Top Five MOST IMPROVED Characters in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate
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- čas přidán 26. 10. 2023
- Today I want to make a video discussing which five characters were most improved in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate from a competitive standpoint since we now have over four years of meta development and progression.
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#SSBU #Top5 #Smash - Hry
You said a lot of times in this video that the meta is becoming punish oriented and I agree, you get punished a lot harder nowadays. Unsafe move on shield? Can be punished by footstool options. Went offstage? Can be punished with a brutal ledge trap. Tried to run a tournament? Punished by Nintendo's legal team.
"Tried to run a tournament? Punished by Nintendo's legal team" 💀💀💀
@@nefalissys9630"try to host a family get together smash tourney" get punished by that same legal team cause no fun allowed
@@nefalissys9630It's facts though 💀
Oof
@@treasure9342 "try to host a family get together smash tourney" get punished by that one guy who plays too much, beats everyone on one joycon and ruins it for everyone
3:10 Low key, I think the best buff ICs got was the change they made to up b where it now allows Nana to sync with Popo for up b even if Nana is in special fall. This basically allowed Ice Climbers players to save Nana in situations where they previously couldn't before and made it less punishing on the player if Nana's CPU used up b in a stupid way while recovering. A good chunk of playing ICs is playing around the mechanics that actively screw you over, and this made it a decent amount easier.
Steve can also be considered a notable contender for most improved character. When the character first came out, players were initially very mixed on the character, and while he was hated in online tournaments early on due to Minecart in input delay, he was only considered high tier at best, and it took this character a very long time to develop to the monster he is.
The key thing is that Steve players optimized the crap out of Create Block, with them discovering that building walls of blocks is a very viable strategy to utilize, and certain block placements can disproportionally help his setups and survivability. Further advancements to Steve tech further pushed the character to ridiculous territory. Most of the stuff discovered is definitely unintended by the developers (he is easily the most complex character to implement into the game), but the thing is by the time all of this was discovered, it had already been over 1.5 years since he released and half a year after the final balance patch, meaning that all his busted tech survived past updates due to how ridiculously long it took to find them.
Good video dude. It is insane just how much the opinions of GandW and sonic have changed as the meta developed
Seeing that early tier list with Samus and Pac-Man as low tiers makes me surprised to not see them mentioned in this video.
Your videos make me anticipate Friday every week, thanks Vars 😁
I think Sonic's improvement is mainly due to Sonix playing him. Like you said he barely changed at all since 1.0. Since there is only Sonix as a top level sonic main , of course the average level of the player base in tournaments is ginormous. But there's a huge gap between Sonix and the others, so i don't really think Sonic is top 2. It's not the character that changed, but a very good player showing what he's capable of, just like Amsa and Yoshi.
Wrath and KEN are very much top level Sonics too, and it was only recently that Sonix overtook KEN as the best Sonic. KEN still does very well despite that.
Nah man Sonic is actually just broken. He’s effectively similar to Steve because of his speed, safeness, and option coverage all around
and Wrath in particular is actually starting to approach Sonix’s level. It’s just that there’s even more to this character than the surface level
@@ChainsSSB KEN played Sonic since the beginning of SSBU. Nobody called Sonic broken then, he even switched to Sephiroth for a while. And Wrath... I mean he's good but are we really gonna compare him to Sonix? The point is: if Sonic was so brain-dead and OP , wouldn't we see more of him in competitive?
@@fhtswstudios4260 Sonic is broken, but instead of an execution barrier like say Fox; Sonic has a mentality barrier. It’s pretty easy to abuse Sonic’s safe defensive and offensive routes, but to some people it just looks too exhausting. That’s why I wouldn’t really say Sonic is a ‘hard’ character imo
@@RealBroccoliHour I totally agree, Sonic's not hard by any means. Except when a character is top 2, you'd expect a bit more people to try him at high level. He is not underplayed at all at mid level, but you scarcely see him in tournaments
I have an idea for some of your videos. You could always revisit characters based on how the meta shifts. For example: if we see a spike in Joker, Falco or Sephiroth users, you could jump in on why that is and *why everyone plays them now*.
But we still have so many why no one plays level characters to explore: Duck Hunt, Villager/Isabelle, Little Mac and Pichu.
And why everyone plays: Mario, Lucina, etc.
This video tells me that we need a new version update
another banger vars!
Sadly were not getting version updates, and now not even getting tournaments anymore, which is sad, and even though sakurai didnt want smash to be this competitive, he must be sad to see his work dying in flames cause Nintendo dosent care
I just wanna say, public opinion on steve shifted from mid/lower mid tier at best to uncontested best in the game
That one Izaw video aged like an open jar of mayonnaise... left outside... during a heat wave in Mississippi.
A video i would really like to see is talking about Donkey Kong. Mainly, i want hear about your thoughts on his gameplay.
I've been around FGC eports so much I just tune out "complaints" about characters being too strong/weak until we're at least 1 year meta in. Some stuff needs to develop before we realize how good/bad a character REALLY is
Lmao remember when every single dlc was the new "best character in the game" EXCEPT Steve?
@@Moss_Dude yep for the longest time. Steve was just a joke character
@@Moss_Dude its crazy how STEVE ; the character who is displayed as God himself among video games characters, turned out to actually be God himself in Smash.
How Game & Watch isn't commonly considered as a top tier genuinely baffles me and I'm glad to finally hear someone else say it so I don't feel like I'm crazy for thinking it.
He IS commonly considered top tier nowadays though.
Especially when you consider how many characters do very poorly against him.
I wish Sonic's Fair was that front flip kick
I'm surprised you talked about Cloud and not Pac-Man. I thought people thought he was just like his smash 4 version, but now people realized he’s a top tier character.
I thought it was the other way? People thought pac was good since ult came out, and Tea pioneered the character, but Tea has died down and I don’t recall much notable pac results in the last year besides some regionals and also DDee vs Sonix. Still definitely had great potential but results wise I believe he’s been lacking
My smash coach Ramses says that when you pay attention to sonix he does side h spin dash to camp and when he does down b spin charge he’s looking for whiffs or bad movement options to whiff punish.
I think if you really slow it down sonix is being very reactive he isn’t just turning no off his brain and spin dashing
Spin dash is the defensive option and Spin charge is the offensive one. Yeah you gotta use the right one at the right time, but it’s not really hard to do.
@@RealBroccoliHour I’m saying it felt like vars wrote it off like he releases all this moves with no thought and that it isn’t actually whiff punish but when you actually watch him and how he uses it all he’s looking for is a whiff of bad movement option which is always a whiff punish
he says exactly this in the video though, he was just hesitant to call it whiff punishing because sonix actively forces the whiffs to begin with, whereas other characters first look for the accidental whiffs then force more, in his own words. He even went out of his way to say that he wasn't saying that sonic players aren't thinking
Another W video. Quick suggestion : Why No One Plays Pichu?
you should do a list on the most "derailed" Smash fighters
If you ever need IC footage that isn’t BigD, check out my boy Dtier. He’s an upcoming IC’s player from CenCal and he’s getting real good. His gameplay will speak for itself
12:07 GnW is absolutely Top 3 along with Steve and Sonic.
Character can mash to win while having no disadvantage state thanks to his moves having almost no End Lag and UpB, which also grants him the best punish game. GnW's only "weakness" is weight while having some of the best moves in the game.
GnW is featherweight tbf. He also struggles a lot with swordies so Up-B is as good. He does demolish archetypes that arent swords, I agree about that. Zoners and most brawlers kinda instalose almost
landing a 9 off of a read will never not be funny
@@benross9174 some swordies give him trouble like aegis and shulk, but he actually beats a good chunk of swordies like ike and Roy. It’s a case by case thing, really.
Vars III is my favorite breakfast cereal
Even when watching this, and hearing how some of these characters seem OP, the video just makes me like this game more. Even as a low tier main as Kirby. all of technical play and optimization is why I love smash.
Also a huge fan of smash as i get back into it, you still playing maplestory?
I would assume you will eventually characters that rather have degraded or fell off from early SSBU. Would Inkling be among them? They were initially a top threat in SSBU but due to power creep and meta changes, they are not played as much anymore.
Even the dev team has nightmares about the Nairo vs Light match
Your thoughts on G&W are what I have been whining about forever.
So many good moves. He's almost a swordie with all his disjoints.
And his Up B+Up Smash having invincibility are just...why? His main two reliable out-of-shield options are invincible? Why???
And it's all just anti-fun too. Just a bunch of "You don't get to play the game" buttons while we hear "bleep bleep" the whole time.
Still, pretty cool that they made him the quintessential anti-meta character, flat like his gameplan, but very effective. He does the meta solid by forcing workarounds to conventional strategy which is commendable, if not necessary for a healthy, stable meta.
But man do I dislike him.
Those sonic buffs are way more important then you’re giving them credit for
2:17 Smash 4 PTSD strikes again lol
Uh oh. Sonic's on the thumbnail. Get ready for all the Sonic comments.
Game and watch old forward Ariel was a coffin 💀
I saw Game and watch at number 1 from a mile away
7:30 look at cloud that is crazy idk what happened there
(is it me or the music sometimes sounds kinda like Zombie mod from black ops 1 ?)
2:25 seeing bayo doing this in ultimate is pretty cool ng
5:10 so can Ganondorf upB after his sideB or use his up tilt and neutralB? oh wait ... Sakurai never actually decloned him
8:28 his game may be 7/10 but my man is crashing hell
Decided I'm gonna join the dark side and become a Ganon main 😈😈😈
Ain't no way Diddy Kong isn't on the list, his Up B didn't even work properly back then
i just feel proud for never thinking game and watch was bad, was always at worst high mid tier for me
I mean, they gave bayo back her post nerf counter from Smash 4, and she still has crazy latter combos, not as crazy as Smash 4, though thank sakurai.
I would put Bayonetta from honorable mention into the top 5. I would remove Fox. Bayonetta was changed into her current threat in the meta by patch updates. There were patches that were done to make her how she was supposed to play which I agree with. It is the buffs to her weakness that changed her into a truly terrifying character. Projectiles are no longer an option against her to stop her from camping, less landing lag to punish her whiffs, and reduced the penalty for spamming Down B.
Never forget the day Samus and Falco mains collectively tricked everyone including Nintendo into believing they were bottom tiers so that'd they'd get constant buffs
Easy way to fix Sonic for tournament play: special timeout rules where he always loses if he and opponent have same amount of stocks, even if Sonic player has less percent. This strongly incentivizes Sonic players to engage unless they can take a stock lead.
In fact, here's another idea if people hate timeouts in general: if there is a timeout, the player who is BEHIND in stocks/percent is declared the winner. This incentivizes players to engage with each other in most contexts.
Than just sd and time your opponent out
@@lom1991 Find me a player who will purposely lose a stock so that they can go for a timeout as their only win con
that's way too illogical,your punishing someone for winning and time outs are only relevant against zoners who will be willing to not interact too,y'all hate potential time outs in like 2 match ups like some characters don't just kill at 40 or win neutral for free against ALL characters why not restrict those too while at it?
@@ahmadkazan5473 Because you don't understand it doesn't make it illogical
@@jeffersonian4 everyone who is willing to go for a timeout in the first place, it literally changes nothing
Characters don’t matter at all. It’s only the player using it. That’s why there is only one successful fox and incinaroar. Many other examples too
scared to talk about diddy kong
Fox is easily top 5.
Where is every characters best move part 3
I feel like Robin is quite a bit underrated in this “punish” meta. Slow? Absolutely. But his tools allow you to catch your opponent on so many things. Shielding an arcfire? You just got hit by a Nosferatu and healed Robin. Decided to roll? Thoron has something to say about that. Robin has very noticeable flaws, but his punish game is surprisingly good, at least for a swordie. He even has standard Thunder to dash attack if the opponent is close enough. While he does require a bit more mental management, it pays off if you pay attention to your opponent
The fact that G&W’s up b no longer puts him into special fall is what makes him so amazing. If he couldn’t safely do that all the time he would be a lot worse. To balance the game either they should make everyone go into special fall after up b or no one. The way special fall is implemented doesn’t make any sense.
G&W isn’t the only character whose up b doesn’t put him into free fall, and his recovery has been like that since brawl. It’s clearly something his up b is built around now so you can’t just take it from him.
@@callinater6133 I know he’s not the only one. That’s the point I was making.
@@luiegiii ‘to balance the game either they should make everyone go into special fall after up b or no one.’ That’s the point you were trying to make and that was what I was disagreeing with.
@@callinater6133 I don’t see the point of your disagreement to be honest. In melee he went into special fall immediately after using up b. But honestly I don’t want them to take it from him. I would prefer that all characters had special fall removed in general or add conditions like the way falcon’s works when he makes contact with an enemy he stays actionable. It just seems like special fall is unfairly applied to each character and it hurts characters like ganondorf who can’t use side b in the air without falling to their death.
@@luiegiii melee was the only game where his up b put him into free fall. Ever since brawl he hasn’t had it on his up b. And no, I’d argue free fall is necessary for most characters as some characters have side bs that can act as horizontal recoveries and it’d be unfair if they could use a side b out of up b.
Danganronpa OST's are all Top Tier
Genuinely question: who the hell puts Sonic top 2😂😂
sonic mains
@@MeLlamoJonathan makes sense to me. Most of them are just stupid glue sniffers
Idc what yall say G&W Fair was WAY better in smash4. That it how you would expect Fair to work.
Again, I'm floored that the community hasn't used rulesets as a way of making the game more balanced and entertaining. For example, consider special and/or character-specific rules that would improve player/audience experience:
• Players may not use "counter" moves to edge guard DK (greatly enhances DK's viability; note: I am not a DK player)
• If there is a timeout, the player who is BEHIND in stocks/percent is declared the winner (this sounds backwards until you think through the logic. i.e. "If I'm behind, I want to engage so I can catch up and win by stocks. If I'm ahead, I want to engage so I can finish off my opponent and not lose due to a timeout."). This rule-change could single-handedly fix Sonic.
• Ban characters that have severely unbalanced risk/reward ratios that cannot be balanced by other creative rules (e.g. Steve, Kazuya).
• etc
Basically, creative, easy-to-understand rules that punish/limit degenerate gameplay.
These are some of the WORST suggestions I have ever heard in my life.
1st: You want to make specific rules like the DK example to use to prevent the opponent from edge-guarding? What's the point of sending your opponent off the stage if they're just allowed to comeback for free without any interference.
2nd: The time-out rule where the player who is "losing" in percent is the one that wins the timeout? That's stupid af. If I hit the opponent and I got the percent lead, I should be rewarded for winning that interaction for engaging.
3rd: Steve ban can be debatable (Steve shouldn't be banned) but the fact you want to ban kazuya is insane. Kazuya has very clear weaknesses that can easily exploited. His recovery is below average, his air game is medicore(He just hits very hard but won't kill you) He ain't even top 5.
@@myoblivion420 Read my suggestions again, but this time try actually comprehending them.
I was ok about the stock rules, but I'm against banning characters. Japan and Sparg0 knows better as combat Steve now.
@@jeffersonian4 I did comprehend what I just read. You're changing the core win conditions and fundamentals of the game. These suggestion for rules are terrible.
@@myoblivion420bro got that leffen mentality.
Would love to see the opposite of this video as well since you often do both sides. Characters that fell off either due to nerfs or other reasons.
Also, current meta top characters honestly...kinda suck imo. Sonic, G&W, Steve aren't fun to fight in the slightest, nor are they fun to watch. I do think the harassment the players go through is unacceptable, but man do those characters completely suck the enjoyment out of this game for a lot of people
No offence, but Fox is 100% top five. You make great videos, but Fox is broken.
Spoiler for the number 1 pick
I really disagree with putting game and watch at number 1, early opinion of the character was really low but maister was top 10 in the world in the game's first year and the character was widely considwred to be an easy top tier. General opinion of the character has further risen, but going from lower top tier to arguably top 5 is less dramatic thsn some of your honorable mentions
Jigglypuff?