Trail of Tragedy: The Excavation of the Donner Party Site
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- čas přidán 4. 10. 2008
- Department of Agriculture
United States Forest Service
Tahoe National Forest
Trail of Tragedy: The Excavation of the Donner Party Site
AVA19387VNB1 - 1994
For many years a plaque has marked the spot where the donner party presumably spent their tragic winter of 1846-47 trapped by the heavy snows of the Sierra Nevada. The Tahoe National Forest working with archaeology students from the university of Nevada.
She said " this is just a wonderful story " .
It's a really sad story , lady .
Feel like having nightmares? Read it all and pretend it's happening in real time:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donner_Party_timeline
I camped there in the mid 90s with my cat. We woke up with four feet of snow on top of us. We were definitely chilling that morning.
how romantic
You brought your cat camping? Lmfao
wow. these people make it sound like the Donner party was a Great success with tons of fun and amazing break through made. the whole thing was a cluster f from almost day 1. it was a horrible horrible tragedy. NOT romantic!
Never take no cutoffs..always follow a trusted trail.
"Never take no cutoffs, and hurry along as fast as you can" is the quotation
Yes and no. If everyone maintained the same trail all the time, nothing new would ever be tried and discovered.
the donner party story is a sad part of the growth of America......worthy of remembrance. great video. thanks for posting
At last, an intelligent comment.
While it is certainly a sad story, the old saying “Nothing ventured, nothing gained” applies.
I bet there's a few million native Americans that may have stories just as sad.
@@VanderlyndenJengold no doubt about it
@@VanderlyndenJengold of course there is. I’m related to some of the people that were on the trail of tears, and there are some stories that have been passed down in the family that are horrendous.
Did that lady at 1:50 really say "just a wonderful story".....Wonderful, REALLY!??
Have you read Virginia Reeds book? Across the Plains in the Donner Party? Try it sometime, it is a great story with a tragic end.
Which also means it isn't a wonderful story.
One of the definitions of wonderful is 'inspiring admiration'. The story of their survival does inspire admiration.
zarasbazaar - then I wish the lady had said "it's a story that inspires admiration" - not a giggly "It's a wonderful story" - she may have meant admiration, but to me it sounded inappropriate. My opinion only - thanks for yours
I have read it - and several others about the Donner party. They touch my heart, but the party also made some pretty stupid mistakes [in my opinion]
What amazes me is how the members of the party are revered as 'pioneers' and 'courageous' when all they did was follow a leader who was unbelievably stupid. Before they began their last ascent, a nearly 70 yo fellow traveler was kicked out of the wagon he was in and NONE of the 60 to 70 other people offered any assistance - he was last seen with feet so swollen they had split open and were bleeding - he was left trail side to die. James Reed was forced out of the camp after he had killed a man in self-defense - he was forced to leave without his own rifle or with ANY of his own supplies - ironically this probably saved his life and it was he who led the 2nd rescue party. These were NOT nice people - and they were stupid. Their story is moving and I have roamed through their camps at Donner Lake - but they brought a lot of their troubles down on their own heads and the heads of their children. It's much more a story of self-righteous pig-headedness, stupidity, racism (let's kill the guides) and spite than it is of courage or honor.
Two true heroes of this saga get rare mention. Two Indians with the Americanized names of Louis and Salvador risked their lives in a expedition from Fort Sutter in an attempt to save this unfortunate group. They ultimately gave their lives - they were shot by a member of the party when found after being warned away by another member that they were being considered for killing and cannibalization.
***** I know, right? Why were these settlers in such a hurry? California wasn't going anywhere...I can understand that if they were prospectors during a gold rush and wanting to get there before the gold was depleted but that wasn't the case here.
They were trying to beat the winter's first snowfall through what would later be called The Donner Pass, and I believe that snow beat them by just 1 or 2 days. That made all the difference in the world, sadly.
Brian Smith you sound like a liberal
Ah, politics. Lets bring it in where its not needed.
Imagine being able to do what the Donner Party did. We have it so dam easy today.
were spoiled now, when we think life is difficult now we need to remember what our ancestors went through
Totally agree, folk complaining over Covid 19. It’s nothing compared to this
They were a bunch of thieves murderers and idiots. They saw the prospect of gold and fortune in California and put themselves in that situation. Instead of just holding out till next spring they decided they could conquer a strange new land before winter's first snowfall.
People were murdered along the way stolen from, and they were brutal enough to kick out the elderly, women and children from their group for any inconvenience.
@@andreac6064 it's actually, nothing at all.
Yeah I'm sure the homeless agree with you
One of our most tragic stories.
Here's somebody who will never know what Liveleak was..
These people ate their roofs and rugs, and then each other. This guy thinks they are going to find "food remnants?" They ate the fringe off their guides jackets and moccasins.
"Just a WoNdErFuL sToRy!"
"It was a GrEaT aDvEnTuRe!"
"ToO bAd they had to start eating each other."
( ͡ಠ ͟ʖ ͡ಠ)
Would be interesting to know if any follow up work was ever done on this project. It has now been 30 years since the group did it’s work.
Dude these people are tripping me out
Show a little reverence, people. Not like those who went through this had the time of their lives on that journey. These people are acting like this wasn't a tragedy of torture and despair that dragged on for months on end.....
Oh wow what a great and moral person you must be! Thanks for sharing, I to love the joy of being offended and being morally superior!
@@Spooky_515 bruh you’re 6 years late to being pressed about that
Do you feel embarassed about what a redditor you were 6 years ago? Or do you still fulfill the prophecy of 2 Timothy 3 in your King James Bible?
You guys are about 130 years too late; C. F. McGlashan of Truckee already dug everything of interest up, including the rotted remains of the cabins, which he sold fragments of as souvenirs beginning in the late 1880s.
Must have been a Trump or Romney Supporter, lol.
Did he rob the graves as well?
No, Bernie supporters are the ones who love theft.
C. W. Kennedy lo
@@troyturton8197 A Trump Supporter from 130 years ago...
That was a pathetic joke.
"..... what GOODIES we find here....." sigh.
If Bridger told me to skip this video I woulda listened to him. Now that is a half hour I can never get back.
Such an incredible lack of respect for those who died - some people have no empathy whatsoever. I doubt any of the people there finding it 'fun' have even skipped breakfast once in their lives, let alone been driven to madness by lack of food.
They chose their own fate who cares
i think it is the height of respect that after all these years the people here know and care who the donner party was and search for evidence of them.
Rare that I comment on these posts. But I’ve always been fascinated by the Donner party. So many people are just mean and ugly inside and it’s easier for them to do it behind a keyboard.
@@itwasaliensyes all those children chose their fate……they could’ve stayed back and lived on the streets ….
Christ you serious? Meh anyone with an attitude like yours almost always life likes to teach them a lesson of humility and empathy.
They killed their native American guides and ate them. Even in their darkest hours they decided to be racist.
I'm happy to see, many other people think the beginning of this video is HORRIBLE & Needs to be Edited out!
"They became cannibalism"
*Slow clap*
Clearly they are archaeology students and not English majors...lmao. I caught that too. I think at one point she said "they ate cannibalism" as well.
Those were visitors to the site, not the scientists.
some of the scientists were pretty bad about it as well.
A R E A L H U M A N B E I N G
Julianne, I know and they also completely destroyed the site!! digging a foot down with spades dragging all the soil out OMG. The worst, that site needs locking down asap and real teams coming in. This is the problem sites get dug up by amateurs with 4yrs training! what a waste of a part of history its scrabbled now.
I'm so disappointed in this documentary. They didn't find anything definitively tied to the Donner party. I'm not sure why they even published this film. We learned nothing.
Thank you for letting me know that they found nothing not even a human bone???
Very, very interesting! Thank you very much…
I remember visiting the place as a kid while on holiday in the US
sadly i lost my batman ring
Irving Stone's Men to Match My Mountains piqued my interest two dozen years ago; I've called the area around Donner Home ever since. Incredible history of the American West permeates the entire area and it's fascinating to see it in a way that validates and supports the legends. Many thanks to the good folks at UNR and the Historical Society; without them we'd know only a fraction of what we know today.
I have that book…..it’s incredible.
half these people say they became cannibalism ,,HELLO ,,sick of being an English teacher ,i AIN'T doin no more
Ha Ha Ha... I know, I noticed it too. Cannibals people... duh, lol.
They were forced to resort to cannibalism. There. How's that?
Don't you do it Billy !!!
Digesting bad language lol
80s synth-pop music and people saying it was "wonderful"....dear God if only the survivors could see what a mockery this video is. I'm only 3 minutes in, and can't be bothered watching the rest.
2:58 "It's too bad they had to start eating each other". *rolls eyes* Guy makes it sound like they were taking bites out of each other while they were still alive. :(
Wouldn’t any hearths or fire damaged trees have been way up high due to the incredible depth of the snow? Didn’t the people who came through later in the summer say the trees were topped due to the Donner party’s’ wood gathering? In the winter of 2022/23, there were 740 inches, a little over 60 feet! There were 52 feet in 1981/82. So I’m thinking that anything left behind would have had to sift and shift down through that snow pack before it was deposited on the ground.
They camped, and remained camped at ground level, with tunnels and dugouts ascending to the surface of the snow.
That 1964 nickle was quite the find
In an episode of the simpsons there was a party store at the mall.
Donner Party Supplies"
18:36 It's a woodworking drill bit for boring large holes into wood, they were looking at the wrong end of it lol
yes because most assemblies in those days used a dowel system not a screw type system like we have - like they were looking for. large hole in two planks of wood held together by a wooden dowel, a system that was never truly abandoned.
They did not become cannabolism. Some of them became cannabils.. this drives me crazy.
People are totally misinterpreting what he meant by "American mythology." After the ordeal was over, many over exaggerated and salacious accounts were published. These accounts with false details have evolved over time and captured the public interest. That's why it is mythology, because it is heavily associated with falsehoods. Yes, cannibalism did occur but not to the extent as was initially reported
you are mistaken, it is considered American mythology because it's tied to the great westward migrations of the 19th century
It's not mythology because it's not a myth.
It's a mix of history and myth, I propose it's myth unless evidence backs it up is it not? I was surprised to see how many of the stories differ of the survivors and news writers at the time. All I known is it was horrible and absolutely incredible the will to survive. These people should not be vilified. Even the older German fellow who survived (his name slips my mind), who seems to have been made into the villain of the story. And yet even with him I get conflicting stories of he went on to be successful and own multiple properties, including... A restaurant...? Lol. And other stories claiming he died alone and penniless (shrug)
Just got back from the Donner camp site near Alder Creek where these excavations went on. The enormous pine that was several hundred years old at the time of this video is now dead, and only a tall bark-less stump is standing, with the main part of the tree lying nearby rotting. To me, it's another unnecessary tragedy.
A lady in the video said that they destroyed a lot of roots of the tree. So they did all that digging for nothing, while destroying a 500 year old tree in the process. WAY TO GO!
The tree was actually killed by Mother Nature in the winter of 1996, the rot from the old fire scar at the base had spread upward enough that the tree succumbed to the winter and broke in half, a good 6 years after this video and archaeology occurred. I know because I worked for the Tahoe National Forest for 17 years. It certainly didn't help the tree that they dug all around the roots like that, but that isn't what killed it, either.
@Daydreams of a Vintage Girl: To your point of having worked there, many more emigrants passed through this area during the Gold Rush which began just a couple years later. So couldn't many artifacts discovered and dated to the period technically belong to later emigrant parties? Not to mention artifacts were collected as souvenirs and sold to benefit the Donner children. Furthermore, the coal fire pit the Donners used became exposed to the elements after the shelter was torn down (or blew down or fell down etc), and as far as we can tell from the area, there are no natural stone formations they may have used as a fire pit (which would still be there if it existed), so point being, wouldn't the significantly harsh elements you're familiar with from your 17yrs service have destroyed evidence of the type of coal fire the Donners likely used? They even said rodents may have spread the coal fragments they did find. Seems the evidence these archaeologists are using is a bit shaky to be so certain (not counting their poor grammar in the video).
slysnide - Yes all very true. The area this dig took place in now a state park (and adjacent national forest land) on the side of Interstate 80. I would presume the same, that the area has been so heavily travelled and impacted by people since the Donner party, that finding any *actual* Donner Party artifacts seems to equate to searching for the proverbial needle in a haystack, in this situation, and even finding any artifacts from the same time period would be difficult to attach to the Donner Party itself. For what it's worth, the park does house a museum & visitor center with many real known Donner Party relics on display.
Vintage Girl: I agree 100%. When I was a teen in the mid 80's we used to follow parts of the Santa Fe Trail. That was heavily traveled & artifacts were easy to find but virtually impossible to date accurately. The hardware used on wagons didn't change much for years so if you find a bearing, or a truck, or bracket or something, you know it's from that era but it still leaves you with an 80+ year spread of time.
If you find a coin purse with dates of 1830,1833, 1838 & 1841 all that tells you is it was lost after 1841. That's certainly helpful but that coin purse very well could have been lost 5 years later. Who is to say the person that lost it had a coin made the year they lost it? It can't be tied to an exact event without lots of supporting finds & that's just not going to happen with the Donner Party artifacts.
People were up there shortly after the rescue collecting things from the Donner Party so they could make a few $$ on the artifacts.
Every group that went up to collect artifacts made their own camp. Countless people went through during the gold rush. It's a high altitude site with lots of snow & rain every year. Things get taken, things get washed away, other things get left by other parties.
Like you say, even if they find stuff from the right time period, it's virtually impossible to tie it to the Donner Party.
Honestly, I wouldn't necessarily even expect to find much evidence of their fires. I would think the burned tree would last longer than charcoal in a fire pit.
It's not like excavating a cave where humans lived for 1,000 years & there is 8 feet of dirt built up. The Donner Party was there for 1 winter. No doubt the burned lots of wood but it all stayed on, or close to the surface & that's going to get washed away easily.
I am inclined to believe the burned tree is accurate. It may not be but it was identified as "the tree" many years ago, when there were artifacts left & the burned area is at least some evidence.
I could be swayed if solid evidence was found elsewhere but, for now, I think the tree site is reasonable.
great adventure...r u kidding me!!!?
why don't they let them rest in peace instead of digging them up...JC...its like some party there at.. those people should go home...
J. Peters Yeah. Silly ppl.
Go take care of the homeless or something. Let the dead rest.
This is "wrong turn" in every sense of the word and I love that movie.
Nice video I'm glad you guys did this excavation
Guys chowing down on a soft serve cone talking about cannibalism. Wow.
They became CANNABILS... not Canabalism !!!!
Who's running this dig?
I only made it 3:40 and then had to quit watching. Very poorly done, folks. It wasn't an adventure, it was a horrific tragedy.
I have watched many UK Time Team videos. I hope this group makes careful records for the future.
Could you imagine if that was attempted nowadays.... Families would perish in the first half a day without their precious smart phones and social media to post things like , I'm in the middle of Nevada taking a shit behind an old pine tree
🤣😂🤣😂🤣
What is amazing is how many women and children survived and many more of the men perished.
women generally have more body fat on reserve
Women and children will huddle up while men are more likely to be solitary.
Approach history with RESPECT
I once almost became live in care looker for the 100 plus year old House on the property Deep in the California Sierra Nevada Mountains above Nevada City CA Where the Donner Rescue Party was Sent From to do the failed rescue, and was supposed to bring Donner Party back too (this house/property).The school house and Horse stable/barn is still standing and super old..the house is big and has no electricity or water. My buddy and his Dog used to be the live in caretaker there. Really interesting stuff. It takes a Lot to live up there.It is WAY BACK in the wilderness.. Your Literally Snowed into the house for Several weeks each winter. Water is from Spring outside. Gotta have Jugs. And need endless candles and lantern fuel etc..also six Cords of fire wood MINIMUM or you die there LITERALLY from freezing trapped in the Snow..Gotta know what your doing up there. Must not of been easy in the 1800's
Thank you, early 90's. Thank you.
I found a number of Old Indians beads in our backyard in Chicago! Sometimes you don't have to venture far? My brother found an old arrow head in the middle of an empty lot, where that old BUSH stood just 5 houses down on Kedzie Avenue, just north of Waveland avenue, (on the East side of the street)!
All sandstone about 3/8ths of an inch in diameter with holes drilled through them! Oh, how I would like to know what tribe lived there, just a few blocks west of the Chicago River? If I remember correctly, the find was about 8-10 inches below the surface? Of course, I assume there were other artifacts there, but I couldn't dig-up the whole backyard? People must've thought I was nuts, maybe digging a grave or something?
I Know that the Potowotomie (spelling,) people lived in the general vicinity, and other tribes too! Oh, how I wish I could have "Brand's" powers and be able to go back in time and visit the area in the early 1700's or so? Just holding those little beads brought me back in time as far as my imagination could take me! Even the tiniest objects bring deep value to the mind!! I love digging to this day, but California and age limit my excursions!!
Roman Bronze statue has been found in someone's back garden in Horfield, UK..
Most of the artifacts they found are from the many ppl that visited that place since the donnor party. It has been an attraction since then. These ppl should know that its common sense
heartless scavengers.
Leave it to a bunch of Californians to turn the tragic Donner Party archaeological site into a theme park..... Pitiful.
It's called "quality time" for the whole family.
Just be a little suspect on any burgers being passed around.
They were from the University of Nevada.
Wow what an ignorant comment. The extent of the Donner Party site is actually a combination of state and federally owned and protected land. There is a small historical museum and a park with interpretive trails which one can hike and read signs about the different historical aspects. Definitely not a theme park. I know because I worked there for 17 years.
Daydreams of a Vintage Girl We were just at the museum last week. It is so surreal to hear, see and read about what they went through.
The little girl at 10.06 is the coolest kid EVERRRRRR!!!!! :D
Gold.
We were just there last week. It is so horrible, what these people had to go through.
WALKING TO CALIFORNIA, FROM MISSOURI?? MY G-D!!
imagine censoring god lmfao
"A part of American mythology" WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK?
That tree has more of an appearance as if it had been hit by lightening not fire on the outside of it.
What's so "mind boggling" to these people that they made it as far as they did? They brought wagons with all the comforts of home, tools, spare parts, food, and supplies.
A WONDERFUL STORY??? That lady at 1:50 says it's a 'wonderful story'. I don't want to know what she does for entertainment! Those people had to make decisions between life and death that noone should ever have to make. In my opinion they should just let them and the remains of their horrific experience rest in peace.
3:12 If that’s meant to be a joke, well, it’s not!! Honestly, the levels people stoop to; poking fun at a group of people trying to survive!! Let’s put them out in the wilderness of the Sierra Mountains during the worst winter recorded!!
and force them to go into it with their entire family, not much more than stone knives and bearskins, and not enough food to last the duration. See how wonderful the story is then, is my thoughts on this.
I have Tam. Reed Diary, I am a direct descendant of her and grandpa J. Reed 🥰.
its been about 30 yrs since this documentary, any new techniques or discoveries since then ?
I remember wearing my hair like that. And I remember those Pepsi cans too! But I don’t remember learning about this in school.
It was not wonderful or exciting- it was HELL.
I think enough time has passed where we can now start referring to this sad, horrific, and yet inspirational saga as 'The Dinner Party' - UHP!
Why do the makers of these videos think we cannot understand the meaning without incessant rattling of the drums?
If Snow was as deep as everyone said it was doint yall think most anything that was left was melted and washed away
As a historical reference, it's strange knowing I wasn't born for another 15 months after this documentary.
I can't see the reasoning behind disturbing the ground at this site. I had heard that the trail was established and identified long ago. It is sacred and should be left in peace.
Roq, how are you going to hunt food in twenty feet of snow? The natives probably spent all spring and summer drying meat and storing up other foods before winter, and a lot of them starved to death anyway. It was pretty routine.
Simply ask UK teams to look and they will find. I know this an older video but this is the most random rough excavation I have ever seen. They dug up a foot with a spade then started looking?? the Donner party wasn't from 100BC anything left will be an inch no more down. and that was just for starters. Ask UK uni's to take a look they will find for you.
I wondered why the were digging so deep myself. Why dig one foot BELOW the tree roots? Yet all of the metal objects found by the metal detectors were within 6" deep. And I agree with Noevilea, that is a lightning strike scar on the tree. Not the result of a camp fire. Also, PooPipeBoy is correct. That is a wood boring auger bit, usually used with a tool called a hand brace.
Unless they too select amateurs like these. Trust me, the US has very competent technology and archeologists of their own. These people however....... smh.
stop saying Sacred Cow
the first thing I think of are all the animals they used and made suffer.... no one thinks about the animals that had to die because of human ignorance. those humans were fools. r.I.p poor animals.
Carmen Morton they had to eat
Animals in the wild often suffer... That's nature...So whether they suffered with these people or as creatures of the wild they'd suffer... and if they were in barns and fed well, they might have hated it... Hey you never know... This is earth. Things suffer here... Just do the best you can... It's not like they had trucks and cars back in those days and they sure didn't expect to die or have to endure what they did either...
That place has been picked over so much.
I would Love to help dig the sight..Awesome History..
They wouldn't have been out in the meadow!! They would have been near the tree line to break the wind
' i wanna find a bone with a bite in it ' i cry for the future . our children have no competent leaders . humanity will get what it deserves .
140 years of looting.
Virtually nothing new is here to be learned. Let the place forget the horror already.
You mean they ate each other up?
Totally agree!!
How is this dig valuable? What could you possibly expect to find at a temporary camp location? At this phase of the journey, the emmigrants had already been foced to abandon their possessions. If you have students looking to donate their time as a field work exercise, fine. Otherwise, I don't see the benefit.
I was waiting for them to dig out an empty bottle of A-1 sauce
It's so sad that when the Donner party stopped in Salt lake, upon hearing of their plans to press on, Brigham Young had told them what his scouts had reported about the early, and very bad winter that was coming, and his offer to stay over was refused!
Lol
Any chance of see a grid record of the finds?
A wonderful story......really??
I hardly think any part of the Donner party story was WONDERFUL" and those that think so are a BIG part of what is so wrong with much of society today!!
i found out im related to some of the people in the donner party
8:01 I'm pretty sure it was picked over before anyone there was even born lol
Just think of the children.
That's so awesome. I love your post. GOD be with you Mike Nichols.
Some of these people are really sick.. Donner Diner , wtf. I find their choice of words of some to be apathetic, callas
Lawl - thank you early 90's.
The story is history and yet sad.
These people doing this and saying it;s romantic are SICK! And watching them laugh and smila just makes me sick!,,, those poor ppl sufffered so much, please show respect to them.
@saletious Dude I'm from the UK and the PBS documentary was screened here years ago as part of an American Experience season. I remembered it through the following years and finally found it as a region 1 version on DVD in the US. So I ordered it and converted Windows Media Player to region 1. Worth it :)
Sometimes thing happen or occur in history that are better left alone as we know the party made some bad decisions and Mother Nature caused the Donner Party more problems than solutions!
Just let them Rest In Peace!
Didn't one of the survivors have a diary or Journal? I maybe not a Survivor but didn't they didn't somebody find one?
@astayonix yeah, I was thinking the same thing! This is a time capsule, not back to the 1840s, but rather, to the strange styles of the early 1990s. :)
nice side-pony tail!
I can't quit understand what they could even find! The snow was 10 to 20 feet deep and the documentary's say they could only bury the dead in the snow ! so unless someone wen't to the site at the first summer after the tragedy I don't think anything would be found ! and now we see these people digging in the ground just don't make any sense ? and I also agree how could anyone call this a wonderful story ? sick
i watched the movie yearrrrrrrrs ago and have yet to find it iwas about 10-15 years old im 54 now its out there my friend
My moms boy friend is related omg that gives me goose bumps thinking about it leave a like if you see this and agree
Why the great story of the Donner Party has never been made into a feature film is puzzling
There was a movie made starring Meredith Baxster. It’s on CZcams
@@fernmeadow20 I think it’s called One More Mountain
When you are told to research the Donner party for your history homework and you teacher gives you this crapy video for 'help'.
You have my sympathy. US Forest Service is very gifted at making crappy videos... lol
This is not much of an obstacle. You've got Google and the Internet at your fingertips. All you do is type in exactly what you want to know about and you get endless articles and videos. Before the internet, we had to fish through hours and hours of microfilm an article indexes just praying to find something that would relate to what we were trying to find out about lol.
When you're too stupid to realize google is a thing
I’m a history grad and I’ve been trying to get in with Forest Service or dept of interior