Everything ACTUALLY Wrong with Inception
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- čas přidán 23. 01. 2012
- Is Inception smart? Rosseter has always wondered how anyone could answer "yes" to this question. Even the people who think it's a "smart movie for dumb people" don't realize just how not-smart it is... That doesn't mean it's not a good movie. It IS a good movie.
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If you've ever had a lucid dream, you would understand what the idea behind "forgetting" you're dreaming or not. You can realize you're dreaming, and then get caught up in what happens and forget your dreaming and lose your lucidity.
When Mal says they were in Arthur's mind she's correct. Arthur is the dreamer his dream is what makes the physical place of the dream. Saito is the subject, his subconscious populates Arthur's dream world. That's why when Arthur's shot the dream collapses
Ok but why doesn't the dream starts colapsing when Fischer is killed by mal then?
@Hoang Do in the snow, when cobb shoots Mal with the sniper after she shot fisher, remember now? Fisher dies in that scene and ends up in limbo
@@adelinogoncalves1180 because the sedative (in the final act) was too powerful that if you died you’d end up in limbo.
Do people not actually watch the movie??
@@mradelphi02 okay, so according to u the dream doesn't start to colapse because Fisher is still dreaming, right? but in the beggining of the movie we see arthur dying and the dream starts to colapse because according to the movie we were in his dream, okay, but arthur like fisher was still dreaming, why arthur dream falls apart, but fisher dream doesn't? I tell u why because nolan nedded the catarse scene between fisher and his dad on the third level, that's why the dream can't colapse, Story porpose.
@@adelinogoncalves1180 they already told you that fischer was under a powerful sedative, that if he died in the dream it would take him to limbo, instead of waking him up
From what I *remember*, Cobb requires a more powerful kick than a normal person. That, or he's freaking paranoid and specifically asked for a water kick. Both theories make sense if you think about it, because the latter isn't really a theory so much as the movie telling us 'he's paranoid' multiple times and me pointing out that it would stand to reason. :P
@regulator619 this is so long I didn't bother to read it.
Bro atleast I liked the post
This film does have issues but Cobb's totem isn't the top. It's his wedding ring, Watch it again.
Yeah. If you watch the movie closely he wears his wedding ring in all the dream sequences but doesn't in the real world, also Cobb never actually outright says "This is my totem" He was just talking about totems with it in his hand. They just assume it is. I think he uses it as a keepsake, a reminder of what he did, and a distraction.
Erick Mendez haha its so funny you refer to her as Juno, i was calling her that throughout the whole movie
she played a juno in a really good movie also called juno. it's just a joke cause that's what she's most known for
In the movie, I'm pretty sure he even says "This one was hers", rather than "Hey, check out my totem. It goes all spinning. Wheeeeeee" etc.
Cobb shows the top and specifically says it was Moll's. He never explains what his totem is.
Love the comment at the very beginning about the weird character-names. Being Dutch, the name for DiCaprio's character has always struck me as amusing. Dom Cobb is phonetically very similar to the Dutch insult 'domkop' meaning a dumb person, like the English insult 'dummy'. The fact that his wife's name 'Mal' literally translates to one of the Dutch words for 'silly' makes it even funnier, because it makes them a married couple named Dummy and Silly. Can't imagine this being intentional though.
That's not a swear, that's an insult. Swearing is specifically offensive words like fuck, shit, any kind of slur, etc.
SO like, I don't know Dutch, but German's pretty close, right? So you have dummkopf, which is just "stupid head" (literally), and then something like scheissekopf, which would be "shit-head". The latter is clearly a lot worse to call someone than the former. So, that's the difference.
Also "Mal" in French is just "bad" so like, the names are ridiculous in every language! Or at least every European language...
Also Mal in Spanish is bad or evil
The reason why the names sound so weird is because the writers tried hard to make them spell D.R.E.A.M
DREAMS PAY
Even then it's like David Richard Emily Andy Michelle. It's not THAT hard.
Daniel, ron, evan, anne, mary xD
Ariadne is greek for mazes/labyrinths too!!
Then what about cobb
That thing about making Ariadne tell Cobb about the shortcut only for him to tell her to explain it to someone else was one of the biggest anger inducing moments in my cinema viewing life. How a writer could let something like that slip by is beyond me.
he wants to lose just like trusting her to sit on chair which we know she wont
This poor guy. Two movies that came out the same year star Leo and his crazy wife. The man just can't catch a break.
Lel
Shutter isle?
@@danejorgensen4553 yeah
Not commenting on anything else, you're mostly right. The only problem I have is when you talk about Cobb's totem. Well, in the movie he never says that's his totem. He only ever says it was his dead wife's. Cobb never mentions his own totem. There is a lot of evidence to suggest that his totem is his wedding ring (he never has it on in the real world, always does in the dream world). The top spinning at the end is kind of a red herring. You have to look at his hand. Then again, I could be wrong.
Nope. I think Heavy Spoilers channel covered this. You're correct and it also makes good sense within the rules of the movie.
the entire movie is actually Cobb's dream. Mal was right. She escaped by jumping while Cobb remained in Limbo, which is where the entire film takes place.
no sh*t sherlock. What difference does it make? The movie logic is faulty at every step
EXACTLY
except michael caine already told everyone christopher nolan told him when he is in the scene, its reality.
My critique is far shorter : when entering the mind of someone, was a gunfight the most interesting thing Nolan could think of?
He should play Psychonauts (2005) and learn.
he has 0 imagination. there are plenty of other films that have way more interesting and creative perceptions of dreams
And very boring gunfights at that. If they were John Woo gunfights that would have already been more interesting and "dreamlike". Dreams are so weird, *especially* when you dream within a dream (happened to me a bunch of times), now THAT is crazy. Nolan lost a very good opportunity here.
Especially after watching Paprika, which essentially has the same plot. Nolan is emotionally and artistically illiterate.
@@majimasmajimemes1156 Paprika's plot is completely different from Inception. In fact Paprika's own plot is copied from Dreamscape(1984). So much for literacy. It honestly sort of boggles my mind because these two movies could not be more different, especially when it comes to the start to finish construction. And even in terms of conceit, the idea of “incepting” dreams in some form goes all the way back to The Iliad and through Phillip K. Dick. Heck, given the chatter I honestly thought there would be at least more directly comparative details. But instead I could sit here and explain why Paprika has so much more in common with films like 8 1/2 or Spellbound than it does the film supposedly stole from it.
Damn, your analysis made me completely reconsider Inception. You made so many valid points that I never even noticed. Congrats on being a very observant viewer!
his criticism is entirely intellectual, i disliked the movie because of the thematic clashes and the fact that it's a movie about dreams and the most imaginative thing they could do was a rolling room and a bunch of guys with a gun. also, the characters are so predictable and annoying.
@@cagneybillingsley2165 agreed. Dreams are weird. None of the dreams in Inception are, except for modified gravity, which is not really weird. The dreams in Inception are much too cerebral, and not enough dreamlike. It happened to me a number of times to dream within a dream. And let me tell you, if you think a regular dream is weird, you haven't seen anything. Especially recently when I got a concussion. I would fall through floors and suddenly be in the sky. The concept of dreams within dreams is very cool, but Nolan took one of the most boring approaches ever. And the action sequences suck. Pow pow pow and you don't see anything. Boring.
You know what this means...If nothing makes sense (the rules of a dream) then Cobb is still dreaming!
Your frustration is so amusing I feel guilty enjoying it.
yup. I feel bad laughing, but it is a bit comical.
ok.
Not sure anything needs settling. Not like we were arguing, LOL.
What am I reading?
@@berkkarsi You're reading about one of the best movies there is. I loved this movie. It was spectacular.
well, the top wasn't his totem in the first place...
Then explain the meaning of the final scene...
@@arctic_haze it meant he let go of Mal...
@@maliceflare Yes. But why he did spin the top, in the first place?
@@arctic_haze i would say habit...
@@maliceflare I understand you because we tend to defend movie plots we like. My problem is I do not feel emotionally connected to anyone in this movie so such plot holes seem gaping to me. BTW, the evidence is on my side. Look up what Nolan says about the final scene purposeful ambiguity and think if it makes any sense if the top is not the totem.
People don't feel speed and from floating...They feel it from acceleration and/or jolts...Yusuf was going downward in the van...Which made the 2nd level gravity-less...But there were no jolts on the 2nd level...That's why the 3rd level was unaffected...
No you don't understand this is general theory of relativity... They are floating in the non inertial frame but the dreamer is experiencing acceleration.... That is why there should be no gravity on the third level...
To make you understand it better imagine a lift is falling you are in it... You would think that you are floating but you are accelerating downwards with the same acceleration as the lift... I know it is a hard concept to understand a guy won noble price for it when he proved that there is nothing like gravity...
Though I belong to the camp of people who see some problems with Inception's plot and the way it betrays its own mechanics, a lot of the nitpicks here (mainly ones having to do with Cobb's decisions and faults in planning) are complaints about characters being irrational. Granted, certain creative decisions are definitely made in favor of spectacle over logic, but characters making irrational and even dumb decisions is only realistic. People are irrational.
My conclusion, I agree with all your gripes about the mechanics of Inception, the kicks, the dream machine, the chemical enhancements, etc. But you're totally off base with Cobb's decisions and mistakes. That's the conflict of the movie. Everything would've definitely gone perfectly if he didn't exist, but that's what gives the movie depth and meaning. It'd just be a lame scifi thriller otherwise but his tortured psyche makes this a legendary movie that I don't like.
Agreed, and that's where people get nose bleeds. It's simple: Inception was about two people: Dom Cob, and Mal Cobb, and Dom's attempt at reconciliation with implanting an idea in his wife's mind, who then believed that she conceived the idea of the world they lived in wasn't real. Cobb has since then been paying the price. The military project, the dream machine, etc...all of that is just to move the plot along in the movie. But if one really thinks about it, the movie was simply Cobb trying to accept, and reconcile, his reality.
Honestly many well recieved scifi movies don’t really make sense if you think about them too much. Inception is a movie that doesn’t want you to try to find logical flaws in the rules of its world (because it obviously has them) but wants you to just go along with it. Several people have praised the movie for its morally gray anti heroes, but I suppose it’s subjective whether you’re able to root for them or not. And the reason I always thought the movie was smart is because it demands your attention to understand what’s going on - partly because there’s a lot of fantastical rules that kind of defy logic, but also because there’s a lot of little set ups that have pay offs later in the movie and it’s definitely not your typical heist/action movie. I’d also consider the imaginative and unexpected ways the movie sets up certain scenes (like the exploding street scene) to be smart writing.
@@unipachu The problem with abandoning logic is, we need a substitute. For you to believe what they say there needs to be an insentive. Throughout the movie i was trying to see any meaning at all and inconsistencies not just in logic but like mentioned in the video, in dialogues or even the script are so bad, its laughable. The graphics were worth the praise like you said, the books exploding and other similar scenes. But thats pretty much the only thing in the movie which could be called "skillfully crafted". Then there's a problem with how the characters have made choices which sound like some "fantastical" and "other worldly" whereas its mythology and there are many many more better written, better performed and more complex mythologies throughout the world. In fact ehy mythology at all? Even take lucid dreaming for example, a much more interesting and imaginative phenomenon which happens in real life to real people with highly complex and potentially mindfucking concepts. So this movie was simply a failure in terms of story telling, imagination, logic(obviously, which a lot of fans have claimed was impeccable) and most importantly some level of common sense/survival instincts.
@@anandita5554 I still think this movie is one of the most original and creative big budget scifi films ever, but I can see where you're coming from.
@@unipachu sure its ambitious. I think thats what you are appreciating in it.
9:25 the dreamer's subconscious (ariadne in this case) can't bring in projections
10:14 9.1 years is close enough to ten, sheesh it's just an approximation
21:20 the passage of time in movies is pretty much never realistic
21:58 or they could just shoot themselves and not wait a week...
23:05 it's the sudden surprise sense of falling that wakes you up. if you know you will fall it's not a kick
If they shoot themselves before the week is over, won't they be too heavily sedated to wake up and end up in limbo? Wasn't the inner ear function supposed to wake them up despite the sedation?
oh yeah, lol
Yep. That's specifically WHY they had to fall by surprise. If all of them had simply shot themselves/killed themselves via some other means, they would have fallen into limbo because the deep sedation wouldn't allow them to wake up naturally. From my understanding of the film, by stuck in limbo is kinda like being in a coma.
@meppers I agree with your last point
7:09
It does have a beginning and end. It's one of those mazes where you go from the edge to the center. So even the redraw has an end. As for the beginning, you couldn't see it because DeCaprio's hand was blocking it, because his pen was on top of it. Where else would you begin a maze?
Just one point. Everything about multiple dreams levels explained tells us that time is expanded further each level down. Then, we're told that limbo lasts extremely long, and that the only person who has gone through it and come out sane was Cobb, and he wasn't exactly using a calender. So why does it matter that he is taking a five conversation with his projections of guilt (which doesn't make much sense anyways)? If it used the same formula as a the special formula, that would translate into fifteen seconds on the level above. Not that long in actuality, not to mention that they're waiting on Fischer anyways. And if they're going on Limbo's distorted time, it would translate into being less than one ten-thousandth of a second. We don't have confirmation either way, though.
Also, something I thought that was extremely obvious, the ending also presumes that Saito will still stick to his end of the bargain after essentially spending fifty years to himself. A few days in solitary confinement can be psychological torture, imagine what fifty years would do. Saito should've gone completely insane, and probably quite vengeful towards Cobb because Cobb failed him.
On why they had two levels, it's largely because they weren't working for Saito.
Also, how are dragons and laser guns realistic and unconvincing for the subject.
You can't make a movie interesting by sorting everything according to the facts, extra drama is needed
I agree that the movie has some mistakes, but you made some too.
Sietse van der Pal like?
Christian Mendez bro the guy who made the video made all kinds of mistakes man all kindzzzzzz
the maze has no beginning like the dream! ayy
Agreed
Nice breakdown. I think the idea of the "kick" had some scope creep for the writers. The idea sounds like it was meant to be that feeling of when you fall in a dream and wake up. This usually happens just as you're getting to sleep. They call it a "hypnic jerk". So the kicks from WITHIN a dream would make sense. But then they conflate that idea with the feeling of falling in real life while sleeping and waking up from that. They are two different sensations that got mixed up to create a confusing story.
All that said, it's a fun movie with a great soundtrack.
Let's nitpick your nitpicks:
A. So in the whole preparation montage Yusuf says that he adjusted the sedative to leave ear function unimpaired, allowing for falling to wake the dreamer. If this was an added attribute, then clearly they must not have had it in the initial heist, thus requiring the bathtub (as water does tend to wake people up).
B. The initial heist was, in a sense, in both Arthur's and Saito's minds as Arthur was the one who designed and hosted the maze and Saito populated it. This is why the dream collapses when Arthur dies.
C. Saito hired them because the entire team disappeared without a trace before he woke up.
D. Well if dreams make time pass faster (from the perceived view of the dreamer), then dream business meetings are very effective for planning a heist in a short period of time.
E. How the hell are they supposed to know what's down in the dream or how it's going to play out. They say that they can't have specificity and don't plan it out in depth because of this.
F. Rolling people off beds isn't as cool.
G. Kicks have be synchronized between both the layer and the one above (Flight descent, bridge jump, elevator, bombs, defib, jumping off the building).
One thing that bugs me about this video is the fact that you assume that these people, whilst "professional" (in a field that doesn't have much professionals to begin with) are unable to make mistakes in high pressure situations. I'm not deffending the movie for being flawless but thinking that the characters cannot make a mistake in calculation and whatnot is just wrong.
Its plain nitpicking.
David Davidson Wrong
Yeah that bugged me too in the video. I gather that dreamstealing is not a very popular field of work and Cobb is one of the best in his trade, so for Saito it didn't matter that Cobb screwed up. He had nobody else to hire anyway and he knew Cobb was (supposedly) very competent at what he does.
Who made a mistake again?
Failure was encountered several times yet still hired to do a high risk endeavor.
Makes sense.
Why trust them in the first place?
Also, why is Cobb the best?
Why does he have a monopoly on it?
What makes him the only one?
The movie rests on believability that flies in the face of logic.
The dismissive tone throughout this review suggests an opinion that borders on a contempt for the work. If the inconsistencies are inconsistencies, and not a product of dream logic or the film being about Inception being performed on Cobb (one common interpretation), then it needs to be argued as such. To not even attempt to address this means that you completely lack any insight, or are lazy, or are deliberately overlooking this meaning to allow you to skewer a film you didn't enjoy.
I've never heard someone full of contempt call a movie good.
NEETfreak1 the delivery of "GOOD" here reads as a backpedal or an inoculation against the backlash of their harangue. Compare their challenges to perceived plot holes here with those pointed out their redress of Prometheus questions. Over there, they call upon sources outside the source material for interpretation or using hand waves, like saying in effect that 'it's just super-science, run with it, ok?' whereas here they chalk up anything that doesn't mesh with their understanding as being based purely in functional or aesthetic causes and not acknowledgement, let alone disproving, that the issue may have had a thematic rationale behind it.
Sorry I haven't see prometheus or any other videos. It's just that they say despite its flaws it was a good movie in the video here.
NEETfreak1 Fair enough. :)
Just taking this video by itself, it's still unfair to a film that uses dream logic and that, depending on your interpretation, could entirely be in a dream, and say that aspects of that could actually be a part of the semiotics of the film are "flaws". It's not a thorough examination so much as an unwarranted backhanded compliment.
NobleBear Wright Really? You justify sloppy writing with the idea that the entire thing might be a dream and up to interpretation? Top, fucking, kek.
"No they're in Saito's mind." Was that a serious comment? While you're explaining the dream mechanics in the movie? Because they were clearly in Cobb's dream. The dreamer creates the world, the subject populates it with his projections. How do we know that they're in Cobb's dream at that point? Because the dream does not collapse until Cobb gets dunked in the tub. And I think that answers your question of why Arthur isn't set up with a kick.
why would the secrets be in cobb’s dream? he’s trying to get the documents from saito
birthdaydinosaur the subjects mind fills the dream up. The safe is filled by Saito’s mind which is why he’s able to hold back information which is referred to in the first dream level - why he’s thrown into the carpet and realises he is still dreaming
??? cobb was entering saito's dream to try to get secrets from the safe. facepalm
@@MrSquaky facepalm indeed. They explain in detail that the dreamer and the subject are different people.
@@th3b0yg it's still the subjects dream, inside the subjects mind. The "Dreamers" aka "Extractors" control the initial enviroment, but they're inside Saito's (the subjects) mind still. hence looking for the safe
It’s a movie about making movies.
Nolan has said this.
It’s simple
is that why timing neuro-science physics business relationship dynamics and countless other things are inaccurate? meaning it should be about making bad popcorn movies
He's just an overrated hack
@@c5quared626 thank 👏🏼you👏🏼
We kill the Batman.
And did it in the least original way he could think of. Also, this explanation doesn't resolve all of the problems presented in this video. As well as the fact that a great allegory should work on every level, not just on the bullshit meaning level that the director decided he had to tell people about because the film is such a clusterfuck. A great film shouldn't have to be explained by the director in interviews, the meaning should become clear and precise upon following clues. Instead we are left with some imitation of an art film.
Sedagive ?! SEDAGIVE !?!
That made my day - God, I miss Gene Wilder.
I had a few thoughts on the end of your video, I think you might have misinterpreted that part of the movie. But keep in mind I loved your review, and that the following is pure conjecture
22:26 I think the charges were to kill them in level 3
22:36 I think Ariadne just misspoke
22:40 Ariadne throws herself and Fischer off the building, which actually does kill them when they land (we just didn't see the landing)
22:48 Eames blows up the hospital, which kills them again (we just don't see thee actual death again)
22:50 Ariadne, Eames, and Fischer are moving because of Arthur's elevator explosion (it's just that the explosion kick didn't work, so they wake up from dying | or that the elevator kick hadn't kicked in yet, and they died in the hospital, and get kicked to the elevator at the same time)
22:53 They all leave the elevator and awake in the van as a result of the water kick, not the elevator kick
22:56 So because they are leaving dreams the proper way, the van should not kick them back to the plane
So basically;
Ariadne and Fischer leave limbo by dying
Eames, Ariadne, and Fischer leave dream 3 (hospital) by dying
Arthur, Eames, Ariadne, and Fischer leave dream 2 (elevator) by being kicked out from falling in water on dream 1 (van)
they would never want to die in level 3 or they'd all go to limbo apparently for decades, (even though all you have to do is kill yourself to get back to reality)... ariadne and fischer don't die in limbo or they'd go straight back to reality and we see them going through the dream kicks... just have to accept that there are unresolvable things in the film
But they already said that dying when they're that sedated would just send them to limbo, so why does dying in dream 2 and 3 send them back up the levels?
@@Neo-lc9wu the only one this person is wrong about is the dying in dream 3 - that one just doesn't make sense because yeah dying would send them into limbo. The reason they wake from dream 3 is because of the elevator kick. But they never said they die in dream 2. They wake from dream 2 because of them hitting the water in dream 1. The creator of the video also gets this wrong, concluding that they should've woken from hitting the water but the kicks still worked the way they did in the opening scene of the movie so he's wrong about the movie being wrong.
What doesn't make sense to me about this whole thing is why they needed to blow up the hospital in dream 3.
If ariadne and fischer were just dreaming then it would make sense but they were in limbo so a kick wouldn't work for them - they would need to die (which they did, making the hospital "kick" useless). But even them supposedly being in limbo isn't explained properly because ariadne and cobb didn't kill themselves to enter limbo, they just entered another dream. And I was under the impression that limbo was different than just going to a fourth dream level (unless I'm wrong about that)
I grant you they either didn't think the "kick" mechanic through or, more likely, it got completely jumbled by multiple people wanting to insert various scenes for the sake of making it more entertaining. That said, I think it was worth it :)
Seriously you must have a really hard time enjoying movies lol. This movie was about a man that lost balance in his life but gains it back at the end. Everything else is just a cool movie way of showing that. Movies don't have to make 100% sense, that's why they're movies. In movies you can make the impossible possible. Your level of cynicism is nauseating. JUST SHUT UP AND ENJOY THE DAMN MOVIE
Holly Roxy Hi Holly.. You deserve a house, for free.
***** Hi Felix.. You deserve a house, for free.
Holly Roxy If stuff doesn't make sense it doesn't make sense. If you gonna throw all the logic out the window in the second part of the movie then don't waste the first part with carefully explaining it to me.
Holly Roxy You are 100% right. Unfortunately, that's the type of "humor" or "film criticism" that is popular now. Just look at ScreenJunkies, or CinemaSins; all they do is point out stuff they think is wrong with a particular movie, and they probably think they are so clever in doing so. This guy is in the same spirit, it seems...
Holly Roxy "Just shut up and enjoy those mediocre convoluted flicks that everyone around you foams at the mouth about."
No, he's allowed to state his fucking opinion. Your standards being low doesn't mean ours are, or should be, too.
I totally agree with TP. The movie was good and entertaining, but I don't think it's as smart as people think it is. Again, that doesn't take away it's entertaining factor, because it has some really awesome SFX and the acting and directing is top notch. I think people who've fooled themselves into thinking it's more deeper than it actually is are the ones butthurt over this video, or any criticizing of the movie. Just like the Cinema Sins video, people just don't like when others point out flaws. Personally, I'm the type who can live with liking a flawed movie. People are wound too tight nowadays. Gotta learn to loosen up and not take things so seriously. Why so serious?!
The problem with cinéma sins, however, is that theyre wrong 90% of the time, at least
Wiping out a murder charge is *very* easy for powerful and wealthy people. Global monopolies of any kind are extremely dangerous. A global monopoly on *energy* would be absolutely disastrous. I can't argue with your point about fighting the competition being equally "corporate greed' but preventing an energy monopoly is, inherently, a good idea. And, why does everyone try to tear apart Nolan's movies with "science"? When did scientific veracity become a requirement for a fictional film where dream sharing is possible? This is the first one of these where the logic is flawed. I won't go into it. I just thought it should be stated.
because they are losers
+Hattori Hanzo It's not about science. It's about consistency in logic.
I fucking hated it when the logic of kicks was turned upside down suddenly as the plot required it. Shows poor writing. And people talk about it as if it was perfect work from genius writers.
Aditya Mishra
A respectable enough opinion. Though you should know that this is straying into the "nitpicking" type of complaint IMO. If you are old enough to remember (as a teen or adult) movies in the 80s and 90s, you should know that requiring perfect logic and the demand for minimal plot devices are both relatively new things for the average movie goer to complain about.
*****
Yes it is. Despite what you may think many murders aren't reported on the evening news and most aren't high profile. You make a grand assumption that it was some kind of "high-profile event" not to mention we don't really know how long he has been gone for. Another grand assumption is that there would be "widespread outrage". Who brought up a "boogie man"? You seem to be jumping to many grand conclusions. There is no boogie man. There, however, is money, power, and and shared interests for those who have those things. It is childish to think that having vast amounts of those things can't wipe out a single person's murder especially when that person wasn't high profile (such as a star athlete or politician).
Besides all of that, we are talking about a movie in which people share lucid dreams. So getting so deep into the nitty gritty of why he could return home is sort of ridiculous.
It doesn't matter if it was a high-profile murder charge or not. It's the fact that Mal says that she told their attorney that he had made threats against her life (a lie), so, he would be the first person the police would go after. Also, if he tried to get back into the country, customs would be alerted to his status as fugitive from the law and he likely would be arrested.
While I like Inception a lot, you touched on a lot of stuff that's always bugged me. Here's hoping they fix continuity errors in Inception 2: Electric Boogaloo.
It didn't happen :(
Inception=stupid, Prometheus= One of the best sci-fi films ever...
I just find it interesting that Fridge Logic puts up a video highlighting all the logical mistakes in the world building of Inception-which do not interfere with the storytelling one bit- but puts up an even longer video defending Prometheus which was almost universally acknowledged as having huge plot holes and errors.
"What pisses me off, though, is seeing nolan fanboys..."
I'm actually a Spielberg guy, but thanks for the assumption that I'm a nolan fanboy.
Also, critics are not more qualified than anybody else. If you're going to say someone is more qualified to judge a movie's merit, it should probably be a great filmmaker like James Cameron, who said Inception should have gotten a best director nomination from the academy.
Maybe you can just take me at my word when I say I found this nitpicky type of take apart of Inception unfair when Twin Perfect went through huge pains to defend Prometheus which could easily have had a video twice this long to nitpick all of its flaws. Deal?
Crystalline Great, for my part I'll edit out the "hahahahahahha" part of my original comment.
logic is secondary - it's all about distributing the tension across the scenes of the movie, making sure the audience doesn't get a "kick" and finds itself watching a movie.
Due to the sedative, a synchronized kick is needed. Yusuf's kick was too early and thus, the kicks weren't synchronized. This was designed to ensure that the team was able to stay where they were needed to finish the job. Instead with the sedative it takes two or more synchronized kicks in all levels with at least part of each kick happening at the same time. Arthur didn't have the second kick ready when the van drove off the bridge, so he wasn't awakened by the van falling off the bridge.
The entire movie is Cobb's dream. The scene where he's trying to defuse through the narrow alley proves it.
Would you care to elaborate please? I think another breakdown mentioned that it was Cobb on whom the Inception was being done all along. Do you mean something along those lines?
OMG!! This is hilarious, I love minute 18's opening explaining the whole air duct thing. You've got a gift my friend.
I could overlook a lot of things with this movie, but the logic breaking down near the end really got to me. After I realized the inconsistencies it kind of ruined it a bit. I'm glad Twin Perfect saw all the issues and made a superb video about them!
About the flight manifest and the attendant not spiking the drink: You just need to check the flight schedule to know which flight. The attendant could just have a clean criminal record and they didn't want to make her an accomplice to a crime that could result in manslaughter charges. Sure, she could be prosecuted for other lesser crimes of conspiracy, but they wouldn't be as severe.
THANK YOU for making this video. I had about 60% of the same serious issues you highlight in this video when first watching it in theaters and had to endure 6 months of how "smart" and "mind-blowing" this movie was to cinema. Neither of which I believe it to be. I finally googled a video breakdown and this is by far the best. Cheers.
Yes 🙌🏽
the entire movie is a maze( reason why it started in the middle of a dream and had no offical start) there is no way out. Cobb did not want to know the way out of the maze because he wanted to stay in the dream state.
Very well done. You pointed almost every complain I had with the movie's logic except one. Let me explain, the reason why no one knew about the death not waking them up thing because the movie explains that cobb bribed the chemist to not tell them so they wouldn't be afraid and back off.
The whole movie is Cobb's projection and the actual inception is Mal and his father in law trying to convincing him to "wake up" and all the other characters are in on it. When they cant get him out, they put him in an alternate reality when we r first introduced to the chemist and make him face his demons through the "job", resulting in him believing the idea he's in reality. That's why he returns to " reality" and is able to project similar but older children and leave the top without waiting to watch it stop spinning.
This would explain why he can't visit his children in the "real world" until the end, and basically answers every question about ability of architect to turn into James bond, basically every totem inconsistency, how 1 phone call could clear an international fugitive of murder/running out on his children, why job would happen after they failed 1st job, why father in law would give new student to go on Cobb's adventure, and would explain issues with kicks, assuming first level is actually several levels down. I do have concerns with some of the kicks, but if everything is based on Cobb's perception of reality, all the glaring holes seem more like clues that he's caught in a lvl between awake and limbo (dreaming?). Appreciate the analysis and opinion, but respectfully disagree and think this was one of the most thought provoking/entertaining movies in a long time.
Did you say "sedagive" at 2:09?
SEDAGIVE?!
That made me smile.
Watching this 8 years later and had to check the comments to see if anyone else caught it. Gave me a chuckle as well.
I stumbled on your Twin Peaks and Mullholland Dr. explanations and I’m really shocked you, of all people, can’t look beyond the internal inconsistencies to see the real meaning of the movie. Just because Nolan directs blockbusters doesn’t mean he lacks the ability to use abstraction in his movies to talk about something else entirely.
I agree, Nolan is great director. This is a problem with Art House.
1 - People from outside don't care about good old films at all.
2 - Minority that cares is extremely hostile toward anything new and good.
3 - As a result - Art House community turns into bunch of cultists with different rival cults (including myself).
I still think that "old classical movies are way better then 99.9% of moder trash", and that Inception is not as good as those old films. But I don't want to think that way. Inception is good. I don't want to be feeling need to add ", but" to this satatement.
I think this is a very common problem with people who love Art House.
@@VK-sz4it Spot on analysis
@@elonif4125 Thank you
The problem with this movie is that it ignores many, many things that are very interesting about dreams. Deformed hands, slight variations in a face you think you recognized, familiar places that are slightly altered, insanely illogical conclusions inside the dream that don't make sense after you woke up, pictures, messages and motives from the unconcious, and then some. The supposed dream sequences feel just like movie scenes not like dreams.
One of the suggested hidden themes in the film is that dream building is basically what Nolan does for a living too, movies and the experience of going to a cinema and watching a film is like shared dreaming. In short, all those rule changes in the dream world are Nolan's way of saying ;the universe of a movie doesn't have to obey any rules either. It is a smart film, but not as smart as some make out. At least it's a step back in the right direction. I have to say, Interstellar doesn't have me feeling very excited at all, though I am sure Nolan fans will love it. You never know though, what I do like about Nolan is he aspires to great film makers like Stanley Kubrick and Alfred Hitchcock. There may well be a proper classic movie in him yet.
I know that this is one of your younger videos, and I'm mainly just here for laughs, which you deliver candidly. That being said, I disagree with most of the moral judgements.
1. There's nothing inherently wrong with Saito attempting to sabotage the competition, especially if it PRESERVES competition by preventing a Monopoly, which ought to frighten all of us a lot more than Coffee Bean planting seeds in Starbucks (pun obviously intended).
2. While the concept of Mind Control scares us and triggers associations with Manipulation, it's fair to presume that ANY body in this Corporate Game will have engaged in some measure of Manipulation on a Bureaucratic Scale, so it's naïve to attack Saito of all people while at the same time feigning hostility for Corporate Power in general. The Power's already there, and using a few mind tricks to boost a young heir's morale and sense of individuality is hardly the worst course of action towards preventing a Multinational Energy Tycoon from cornering the Global Market, all just to resolve an adolescent Father Complex.
3. Finally: let's not forget that "mind control" is a dated trope in "villainy". "Oh, no!! He planted thoughts in MY mind; who is *he* to challenge MY autonomy and genius?" Most people will willingly agree to sacrifice some measure of their sovereignty if the facts are made clear to them; that's why we get *vaccinated.* The trick is to make people SEE those facts, and if a movie features that sort of subliminal advertising, guess what? That's what the audience PAID TO SEE, and ALL good films appeal to your "Subconscious" (why not call it that?). Let's not be like the methhead in _Breaking Bad_ who's calling for "Tucker" and says, "you don't put thoughts in my head." Yeah, that's valuable stuff you've got in there for sure, pal. [Rolls eyes.]
I'm having fun with this, though. I am happy to see just how far you've come in just nine years. Your David Lynch critiques show growth, maturity, and subtlety in passing judgement. I just watched this one for fun, much like I watched the film itself. I take it you had fun earning all those dislikes. I'll still defend your _Twin Peaks_ thesis to the death, however. *Good Eye.*
*[({M.M.)}]*
....so when are you going to do interstellar?
In this way, it doesn't matter whether or not the top falls; the end tricks you into thinking it's important when you should be focused on what the kids are saying. They mention a castle on a hill, an image that has shown up multiple times in the dream. All the problems with the dream mechanics that we see are explained if every other character is a projection.
Any parent/guardian in Cobb's position would understand why he didn't risk taking his children abroad if he is wanted for a crime. It's easier to be on the move. The children would have stability even if he were found and arrested. It makes perfect sense. Fleeing anything with children that doesn't directly threatn their lives makes no sense.
People confuse entertaining with intelligent. Inception is far from smart it's just confusing. But it is entertaining you will not be bored watching this movie.
Well i was bored during the first 20 minutes
Well done guys, I've never watched a 20+ video so closely :P
I think the thing about Kicks is that they only wake you up from 1 lower dream state, so level 3 will wake level 4. And it must be done in sequence to wake up from level 4 to level 1 and then to reality, and the effects of the kick on a higher level lets say level 2 only effect level 3, but aftershocks of the effects on level 3 can be felt in level 4.
Ariadne is the name of the Ancient Greek Princess who helped Theseus
escape out of the Labyrinth, after killing the Minotaur.
oooooo symbolism
18:22 genius, i've always hated that part
There didn't have to be a kick on the plane because they knew exactly how long the flight was so that they could set the timer for exactly when the plane landed on the dream machine.
Donald Bonds Yeah, this used to be my favorite movie back a few years ago when I was younger. It's still interesting, but I'll admit it's a flawed mess filled with plot holes big enough to sink the whole story into. lol
I think a betwr alternative world be if Arthur woke up when the van hit the bridge, and since he wasnt in the second level anymore the dream started to collapse causing the others to fall and wake up.
The part where the police apprehended Cobb when he got off the plane, was that before or after he was charged for murder?
I must've missed the part where nobody in the whole movie says anything about "water kicks" which is why I made up the term for this video...
The thing about this movie is that the concept it brilliant. There may be plot holes here and there but not many of us could have thought up of an idea like this.
The concept is very cool indeed. But Nolan managed to take something as cool and exciting as dreams and make them almost boring. None of the dreams are dreamlike, they are way too cerebral. The further down within dreams you are, the more fucked up things should be. And not just modified gravity.
It's amazing how bad fans of this movie take criticism.
+Alon Shechter I love this movie, and these comments are retarded. Stop defending something you probably don't understand as well as OP does. He even said he likes Inception and thinks it's good. CZcams comments are trash
+Alon Shechter its amazing the "haters' of this movie, like this guy in the video, think they are "too smart" for this movie, when in reality they are so stupid they couldn't even understand it.
john smith Funny, because the guy in the video which you probably didn't watch said he liked the movie.
Alon Shechter yeah, because I talked about liking or not liking the movie, right? Nice reading comprehension
john smith Stunning counter. It's so meaningless that I don't even have to add anything.
The absolute stupidest thing you could do as a fugitive on the run would be to bring your kids along with you. Imagine how easy it would be to identify a fugitive who is carrying his two small blonde children with him; one boy and one girl. As a fugitive you want there to be as little things possible to identify you; bringing two small children with you seems like the easiest way to get identified. Not to mention they probably didn't have passports.
He didn't just get the kids out of the country because the whole thing was a dream, and he was really just too guilty of facing his children. You can know the whole thing was a dream by the end. No not the totem. But the kids were wearing the same thing throughout the whole movie, even in the end when we finally got to see their faces.
Cobb didn't tell them that they could be stuck in limbo because he knew that they would decline going through with the mission in the first place, knowing the risk that is involved.
Oh God, as I keep watching this video i have so many answers for him, I feel like this reviewer should've tried to answer his own questions in before asking them.
You're supposed to accept laws in a movie, same as you're supposed to accept time travel in back to the future. But he's questioning some of these things.
Although there were some serious points that I also had, including why he asked ariadne what the secret feature was, instead of telling the other person instead. Or some kick mechanics that also contradicted some moments in the movie.
But I feel like little things like these could be found in so many "greatest movie of all time"(s)
And I think that those inconsistencies could be due to him being in a dream the whole time, like none of what was shown in the movie was even reality. He was stuck in a loop the whole time. But finally getting to see his children's faces brought him out of the loop. Remember he was trying to change his memories?
It's not all a dream though. His totem wobbled. It's all real outside of the dream sequences. Inconsistencies are not found in the "greatest movies of all time". That's why they're considered so good.
Arty the Great It's all a dream. You'll notice how the children wear the same clothes through out the whole movie and even at the end when it's supposed to be real they are wearing the same thing.
Also his totem was compromised, remember how they kept saying your totem is supposed to be your own and to not let anyone touch it? They emphasized that in the movie, yet his totem wasn't even his own. His totem was his wife's and his wife touched it.
***** Wrong and wrong
Max Bruggy No he's right on both counts. They actually had different actors in the final scene.
Jonathan Klui Even in dreams people still age. Leo and his wife became pretty old. why wouldn't the kids if they were in a dream?
The explanation was part wrong. The water kick was actually used when the car hit the water. I'm pretty sure. And plus this brief was too logical. You can't bloody have a film for 10 years -.-
I just think that this was too logical and this movie was creative and I thought everything makes sense if you didn't think of negativity.
7:10 Did she forget to put in a beginning and an end?! Good maze, you're hired! Hahaha! That had me! :]
In the film it is said that while in a dream everything makes sense, it's only when you wake up that you realise it was weird. My personal opinion is that that is exactly what Nolan was going for. Watching it makes sense but once the film is over you go... huh, wait a minute :)
(Plus-- Mol is on the opposite balcony when she jumps... no one else pick up on that, perfect example of what I wrote above)
Great video, great presentation and yeah, I did think you were going to talk about the ending.
You are a very smart man. My advice for a happy life: stay away from cinema, only misery and tears await you there.
Michal Sulima yessssssss lol
the thing s the dude didn't understand the kick... it is described wrong in the movie ....if u drop the guy from, for example, bed he won't wake up he will hit the floor and wake up of pain...and not in 100% but if u were dreaming of falling from, for example, a clif u will wake up in your bed ...u don't need your bed to be falling...and the movie is correct for that matter
But I'll give you replaying Author getting shot and screaming. Too good man.
No, the kick in the hospital is not for Ariadne and Cobb, it's for Eames. This'll wake him up in the elevator by the time Arthur was blowing up the elevator, and so on. They were supposed to ride 3 kicks back up the layers, not two. The van hitting the water was not supposed to wake them up on the airplane, and it certainly didn't if you remember them SWIMMING OUT OF THE RIVER!
I can highly recommend the Google Talk "Why Inception should have won 'Best picture'" by Kyle Johnson.
It also tackles several of the issues you have with the movie.
thanks
This was a really intelligently written and well-presented video.
1. Who actually gets pissed off about the names sounding "weird"?! Ariadne is the Greek heroine who guided Theseus through the labyrinth, and the other names, most very common (Robert, Arthur, Dominic, Saito) are named like that to specifically spell "Dreams"
2. You seem to not understand the difference between the Dreamer and the Subject. Saito's subconscious fills the dream, but Arthur is the dreamer and controls the world. Same with the snowy dream, Fischer is unknowingly the subject and Eames is the dreamer.
3. "hoW wAs hE kiDnapped fOR a WeEk?". It's a dream, time is much different to the dreamer, anyone who's dreamed can relate to this. But even so, he was NOT kidnapped for a week, it wasn't even for a day. They originally planned to do it for a week, but Saito getting shot sped that up and it only took a few hours.
4. Rather than focusing on some random flight attendant putting knockout drugs in, they made Cobb do it so it was obvious what was going on and so idiots didn't complain about some new character, although it seems that you'll complain either way.
5. Fischer's subconscious was trained and militarized, which is why they couldn't obviously move walls and change everything around.
6. Cobb knows that you'll forget what's happening once you're in limbo, he's not being an idiot by not telling them to do something that they can't do. It makes much more sense that Cobb would try and avoid anyone going into Limbo instead.
7. you say you were under the impression that Limbo was further down than four levels, but why would you think that? It gets so unstable that often you will end up in limbo after as little as two or three.
8. "The wallet's worth more than that" How is that sloppy writing? At least explain your ridiculous comments.
I could make a hundred of these comments on the whole video but I'd rather not. I don't understand how someone can interpret so much about a movie so wrong.
I thought the movie was genius. Now don't get me wrong, the mechanics were a bit flimsy, yes, but the movie retains its brilliance in its more abstract concepts, such as the sensing of a dreamers foreign nature, falling awake due to a kick, the dropping into limbo, and many others. It's the things about dreams that we've all noticed that we never really put together and the concepts within dreams that perplex us explained logically, rather than the mechanics of the job itself that make it extremely intelligent.
In other words, think of it this way: the theories of Einstein are undeniably brilliant, yet he still had flaws within certain elements of them, in translate: the mechanics.
yup yup. very a cool for a Hollywood movie to be made about the strange logic of dreams
"People are always accusing my films of having plot holes, and I’m very aware of the plot holes in my films and very aware of when people spot them, but they generally don’t." - christopher nolan
i'm pretty sure that most of the flaws pointed out here are intented.(not counting the silly ones)
Moreover i would say, you did not fully understand the movie.(you only touched the surface)
One example: the Totem. (what it means in my opinion)
"that way, when you look at your totem, you know without a doubt, that you are not in someone else's dream"
You are absolutely right: in everybody else's dream the top would fall and that is exactly what the totem should do.
It tells you one simple thing: "I am not dreaming, because in my dream the top would continue to spin".
--> Therfore you either are awake or in someone else's dream.
This is also the reason cobb is always spinning the top. The whole movie he is afraid, mal is right and he is still dreaming.
So the totem is only a way to tell if YOU are the dreamer. When somebody else touches it and knows what you would expect from it, he could make you believe, that you are dreaming. (Which is exactly what cobb does to mal)
"Dreams feel real when we are in them, it's only when we wake up we realize, something was actually strange"
Did you realize those mistakes watching the movie? ;)
I realised I was dreaming once, but only once after thinking it was real. It was only when I realised I was morphing through a window did I know I was dreaming.
Crap... Nolan is flawed. Just like every other filmmaker. But as usual, when people are confronted with the truth that what they thought is intelligent( or at least is not as smart or well crafted as they believe ), their basic psychological defense system kicks in, and they "double down" on flawed logic to re-justify their sense of intelligence.
Where as, when people accept the flaws in their thinking, they LEARN some truths about the subject, and themselves, and grow. This is true intelligence. Knowing you could be wrong, and that you can learn truths from people who disagree, or poke holes in your truth.
Greatest example. Science and Religion. The scientist is a great example of true learning. The religious zealot is a great example of doubling down on your flawed truth, until one day, you realize that you have only been deceiving yourself. The latter is usually followed by larger problems and catastrophes to your life, than was really necessary.
It's scary to think that you could be wrong, I get it. But there is nothing wrong with being wrong, unless you ignore it and keep believing your right anyway. Just look at a lot of war from the 20th century. WW2, Vietnam ect. The losers always seem to have a leadership that thinks it is infallible, and knows best. How did it turn out for them?
@@RogueBoyScout very well said. Agree 100%
@@RogueBoyScout bravo my friend
I came to the same conclusion myself that they changed the 'kick' rule suddenly to apply in the current dream state, but maybe that was always the logic when you end up in dreams within dreams. The way I see it is a kick from reality can wake you up from the 1st dream state, but from then on as you go further up, a kick from within the same dream state will only wake you up from that dream state and thus send you down a level. But a kick from level 1 will not send you to reality, it will just wake you up in level 1 (since you were put to sleep in level 1 to get to level 2). This means the kick from level 2 will send you to level 1 but you'll still be asleep within level 1 until you get that kick in level 1. Maybe that's why arthur didn't go to level 1 early. BUT now i've just finished writing this, i've realised this doesn't make much sense either. It's a complete paradox how they appear to have changed the kick rule half way through the film. But they would not be that stupid. It must be on purpose to get us talking like this.
the entire movie is actually Cobb's dream. Mal was right. She escaped by jumping while Cobb remained in Limbo, which is where the entire film takes place.
So how does aridena felt the kick in level 3?
When van hit the water!
The problem is Arthur. If a kick in level 1 wakes you up from level 2 in level 1, then Arthur should have woken up while the van was falling. If a kick in level 1 doesn't wake you up from level 2 in level 1, then there is no point in having one in the first place.
ok this is awsome! how have i not seen this channel b4? How do you guys not have like a million subscribers?! Amazing Content.
Maybe u have read this before;Character were named with purpose,like Ariadne:"Comes from the legend of Ariadne,daughter of King Minos.She was in charge of labyrinths and helped Theseus find the way out of the Minotaur’s labyrinth".Dom Cobb:"Dom means ‘Of God’, Mal’s name shares this meaning, possibly linked to them ‘being gods’ in the dreamworld. Cobb’s name also comes from Nolan’s film Following, in which is a thief who uses his art to steal things so that people would re-examine reality"
The whole film is a dream. Cobb never woke up. Moll did. He spent decades building an elaborate reality down there and got lost in it. By the end, he didn't care if he was dreaming anymore. This was my reading of the film. Inception is a masterpiece.
It's impossible to go 7 level or more deep , the dream would be unstable as hell , because having an ability to manage the chaos and be completely lost in your mind is impossible.
It's literally not.
It's a very good, very unique movie
@@thomasray It's open to interpretation and makes sense in multiple readings.
That's the most boring interpretation of the movie. "It was all a dream" is the laziest plot twist imaginable.
@@forgot7en Fair enough.
Bruh, the whole 'why doesn't he kill dead wife' and 'why doesn't he ignore his projections' are just his character flaw, his guilt. It's like you were saying 'why doesn't James (SH2) just forget about his naggy wife?', or 'why doesn't Jesus just, y'know, give in to the devil in the desert?' Bruh...
They may be character flaws but James is a totally different character from Cobb. Not to mention that James did forget he killed his wife, and forget the timeframe it all happened in. Not to mention all the differences in setting and situations.
The Jesus bit is kinda silly and I don't know how that figures into this.
Are you implying that not obeying Satan himself is a character flaw?
No, I'm saying that taking the easy way out (whoever you are) defeats the purpose of character building.
@@LNS103 Depends on context. Taking the easy way out can be character building as well if done right.
Nolan's movies are enjoyable but the more you think the more it falls apart.. and there's hardly any character focus.. the reason why Nolan isn't in my top list director.. he is just a great commercial director
Omg, i thought i was the only one who thought something was wrong about the time calculation. Now i am sure. Great video.
Arthur's scream :D
This movie moves so quickly that everyone plays along in good faith. But there was still this feeling of 'illogic'. Never got around to figuring it out. Thanks a lot!! Gave it a big fat like
Please keep making these
I think subconscious works as a term of art over unconscious in this case. The "sub" brings to mind "lower", and all throughout the finale the plot is moved as they descend to "lower levels" of dreamscape.
Haha, I love reading the comments here. People are so touchy. Relax the film is great, he even says he thinks the film is good himself.... however it's ok to poke fun at it's shortcoming and still think it's a great film. I love Inception, it ranks in my top 10 films, but I thought this analysis was rather funny.
11:02 lmao
Yo the "water kick" is just a normal kick but instead of landing on a mattress he lands in some water because it looks super awesome in slow-motion
lol sweet video!
my pet hate was the incredibly tense music lasting for hours and hours. the music was telling me "omg such stuff is happening!", but the visuals were telling me "omg nothing is happening, how long is this going to go on for"
I didnt like Inception straight up, it just didnt click for me i just went Meh when the credits came up
You nailed it! It do has many flaws which you explained very well. Plot maker will feel shit after seeing them, but still a great and entertaining movie, the best I have seen.
The "water kick" from the beginning may work the way it does because of the chemicals being used. As the chemist says, the sedative being used for the final dream leaves inner ear function intact, allowing the falling sensation to be felt. Perhaps the chemical used in the opening does not have such a feature.
They had a strong cast, an idea and money. So, none of them cared about logic or continuity.