Brexit caused an ‘existential crisis’ in the Tory Party and has left them unlikely to recover
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- čas přidán 24. 05. 2024
- Political historian Geoffrey Wheatcroft explains how the Conservative Party has changed since the days of Thatcher, and how Brexit created an ‘existential crisis’ within the party.
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Used to have the EU as a scapegoat for all their woes while in government but can't do that anymore lol
Luckily there's the disabled and young people. It'll probably be gingers next.
You only need three or four because you can just rotate them every two weeks, the public have goldfish brains.
A single market without barriers-visible or invisible-giving you direct and unhindered access to the purchasing power of over 300 million of the world’s wealthiest and most prosperous people. This was from none other than Thatcher. 1988
Yes but for many Tories the idea of cooperation with Germany or the French was simply impossible. English exceptionalism writ large
Ditching the Single Market was the end and why I left the Conservative party along with them choosing Boris as leader, a complete cynical lying charlatan. The roots of this decline in the Conservative Party rest in ideological right wing theories taking hold that you could pigeon hole as libertarianism. In the real world there is no such thing. What used to make British Conservatism successful was actually a form of rural paternalistic practicalism that underpinned things like One Nation beliefs. For a current exmaple of a rural paternalistic practical Conservative, think Rory Stewart. What was left of that which had anchored and steadied the form of shape shifting the Conservative party took (even Thatcher) was almost completely gone by 2019.
not exceptionalism, but latent racism which is rife in the UK who live in a fantasy world of their own fictional superiority over everyone else. They also cannot accept that Sunak, from a former colony, is PM.@@timoakley277
@@Northstander "there is no way that there would have been a referendum on EU membership" - Yeah, why let the people decide who governs them? That would be democracy (GASP!) - can't have that, can we?
@@dogglebird4430 Let the House of Lords decide your future, right?
At last a Brexit benefit!
Well played! Just so!
:-D
Brexit benefit being to undo Brexit.
Yeah, but at to high price, most of us used the freedoms that we have all lost
The Tories sold their soul to the devil when they tried to stave off the threat from the extreme right by out-UKIPing UKIP. Their latest little gem regarding national service merely confirms that they have given up all pretence of caring for the aspirations of young people (and hence any future support), preferring to cultivate the vote of the geriatric Little Englanders. As a 74 year old myself, I despise both them and their target supporters.
“Brexit caused an ‘existential crisis’ in the Tory Party and has left them unlikely to recover” good.
Unfortunately, the rest of us will never fully recover from brexit either.
@@tonyb9735 it has scarred a lot of us 😓
Putin doesn't care.
Lol.
In hindsight, there will be a lot of benefit from Brexit, as we sink into war on the continent and Emperor Macron brings more angst.
The tories have no beliefs, only interests.
The godless Tory hypocrites know only money. Nothing else matters to them.
In other words Brexit does in fact have a silver lining...
No silver lining, the cloud is still there, maybe just a shade lighter!
Tories are as dead as an ex-parrot now, and not before time.
I certainly hope so. No party that has had such a disgust for ordinary people should ever hold power.
It has seiced to be
*DUDE IT NEVER HAD ANY OF THOSE QUALITIES* it has greed, h-a-t-r-e-d of the poor, and snobbery as its core guiding principles
It did however have the commonsense of covering its grotesque face with an acceptable mask. That mask was discarded under Johnson.
@@nigelhardy7218 100% CORRECT...!!! It also had the common sense to pay and staff the police, if you are going to be terrible - you need the police on your side.
You can't compare the Conservative party before and after Thatcher
@nigelhardy7218 the mask was discarded by Thatcher.
Are you talking about the remainers/rejoiners there?
The Tory party may well be shapeshifters to survive but shapeshifting into fascism is a real issue.
Fascism and incitement to hate is not a good look. HATE always ends up destroying the hater from within and you have seen that happen now to the Tories and the UK economy as the ones hit hardest by Brexit were the regions outside London like Grimsby, Boston and Newcastle that voted most heavily for Brexit.
@@jamesprivet The Tories decided to vandalise Brexit - now they will face the voters' verdict on their bastardised Brexit. The latest polling suggests they will get just 66 seats - they will not survive the next 5 years. They will get wound-up, closed down and struck off the register of parties by the Electoral Commission. The Tories are a collapsed and failed party - they have chosen suicide rather than carrying out what people voted for. They will not be missed.
The strangest thing is that they knew this is what was going to happen. I’m old enough to remember any number of Tory grandees - from after the 1975 referendum onwards, through the Maastricht treaty and the Lisbon treaty- warning that if the party could not finally resolve its disputes over “Europe” and reconcile itself to Britain being no longer an imperial power, then the resulting split would be the last one and irreparable. But they did it anyway.
But the divide on Europe is a divide in Britain. And the Tories have represented that divide quite well. Europe has been divisive in Britain ever since the Attlee govt refused to make us a founding member by refusing to take us into the Schuman declaration.
@@khar12d8 Of course some divide has always existed - as it does in nearly every European country, and indeed within Labour (eg the Blair - Brown split over the Euro) but in most other cases it has been seen as a dilemma to be resolved - not a means of creating division and disruption - and the U.K. had actually been good at doing that, maximising its national advantage. But it has only ever been a top 5 electoral issue when the Conservatives have made it one and only when they have been forced to do so by their own internal divisions, or as a means of diverting attention from their failures.
@@khar12d8true that the Celtic nations have more sense than our Anglo neighbours.🏴🏴🏴🏴🏴
@@davidpaterson2309 Fair enough, but have you ever thought that part of the reason the Tories won elections in the last 14 years is because eurosceptic voters have voted for them to be there? I don't think any country in Europe is eurosceptic like Britain. And the growth of UKIP was happening for a long time even before 2010.
@@khar12d8 No, you’re right. That has never occurred to me because I think it’s mistaken. I do not think it’s true that eurosceptic voters voted Tory - at least not in quantity. They voted UKIP. But the whole purpose of UKIP (Farage has said this repeatedly) was to undermine the Tory “broad church” by inciting division within the party and trying to radicalise its right wing into a UKIP-within-Tory party. Which he succeeded in doing - ERG etc.
Hilarious that the one thing Tories are proud of is the very thing which has blown them to smithereens...Brexit has sadly been a disaster for the entire nation, however.
the writing was on the wall when the last intelligent Tories were forced out by Dominic Cummings in 2019🤡
Yep, that will last decades, if not generations.
The Tories are not proud of Brexit, they voted against it and opposed it at every opportunity (with a few exceptions). The only claimed to support it because they thought this would make them popular and keep them in power.
Brexit was never a credible policy. Ask 20 Brexiteers what Brexit is and get 20 different answers.
40 different answers if you ask them twice. 🙄
but if it brings the end of the Tory Party perhaps there's something in it.
Freedom of movement, political influence in Europe...
Completely agree. But ask 20 remainers where the EU is going and you get 20 different answers.
This 👆
A Brexistential crisis.
Keep them out for a generation
Keep them out forever, more like
DUDE stop thinking so small - FOR EVER....!!!
It will take at least that long to repair the damage they have done
Sorry, but next time they will win again. They lie unhindered and all te poorely educated belive them. They also has the press behind them. Because the citizens of England doesn't care that murdoch and russian oligarchs are feeding them propaganda.
If the Lib Dems become the official opposition, which is possible but not certain; then the Tories could be out for the next 100 years.
Think back to 1922 when the Liberal Party lost the election and finished in 3rd place behind Labour.
Whether the Tories recover or not is irrelevant compared to the excess deaths they've caused!
As a Swiss I would like to comment that we do quite well with many referenda without succumbing to despotism.
I do see your point. CH is a very different country. Referenda are normal and well understood, it ois also a small country, and has a much more democratic election system.
Maybe one day UK can handle them.
@@Benjamin.Jamin. I agree with you. Our system requires education that starts before even kindergarten, with kids voting regularly and learning to compromise. But I think that with some work and adaptions, it could function in a country with a long tradition of democracy like the UK.
Is it because the Swiss and other sensible countries employ referenda on clearer questions where implementation is easier?
@@PlanofBattle The Swiss will often redo referenda multiple times until a consensus is reached, the idea that a 52/48 vote would be the last word on an issue of fundamental importance would be ridiculous to their democratic system.
The Tories will have difficulty finding enough people who want to run
there's always plenty of useful idiots. 18% of the population are far right wing.
....or stand
Leaving the EU was an act of self harm
Constitutionalism is more important that some travel privileges.
@@aleph8888We had our constitution when we were EU members.
i don't know if to laugh, cry or get really angry? 16 years of zero growth is unacceptable at the end of the day!
The Tories deliberately shrunk the economy during a recession through Austerity, the economy has never recovered.
@@Dmanz67well we have a smaller population so we don't need such a big state.
@@therealrobertbirchall Eh?
@@Dmanz67 well isn't that right?
@@therealrobertbirchall No, it's not right. What do you mean? Smaller than 2010? The population is millions higher now.
Cameron made the huge mistake of not allowing EU Brits to vote. 1.3 million votes would have made the difference
It wasnt that he didnt allow it- it was a manifesto commitment that they would be able to vote- but it could not be done in time- which he should have known
@@sinistregothevery council has the electoral register already done. It's an ongoing process.
According to Boris former flame(Jennifer Accuri) - the actualy result to leave was around 70%. The establishment were shocked and covered it up. I know we only have word on that - but I tend to believe that, as I think immigration was a major factor in that vote.
@@alphabetaxenonzzzcat So it wasn't 51%, it was 70%? Another phoney election result just like Biden winning the 2020 election by 8 million was a fake.?
Go and lie down with your comics..
I think people have short memories and forget how utterly wrecked the Tories were from 1997 to 2005. There were very genuine debates from about 2001 to 2005 as to whether the Tories could ever win again. Blair dominated to an incredible degree. I doubt Starmer will dominate like that. Labour will have its own troubles in power.
Blair ruined Labour with Iraq and Afghanistan though, those disaster were massively influential on the 2010 result.
This is different. They’ve gone too far now. Ruined the country. Stolen my EU citizenship from me and my children. I was a swing voter. I still am. But I will never vote Tory after what they have done. Ever. Ever. I’m a fairly affluent middle income homeowner - Tory traditional demographic. Not any more.
They have to have a six week campaign because they need to select about 200 candidates at short notice.
Everything wrong blamed o brexit. Ridicous
First Past the Post is what kept the Tories in power in the ladt 110 years.
No, what has kept them in power are the silly feckers who keep voting for them
Geoffrey Wheatcroft is a historian and somewhat older than I am, but the collapse of the Tories is a long term consequence of Thatcherism. She injected ideology into the party and helped make it ungovernable after she left office, undermining Major. It also meant the party couldn't change with the times when it needed to. They couldn't abandon Thatcherism after the financial crash in 2008.
Being opposed to change is rather a characteristic of being a conservative though is it not?
Absolute drivel !
"The World’s largest food awards move judging panel from UK to Ireland to avoid Brexit red tape. Due to new import controls, a judging session for the Great Taste awards is being held outside the UK for the first time in 30 years". OK, it's a small thing but it's an indication of the decline across the board, the post-Brexit death by a thousand cuts...
The last 10 years? Being the preferred party of the British establishment, and subsequently supported by the majority of the right wing press has enabled the Conservative Party to become totally self-indulgent and completely immerse itself for decades in the Eurosceptic anti-EU debate. But now Brexit has finally been ‘done’ and the bickering continues unabated, the British public can see, that no form of Brexit could be ever be too extreme enough for the extreme right-wing fruit loops, and subsequently, the Conservative Party has splintered into warring factions, but the constant distraction has ensured that Conservative Party is unable and unfit to govern the country. They need a good long spell in opposition, or hopefully, oblivion.
The irony of the EU referendum is that Cameron would hope it would silence once and for all the Right element in the Tory party. In fact, Brexit provided them with more oxygene and has made them more of a problem than ever.
This historian the the epitome of what is rancidly wrong with the UK. "in terms of policy there is little to choose from between the Tories and the Labour Party...!' Where does this guy live? Forget policy, think of people unable to pay bills, 4.5 million children living in poverty (the highest in Europe) people pulling out their own teeth, people dying for lack of access to health care. Who gives a damn about policy. And this guy is waffling on as if he's discussing the difference between The Red Cross and St John's Ambulance,. Good God you truly get the government you deserve
Isn’t it true? Have you heard Rachel Reeves speak? She makes Blair look like Atlee 😂
There’s more to policy than welfare policy. E.g. without successful foreign and trade policy you won’t have the means needed to fund the welfare spending you call for. Not saying you’re wrong re the salience of those issues but the money needs to come from somewhere, foreign direct investment needs to grow, etc.
Brexit directly stopped foreign investment and will always do so while better choices exist in EU countries / globally. The disastrous Conservatives destroyed internal investment in all U.K. infrastructure and public services so this is what the next government has to turn around.
Let's not forget the role our media has played in the ' success ' of the Tory Party. And imagine how far they'd be behind in the polls now if we had a balanced media .....
Brexit was the decision of the electorate; the Tories supported remaining in the EU. Of course, referendums can be used be dictators and demagogues, but that's their way of getting the result they wanted. The Brexit referendum proved this wasn't always the case as the electorate voted against what the British Establishment wanted. We voters gave them the opposite result to the one they wanted.
And what exactly has Brexit given you?
@@ddhh1270 "You" meaning the people of the UK? It has restored our precious sovereignty.
And that idiot Cameron failed to insist on a two-thirds majority to carry any decision...
@@dogglebird4430 Do you think the French or Germans have less "sovereignty" than we do?
ZERO SEATS!!!
I think it will be 12 seats, 9 of them in Scotland.
Brexit will do the same to Labour if they ignore the elephant in the room.
They have already said they want closer ties with the EU. So definately not ignoring the consequences...
Labour is still deluded to think the UK can simply turn up with what it wants and simply get it...
Beggars can't be choosers so best get the fancy begging bowl out.
Labour will not ignore the "elephant in the room", but you forget that the media in the UK is owned by Tory brexiters, which means it is pointless to pick a fight with them before the election, why is this so difficult to understand?
I agree. Though I think that if there is a massive Labour majority, Labour will actually grasp the nettle and start making moves to at least trying to join the SM. But they’ll also have to point out factually what damage has been caused by Brexit and also prosecute Brexit loons, especially Johnson, for their fraud.
Brexit has made Zero impact on
Britain's ranking in the European
economies. ! Care to explain what " devastating " effects it has had ? German economy is in Recession and predicted slower growth than UK next year...
Is that because of Brexit..😂😂😂
I remember the last time the Tories were wiped out in an existential crisis and then were in power for 14 years...
Brexit was good why are countries protesting about eu policies. Just shut up
20 % of the population are living below the poverty line. The NHS has waiting lists for 7-8 million people. Delays at the ports and airports are at record levels.
Immigration has surged since brexit - currently more than a million a year post brexit.
Asylum seekers now cost more per annum (9 Bn GBP)than the net contribution to the EU back in 2016...
Meanwhile we have an unelected PM whose Indian wife's family firm has just landed plenty of IT deals from HM Government. The PM pays a lower marginal rate of tax than a qualified nurse...
Has the country been well run since Brexit?
PPE scandal (48 Bn mislaid...), Net zero has been dropped as a priority. Foreign aid has been siphoned. The NHS is on its knees. Post Office scandal (and the same IT firm now runs the new "border controls". The trains are still on strike...small firms cannot find trained staff as Education has been trashed. Many local authorities are teetering on bankruptcy.
Meanwhile, the Gov dropped the ball on sanctions on Russia (giving 5 weeks notice for stolen money to be sent after being laundered). No one has investigated "Conservative Friends of Russia", Cambridge Analytica or published the Parliamentary investigation into Brexit Interference by Russia...
We've had loads of issues like you mention long before Brexit, the Post Office scandal started decades ago. Having an unelected PM is completely normal. Gordon Brown was unelected. John Major was unelected before 1992. That's how our system works. And always has done.
@@khar12d8 The last prime minister to take office on winning an election and leave office on losing an election was Ted Heath. I don't think any prime minister has ever done that and served more than one parliament.
You do know that we don't elect a pm in this country don't you??
@@khar12d8you do know that we don't elect a pm in this country don't you??
@@khar12d8 But the extent of the mess since austerity and Putin's lies pushed GB into brexit are way out of order.
It's strong coffee time for many people.
2:45 Thatcher broke the country. Not just changed it.
I was and am a rejoiner. A full on european. But brexit did feel like an unavoidable cultural crisis we had to go through when shedding our imperial heritage and embedded exceptionalism. It hurts and will leave marks. But i suspect we will come out of it much improved in the long term.... it is a profound national lesson that will resonate for generations.
A hard way to learn. There were alternatives
I know people who still think brexit was a good idea 😂
I could have sworn it was the British people who were given the choice on Brexit, not any single political party. Or was I dreaming?
You where dreaming. Uk held a referendum on the issue. Parliament with a tory majority made brexit. Uk is not ruled by referendums but is a parlamental democracy. A civics class might help.
@@ulfosterberg9116 could have sworn you just wrote that the choice was a referendum.
You'd have thought that Times Radio would be able to deal with sound levels in their videos
The ads are up to 3 times louder than the sound in their videos
Why a 6-week election campaign period? So that Rishi could say that he delivered on one promise - that the election would happen in the 2nd half of this year!
Unlikely to recover, good.
Strictly speaking the long term and existential crisis in the Tory Party caused the vote to call a referendum.
The Conservative Party are the political equivalent of a dog that makes a habit of chasing cars that actually catches one. They've no idea what to do with it once they have it.
A bit deluded….it wasn’t Boris that took the Tories down a blind alley, it was Cameron. You could also argue that Thatcher destroyed the sense of common purpose and social adhesion and built up the drive for every man for himself and sink or swim. Of course she doesn’t look so demonic by comparison to the cruelty of the Tory governments of the last 10+ years but she was a catalyst for the changes that have followed.
Heard John Redwood on lbc yesterday,totally deluded individual even now refuses to accept any blame for the state of the country.
Criley! Does anyone think that piece of work is worth his rations?
Hopefully the election will rid us of such trash.
I tried to listen. I really did.
But, “Brexit made me cry,” isn’t anything very new to hear.
Brexit. No-one asks Brexiteers why we voted leave. The media and politicians make assumptions. I voted no in 1973 and voted leave at the referendum to get rid of yet another unnecessary and expensive level of government. We have parish councils, town councils, county councils, devolved governments, Westminster MPs and all the various committees in between. It is painful to achieve anything that affects the general population,it all takes far too long. From my experience in business where things move quickly and deadlines have to be met councillors/politicians wouldn’t last long.
So, you voted 'Brexit' to reduce beaurocracy, remove unnecessary 'red tape' and improve the efficiency of government. How's that working out for you?
There was probably an 80:20 split between the benefits of staying versus any benefit of leaving; no way should it have ended up 48:52. You may have disliked aspects of the EU but we are undoubtedly poorer for leaving.
If Starmer doesn't Fix Brexit, it will also bring down and destroy Labour as well. Brexit is not a neutral topic, it's in play every day and will hit the economy very hard in the next 5 to 10 years. Starmer either has to renegotiate the trade deal or rejoin the single market otherwise the Labour Ship will also get blamed for Brexit. He has to deal with it
Totally agree. At some point he has to grasp the nettle. Right now he seems to be doing his best to not say anything at all - precisely because he can win without having to say anything, so catastrophic the Tories have been. But he will have to tackle the EU issue and I imagine the Labour membership will expect him to do that. At the moment I'll give him the benefit of the doubt - he doesn't want this messy and divisive subject to dominate the campaign and he doesn't want to bring Farage into play. But when he's in Downing Street I'm expecting a different approach towards the EU from Labour.
@@hugodrax71 Totally Agree. Starmer had to Take Brexit Off the Table in this election campaign, but if he continues to ignore it during his entire first term I guarantee it will become a live Topic at the 2029 General Election where the Tories and Reform will double up and say ' Look Statmer squandered out Brexit Opportunity'. It's in the post and if Starmer tries to ignore it then it will be a single term parliament for him and Labour.
Russian money! 🇷🇺 💰
Technical point. Why is the sound on your videos so low? Even with the volume on my two-month-old HP laptop on full, I can barely hear what's said. In contrast, TLDR or Channel 4 news is loud and clear.
Its not brexit its absolutely EVERYTHING
Good commentary
Actually what happened is King was asking criminal Sunak did he gaved order to attack me and after he said yes we all see what is happening in UK/that is truth of early elections.
Maybe Sunak is forcing a bad result to get rid of as many Tory extremists as possible. Let them go to Reform, a commercial company. Then he hopes to rebuild a centre ground party. Who knows, but the Tories are in a terrible mess.
Take a look at the EU not a bed of roses.
Why is the sound so low on these clips?
Try turning your volume up.
@@simonf2220 duh
You have clearly missed the point! 😂😂
Good. Let’s hope they never return to power.
Thatcherism was a combination of nationalism and free market economics. Thatcherites, who grew to dominate the Tory party saw the EU as diluting our sovereignty and imposing more social democratic economic policies on us. But most thought leaving the EU was a step too far. Better to stay in and get the trade benefits of EU membership and insist on opt-outs for any policies that they found unacceptable. The EU has no mechanism for expelling unruly members so they usually had to concede.
But there was always a fringe on the right of the party that had a visceral hatred for the EU and they had caused a lot of trouble for Tory leaders over the years. Farage's UKIP was also gaining popularity, after years of being a tiny fringe party, by linking EU membership to immigration. Cameron had a cunning plan to shut them all up once and for all - call their bluff by asking the voters in a referendum if they wanted to leave the EU. All the polls, going back many years, showed that they did not. He'd just won a similar gamble with the Scottish independence referendum. He was good at this, what could go wrong?
The gov have failed to act on brexit in the way that was needed. Sunak has been in the two main roles and is totally responsible for the failures on nhs , illegal migration and the mess that is the economy. He has failed the country and the party and can fly off to the USA as soon as the votes are counted!!
I have been involved in the Tories since I was 17 and the party had become very anti EU from way before 2016, most rank and file Tories were Brexit supporting for a long time. The party from the 1990s was strongly eurosceptic. The Tories will recover. Labour will not scrap FPTP. The Tories lost very badly in 1906, 1945 and 1997 and have always come back.
The problem the Tories have is they haven’t recovered from 1997 and are going into another disastrous election that could on current polling remove most of their tools for ensuring even a similcum of recovery. Of the last 7 elections labour have won 3, the Tories 2 and the best of those about as good as the worst of Labours 3 wins, with 2 hung parliaments. If Judas Clegg hadn’t betrayed 80% of his voters by creating the 2010 coalition even that decree of recovery wouldn’t have happened. The 2015 victory was only possible because the Lib Dem’s collapsed, with the SNP performance in Scotland obscuring the Labour gains in England and Wales. In 2017 May lost an election against a Labour Party led by a disciple of Michael Foot and could only remain in power with the votes and abstentions of diametrically opposed bigoted terrorists in the DUP and SF.
The Tories never cleansed their extremists in 2004-2015 when they had multiple chances to do so. Instead they have become UKIP and are about as electable.
A centre right party will emerge from the wreckage of this election. The question is can the Tories purge the far right nutcases who currently dominate the party and recover or will the Lib Dem’s become that party. Right now the smart money is on the Lib Dem’s.
I agree, the Tories are masters of survival - but this time I'm not so sure. Brexit isn't the Utopia promised and the economic aftershock will be felt for years to come unless there is some sort of rapprochement with the EU. Don't underestimate the number of swing voters who feel livid Brexit happened. Also, the party is visibly splitting - more than ever - with the Right element (in tune with Reform - there's another headache for the Tories) battling for the throne so I predict further internal unrest after the GE. As for the GE itself, I'd be amazed if it doesn't eclipse 1906 as the Tories' heaviest ever defeat.
You’re wrong I think. They’ve gone too far this time. Austerity and Brexit. I am a swing voter and in the traditional Tory demographic, but I will never vote Tory in my life now. Neither will my wife. And I’ll make sure my children understand how toxic they are. They have stolen the European citizenship from my family and that will never be forgiven. Ever.
Hard to argue with that.
Never do video call with a laptop on your lap.
Nah
Brexit was and still is a very controversial issue
The MAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE WHO VOTED expressed a desire to leave
As a democratic country the Government either Conservative or Labour had a responsibility to follow the wish of the people in this country
I know that it was the Conservatives who were in power at the time but disgrafully the PM at the time stood down when the result came thru
It can be argued that there were only a certain percentage that actually voted on Brexit at all but the people had the chance to vote so it's no good moaning when the result doesn't go your way
We cannot adopt the American stance that votes are rigid or blocked when things go differently
Each eligible voter should have used their vote at the time and not in hindsight moan
The country would still be where we are at this point under a Labour Government
Let's hope that what Johnson did not achieve, Sunak does - give the Tories the well deserved coup de grace coming to them. This party for the 1% which has been gutting British society since Thatcher deserves never again to come into power!
The Conservatives will take a break but with new faces, ideas and a disapointing Labour party they will be the government again in 5 years......our first past the post system dosen't allow for anything else. The sheep can always be relied on.
Good.
You made me laugh out loud on a plane and look weird 😅
Geoffrey Wheatcroft clearly knows his stuff but is not a fluent speaker, shame
Put a compressor on his audio stream, please. Those whistles are like sharp arrows coming from the speakers.
Wise words, Geoffrey, but you're making me seasick. Had to give up at 1:17
Commentators looking back at the 2017 election always forget that polling day was just days after the Grenfell fire, which was being blamed loudly on a Conservative-controlled local council. The only manner in which there was a 'swing towards Corbyn' was due to the revulsion being stoked in the media towards the Tories due to the blame being ascribed to them for the fire. It wasn't Corbyn they wanted, it was (rather like now but with a narrower focus) 'not a Tory'. Even Theresa May could have got an actual majority if the fire hadn't happened.
You are thinking to small. The question is " will UK recover"
I’m still waiting to hear of a single benefit of Brexit that stands up to any scrutiny. If the UK wants back in at some stage there will need to be a complete change of attitude by the British people. Given the level of supreme ignorance displayed before and after Brexit, that won’t happen.
it won't happen while the Tory owned media dictates public opinion, it will happen at some point under a Labour government
Yes. Show us. Be transparent. Don’t just say it. Or that there is a “Plan”
The problem isn't really Brexit, it's that you actually have to have some kind of plan or vision. The only vision for Brexit that made any sense was the Dan Hannan type vision...a Singapore style, low regulation, low tax country that is heavily focused on competing financially and selling stuff and manufacturing technology. . Ultimately that's quite a minority view in what is a very socialist country., and would require a complete change in how people are educated and the entire infrastructure and culture of the country. Personally, I still think it's the only possible route to success in a globalist system. You have to outcompete everybody else. The EU is dying. It focuses only on itself and is losing power and market share to the rest of the world at an alarming rate...it's not the answer.
Why dont Cons / Tory Party make a few hundred cardboard cutouts of sunank and put them forward as potential M.Ps for the Tory Party...
Its crazy times when drug dealers make more money than this country trades.
Zero seats.
The clown Johnson single handed destroyed the tory party......well done sir.
Great discussion, thanks! 😃
Notoriously ruled by dictatorship and demagoguery Swiss had 10 referendums in 2018
That's because they have a semi-direct democracy.
Does that mean that they are finished and will split ? That's one of the reasons I voted leave. It's taken 10 years and the collapse of the UK economy. But it will have been worth it.
I don't see common sense, nor pragmatism or skepticism. I see Neoliberalism, small state, Business before politics, Austerity, and Labour is complicit. Not much to chose between those parties.
The fault lines have been there for years the tory party will split along those lines. If this happens good riddance to them as the country cannot afford their grifting which has asset stripped the country.
Since the Tories is out of the political game for now, so ideally the electorate should not continue with a binary vote. Proportional representation is a must. The tired British electorate system needs a root and branch overall. Forget tradition and all that rot.
I believe that rejoining the EU will be the great endeavour of the next decade, just as leaving it was to the last.
Totally up to the 27 EU member states if that ever happens.
Even if the Tories only get a few 10's of seats in the GE, it leaves a political vacuum on the right wing, which will be filled by at least two parties, a centre right Europhile one nation tory party and a firm right or hard right wing party that is very Eurosceptic, free markeeter, populist and as policies that borders on crypto-nationalism.
🕺We will tell you any man. And not mean any of it. Vote Tory.
SUNK
After a term of a Labour government, they will probably be back again.
4:23 bojo was NOT the cause of Brexit. He was a useful idiot.
This analysis fails to acknowledge just how manipulated the Tories are by economic Librarian"think tanks" etc.
Leaving the EU was certainly a vanity project of the old guard - IDS, Redwood etc. - but Brexit (the Brexit we got, the one I voted against) was a big step on the road of deregulation. Nothing else.
It's got nothing to do with Brexit but it has 100% to do with Sunak ... He is Useless
You are in Cloud Cuckoo land!"
The Tory plan is to continually say as often as they can that Labour does not have a plan.
No-one has a plan, outside of the globalist cabal, whose only plan is to transfer all wealth and assets to themselves and create a feudal state.
Vote reform. They won’t win, but have to be given support in order to grow.
They will never win because most Brits don't want to trade one group of sociopaths for another group of even the worst sociopaths
The national service idea will be a vote winner. Snort !
A brexit benefit, the Torys getting their arses kicked😂
Goodbye Tories. You won't be missed.
oh dear, there are some days, i;t's best to stay in bed. I often wondered how Rome fell, probably something like this.I don't want my lads to be cannon fodder, unless they choose it, we have a long tradition of a professional army. I have voted tory most of my life, coz I thought, at least the economy will be ok. They are all deplorable on all sides, they are career politians, they don't stand for anything.
Tories are finished! Lol
basically the Tories didn't want to lose out on the right hand side of the political spectrum to UKIP so they took their main issue (leaving the EU) and made it their own to take the wind out of UKIP's sails. The rest of the UK has been paying the price ever since.
And where is Farage now?
But the Right element never went away with Brexit. In fact, they're more vocal and politically aggressive than ever. They rebranded into Reform which is now going after the party that gave them their wish of leaving the EU!!
The single market was one of Mrs Thatcher’s flagship policies. Being outside that is not helping our economy. Many of the present Tory MP’s
stepping down are those who were so dishonest about Brexit. The demise of the Tories started with Boris Johnson and I predicted his arrogance had the ability for self destruction.He was so dishonest about his ‘oven ready’ deal which still hasn’t been fully implemented. Many MP’s signed up to his ‘deal’ because they didn’t want to sacked - they didn’t even read it.