Gimbal or Fluid Tripod Head?
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- čas přidán 10. 07. 2024
- While I look at this from the perspective of the wildlife photographer, the comparison could be helpful to anyone thinking about a purchase or upgrade
Manfrotto 502AH
bhpho.to/44mv4Pd
Promedia Gear Katana Jr.
promediagear.com/products/gkj...
Robus 5888-3 (3 section, 58", 55lb load)
bhpho.to/40I8RZU
Robus RC-8880 (4 section, 80", 77lb load)
bhpho.to/40I8RZU
0:00 Intro
1:00 Gear Review
2:00 Gimbal
5:30 Fluid Head
6:00 Manfrotto to Arca conversion
10:00 Leveling base
12:45 Differences of Style
22:00 Who is each for?
The Kirk replacement is worth every penny. Especially if you go from lens mount to camera mount. Quick and easy to change plate orientation. Also, you can change your handle mount to bring locking mechanism to the rear
Really appreciate that you made an actionable recommendation.
Thanks (stay tuned)
Thank you. I'm refamiliarizing myself with photography and because of digital cameras, video. I've more kit than knowledge. This is super helpful, helping me understand application of different tools.
Even though I am not at all into videography, this is a very well explained video. Great content for anyone interested in learning.
Awesome, thank you!
Cool discussion! Back when I had some big heavy f-mount supertele glass I tried everything from ballheads with 'sidekicks' (never smooth enough), video heads just like that 500 series (too heavy), and normal gimbals. In the end, I got a Gitzo fluid gimbal and that was my go-to for long glass for years!
These days I don't have any really heavy long lenses (my 400mm f/4.5 S is less than 2kg), so I am using a Flexshooter Pro for everything - it is somewhere between a ballhead and a video head in that it has a mode using spring loaded counterbalance and roll lock, but also a completely 'free' ballhead mode... It was outrageously expensive but it does work really well, and when I suffered a failure on part of it, they just sent me a replacement part immediately from Hungary!
Scott this was so helpful thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
Thank you for the information, Scott!!.
Any time!
Great info, especially the bowl and level unit and the arca Swiss adapter. it helps out in my decision
Shoot me a message and I'll send a link. If you can hold off, Im reviewing like 3 under $500
I got a Benro gimbal head and love it. Thanks so much for the content
They mid level gimbals are really good IMO
Great video and thanks for your advice regarding these in our cars on safari! The system you recommended for us is perfect and much more compact for travel!!!
Great to hear!
Great explanation I can’t imagine you missed anything!
Thanks for watching!
I've been using the Manfrotto fluid head on the tallest Robus legs. I originally bought the combo for studio and landscape photography. The combo worked so well for wildlife I never went to a gimbal head.
For use with a spotting telescope, a fluid head is great ! I use the MANFROTTO VIDEO MVH502AH Flat Base which I highly can recommend.
Great video and explanation of the differences, Scott! I've been considering a fluid head system and am looking forward to your second video to learn which have the best counterbalance ratings.
Awesome.
Thanks very much, this was very helpful!!
You're welcome!
That Manfrotto 502 is the head allows me to make extremely fine adjustments at high magnifications with a spotting scope. The drag adjustment takes too much turning from min to max, but mine is set to max the entire time, so I don't care. the counterbalance is also just right for the scope. I can't imagine using a friction-based head for that. I used the 500 before and it was just a bit too twitchy to make fine adjustements at 60x magnification. When I turned up the friction, it just wasn't smooth enough anymore.
I would love to try out the Camgear Mark 4/Mark 6, which is the lightest fully adjustable fluid head.
Good information, Scott. I've noticed that most of the wildlife photographers that I follow have switched to fluid heads because they shoot so much video now. I think Thomas Heaton was the first landscape photographer that I follow who illustrated the advantages of the easy leveling half bowl for photography. I watched your series of videos on gimbal heads and switched from a ball head to a Benro gimbal for all of my bird photography. Thank you very much. I chose the aluminum model because I'm doing most of my bird-art on a setup on the back porch and don't care about the weight.
I think you'll like it Clifton
@@WildlifeInspired I do like it very much, Scott.
Good explanation. I used a gimbal until I stumbled across the manfrotto fluid head on sale. I think it matched my gimbal in photography performance...swings buttery smooth. In the end, the gimbal is in my closet and the fluid head remains on the primary tripod.
Great video. I am a big fan of a gimbal head for long lenses. I really like that you can just let go and not worry that it will tilt over and potentially make the whole tripod tip over. I shoot stills, so maybe I'd feel different if i shot video.
A set-up I like for pro soccer is my 600 f4 on a gimble and tripod set up someplace like a corner press box, and 70-200 on a 2nd body hanging from a strap. This why can shoot deep into the field with the 600, but also just let go and roam the area with the 70-200 when the ball is lose.
Thanks a lot for this
Welcome!
great vid, thx!
Glad you liked it!
For most of my photography I'm using a ball head now when using the tripod. That's because I don't use a tripod as often as I should, and I don't shoot only wildlife. I do have a cheap (sub $100) gimbal that I do use occasionally. I love seeing all these heads that are so far out of my budget that I can only dream about them. I'm just not at the point of being able to get all the gear that I really want, but perhaps someday I will get closer. Thanks for all your information Scott.
If you have a good ball head, take a look at a used promedia tomohawk. I wonder if you could get one for $200 used (they last for ever) and use it in conjunction with the ballhead or maybe a wimberly sidekick used
Thanks Scott. A couple years ago I opted for the manfrotto 500 and the kirk Bridge. I also have a Leofoto leveling base above the tripod apex. i use it for all my stills from Birds in Flight to tracked astro photography.
I have this same set up. Love it.
Very nice!
Hi Scott, thanks for an inciteful video covering key differences between gimbals and fluid heads. I can learn from this. In short, it's really a case of "the right tool for the job in hand".
I traditionally used balls or geared heads for photography, but these don't lend themselves well to videography, which I'm attempting to do more of. I now realise on balance (no pun intended) that I'm better off considering a fluid head approach for video and longer lens photography and not buying a good-enough gimbal. I already own a Manfrotto 500 AH with a Kirk Enterprises arca adaption (as recommended by Hudson Henry). I'm now going to investigate better video heads too, so looking forward to seeing your follow up video.
Owning multiple tripods, heads etc is a little like having multiple lenses, cameras, bags etc etc. In chasing the best tool for any given situation, I realise it won't be best in all cases. It's easy to waste money buying kit that's too cheap (limited, needing upgrading) or too expensive (waste of funds, better be deployed elsewhere).
Heads all do similar things, but excel in certain use cases. As there is no one 'best' solution for all situations, there's a trade off between conflicting parameters - weight, bulk, performance, speed, robustness, cost, ergonomics etc etc. This principle arguably applies to most things in life too, so thoughtful reflection and careful research, pre-commitment, can be helpful. Hence the old mantra "buy in haste repent at leisure".
As I can't physically carry/travel with all my kit, what's packed needs choosing carefully to suit the expected situation(s). In this respect I learnt that a fluid head is often a better compromise for me, albeit I will fall back on my small relatively lightweight Acratech ball and small tripod (or shoot hand-held) in different circumstances.
I have been using gimbalhead for three years now, and I have starting to do more video. But I often find out how not smooth it is so I will by a video head soon! I will wait on part two and see what the best option for me is! great work on this video!
If you aren't in a rush, watch part 3 Trying to get hands on a new release but its not out yet.
@@WildlifeInspired Thank you for telling me, will wait for part 3 also! patient is key is the most value thing I've learned in the passed years! So off course il wait 🙋♂
Great video Scott. I have the manfrotto MVH 500 fluid head with the Kirk Quick release bridge which makes it easy to turn the quick release perpendicular to the head for landscape work. I mostly photograph wildlife (Birds) which I handhold my camera but when I find a place that the wildlife is staying at the same area I use the fluid head setup as I can do some video also. Just a heads up B&H has their manfrotto fluid heads on sale!
Thanks for the info!
The Manfroto isn't a 'real' fluid head. I have a Sachtler FSB-8 I use on Gitzo Mdl. 1325 Mk. II for wildlife images and video. It works buttery smooth, and when the Fluidhead is adjusted and balanced correctly, my Sony a6700 and SEL200600G lens stays in any position put it. The FSB-8 has just about replaced my Arca-Swiss Ballhead entirely.
There's a version of 502 with integrated half bowl 75mm (MVH502A here in Europe). Price is about the same as the flat version (MVH502AH).
I’ve never worked with a gimbal system. My Manfrotto fluid head (which looks like yours) is heavy and much larger than pictures would lead one to believe.
They make another version that looks similar but is bigger and heavier. Maybe that's what you have.
I use both, a Sachtler FSB8 and the FlexShooter Pro (on Sachtler Flowtech legs btw) with my 400TC and 800PF. I think the traditional Gimbals are having a hard time with the FlexShooter being able to do everything I need 99% of the time. It's size and weight advantage over Gimbals were the primary reasons why I bought it and after using it for over two years I can now say that I don't regret it. However, I still keep the FSB8 for some special use cases where I just sit down or stand at a certain spot and when I don't have to do long walks. Right now I'm using it for Alpine Swifts and I think it still has some significant handling advantages when aiming at fast birds and for panning. I like have it all the way loose but with some amount of counterbalance in the horizontal axis it just feels perfect and I'd even say it helps me improving my keeper rate with the Swifts by providing even smoother motion than the Flexshooter. A guy from Austria has CNC-milled plates that go on top of the FSB8 and replace the original plate there so you have a real arca clamp without adding something additional to the existing base plate. Works like a charm! I'm sure similar plates could be made for other fluid heads as well.
How big is your set up Replies sometimes get buried, so if I dont reply, email skeysimages@gmail.com I didnt love the flexshooter, but I understand its value (compact and versatile) If I was traveling and doing, photos and video it could be really good. I may try to own one at some point to be fair to it.
I use the Sachtler FSB6 for at least 15 years now. Super fluid head I must say. Never had any problems and it still works great at minus twenty degrees Celsius. The Flexshooter is on my bucketlist for some time, but the list is a little to long!!
Hi Scott, thanks for video. I'm looking for the Arca Swiss clamp you added to the Manfroto plate. Where can I find that? I like that yours has space for at least two bolts.
That's a cheap one which is why I'm afraid to suggest it. I have had no issues for like 15 bucks Ill link you but be advised, this is not a recommended product as a entry level clamp.
amzn.to/43rSJN7
amzn.to/44tJkpL
First link has a longer handle and I wasn't sure about the setup so I tried it cheap. There's a $100 clamp by one of the better companies available as well
I use the Manfrotto Head when i´m in a hide as a stable platform, in all other situations i use the LeoFoto PG-1.
nice mix
Excellent, really informative. Question you use Robus in the studio but what tripod do you use out in the field? Could you use the Katana Jr on a monopod?
You can use katana in the field. For Tripod I used a Fiesol for years but now long use it (I keep it at the house with a ballhead for pics around the yard - macro and such, or to hold my iphone/cam to record) I use the Robus in the field to be honest. While there are sturdier tripods for $1,000+ I just don't see the need to go out of pocket to get something that is 10% "better" Also note, I shoot a monopod a lot for songbirds, hand held for fast moving raptors during migration, and low angle for ducks and shorebirds. I shoot a tripod less than the others but I always use one if I think I will shoot video.
Leveling bowl ~ wheither above or below, the camera will still be higher from water lever. Scott, on the fluid head, how do you manage that handle? It would seem to be in the way a lot, especially when you are low or in brush.
You can rotate that handle to it is bent up or to the side. But if you're in a really brushy spot could be in play. They all come out very quickly and could be used without if needed just isn't quite as smooth.
Great video Scott! Would have been good to throw the curveball Flexshooter in there too :)
I did one Before. Seems to perform like a light weight fluid head. Some of the same pros and cons. Top mounted. Can be smooth. Seems to hold a decent weight but maybe not the heaviest. Little pricey. If weight is no object the fluid head is a better bet to me. But a really great option for a small set up that does photo and video well.
@@WildlifeInspired Thanks Scott, video not a factor for me, as i shoot primarily stills, but really like the look of the Flexshooter as it is so compact and light.
Youre gonna make me try it again lol People swear by it or don't like.
Where's part 2?
It's in his video about fluid heads.
Hi Scott, thanks for the video, if you don’t mind can you please share the Arca swiss Adapter for Monfrotto quick release system.
Will do
Just use these links and proceed are your own risk, though I have had ZERO ISSUES.
You want 75-150mm clamp with a Level or a long knob
amzn.to/41JTGkF
amzn.to/3S1vrer
The one I use: amzn.to/3tC8YLE (inexpensive chinese with extra long knob)
Just thread your manfrotto plate to that MAKE SURE IT HAS 2-3 THREAD CONNECTIONS DONT USE JUST ONE.
@@WildlifeInspired thank you. I got the idea now. Appreciate your quick response
The correct term for the amount of force to overcome a friction based resistance is stiction. It is common in things like motorcycle forks. Once they start moving it requires less energy to keep them moving. I'm thinking of getting a Pro-Media Katana Jr. They look beautifully made.......The Wimberly gimbals are a bit too pricey and heavy. Gimbals like the Tomahawk are definitely not of interest.
Now I have to google!
Good showdown! You should look into the Sachtler Flowtech75 Aktiv6 combo! It's WEIGHTY and expensive but is solves all my gripes with traditional fluid heads! It can level super quickly AND get down low to the ground, it is super smooth and can handle 18 lbs of counterbalance! It can also quickly be moved to say a groundpod or a slider. I am trying my hardest to justify spending just north of 2000 usd on that setup, because I rented it once and fell in love hahah
I will check it out The "best" one i used is a pretty utilitarian one my millers. Rock solid but not much adjustment.
@@WildlifeInspired excited for the next episode! 😃 🤘
Scott, have you tried video heads from Sachtler?
I have not.... I will just not yet
Has anyone used the Komodo K5/K5S or the Manfrotto MVH500 for large telephoto lenses like the 180-600? Please share, cheers!
Great video. Understandably, you are focused on wildlife photography. Consider whether a fluid head might gain a point or two if it is also used for other types of photography - landscapes, portraits, night sky, etc. Also, some folks may want to use one set up for everything they do, including bird watching with a spotting scope. The Kirk top plate is a terrific addition to the Manfrotto fluid head. It is well made and works very well. Looking forward to your next video on this.
Thanks Rob!
If you have to choose 1 to use on your ground pod ,which will that be? While shooting you might be doing a mixture of video/stills.!!
Probably a gimbal unless it's heavy video. Panning is good on lost gimbals and for low angle youre mostly panning. If your focus is video, fluid head. Keep in mind a fluid head is going to sit up much higher so it won't ever. Be really low.
Thank you for the video Scott. I'm halfway through the video. I just bought a Leofoto gimbal from watching your other video and I have the same manfrotto fluid head as in this video. I'm pretty sure I have the exact same Arca swiss base that you used for the manfrotto? I was wondering if you happen to have a link to the one you have? Thank you and I'm looking forward to part two of your video. 🙂👍🏻📷
Great to hear!
@@WildlifeInspired Do you have a link to the ARCA Swiss base that you adapted to the manfrotto plate? Thank you
I have a Gitzo fluid head mounted to a GItzo tripod. I am a photographer and shoot primarily wildlife (most birds currently). I use this setup with Nikon D850 and a Nikon 600mm F/4E lens and a Sigma 150 - 600mm Sport lens. In your opinion what are the pros and cons to this setup? Both lenses are too heavy for me to hand-hold either of them for very long. I understand this does cause me to miss a number of shots of birds in flight, but I still manage to get a few shots from time to time.
Not much downside other than I don't love the fluid gimbal. The concept seems solid and very few people make this. It's not bad, I just didn't love the gitzo. As I remember it never got frictionless and always had resistance.
I'm glad others had mentioned the Gitzo fluid head as well. This is what I am using now and I don't feel it works very well for video with long lenses. In my copy at least, I have the opposite problem with the horizontal panning. Very little resistance and very little to no ability to adjust resistance with the poor knob. You can also see the clunks when you begin movement. I do not recommend the Gitzo for video but it is still a nice gimabl.@@WildlifeInspired
Okay, I do now more video than stills however I heard mainly bad than better reviews on this specific fluid head while I tried Benro WH15 and it was literally little to no difference to any gimbal head. On the other side it's also uncomfortable as I got used to hold the gimbal head with my left hand while fluid heads don't have such handle. I want to try the Manfrotto Nitrotech 608 but I feel like with my equipment (z9 + z800PF) it's all the same and there are always shakes when moving it to whatever direction... (it happened on the Benro head which is their top tier fluid head). Very anxious topic ;D
I did 3 more recently and will be out soon $400-500
The Manfrotto 502AH counter balance weight is 4KG. So any equipment around 4kg will be as balanced on it as it will be on a gimbal. It will not creep forward or backward when tilted but the tripod plate needs to balanced in the first place as in the case of a gimbal. If you don't balance it with all knobs loose then it will fall forward or backward when tilted too much. Test the the Manfrotto 502AH with Sony 200-600mm or Nikon 200-500mm or 300mm f2.8 or any such lens.
I tested with a 300 2.8 and that was pushing it. IF you tilted too much it crept. Cant handle a 400 2.8 500 f4 etc.
Whilst this video may be 3 months old ... Whilst i bought a Manfrotto MVH500AH without even watching this video at all until now ..
I bought the the fluidhead mainly because of price that i could afford .. Gimbals are a blatent ripoff .. for the money !!
Even when am Level when capturing a target i've noticed that when following a target ethier up or down river the Horizon .. goes off slightly when taken pics .. and since i mainly bought it for my Sigma 150-600 it's bloody annoying due to the fact the shockingly bad placement of the tripod collar/mount offers ZERO STABILITY TO THE LENSE . Whereby I have to use a remote shutter thus cancelling out lense shake /vibration .
Not only that everytime when i tighten the mount when getting the target dead center especially when capturing the Moon your garunteed everytime have to alter it again due to the lense shake vibration of the lense caused by the badly placed tripod collar
And with the fluidhead i can get a near vertical capture when doing Nightsky captures
Ha! The Gitzo branded bowl and leveling base are well over $500 total. I've been told I shouldn't use other brand bowls/bases with my Gitzo legs. Anyone can comment on this?
good video but if one is also doing landscape and wildlife photography i dont do much video in fact hardly any video what would u suggest
Theres a couple I liked for landscape. The Fotopro Eagle series as I recall was a really good one for both. (B&H sometimes runs a nice sale on it)
Hi Scott,
Really enjoy your informative videos on all things wildlife !! Bought the LeoPhoto Tripod and Gimbal setup. I like it, but as you mentioned the gimbals are a little sticky/jerky for video. Probably go with fluid setup eventually. However, I have yet to use it outdoors, cuz I find handheld more practical and not have to suffer from lugging around a mini-studio. Of course, some of my photos are blurry as a result of a shaky hand ??
Might try your recommendation of using AI to touch up some photos that need HELP.
Would really like to see a review on PRINTERS !! I'm thinking of buying a Amateur/Professional grade Canon or Epson Photo Printer - Look forward to your future input on printers
All the best !!
I'll never do a printer review. I don't print lol sorry. I like to shoot too much.
@@WildlifeInspired Thanks for the reply - Look forward to your next video !!
Just a quick question. Does the gimble only work reguarding balance with a prime lens. How would it fair with a zoom lens. Would that be a problem
It will work but when you shorten the length it will become unbalanced in theory. All heads would have this issue btw. Some systems with a counterbalance (fluid head) might work. Most of the bird photographers I know are 90%+ at the longest length of the lens and balance around that length.
Thanks. Though as much but good to be aware. Great site by the way. Very informative.
Hello, where can we find the arca swiss gearbox for the Manfrotto 502AH?
bhpho.to/4bNfDEb
I still would have a look at the Uniqball or it's newer rival the Flexshooter pro
I did a review on these. Check it out through search. The unique wasn't ideal for me
@@WildlifeInspired I know, still they are intermediate options for those that want a more traditional ball head for other uses where neither the Gymbal nor the fluid head do too well - like in macro photography. I do less normal wildlife photography and more macro thus the Uniqball (back then the better Flexishooter didn't exist yet) is a valid option to stand in for the otherwise underutilised Gymbal/fluid head solution.
I’m interested in whether you’ve compared the Manfrotto 500AH to the 502AH?
I have not but I may look at the 500, 502 and iFootage K5 at somepoint.
Any idea where to find the 100mm ARCA Swiss clamp? I can't not find it on Amazon or other stores.
this is a trhid party inexpensive, but i have used it for a long time and the long screw is helpful
amzn.to/3U1Elty
@@WildlifeInspired thanks unfortunately it’s out stock now :( I will cheek other ones
Slide that camera back to you and it will be fine on the fluid head. I can balance mine, so it doesn't move. I have the same kind.
This not true. The monfrotto will not balance 10 pounds. If your set up is less than 8 pounds it may balance.
@@WildlifeInspired I don't know what to tell you but it does. Sorry. Maybe it's not that heavy. Idk. Never put it on the scale.
I also have another slider from Kirk that helps it slide a lot more than the one that comes with the lens...works well...Thanks for sharing your time. Peace...
30 kg extra in equipaments...
I do zero % video and got 3 fluid heads. The reason - monopods. Nothing works as good on a monopod as a small fluid head. Hard to find and buy those, but they exist. Have one large which i can mount on a tripod for heavier lens, and 2 small ones for my 2 monopods. All Arca swiss btw.
can you give me your favorite model? I'd like to explore this?
I,ove m’y gimbal…. But almost not using it because the size of it to carry 🫣