1990s Electric Car Experiment: The Rügen Project
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- čas přidán 5. 06. 2024
- A classic car connaisseur talks about the forgotten electric car experiment on the German island of Rügen in the 1990s! On the island, various European carmakers like Volkswagen, Mercedes and BWM send in electrified versions of their ordinary petrol powered passenger cars, like the 190, 3 Series and Golf. Was this test a succes or a failure? Find out in this automotive history episode!
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at 4:20 a small correction, in the 90s it was the "Deutsche Mark", we had the Reichsmark in the second World War and up to 1948
He's Dutch. I'm pretty sure, he knew what he said.
that was a joke, the same kind that Prince Philip once made when he spoke to Chancelor Kohl with the famous salutation "Herr Reichskanzler Kohl" which was the salutation in the dawn of Hitlers dictator ship before he became only the Führer.
Could also be the honey trap to identify germans that would correct him.
@@typxxilps "Could also be the honey trap to identify germans that would correct him."
Or coin collector...
Or literally anyone who knows history?? @@AirbornChaos
Oh FFS 🙄
In 1991, in Italy FIAT had an electric version of the Panda ("Panda Elettra").
13:47 and of course, there was GM’s efforts in the EV1 and the Chevrolet S10 Electric (there are only 5 in the world that are still fully operational!)
GM tried earlier in the 80s with the GMC Griffon
Also a series hybrid of the EV1 that had a turbine in the trunk.
GM actually had a huge head start in many respects and look at them now.
Jared at The Questionable Garage has one of those functional S-10 Electrics; originally, it was owned by the Air Force at one of their Georgia bases (unlike the EV1s, which could only be leased, the S-10 Electrics were offered for purchase outright, like any other GM vehicle, predominantly for fleet and government sales).
@@talon262 and as soon as he gets enough data and sees how the different computers talk to each other, he is going to build a lithium ion battery pack that is made of reclaimed Tesla battery modules!
In 1990-2000 PSA (nowadays Stellantis) sold 4x EVs more than GM EV1.
as someone who actually grew up on Rügen im embarrassed to say that i didn’t know about this. But its cool to recognize some places in the Video. BTW its a beautiful place to vacation, would recommend anyone to come here.
Sounded different with the 9€ Ticket :D
I love how unbiased this video is.
Something an informative video should be.
Even got the official name of the Germany currency correct
Thank you for pronouncing Rugen correctly. Then again, you speak Dutch, which is pretty close to German. Anytime an Ed's Auto Review shows up, I immediately watch it ASAP. I've been with you since the third episode.
Babe wake up. Ed uploaded a new car history video
Wow. Thats original.
@@giggiddyThanks, giggiddy
Babe wake up... Oh right... You don't exist.
@@Melrieoi why?
@@user-ox8ii3io8n Because you touch yourself at night.
ED!! I love your videos and get so excited when your notifications come across my phone!
I worked on hub motors in the mid to late 80ties. There were so many unsolved and missing technologies back then. Rare earth magnets were excessively expensive, power electronics heavy and unreliable, computing power still very limited, and no suitable battery chemistry available. It started to change in the early 2000s but the real leap came in the 2010s. And even today weight and range are a tradeoff. Just look at the net mass of the Tesla M3
@@CAVALRY19Dmy insurance is $160/mo and my car drives itself
@@CAVALRY19D The personal car as a concept will be dead in 50 years. EVs are just a last ditch effort to safe a slowly dying concept.
@@CAVALRY19D lithium batteries are not perfect. there's a lot that can be done at the very least in packaging to make them a lot better. for the depreciation, just buy used. evs rn are bargains and they will only get cheaper. and range on properly cooled packs (early leafs don't count, their cooling system is trash) doesn't degrade at the rate many people think.
@@foximacentauri7891 why would the personal car be dead as a concept? I know plenty of people who have two or more.
@@foximacentauri7891 why should it be? If I live in the rural part of my country with no available public transport, I'm not getting rid of my car in any way, neither would anyone with a sane mind.
Watching this while laying in the back of my EV while charging is quite fitting
The music in the background at 11:04 is Re-Development from the Sim City 4 soundtrack.
Very interesting Video, I am from the beautiful State of Mecklenburg-Vorpommern in which Rügen is situated and never knew about this
Love the sim city 4 music!
I thought I was imagining things, but you're right!
My farther in law worked for the Company wich made the Batteries for Daimler. Also for VWs EV-Experiments. He developed the grid of the cells.
what a cool job.
There was also a small obscure project going on with FIAT in the 90s, I believe it was called the FIAT downtown or Zip. However in the real world only some ev conversions were sold, such as the Panda Elettra (YES AN ELECTRIC PANDA) or the fiat Seciento Elettra
Funny to see how many falling for Ed’s “reichmark” remark. 🤭
He is just joking. In Norway we do the same.
Same goes for Poland ;)
My state gov here in the USA tried something similar, putting a small fleet of converted Chevy Metro's into shuttle service over a 40 mile run- it was a flop. No one had reckoned with the tremendous need for heat in our northern climate; gaining it via electrical resistance rather than from the 'waste' heat of an internal combustion engine's cooling system knocked out any chance the little ev's really had.
You are fully right - back then, it would've been a serious drop in range if you draw a kilowatt or so continuously out of the battery.
However, this issue was already solved in that era. There were diesel heaters that performed very well. Although it wouldn't be a completely electric vehicle, at the very least you reduce emissions dramatically in the warm season, and even in the cold season the little 2kW diesel heater would use much less fuel than a gasoline car. At 2kW burner power, you can expect about 1 liter of diesel per 5 to 8 hours.
@@mfbfreak - we knew about that- we'd had gas heaters in our aircooled VW's for years- but the use of two fuels/two separate systems in one vehicle already induces a complexity putting the ev out of contention for average consumer use.
Have you ever considered doing a video on the Enfield 8000? It’s an electric car from the 70s that is very rare.
I still love the EV-1.
The 90s cars look just so muc better than modern EVs .. I drive a 1997 Volvo V70 … I would love if someone build it into a EV
I was thinking about how much better the BWW at 9:07 looked than anything they produce today. You know, the ones with two Peterbilt grilles stuck on the front end. They need to go back and look at the 635 CSi models produced in the 80s. Those were very nice, just gorgeous. Also the Volvo 850 models were great.
All cars now look like they've been pumped out of the same mold at the factory, it's nothing EV specific...
It depends on your preferences, I personally like old cars too, but I also very like how new cars look (not all of them, but at least Teslas are kinda fine)
@@zeoxiro i bought a Passat CC 2008 as 2. Car ... much better fuel Economy, much better driving experience and also the look is pretty nice .. basicly a Budget CLS . But again , everytime i get into the Volvo i just feel relaxed ... its old its slow , its Boxy . You just relax , why bother driving over 100km/h ? It can drive 220 . I tried it but allready at 130km/h the fuel consumption is through the roof ! With a 70L Tank i come around 600-650km Maximum! I usually refill at 550-600km ... the Passat CC ? Same 70L Tank but 750-800km range ! If i drive only Autobahn 130km/h ... probably over 800km , only 100km/h ? Propably close to 1000km ! And its gasoline ! No Diesel
I've seen an electric 245, so why not convert an 850/V70 too? Ok, cost... but if your car is in really good shape, it might be worth. I am dreaming of a converted Citroën XM or CX - which is not as straight-forward as a Volvo because you need to power the hydraulics, too. But even that is possible.
"I want you to go back to the lobby, get some snacks, get back set back relax, as i bout to tell you the........."
This line need a comeback for the ed's auto review OG
No, IMHO it's ANNOYING. I don't need somebody to tell me how to relax.
@@johngraves6878 suits yourself. Its your opinion
Reichsmark , did you mean Deutsche Mark ?
I Loved ICE. I pumped gas, worked at auto parts store, tire store & restored 72’ 240Z & 2 Datsun Roadsters 67 1/2” 1600/ 69’ 2000😅. I’m done wrenching. We own 2 Model Y’s❤️❤️. Never going back 💨. ✌🏻❤️🌎
ED, I would like to say, I love your work!
professional, fun, great knowledge and excellent 👍research.
UK manufacturers was always messing with elecric vehicles like the Bedford CF or GMC Griffon was the first mass produced electric van offered in the mid 80s, but i remember milk carts in the uk were all electric when i was growing up in the 1970s
I remember Margaret Thatcher, and Electric Cars being developed way back then. She said that anyone who developed their own EV could place it on the UK roads - completely free of Road Tax. It never happened, but it was hyped-up back then, and Lithium Batteries hadn't been invented. Plenty of Electric Milk Carts were everywhere in our town too!
Thanks for doing these entertaining, er uh, informative episodes. 👍
My Dutch Firend! - Of course Germany has islands! And not only in the Baltic sea, but also in the North Sea, right next to the Dutch Frisian Islands… 🤣
Love your video series! What baffled me with this one is, that i had never heart before about the Rügen ExperimentI am German and lived in Germany in the 90's. Also i was a real car and techt enthusiast and for sure would have noticed this in the news. (Tagesschau…) - But Nada! Even in the German Wikipedia there is no article about this. 😲
Where did you find so much information about this?
I actually came across one of those electric Citicars from the 70s randomly parked in someone's driveway here in town when I was on a walk years ago!
Great episode as usual. Good job.👍🏻👍🏻
Very interested episode!
5:11 They have Islands in the North Sea too 🤦♂️
How would a dutch know? They cant get there with those caravans.
@@pawsnpistons bycicles. I have heard gossip about Dutch Islands in the North sea which you can walk over to.
0:40 I love how you even pronounce the island's name correctly. Most 'Muricans simply say "Roogen", about the same as if I'd say "Neff York" :)
Cant wait to see a video on the GM EV1 story its such a sad and tragic tale
really impressive video about a long forgottne german experiment and its results I had never heard of or can not remember even though I had been working in the headquarter of the oldest car manufacturer.
How did you find the idea for this very niche topic unknown in germany ?
Toledo in this gen was a liftback)
Thank you Ed. This was interesting from the European perspective about electric cars.. It will be interesting to see what other videos you will share on this subject. Excellent research.
What an awesome surprise to wake up to!
Another E.A.R. Video!!!!
Pretty happy Ed didn't make fun of the original project title Erprobung von Elektrofahrzeugen der neuesten Generation auf der Insel Rügen. But that would have been a too easy joke.
15:26 i can assure you the Citroen and Peugeots were not 'scrapped' they were a full production vehicle, AX, 106, Saxo, Berlingo, Partner. I have a 1998 Berlingo that I regularly drive. Ni-Cd batteries. I love it. They made this model up until 2005. I am in the UK, the van is a rare sight here but it was popular with the French postal service. czcams.com/video/MhULJHDwQcg/video.html
A guy in Yuba City, CA, used to show up at car shows wih a Baker electric car, I think a 1912. It was enclosed and in great shape and seemed to be built quite well. Could you feature that model some day? Baker merged with another company later. Enjoyed the video. Thanks.
Great doc, I love those electric cars. I want to put a modern electric conversion unit in there
Wow, never ever heard of these EVs of the 90s. Amazing research and documentation
Love waking up to a new EAR vid
Hey Ed, Duitsland heeft meer eilanden dan Nederland!😊
An electrified Sexo. I'm sorry. That made me laugh...Sounds like one helluva good night.
Entering as always.
Saxo.
Fun fact:
Alfa Romeo, who now, as one of the last, have introduced an EV (the second Junior), had an prototype hybrid in the 80’s.
thats amazing. making old cars live so much longer!!!!
IMHO according to mobility two other German islands in the north sea are also interesting: Amrum has a bunch of kilometres of road/streets, but not a single traffic light (except on the linkspans for the ferries) and on some other islands like the Halligen AFAIK cars are banned, but the most interesting one is Helgoland: Germanys only offshore island, and it's so small that there are no private cars (AFAIK bicycles are also banned), only cars for special purposes like luggage service and Taxi (onto the upper part of the island), fire brigade, ambulance and waste management, the Police had a Mercedes A-class in the 2000s, but they used it reluctantly because you know the island is so small that you just can walk and no need to race to a crime scene with the car or have a pursuit.
Most other cars were also electric and of Kei-Car size, some were just electrocarts for material handling (that transport goods in larger factories, however these often already got replaced by autonomous robot vehicles 1-2 decades ago)
It has an airfield on the second island (called the "Dune" because it's mostly out of sand) with the longest runway having a length of just 480 metres, slightly longer than an aircraft carrier but without the catapult/ropes, so it's only suitable for STOL/STOVL aircraft.
It's also duty-free what causes the most tourists to just do a daily trip, they come in the morning/noon, buy some stuff, have a lunch and maybe walk around the rocks and then leave in the late afternoon.
The sodium-nickel-chloride battery is interesting, it's also named ZEBRA (because of the Zeolite Battery Research Africa project), and it consists of solid and liquid components and the liquid is molten sodium-chloride - normal salt, to work properly it needs to be kept hot at around 300°C, you can let it cool down and it seems to not decrease the lifespan, however you then need several hours to heat it up again, so only suitable if you don't need the car for the weekend and you can't just start it up spontaneuously, I guess you have to keep it attached to a charger because self-discharging might be pretty high.
11:00 Simcity music !!!!! Great choice !
2:02 to 2:30 is a Chevy Corvair from 1965. I own a 65 Corvair convertible, not electric of course.
I believe the Electrovair ll was a 1967, last year for the 4 door body style. I had a 66 Corv-8 that had the front end modified to look like the Electrovair (air intake below the front bumper). Chevy also made the Electrovair l, which was a 64 4-door. You don't see or hear much about that one. Both cars had lead-acid batteries, which made them heavy and have short driving range.
God I love your videos you beautiful car nerd
If you want to see something crazy, Jay Leno is converting his 1909 Baker electric to modern components.
Un grand merci à vous pour ce sujet très intéressant 👍 En tant qu'auditeur français de votre excellent travail, je tiens à vous dire que votre phrasé est très agréable et accessible pour moi.
Mon opinion est que la VE imposée en France et en Europe n'aura pas l'avenir escompté car au final les VE ne sont pas écologiques, ne serait-ce que leur poids..
Pour moi, 2035 ne sera pas la fin des véhicules thermiques, mais plutôt celle des " enclumes à roulettes à piles " .
Une question pour vous :
Comment expliquez-vous, comprenez-vous l'actuelle gamme Renault avec tous ces SUV électriques et thermiques et l'abandon relatif des autres carrosseries ? Merci de votre attention. 🙏
Thanks for the EV history lesson, Ed !
Ed great episode
I live in Mendrisio and the attempt made here in the 90s was called InfoVEL and promoted by one of the pioneers of ev mobility in Switzerland, who nowadays is still in business with charging station infrastructure. Unfortunately that attempt was way too ahead of the times and ended in 2015. Some of the original charging stations are still around and working, most of them were replaced by new ones running under a different company. I clearly remember the old 106 and similar driving around in silence and they could be charged for free. I think i have even around some old documentational cds of the project
I remember many Citroen and Peugeot around Ticino (Switzerland) in those days, half of them were commercial veichles. There were controversies on newspapers about some problems they had in highway use.
These were never intended for highway use. Max speed of the AX Electrique is about 85-90 kph, which you avoid to drive more than a minute or so because the range is shrinking too quickly. And going uphill means you can get really slow. But it's perfect for city and country roads driving.
@@kiirunavaara Ok but people used them also on highways...
The 1990s in germany? So like, 1991 or 1998? Im not a german, but I feel like there would be a significant political difference between those two times, it would make the story you're telling more complete.
Edit: 1992, wow, germany didn't take long to get spending on random "environmental" projects
I recall an article in the British "What Car?" from 1988 or thereabouts that Audi made an electric car. They used a 100 Avant. There was a photograph showing the loadspace that was taken up with lots of batteries!
They really did try in the 90s and early 00s. Unfortunately the tech wasnt there and the cars were always designed as understated nerd mobiles. Now they're just obnoxious nerd mobiles....
The oil industry also did everything it could to destroy the electric car
@@gerarduspoppel2831 yes, the "oil industry"...it wasn't the fact the batteries of the day at minimum doubled the cost of the car while making it worse in every performance metric possible, no, people would surely fight to pay double for a far less usable car...
@@gerarduspoppel2831 LOL "the oil industry". True is that the battery & electric motor technology wasn't ready yet.
@@gerarduspoppel2831 The same "oil industry" that purchased and buried the patents on the 100 MPG carburetor, right?
@@TheOtherBill . Never heard of that thing.
Why havent i heard of this, this is so intressting❤❤
Thanks Ed.
Great story, I actually visited Rügen with a hired EV (Skoda Enyaq) and we could charge overnight at the hotel. Here in Australia where I live I drive a 10 year old Tesla Model S with almost 400.000km on it, best car I ever had. The cars are great but public charging outside the Tesla bubble is a total disaster. Marketing num nuts in control of charging networks have all but destroyed public opinion about the future of EVs.
I would love to have an electric Corvair. Not the one made in the 60's. I want a regular Corvair converted to a modern electric drivetrain. Actually, any classic car would be a good conversion. But I wouldn't ruin a good original car. It would have to be one that was already worn out and not worth much
Toyota America had an electric Rav 4
But then their CEO said never again. Hybrids, yes, EVs, no.
@@ronaldjohnson1474smart man
Much appreciated!
Henry Ford’s wife, Clara, preferred her Electric Car
they are know as CARB not the "clean air agency"
It's interesting to see Opel name their EV the "Impulse", where as GM (Which owned Opel at the time) called their EV the "Impact". It didn't get released until 1996, and it was called the EV1. I wonder how well the EV1 would've done in those early European EV tests. The NiMH battery versions could do over 100 miles, and it had no problem getting to highway speeds.
didn-t have to go far for the foaming at the mouth at Reichsmark
congrats Ed
The added random SC4 music made my day
fun fact stellantis offers EV Versions of their Commercial vehicles these days
13:12 you should also be noted that the German needs to find alternatives to petrol was drastically eliminated with unification and access to internationally traded oil on a scale that had previously been on either prohibitively expensive for strategically disadvantagous. there was a little point of supplying West Germany with excess petrol products to be smuggled into East Germany, when East Germany famously being short of everything including petrol (especially petrol)
I remember seeing the Peugeot éléctrique at the Belgian car show in the '90s. I liked it but every year I went back hoping that there would be more electric cars, every year I was dissapointed.
Nice!
In Finland was Post office experiment to use electric vans, with battery swap. Range and payload was enough, but winter time they was cold weak. In extreme cold they was hopeless.
People go on like ICE is the same as horse and buggy was. Electric is still a compromise for now. Hopefully it will one day be an improvement instead of a compromise
I miss the innovation that Mercedes-Benz experimented with before they merged with Chrysler. 😢
wait, mercedes is part of chrysler now? how many names does that company own, goddamn
@@TheAechBomb They merged at the end of the 90s - the era of Daimler Chrysler AG with the worst quality they ever offered. Later they separated again, now they are only Daimler AG again. Chrysler is now part of Stellantis, together with other infamous car brands.
I'm sure one or two german islands are actually free of fuel burning cars. One of them is Heligoland. Mainly because where do you want to drive there?
Nice narration - worth to know the long neglection of harvesting energies from vehicle´s surfaces.
Interesting that the vw golf came back about 20 years later with just slightly better range. Actually the same range as some of the other cars in this vid.
Bruno Sacco designed a timeless masterpiece with the Mercedes 190 (W201).
I see one of the remaining Golf 3 CityStromer here in my city from time to time :-)
Thanks for this video😀 and without a company making EVs with longer range and high power, we would face still the same situation as back then 😉
Hello
Seat Toledo looks like a rebadged Passat, which in turn is a rebodied Mk3 Jetta/Bora, which in turn is a Golf with a trunk.
without the pressure of Tesla the car makers, not only in Germany, would still hold tight to the ICE
And, like it was mentioned already, it is Deutsche Mark not Reichs Mark!
And we are happy we don't have THIS currency anymore (unhappy that we now have the Euro, but that is another story)
Those wind turbines in the background of the Mercedes shots look minuscule by today's standards.
Super interesting episode. Just imagine the German government had decided to continue the subsidies. Also flabberghasted at the forward-thinking Opel battery and drivetrain.
Ducktales: Elvira „Grandma Duck“ Coot drives a Detroit Electric
I imagine when Cascadia and San Andreas have large magnitude releases... the California CARB "problem" will be solved.
Kerplunk!
Have a look at the Bizzarrin Kjara from the end of the 90's. Giotto Bizzarrini (yes, the 250 GTO and breadvan, Lambourghini v12 of the 350GT) gave his idea of the (near) hybrid future. Hybrids can be fun!
11:18 Sim City 4 background music!
Somebody better call up Nikki of Transport Evolved
Both the ford ranger and the s10 had electric fleet options for use in manufacturing campuses and large scale warehouses
Not only well-written, generally, but more pointed praise for structuring this story this way. These stories. For structuring this argument in this way. It's the best sort of argument, the one that is evidently the assertion itself. Putting these stories on the timeline, in parallel; not using the term "conspiracy" even once. Just presenting the well-documented history of what the actual industry players were actually doing. Love it. Thanks. 👍👍👍
I love the Dutch accent, I don't think electric cars will catch on but I suppose there is a place for them
The first ev car that I touched was a 1997 ev Peugeot partner. That car batteries required to refill with distilled water!
Wind mills 30 years ago, but they unexpectedly became a "problem" now... 🤯
man i want a 190 electric
I’d love to drive a 190E today with a modern electric conversion. They just don’t make cars like they used to.