Preamp Noise vs Room Noise - How I Measure the Difference
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- čas přidán 2. 08. 2024
- It can be hard to tell if noise in your audio is coming from your gear or your recording environment. Here's how I'm making that distinction in my own recordings. All gear used is linked below and all my gear can be found at kit.com/rayortega.
I'm using a 150ohm resistor to measure the amount of noise coming from the preamps in the audio interfaces and recorders that I use to record audio. It's a tougher process to compare one preamp to another, you need to get more technical with it and in most cases my interests lay somewhere between technical and practical. For me, it's just helpful to know how much of the noise I'm hearing in any single recording is generated from noise in my environment vs. my gear. This dummy plug I made helps me do just that.
Most consumer recorders and interfaces supply around 50dB of gain. When you use the dummy resistor to measure the preamp at 100% of 50dB of gain, you'll hopefully get a measurement that is no louder than -75dB avg. RMS. This should generally mean your device will not add any audible noise or any amount of noise you can't get rid of in post-production.
But a better test is to plug in your microphone, set the gain to what you need to record a good level (-18 to -12db peak) and then insert the dummy plug and measure the noise floor.
This number should be well below -75dB cause in most cases you won't be using 100% of the gain in your device. But even beyond the numbers, listen. You can now hear exactly the amount and type of noise your preamp is or isn't exhibiting.
From there you can determine if this is an acceptable piece of gear for your productions and if you hear much more noise in your final recordings, then you have a good idea that it was coming from your environment and that you need to make some adjustments to your recording space if you want to reduce that noise.
Shoutout to / juliankrause where I first learned of this dummy plug for measuring preamp noise and who helped me make my own. Subscribe to Julian!
SUBSCRIBE: / rayortega
INSTAGRAM: / podcasthelper
TWITTER: / podcasthelper
Parts to Build Your Own:
► XLR Male Connector amzn.to/2SRgrRA
► 150 ohm metal film resistors amzn.to/3bhOzMW
► Soldering iron kit (shop for the quality you desire, this is a cheap one but worked for me) amzn.to/3dnMSim
🎥 🖥 📱🎤 GEAR USED TO MAKE THIS VIDEO 🤘
► Audient EVO 4: podhelp.me/EVO4BH
► Focusrite Scarlett 4i4: amzn.to/2ZvQQ1V
► Zoom F8n (updated version of mine) podhelp.me/ZoomF8nZon
►Sony a6500: podhelp.me/a6500kit1BH
► LENS: Sigma 16mm F1.4: podhelp.me/SigmaE16mmBH
► Rode VideoMic Pro podhelp.me/RodeVMP-R_BH
► SmallHD 5" Focus Monitor: podhelp.me/SmallHDFocusBH
► Transcend 65GB SDXC card for 4K podhelp.me/Trans64U3zon
► SmallRig Cage for Sony a6500/a6300 podhelp.me/smallriga65006300BH
► Aputure Light Storm COB 120D amzn.to/2mD7JFC
► Aputure Light Dome Mini amzn.to/2DEIj2v
► Shure SM7B microphone: podhelp.me/sm7bZon
► Adobe Creative Cloud podhelp.me/CC1yearBHdownload
*all links should be considered affiliate links. I encourage you to shop around for the best prices at the time you are viewing this. You can read my ethics statement via thepodcastersstudio.com/ethics. Thanks!
#audio #DIY #preamp - Věda a technologie
Wow, it's been like 5 years since I seen one of your videos man, glad you returned.
Stupid youtube algorithms lol. I don't make a lot of videos but it definitely hasn't been that long, glad you found your way back, appreciate you sticking around!
@@RayOrtega Yeah I see that you actually have more videos. I still remember that video about an ios app for podcasting, I bought it for my ipad like 5 or 6 years ago.
Great vis Ray. Very insightful. Thanks
Thanks, Samson!
I like this:
*But a better test is to plug in your microphone, set the gain to what you need to record a good level (-18 to -12db peak) and then insert the dummy plug and measure the noise floor.
In Julian Krause test he puts the gain at maximum level but for me It's best to measure in a "normal" recording situation, like You have done.
Awesome! This is a great content. Informations are so helpful! :)
Great video! Thanks Ray!
Thanks, Jeff!
You are the only video with an sm7b that I couldn't hear the that annoying white noise. Why can't joe Rogan's podcast have this clean of a sound.
Thanks. I don't listen to that podcast but they either aren't using a good preamp or they might have an HVAC system creating noise in the studio. When you build a custom studio like that, you definitely can create heating and air conditioning that won't leak into the audio and there's no excuse for anyone making money from their show to not use the right gear.
@@RayOrtega Thank you so much Ray for finding the time to reply. Appreciate it. Although, I have to say it isn't the HVAC system since its really present it i'd say most of the YT vids featuring the SM7B. I have a dbx 286s and for the life of me I cant get rid of it. Anyway, thank so much again!
It's amazing that the gear itself creates this noise. I can fix this in post but a cloudlifter seems like the best option for a live stream.
Yeah electrical signals inside are going to have some inherent noise but in many devices today, even cheaper ones, it's a non factor. Using a CL in the case of live-streams will help you get to a level that you need for live which can tend to be louder than what you need to record.
@@RayOrtega Thank you I'm experimenting some background noise in my a mixer I have (zoom livetrack L-8) and seems like I can't get rid of it. It's not loud enough but it's there.
You have registered your channel. I support you.😉👍
My sm7b with the UA710 has an audible noise floor. My motu 828x is at 0db. My preamp is at -7. You can hear the noise floor at PP dynamic when I'm playing quite acoustic instruments. What should I do?
Can i aply this
My main console is Sq6 allen heath and conected to arakkis arc blue broadcast mixer. The signal is to high same as noise hiss level. Any sugestion please
What i should buy , Evo 4 or Scarlett Solo gen 3 ??
I need your help..
I’ve had more noise than I’d like for years and I’ve decided it’s probably my Heil
Hmmm, now I wonder how we can test that;) I so wanted to be done with this once I finished this video but questions always remain lol. I think, in my very unscientific way, I can simply establish a baseline noise sample then plug in different mics and see if the difference shows up in measurements 🤷♂️
@@RayOrtega yeah once you have that baseline it wouldn't be so hard to measure
I think you’ve reviewed the audient evo4 and I was wondering If you had any radio or electromagnetic interference with their it? I’m trying to figure out how to get rid of this high pitch hum/buzz. It comes in an out intermittently.
I did and that was my biggest issue with the device, it seems not as well shielded from interference as other devices. For me, it mattered where I placed the device. Make sure you are not near something that can create interference like too close to a computer or speaker or phone etc. You could be getting a ground loop from the power so try different plugs or power sources making sure cables are crossing microphone cables or other power cables. I did have interference but I was also able to setup in a spot where it didn't pick up any issues, I think the phone being too was what created most of the issues in my case
@@RayOrtega exactly what I’m thinking it is. Because if I touch it or move it the interference can go away.
Trying to see if there’s some sort of diy to get it to ground better or buy a USB isolator. Might try that.
Thanks for answering and helping me confirm my suspicions! It’s been driving me nuts for the last 48hrs! Haha
@@AtomicPixel Cool, let me know if you find something that works better to shield it!
@@RayOrtega HAHAH you won't believe it, but I put a sheet of tinfoil on top and it now works great. Not a long term solution as I'm in touch with Audient Helpdesk so hopefully we can sort it out, but thought it was funny so I wanted to let ya know. :)
@@AtomicPixel Nice. Actually very helpful cause one idea was that the shielding just wasn't enough. That seems to help prove that case. I wonder if opening it up and lining it with foil, at least the top of the inside, would work well or if it would cause issues inside. I might have to open it up and try it! :)
Thanks. What's the best audio interface money can buy in terms of low amp self noise?
That can get really crazy in terms of money, not sure what the top of the top is but the Apollo stuff is pretty great from what I've heard amzn.to/3b6kpyA haven't actually got my hands on one though. That said, I think the returns/difference is pretty small. Most interfaces these days do a great job with gain, the EVO4 I reviewed czcams.com/video/nklTpoxNMjc/video.html has one of the quietest noise floors I've heard and a great price amzn.to/3Gfbo4p but is a little susceptible to interference so you have to be aware of that. Check out czcams.com/users/JayKayRause for a detailed breakdown of the lowest noise preamps. Tell Julian I sent you ;)
dude ray...you just blew my mind
ive always done the noise reduction first and had to do like a 50 percent noise reduction just to get my noise floor to -60 db, i noticed that after doing the high pass filter, i only have to set my noise reduction to like 10 percent to get my noise floor to -60 db
so, is the correct process for reducing the noise floor to
1. high pass filter
2. then do noise reduction?
also, is -60 db the range the noise floor should be?
Cool! And yes, high-pass first then noise reduce. In fact do all your EQ "cuts" (any reduction, no boosts) first so that the noise reduction has less frequencies it has to process. In other words, always do at least a high-pass at 80Hz or as much as you can until it negatively affects your voice that way you reduce noise before you actually get to noise removal software and then run that software for what is left over. I also mention this in my newest video about noise reduction czcams.com/video/RW3WIzdljZU/video.html
@@RayOrtega dang man, i had no idea, you smart man!!
so as you mentioned, a -60 db noise floor is pretty common for a good vocal?
iuno why im expecting the background noise to be like dead silent at -90 db after the noise reduction
@@sungkim465 Thanks. In my ideal recording environment, my levels when quiet while recording are less than -60db and then when you bring that up in post production you should be able to apply a little noise removal to get that down to -70db or less and once you hit -70 to -75db range noise will no longer be perceivable by almost any listener and it's certainly not worth degrading your vocal too much for noise that 99.5% of the audience will not hear but I understand being satisfied with your own expectations but if you start clean and then reduce a little, you should be really happy with the vocal. You can also add some light expansion which I show in the video I linked which will push the rest any noise down further in the quiet parts and while you are talking you won't hear a noise floor that quiet cause it is buried under the vocal. Good luck with your productions!
@@RayOrtega that is Reallllly awesome info ray. wow thank you so much
Is that adobe audition you’re using? What menu option(s) give you the noise floor/ rms info?
Yes, Audition and if you go to the Radio Production Workspace, you'll see the tools for measuring the noise floor the way I did in the waveform editor.
@@RayOrtega Thank you!
Why when you are trying the evo 4, in the rms meter it says 4i4?!?! My interface umc 202 has noise at max gain without mic at -59 rms short term(separate info comment). Nice video
Not sure, what is the timestamp of what you are seeing? I'll take a look, I could find it. I'm definitely not trying to trick you lol. Definitely could be an editing error.
@@RayOrtega I also corrected my comment XD, it's the part at 2:01 (4i4 max gain but I think and evo).
I noticed this too. Little error