individual apparantly by leaks?) in Teyvat.
Here's my take:
Gods in genshin scales variously. Say in a category where Nahida who is strong as a support than strong as a fighter lorewise. Then we have Havria who is also a god but weak that a human can kill her. Then we have the brutes like Ei, Morax, and possibly Murarata who are god slayers.
Sure Dottore is stronger than Nahida, but that's because she's not a fighter and with Traveler taken down she's got nothing against someone like Dottore (I think he has pretty scary feats via the manga. For all we know, that fan animation where its showing Dottore and Scara fighting can be how he really fights.)
I think they can be stronger than half of the archons like the support once, but not as strong as the brutes. I mean, Ei sliced through an island and Orobashi, Morax is able to create massive weapons that can become islands, even subspaces and kill gods on a daily during the archon war, judging he can create gold which is said by Albedo, needs the power of 8 suns. That is nothing to scoff at and here they are scaling the top 3 to be stronger than them when Nahida only said "comperable" and that Capitano being the strongest individual title is a leak. He is said to be "mere mortal" by Varka and idk if he is the strongest mortal/human but he is the strongest harbinger and likely is the strongest human...
So yeah...how strong to you think the top 3 is? Mainly Capitano...
In chinese translation, nahida said the top 3 are comparable to "archons". But the power level of the archons isnt the same, each archon has a specific role they're good at and their strengths are on different levels so we cant be so sure if capitano is slightly weaker or on the same level as the brutes like raiden and morax
@@kim_genshin Welp...that busts their sovereign powerlevel claim. How they got to that point is...concerning...even if they say they're stronger than all archons its still concerning. Also, do you know where its stated Capitano is the strongest individual or human or mortal? Most of the sources I read of Capitano is the wiki or Mika's letter reading on yt
@@deannerodriguez2208the only things we know about capitano is that he's an "ordinary mortal" who gets the most praise by the fatui, and he's currently in natlan. That's all we know. There's no canon information that he's the strongest in teyvat as that's only a leak. But i dont think he's weak either, he's definitely strong since he's ranked as the first harbinger, and who knows he might actually be stronger than archons
@@kim_genshin Oh he's definitely stronger than some archons, but kinda hard to believe he can defeat someone like Ei or Morax, Nahida (Solo) is explainable as she's not exactly a fighter as noted by Paimon, and unlike the brutes, she's trapped for most of her life. Not hard to think that the top 3 can defeat her, (Oh not saying she's weak, but just in a 1v1 situation...she can loop but that won't be enough...). Maybe Capitano can hold his ground but not outright that overpowered
Paimon is the 3rd ig
Ok but u smart "women"... tell me. The irminsoul does not "memories" of aether BUT of lumine. U "debunk" me that too? Bc u just say they ALWAYS traveled together. But one sibling is in the memorier and the other not....
"You were a pair of traveling twins, passing through countless words during your jounrey" the source is literally infront of you in 5:56
The reason why lumine has some informations on irminsul but not aether is unknown, nobody knows why
@@kim_genshin im pointing out that i am agree with u somehow but there i just the irminsoul that completly contradicts ur theorie. Btw not everything that are said can be taken face value. Some books contains lies
@@inos9actually the irminsul doesnt contradict my theory, its supporting it instead. Because Nahida said 2 things:
1) the irminsul doesnt have any informations on descenders.
2) the irminsul has info on lumine.
This means that lumine CANT be a descender let alone be the 3rd
The fatui themselves didnt classify her as a descender
We even learn in a fonatine world quest that for someone to be a "descender" they need to be:
1) from outside the world
2) have a will to rival the world
So from this we learn that not eveyone who comes from outside is a descender
@@kim_genshin hmm thank u for ur specifics. I said irminsoul knows lumine. But no aether. Contradicts ur saying that they ALWAYS traveled together. I too believe THEY NOT REAL SIBLINGS. Is just not possible if IS know lumine but no aether. Thats what im saying too. Lumine IS NOT a descender!
There are a few options to explain why the Sibling is reflected in Irminsul:
1) Through some trickery, Irminsul was made to think the Sibling is part of this world and should be recorded. Perhaps Dainsleif, the Bough Keeper, carries an artifact with this power.
Perhaps Lumine herself did it to hide from the Sustainer. Or to leave a trail for her brother to follow.
2) Lumine was depressed by separation from her brother, and that decreased her will to the point where her will was no longer stronger than the world. As her will recovered, Irminsul stopped being able to record her.
3) Lumine recorded in Irminsul is somehow fake. Perhaps she was created by real Lumine to throw Dainsleif and Sustainer off her trail.
Then explaine why scaramoushe tell us about twin Came to khaenri'ah before the traveler?
Not all of them are always the star you want is a descender
Such as pulling for Yae Miko in a 50/50 chances but only got qiqi instead
Nahida said the twin "suddenly appeared in khaenriah 500 years ago" which is the same time when both twins came to the planet
Even traveler's first character story says that both twins came together at the same time
Did you play other sumeru's quest?
@@kim_genshinyeah and that they woke at different time : the Abyss twin was shortly before the Cataclysm and the Traveler after.
I've been looking but I can't find where it says the 3rd descender died.
In order to have 'remains' of someone, that someone needs to be dead. Otherwise you'd say the gnoses are 'parts' of the 3rd descender.
@@VeraldoAncodini to be honest this is an assumption. There might be a purple eight-sided giant crystal holding their soul and the gnosis is the body
@@FrederickSkinner We call that being dead lol. If your soul has left your body that means you're dead.
Neuvillette said it quoting Skirk, we repeat it
@VeraldoAncodini If this was true. Our sibling and us would be dead before the game started. A descender is determined by the power to control the elements of creation. Let's say our twin completed their journey when they collected all the Gnosis. Then, the false heavens took their power to strengthen the power of the Gnosis to keep Phanes eggshell from further cracking. Detering the "old world" from taking over Teyvat.
Once their power was taken, they became mortal. Thus, why our twin is from Teyvat. Then, they seek the power of the abyss to compensate. If people are getting caught up on the second who came. It's clearly Nibelung. Apep says that their battle caused the world to nearly collapse. Sounds like a job for the Gnosis to fix. It's also said that the first who came and the second who came created the Gnosis to "sustain" this fractured world.
What you said in the video is wrong thought. Because the other twin hasn't seen the cataclysm as the first thing. They had already been in Khaenri'ah for a while before WE woke up. We were unconscious, but our twin was awake. Also, the fact that the twin we have seen recently is a fake can easily make sense by saying: Albedo. Rhinedottir uses the art of Khemia, with which she created Durin, maybe Elynas, Albedo and many more. Who is to say that she didn't, using our genes and chalk, create our twin after Celestia killed them? Who is to say that the connection we have isn't due to that? (First time being separated, how would we know this connection is something new?). This theory is easy to debunk if you use false informations to do that.
0:56
"You were a pair of traveling twins, passing through countless worlds during your journey. Descending upon a continent named Teyvat, you hoped that you would be able to enjoy your time here. But as you awoke among the falling stars, you saw the world in turmoil, a cataclysm raging across the land... You sought to leave this place and move on to the next world, but then an unknown god stood before you, barring the way." (traveler character story 1)
From this and the cutscene we learn that the twins came to teyvat when the cataclysm was happening which we know was 500 years ago -> they tried to escape but were stopped by the unknown god -> traveler was put to sleep by the unknown god for a long period of time while the other twin "suddenly appeared in khaenriah" -> while traveler was asleep, the other twin met dainsleif and traveled the entire teyvat together -> 500 years later the traveler woke up from the deep slumber -> some time after that he met paimon
@@kim_genshin no, from this we learn that the traveler AWOKE while the cataclysm was happening "but as you awoke amongst the falling stars". What we know for sure is that the people of Khaenri'ah knew the twin of the traveler from before, and they called them "Prince/princess of Khaenri'ah" (from the quest Caribert "but to us you *were* the abyss." - Clothar before creating the abyss order). And from the door to Khaenri'ah in Sumeru, reading the notes, we learn that they tried to leave immediately because Khaneri'ah was completely devastated. So they were in khaenri'ah for a while, awake, while we were unconscious. We woke up during the cataclysm and we tried to leave together. Then, the unknown god put us to slumber once more and our twin traveled with Dainsleif (Pari world quest and Caribert once more). We were asleep twice! And the first time was while our twin was in Khaenri'ah while the second was when they became the traveler in the first journey, with Dainsleif. When they met the sinner, in front of which unlike us they bowed down ("o dear creature, why do you bow down?"), and Clothar, who founded the abyss order after said meeting. We weren't asleep only once and it's even more clear when Lumine is the traveler, because she says whe awoke in Khaenri'ah during the cataclysm with those flowers in her head.
And the traveler met Paimon two months later as stated in the beginning of the game btw
@@IkikuroKidenai how would the traveler be put to sleep by the unknown god if they didnt even meet yet? The next paragraphe states that the twins encountered the unknown god and thats when the traveler was put to sleep untill he woke up after 500 years then met paimon
@@kim_genshin the traveler has been put to sleep by the unknown god only the second time. The first didn't depend on them and I never said it did
@@kim_genshin in the "Requiem of the Echoin Depths" quest the traveler Lumine says "That's the flower I've been wearing on my head since when I woke up" and she has it in the cutscene against the unknown god. Which means she's referring to the first time she awoke in Teyvat.
: )
:D
@@kim_genshin :)