RC-One : Polini Belt & Hi-Speed Variator Tested : CVT Upgrades : RC1 : Part 12
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- čas přidán 29. 06. 2024
- My quest to improve the CVT continues with the addition of a longer Polini drive belt and a Polini Hi-Speed Evolution variator kit. The belt is part number 248.037.2 and the variator kit is 241.750.
I'll show you an easy way to measure belt length, correct a few issues with these parts when used with the RC-One and Malossi Over Range kit, make a custom variator holding tool and provide data to show what works or doesn't work.
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0:00 Intro
1:24 Measuring Belt Length
4:54 Low Gear
5:49 Polini Belt Tests
10:07 Variator Unboxing & Comparison
11:41 Fixed Half & Holding Tool
13:07 Torsion Controller
14:19 Ramp Plate Issue
15:30 Drive Face Angles
16:51 Variator Install
19:10 Tuning
20:51 Belt Revisited
22:23 Conclusions
#CVTTuning #CVT #Polini - Auta a dopravní prostředky
Here in Europe we never use Malossi belts..To add to the better dimentions, Polini belt has more grip or less slip. The belt needs time to wear in before it starts doing well. Great video! I like it!
Here in Europe where?
Are u own Europe? Im use only malossi i have bad experience with polini.
Great video, man! I'm glad we still get to ride along on your RC-One Journey! At 2:20 you can just put that tape straight on the belt and remove it for measurement - cut out the middleman!
Excellent INfo Brent! Thank you for the effort Needed to put this out 🙂
Thank you again for such an informative video, your deep dives are awesome.
Brent, that's a great breakdown. Someday I'll find time to make videos of this quality. Thanks for the shoutout on the proper way to measure a belt, we made that particular video a LONG time ago.
i had the same problem with my malossi over range belt and kit on my standard piaggio engine, belt would not sit high enough in the rear pulley. I posted it to your forum and you suggested some solutions. I'm glad you made this video as it answered all of my questions. Guess i was not tripping after all
Nice video Brent.
That ScooterTuning promo looked smoother than last time. 👍
Nice job Brent..
Excellent. Video.
Hey Brent, thanks again for another new video about the RCone. 😊 I think you can make it just a bit faster with a stronger contra spring (e.g. 36kg) and even heavier rollers. 😉
Thanks been watching you for a long time now and enjoy your content. I have the 1pe40qmb. With some goodies
BRENT YOU DONE IT AGAIN ANOTHER MOST EXCELLENT VIDEO YOUR SCIENTIFIC TESTING IS VERY DETAILED NO ONE COMES CLOSE WELL DONE , EXCELLENT INFORMATIVE CONTENT FOR ALL THE SCOOTER FREAKS AROUND THE WORLD 🌍 THANK YOU
Pretty impressive what a few changes can do. Great video as always!
Polini Kevlar Evo belt is an easy 1-2 hp on the 70cc Testa Rossa engines, we use as race in Denmark.
Yeey, a new vid !! :)) Nice job Brent.. just a mention, to be more careful with polini belt, and inspect it more often.. there were belts with quality issues, and many people write about belts snaping.. I bought polini (gates) for stock peugeot 50cc vertical, and belt started to peeling of emediately, after 10 miles test ride...
Just checked it this morning and it looks like about 0.1mm wear in at least 250 miles.
I had almost belt snapping with athena race blabla.Shit quality i never dissapointed with malossi.
great !
That 2t sounds really really good! Lol
I filled the variator ramps with a bit of epoxy and smoothed em out .works the same as a sports variator
great video, keep hitting the gym;)
impressive results brent! waiting for you to try the black malossi clutch springs :)
I've got a Stage6 Torque Control clutch.
interms of variators and the 12.5°angle im pretty sure polini have two types i.e minarelli is 14mm dia hole and piaggio is 16m dia hole hope this helps the search
note the polini torsion controller really hindered performance for me
I think I just saw you in Ocean City MD. I am staying on 138th St. I saw a scoot that looked like yours on the 18th.
😁 I rode to and from OC for a 175 mile trip yesterday. I don't normally go on that scoot other than car shows, but really wanted to for some reason yesterday.
Pretty a crazy 9 second 8th
It's a long way from the TaoTao that takes 20 seconds to go 0-30MPH.
hi brent!
i had the same engine. my cvt setup was: malossi vario, polini beld, polini 3g clutch with the black malossi spring in it and the screw from the clutch at the max, 2fast red pressure spring...... it was coming to life after i had this. but the first thing what you must do is to trow the exhaust away.... its really not the best for the cilinder. i change it to to a roost 100cc exhaust and it turned the engine in a beast
Thanks. Check out the vids after this to see the exhaust that I tried.
its. even easier and foolproof to just stick the tape to the belt in the first place. make sure it overlaps then cut it lay it out and measure it
The other piece of the torsion control is supposed to sit at the clutch side.
You won't strip the splines on the crank because they're hard steel. You could strip the drive pulley groves, them being aluminium, but unlikely if properly tightened down.
Can you give some advice what would be a fairly stock roller weight?
Thanks, great video again!! 😎
A stock weight for what? I probably can't give you a good suggestion TBH, because I've never used this variator on anything else.
I’m doing a similar build on my bugeye zuma la furia malossi rear torque driver and polini variator and belt should fly
i got a polini speed control variator on order and didnt get a new belt, will my stock bando belt work? or cant it make use of the bigger pulley on the polini pulley?
Great quality and informative video!
Because of this video I ordered the variator for myself to try it out, but still waiting for the delivery.😁
Big question is that the Polini hispeed evo 2 will make big difference from stock one.😄
And maybe you have ideas why the belt keeps braking in the joint? I'm thinking to much power could be causing it...
(Piaggio two stroke engine with stage6 Streetrace 70cc and Yasuni C16)
Check alignment of the front and rear pulleys first. See if that shows any issues.
Thanks, I will check that👍
polini has always been my num 1 go to variator 100% without doubt wayy better than the multivar
They aren't too far apart for acceleration, but this does seem like a better design. I'm really not sure why Malossi undersizes a belt. Seems like anyone that knows CVTs would take one look and say we need a different belt after all of the trouble of coming up with the RC-One. I guess it's easier to use the existing Piaggio belt, but I wonder if they have the same trouble. Anyway, I was riding this morning and I was at 13,400RPM at 70MPH+.
@@49ccscootin Italy we use a lot cvt fr4 variators for drag scooters
@@nazzytpr I've never heard of those before, but I looked them up. The way the ramp plate and variator interact is different than any variator that I'm used to. They list a Piaggio 50cc, but 70 and 90cc are listed as unavailable and it lists heavier rollers for a 50 than a 90 (when usually it would be the opposite if all else is equal) so I'm not sure that they'd even have something suitable for the RC-One. Sounds like something else in the design changes... unless Piaggio makes 70 and 90cc stock models and they're totally different platforms.
@@49ccscoot I usually use 4 to 7 grams rollers with 50cc and white-yellow counter spring, on 100ccs I use 3-4 grams rollers with red or harder springs, however I forgot to mention they’re widely used on stock cases category, not on rc-1…
@@nazzytpr Thanks for the info.
Im wondering how this compares to the stage6 variator
For the carb petrol suply issue why not add a 1 to 2 psi fuel pump
597338 briggs and stratton fuel pump might do the trick, as on a briggs it does not push throug the float needle but still adds some pressure to the fuel line 👍
I was trying to keep it simple. Seems to be more of a carb issue. I adjusted the float height about 0.5mm this morning and ran it up over 70 multiple times without issue. For some reason this carb will not stay stable.
Hey Man, I've been following you for a while and wanted to ask what you'd do. I have a Gilera Runner 180 2T, -a beast in scooter terms- top speed around 100+ mph which I think is way beyond I'd need in everyday use, because the front becomes pretty unstable at high speeds. What would you suggest: should i go with lighter rollers or just keep the current roller weight and go for shimming out the front pulley with spacers to decrease the top speed and increase acceleration. I dont need that of a top speed, I'd happily trade it for even better acceleration. Thx
See if you can get more acceleration with roller tuning. If not, just stay out of the throttle and don't take it up to those speeds.
Hey Brent what battery do you use for mvt digital direct ignition mine is a motobatt 12v mtz5s , can I go on a higher ahmp like from 5ahmp to 8ahmp motobatt battery , what's your suggestion??
I use a MotoBatt MBTX7U (8Ah). I don't know how much capacity matters for me. Being kickstart only, I basically just need lighting power.
Hi! What do you think about trying stage6 oversize variator? It is larger than polini!
I'm not against it, but I don't really wanna buy variator after variator right now.
hi my stock belt runs about 8mm from the edge of the variator based on marks. Do you think I can just shim it out slightly and get some extra top speed? .. Stupid question but can the belt fly off if it goes too far out?
If the belt is not reaching the outer edge of the variator, adding shims won't help. Shimming would be more likely to net less belt travel in the front pulley. You'd need less drive boss length or a wider belt (possibly just a new belt if yours is worn) or a longer belt. If the belt is too long it could be pushed out of the front pulley, assuming the pulleys can close that much and the belt is wide enough.
Hi, I have been watching your videos, specially the ones on the TaoTao. I have got the same GY6 motor based scooter which has been working fine, but today it started to make a clicking noise from the clutch assembly. The scooter is all stock, but it has more than 5000km under his belt. Furthermore I also noticed that the rear wheel sometimes does not rotate freely, but it looks like I am pulling the brake a bit (which I am not). Rotating the wheel backwards it frees it a bit, to then bind again after a few meters. Have any idea what the issue might be?
Check your brake system first. If that's good, then you'll need to take a look at the clutch and CVT and then the gearbox. Drain the gear oil anyway and see how that looks before you call it done, even if you find something else. Sorry this is not a "check exactly this" answer, but sometimes you have to do the work to find it. It's time to go over the whole CVT anyway IMO. I like to clean and inspect them pretty regularly.
@@49ccscoot thanks for the reply. CVT and clutch will be replaced with belt. Brakes too.
@@onlyvintagewatches You don't necessarily have to replace those things, just inspect and clean. Here's a detailed CVT inspection video :
czcams.com/video/2EjW-iSP-Q8/video.html
The rear brake should be a simple inspection, assuming it's drum. Make sure the cable is adjusted properly and that nothing is hanging up. If you think the brake could be the cause but aren't sure, you could back the cable out till it's obviously not pulling the brake at all and then see if the same thing happens when you rotate the wheel. Most of the drum brake components should last a long time.
@@49ccscoot thanks again for the follow-up. I met an old man (retired mechanic) the other day and he had some parts laying around from all the scooters he has (six in his garden house.... and counting) and he agreed there was something wrong with the CVT and belt. He took some tools and we disovered the belt was about to rip and the clutch was so worn it needed replacement anyway. Since he had these parts (used but in better condition than mine, I checked) he replaced them all: CVT, clutch and belt. Brakes need to be replaced as well, but he didn't have any and I did not want to push him, since all he took for the parts and job was a pack of beers... Germans...
@@onlyvintagewatches Ah. Glad you're getting it done then!
Hey thanks for all the info that you've provided. My Question is how do you know what size belt would I need for a Tao Tao VIP future champion handsome. I bought my scooter used and didn't run. I've bought a new centrifugal clutch and variater even though it didn't need it but the belt I bought for it is 669-18-30 it fits loose any ideas or information will help out a lot since I broke the one I had on it. Thanks
The 669 is usually the short belt for the 139QMB.
www.49ccscoot.com/faq/whatbelt.html
The 729 belt is what the info you gave me says. The 669 belt is what I had on it and until I put on the big bore kit I hadn't had a problem with it. But I really appreciate the information you provided.
@@guarddog73 Make sure the belt is at least nearly all the way to the edge of the rear pulley. If not, maybe a torque driver or contra spring issue won't let the belt get tension.
Hello great vid, one question. I bought a variator and didn't order a drive face will it be okay to run the stock one short term?
If it's an over range, I'd wait to get the matching fixed half. If it's a standard upgrade variator, it will probably work OK. Some do, some don't. You can check the angle of the vari and your stock fixed half to see if they match or are close. It's best to have them matched. If you don't have an angle finder, some phones can do that.
@@49ccscoot Thanks will do
Thing is those come from philipines cost coins and are sold for tripple price 😁
Can you use 50cc cvt parts in a 200cc gy6 engine. Does that really matter they look the same to me. Thank you very much.
You may be able to swap the rear pulley. Probably not the variator without some custom work. Belts work on whatever they meet the specs of.
My question is. I see that 5.25gr of rolles gave the best result,
Why do polini have in the kit 3.8gr and 4.3gr ??
Since your test in 4.375 seemed light.
One size fit's all doesn't really work and I don't think they want to include a whole lot of weights. There's a big difference in the RC-One's output vs a 49cc stocker or even a 70cc sport or midrace engine. The kit is for a Piaggio engine so those weights probably work well with some Piaggio setups.
One question...you have a great setup and its one of the top line,or high end of the malossi production...just wondering,how the hell is possible that piaggio zip during malossi trofeo hits 107 Mph top speeds...seams unreal to say at least....
I'm not sure what the rules are there. If they can mess with them, I'd guess porting and fine tuning of everything. You're definitely not taking an RC-One out of the box and doing that speed.
@@49ccscoot thats right,but such a difference in power trough porting and fine tuning...the engines are brought up to 32-33 Hp on 14800 rpm..cca..by the way,watching your previous video I decided to buy a Stage 6 EGT and wit your detail explanations will try to fit it on my piaggio NRG 2018.. thnx for that :)))))
@@kex2160 I don't think you'll regret it. EG is a great tuning tool and it's way easier to avoid melting things with EGT vs CHT that I relied on previously.
Hey, can you help me finding interchangeable parts for my cvt? I have a 125cc Aprilia leonardo from 1998. I really want it to scoot faster and quicker
I can't say that I know anything about them. I searching and didn't find much. I found sites listing performance parts, but it's all pretty much universal sort of products... which makes me think there may not be performance parts on the market. That means you'd be in for a lot fo effort trying to match up and measure things to see if maybe they could work or be modified to work. TBH, sometimes it's just easier to get a scooter that already has a bunch of parts made for it if you're into modifications.
I have used the Polini Hi speed variator for years on my 2 stroke Piaggio NRG fitted wit a 70ccm Airsal head and cylinder for years... the belt isnt really that crutial as long as it is a performace belt.. Polini, Malossi.. dosnt matter
Honestly when considering the variator and belt combo, I could go either way with both if I were just riding. It runs strong either way. It's when I looked at numbers that the choices mattered more to me.
I've been using Polini, Malossi, Stage6 belts.. what ever they have in stock really. I use a Doppler crankshaft with hi secondary crank pressure.
I would like to get an RC1 engine one day. Until then I have my Genuine Roughhouse 50 with Polini BBK performance variator ect. Needs more CVT options back pulley seems too small. I know id have to modify the case so no rub for this but. Is there a overrange kit for a genuine Rh50 sport BBK used to be named rattler 50. I know a few CVT parts from a gy6 50 fit and work. Do you have any suggestions or do I just not have the right scooter for an overrange kit preferably like Polini Hi-speed type?
Polini has a Hi-Speed vari for the Roughhouse and Malossi makes a torque driver (not the whole pulley). ScooterTuning has both. Not sure if you can get much closer to an OR kit with the Roughhouse.
@@49ccscoot Thank you very very much for the information. Is there anything else you would recommend doing to get it's most low gear and full high gear? It would be nice to find a bigger back pulley and better too than stock back pulley. The belt doesn't seem to seat (belt doesn't ride on outer edge) like yours does. It also appears it could go into a higher gear as well. It's like the back pulley has restrictions to how far it can close and open the only start part left of the CVT.
@@michaelkosinski5671 Sometimes the grooves aren't as long as they could be in a stock torque driver, though usually people try to mod them for the opposite end (speed). Always check without the fixed half of the front pulley installed because that will show you if the belt may be too short or if the drive boss would need shimming to get more travel. Check the belt width vs spec. Could just be a worn belt.
Good video.please Czech subtitles in all videos.
Thanks. Turn on closed captioning (on English CZcams it's a "CC" button in the bottom right area). Then go to settings, which should look like a gear in the same area. There is a "Subtitles/CC" option. Choose that and then select "Auto-translate". A menu should come up with Czech as an option.
unfortunately, there are no Czech subtitles to choose from in the automatic translation
@@littlemonkey7783 That's strange. I can choose them when I watch. 🤔
thank you, I found out that Czech subtitles only work on PC. They are not available on mobile.
@@littlemonkey7783 I just checked on my phone as well. Even with the app, it doesn't work. It's a great feature that they need to fix. CZcams tells creators to look at platforms that viewers use and make sure content is good for those platforms. Meanwhile, they leave out an important feature on mobile that helps a lot of people.
I don't get there is a problem with all the over range or only on the RC/C-one?
I wouldn't call it a problem. The Malossi OR kit for Piaggio works quite well. This is just a little improvement for acceleration times. Again, something that you probably won't notice or care about unless you are drag racing and paying a lot of attention to data. Possibly better for top speed as well.
try bando belt
Which one?
You could have measured the "roll out" with a sewing tape, which would have been much easier and efficient.
Just cut the belt and measure it 🤣
Gates belt's
🛵💯🔥🚀🏁ВК напишите мне, Ангули Ачмиз✊
I was told the Polini Hi-speed is a flawed design and they don't work correctly. I been following @scooterswapshop for a while now and they swear by it that it's flawed. I was never able to get full travel out of it when I had one, it was oddly strange.
I can't speak for full travel on the speed side, but the results speak for themselves for acceleration. It's an easy enough to get longer belt and the Polini vari handles the wider belt easier. It's not something I'd say everyone should run out and buy. The Malossi works quite well too. There's some other company in Europe that someone posted on the forum making a longer belt for it as well. Kind of a shame Malossi didn't make a belt to get full travel of the rear pulley after all that it must take to produce this engine.
🇺🇦