Amazing Kodak 250D CINEMA scans ... ECN-2 vision3 film is a must via the Cintel scanner
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- čas přidán 28. 06. 2024
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Midwest Film Co. is doing great work - shop here: www.midwestfilmco.com/shop/ec.... They are doing us all a favor buy offering affordable vision3 ECN-2 film in 35mm cassettes and scanning our film with incredible detail and quality! Their black magic cintel scanner is such a great tool.
See more Vision3 images on my website: corn-violin-e2km.squarespace....
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0:00 Intro
1:18 250D is beautiful
2:37 try Midwest Film Co
3:05 the CINEMA SCANNER
5:02 real ECN-2 development
6:27 the REMJET ...
9:36 how to cinema scan / what is LOG
11:14 editing a cinema LOG scan
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Get Young And Wild by Matt Goodman, Matthew Bento here t.lickd.co/ff9bee45fd06417fb2...
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Get this and other songs for your next CZcams video at lickd.co - Věda a technologie
Great video! I sent Midwest Film Co a roll of Cinestill 800 and asked them to develop in ECN2. They were more than gracious to oblige and scanned it on their Cintel. The results were amazing, I am hooked. The latitude I had in the shots was eye-opening and they suggested I would have even more latitude using un-altered Vision3 with the remjet in place. Great people at Midwest Film Co & the results speak for themselves. Thanks for this vid, Ribsy.
Thanks for watching. Yea vision3 film shines when developed the native way
nice! does that mean that the Cinestill 800 rolls have the remjet removed?
We need more places bulk rolling Ektachrome now that 400' rolls are available to purchase! Having cheap slide film will definitely be a game changer and so far only reflx lab has jumped onto this
That would be pretty cool
I bought an Ektachrome 100D (Eastman Kodak 5294) 35mm 24 EXP and 36 EXP on eBay
You post this video the day after i developed and scanned my own 250d. All I can say is, you're right! It looks fantastic
great minds think alike!
damn, didn't know getting ecn2 developed this way was an option for consumers. definitely will give this a shot one day. only bummer will be that I have to use a crossborder service to ship it back from the states to Canada. you US folk are blessed with the options you guys have
oh yea - it is now!
Brilliant video Ribs, nice to see another place offering this service!
Thanks for watching! Yea this process is worth it
Bro your talking head quality upgrade didnt go un-noticed. Love it. Also the photo results look amazing.
Thanks man! Working hard all around!
Hi Alex. I noticed 🙂 Also, tell Japan to open by March if possible
Damn! This is awesome. I bought a set of rolls and development/scanning from Sibersalz like 3 years ago, and I STILL haven't sent them back because shipping back to Germany is just a hassle and I keep procrastinating. It's awesome to know that there is a place here in the US doing the same thing 👏🏽 Thanks for sharing!
Oh yea definitely! Send them to Midwest film fo!
Bro your shirt, It’s nectar for the gods! I get one bottle a year here in Florida, if I’m lucky enough to find someone with it.
Haha yes indeed!
that is really nice!
keep up the good work!
thanks!
I definitely like the telecine process! A very nice thing to have access to.
Yea definitely. Can’t beat it!
I´m a heavy user of Kodak Vision 3 250D and also 50D and the results are ammazing! Here in Brazil I have a provider that spools the film and sells for 1/3 or 1/4 of the price of stocks as Portra or Ektar. The lab I send my films does an ammazing job but I imagine the results on a scanner like this. Fantastic video!
That’s awesome! Glad you have access to it at such a good price
Awesome video and shots, mate!! Started printing RA-4 inspired by your content, keep inspiring man!! Oh, and how beautiful is that film canister?!
thanks for watching!
Kodak vision + Don of the streets? What an awesome combination man! Loved the results you got!
thanks! yea it was fun - watch this video czcams.com/video/Pw9FdiE-mTU/video.html (you will see when i get ran over by a bike ...)
@@ribsy Oh damn! Did you damage any gear? you might see yourself in this one czcams.com/video/o5eZUn2-Xh8/video.html
Thanks u for this info!
Cool! As I am in Europe I will try the German lab.
sounds good 😀
I love silbersalz35, it’s also Kodak vision but with 14k scans
Yea that’s good
Great video. I'm getting ready to dive into shooting some Kodak cinema films myself. Just can't beat the prices and managed to find a place here in Korea that sell it rolled or in bulk as well as local labs that will process it. Probably gonna grab a 100 ft roll on payday since I bulk load at home.
100ft rolls are hard to come by. Usually 400 is the minimum
@@ribsy Fortunately we got a place here that cuts them down to 100 ft. They also sell it already in 36 exp rolls so I picked up a few of those.
Yes I like that film
its great! im hooked
I appreciate you sharing this information. I use silbersalz because I like their process and film rolling processing with it keyed to be 125 rather than 250. However, it is expensive and I'm not a big fan of having to pay EU VAT in the US. So, your pointer to the midwestern film is really useful.
Glad this is useful!
SIlbersalz in Germany is a great option for people who live in Europe!
But I have to say, if you live in a popular city or area such as New York, I'd definetly look into setting up shop for people with in-house ECN-2 dev + scan setup.
It might be a costly upfront purchase, but I tell you A LOT of people are going to be flocking to Vision 3 stock, especially with the crazy prices we're seeing currently.
To add to this also, I have found motion picture scanners to overall outperform even drum scanning (eg Silbersalz' 14k scanner)
Of course nearly £80-100 might sound like a lot for only 4 rolls of film, but you're also getting 144 Raw 14k scans that just completly makes it worth it for me.
We've all done it, shot tons of rolls of film, but never got around to getting them proffesionally scanned. Do yourself a favour and start getting them scanned as well as developed, it just makes the whole proccess so much less of a hassel in the long run for storing your images/portfolio.
yea vision3 is super popular right now
Interesting process! The Cintel scanner can give you HDR scans. Theoretically you can get up to 15.5 stops of DR range from that ECN-2 film. I think the max resolution is 4K but it's plenty I think for still images. Here's where I think you can get really creative. Since you're using a film scanner, you can colour grade the scanned film in DaVinci Resolve. However there's a little math involved to get the right transforms in place. BMD has a pair of 1D Luts one that takes you from Cintel Negative/Print to Linear (depending on if you've scanned neg or print). Like with any scanner you have a DMin, which means your blacks won't be true black. Linear adjustments help correct for the scanners DMin. On the colour page you can make adjustments in linear or use a 2nd LUT from BMD that converts to Cineon. Cineon is like the OG gamma curve and really what alot of other curves are modeled after (SLOG, CLOG, LOGC etc). Once you're in Cineon, BMD has print LUTs that'll take you from your ECN-2 neg to a print, think Kodak 2383. Since you're using actual film, you can use any one of these LUTs at the end of your chain and then colour correct after you've converted into Cineon log space and before the print LUT (corrections made in Cineon).
im sure the results would be nice but thats alot of work for 1 photo (multiply this by many photos!)
@@ribsy first time implementing and for someone that doesn’t use resolve regularly for sure. But you can save presets of node trees and looks and ripple looks through your photos, just like you would in LR.
I'm going to look into this as I need some guidance for my BMC scans @@TwaynePereira
Timely release, thanks. I bought a 100 foot roll of Vision 3 and bulk loaded it into 20 exp cartridges. (personal preference).
Question for you; You did not set the WB by picking on the border before inverting the tones? That's what I've been doing with C41 forever.
I did buy an ECN kit from FreeStyle and I have 10 rolls of my bulk film to develop. I'm also considering REMJET removal with baking soda first followed by developing with C41, just to see the difference between the two chemistries.
Thanks for posting this video.
the scans are positive images. no inversion is necessary
Silbersalz in Germany has been doing this for years. Only that they use a real ECN-2 processor in a controlled process and have upgraded their scanning from a 4K Cintel to a new and huge 14K Motion Picture Scanner.
We know 😄
@@ribsy have you ever used them?
The scan's perfect for adding your sauce. Definitely grabbing some. BTW, who's Eric Toribio?
i dunno such eric toribio
Honest question: it seems like a lot of process to get maximum editing capability from film. At this point, is there very much difference between the film scan and digital? What is the advantage of shooting this film over digital if that is the case?
Great video! I really loved this and the cinelab one. Quick question, what would be the main benefit of getting Ecn-2 film scanned on a cinema scanner over a still scanner?
Also, I notice that everyone seems to edit their vision 3 film in Davinci resolve, would that be a better option than Lightroom for cinema film? I’d love to figure out how to color grade stills like a movie.
the biggest benefit for scanning is that the vison3 film was designed to be scanned by scanners that product log images. so its the preferred tool without question
i edit my vision3 is lightroom with zero issue. davinci is a whole different mindset
@@ribsy well just upload it in DaVinci and apply any FPE lut and boom, you have beloved classical cinema look.
Very cool video. I think I may have to give it a try. Did you use any filters on your camera to deal with the tungsten film? Also, do you know the name of the German Lab that uses the scanner?
for tungsten you probably should use the filter if shooting in daylight. when developed true ecn2, the color cast is more apparent if you don't use the filter. the german one is siberzalz
@@ribsy thank you
We have the same service here in Germany provided by Silbersalz35.
Can't wait to try it out :)
NVM, the German service was mentioned haha.
The fire at 5:02 WOW
Thanks for watching!
I love the vision 3 stuff, but I kinda hope people don't start shooting ecn2 exclusively because then that much more c41 stuff is gonna go away. After all I find c41 is really how you get the best ra4 prints.
agreed. i think it hobbyists will continue to buy c41 film. vision3 is keeping film alive tho
Hey, I love your videos and I inspire by your work here on CZcams. But how do you protect yourself during developing ECN-2 and C41 films? I heard developers and all the rest chemistry for these processes are very toxic. And it is interesting what you do with all the chemistry after it is done. I’ll appreciate your answers, sir!
I don’t work in a lab so I don’t worry too much
I can see why they'd use the Cintel, they already have it for their film work AND the workflow looks great even for stills. But for what it costs, I'd wonder if it is "better" than a drum scanner, regardless of film type.
Drum scanner is very impractical and slow for a lab that process 35mm at scale. Drum scan is intended for special single images
Wow. ❤!!
😃
since it's on log, don't you think it's better to just use color space transform to rec. 709 (if that's the intended output) in davinci resolve?
Yea that would def work very well. But I prefer to keep everything in Lightroom for the sake of organization
At this point, I'm just going to stock up on vision 3 short ends. C41 film is getting extremely hard to find at good prices. Even something simple as the 3 packs of Fujifilm at the pharmacy and Wal Mart are starting to become more expensive. It's a bit heartbreaking walking into CVS and seeing it cost 30 dollars.
Agreed on all fronts!
We need a touch-less method of removing "the black death"
It’s not too much work tho
Is MIdwest Film CO still in business? the site is up but looked at the address and is not a Roofing and Construction place. They mention in this video another place in germany does it? did they happen to mention that company by name? thx Ribsy!
08:36 what product is this? I need it! Tried out many methods to not get water spots or scratches.. my best way so far is also using destilled water with a bit of photoflow but theses pads looks exactly what I need...
The pec pads?
Go Barça Go! 😁
haha yessir
if ur a pro using cinema scanner, RAW image is really useful. May I know what sensor Cintel uses?
I don’t shit the cintel creates raw. I just don’t know
@@ribsy The Blackmagic Cintel scans to it's own proprietary raw format. Blackmagic doesn't publicize the sensor. Blackmagic's taking over the Cintel scanner line predates them having their own S35 sized sensor in-house
Most of the ECN-2 film I find online is about the same price as the Kodak c-41 films...
vision3 is pro kodak film, comparable to portra. now you can't find portra 400 for less than $15 a roll if you are lucky
Will they do a service to the UK? I used Silbersalz but as we're now not EU (crazy, I know) they make you order 2 packs (ten rolls) and then stipulate you have to return it within 12 months of purchase, which is a bit rich, having spent £140 !
I don’t see why not. Give it a try on the site
You can order normal with silbersalzz again. Check their site. And I think the 12 months thing is more of a legal guarantee thing than anything else.
Also in the uk. Did you have any luck or find a better option ? :)
As my homie Pedro Pascal said a few times, This is the way
Hahaha
Better than Portra? How dare you say that. I’m so damn offended. How dare you speak the truth 😀 Lol. When I developed my first roll I immediately saw that too. You definitely have me interested in sending mine to Midwest having it scanned like that. Well done Ribs!
portra isn't bad by any means. i just def like this way better! (and the price 😅)
Yo, you'll probably have better color in your scans if you take those scans into Resolve and just apply a Cineon to whatever (rec2020, RGB, etc) LUT. Lightroom just doesn't have the tools to really get the most out of a Cineon scan.
I don’t have facts but find that hard to believe. Either way, editing 30+ photos is a workflow nightmare in resolve - LR is no question better in that regard
@@ribsy Hey, didn't mean to come off harsh, was just typing fast on the move. I do have the facts, been working with log footage professionally for 10 years. To get the most out of a Cineon scan, your don't want to wing it by eye with tools meant for photo. It will look amazing out of the box with one click if you use a tool to convert the Cineon meant for it. Lightroom Classic can do LUTs, that would be better, just need a Cineon -> whatever LUT. And, btw, Resolve is WAY faster, if you know how to use it. TONS of tools to keep from re-doing the same operations twice. Lightroom doesn't even come close to the color tools of Resolve, and it's free.
@@TheNateweaver all good. i don't doubt resolve's power (i use it for my BRAW footage). but i rather keep photo editing in lightroom. just much easier in terms of workflow. i'll def look into the LUTs recommendation, thanks
Is it true that analog cine film prints are worse than C41 film prints? This sounds especially strange, given that Portra was based on Kodak Vision. What is your experience? Thank you!
i don't understand what you mean - analogue vs c41?
@@ribsy Sorry. I heard cine film prints are worse than C41 prints. It's true?
My mans got the slappers in the background
lol what you mean?
@@ribsy starting at 1:18... background tracks SLAP. (I guess that's a bay area term 😂)
@@didiMao bet!
I love 250D. Just wondered if you've ever tried Nik and Trick Photo Services in Folkestone (England)? They spool their own 50D, 250D, 200T and 500T and also do ECN-2. Their films are only £6.25 for approximately 30 exposures. Develop and scan (16bit TIFF) is £17. Not sure what scanning process they use for Vision 3 but I was delighted with the scans I had. Silbersalz in Germany I think use a very similar process to your guys here
i've bought from nik and trick, but never did dev. not sure if anyone else uses a cinema scanner
Yes, I bought from Silber but they make you buy 10 rolls now (Brexit). N&T don't scan on cine scanner, that's the difference.
@@neilgenower9950 Ah ok. Silbersalz used to be 4 rolls i think
Color film I only shoot vision 3.
makes sense!
2:50 "there is a lab in Germany" Where is it, does anyone know about it?
Silbersalz
Beter and cheaper than Portra... That was Fuji Pro400H. RIP 😢
they still sell that fresh!
@@ribsy Yeah, but they increased the price quite a lot. The morning they announced the discontinuation I order a lot, it still costs €33 for a five pack 120 then. Now it's €55. I can keep shooting Pro160NS and Pro400H for a couple of years.
10$ per roll is nice, but 50$ for scaning and developing is a bit much. Although it is something special and unique.
It’s not $50
See, this is really cool but FPP still sells Vision3 for $10 and I’m assuming shipping it out to them and the development & scanning process isn’t free. Think I’ll stick to FPP.
👍🏽
so its basically the american Silbersalz35
Sure
What's the price though? 😆
Check the link 😃
Thing is, it is a neutral pre grade film. You can also shoot digital, same same.
Na, ya don’t get it
Still very much looks like an amateur operation using that jobo and wiping off remjet with pec pads. I was hoping they had real lab quality machines for developing ECN-2 with cinema lab quality consistency.
The vast majority of ecn2 labs for stills are going to be like this. The ecn2 machines are designed for motion picture film which is substantially longer than a roll of 35mm film
@@ribsy Looks like Atlanta film co offers real ECN-2 processing for stills which are sent through the cinema processing machines at Kodak Motion Picture Film Lab in Atlanta for $10 a roll. Seems like that would be the only way to go when it is an option.
Basically saltbiltz well done 😂
Another silbersalz comment
#pliny
yup!
Benfica caralhoooooo
🙌
came for the film but noticed the bois Anthony Panza and dusty!! yall should check out Anthony's youtube page yall amazing bmx vids! also amazing film!
Yea they are cool