Was The Most Important PC an Apple?
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- čas přidán 6. 02. 2023
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The Apple Lisa is much less well-known than the Macintosh, but it paved the way for the future of PCs - including non-Apple products.
Emulator link: lisa.sunder.net/
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I don't know why all the old apple commercials had actors using the mouse so weirdly.
So the Hand doesn’t obscure it
It's brand new. People don't know what it is, so actors have it hold it that way so people can see it.
Also bear in mind this mouse is very square, so is probably not too comfortable to use like we do now
"What is this futuristic sorcery!?" 🤏🖱
The same reason beer commercials have actors holding the bottle weird. Visibility of the product/label
I'm one of the lucky people who's gotten to see an Apple Lisa in person. I work in computer recycling and someone dropped one off at my shop saying that they had tried to give to to a computer museum and they wouldn't take it because of COVID. They claimed their husband was one of the original designers who worked on it. We ended up selling it to a computer museum across the country from us for a few thousand dollars. It was in pretty beat up condition when we got it, but it's drives apparently had beta software on it that had yet to be preserved.
Please tell me you uploaded the beta software to the internet archive before you sold it.
Most of apples beta software history from 1986 and older is basically lost and all traces have likely been destroyed
@@ozordiprince9405 Hope there's good news.
@@ozordiprince9405 Narrator: He did not
@@ozordiprince9405 I'm not the person who handles our retro computers in general, I know a good amount about them, but I don't generally mess with them. My co worker who is the person who dealt with the transaction regularly contributes to the internet archive in San Francisco, so I wouldn't be surprised if he backed it up himself first.
I got to use a Lisa at the National Museum of Computing in Bletchley Park England. I suggest you visit if you have the opportunity. The Lisa itself was slow as you said. It accessed the (slow) hard drive pretty much any time you clicked anything, even menus. Regardless I was happy for the opportunity.
I'd love to take a Turing of Bletchley Park someday.
@@benwu7980 Make sure you take the "complete" tour.
Reminder that, like for hard disks, the word 'floppy' refers to the actual magnetic disk inside of the casing, not to the casing itself.
Therefore all floppies, even 3.5" ones, are actually floppy.
The LISA was an amazing machine at the time, the first hard drives that came our for them were 5m & 10m for $5k & $10K they were huge and clunky and wow that was a lot of storage back them
Also the LISA was the first machine to have the sleep feature, it really was an incredible machine for its time. I remember fondly fixing a lot of them (like 5 out of maybe 20 that the store sold) in the service department :). I think that 5 of them were sold to Martin Areo space in the state I was in so I did get to go into the entry for the secure area to fix them while being watched by a lot of security folks ... ah the fun times
I recently sold (in a 286) a Type 1 hard disk, MFM, 10 Mb with no bad sectors at all. This drive was from 1981, and apparently made it from Toronto to Vancouver without damage. 10 Mb back then cost you at least a couple grand, if not more. It wasn't too terrible, I ended up IIRC with Windows 3.0 or 3.1 on it and it did "work", in the same way Windows 7 "works" on an Atom netbook from 2009.
I remember getting in trouble in my inner city preschool for playing on their computer. They would yell at me all "THIS COST THOUSANDS, IT'S NOT A TOY" and I was bewildered as to why until today I learned that it was the first macintosh.
😂 poor kid trying to learn. Now kids have computers in their pockets that are a million times more powerful
Oh, wow! I remember when we got our hands on our first Mac(In 1984?). And it was pretty much duplicated with the first iMacs - mine was Bondi Blue. What my 2019 iMac here lacks is a carrying handle like the early Macs. But the current OS, Ventura (13.2) smacks the early MacOSs 'longside they heads, it's SO much smoother and refined.
I feel like there's a generational blindspot in how LTT covers old computer history. The Amiga came out just a couple years later and featured fully preemptive multittasking, stereo sound, color graphics, the ability to use ram as a hard disk, and tons of other innovations that took the rest of the PC world decades to catch up with. Amigas were used to produce videos (See Video Toaster) including CGI in Aladdin, and were used until pretty recently in the launch of space shuttles by NASA because the OS was so robust.
LGR or 8 Bit guy?
While everything you said was true, it wasn't the only computer or software trying to explore the GUI goldmines. Just one year after the Macintosh, in 1985, Windows 1.0x was released. So did Atari ST with DRI's GEM and the original Amiga with AmigaOS. All of these took notice of the things happening in Apple, and were trying to capitalize in software usability and stability. And both the Lisa, Macintosh, Amiga and Atari ST had an appeal to artists and designers, with the latter two also having excellent gaming and music capabilities. Windows already ran on the IBM PC platform, which was already dominating the office market at this point.
But the point is that everything released in 1985 was kinda at initial steps, still. Windows 1.0x was buggy and unstable, and AmigaOS wasn't at its greatest either. The original Amiga even didn't have the OS running at ROM at that time; you had to boot it through the Kickstart first, using a floppy disk.
But more importantly, neither of those platforms were very popular at 1985. Though the Mac had a good launch, it wasn't selling as well as Apple wanted it to, and the Apple II continued to be Apple's cashcow. Windows 1.0x wasn't even close to the success of future versions such as 3.0. The original Amiga was an expensive computer to the home market, so they had to create a cheaper alternative, which was the Amiga 500 (the original was renamed to Amiga 1000), the best-selling model in the family. But even then, the Amiga 500 was only released in 1987. As for the Atari ST, it sold around 2.1 - 2.2 million units, compared to the Amiga's around 4 - 5 million units sold. The Atari ST however had inferior graphics and sound capabilities than the Amiga for a lower cost, so it had its appeal.
That all being said, yes. The Amiga was a powerhouse of hardware and software technology. But the Amiga 500 was only released in 1987, and I think Lisa had its merits, being released in 1983.
@@yukinagato1573 this was also when IBM was hashing out Unix. Although their GUI would not appear for a few years
I think that's due to the age of their employees. Most of them have probably never seen a push button phone. They never cover the small innovators who surpassed Apple and Microsoft in affordability and usability, but were either bought out and suppressed or kept out of the market due to exclusivity contracts with non-compete clauses.
@@lawrenceking4144 another problem to me is that most people who watch LTT aren’t looking for retro content, and those who are looking for retro content have a whole host of CZcamsrs who can cover these subjects way better and more in-depth. I get this is their shorter series, but even when they cover retro stuff on their main channel it feels kinda half-baked.
I saw the Lisa as a boy in an electronics shop, and was later puzzled what are these memories that I have about such a strange, futuristic computer. In particular since this was before I started with computers, the usual 8-bit computers with text-only interfaces (the Commodore C64 in particular). Only a few years ago I found that my recollections were in fact pretty accurate and that this computer really existed in the early 80s.
Alto wasn't really supposed to be a commercial product. That was the Xerox 8010 "Star", which also predated the Lisa by a couple of years
yeah, this would have been much more interesting starting with Doug Englebart and NLS and actually showing a few of the other machines that ripped it off too. It makes Lisa look far more influential than it was
I remember way back in the early 1980s when the Apple store in my home town was located opposite the railroad station, and they actually had a Lisa running in the window showing its features to the occupants of the cars driving slowly past. It was a nice view from the backseat, for a 10 year old boy
The guy who wrote the Lisa emulator passed away earlier this year. RIP Ray Arachelian.
I actually prefer the Amiga Workbench as a GUI and the Amiga was way cheaper, even than the Apple Macintosh and came out even a bit before the Macintosh. So even Amiga and Commodore were not the first to have a nice and versatile GUI and real multitasking, but they were the first to adopt it and make it really accessible for many.
Amiga Release date, July 23, 1985
macintosh release date January 24, 1984
@@carboncomplex Regardless, the Amiga hardware/OS was far superior even given for the date of release.
5 thumbs up! Damn, can only give one.
Btw, I think the Amiga was the First consumer PC to have Pre-emptive multitasking which is significantly different than what was approximated on other systems.
Still have my A1200 set up on the desk. Never know when you'll want a quick game of Sensible Soccer.
Apple later rebranded the Lisa as Macintosh XL. It included software to emulate Macintosh.
It blows my mind how expensive PCs were back then. I was born in ‘93 and got into computers around 2006, I remember trying to save up a few hundred dollars for my first PC. I don’t think kids could have done that back in the 80s, maybe even the 90s?
Gives you some perspective on everyone complaining about graphics card prices as if they’re being gouged on insulin. PCs were not only ridiculously expensive well into the 90s, but they were outdated quickly as well. You could easily blow 2 grand in today’s money on a rig that wouldn’t even be able to run the latest games in a couple years.
In 1992, I graduated HS and my dad bought me a Gateway 486-66DX2. I don't recall the rest of the specs but it was loaded. I think he spent almost $3000 for the full tower and 19" monitor. It was a lot of money back when you could buy a car for $10k, gas was $1, and you could eat all you wanted at Taco Bell for $6. Minimum wage was $3.35/hr.
I used AutoCad 12, came on 14 3.5" floppies. Did a lot of converting manually drawn blueprints into CAD for several architects, and saved up $500 for an ATI video card (don't remember the specs but it was the top of the line for a consumer card, without going into the professional cards.
So my point is computers and video cards are cheap nowadays, but a $1500+ 4900 is nuts.
I didn't get into PCs until I'd (sorta) learned FORTRAN on punch cards & a timeshared computer across town, then used FORTRAN over a phone line to a mainframe DEC I never did get to see. Being an adult getting paid real money, I could afford the Apple ][c with its single floppy drive for $2500, which was about the same price I paid for a 24" Intel core 2 duo iMac now resting on a table to my right. IIRC, dumb terminals (VT52 or VT100) were also about the same cost. Right now, I'm lusting over the current 24" M1 iMac with a cost of about $1300. It's funny how things have changed. My Dad programmed Big Blue IBM 360s: Such monsters taking up so much room and consuming so much power and cooling! And then, about 15 years ago, Apple came out with the iBook, which was honestly more powerful than any big iron my Dad beat into submission. -- and I could use it on my lap, wirelessly connecting back to work when I had to. It was about $1,000 and would have blown Dad's mind. Heck, the Apple ][ was a more productive programming platform than the 360s, since the compilers were ultra-expensive so Dad worked in IBM's Assembler, which was oh so esoteric and inscrutable.
I remember how revolutionary just the most basic computer was back then. Before you had to rely on a typewriter to create documents and making corrections was a pain. Imagine a machine that allow you to edit and modify documents with ease. That was revolutionary at the time.
Bought three Lisa's way back in the day for work. Expensive, but well liked by the users. As to SLOW? We were also using HP-UX on 9000 series workstations. Those took so long to boot that you could make and drink a pot of coffee, and those would still be booting.
I had a similar situation with my Windows workstation about 15 years ago. Boot up -- or try to wake it up, and I could walk to the far end of the building, grab a smoke, walk up two floors to the coffee machine, start a new urn of coffee, fill my cup and get back to my cubby to finish the wake up and finally log in. What was Microsoft THINKING with XP? And then MS SQL server crashed the servers if we didn't reboot them every other day, at least. It was a persistent memory leak that any novice would have automatically avoided: The module that makes a new object always disposes of the object once it's finished doing its thang. Our code reviews looked for that sort of thing.
I was using HP-UX (version 10) in 1995 or so and it was the bomb. I feel like there was an earlier set of software and hardware you were using named similarly.
@@johnboynb It was great by 1995, this was 1984 and an HP 9000 back then was pretty much just a 68K processor. It ran OK after booting, but took FOREVER to boot.
@@glenjo0 RAM was expensive back in 80s...
My folks still have their Mac II shelved away, thing might even still work. It's neat to see the old Apple Logo and one of the original PCs from the day.
I had six and used them like cinderblocks to build a shelving unit.
Great video! Feels like it’s not necessarily using Anthony to his potential but still fun to watch.
Anthony has infinite potential. He can't use it all in every video. It would destroy the universe.
I like those short kind of videos about computing, but you could make them longer with much more details. It's a suggestion. I like retro-computing and how it evolves over time.
Computers used to be so expensive. I only knew one person who had a computer back in the 80's and I got to play Duke Nukem and other games. I wasn't able to get a computer until the 2000's.
The Macintosh was the most important PC for the early home computing market besides the IBM PC juniors. The Lisa was DOA and they begun the development of the Macintosh as a skunkworks project and hiding it from Jobs, so that he would not get side railed and postpone the already late release on the Lisa.
I would reckon that the IBM ps/2 systems did more for the PC market as a whole afterwards as this is still the form we use today.
Would be nice to have the promised link in description
agreed
The Apple Lisa did receive one Hardware revision that gave it the Sony 1.44 mb floppy drive from the Macintosh and a new front plate with the Macintosh Snow White design language being rebranded first as the Lisa II when it still ran the Lisa Office System. Later when the Mac took off the unsold Lisa II stock was repackaged with emulation layer software that let them boot the Macintosh system software known as Macworks and they were rebranded as the Macintosh XL to fill the need for a faster Mac until they had a actual solution ready.
When Lisa came out, I was working on a DEC 11/73 that cost about the same, with true multitasking in either rsx 11 or rsts, I forget which after 40 years.
I think the most important Apple Machine was actually the Apple ][ Line, because it gave Apple the money to survive failures like the Apple Lisa. The Apple ][ was produced a loong time in different variations and man, I am happy to have my Apple //e with 128k RAM (+80 Coloumn) and the DuoDisk (2x 5 1/4") here next to my. Next the the Macintosh SE and Commodore C64(C) :D
Steve Jobs only started the company because he had parents to lend him money, unfortunately my parents just want to use me and take all my money. doesn't really seem fair haha
oh wait, that might have been Jeff Bezos LMAO well... what ever haha I bet they didnt have the start to life that I had
Some of those features took quite a while to be implemented on the mac
Some, not until Mac OS X. And that's just because Mac OS X is actually a completely different OS.
really digging these look at the past videos, you always learn something new about tech history
For me the Xerox Star deserves this position more than the Apple Lisa. Both served a similar purpose and had the same sort of GUI interface. I remember working with one at my college back in the 1981-82 time frame, before the Lisa was released in 1983.
They both had GUIs, but the GUIs were nothing alike.
@@tookitogo yes you are right. The XEROX Star GUI was actually superior to Lisas GUI, it was completely document oriented like we do have today and not program oriented, it was also fully multi-user and multitasking, unlike Lisa. Also it was the first computer to introduce WYSIWYG, had a high resolution 17" monitor on the workstation and the OS was pseudo object oriented, Lisa was not even close...
Why doesn’t the Commodore 64 get any love in these conversations?
and how it was also able to run a GUI (like GEOS) but all in 64 kB
(but with plenty of disk-swapping)
(i know RAM expanders were available)
oh, those were the days 😍 LOL
Geos on c64 released ING 1986 and did most of what apple did en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/GEOS_(8-bit_operating_system)#:~:text=Originally%20designed%20for%20the%20Commodore,for%20the%20Commodore%20Plus%2F4.
Over here the Sinclair ZX Spectrum takes that crown for sure.
A computer in the sub-£100 bracket that wasn't just a glorified calculator. The "only 2 colours per 8x8 pixel block" graphics might seem quaint now, but a computer in 1982 that was capable of actual gaming, even if you were sacrificing sound(it only had a built-in PC speaker) and colour depth, that was a viable option even for the poorest people in the country was massive in getting computers into homes over here. Didn't matter if you had a single mum working part time, she could afford to get you a Spectrum.
I mean, I had a C64 myself, but still gotta take my hat off to Sir Clive. I mean, the Spectrum was in the same price bracket as the RAM anaemic VIC-20, but with almost 10 times the RAM. You could make games that played as well as C64 games, but in an odd form of monochrome. Games such as Double Dragon even played better on Spectrum, 'cause the mono graphics allowed them to pack bigger sprites into RAM and have a higher screen res.
I often think about this, the AMIGA was probably the best example of most important pc. It showed that powerful home PC's could be affordable and fun. Its a crying shame Commodore is not around today to be the 3rd Major PC OS
lol you clearly dont know much about Commodore the company. Its a crying shame AMIGA (the German company they bought it from) didnt have more influence.
@@mycosys Lol about ripping off, What's race got to do with it? There are many chapters around the world of Commodore computer inc, the difference was big blue was charging top dollar for business computers, a stinky ex atari employee who ripped off his friend was charging less for cheap hardware and then you had Commodore (And Atari) who wanted a PC in every home that could do as much and more for less without the quality halving like now.
@@mycosys The original Amiga company was located in Silicon Valley and founded by Jay Miner. Commodore wasn't German, either. In 1995, the German PC retailer Escom AG purchased Commodore. The Amiga trademark passed from Escom AG to Gateway 2000 in 1997. From there, the rights went to Amiga, Inc. and so on and so forth. As Escom bought Amiga, the system was already falling behind. Commodore's lack of focus on R&D of the Amiga started to show (Commodore was also building MS-DOS/Windows PCs), and I think Escom was from my perspective (correct me if I am wrong) a too small of a company to be able to catch-up with development. So, yes you can blame a German company for buying a sinking ship and doing too less, but the problems started way earlier. There was a glimmer of hope, as Gateway did some R&D. This was not for long, unfortunately. They probably realized that they did not have a chance to catch-up, either. There was a time, where I heard rumors or may even red news that Samsung was interested in buying Amiga. This would have probably been the best outcome. Though it never happened. At the end of the 90's, no closed system was able to compete against the growing Wintel Market with countless companies building Systems of any flavor, developing powerful extensions and making a flood of software. Even Apple was struggling and Bill Gates was forced to help them. Without Gate's $150 million investment, Apple probably would not have made it, either.
Amiga was a DUD, and the AmigaDOS was a gimmick on A1000 hardware. Actually it was ATARI ST that was the real value and modern way to do home computer in 1985.
I got to program on a pre-production one back in 1982. Coming from writing everything (screens, database managers, etc) on Apple ][, Apple III, CP/M machines, it was quite an experience. SLOOOOOW compared to the pre-production Mac we got (had to keep it in a locked room) later.
I can recall the day the brand new Lisa was brought into our lab. We like everyone at the time in the new "home computer industry" was making a text screen interface (CP/M) with graphics capability for throwing up a pie chart etc. - truthfully we felt nauseous. It was so far ahead of anything we had seen although some had seen similar prototypes from Xerox and so forth. We fought over the thing. What was also cool was the printer - a dot matrix - also had a swappable scan head. Now the funny thing there is the printer was very primitive and had no smarts. The Lisa had to render the line and then drive the printer - wait while it rendered a new line - print a line etc. Painfully slow, and you could do nothing else while it did this, but it worked. It also had real expansion. You could see companies designing after market cards. Then they jacked the price and it faded away. The Macintosh was a much weaker stepchild. And most importantly the Mac lacked expansion slots. This is what "killed" the Mac. It allowed all the diverse, dynamic market to grow on the PC (and PC clones) an inferior machine with a weaker processor, supporting less memory etc etc. But because of those slots it got better graphics, better sound, CAD, Ethernet, etc etc etc.
I remember the days in the 80's learning on a PC that had a black screen and green text. You had to input every command. I hated it. Then eventually they upgraded to computers with graphical interface and then I really got into computers. I also really liked how I could type something up and save it, and then edit again later. It was so much better than having to write it out or use a typewriter. I could barely type on a typewriter, but fell in love with the keyboard on a computer to where I could type really fast. And then really liked it when they had spell check. As I could type really fast, and then go back and fix spelling mistakes. You couldn't really do that on a typewriter.
Amazing that a product that was a commercial flop still influences PCs today! Thanks Antony for this fun History lesson!🙂
Techquickie should do more videos like this.
I love seeing these videos from Anthony, I wish they were more in depth. He is so smart and his way of explaining things is so good.
Lisa’s GUI looks fantastically good for 1987, really the game changer
1983: it released a year before the Macintosh.
Now go and look at Doug Englebart's the mother of all demos (1968), the oN-Line System, and the Xerox alto it inspired. Most of this was round before man reached the moon.
That Jobs was not impressed with Xerox is quite something, considering Jobs and Apple owe so much to their ground-breaking research.
I think later Jobs said that they invented the GUI and the mouse.
Anyway, GUI's went their own life. It was not just apple. I mean: the first drawing program (and hardware) was from 1963 using a pen.
The Xerox GUI was actually designed for children. And it was almost decade ahead of the Lisa.
Something amazing: Lisa's OS (and the original Mac's OS) were written in (Object) Pascal!!
And M68k assembly.
Even Mac OS 9.2.2 still had some 68k assembly due to how Mac OS was designed.
Copland was originally conceived to be 100% PowerPC code, but feature creep killed it.
Glad you mentioned the Xerox Alto. Many people forget that both the Lisa/Macintosh and Windows 1 got their design after both Steve and Bill got to see the Alto over at Xerox. Back when I worked at Apple support the apple trainer told us the Macintosh was the first Computer with a GUI, Guess the Lisa is a sore subject for Steve. And if your gonna talk about A GUI you mustn't forget about Douglas Carl Engelbart and his "Mother of all demo's" back in the late 60's The oN-Line System or, more commonly, NLS was coded by many of the same people who built the Alto and STAR system over at Xerox PARC.
Anthony, you forgot to link the Lisa emulator. Wouldn't mind giving it a rattle!
In high school the Macintosh was just new. It really changed my year end projects. Good ol print Shop pro. The din of dot matrix printer in the background...
Anthony, you should consider telling the story how Steve Wozniak made the floppy drive work with the Apple ][, and how they managed to make Xerox PARC's mouse into something that was super cheap to build, and with only one button. Steve Jobs also wanted to sell the Mac originally for $1,995, but was talked out of it by John Sculley.
Or how an employee had to go around Jobs to get the 3.5 inch floppies from Sony and had to hide the Sony rep in a closet.
I saw an Alta once in the early 90s. Amazing stuff.
My suggestion is more Anthony.
Alex and Anthony vs Luke and Linus in a marathon race, building whale rigs for LTX.
1:30 Floppy Anthony is so groove.
The Lisa was AMAZING for it's time!
I would say the Tandy computers were more important then any Apple computer, Tandy had DeskMate and were IBM compatible and were more affordable then apple, not to mention upgradeable with widely available PC hardware.
yes - the TRS-80 got computers into the hands of people, schools and really started my generation thinking about programming. It was far reaching in societal impact.
Was just thinking the other day how there hasn't been enough Anthony on LTT lately, and today we get two videos with him.
Fun fact: Apple sold one of the later Lisa models as the Mac XL with software that enabled emulation of the Mac.
4:35 No, you didn’t put a link in the description.
Lisa Brennan Jobs now lives in Brooklyn, New York. I once saw her on the news being interviewed last year, because her neighborhood in Fort Greene, Brooklyn, had this weird alien resonance sound going on at night. They did not put her name on the screen, but the moment I saw her, I knew it was Lisa! She changed her hair color to blonde, so at first I double checked if it really was her. But I immediately figured out it was her based on the way she talked. Unmistakably Lisa. She’s so adorable.
I love these tech history lessons.
Hope the real Lisa sees this video. This video is a great short tribute to Apple Lisa!
Could Anthony please do a feature on BeOS and it's followup in Haiku at some point? I think there's a lot of history available to summarise that I haven't seen fully explored yet and it's definitely a pretty unique OS
Please 🙏 BeOS and Be Inc story would be cool
IBMs OS/2 would be a nice thing to cover too
More videos about old OS, like BeOS or OS/2.
I love the enthusiasm Anthony gives to the software being so ahead of its time.... but everyone still bags on Vista which was the same issue... it was built for multicore which many didn't have yet
My first computer was a Mac Performa 640 CD. I believe it was $2,500 in 1996. It dual booted Mac OS & DOS. So it ran windows 3.1.
Escape Velocity was my favorite game.
Mine was a Performa 638CD. Still have it, actually! I also remember playing Escape Velocity, was awesome, always wished it was a multiplayer game.
Yup, like Henry Ford and the Model, they weren't first but they sure pioneered and made it practical, now we all have supercomputers in our pockets which was the size of a refrigerator before or a building.
God bless.
Thank you for your always amazing videos! Anthony is one of my most favourite presenters - a guy I'd love to be friends with!
without the tiny mac classic being sold in the early 1990s, I wouldn't have had the opportunity to play hot dog stand every day in AP physics. That's the last time I got utility out of an apple product (but recognize other people who aren't spec. vs. price sensitive love the stuff).
I would love to see Anthony make a docu about the c64 or Amiga.
It could be nice.. but it seems he doesn't spend much time researching. and the consequence of that is while much is correct, he keeps making little errors. People who used to own these know that, but can't do much about it, but groan a little. but that would make the channel a lot more interesting, no doubt..
I had a Mac SE. So I remember that GUI. No HD just floppy disk. Madness. However I was able to record a whole album on it.
I remember seeing a Lisa in person at the time, at a trade show, even though I was just a teenager at the time. Even though I wasn't actually allowed to touch it, it had a definite impact on me, I still remember it clearly, all these years later. That Profile 5 MB hard drive was dog slow though, even for hard drives at the time.
Think they ran at 3600 rpm, which is brutally slow.
I read about the Lisa. As a software engineer, it was even more fascinating the tricks they had to use to make up for the Macintosh’s lesser hardware and squeeze a GUI interface into it. Lisa is where it all started. The GUI as a concept was a HUGE gamble that shook the entire industry. Many at the time probably saw it as a scam quite honestly.
Douglas Engelbart invented the Mouse and the First GUI, Xerox took the idea from Douglas when he work at SRI International and then Apple and MS got their idea from Xerox.
@quantumleaper Wow thank you for that. He was truly a visionary. Creating SRI (Stanford Research Institute). Creating the first mouse and in 1968 he did ‘the mother of all demos’ to over 1000 computer engineers. Showing the mouse, text editing, and file sharing. This guy was a legend.
I owned two Lisas. They were mind-blowing at the time.
Wow, Lisa had the first ultrawide monitor with a 2:1 display (NOT 18:9 because that's not how ratios work)
I had boxes of 5.25” floppies. Still have some 3.5” I use. I’m not “that” old.
The double clicking origin is the most Apple thing I've ever heard. I guess they never changed 😂
There is a great book on the history of Xerox PARC called Dealers of Lightening. There may not be a bigger story in tech of not knowing what you have than Xerox with the Alto
So LISA introduces Cut and Paste, yet now we only get the copy feature by default on macOS!
My first PC ( Personal Computer ) was Macintosh plus with no hard drive, you had to load the operating system from a 3.5" floppy disc onto the ROM, and it was GLORIOUS peace of technical marvel. Later i bought external disc drive and that was life changing experience. But i always dreamt about buying external hard drive for it. And i was so jealous when my friend who had Windows PC has 120 Mb Hard Drive. Megabyte not Gigabyte...
Actually, the first GUI was NLS computer system. So they are responsible for the advancements by Xerox PARC.
wouldn’t mind more vids in this style, with Mr. A ofc :-)
Xerox Star came after Alto and before Lisa and was meant to be a soho computer like the Lisa. It was about $17k dollars at the time. As many people have said we could be living in a Xerox world if Xerox just had better business sense about computers.
Honestly. I often think about what the PC world would be like if Xerox didn't fumble so many times. They genuinely were way ahead of their time and every time I look to their period of PC development, it surprises me of the features they had available before anyone else.
One thing I remember about the 80's is that everything was designed to have sharp edges. Everything was a square shape from appliances to cars. Then they started rounding things off in the 90's where I think a lot of it was ugly until they figured out how to make things look nice in the modern age. Kind of like how 3D graphics on the N64 and Playstation look pretty ugly.
I'm a bit young for the Lisa , but I was an Apple Engineer from 1990 in the UK. I was repairing Mac's from the original 1984 model onward. I've never owned a PC
🍎 🐑
I always thought GUI was pronounced “jee-you-eye” and not “gooey” lol
I got a good experience from the commodore Amiga workbench.
It was an excellent alternative to Windows or the Mac system at the time.
I always thought of the early Apple products as ripp-offs of the XEROX and Unix GUIs, and had very little to do with the coming of age of OS/2 and Windows which were also from the same XEROX and Unix GUI beginnings, I'm pretty sure that the W Windows System and X Window System both came out about the same time as LISA, were more widely known and used in comparison to LISA.
Then again it may just be because I'm not from USA that it felt this way, like SUN/SGI workstations were more widely known here than Apple at that stage.
I remember using WYSIWYG applications like Lotus123 on a 286(at home) prior to ever seeing my first Apple IIe(at school), which I thought was a downgrade compared to what I was using at home.
The Apple ][ could be the most important machine, for his lifespan alone.
Common mistake... It wasn't named after Steve Jobs' daughter (Lisa).. it was in fact named for Lary Tesler's daughter of the same name. Larry was a friend of my dad. I recall being a young kid with my dad visiting Larry at his house and playing around on a Lisa prototype and Larry telling me who it was named after. For those who may not know who Larry was.. he moved over to Apple in 1980 with a bunch of folks from Xerox PARC. He's also the guy who invented copy and paste. I'm sure people will call BS on this but I swear it's true. When my dad died when I was 21 and found myself next of kin, Larry was the guy who paid for his funeral.
It’s a common misconception that Lisa had pre-emptive multitasking, but it didn’t. The OS was designed with cooperative multitasking to improve performance for the app in the foreground, similar to early Mac designs. Commodore Amiga was the first personal computer to introduce real preemptive multitasking to home users.
This would have been a LOT more interesting if it was on Doug Englebart, the Mother of All Demos, the oNLine System (with the first mouse and teleconferencing), and the subsequent Xerox machines it inspired in the early 70s.
Knowing that the entire modern computing paradigm originates and was pretty much functional in the 60s tends to low peoples minds.
I'm inclined to add Amstrad, Sinclair and Commodore to the list of most important because they made it viable for families and especially kids to get a pc around the same time for hundreds of dollars instead of thousands.
PS. The Commodore 64 came out 1982!
Yes, my II+ and IIe led me straight to building my own 386 PC
Yes, the last time Apple had a decent product.
The black and white Macintosh came out in 86, I was using a colour Amiga by 85, I owned an Amiga early 86. Obviously no one had a lisa.
@@alanhilder1883 The original Macintosh came out in 1984 (they even have a _very_ famous ad advertising it "…Why 1984 won't be… like *1984*").
@@MaddTheSane They didn't get to Australia that quick, Oh right the Americans don't know the rest of the world exists, so why would they send them there.
I am saying that the Amiga that I was using before I got mine was a few years old and the first person I know who got a macintosh was later AND it was only black and white, they got colour a few years later.
My recollection may be a bit shaky here but I recall that one of the ways Apple tried to shift Lisas was by making it the development machine for the Mac as it wasn't possible to develope Mac software on the Mac.
Anthony is like the computer historian guru. Linus does know a lot, but Anthony is the GOAT on "It all began with..."
It actually all began with 'The Mother of All Demos' by Doug Englebart in 1968 (mankind reached the GUI before a man reached the moon lol). The main features of the Alto/Mac, including the first mouse and teleconferencing and primitive hypertext were all demonstrated there.
Where is the link to the LISA emulator "DOWN IN THE DESCRIPTION"?
Would love to see Apple go back to an user focused design.
If only people knew this mouse would be more comfortable than a future one...
The Mouse
Trackballs, light pens, and other clever pointing devices were widespread. Then the mouse was invented. Twice. (Well, at least twice.)
Doug Engelbart reportedly conceived the mouse during a conference lecture in 1961. His first design, in 1963, used rolling wheels inspired by mechanical area-measuring devices called planimeters invented in the 1800s.
Engineers at Germany’s Telefunken also invented a mouse in the mid-1960s. First described in 1968, their version used a rolling ball-essentially a small, upside-down trackball-which became the standard for decades.
I love apple devices for their easiness to use but they take credit for all sorts of things that they shouldnt
they were NOT first (at anything)
Just to be fair after my recent comments I am just saying that all the devices Apple uses are just stolen from other places however this video is about the first computer that used both mouse and GUI operating system, I just hate that all this tech comes from other places but no credit is given, Apple seems to just act like it came up with everything
I'm surprised that they don't talk about the Apple computer or the Apple II computer, and talking about computers with a GUI OS... forgetting the Apple IIGS!
I like how he prenounces GUI as gooey
I feel like the most insane spec on that Mac is that it has 25% of the storage in ram
One of the coolest computers of the computer history.
I wonder how many times irl Lisa has been asked if she uses various Apple products.
One MEGABYTE of ram, that was so much!
FYI, Lisa Jobs' "Small Fry" book is really good. She is mentioned in almost every Apple biography book and movie adaptations, etc., so she certainly had the right to write it.
where's the Lisa emulator link? just curious to give it a try 😄