Sylvanas Windrunner Sucks *RANT*
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- čas přidán 24. 09. 2019
- After watching this video, please go watch this amazing machinima video made by Captain Grim: • Shadowlands Cinematic ...
It sums up all my grievancies with this character.
Don't take this rant too seriously guys, it's only about a videogame character I thought was shit so I thought I'd share my thoughts on her... but it is gonna be a rant and it's gonna be a shitty video so have fun watching me get really pissed off just keep any complaints about the video to yourself. Feel free to bitch at me for my opinion though, I won't respond though because you will never change my mind on it.
To see how unlikable Sylvanas is, watch this video: • War Campaign Finale Ci...
Visit my blog here: cynicalgamingblog.wordpress.com/
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Also N'zoth, and old god got killed off in a single patch LOL.
When the last old god was killed by the Titans it created the well of eternity, the Titans imprisoned the other old gods because killing them off would fuck up Azeroth, yet apparently that's retconed too, just like all the other good lore.
Not surprised there. I knew N'Zoth would be next because Sargeras is dead (LOL what!?) so they needed a new big bad.
@@CynicalGamingBlogTerry309 sargeras is not dead tho, hes just imprisoned by the other titans while illidan is just.. there watching him i guess?
@@neotekilla He might as well be dead all things considered. Blizzard created a single expansion just to remove the Burning Legion from the lore so they can move on with Sylvanas' conquest of the universe, starting with the Horde. So he is dead to me: removal from lore = dead character as far as I'm concerned, it's a killed off camera situation really. Why would they bring him back now? To be killed if anything. They even killed Kil'jaeden... motherfucking Kil'jaeden, the guy who single handedly organized the first and second war. It's insulting how badly these characters were treated by Blizzard, they never got a chance to shine because of the stupid MMO format being so one dimensional.
Imprisonment, death it's all the same really, it's Blizzard's way of saying "fuck this character, we want him out of our Sylvanas fan fic!!!"
I've noticed in the past years that LOTS of active players, especially female players, seem to always defend and admire Sylvanas Windrunner, even after or before the Burning of Teldrassil. Their reasoning was that she was a deeply traumatized who was able to overcome and harden herself through her trials and become a strong individual with very great force of will.
And what I would say. No she is not. How Mass murder, War Instigation, Torture, Animal Cruelty, Unethical Experimentation, Attempted Enslavement, Attempted Omnicide, Mass Genocide, Arson, Treason, and War Crimes "empowerment?" She's a genocidal maniac and has been since Vanilla.
It is funny that the writers, and the fans are big Sylvanas stans and are searching for a way to get people like me to forgive and forget everything bad she has done. Trying to paint her as some unfortunate victim of the Jailer's manipulations is just one of many steps along that path.
But the sad part for them is that not going to make me forgive Sylvanas or feel any sense of emphaty for her. All they are doing is making me more apathetic to her. I literally don’t care about Sylvanas at all anymore I wouldn’t mind her never being mentioned again at this point.
My feelings for Sylvanas Windrunner is the same feelings I have fir Darth Vader. I don't feel sorry for them at all. What is there to feel sorry for?
They both constantly kills people, a lot of whom are innocents without feeling any shred of remorse. I just have a hard time feeling sorry for them, because they constantly makes conscious choices to do terrible things.
So! I am not loyal to Sylvanas because she has not earned my loyalty. The only reason some people are loyal to her is because they are horny for her and nothing more.
Yep, you just about hit the nail on the head.
Sylvanas has gotta go man
Bring the legion back!
Thank you. I was never a fan of Sylvanas. It's funny how for years Sylvanas has been considered by many fans to be the Scourge's biggest victim, that nobody suffered as much as she did, while in my opinion, the third generation death knights had it worse as they had to kill not only their people, but their family and close friends against their will to prove to the Lich King that they were pure monsters. Even when some of them regained their free will, they are still cursed with the endless hunger, where they have to inflict suffering or else they suffer and can even go into madness themselves.
Oh yeah there's many people who had it worse in the Warcraft series than Sylvanas, even if you look beyond the scourge you have characters like Taretha Foxton and Griselda, their lives were pretty grim. Sylvanas had it comming anyways, she was too mouthy and she paid the price. Maybe next time don't talk shit to an army of cannibal undead???
She is a thousand times worse in WoW right now.
I know... it's taken this long for people to finally catch on.
And made her even more unlikeable in SL. The whole expansion happened because of her sheer idiocy. 🙄
Don't watch WOW Shadowlands reveal trailer.
Too late... and no it does not surprise me. Nothing surprises me anymore where World Of Warcraft is concerned.
I’m sort of getting Alice from the Resident Evil film vibes from how you described Sylvanas, only Sylvanas seems worse.
Never seen the resident evil films so I don't know all that much about Alice.
Pretty much Paul's OC(Director) to insert his wife and make her a Mary Sue. Which is what Sylvanas is.
I love how Arthas called out Sylvanas for getting her own people killed. All he wanted was the sunwell.
If they want an undead race, they should have made a character who tried to rebel against Sylvanas. That would have been a better leader who is part of the Horde. Who would even want to work with Sylvanas?!
Varimathras tried it but Thrall showed up alongside the entire horde to screw him. It was a great story build up too, lots of scheming and planning happened but Thrall wasn't in the equasion at the time because originally the Forsaken weren't supposed to be in the horde, that was retconned in WOW. If it wasn't for that retcon, Varimathras would have won.
At one point she turned heel and was even a raid boss but Blizzard somehow found a cheap way to turn her face again. Wouldn't want to upset the fans by permenantly killing her.
Funnily enough her second in command prior to her heel turn was Wowcrendor's OG Character that Blizzard put in the game for him which I find quite funny. Imagine the forsaken led by him?
@@CynicalGamingBlogTerry309 anyone but Sylvanas
I would have LOVED to see a an undead rebel against Sylvanas and NOT be portrayed as being "in the wrong" for doing it. Part of what always annoyed me the most about Sylvanas' story is that everyone who hates her either has to forgive her because she's "misunderstood" or end up as a villains. I am so sick of it. Arthas and Genn Greymane were jerks, they hated Sylvanas. Garrosh hated her and received the villain bat. Tyrande hated her, and had to forgive her. Let's not forget when Sylvanas reunited with her sisters. In Warcrimes, Sylvanas fantasized about murdering Vereesa and raising her into undeath without her knowledge or consent. When Vereesa decided she did not want to abandon her living sons, Sylvanas threw a hissy fit and went on a killing spree. In the trash comic Three Sisters, Sylvanas reunites with both Vereesa and Alleria. Alleria hates Sylvanas not because of the atrocities she committed, but because she is an undead creature. Throughout the whole comic I got the feeling that the writers tried to paint Sylvanas akin to someone being bullied by her sisters for being socially awkward or different. Sylvanas deserves nearly all of the hate in Azeroth she gets, she is not misunderstood, she is a rabid dog.
When you realize her second in command now is literally Crendor...
Crendor will be the first real person to become a faction leader in the Warcraft universe, his character will be part of the lore.
I have hated Sylvanas Windrunner for a long time! COUNTLESS souls have fought, bled, and sacrificed themselves for their homeland as well as for their loved ones and ended up suffering at the hands of Arthas and the Scourge. Those said people were also raised into undeath and forced to be a slave to his will. Many characters have shared pretty much, the same exact fate as Sylvanas and yet Sylvanas gets singled out? Why? What makes her so special? Sure she died a hero, defending her homeland and her people, but so did many of the forsaken, as well as many deathknights of the Ebon Blade!
The burning of Teldrassil is in fact, one of the many villianous acts she had commited ever since she regained her freewill as a banshee. Since Cataclysm, Sylvanas has been commiting pretty heinous attrocities. She plagued both Gilneas and Southshore which is, by the way, attempted genocide. The plague would have killed not only soldiers, but also civilians. Now, I know Genn Greymane was a huge asshole but, surely not all of the Gilneans deserved to die. The reason I brought Genn up is because there are many who believe Gilneas deserved what it got when Genn, and maybe a few of his supporters, are the only guilty ones. Also, in just about every battle she fought in, Sylvanas was reanimating fallen soldiers from the dead, an act that Arthas would have been so proud of her for! What infuriated me so much is that Sylvanas does all of this and she gets away scott free because she's "a StRoNg iNdEpEnDeNt WhAmEn! Now back to Sylvanas reanimaring the dead. Ah yes, Sylvanas during the Siege of Orgrimmar, wanted to raise Blood Elves ( her former people ) who fell in battle into undeath. Lor'themar did luckily prevent that from happing but still. Hey, there's also that time where Sylvanas actually wanted to murder and raise her own sister just so she can be with her. Selfish bitch. Anyone in the lore who hates Sylvanas is either a villain, a traitor, a moron, and/or is portrayed as a heartless monster who likely become a villain. Hey Blizzard! Did you know that it is very possible to have a character hate a "badass hero" while still being badass hero themselves? I have not considered Sylvanas a hero sincle Wotlk but there are many people, including quite a few people at Blizzard, who do.
One last thing I would like to add is that Sylvanas has the most toxic fanbase. According to this particular fanbase, she is completely innocent no matter what she does or who she kills. In their eyes, everyone and anyone who Sylvanas harmed or killed deserved it. Every vile act by Sylvanas is followed by excuse after excuse pulled out of their asses. Sylvanas is in my opinion, probably the most obnoxious karma houdini in fiction
200% agreed, Sylvanas is the worst character in fiction. You nailed so much about what is wrong with her.
I haven't watched the vid but considering how you love to complain about this character, I am glad I don't know anything about her. I already loathe Rey from Star Wars.
The worst thing about Sylvanas is that she isn't even heroic, she's pure evil but she is treated as a hero by fans.
Come to think of it, based on what Shintai said in his podcast about that series, I think you may be right on that.
@@CynicalGamingBlogTerry309
Well nice to know that the Warcraft and anime fanbase have equal level of intellect
lol
She's basically the John Cena of the warcraft universe 🤣
Johnvanas Cenarunner LOL
Though I always compare her more to Triple H because like Triple H she slept her way to the top, you ain't telling me Thrall wasn't banging her back in vanilla, I refuse to believe that, there's no way they'd let her forsaken into the Horde otherwise, must have been some special favors under the table.
So Hunter Ho Headbringer
Because she brings Thrall head like the dirty slag she is.
Plus like Triple H, she always has the last laugh and cannot be seen to look weak in videogames
Sylvanas technically might be a Mary Sue, but the World of Warcraft itself suffers from bad writing. TL;DR the lore of Warcraft neither interesting hatred of corporate greed.
The way Sylvanas make as a character: she's not an idealist elf than Arthas saving the people (before Arthas screw her up). After becoming undead she's not interested in joining Arthas and Kel'thuzad genocidal human, but she's secretly worked the Dreadlord in reality her goal was too killed Arthas and once the prince was killed Sylvanas was betrayed by the Dreadlord all the time killed her and she was happy that her goal was over and finally rest her soul.
That Sylvanas as an actual character: She's not interested in any petty politics or power-mongering and doesn't mind control the army she controls and wants Arthas killed. The Dreadlord just backstab and killed her after the prince's death.
No Forsaken and The Dreadlord and Kel'thuzad war occur then Illidan goes the Frozen Throne without any problem meaning No Wrath of the Lich King and Battle for Azeroth since Sylvanas is not very idealist High Elf Ranger-General only work the people endangered although many innocent elf people killed she's only worked as a military that promised her family tradition. Still, she does not succumb to vengeance unlike Alleria Windrunner. Only as an Undead the trick either survived or killed not vengeance.
Making the two Windrunner survivors are Vereesa and Alleria left.
You can only dream I suppose.
It is true that World Of Warcraft messed up the lore in general, Sylvanas is the biggest highlight of the fuckery that the lore has become, hence why she's the focus of the video. She is the core of my issues with the lore but not the entirety. There's a lot of things that piss me off about WOW lore.
Let me tell you something! Look Activision is the problem of Warcraft Lore! Secondly, EA suffers pride and arrogance for greed! Thirdly, it hard any explains many corporate ignore and selfish motivations make cheaper way like incomplete process pretty much AAA if it's good or bad by backlash! And, lastly! The world becomes crazy right now (ignore COVID-19, ignore US Politics, ignore SJW, etc too irrelevant) we suffer "the escapism is forbidden." Pretty much USA "hotbed-spoiled-egoselfish".
I ignore most other people just whining pretty much internet-user rant about the company cannot handle criticism.
I agree about Sylvanas rant it just "a person to write superheroes always good, alternatively supervillains always evil, it just came in where the flaw, explanation, and backstories don't exist making unlikable characters aka Mary Sue." most Warcraft characters just plain flat, especially the storywise involved player, but what's about the army based on RTS like LotR army involved by a great leader.
If World of Warcraft was a good game just focus a character as the player while maintains a separate: army and quest, but all the characters are good writing.
TL;DR it's so much explanation, but it gets repetitive and I don't care if the corporate got bankrupt or USA something fuckup. Like I said I don't care about prejudice in some corporate practices since I'm from a third-world country.
@@meilstoer1574 Oh I know it's Activision, they poison everything they touch, it's part of the reason why I started Cynical Gaming Blog, to bring up the bullshit that these corporations get up to and to make everyone realize that they are the problem.
Though quite frankly the MMORPG format didn't do the lore any favors either, they had to change the lore to fit the format, that's they the Forsaken joined the Horde, to balance the PVP. It's because of this that Varimathras failed to userp Sylvanas... because she got Thrall to save her ass. He should have succeeded.
Blizzard could have made a Warcraft 4 but they saw more money in WOW so they abandoned Warcraft long before Activision got involved. Activision just made things far worse.
Finally, someone made a video on this
It needed to be done, as someone who has hated Sylvanas since the start, thought it would be best to take it upon myself to do it.
I didn't hate her to start with, I actually felt sympathetic towards her and the forsaken and for what they were turned into.
It's just how over the years her status as a mary sue grew, and her fanbase are just some of the worst, ignoring all the shit shes done and excusing it because, as you said, she has big tits so doesn't matter what she does to them.
Righr now, any of the bad shit garrosh did is minuscule compared to what shes done, and hes being used as a sin battery in revendreth for his crimes.
Oh man...
Ur gonna hate the shadowlands cinematic
Sylvanas beats God next time
U are 100 percent right tho
I know, I foresaw the future before Shadowlands was even a thing. Sylvanas becomes Queen of the universe and enslaves the void lords.
In all seriousness though, Blizzard are clearly trying to make Sylvanas a heel character now which means that she will inevitably turn into a loot pinata... unless they give her a redemption arc which would be the worst possible outcome... though I pray it does not come to that. Tear that bitch to shreds and piss on the remains, that's what I say.
@@CynicalGamingBlogTerry309 a man can dream
Cheers
@@eldritchdragon5755 So my premonition was true after all... queen of the universe she shall be.
I don't know if the date of this video is clear evidence but I always knew that Blizzard would do this the moment the wrathgate questline ended in Wrath Of The Lich King where Varimathras took over Undercity, Sylvanas got it back so quickly that it pretty much rendered all the build up of Varimathras' character in Warcraft 3 completely pointless... but Sylvanas can't lose... because she has boobies.
Perhaps there's some kind of feminist agenda going on at Blizzard, I actually asked Mark Kern on one of his streams after leaving Blizzard about the state of the lore and he said that the reason why the lore is so terrible now is because there's a lot of political influence in the writing. So I have a feeling that they're trying to make Sylvanas a mary sue just to pander to feminists. It honestly wouldn't surprise me, that being said, she isn't the only mary sue character in the lore, Rhonin and Medan are also massive gary stu characters and it's becoming a problem.
When you have mortals like Sylvanas, Rhonin, Medan and even Illidan (in recent years) being mary sue's, it makes the villains look weak by comparison and that is a very bad idea. A villain needs to be at least equal or superior otherwise they aren't threatening enough to make for an interesting story.
Then again, I would argue that Sylvanas has been this way ever since Frozen Throne. She defeated the Dreadlords like they were nothing. I know that Varimathras was kinda using her... but the game clearly wanted to make her look powerful. Thing is though is that by doing so, she made the Dreadlords look stupid. This is right after they userped Arthas' throne, they had so much potential to brew trouble but they wasted it for Sylvanas' mary sue plotline.
Thing is, I wouldn't have been as mad if Sylvanas defeated Arthas at the end and got her revenge, I mean she had a personal connection to Arthas so it would make sense but the Dreadlords? Hell no, that's where I draw the line. If anyone were to have defeated the Dreadlords, it should have been Kel'thuzad, after all, Kel'thuzad knew the Dreadlords were bad news and never to trust them. I think that if Arthas did reach the top of the Frozen Throne, he could have succeeded at vanquishing the Dreadlords with raw firepower. The Dreadlords are supposed to be masterminds... but they're treated like dumb cartoon villains by Blizzard and this is what hurts the most. They need to make the Dreadlords actually threatening like they are meant to be and the silly thing is, they have the potential to be just that, they have proven to be smart... but each and every time they get outsmarted in the worst way possible... and that really sucks.
@@eldritchdragon5755 Pretty much yeah. The Dreadlords' biggest strength was their cunning nature, they were masterminds, yet they somehow get thwarted so easily. It should have taken people time to realize the true terror of the Dreadlords as they usually spent most of their time hidden behind the scenes orchestrating the events the unfold throughout the game and essentially, they are the ones who provide the obstacles for the heroes to overcome. Mal'ganis orchestrated Arthas' downfall and Tichondrius orchestrated the legion's invasion. Balnazzar, Varimathras and Detheroc were brought in right at the end of Warcraft 3 and before they could do much, they were killed off by Sylvanas. Thing is, they displayed their caliber by orchestrating the userping of Lordaeron... but the issue is that it didn't accomplish much for them because of Sylvanas. Had it not been for her, they could have been far more threatening and would have made for some really interesting villains later down the line. The potential was there to make them great and Ashbringer kinda shows what they were planning with Balnazzar at least with his whole takeover of the scarlet crusade. Thing is that every single time those 3 tried to do anything, they would get knocked down before they could even have a chance to get even close to victory.
What should have happened is the Dreadlord Insurgents should have played a massive part in dividing Azeroth. The dividing of the humans was a good start by Balnazzar but I think Varimathras and Detheroc should have had their chance to stir things up. Sure Varimathras was manipulating Sylvanas and all... but look at how that turned out.
Methinks Detheroc should have mind controlled Garithos for longer and make Garithos into more of a villain, to create a new faction involving Garithos' forces on his crusade to defeat the other races under Detheroc's command.
So Balnazzar would occupy the holy order, Detheroc would occupy Garithos' mercenary group and that leaves Varimathras. Well I think he would be best at commanding any rogue undead forces. Perhaps he could end up working with Sylvanas to defeat Arthas, not as a subordinate but as an equal ally. I mean Sylvanas had no reason to hate the Dreadlords and they both share the same goals. With Sylvanas comes her troops, so Varimathras would command the rogue undead.
It would be a great way to set things up for Warcraft 4, where Lordaeron is divided into several factions all occupied by demons who conflict amongst one another at the Dreadlord's will to weaken them. Then the Scourge arrives and causes a massive war, this is where Kel'thuzad would come into play, commanding the scourge to take down the Dreadlords and their armies of humans and undead. Meanwhile Sylvanas would end up working with Kael'thas, Vashj and Illidan, all of them want Arthas dead after all, Varimathras would probably be involved also. Of course they'd have Anub'arak to contend with as well as Sapphiron.
Oh my God you called it
couldnt fucking relate a video more than this
It's worse now sadly :(
Warcraft lore is trash, badly written, filled with constant power creeps and retcons.
The story suffers from pretty much every single writing mistake imaginable.
Everything that happens in the story happens out of convenience, the night elf army conveniently wasn't at Teldrassil while it was attacked, the alliance just conveniently stop attacking the horde because of honor, one minute the horde/alliance have entire armies then suddenly we're told that they don't have anything close to what's needed simply out of plot convenience.
Characters constantly act counter to their already established personality, some characters like Malfurion and Tryande, who are incredibly powerful beings completely fail at everything imaginable. Some regular characters punch WAY above their weight class, such as Nathanos, who is a fucking self insert of some fat bald Blizzard writer. What kind of writers make self inserts?
It obvious that Blizzard love to shill for this emothot because they sacrifice EVERY other character to simply FURTHER HER STORY, characters like Bolvar, Malfurion, Tryande, Saurfang and the list goes on.
I love how they made the lich kings helmet the gateway to ?hell?, which doesn't make ANY sense since the helmet was MADE by KIL' JEADEN a couple of DECADES before to CONTROL the scourge, yet that apparently doesn't matter because Blizzard can just make up whatever
I can go on and write a more detailed and less pissed off comment but I don't need to, because anybody who sees the story for what it is agrees with me, those who don't can go back to browsing Sylvanas rule 34.
I wouldn't go as far as to say Warcraft lore as a whole is trash. Warcraft 3's story wasn't bad at all.
It's World Of Warcraft where the story takes a nose dive. As far as I'm concerned, World Of Warcraft is the worst game ever created and has the worst story for a game I've ever seen in my life.
Had they made a Warcraft 4, I would guarantee that the story would be a lot more consistent and the reason being is that World Of Warcraft is an MMORPG which means that every bit of lore the Warcraft series brought to the table was milked to death for the sake of padding out game time and giving players more reasons to play. "Hey remember that guy from Warcraft 3? How about we bring him back as a loot pintata for players to smash?" that's pretty much what World Of Warcraft did and it fucked with the story so much and retcons happened as a result of that.
Now I know that retcons have been in the series since the start but to Warcraft 1 and 2's credit, neither of them had a definitive ending, Warcraft 3 on the other hand did have a definitive ending and therefore, Blizzard could have made a Warcraft 4 without having to retcon a single bit of story but they didn't, they just made their money making machine, World Of Warcraft, that game makes the Star Wars prequels look masterful by comparison in terms of storytelling.
As for Sylvanas, as annoying as she was, she wasn't too bad in Reign Of Chaos, it was Frozen Throne where her character started to become a problem. Had she just died and stayed dead in Reign Of Chaos, she would have been a nuisance but nothing more, at least in Reign Of Chaos she had a purpose, make a character so unlikable that players would want to play as a genocidal mad man as opposed to being like "this feels wrong, killing all these people". With Sylvanas, it didn't feel wrong, you hated her and you were rooting for Arthas because you wanted her to die.
As for Frozen Throne, yeah Sylvanas is hands down the worst character in that game and without a doubt the story's biggest flaw. She completely forgot her motives and just changed into a power hungry monarch out of thin air but with that aside, I do think the rest of Frozen Throne was still pretty good overall.
World Of Warcraft was the biggest problem and always will be, particularly Wrath Of The Lich King... god that expansion was so stupid I can't accept it as a true Warcraft game... since then it just got worse and worse... to the point that the series story is literally cancer at this point. Watching Thrall come to Sylvanas' rescue was the dumbest thing I have ever saw in a videogame ever... until I saw what happened in later expansions...
@@CynicalGamingBlogTerry309
I phrased my comment wrong, when I said warcraft lore is trash, I'm looking at it as a single entity ending with the current shadowlands.
While WoW ruined pretty much everything story related, WC3 was an amazing game filled with great stories, it was my childhood game and it caused me to care about the lore to begin with.
But, if a story has a bad ending, no matter how good it was in the beginning it inherently devalues it.
@@dare2630 Then you know exactly how I feel.
It's difficult for me to come to terms with the state of the story now so I just like to remember the good old days.
Ukenjali su sve,za mene je wow i prica i zaintersovanost umrla kad je lich king umro.WC3 je bila odlicna igrica.
Ahah the 4/3 format ahahahah this video is UNIQUE
It's because of the editing software I'm using. It isn't very good.
@@CynicalGamingBlogTerry309 It's okay it adds substance to the rant
Well great minds think a like. Unrelated, but I agree.
When Sylvanas dies, a celebration is in order methinks.
your voice sounds like the peasant "jobs done"
I'm british, that might be why.
You sounds like Kermit the Frog
After watching the video I can see what you mean, my voice has a similar pitch but I'm british so I don't think I could do a good Jim Henson impersonation.
First off I just want to say Sylvanas is one of my favourite characters of Warcraft 3 (alongside Illidan). Almost no one suffers as much as her, she loses her home, her people and her life and it doesn't even end there as she is made to serve directly under the jumped up little prick Arthas who instead of following Jaina cucked himself for Mal'Ganis (though I guess it worked out in the end because he becomes the Lich King and thus the coolest villain in all of Warcraft).
When Sylvanas finally gets her revenge against them all by manipulating Garithos and the Dreadlords to create the Forsaken, it was fantastic for me to see. A free-willed Forsaken vs the enslaved Scourge has been the storyline that I'm most interested in for the entire lore. Yes Sylvanas is a bitch, but it's so easy to see why she became one. Could anyone come out of such pain and misery and overcome it? I don't know.
Secondly, Sylvanas is my most hated character in WoW, sharing the spot with (again, Illidan). Why is that? Because she's a Mary Sue (just like Illidan). It's as simple as that. It makes no sense why she takes over the Horde. It comes out of nowhere when you have Vol'jin, who is a wonderful boy scout, gets stabbed randomly on the Broken Shore because hey, both leaders of both factions have to die apparently? No wait, I know why. It's because of fan service. Except here's the thing. I'm not a fan of Sylvanas when she wins all the time, I'm a fan of her character because of who she is and what she represents and the tragedy it embodies.
For her to keep control of the Horde despite how vile her methods are to everyone else is really stupid. After they defeat the Legion they have no reason to keep her there, she's fucking everything up for the rest of the world and the Horde decide to do nothing. They deposed one leader before in MoP but apparently they need to do Mok'gara again to defeat her and let her win for fucks sake this makes me so mad...
And if I can touch on Illidan for a second, the way they retcon his entire story to say 'Illidan was right all along' was so fucking insulting. I couldn't stand to see that purple-skinned eyesore for that entire story. In my opinion the lore has nose-dived into a mountain and I'm just cursing myself for already paying for a 12 month subscription till next year.
TLDR: I love Sylvanas because she's a complete bitch, not because she's an untouchable mary sue. K thx
Many people lost their lives and homeland to Arthas (and other things), Sylvanas is just one of the many victims that suffered, to single her out by saying "almost nobody suffers as much as her" is kinda silly especially when characters like Taretha Foxton and Griselda suffer a fate that is far worse.
Thing is that unlike everyone else, Sylvanas was kinda asking for it because like many other elves, she was incredibly vain, going out of her way to taunt Arthas as opposed to reasoning with him like Uther. Had she not flaunted her ego, she would have died peacefully like Uther did but instead she was raised as a banshee and rightfully so, she goaded Arthas the whole way and learned her lesson the hard way.
She later became spiteful as a result and while this could be seen as understandable to some degree, the point still stands that she brought all of this upon herself.
The whole creation of the forsaken was nonsense to me, it was completely out of character for her to do that, she claimed to have no interest in politics of power mongering yet she does exactly that. She only wanted revenge against Arthas, the Dreadlords had nothing to do with her vengence, heck they even worked together with her.
I find it ironic how Maiev will chase Illidan to the ends of the universe yet Sylvanas doesn't chase Arthas to Northrend considering the fact that Maiev doesn't have any personal vengence towards Illidan, she's just doing her job as a warden... with a bit of personal interest in her mission. Arthas murdered and turned Sylvanas into a banshee but instead of killing of Arthas at his weakest before becoming the lich king like a smart person, she sticks around Lordaeron to establish a kingdom of her own for no reason. It's completely out of character and that's why I hate her.
The whole Dreadlord thing was kinda ridiculous too, what beef did she have with the Dreadlords besides their threats? She would gain literally nothing of value by going to war with them yet she does. It doesn't make sense for her to do so, especially since the undead in Lordaeron aren't even her people, they are terenas' people and she shows pretty clearly how little of a shit she gives about humans by killing Garithos, showing that she was racist from the very beginning (bear in mind that she was unaware of Garithos' racism at the time). She only cared about the elves, she didn't give a single shit about the humans who fought to protect her homeland at her sister's request in the second war.
I always believed that the Dreadlords and Kel'thuzad conflict should have happened instead of Sylvanas vs Dreadlords, it would make way more sense for Sylvanas vs Arthas to be a thing, she should have chased him to northrend, it would have been interesting to see her meet Kael'thas and she could have either teamed up with them or go her own path in an attempt to eliminate Arthas beforehand. Heck she could have been the one to actually kill him off for all I care.
As for the Dreadlords/Kel'thuzad, that's a war that was meant to happen. Kel'thuzad has the book of medivh, the key to bringing Kil'jaeden to Azeroth, the Dreadlords want that book badly so they can get reinforcements. Kel'thuzad wants to eliminate the Dreadlords to get rid of the legion's influence over the plaguelands.
There's a potential story arc there that never really went anywhere and considering the fact that both Kel'thuzad and the Dreadlords are cunning masterminds, they would have been an interesting match up.
I will always consider Sylvanas to be the weakest character in Warcraft 3 for this reason, everything she does by the end of the game makes no sense and is completely pointless considering what her character is supposed to be. I love the rest of the cast but I hate her, she wasted the Dreadlord's potential. The Dreadlords were the most interesting characters in Warcraft 3, they were guiding the player and manipulating all the events behind the scenes, the problem is that they never got the opportunity to be fleshed out and never got the spotlight they deserved because of Sylvanas.
They had potential to be some of the greatest villains in the series, to watch them get out of the terrible situation they're in to watch them slowly bring the legion back to Azeroth would have been amazing to see even if they did fail in the end but nope, they were wasted potential and I blame Sylvanas for this.
I'm also not fond of what they did with Illidan in WOW either. I mean sure he was always edgy but they quadrupled his edginess in WOW. Most characters in WOW are terrible. I mean look at Thrall now, running away from his responsibility, that's not the leader we saw leading the Horde at Durnholde.
Put simply, I have always disliked Sylvanas but what they did to her in WOW made me hate her even more.
So we will have to agree to disagree on this.
@@CynicalGamingBlogTerry309 Damn, I'm glad I commented on your video. You've made a great argument for why Sylvanas holds Warcraft 3 back and I've never heard that viewpoint before. Kel'thuzad vs the Dreadlords? Arthas vs Sylvanas? You are completely correct that these undead factions have more reasons to directly fight each other. However I want to contend the claim that Sylvanas has no reason for fighting the Dreadlords and forming her kingdom.
First off though, Griselda and Taretha do not suffer worse fates than Sylvanas or any of the undead. Being brought back as unholy abominations is worse than death because it is violation of life itself.
When Sylvanas' section of the Undead campaign starts two things happens. Firstly she is able to trap Arthas, wounding him with a poisoned arrow that will painfully kill him. In this moment Arthas even demands her to kill him swiftly. However in her arrogance and hatred she refuses for she wishes to see him die suffering. This moment of hubris immediately punishes her when Kel'thuzad saves Arthas and she runs away humiliated.
After her mistake she is met by Varimathras who requests that she joins his forces. She forcefully rejects his offer and says herself "My only interest was in seeing Arthas dead. I have no time for your petty politics or power mongering." So from the start Sylvanas sees no reason to participate in their war, but her refusal to participate incites Varimathras to follow through with his threat to punish her for not joining him. Unfortunately for Varimathras and the future of the lore, the Dreadlord is overpowered and he betrays Detheroc and Balnazzar to save his own hide. She then proceeds to defeat the other Dreadlords and establish Lordaeron as her kingdom.
Initially, Sylvanas has no reason to take Lordaeron. But she is dragged into the war for the reason of self-preservation and then takes Lordaeron because it's there for the taking when she outwits her foes. And what better way to insult Arthas than to rule his rightful homeland? And it's an excellent base of operations to gain power so she can rectify her moment of sheer idiocy. (which she never does since Tirion Fordring and the players of WoW slay Arthas for good)
But that's not really why she takes Lordaeron. This throwaway line when Varimathras and Sylvanas has just recruited Garithos to fight Balnazzar finally reveals who Sylvanas has really become.
Varimathras: "Come now, you have no intention of giving them their lands back."
Sylvanas: "Of course not, the humans are simply a means to an end."
Varimathras: "You sound more like one of us with every passing day, my lady."
Sylvanas: "Watch it, Dreadlord."
I hope you see now that there is a reason why she takes Lordaeron. She does it for herself. She's self-serving, vengeful to her own detriment and cares for no one but herself. And you know what. You're not wrong to despise her for that.
On that note I concede. I started writing this to see if I could find anything else wrong with your grievances, but I can't refute that the Dreadlords are wasted potential. I have to admit that. A Forsaken nation of Lordaeron ruled by dreadlords who get kicked out of the Legion for disobeying an important tenet (such as forbidding the murder of other Dreadlords) would have been interesting to see unfold in WoW. Because of how fucking awful the story of BFA is, I'm now willing to indulge the idea of Kel'thuzad vs Dreadlords to bleach the current lore from my mind, and envision what could have been.
So yeah. I can agree to disagree on this.
Just to clarify, Taretha and Griselda's death wasn't the worst part of their lives.
Taretha was brutally raped and beaten by Lord Blackmoore many times at a very young age
And Griselda was persecuted by her father because she was a woman and considering the orcish society at the time and the fact that Blackhand controlled the entire horde, she was imprisoned in a life of persecution.
Sure they both get killed in the end but their lives were not that great to begin with.
I'm glad that you can see my frustrations though, the Dreadlords were painfully underutilized. It would have been interesting to see them become something along the lines of the Patriots from Metal Gear Solid where they would have influence over all of Azeroth and play the role of a recurring villain throughout but they never really got the chance.