Filmmakers Who Make Money Aren't Sell Outs - Steven Shea
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- čas přidán 23. 02. 2023
- International Award-Winning, STEVEN SHEA has been working in the entertainment industry since he was 16 years old. Starting out in the local television market in the Florida Keys where he grew up, he eventually made his way to Orlando where he founded Abyssmal Entertainment in 2002. His first feature film he wrote and directed, “The Night Owl", was distributed globally in the Summer of 2005. In 2008, “Hoodoo For Voodoo”, Steven's 2nd feature he wrote and directed was released on DVD. Steven garnered some awards on the international festival circuit with the horrific short film “2:22” in 2009, which has been distributed through Hulu & FearNet. “Doomsday County” is a horror anthology film that he co-directed and produced that was released worldwide through Troma Inc in 2013. The comedy web series “The Interrogationists” was released in the summer of 2014 through Funny Or Die. His latest feature is the Documentary "Surviving Supercon" that was completed in 2019. Steven had directed over 25 music videos, for such artists as Kitty In A Casket, The Hellfreaks, The Dollyrots, The Attack, The Bloody Jug Band, WhiteQube and The Crazy Carls. As an award winning photographer, Steven has directed and shot such talent as Harrison Ford, Louise Fletcher, Roger Corman, Deepak Chopra, Lin Shaye, Mark McGrath, Denise Richards, Vivica A. Fox, Rick Fox, Juliana Harkavy and many more. He was a Producer on the feature films Last Shift, Rockabilly Zombie Weekend, The Unbroken, Deadly Weekend, Two Days, and Andre the Butcher. As well as Producer for the Disney Channel series Game On!
Steven's latest film is SURVIVING SUPERCON, a zany behind the scenes look at how a rag-tag Mom & Pop organization pulls off one the biggest pop culture conventions in the United States.
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My philosophy is to create like an artist, but market like a business man. I make art in order to fulfill my creative passions, but so I can continue to finance my creativity, I will shamelessly promote my work, occasionally in subliminal ways. I’m not selling out; I just want to make sure that my work is seen.
I give a company like Criterion respect for including The Rock and Armageddon in their collection. Big loud blockbusters are a part of the patchwork of American cinema. You can't only eat fruits and vegetables. Sometimes a candy bar is what you crave.
My thing is this...we live in a world of economics. Things are bought and sold, yet the art and creative world must exist in this world yet not engage with the process of buying and selling.
Why in 2023 does this stigma still exist? To ask artists to work for free in an economic environment where other participants are buying and selling just doesn't make sense.
This isn't about greed or love or none of that. This is about business. If you make 0$ ur still an artist. They filter your success through dollars to label you a "real" artists yet you can't ask to be paid?
Like I said, this is tiring. Make dope shit and spread ur message. That's all art is to me.
You guys don't know about the videogame biz, but I've been in it for 40 years and nowadays there's "indie" and "AAA". AAA is basically "studio" / blockbusters and "indie" is like "independent". But in the games biz, you're automatically a sell-out/not-indie if you dare to make money from it, get GOTY (Game of the Year awards) or have more than a few people to make the game. The loud talkers; not just the audience (gamers), but particularly other "indie" game developers will bring out the pitchforks and torches at the slightest sight of your "indie" game being successful outside of niche or if it's "too polished". It's insanity and I've just stopped letting other people define and gatekeep. They don't understand that if you don't actually make money, you can't do it over and over.
What about Five Nights at Freddy’s? It’s Indie, few developers, one of the highest selling IP’s out there in the modern day. Film deal, 8+ sequels, books, Merch, passionate fandom…
that is complete false...
I have a weird relationship with Michael Bay movies. On one hand I think he’s one of the most talented filmmakers working today, but I’m also not sure if he’s ever made a good movie and he’s definitely made some terrible ones.
You might not like his movies for the most part but he's hard to hate as a filmmaker if that makes sense. I can't say his technique is lazy by any means. He's trying new ways to point the camera and make a scene memorable. I like to think Bay and Terrence Malick are on opposite sides of the spectrum but have similar approaches. They shoot tons of footage and "find" the movie in editing which can make things confusing if done poorly.
Hush your mouth. #BadBoys
@@matthewpaul6904 I think he may be the best commercial of director of all time. His Mercedes Benz Timeless commercial is wonderful.
What is your favorite Michael Bay movie?
Bad Boys
The Rock
Recently watched Ambulance and enjoyed it.
@@filmcourage
"Ambulance" is no joke a superior movie to most of the top critics choices of last year.
Easily, to be real!
@@Geronimo_Jehoshaphat really? 🤨
Awesome topic!!! Thank you for bringing this type of conversations to the table, because it is important to see things from different angles.
Great conversation, very interesting
It reminds me of a quote by François Truffaud about the movie "la grande vadrouille" (The Great Stroll, also known as "don't look now... we're being shot at!"), the greatest success in France for forty years : "the success of la grande vadrouille makes its appreciation difficult"
Thank you for this Karen.... 🎬
😂 ❤ Awsome talk!
Yep and If you don’t make money you can’t make more stuff. I know Michael bay did the transformer movies I can see why they “sold out” every seat in theaters too. I saw all of them with my nephews, they love them The song by the cars was a nice touch (bumblebee dialing through the radio) I know guys that paint/draw even in music that are really-really good but they for some reason will not listen their guard stays up so tight they’ll probably never make any good moves and they never have. You don’t have to necessarily sell out, but you can’t have one without the other if money is not involved, you won’t get any more tools to create more stuff, LOL it sucks but getting your way is hard work…life happens and it’s over faster than it all started, For all of us. This is still the place 🇺🇸🗽of/for creation/creating. Movies, Food, Music, Air conditioning, clean water, beautiful females, beautiful people all shapes sizes and colors, beautiful land/lakes/mountains/rivers, beautiful big buildings,historical landmarks, we used to have Awsome theme parks with Awsome themes, bringing things to light (library), but it’s looking bad guys real bad everybody all over the world can see just by watching our entertainment awards. I don’t want it to be over I’m afraid it’s all been taken for granted/abused to the point that it’ll never be as Awsome as it was. We had a really good thing, Im afraid it’s going to all be over for everybody now.
And film-makers who work in arthouse films and indies aren't necessarily talented or too risque.
I gotta add i like this guy and I’ve seen him in other stuff? Maybe in a TV show? This is the first time I’ve caught his name. This is a really good point people need to think about. The “art” can’t be seen or heard if money is not involved. Everybody involved in your dream or job coming to light needs a paycheck it’s their goal now as well they need money…bills,food, kids, life. You absolutely can sale out but the bigger anything is the more catch 22 type of decisions you’re gonna have to make or everything would be easy everybody would be millionaires and nobody would go to work LOL
Most people that are loose with the name sale out haven’t put in any real work/time or any real attempt to get anywhere you gotta be rejected and learn, even embarrassed. …when you can share genuine stories of embarrassment trying to get ahead in life and making a fool of yourself me and you can absolutely get along 💯% it should be considered a psychological right of passage 🙌🏼 baptized by embarrassment. 😝🤣
The entertainment industry exists solely to make money, I don't know how anyone can be a 'sellout' when attracting viewers is the point. However, I'm also struggling to understand the point of this interview, "people can like different things" is not exactly a profound or informative statement. And, the amount of people who actually criticize media is so low, it's not really worth talking about, since they have no real influence over the general public. And, why exactly should we not criticize products we pay money for? Are people supposed to stay silent if they don't like something? This makes no sense.
Isn't "general public" jail slang?
@@lowe_sa2976 I think it's general population, but you know, old habits
David Fincher wants to familiarize this glib pundit with his "Jenny's Got A Gun" Aerosmith video - as well as Coppola's "Dracula" and Jean Cocteau's "Beauty and the Beast" - if Bay's "I Would Do Anything For Love" music video looks EXACTLY like Transformers...
Michael Bay is highly creative....but does the same kind of thing at the same time (action (which is hard) only)
*I write what I like ... which is usually what others like too.*
Haha, I don't think this schlub knows how an "Executive Producer" credit can be achieved. He seems to take the word "executive" as actually having authoritative meaning.
Nearly never.
What about some CZcamsrs? I consider some to be sellouts that push the narrative like the Quartling or midnight edge
You mean they're cynically disingenuous about what they curate purely to exploit a certain contingent?
And that would make them an exception to the rule?
@@Geronimo_Jehoshaphat yes and CZcams promote these kind of channels
@@jessegartung294
Hmm...
I may comprehend what you mean; Wide eyed guardians of the glint who constantly reach beyond their grasp to hook slim anecdotal slices of cheese into a tapestry of wild red yarn darting all over randomly pinned thumbtacks to allegedly prove nefarious designs from dark overlords are afoot.
Although they're probably not exclusively wrong.
I don't particularly like either. But Midnight Edge is surely more articulate and affable than the desperate dot connecting of The Quartering though.
But then by deduction I conclude you will affirm other channels of similar subject genre - but different, yet equally ardent ideological slant - which CZcams also dolls up and pimps out to lonely lemmings? Why are some solicitations more or less valid than another when they mutually saunter the same seedy streets, still offering to gratify with counterfeit conflations of rummaged raunch? Your ire can be staved off merely because the ornery ilk you prefer wear the right shiney badge and toe the litigated line to whisper just the sweet nothings that the zeitgeist czars approve, therefore making you feel like your worldview came from your own mind rather than other's cynical mandate to control your cadence and corral your compliant conformity?
If such scepticisms never occur to you, then you have far more of my envy than my pity.
Personally, I've yet to find any pundit in any realm of art on any platformed milieu to which I can genuinely muster much respect for. I find every one of them to be obnoxiously glib and severely lacking more often than not.
Therefore, I'm compelled to criticize them all equally yet uniquely based on their respectively thoughtless droning and speculative blindspots.
The market accepts and rewards your specific talent equals winning the genetic-hard-work-good fortune lottery. We ought to be happy for artists who leave their economic level for a higher one through their work and the high risk of pursuing a one-in-ten trillion shot at earning a liveable income by publicly sharing their creative skills.
I dunno, I feel like there are still ways you can better preserve your integrity even while pursuing the otherwise neutral/positive goal of financial security
We have a different opinion on this.
I like some of Michael Bay's movies but his TMNT & Transformers movies are terrible trash. Being a nerd, that's the only thing that I dislike about him, he has these dumb ideas to radically change the core of these great IPs. Love the action, the explosions, even the dumb simple plot of Armageddon.
The line between artist and sellout artist is the ratio of compromise. Of course there are pressures and some ground needs to be given to help the project get completed, but it's not that confusing. Artist sellouts are still artists, and they can be sellouts too.
No mate, artists make what they write, sell outs panda to the studio just to have a job. Artists don't negotiate 😉🇬🇧
You’re tripping all over yourself to avoid offending anyone. CRINGE ..Sir it’s ok to admit you don’t like the WOKE movement lol. It’s why everyone likes 80s movies … non-woke , no CGI… more REAL
6:24 See this is where he lost me. He said there's nothing wrong with making a lot of money for a picture like Michael Bay makes. But then he supports movies and the business being woke when it clearly makes no money. If you really wanted to support big budget pictures making money, you'd be staunchly against all forms of progressive politics in movies.
Woke films don't make money? This is a continuing phrase by the anti-woke crowd that has no evidence backing it up.
I think selling out isn’t so much about making money, but about PLANNING to make that money.
If you simply set out to make the highest-quality artistic project possible, and it just so happened to end up accumulating massive critical/commercial success (my favorite example being Peter Jackson’s “Lord of the Rings” trilogy), then that’s not “selling out”. All you did was get rewarded by good fortune for all your hard work, and many would say rightly so.
But if your entire PLAN is to enter the most (currently) lucrative genre/market space possible, and you also try to broaden the audience as widely as possible, and you also pursue the most licensing deals possible, and you also try squeezing as much pay out for yourself (versus your coworkers) as possible, then yeah: you’re goddamn right you “sold out” lol
What other explanation would there even be?
I agree with the difference in underlying motivation (planning to make that money vs artistic endeavor).
You are correct. I think it secretly comes from resentment bred by jealousy.
Artists tend to lack financial discipline and understanding. When it comes to business and marketing, it’s even worse. So, someone figures it out they prove that it can be done. As such, the artist who can’t make enough money has to make up a reason that doesn’t make them look like a failure.
Planning to make money is an art unto itself.
@@Geronimo_Jehoshaphat
Really? So all Wall Street analyst-types are magically “artists” as well overnight?
I feel like we’re being … way too loose with definitions here lol
@@RainHex
Hear, hear. Just because it’s possible to sell out doesn’t mean that all artists who earn well ARE sellouts. They had to have planned it all beforehand
Michael Bay sucks because he makes fluff. He makes lowest-common-denominator movies which are _also_ devoid of charismatic, interesting characters to whom audiences can get attached.
Take every bit of vitriol flung at George Lucas...Michael Bay deserves _at least_ twice that. Probably more. Maybe if he made genuinely _good_ fluff...but he doesn't.
He's like Luc Besson: flashy, colorful, very pretty...but genuinely devoid of substance.
When I'm done watching one of his movies, I feel like I've just watched two hours of cookie cutter commercials for cars and toys, and nothing more. That's Michael Bay energy.
Don't watch his movies then. Go watch a documentary about Beavers building dams. I'm sure that's much more interesting to you
@@ericjohnson8326 Triggered much, kiddo? Loooooove Michael Bay, do we? **shakes head sadly**
And you're probably twelve years old if _that's_ how you react. If you're that cranky because someone doesn't suckle at the teat of your favorite director (and the lowest-common-denominator bubblegum he produces), go home and get mommy to give you a big hug and make it all better.
@@ericjohnson8326at least the wooden acting is genuine.
@@kiracollie7115 Besides Megan Fox who was fairly new in the business....who was wooden acting?