Is It Actually Important to Stay Conscious When Seriously Injured as Depicted by Hollywood?
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- čas přidán 15. 07. 2019
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In this video:
We’ve all seen movie scenes where someone is seriously injured and slowly drifting in and out of consciousness. Someone else there will inevitably yell something like, “Stay with me DAMMIT!!!” It’s even sometimes explicitly stated that it’s important for the person to stay awake to keep the Grim Reaper away. Towards this end, the person with them may even be shown to slap the person in the face and/or shake them in an attempt to keep them conscious.
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Sources:
www.pnas.org/content/105/17/6409
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NB...
www.datasci.com/solutions/car...)
www.cvphysiology.com/Blood%20...
For those interested, here's the Medical Confessions podcast the author of this piece is the co-host of :-): Apple Podcasts: itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/medical-confessions-podcast/id1440644061 Android: subscribeonandroid.com/medicalconfessions.com/feed/podcast/ or find them on CZcams czcams.com/channels/i8jkvwpSmGoDtfrIw_HDKQ.html
Today I Found Out As always depends. If they are holding on to something or something like that yes. Otherwise no.
What about staying awake during a concussion
In extreme cold it is better to stay awake only time it helps
Here's an EMT acronym for you FUBAR BUNDY
@@andmake-qg5bi he covered that in the video whenever he talked about a traumatic brain injury. Trying to keep someone awake who has a concussion or is possibly concussed will only serve to anger the person that you're trying to keep awake. The only reason why you may want to keep someone who is concussed awake is so they can more easily give a medical history to professionals. It always frustrates me whenever a medical professional insists that someone stay awake for a concussion. Falling asleep while concussed will not lead to you going into a coma. If you were going to go into a coma, you would fall into a coma regardless of whether or not you're trying to stay awake.
Turns out the body is designed to survive things that would have been almost common for most of human history. Who knew?
Is that why I survived a car accident?
@Roger Dottin I walked away from a drunk hitting me at 80 mph. Thank you Neanderthal DNA, great hand eye coordination, and Buick.
@@briancrawford8751 why Buick?
As a paramedic myself with about 8 years of field experience, while there's no medical need for the patient to stay awake, it's VERY useful for me to be able to keep track of any changes in a patient's condition. If they are awake, I don't have to watch them nearly as closely because that means they're still compensating to some degree, and I can focus more on other interventions (one paramedic in the back of an ambulance has about ten to twenty different simultaneous jobs, and if we can keep the patient awake, and preferably talking or moaning or making some kind of noise, that gives us a much more visual reference for the fact that the patient has not completely decompensated yet.) But if they suddenly become unconscious I then have to watch their airway, pulse and blood pressure like a goddamn hawk, because there will be no outward sign that their pulse has suddenly stopped and I need to begin compressions because not every patient is hooked to the monitor, and dropping a tube carries its own inherent risks, and should never be used flippantly as an intervention.
I will even resort to sternal rubs on patients who are massively intoxicated if they're drifting off, because that sudden step between unconscious and not breathing is fast and hard to spot if you're preoccupied and trying to set up an IV or phone a report into a hospital. I also want them awake because that reduces the sudden chance of them becoming startled and angry and possibly violent when you get them to the ER and ten people are suddenly poking and prodding and cutting off their clothes. And if they are overdosing on opiates/opioids, the step between conscious and unconscious is usually the line where you need to administer naloxone. If they can stay awake, I let them keep their high, because a stiff shot of narcan will mess their day up royally, and can make them immensely aggressive.
You mentioned correctly that being dozy affects your GCS, which does direct interventions, and a patient that is able to make their needs know will help a lot. Being able to say that that pain in your abdomen suddenly became a severely painful tearing sensation, I instantly know I've got a ruptured abdominal aortic aneurysm, and you need to be in an OR, not an ER.
So, in short, if a patient is not paralyzed and intubated with at least a four lead EKG running, I want them awake. But a layperson should never strike or shake or hit a trauma patient, without safe spinal immobilization, you risk causing more injury (generally in that situation you can just watch their breathing while you apply pressure. If they're still breathing, they have a pulse)
You should have mentioned that as long as your skin is intact, you are just fine to touch another person's blood. Even HIV patients with all the ghonnosyphiherpelaids in the world won't infect you through intact skin. So don't be afraid to get in there and slam down your hands on that bleeding wound. Gloves don't even do that much good, blood gets around and inside them all the time. I honestly rarely glove up and simply rely on rigorous hand washing.
Also your writer forgot to mention that if you see a bullet wound or stab wound or other general small-ish hole in the chest and it's making some awful noises or bubbling, slap a hand down on that hole IMMEDIATELY and DO NOT MOVE IT until help arrives. You're trying to keep air from entering the chest cavity and collapsing the lungs, which can happen in mere minutes. You can utterly save a life with that. If you have a piece of plastic wrap or a plastic bag or a rubber glove, you can move your hand and place that over it. The more complete the seal, the better.
Colin Martin I’m so glad you brought up intact skin!
That last one, the Sucking Chest Wound. That was a disturbing training evolution.
I attended a stabbing (ex military medic) on the street. Puncture of the chest cavity but not the lung, so the lung was collapsing but no bubbling. A plastic bag, good timing and some sellotape....reinflated lungs! :-)
@@valerierodger7700 So what happens if you spend time getting gloves and it increases the chance of the victim dying? Rules only matter when they work.
I guess 2 paramedics are less than the ideal number in such situations. Maybe the standard should be improved.
When I took an unscheduled 30mph tour of a Jeep Grand Cherokee by bicycle in 2014, it left me unconscious on the road and the following 3 hours. I had a massive concussion and a laundry list of broken bones. Several bystanders said they thought I was dead (police report/law suit testimony). I was told being unconscious probably saved me from far worse. Given the spinal injuries I had, movement would have potentially worse consequences.
I'm glad I was unconscious. I can also say, if you get to choose a way to _go,_ a massive head injury is at the top of my list. I can't remember anything for those 3 hours. I regained consciousness when they removed the last piece of glass from my face. It severed the nerve for part of my chin and lower lip. That was enough to get me awake and aware.
If anyone had slapped me around or anything like that right after it happened, they could count on being named in a multi million dollar lawsuit. I wouldn't recommend it.
Oh and if you happen to find yourself driving somewhere unfamiliar and need to make a U-Turn or don't have a clue what you are doing, always remember: *you don't matter.* Pull off the road and park safely, LEGALLY!!, pull up a street view map on your phone and learn where you are going like a responsible human being.
Definitely do not make a U-Turn blindly, crash into another car sending them into an innocent pedestrian and/or cyclist commuting to work. You might have to go through a massive lawsuit, lose everything you own, and live with those you've killed and/or permanently disabled.
-Jake
Jake, so sorry you went through such a difficult time. So glad you survived. I hope you have completely recovered.
In some states,just being there involves you as 49% of the blame for your mishap.The lawyers declare quite reasonably that IF you weren't there- you coudn't possibly had this incident
I hope you are in some shape to ride your stuff.I have faced so MANY asswipes
driving impulsively and doing stuff on the roads that cause funeral homes to be overwhelmed.It's almost too dangerous to ride on a country road now,for sure some peckerhead is texting or otherwise NOT seeing you and your bike- until it;s too late
Thank you Samsung,LG, HTC, AT&T,Verizon,Sprint and the rest of the people causing the mayhem (and killing some of your customers)
You could name anybody in multi million dollat lawsuit, but you wouldnt get a cent even if they did something wrong. It is "good samaritan law" and you couldnt be prosecuted if you had good intentions...
@@vaclavsmid5525 One must be careful of commenting as if one has complete knowledge of a concept.In this case, NOT TRUE IN THE USA
Good Samaritan laws protect caregivers from prosecution for medical mistakes, as long as the caregivers are acting in a voluntary manner without any expectation of reward (like the good Samaritan from the Bible story). The protection that Good Samaritan laws provide is not unlimited and is different from state to state.
www.verywellhealth.com/do-all-states-have-good-samaritan-laws-1298836
Jake:
How you doing now? I wish you had a CZcams channel where you tell us what happened. How your life is now. Lot of stuff like that. You really have a great sense of humor, and it'd benefit all of us to learn from you.
I’ve heard anecdotal accounts of people fighting to stay conscious and saying that it actually helped them, but typically the body is so overwhelmed that it’s better to let them lose consciousness if that’s what their body needs. Your body is really good at trying to help itself as best as it can, so if you’re about to black out, you shouldn’t fight against it, because there’s a very good reason. If you’re ever in that situation, just try to stay awake long enough to explain to someone, as best you can, what just happened to you. That helps us out a lot.
Edit: *OOOH, I FORGOT ONE POINT!* If your phone has an emergency medical app where you can put in your medical conditions and any drugs you take, _please_ take a moment to fill that out. If you’re in an acute emergency situation where we have no time to get any sort of medical history on you, that thing really does make a difference. And please be honest about it. If you’re an alcoholic, or if you take viagra, or if you’ve been getting high on your grandma’s OxyContin, we want to know those things. Trust me, we don’t give a shit. We’re not judging you. We need to know the good, bad, and the ugly.
Well said. Don't forget adding supplements as well to the list of meds.
And if you feel you're going to pass out and can safely sit/lie down it can help prevent an additional head injury. I've felt like I was going to pass out a couple of times but was luckily able to sit down (once by leaning on the wall and sliding down) and the feeling passed.
@@imzadi83fanvids7 If you can't sit try flexing all the muscles in your legs. Forces a bit more blood upward and can help a bit.
I've been an EMT for nearly 15 years... I've never once taken a look at anyone's phone for their ICE information. If they can't talk to me then I have bigger concerns than who they are. That's more for the hospital to worry about than the ambulance crew
Good to know, thanks!
@@ScarlettDeLion Lacking any other available medical intervention would slapping/applying pain be useful to a person suffering an opiate overdose?
I'm imagining the pain causing the release of epinephrine and norepinephrine.
I was there when my mom died. All I could do is be there, hold her and tell her I loved her. It's a journey we all must take someday. The most we can ask is someone we love be there to comfort us. Miss ya mom. I will keep your lessons. Stay calm, carry on and do the things that must be done.
Im sorry for your loss u.u
I visited my mother in the care center an hour or so before she died. I don't think she knew I was there.
@@douglasdea637 it happened for me the same way we we're there all day went to have some lunch and she passed in that short time but while we were there she was extremely out of it so being there may have just made it harder on us
LambentLark
I’m very sorry to hear that
Did you slap her repeatedly while screaming "stay with me goddamnit"?
The most commonly depicted “must stay awake” scenario in film is hypothermia. A video specifically for this topic would be a great idea.
As well as head injury
And ODing on barbituates,..
You need to stay awake with hypothermia. If you go to sleep your heart rate slows lowering your body temperature again and you also stop shivering which is a survival thing your body does to try to stay alive.
@@KarlieJJohnson , yeah, I thought it was for specific conditions that they say that in movies. Other than that, they're not saying 'stay awake', they're saying 'stay alive'!
Is it okay if I've done all three in this thread?
To those asking about trying to keep a person awake after a head injury:
“What if you are around someone who experiences a serious head injury or concussion? You may have heard that you should not let the person go to sleep, but is this true? Most health professionals don’t think so. It is generally considered safe for people with head injuries or concussions to go to sleep. In some cases, a doctor may recommend waking the person regularly to make sure his or her condition has not worsened.”
Great video Simon.
Had a friend who hit his head, went to sleep and sadly never woke again. Said he had a concussion that caused his death.
Strange the emergency room discharge orders specifically said to stay awake. I can't remember how many hours. You are probably right though.
I have dealt with doctors and nurses a lot over the last 15 years, and its amazing how little they actually know about the body.
Try telling someone having a cardiac arrest to "stay awake." Doesn't work that well.
I stayed awake during mine, and the entire angioplasty procedure. But, I also realized what was happening and remained calm through the entire ordeal, so I was able to remain conscious and focused. Most people panic, which increases heart rate and exacerbates the problem.
@@daltigoth3970 I collapsed and fell unconscious in a few seconds when I had tachycardia. :/
@@Hyginx Yeah, that can definitely happen. Depends on the cause and other factors. My heart stopped briefly during the surgery, and that was not a pleasant experience...I nearly passed out at that point, and probably would have if they hadn't completed the surgery seconds later. Not a fun experience, to say the least.
@@daltigoth3970 If you had angioplasty then you had a heart attack (ACS), not cardiac arrest. A heart attack is a plumbing problem; cardiac arrest is an electrical problem.
@@jayteegamble I'm aware of the difference, I went into cardiac arrest during the angioplasty, as I said in my last reply...
I had a TBI four years ago. It really doesn’t matter if someone is trying to keep you awake or not. The last thing I remember, before going into a coma for 5 days, is my internal dialogue, “you can’t do this, just go to sleep.” And I was out, despite people trying to keep me awake.
Awesome video! Now we know, there’s no need to shake and smack to keep people awake.
He did NOT just quote Tony Stark's dying moments.
You're right, he didn't (shhh)
😫😫😫😫😫
Well all I know as a former Combat Medic is that it was ALWAYS.... MUCH easier to work on someone passed out than someone writhing around in pain................
although in the defense of an EMT....a car accident can have MULTIPLE types of injuries....
whereas in combat.............we typically see the same 3 or 4 injuries............GSW, gross amputations, heat related injuries and the worst one to figure out.....those who went through any sort of blast....IED, Bombs, Mortar...etc...those are the worst because you just don't know what's happening inside....
Yeah, they scream.
You'd like me then. I have a very active vasovagal response to getting holes in me.
@@diamondflaw Hey, I wield a big needle.
rwest1833_MGTOW stupid question are combat medics armed? or do they just carry their medical supplies with them?
@@clxwncrxwn depends on the situation, but you always have a 9mm sidearm...usually a beretta...and a lot of medics do carry an AR or M16...
Having had the personal experience of being carted off to the hospital in (ironically) Hollywood, CA. of all places, I can personally attest that no one ever slapped me in the face and told me to stay awake. I was strapped to a wood board, in immense pain, drifting in and out of consciousness, not knowing what happened or where I was. A very surreal experience to say the least; and certainly something I never want to happen again
I was in a motorcycle accident back in March. You'll pass out regardless if you want to stay awake.
Rob Webster God bless you sir
Rob Webster and trust me, you probably don’t want to be conscious during the shit we are about to do to you. Intubation, trying to start IVs, physical assessments, etc. - it ain’t pretty. Better to let yourself go and hope for the best on your way under.
Did your road rash turn blue? A buddy of mine had that happen to him like, a decade ago. Looked like someone dumped blue ink into it, which I wouldn't put past him, but he didn't. I got some from a bicycle accident as a teen, and that crap bubbled up like shaken soda! 15 years later, its still not done healing (it shrinks a little more every year)
Not to sound weird, but I’m glad you made it.
@@overworkedcna412 In the army they occasionally asked for volunteers for IV's, just a saline solution. It's not that bad and it clears up a hangover like nothing else. But other then that, it ain't pretty indeed
That Endgame reference at the end. Ouch. Just... ouch. I love this channel 3000.
Following Hollywood's depiction would result in further trauma or death. Who would have known.
Police officer: "I don't want to kill the suspect, so I'm just going to shoot him in the leg." 𝗣𝗿𝗼𝗰𝗲𝗲𝗱𝘀 𝘁𝗼 𝘀𝗵𝗼𝗼𝘁 𝘀𝘂𝘀𝗽𝗲𝗰𝘁 𝗶𝗻 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗹𝗲𝗴
Hollywood outcome: It's just a flesh wound, suspect is placed under arrest.
Reality: Suspect dies within minutes due to arterial bleeding.
Many people will opt for the Hollywood solution because they've "𝘴𝘦𝘦𝘯 𝘪𝘵 𝘸𝘰𝘳𝘬 𝘰𝘯 𝘵𝘷 𝘮𝘢𝘯𝘺 𝘵𝘪𝘮𝘦𝘴."
@BlazePlayz YT Don't know why they do that. Too lazy to Google? To cheap to consult someone with a medical background?
It still doesn't explain why in Hospital soaps where they do have at least one consultant, keep the myth of the "resurrection" defibrillator alive. A defibrillator is a waste of space when a patient flatlines. CPR and pumping the patient full of drugs is the way to go. Defibrillators can only restore an irregular heart rhythm to normal sinus rhythm.
I know of a case where family members of a deceased patient went berserk at the hospital because they found out the medical staff didn't use the 'magic defibrillator' during the resuscitation attempt.
Maybe Hollywood cares more about the dramatic effect than a moral obligation to get things right.
@BlazePlayz YT if Hollywood is doing something stupid, these days 8-9 times out of 10, the producers (aka glorified corporate bean counters) are to blame, overruling the professionals who often spend a good deal of time researching to get the accuracy of what their job is to depict correct.
Ultimately, the people with control of the purse-strings decide what ends up on screen, and they overrule professionals and artists all the time to try and dumb things down to (lower than) the lowest common denominator regurally.
The momentum of movie conventions and the writers aren't helping at this point either, but it's not like the producers aren't involved in either of those aspects either.
This is also why we're flooded with remakes and sequals, btw.
“A significant thing just happened.”
In regular people speak:
AAAAAGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!
Thanks for another great video! Future video idea: Are there ever custody battles where neither of the parents want the kid.
In 1994 I was doused with petrol and set alight whilst sleeping at a camp area in remote far north Queensland. I had 65% full thickness burns, was alone and closest medical help was many hours away by air. I was set alight at 11pm, put myself out and sat there till 6am the next day when I was discovered.
I spent seven hours repeating " don't fall asleep or you will die" like a mantra. It helped me.
Most excellent, Simon! And very good to know. Thanks for sharing this important information.
"I have ligma" - Simon Whistler, 2019...
Can someone educate me what's a deal with that? Meaning, context, what it actually is. Because I see it time to time and googling gets me confused as it has something to do with game streamers.
As in ligma balls?
@@exlibrisas it's just some dumb made up disease. Ninja supposedly had it. It's just a stupid joke.
I too have ligma and it's very painful some mornings I can't even get out of my bed and it's hard to walk.
@@exlibrisas It's a meme. From what I understand, it started as a dumb joke similar to "updog".
(Person A: "I have Ligma"
Person B: "Oh no. What's Ligma?"
Person A: "Ligma balls! Ha Gottem!")
It then spread when Twitch streamer Ninja took a break for a couple days and people started saying he died of Ligma (Thus getting people to ask what Ligma was).
In movies, they usually say to stay awake to people in shock. Also, medically-induced comas are usually for extreme cases, but again, as Simon said, sometimes _not_ being conscious is the better option.
I always assumed that being unconscious would be preferable in many cases, as if you're forced into consciousness you are more likely to be stressed and move around which could further exacerbate any injuries.
Makes sense and to see loved ones freaking out would make it worse for the person hurt
Yes HAL 9000 we know your evil plans.
Better start singing "Daisy" when the lights go out
i once broke my ankle and trust me..
wait no i kept walking and only realized after a scan years later.
Is your ankle fine now?
I has fallen down some stairs and ruptured 3 tendons and walked home. Only after waking up, I was in such great pain that it KOed me... Which BTW gave me the best dream I ever had.
... What was the dream?
@@BallHacks First, I did not realise that I was dreaming. I heard waves and birds and opened my eyes to see the blue sky and that´s when I realised that I must be either dreaming, or something went terribly wrong... It was a beautiful place, warm, but not too hot, with gorgeous beach and lush vegetation and no competition amongst tourists... because there were no humans, nor any sign of civilisaiton other than a park bench next to a path. Someone, was sitting there and asked me to come over to talk with me. That´s when I smelled a repugnant foul odor and opened my eyes for real looking into the ugly mug of my father and my entire body was in great pain again. I F-ing hated everything in this moment, but when I was dreaming, I had no pain and I felt happy, without any worries. I even contemplated for a second, if I could be dead and the idea didn´t scare me. I had no regrets, no expectations, my attention went to this lovely place and I felt relaxed and content.
I´ve never in my entire life ever felt something remotely close to this ever again.
@@edi9892 F
Damn, your really churning them videos out Simon! Cheers!
I hoped you would have touched on that thing in med dramas when they claim the patient has a GCS of 0.
Hollywood and Bollywood have created foolish myths and stereotypes please make a series on busting such misconceptions.
AG. They used to have myth busters
Their's a whole tv show about this MythBusters.
There is also Because Science which is a CZcams channel that does nothing but debunk misconceptions in movies, comics, and TV shows.
Yes once saw a Bollywood man catch a bullet in his hands and throw it back and shoot the guy with the gun. I'm assuming that wouldn't work in real life.
And then there's Tamil movie where all the hero are reality bending super being in human from
In a case of an opioid overdose, staying conscious can really save your life.
Unfortunately, I've already been there... You don't feel like you need to breath anymore and you just want to sleep. That's not a good thing...
I remember saying to myself: "You know if you stop breathing, you'll die... RIGHT?"
I was disappointed this was wasn't addressed. My wife overdosed and the paramedics, the nurses, and the ER doctor all made it very clear to me to make sure she did not fall asleep. They stated if she fell asleep, that her body would probably not be able to breath on her own. I had to keep her awake for hours until some numbers they were monitoring had dissipated. Literally for hours, an attending nurse, me, and my wife (barely) just sat there talking about the most mundane things nonstop. So, to hear that this wasn't 'important', leaves me wondering why the trained medical experts made it such a priority in my wife's case.
shutdown your computer by pulling the power chord.
Really Simon " You can rest now" xD
I think Hollywood should become a hospital after this expert advice
I think Hollywood should stay far away from all the things they know nothing about. IE law, money, medicine, and physics to name but a few. And everyone should remember, if you saw it in a movie... it was almost definitely wrong.
I never really thought of that as mattering for the person who's injured as much as it was for the person saying "STAY WITH ME DAMMIT" because being conscious makes it super easy for everyone to tell you aren't dead. 🤷♂️
(I actually wrote this before watching, so I love that Simon/the writer also went with STAY WITH ME DAMMIT 😂)
Depends how you define dead, most people these days are physically conscious... but no telling if there is a person alive in there anymore
As someone with an active vasovagal response to holes in me, I faint fairly predictably after being punctured.
Was in a nasty car accident over a decade ago..... yeahhhhhhh staying conscious was not gonna happen 🤣 although I WAS surprised they did ask “do you know what day it is?” And “do you know who the president is?” And “do you know what happened to you?” I thought those questions were such bullshit in those medical shows beforehand 🤣😂😲
They asked me those questions too in the ER last fall, when they asked me if I knew who the president was I replied "Unfortunately, yes!" That got a big laugh from all present.
It's to test your short and long term memory. Usually head injuries come with some degree of memory loss.
I suffered a concussion on multiple occasions and witnessed others having one. Without being a medical expert or anything I can tell you it is by no means bullshit. Two of the times I was unable to recall anything that happened over the last 2 months or so, had no idea how I got there and so on, yet I was able to state my age, name and such things.
When it happened to my friend he was unable to say what he had for breakfast and maybe which day of the week it was. At this point another friend (kind of a stoner guy) was really excited that, he in fact knew what day it was, saying it proudly before the injured person could try and answer.
Asking what seems to be random questions to an injured person is also a common thing to do to help keep their mind off the injuries so they stay calm. This helps make it a lot easier to get the injured person the help they need (because they are not freaking out) and can help to prevent them going into shock. Also asking if they know what happened can help bring to light things that lead to the injuries which will help medical professionals to properly treat.
Yep, had those questions and others asked when I had a heart attack earlier this year. Fire Department was on the scene first and asked the questions, paramedics arrived next and asked the same questions again. Nurse in ER asked the questions again. Doctor asked them again. Was starting to get annoyed by it all. They could at least change the questions now and then.
I had a near death road accident relatively recently. Shattered bones but more importantly a loss of 80% blood (also my left foot was behind my right shoulder, which I resolved before help came). Other than discomfort I did feel like preferring to just drift away. The off duty police officer kept me talking, while getting what could have been essential info. When the Ketamine kicked in, bystanders said I talked rubbish. When in the ambulance I did stop breathing a number of times. It's a peculiar feeling not wanting to be alive anymore. Sort of screws with you for some time and even to this day. Anyway, thanks to that copper, my old and new family appreciate your anonymous efforts 👏👏👏
Thanks Scott! And Simon!
In September 2008, I had the unfortunate opportunity to ask a paramedic about this following a near-fatal auto accident. He informed me that while staying awake certainly helped me in flagging drivers on a seldom-used stretch of rural road, that -- provided I had gotten sufficiently far from the flames from my vehicle -- passing out was unlikely to have caused me any real harm.
They offered to let me sleep in the ambulance, but by that point the adrenaline had taken over and I was fully alert until the doctors at the hospital anesthetized me for surgery several hours later.
Counterpoint: Nobody ever died while remaining conscious.
😂
@Michael Smith not true. Ask any EMT, there have been many instances where a conscious person going through shock, has died. You don't always slip into unconsciousness when in shock.
☝️😮... 🤔...😏
Tell that to Marie Antoinette
Lol so true
I think it's more for our benefit, thinking if they are awake and responding (relatively) that it make us feel like it's going to be okay. I remember doing that to my little brother when he was about 8 years old. He was shot point blank in the back of the head with an airsoft pistol. He was bleeding really badly.
Worse than falling asleep, which removes the person from his or her pain, is panic, either in the victim or yourself. I remember helping a kid who had just broken both arms. He was panicking and flopping his arms around. He didn't know how to deal with the pain and was making things worse. I helped him by calmly getting in his face. Someone years ago did the same for me. When you get in someone's face that person's whole attention turns to you. And I mean really get in the person's face. I normally like a lot of personal space, but inches from his nose was the proper distance to have his whole attention. And if you are calm, this will calm the person you are helping. Fake it if you have to. After he was calm I backed up to close talking distance.
As I didn't have any supplies, I had him rest his arms across his chest to splint them. sat him down and laid him back so if shock set in he wouldn't fall. I also helped with the shock by asking him questions that were easy to answer, but kept his mind busy while help was coming. Thankfully it was at a park and so there were lots of people to look for the kid's dad and call 911 while I stayed with him. What were some of the questions I asked? What was his name. Who did he come to the park with. Did he prefer butterflies or monster trucks. What was his his favorite color. I don't remember his name any more, he came with his dad, he prefered monster trucks and his favorite color was red.
What I've always seen is someone with a concussion having to be kept awake with conversation.
The doctor character tells someone else in the room "Keep talking to them. Don't let them fall asleep.".
That or they say to wake the person every half hour or hour or two. I should Google that to see if there's truth in there. Love my sleep, would be unpleasant if ill and someone's waking me.
I had a head trauma and due to the nature of the injury the EMT wanted me to do my best to stay conscious (it was annoying but I just was sarcastic and snarky for most of it). But once I was confirmed stable and we knew the extent of the damage I was told to sleep as much as needed. Sleep for the next 3 days I did.
It's not like you have a choice. When you have a concussion, you have to sleep until it's healed.
I am working to become an EMT I agree with everything you said in this video.
However, it was a bit easy to misunderstand what you mean, at least how I understood it.
As stated, shaking a person so they stay awake will usually not do much and might even be harmful, depending on the problems the patient has. However, it is always nice to keep them awake. Obviously, this shouldn't be done by shaking them like crazy, but what you can do is keep them from drifting off by asking them important questions, like what happened, what symptoms they have, what medications they might be taking, what medical history they have and such, all things that are nice to know for EMS in case the patient does actually become unconscious prior to their arrival.
Now, I'd just tell you why I personally think that it is definitely best to try and keep the patient awake while providing first aid, especially if they've suffered trauma. the reason is the airway. Whenever someone is unconscious, their reflexes like coughing are knocked out, which means that the can't keep their airway clear of slime, blood or vomit, which is precisely the reason for the existence "GCS below 8, intubate!" Rule.
Obviously, you can't intubate a person if you're not trained, you won't even have a tube with you, which is why you turn unconscious patients on the side, as you probably know from first aid courses.
However, this is something that is not really great for a patient with trauma, as that means you will be moving them even more, which might not be great for their existing injuries. Still, it is a necessary action with any unconscious person, which is why you have to do it when a patient does drift too far off. This is why you still want your patient to stay awake, try to keep it that way by keeping them occupied and comforting them.
If you know more than me about the field of emergency medicine, which is pretty likely if you're a trained person, feel free to correct me here, this was just my personal opinion on this after studying myself to death. ;)
This was an excellent video. I learned a lot. Thank you. :)
That thing you said about applying pressure to a bleeding wound: it drives me nuts how most of the time in movies when someone is injured their companions just fall to their knees next to them and start crying/shouting no or apologizing and NO ONE performs anything loosely resembling first aid! This is especially frustrating in movies with a modern setting when no one calls an ambulance!
simon whistler, thank you for helping me understand my daughters death better. it was 32 years ago. i have been haunted by questions i did not know how to ask and you just put my mind and heart at ease. i will sleep better in the future. you have no idea how much these sensitive topics being comprehendable means.
His last statement before his outro, hit right in the feels.
Simon you handsom devil I love you and everyone behind the scenes of this channel and every channel you all work on together or individually!
Cornlips 4 me too. I love Simon. Not gay... Not that there is anything wrong with that of course
@@rgerber lmao I hear you. I would totally go gay for Simon though. I am not gay but it is Simon come on...
Fascinating topic and I've wondered about this too!
When I was younger, I lived in a very hot environment. After doing yard work, I would frequently come inside, lay in the floor under the fan, and promptly pass out. About 20-30 minutes later, I'd wake up and then relax and try and rehydrate for the next several hours. Without question, I was suffering from heat exhaustion and borderline heat stroke and when I passed out, I was barely holding on to conciousness as it was. In retrospect, it might have been heat stroke. I have often wondered if what I did was the smartest thing to do but figured that if it was ever serious, a family member would take me to the hospital when I proved unresponsive.
I guess that's only really useful when someone is freezing to death.
I guess maybe that's where they got the idea from and then started to add it to other situations as well, because they noticed it works rather well dramatically
Pretty sure falling asleep under threat from hypothermia is a bad idea
About that, if you’re out cold you’re out cold. Unless you’re very near salvation by being warmed, even that probably isn’t helping much.
When I was 14 I was on a Cruise I ended up with a UTI that turned into a bladder infection that turned into a kidney and then into septic shock when I landed in Denver I went straight to children’s before loosing consciousness I distinctly remember the nurse saying “stay with us”
Thanks... well spoke and shown with the images
One of my friends got jumped and they hit him in the head with a metal rod. He went to his girl’s place which was right near by, told her what happened and was gonna go to sleep on the couch but she got him up and rushed him to the hospital and the doctor said if he had gone to sleep he wouldn’t have woken up so I always thought if some gets a serious head injury but stay conscious keep them awake until you get them help
This one did it I'm subscribed. Love your work.
Thank you! If I’ve got a concussion and haven’t slept in 20 hours already, I’m taking a damn nap! If I don’t wake up, oh well, at least I didn’t die tired.
I was confronted with this sort of medical ignorance when I was a teenager. I was participating in a Boy Scout activity and hit my head on a brick wall collapsing into a seizure. My Scoutmaster held me down even putting a metal spoon in my mouth to keep me from swallowing my tongue. When the paramedics arrived they apparently berated him, I didn't regain consciousness until nearly midnight of the same day. Since then however my district enacted new policies such as all adult leaders must be certified in both basic first aid and cpr from the American Red Cross also group insurance covering scouts encase of accidents.
We medics do that to have control over life threatening shock.
Thank you, this was spot on
Very good one, Simon. I have held an occupational (sometime called industrial) first aid certificate for quite a few years and slapping a patient was unsurprisingly not part of the course (and would have led to an automatic fail if done during the practical exams for, reasons). There are so many harmful and outdated first aid procedures out there (put butter on a severe burn, jam something between the teeth of someone experiencing a seizure) that it's scary. The job of a certified first aid responder is to rapidly assess the patient based on what they know (what happened), what they can see and evaluate and initiate the appropriate treatment to save a life. There are protocols, one of which is regular re-assessment of the patient, as a change in vital signs, including the Glasgow Coma Scale, are essential in knowing how treatment may need to be modified. I have been lucky - never had to deal with more than a few nasty cuts for the most part and a couple of patients reporting chest pains (those got an ambulance ride and it turned out to be nothing in both cases but it was most definitely treated as life threatening - better safe than sorry). Worst case was when a car load of drunk kids hit a tree when I was at my Mum's place. Ambulance was called, two neighbours happened to be off-duty nurse and EMT, and they handled the heavy lifting of continuing evaluation while I spent 30 minutes doing C-spine immobilization on the one kid until the pros showed up (the other two boys were unhurt and fled the scene).
For all those folks out there who want to help in cases of emergency, some advice. There are recognized first aid courses out there that can give you the basic knowledge to stay calm in a crisis and do no harm. Take them. If you go the internet route, please choose sites that are current and reputable. Know that first aid protocols change all the time - that CPR course you took 20 years ago is way out of date and that's why we have to re-certify every two to three years. Have a basic first aid kit at home and/or in your vehicle (one recommended by an organization like the Red Cross or St. John Ambulance) to be appropriate for what your doing and the health risks of your loved ones. And never slap a patient unless it's a newborn and you want to induce breathing.
I reserve the right to slap said patient if they are a sibling or child of mine....and I will probably never have children.
My sister is (was) an emt and during one request for help (non locking pocket knife cut me literally to the bone when making a circular cut....) she told me....and I quote "stop crying you big baby" (around 14) and after I asked about bedside manner and being nice to your patient I got back, not for my brother...
I figured it was so you can get feedback. Like, "i can't feel my leg" so you know not to move the leg and make it worse
I had a severe concussion last fall. My doctor told me no screens and lots of sleep. I specifically asked her about, oh I thought you had to stay awake for the first, however many hours. She said that only really applies if your brain is actually bleeding or some of your protective fluids is leaking. Basically if you have brain liquid where it's not supposed to be, but not always even then either. Other than that, the less amount of information/stimulation your brain has to deal with, the faster it will heal, so sleep away.
I had a nearly fatal motorcycle accident 15 years ago and staying awake was a priority for me because it don’t want to give up that fight!
This was good information. I once had cramps in both my thighs and promptly fainted. When I came to the incredible pain was completely gone. I recommend unconsciousness for dealing with pain like this.
Very informative !!
*rolls up on scene*
"Why is that guy treating our patient like a punching bag?!"
This was a really good question!
8:24 I didn't expect that hit in the feels 😭
Would just like to add, that yes this does happen. My mom after a procedure like an hour after recovery when she was moved to a room. She thought her blood sugar was dropping and the nurse was getting supplies to test it. All the sudden her blood pressure dropped to 50/30 which if you know blood pressure averages this is super dangerously low, like pulling out the paddles low. The nurse called code blue, other nurses rushed in. They put an IV in her neck, and in the meantime while giving medicine to help her. They were constantly telling her to talk to them and keep talking. For her to keep her eyes open, she keep closing them because she was seeing an bright white light. The nurses were talking to one another while talking to her, mentioning to call family. My mom stayed awake to tell them not to call me and call my brother instead. They said 'well shes talking, thats good' she was rushed to the ICU, eventually her blood pressure raised and she was normal and feeling fine.
She talked to my brother telling him not to tell me. He afterward called me knowing if anything happened and I wasnt told, I would never forgive anyone involved not telling me. We went to see her, and she told us what happened. Shes totally fine now as this happened 2 years ago. Shes not allowed to have many procedures unless absolutely necessary because of this reaction to the anesthesia. And yes I still havent forgiven her for not teling me/letting the hospital call me. And that I had to have been told through my brother.
I always figured “stay with me!” was in effect more about the uninjured person wanting reassurance. If their loved one is still conscious it means they’re still alive, and well enough off to still _be_ conscious to boot!
I've been taught for years to yell at the person instead of assaulting them to access their level of consciousness, breathing and get as much information as possible.
But whats shown in movies is opposite they show that person is kept woken up not to ask them about injuries but just to keep them awake in pain so that they dont pass out which is so stupid its just like assaulting them mentally and physically as whats best for them was to sleep instead bear that pain..for some stupid unknown reason like hollywood shows
Interesting, from what I've heard in emergency patient state of mind have a big role to play.
If patient goes easy or is at peace things except himself are fine he himself gives up.
Often the case in hypothermia, when right after rescue, feeling safe victim just dies because they feel safe and don't feel like struggle anymore.
Debatable. If they've been in a state of prolonged oxygen deficiency (such as _might_ happen in some cases of hypothermia), then the restoration of oxygen can actually cause the sudden oxygenation of built-up chemicals, producing a sudden and fatal accumulation of cellular toxins. Not going to say that the "relaxation death" idea is completely bunk or anything, but it's not the only thing that can show that pattern.
I had an incident of a brutal mugging (involving head injury that did not result in concussion or the like, and a lot of bleeding) and when somebody finally got a hold of Dispatch, I kept asking them to tell me whether or not I needed to stay conscious, or if I was allowed to drift off- and the message I recieved was "sit upright in a comfortable chair and don't pass out."
Makes me wonder if my intermediaries were mistaken.
Thanks for the vid. It really always seemed a bit odd this sort of depiction of slapping people awake, because of the possibility of adding to or impacting or impounding a person’s injuries. There is one nugget of truth in every crazy tv antic. This one’s grain of truth is that you want to make sure a person you didn’t see pass out is actually passed out and not sleeping. You would say “hey sir/mam are you ok” and give them a gentle tap on the shoulder do this a couple times and then call 911 and determine by the scene if there are any visible injuries, also determine if the person has a pulse and give cpr if needed until emergency medical services arrive. But they blow this to a new level on the tv and in doing so teach people the wrong stuff. 🤦♂️
I've watched enough of your videos. Yes I subscribed and rang the bell. P.S. We have Kinder Joy's in Virginia
As a sanitary helper I can confirm that people fading away are a great help while transporting them, and some disappear while moving them due to pain. Others are under shock and don't feel a thing. That's ideal because they can communicate the problem, and can be sometimes operated without anesthetics ... if it's a fast fix.
Perfect! I've often wondered and now we know. No slapping injured people!
This is actually an excellent question.
The EMTs and paramedics have a profound emotional need for a patient to be awake and responsive. A quiet patient frightens them; they're no longer certain that the person has an open airway and is breathing. In fact, medics often won't give patients enough pain meds because the patient's cries are reassuring. They'd rather have a loud patient than a dead one.
i suffered a severe reaction to an antibiotic last year and the 911 operator specifically tried to keep me awake.
My blood pressure had crashed, 70/30 and she was concerned that I was keeping myself alive just by being awake. Even the EMTs kept me awake and answering questions on the ride to the hospital.
I suspect EMTs absorb ideas from Hollywood just like the rest of us.
"When rats were intentionally knocked out...."
Like what with a mallet?
Fun study.
Probably with drugs. Still fun just, ya know, more so for the rats.
Centrifuge induced g-loc maybe?
They read the 1875 land acquisition act in a very monotonous voice.
A very small mallet. One a rat could hold.
I enjoyed your reference to Avengers and 3000. This was positive and informative but I wanted to let you know my enjoyment of your reference. Thanks!
Jeez Simon. That Endgame reference hit way too hard in the feels. It's just too soon. *ugly cries*
What about in cases of opiate overdose? Wouldn't causing pain stimulate the parasympathetic nervous system to release epinephrine?
Its not just in movie I once broke my foot and my buddy was yelling at me and I quote "don't you go to fucking sleep !!"
When I was 5, I drowned in the pool and my mother dragged me up and pushed the water
from my lungs, and was hopefully doing CPR correctly. My aunt who was helping her got frustrated with my lack of response and hit me in the face hoping that would revive me.
All I know is that it took 23 years before my aunt and mother admitted where that
black eye came from. I didn't wake up until the ambulance made it to the hospital.
Well, I certainly don't know the science behind all of this, but when my sergeant was shot, he was bleeding quite a lot. And I stayed with him when the medics transported him. Me and the medics kept telling him to stay awake and fight. We told him to stay angry. We did this to try to get him to stay angry at who shot him and not be scared of dying. Kinda like encouraging him not to give in to the thought that he was going to die. I don't know if that contributed to his survival or not. All the medical people said that it did help. Along with the immediate medical attention, of course. But he still to this day says that staying focused on his anger and will to live kept him from resigning himself to the idea that he was going to die.
Like I said, I don't know if that contributed to his survival or not. But it seems like it.
"I have ligma." I'm just died from laughter. Also, that Endgame reference.
You rush through, pushing people out of the way. You grab the leg and shake it violently and then proceed to repeatedly slap it back and forth.... _"STAY WITH ME, DAMNIT!!"_
Someone approaches _"... Are you a doctor?"_
You reply _"I've seen this before, on the internet, I think it could be Ligma!"_
_... "Ligma what?"_
I got hit by a car a couple years ago. Broke my clavicle and a few ribs. I kept drifting in and out of consciousness and all I can remember was thinking that if I closed my eyes I would die. I eventually passed out and woke up with tubes in my throat and ten people around me. Scariest thing I’ve ever experienced
i has a concussion
apparently for 8 hours in the hospital i asked
"where am i?"
"what time is it?"
"why am i here?"
"when can we go?"
4 days in the hospital seemed like two weeks and i had a disconnect from my body
like my perception was something similar to 3d person camera and slowly over the years ive been getting "resurgences" of connection in my brain
in supprised i diddnt need to be shown how to use a cup
but i have a tiny bit of aphasia and its like i" boggled" my internal dictionary
Still here at 8:51, conscious and well informed. They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but every little helps.
That last part got to Me. I have a good Friend whose passing soon, like in the next week soon. He's been battling stomach cancer for the second time now after He lost His whole stomach and His Wife passed I still remember Her Funeral it was fairly recent and it was Beautiful. Me and Him had a talk a couple months ago about this day that's coming up. He was supposed to be My best Man at My Wedding, which, the Wedding isn't going to happen now anyway, but that's unrelated. Anyway I've texted Him a couple of times in the past couple of days with no reply so it's possible (and understandable) that He wants to spend these last few days with His actual Family, and I can definitely respect that, but the second to last message I sent was I Love You Luis, so as long as He got the message.. He was the Father I still had when I stayed in Virginia when the rest of My Family moved to Florida when I got out of Rehab. This Man taught Me a lot and played a large part in My personap Growth from a flawed boy to what I would like to think of as a Good Man. I Love You Luis.
Great way to end it loved the finale
Great video Simon. Cool subject. It was a little boring. I kinda went catatonic halfway through. 😒
When I had my concussion in grade 9 I remember my mom asking if it was okay for me to sleep as my brain was forcing me to once things calmed down and the Doctor explained that it was normal and a very, very good sign in that it meant that my brain was focusing on healing itself.
Now I don't know how much of that's actually true but it's food for thought.
Before watching- i was always taught that it is important to stay concious if you are concussed to avoid brain damage and avoid coma.
Some 28 years ago, my father cut his finger lengthwise with an cirkular saw. We had him lie down and gave him first aid while waiting for an ambulance (over 1 hour - this was after all north of Sweden). He didnt loose any more blod then you loose in a small cut with the kitchen knife. He did loose his finger on the opertion table, though.
I think the misconception is due to conflation with hypothermia, where staying awake while I'm not sure if necessarily helps but is at least a good indicator of how long they can stay alive.
I've only ever heard this trope used in response to head injury.
Wow, thank you for telling me something I already suspected.