How BoJack Horseman Explores Grief
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- čas přidán 6. 05. 2024
- If you've got deja vu, YES, this is an older video! But that video had terrible audio and some very ugly old borders I used to use. This is a re-recorded, remastered version with slightly improved editing.
The Old Sugarman Place is my favorite episode of BoJack Horseman. This story comes on the heels of Sarah Lynn’s untimely death, at a point where the audience and BoJack are both grieving, and fittingly, grief is what is explored so thoroughly in this episode. Primarily through the eyes of BoJack, Honey Sugarman and Eddie the Dragonfly, we take an in depth look at the many ways death and grief can break us, and the ways that improperly dealing with that grief can have major long term effects on us and those we love. Enjoy this breakdown of this masterpiece from BoJack Horseman season 4.
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Music:
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Johnny 2 Cellos Theme Music - Norman Marston
Johnny 2 Cellos Theme Remix- @BlackTyeChi
Video Used:
BoJack Horseman (2014-2020)
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Hey everyone, YES this is an old video! I’ve been re-recording them for my compilations on @Johnny2Cozy. This has GREATLY IMPROVED audio, better editing and removed the ugly old border. Plus a shiny new thumbnail! Enjoy! Or don’t! You do you!
Thank you for taking the time to improve old work. It shows dedication and how far youve come. Also you filled mmy void with more bojack, happy void
It's okay, I know you know that I just rewatched season 4. Good looking out 🙏🏾
OHHHHH
I got really confused, at first
Ty!
I am a proud ugly old border supremacist
Not-so-fun fact about the phases of grief: The person who first coined them specifically called them phases and not stages since they were not linear. Yet, when they were popularised, they became linear and known as the Stages of Grief
When I was in school, I was specifically taught they could happen in any order, including acceptance first and denial last. That made a lot of sense to me as I grew up and continues to do so even now.
They were also called the phases of death originally, because it was first noted that patients given a short lift estimate would experience these emotions in a similar pattern
I saw The Old Sugarman Place shortly after losing my son. I went through a lot of what Honey went through losing hers. I acted recklessly, just wanting to feel something other than grief. Absolutely amazing episode.
I'm sorry about what happened to your son... I hope things are better for you now, even though wounds like that never fully heal.
I'm sorry for your loss, but don't you mean Honey? Beatrice was Bojack's mother.
@@annafowdy yes, I misspoke
Sorry for your loss.
My condolences
This show was depressing as fuck but this EP took the cake
I see the show is very inspirational and hopeful TBH, at least by the end of it
The lobotomy part was the first time watching any show that I genuinely thought “what the fuck” in pure shock because holy shit that is utterly dark and depressing, and fucked up. I know Bojack Horseman was a messed up show, but you can argue a lot of people either got what was coming, or the consequences were expected, but she didn’t deserve any of it, and all she did was grieve.
But I got a free churro
The view from halfway down?
The sad part is that Mr. Sugarman really did think he was helping his wife because at the time, it was thought that lobotomies were a useful procedure. We know better with time but this was the 40's when psychology was not really that great.
Mental health awareness and treatment was hell on earth for many people back in the early 20th century. Glad to know it's improved.
@ItsNotUnusual-mp5qd Not really relevant since this is an American character
he didn't even let her eat food other than vegetables and fruit the fuck? he ignores her and stops her from doing things she loves. he was abusive period.
he was abusive yes but you have to consider the ideals of the time. he wasn't exactly allowed to be kind to his family and he thought of a horrible way to help his wife because mental health care wasn't the best at the time! not justifying his actions but with context it unfortunately makes sense @@saigeskinner6535
Psychology is not that great in 2024 either. Just look at the replication crisis and the raising numbers of all diagnosed mental disorders.
One thing I really appreciate about that dual scene when Beatrice and Honey/BoJack and Eddie are driving back to the house is that it shows Beatrice crashing into the gas station then pans back to show BoJack and Eddie pass it in the modern day, but the damage from Beatrice and Honey's accident is still there all those years later, showing how their trauma and grief have in part led to BoJack's trauma and grief as well. Season 4 will always be my favorite season for the focus on generational trauma, and it's shown in so many obvious and subtle ways.
"I can't be with people, and I can't be alone." My favorite episode by a landslide, I haven't been able to stop thinking about it
it always infuriated me how he destroyed the house at the end of the episode. yes, he has done worse and its literally a cartoon house but when I rewatch it I always think what a f*cking as*hole he is.
I hated that too. I don't care about the symbolism. Fixing this house was all for nothing. Eddie was kind to Bojack in his time of grief. Fixing the house gave them something to do. The materials were most likely bought with Eddie's money. They got into an altercation with the Crab Guys. But Bojack didn't respect Eddie's trauma and triggered it. While I don't think that Eddie was right for trying to kill Bojack- now he's left with more trauma then before and it would have been better for him to not help Bojack at all. I bet Eddie felt good satisfaction when Bojack ends up being publicly dragged for what he did to Sarah Lynn.
Well... It was nice while it lasted 😢
Grief is awful. My mother passed away at the beginning of the year in February. She was literally the glue that held our family together and now she's just gone. Bojack is the only show that has really been at the front of my mind when dealing with very intense moments of grief. so many good messages and lessons throughout the series, but it's just funny little horse show right? Lol!
Hey, my mom passed 4 years ago, also in February. I was 17. I know how you feel. She was also pretty much the glue of the family. But ironically that made smaller subsections of the family stick closer together. Things will be hard, but you'll be okay, trust me.
Even though the grief is immensible, I won't lie...
You'll be fine ❤❤❤❤
@@CrayCrayslab thank you so much! I really appreciate that and I'm so sorry you had to go through this as well! Nobody deserves to feel this way!
Sending love your way❤ this show has helped me process so much grief and shame from abuse. It will forever hold a special place in my heart
@@billandbraden1439my dad died back in October 2021, less than 2 months after I had turned 18. Not exactly the glue to hold the family together, he was struggling with a her*in and cr*ck addiction, but I loved him so much and ironically, of him, my alcoholic mom and my alcoholic stepdad, he hurt me the least and he never abused me or degraded me and he always believed in me. It still hurt like hell losing him and I regret distancing myself from him when he relapsed after HIS dad passed away, in a time where he probably needed me the most. But I just wanted to say, it gets easier with time. I don't think the grief will ever go away, but eventually I've come to realize maybe that's a good thing, and it DOES get easier. The pain that stays is love. It means I loved him and I always will love him. And it means I am capable still of loving others. Whereas when he first passed away the pain was so enormous I just became numb. The numbness is NOT permanent unless you drown your feelings in substances permanently.
And one more thing, no matter what anyone else tells you, it's OKAY to grieve!! Take your time, heal, grieve, cry, feel, please. It takes a long time to recover from a loss this heavy.
In 2021, Bojack Horseman made me realize I wasn't okay during a time in my life when I was emphatically not okay.
i feel that too. when i watched it for the first time i had no clue what i was getting into, i thought bojack was just another mindless adult cartoon but boy was i wrong. it forced me to see and address things that i hadnt before and im very thankful for it
The sad part of a remastered video is that the old comments are gone....
Old video is still up for archival purposes!
Cried like a baby the first time i watched it and still shes a tear each time 😢😢😢😢
This episode is why I can't ever hate BoJack completely. He's done a lot of horrible things, and he deserves to pay the price for them, but he's also the fruit of a poisoned tree with deeply depraved roots. How could he not have been a narcissistic manipulative ass given those were the only values he got from his parents, further magnified by the microscopic lens of a stand-up, sitcom, Hollywood career? It's kind of a miracle that he's even SOMETIMES a decent person. My headcanon for BJ is that after prison he became an acting coach, settled down in a townhouse with PB, and they worked on their issues together (with an occasional relapse just to keep them grounded). I don't need to see it animated, I just like to think that years later, he gave something back to the world for all he took... and also found the peace no one in his family ever had.
It's my first time dealing with grief in my life. Breakup. Not my first, but right person wrong time. She couldn't get better unless alone. Living in the grey is new to me. Thank you for the perspective.
Hope you're doing good; I'm going through something similar, I'm stuck on the dull depressed stage, it's hard but I know you can get through this
@@SavageKikuI’ve been in a pretty similar situation to yall, and just wanted to tell you it gets better. Give everything time and it will heal, but I advise you both to enjoy the time away from relationships to just be yourself. I give my best wishes to both of you and wish yall luck in your journey.
Taking a day off to J off is helpful.
Grey is what the world is, but learn to enjoy how light and dark the tones are. An appreciation of it makes the color more surreal once it comes back
It gets easier. I'm assuming (although I could be wrong) that you're young. Life will bring highs and lows and the older you get the more...bittersweet these moments become.
It hurts now, and it will hurt for a while to come, but one day you'll be smiling again.
This episode felt like a whole season to me. I was so engaged watching it and I felt like I was there in the Old Sugarman place throughout time, like an arrow. And by the time "I will always think of you" played, I was in awe.
That was the first time I felt like this in a series and definitely one of my the episodes of my life. Bojack will always stay with me as this amazing thing it is.
Great video, man. Love the Bojack stuff.
Easily among my top 3 episodes of the series, though at that point, I have a very hard time deciding which is best. The transitions between and juxtaposes past and present and how well this episode both establishes history and trauma while simultaneously not beating you over the head with it truly makes it a stand-out, music and all.
My husband and i made "i will always think of you" our song, we sang it to each other at our wedding while my friend played piano. Now that hes gone this video hurts but in a beautiful way, from the good days together, to the dark day i sang to him before they took him away, to now. Ill always think of him.
Honey's story gives me such chills, especially with how Time's Arrow follows up on how Beatrice was affected by everything.
Had to say goodbye to my absolutely beloved dog recently so I've been contemplating the various griefs people experience and the loves they stems from in the succeeding weeks. Maybe this popped up when I needed it most
Perfectly timed, I just started rewatching Bojack
I thought you were a bot with that pfp 😭
@@normanmai7865 I’ll take that as a compliment lol
Crazy how I’m losing my dad, going thru a breakup, and rewatching bojack rn
so sorry you're going through all that, stay safe and hope everything works out for you ❤
I haven’t experienced major grief yet. I don’t think I’m ready, and I’m scared.
With only one possible exception (an old family member with health complications, for example) you can never really be ready for an event of major grief. The important thing is to make sure that you have a good support system, friends and family, for example, and if necessary, seek professional help. I haven't experienced very many events of major grief personally, The only events where a few family members dying and going through some major breakups. But what helped me was having my mom and friends by my side. Not everyone is lucky enough to have those, but I promise, someone cares about you. To quote another CZcamsr: you are loved, you are wanted, and you got this! ❤
The house reflects each characters trajectory. Beautiful and well-constructed but falls into disrepair, mirroring the Sugarman family. In disrepair then on some level repaired, mirroring BoJack
Absolutely! And then Bojack himself is the one to ultimately destroy it forever
@@meghan253 right. In much the same way he halts the generational trauma by not having kids (although arguably the trauma does continue with Hollyhock when she stays with him)
That gave me chills Johnny, “sometimes those consequences outlive us all”
This was the episode where I went from a casual observer of this show to a huge fan. I've never seen anything else that speaks to generational trauma so well.
The story telling in this episode led me down a path of exploring these patterns in my own family - from the plane wreck that killed my great grandmother, through 2 generations of abusive matriarchs. I'm working hard to break the cycle in my own life. It's difficult when you don't have someone guiding you down a path of healing.
i think it's interesting comparison where both of the men: bojack and eddie went to anger rather than bargaining rather than beatrice, the woman who took to bargaining.
Johnny please never stop making Bojack videos. You keep the show alive even after it’s been finished for so long ❤
I feel bad for honey, the death of a child is the worst experience for a mother to go through. 😞
For me, This episode was both sad and interesting at the same time. My favorite parts were the flashback scenes with Beatrice and her family.
I think there was a comment on the old video that also mentioned how this episode highlights war's long reach of destruction. Crackerjack was the only one in the family to fight in the war, but it lead to the breaking apart of Beatrice's whole family and trickled down to Bojack and Sara Lynn.
Season 4 is by far my favorite season between this and times arrow as well as all the hollyhock stuff.
I didn't really experience a heavy grief in my life I think, but for some reason videos like this make me so, so emotional. This one and TB Skyen's one made me cry
I lost my mother suddenly in 2016. And have very difficult and complicated feelings towards my father. So for me Free Churro is my favorite episode. Left me in complete silence. My mother wasn't anything like Bea, she was a very loving mother, but like everyone, we didn't always see eye to eye. Idk, it really resonated in me. This show captures grief and the complex feelings of it very accurately. Time to watch it for the 4th time lol
ive been dealing with grief all year and something abt watching bojack struggle made me realize that, yes you have to move forward but you have to be able to look at the past to do so
That song played in Breaking Bad around the time Walter was spiralling out of control -- for reasons other than grief, sure, but he did want to get out of his skin rather badly. It's not much of a connection but it doubled the sense of plunging into a featureless void.
My friend watched that one episode where bojack's in his mind like 1000 times after his dad passed
what i find interesting is that Joseph Sugarman after entering shock never goes into denial and skips straight to stage 5) the upward turn never really processing the loss of his son just ignoring it and tries to go back to business as usual and after his wifes lobotomy he actual goes backwards through the stages entering a quiet depression having to live with the consequences in the form of his mentally deteriorating wife which leads to stage 3) anger and bargaining as he has to deal with his daughter growing into a more and more independent woman defying him and eventually drifting away it is likely he spent the remainder of his life in stage 2) pain and guilt.
This was also my favorite episode of the series….it really hit home
This was my comfort show back in 2021 ❤
Still my comfort show tbh 😅
I think the most haunting part of the "well i have half a mind to ..." and "you can keep that half" is that honey brished this line off if anyone daid that now it wold be an instant red flag but honey didnt want to belive her beloved hisband would hurt her she thinks everything he does is for her own good he could stab her and she wouldnt bat an eye
Havent u already made this video 3 years ago?
Nvm just checked description
This is one of my favorite episodes of Bojack too. In general I really connected with the episodes about Beatrice’s childhood. It’s so masterful the way she’s presented as a one dimensional villain throughout most of the show, and then we’re hit with all of this, and while she’s still awful for what she did, that awfulness makes sense now.
Johnny will never get old with bojack
Wow. This puts in grief in a perspective I'd never considered before. I've been working on my own fiction about a character's grief, and this just gave me some huge inspiration! Keep up the good work! :D
You have such a beautiful way of deep diving into this show and it makes me appreciate it so much more
This episode is so heavy but yet it’s my favorite.
A great update to your old video! This is also my favourite episode of the series. I especially appreciated the revisiting of the phases of grief and the exploring of how healing isn’t linear.
Ohhhh myyy god LETS GOOO I'm so happy you made a video on this episode it's my favorite in the whole series 🙏
A stellar video, as always! You point out so many things I never considered before and connected so many dots. It was literally with your closing words that I made the (potential) connection between Sarah Lynn's dream of being an architect, and Bojack and Eddie rebuilding the house 🤯
THANK YOU for all the BoJack videos, I found your channel through them and love how you analyse my favorite show💛
Dude absolutely insightful I love it! Keep up the great work!
I forgot this was an old video, but enjoyed the hell out of it! You did a GREAT job improving it. It hurts to get through the vids sometimes because the subject matters are so sad, but that means your explanation of everything encapsulates everything the creators were going for. Love your work man.
This episode kinda broke me. If I had half a mind
sometimes the consequences outlive us is a great line dude
Aw man, just what I needed today.
pls make more videos about Tuca & Bertie this show needs recognition and your style is perfect for it
I do really wanna get back into T&B vids!
Bojacks writers knew exactly what they were doing with this episode and I love it so much🤍
3 MINUTES AGO????
Yes please
Thank you for this. I'm going through something similar right now. Now I know how I'll be able to move forward. 👊
my grandmother just died last week. it’s indescribable how much I saw her in the portrayal of Beatrice & in this show as a whole
from being born one year apart to having their ability to love a child stunted by the death of a sibling to body image issues to sarcasm to succumbing to dementia, the parallels are so strong & this shows practically been my crutch to comprehend the muddled emotions of an incredibly morally gray family members death
great to this this episode get reuploaded now that the series has ended and we see, as you wonderfully explained, how a lot of the events of this episode now has some context added thanks to revelations we would see in future episodes.
it's just such a shame that said revelations all show just how tainted Bojack's lineage is and you perfectly summed it up with the phrase "actions have consequences" almost all of the problems that Bojack has as a character is rooted back to the actions his grandfather chose to make because of his ignorance and refusal to change, which is why our choices in the here and now ARE important why we have to choose to either break the cycle and rise above the pain that inflicted us or drown in it and become like what Bojack inevitably became, especially since his own actions throughout the early parts of the series and with Sarah Lynn would have a ripple effect
Honey Sugarman and Eddie the fly singing is by far my favorite moment in this show. It’s so tragically beautiful
enjoyed the video very much! keep up the great work sir 🎉😊
O geee i love it when you do Bojack episodes...
Ah, yes, one of the most emotional Bojack episodes, and also my favorite
Enjoyed this video truly
You're quick on the draw.
Hooooooooboy😭 When I first saw you cover this episode, it was a couple of years ago before my mom passed. It’s been two years since her passing, and it’s terrifying seeing the similarities between Honey/Beatrice and my mom; right down to passing in the nursing home and the turban. She came from such a rich background, was a literal principal ballerina, debutant, brilliant, and gave it all up for my dad who drained her of life but she couldn’t let go of and died waiting for him.
She had a stroke and an aneurysm and when I say it she was identical to Honey after her lobotomy. She even pulled a Henrietta and had a whole secret son she never told me and my sister about that she was forced to give up by her socialite mom (LITERALLY Beatrice Horseman, all the worst parts) as a teen-and he just happened to find me on social media literally last year. So watching this again is going to be a trip, but definitely so needed before Mother’s Day.
Thank you for always making amazing content, and keeping our love for this series alive and well.
I know we've seen this thumbnail before but man, I love how these thumbnails look
Made me cry
Great video Johnny! Why, I have half a mind...
My jaw dropped at the end of the episode when I saw little Beatrice leaving the house with her bike while Bojack destroyed the house.
One of my top 3 episodes
Hey, Johnnie. I'm hoping one day you can tackle parental relationships in Bojack. Maybe compare how some characters were raised and compare it to where they end up with their kids or similar
I didn't cry until she said the God damn line
This is an AMAZING thumbnail
Love the bojack content
This is my 2nd favorite episode!
Are you a lifetime of alcohol and drug abuse? 'Cos you're killin' it with the BoJack content!!
i cried
I think alot of people think Joseph is more problematic and evil than he really is. I just think hes a product of his time, especially with the lobotomy. I dont think he did that to punish Honey. Back then, people really did think this was a miracle cure for mental illness. Mental health care was in its infancy in this time period, people knew very little about it and there weren't the treatments we have today. Psychiatic drugs didnt exist yet and therapy was a taboo thing. Not to mention Joseph seems to be a kind of reserved guy who keeps his emotions to himself or just bottles them up and explains things away like a "man should be like". Which is also a product of the time. I think he got Honey the lobotomy because he really thought it would help her and when it didnt he bottled up his emotions or explained it all away. Joseph did love his family alot but was just an extreme product of the time period and we are judging him based on the standards of today which are very different. Doesnt make what he did ok or good. Its just that he's not an evil person who wanted to hurt others.
this is a bombastic vdieo
I said eff work, drinking beer, and our man 2 cellos drops a new video. Shiiiet
Based.
Its a re upload
@@PJC0007 new to me so whatever
@@bryansansone3301 read the description
YESSS BOJACK
Hey Johnny! Just wondering, where do you get your clips from?
❤ ur stuff
I may or may not have introduced myself as Hambone Fakenamigton.
watching the episode I was 100% sure Honey killed Lorein and it was even reinforced in the gas station scene which is owned by eddie
Does Beatrice ever drive in the series besides when she was a child? I might be blanking but i don’t think i’ve ever seen her in the drivers seat again
i
i just finished watching bojack for the first time and so ive been filling that bojack void with yt vids for the past week... are you spying on meeee lol you mustve seen that ive been watching all these videos like crazy 🙃
Deja vu, I just been in this place before (not complaining AT ALL I'm thrilled!!)
joseph didn't know abt the lobotomy
Look at me everybody. Pay no attention to the roof of that barn!
Psychology student here! I would like to clarify something at 8:30, a regular person can't "opt" for brain damage. Lobotomies were used in mental health facilities in the 30s for people who display violent or very inappropriate behavior, looking at Honey's fit of mania and pressuring Beatrice to drive a car, it could be safe to assume that Joseph simply checked her into a mental health facility, which would make sense since he obviously could afford it, and honey was problematic in there, eventually, the doctors decided that she should be lobotomized, now I know what people might think of lobotomies at first because this was my reaction when I saw it on the show and learned about it in class, lobotomies AREN'T used to damage the brain, it's a simple matter of severing the frontal part of the brain from the rest. The expectation is that they become less tense and agitated and there are a lot of successes, however in Honey's case unfortunately, it can sometimes leave a person emotionally blunted and intellectually reduced in other words, pretty much brain-dead. It's also worth mentioning that Joseph's own unempathetic behavior could be due to his own past, he said it himself, he was never taught how to handle other people's emotions, his ignorant actions with his Family, like Beatrice and BoJack's are appalling but as Johnny suggested, this could be an effect of the cycle of abuse that is being left on BoJack's Family, looking at it all, it's hard to say when it began. When we stray down a dark path we often need to count on others to help us control ourselves and get back our sense of control and self, BoJack's family never did, but BoJack did, and he gained control eventually, and despite how it all ended for him, we can all at least Believe in him and others who may stray from the path of Good, Thanks for Reading and Have a Great Day 💙
In the end, our choices make us
Bojack's grandad looks like John Vernou Bouvier the III Jackie O's dad.
live
Laugh
LOBOTOMY
I might be grasping at straws here but I think there might be a connection between A Horse With No Name and the fact that his character on Horsin' Around also didn't really have a name - just The Horse 🤔
Free churro is my favorite
My favourite characters outside MC are those 4 Virgin College dudes doing everything in an attempt to woo ladies & my favourite Manga Chapter is now 92.5 is they were trying to take pic of 1 of them in attempt to get rewarded with Mixer