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Why Jiaoqiu is much better in practice than in theory ft v5 l Honkai: Star Rail
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- čas přidán 16. 08. 2024
- This is a follow up video explaining more in depth the comparison of JQ to his 4* counterparts as well as seeing how v5 would impact Acheron and other teams.
comparison really do be the thief of joy
• Jiaoqiu & Acheron (All...
Pure Fiction Example when I was talking at the 10 min mark
• HSR 2.4 comparing jiao...
Pela vs JQ in MOC & PF
/ v5_analysis
Some more info of JQ via reddit
Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
00:32 Updated Chart on Comparison for Pela & Gui
01:05 E1S1 Comparison with Ruan Mei
02:07 Why Uptime is Important, even for Acheron
02:50 Pela Example in Pure Fiction
03:46 Uptime in MOC
04:00 GUI CORRECTION (stacks do stay with boss phase changing)
04:35 How does one lose Pela Uptime?
05:26 How would v5 impact Other ppl and Acheron
05:54 Chart correction. the 6 stack limit starts on the enemy's turn, So under the silvermane lieutenants, it should be 5/6 and 4/6 respectively
07:04 Him and Acheron in PF
09:07 Pure Fiction Tip
10:01 How many stacks less did Acheron gain from JQ
Hope this helps ;-;
#honkaistarrail #acheron #jiaoqiu
Just want to mention that jiaoqiu’s talent is 5 stacks where the first one is 15% and the other 4 are 5% each so max stacks is 35% and not 40% like you’ve used for the calculation
ty for the correction. dam it, now everything is 5% off ;-;
@@yun3_ not too big of a difference but a difference nonetheless ^^’ I’m also one of the apparently very few people that never understood the Jiaoqiu hate. Its like people just forgot he has up to 74% vulnerability on a 100% uptime which is absolutely insane. Everyone is so blinded by the word “nerf” that they forgot his purpose
@@suyukii2 For Acheron, the 74% vulnerability only matters if it takes an extra ult to kill without it hence the emphasis on stack generation.
@@suyukii2Genuinely asking this, do we count Signature lightcone as the character base kit now? Do 74% as in 35% apply to all damage types, 15% for Ultimate damage and 24% (all damage) only with Signature right?
@@Hann-qx8pu 59 vulnerability + 15 Ult vulnerability. That for E0S1, E0S0 has 35 vulnerability +15 Ult vulnerability
Jiaoqiu's Biggest Strength is his debuff uptime.
I will get him for that.
Also they can potentially buff the mobs , elites and the boss speed potentially ruin the debuff uptime of pela and guinaifen.
So boothill’s implanted phy weakness through ultimate will be gone as well?
@@icon2719 Boothill has built in action delay in his kit, also he breaks the enemies so fast that he delays them further
Thank you very much, I saw jiaoqiu's drip market and was really interested by his kit, especially with the nihility healing part. I'm sad it got removed and after a few other nerfs I was really reconsidering in pulling for jiaoqiu. But after this video yeah I will definitely pull for him! Thanks for the information. here's a subscribe for you
05:53 Chart correction. Sorry, the 6 stack limit starts on the enemy's turn, i dunno what was going on in my brain. So under the silvermane lieutenants, it should be 5/6 and 4/6 respectively
Why dont u pin this?
@@bugabooble It was actually my first pin but I can only pin one thing at a time. And there was something for the dmg increase* chart which I believe more ppl would look at and would try to correct that instead 👍
I'm overall still disappointed with his personal damage and v5 changes, but at the same time, still pulling for him solely for my e0s1 acheron. despite all the nerfs, he still stacks acheron ult a lot faster and has more consistent debuff uptime between waves and boss phases compared to other nihility units at the end of the day; and pulling for e0 jiaoqiu is a lot cheaper than going for 2 acheron copies(e0 to e2) which can reach up to 4 hard pities at worst case scenario. also, that support units in hoyo games tend to age better than dps units.
I don't think you've to worry much about DPS powercreep when it comes to DHIL / Acheron / FF.
How futureproof a DPS is, is strongly tied to their Eidolons. The devs have to balance around E0 chars, so the most important thing is how broken are your DPS' Eidolons.
You can argue that a future E2 DPS will be better than your current E2 DPS, but you would've also spent a year or two cruising through contents precisely because of that E2.
@@Kenji1358 I'm already cruising through content with e0s1. once content actually gets hard enough that even my e0s1 acheron/ff start struggling, there'll surely also gonna be a new even more op main dps released alongside it which I'll be pulling for and letting either my acheron and/or ff finally rest. most likely acheron first cuz ff has more rainbow coverage and a newer meta. meanwhile jq will still be used on the next op debuff-reliant dps.
@@geebeepmanthat will be likely patch 4.0 imo
@@rektarduno9153 more time to save then.
@@geebeepman acheron will be still amazing after 3 years from now, look at raiden shogun in genshin
came back to this video after seeing a jiaoqiu/guinaifen comparison and holy shit even while using the same light cone the difference was pretty crazy
can't wait to see it for myself going from guinaifen w/o pearls to jiaoqiu (hopefully) with his sig LC
well gl on ur pulls 👍 im just glad the sentiment of him has been slowly changing as time has progressed
Three months(April 20 to be exact) into the game, and he's the first 5 stars character I'm going to pull. I'm a F2P and have been saving jades until I see a character I like. Just follow your heart, guys. Skip if you don't like his design, think he's unworthy or whatever the reasons are and vice versa. Don't force yourself to pull or not pull a character just because of what other people say and regret afterward. Just go for what you want.
Gud luck on ur pulls and enjoy kauzha's VA :)
@yun3_ Thank you so much🙏🏻 Is it the Chinese VA you are referring to? Cause I play in Japanese dub haha~
Ah ok. Kazuha's english VA is the same as JQ :)
@yun3_ I see, I'm curious how Jiaoqiu will sound like in Japanese :D Maybe a bit sly, like a fox🦊
@@yun3_hmmm I've heard that people thought before Kazuha's release that he will be a slightly better version of Sucrose but he became the best support...And now people think that JQ is a slightly better Pela & Gui...I hope it's just a coincidence 😂
The problem with him is the amount of impact he provides doesn't justify him being a limited 5*, especially with the kit designs other limited characters are receiving, his was just a hybrid that can be neglected especially if you have E2 Acheron, really not worth using 180 if not 240 jades on him, especially that his utility outside Acheron is questionable. Im personally giving up on Acheron rerun as i have a feeling that every incoming nihility will be mid, will go for better lightning dps and harmony instead (still have destruction lightning after all)
with acheron existing, every future dmg amp nihility unit will be balanced around acheron sadly 😢
@@yun3_ exactly why I decided to skip her rerun...I'll hope that lightning destruction is something (better not be tingyun because Sunday is in the corner)
@@sorashizen5130Sunday is rumoured to be harmony but considering that the only attacks he have is his basic, highly likely.
@@julius_pat yes which is why I'm going for him, ppl are speculating that he'll be super break harmony (no actual leaks) but we'll see
fellow Arlan user
Thank you for doing the math and calculations so we can see the differences better
yah np :)
In pure fiction, Jiaoqiu does suffer from uptime issues. His ult was changed so it can only apply debuffs 6 times total. its affected less in moc and as bc theres not just waves on waves of enemies
also, gui's vuln debuffs dont reset on boss phases
edit: i saw that u addressed this in the video, i just commented before i watched that part, mb
for those of u wondering, u can go +1 every 3 turns with qpq or huohuo or shared feeling
uptime as in the vulnerability will always be up. the 6 tigger limit as mentioned in the video doesnt really get triggered unless for a few specific scenarios. if u give him tutorial or the herta one, even less so for uptime issues
And for gui, ty for correcting me. i think just looked at the fire dot disappearing and my brain thought her firekiss stacks left too.
nono ty for correcting me. i literally changed this in the vid/description bc of ur comment
@@yun3_ i got it the first time but yeah lol
Ik you prolly know now but solitary healing completely negates that issue :)
@@HelloThere-hz6po yeah lol i wasnt aware of what i did at that time :D
i'm doing a full 0 cycle Rotation calculation for Ratio+Jiaoqiu. If you want to use it in a video you can, just don't say i was the source because i don't want to get too involved in leaks crafting. i will share the spreadsheet with you if you like it.
what i have now is:
Pela wave 1 is stronger than Jiaoqiu because of her OP ahh technique, but Jiaoqiu is overall 10% better than Pela for Ratio. Kinda disappointing as Robin is 20% better than RM for FuA comp. 10% upgrade from a 4 star VS 20% upgrade from a 5 star, but for Acheron JQ results should be amazing.
Edit 1: 'Robin is 17% better than RM for FuA comp'>'Robin is 20% better than RM for FuA comp'.
@@BailuGamingI want to say that FuA is robins niche which makes sense why she outperforms in that regard, but JQ can just simply be thought as a better pela. Nothing special but just amps ur dmg in many teams and situations. I dont have a premium FuA team so when i use ratio, its generally with tingyuan and ruan mei. I feel like in this particular comp(hyper C ratio), JQ may actually be better than ruan mei. maybe tho
@@yun3_ yeah, Jiaoqiu wasn't designed for Ratio so it's totaly fair that he is not as game changing for Ratio as he is for Acheron. What i find funny is people dooming him because he gets no heal or because his MV was nerfed(he doesn't even build crit) . I had some fault on JQ dooming as he didn't meet my expectations but since v2 i've been defending him. Congrats for reaching 150 subs hopefully still this year you'll be monetizing your channel.
tysm :) gotta make worthy content of reaching there first and foremost. Don't wanna just clickbait or just tell people things they already know
i don't completely understand but the amount of effort you put into this video convinced me 😅
do u have any questions in particular that i could answer?
@@yun3_ Question, will he make Acheron as good or better than Firefly because i think in earlier version he kinda does
@@nyes4596 tbh, from all the things i have read and seen, v1 > v5 didnt really impact acheron’s all performance all that much. I think getting JQ would put acheron slightly further ahead than FF.
I personally think at this current moment before lingsha, acheron is already better than ff. cuz imo, acheron and ff = moc, acheron > pf, and ff is >apoc shadow, BUT, ive seen some crazy acheron things in apoc shadow saying other wise
Honestly after this, he doesn't seem as bad but the reality is... Nothing about his kit would make him pullable when people have built Pela, Guinaifen, or have any of the limited HARMony characters. His LC has more value than himself as it's an upgrade to Guinaifen or side-grade to Black Swan and requires less pulls to spend on compared to getting him as a unit. If the leaks are true and Black Swan reruns with him, my boy is definitely left with a bad hand. Husbando enjoys have been waiting for a support since the start and he's basically an ugrapde to Acheron PF and Ruan Mei substitute in a DoT team (I think the fact Ruan Mei gives unconditional +10 spd gives her an extra advantage too). He can work with other teams but not as effective as Acheron/DoT teams.
But oh well, I'm still pulling him tho, hopefully he comes home early so I can still have for Feixiao (collecting all the Foxians is one of my goals). I'll make him work in my DoT team and my Ratio team.
Makes me wonder strong he would be if he were to be in a DoT team with BS, RM, and Huohuo. Because I didn't get Kafka since I wanted Ratio's LC so badly (unfortunately didn't have enough Jades to get his LC so 😔).
one thing, i really dislike that the new 6 charges thingie for his ult does not have an indicator anywhere
dang that does suck a lil. there still is quite some time before his release so they def can add an indicator by then
''jayqu'' you did not have to nerf his name T-T
Imao. I cant be butchering his name, as maybe some future viewer comes watching the vid and cringes so hard cuz they heard the gud in game pronunciation. I’d actually die. JQJQJQ
if it wasn't for the Sparkle rerun, I might be going for him
I never thought of JQ as genderbent Sakura. I mean he is a pink fox too.
First off, both videos were very informative and "unbiased", good job! 💪
That being said, and this is my personal opinion, I believe that despite Jiaoqiu being a lot more consistent than Guinaifen/Pela, his kit is still not on-par with most of the recent characters.
While yes, his debuffs are slightly higher than the other Nihility debuffers, and a LOT more consistent and faster to stack, even considering all of this, his damage increase isn't really worth pulling for a 5*, I'd much rather pull a Harmony unit (outside of Acheron or DoT teams) because they are as consistent as him (if not even more) and are generally more universal and versatile in terms of team comps.
In Acheron or DoT teams, yes he might be the best option for now, but I strongly believe there will be better characters suited for those roles to be released in the future.
Me personally already have all the harmony characters right now so I'm not worried about those other teams they are good it feels like Acheron is the one falling behind right now and depending on the Trend LC is not really future proof since some enemies don't even attack on their turn much less attack the character with trend lc on them. It really make your preservation sustain weaker compared to other lightcones too. Jiaoqiu also allow you to go for Abundance characters instead and still get a lot of stacks if you want.
Only thing really gimping Jiaoqiu is his 60% base chance on his ult debuff it should be guaranteed like Black Swan Epiphany. Its going to be really hard getting those effect hit rate substats in addition to getting enough spd for him.
i think he’s balanced in that way bc if it was say guaranteed, then u could just build him all atk/spd, making him “potentially” even a better than black swan
@@yun3_ Yeah, but then such units like Firefly and Acheron exist, who are completely overtuned and they really weren't released that lobg before him
i cannot lie, as a e2 FF enjoyer, my results honestly still pale in comparison to what a e0s1 Acheron can do at times. and missing either ruan mei or htb insta delete ur dmg ;-;
Thank you very much! Comfy video and very informative!
I don't agree with Jiao's criticism that you fought against in the last video.
You justify the nerfs to Jiao by the fact of Acheron's existence.
My main complaint is that the developers can actually very easily make a character who will be Acheron's signature support without making her too strong, but at the same time allowing this character to be a strong option in other teams.
Moreover, the developers did the worst thing they could do with this character and made him a DoT character.
Well, he's too strong for Acheron, right?
In this case, why does Jiao give an ultimate damage bonus?
A damage type that only Acheron and Argenti fully rely on.
Same thing with Def Shred.
This stat balances itself due to the fact that it has a limitation.
At the same time, many characters or relics have a bit of def shred, even if sometimes it is hidden behind eidolons or cones.
Will Acheron be very sad if the def shred in her team far exceeds 100%?
I don’t think so, on the contrary, she will have the opportunity to use someone other than Pela or at least another cone other than Perls.
But at the same time, characters with built-in def shred will be better able to greet Jiao.
His multipliers were nerfed precisely because he is now a DoT character, this is their “trick” so that they do not collect crits.
By the way, DoT was given to him only so that he would not collect crits, because I don’t see any reason to use him in a DoT team when there is Sampo (whom no one uses as a support).
And these are just my personal complaints, which I usually don’t find discussed anywhere.
This character still has many problems that are not always practical, but this does not make them disappear.
At v1, I accepted Jiao as a character who had problems with energy, dependence on the cone and boring technique.
But subsequent patches only gave him an ultimate on the 1st turn and otherwise made this character worse.
For some reason Jade is not respected for being the best PF unit, is there something different here?
Is there any reason to use Jiao outside of "with Acheron in PF"?
I mean if your Acheron isn't E2 he's pretty much better than any other nihility unit for Acheron. And even with E2 he provides so much value he would be the choice for that in any mode(MOC, AS and PF)
@@user-uv6qu3wb5d this is not even discussed, of course he is the best for Acheron.
But does she really need him?
And most importantly, does anyone else need him?
@@lelegardl9473 actually making him a dot character was going to be the best route to go. rather than ehr,spd, cr/cdmg, atk. you now can just go ehr,spd, atk instead which makes him much easier to build and not requiring literal perfect substats.
the ultimate dmg bonus isn’t the main draw imo but just vulnerability in itself. if he was more general and say converted the ult vuln to the base talent kit alone, he would be even stronger for acheron cuz now even skills are doing more dmg(i understand it is not a big % of her dmg).
including a bit of healing and now u could go
“acheron, pela, sparkle, jq(pseudo sustain). the damage would be in a different ball park compared other teams cuz she’s balanced around the fact ur supposed to get either 1 nihility and 1 harmony at e2 or 2 nihil at e1. 2 dmg amp nihil + a harmony would’ve been too strong
jq also shouldnt have er issues sitting at 100er.
i also want to note JQ frees up ruan mei for another team in dot as another viewer commented. he can also replaced robin and ruanmei in duo dps comps albiet not as good, as debuffing all enemies=buffing all teamates
Hard to make a unit CRIT in the first place,
coz the unit would require LOTS of Hitrate as a priority.
Only difference between him and Silver Wolf is that Jiaoqiu has that saving grace of a "Hitrate to ATK%" Converter Trace, which was denied for Silver Wolf.
@@JMike-bq6rl my pela has is 60 120, 165 spd, and even if i did give her sw’s lc, im still only at 100/180 ehr ;-;
Tbh, my problem is that they essentially limited him to 2 types of teams, one that already has many who could stand in his place (DoT) and one that didn't even need to be buffed even higher (Acheron).
I was sincerely looking forward to a pure debuffer who could affect multiple enemies and apply enough debuffs for someone like Ratio, because we do not have that sort of character in the game at this point, and JQ looked like he COULD be that. But now he's not.
That's my main gripe with the kit changes. They took away what we don't yet have and turned him into something we already have / an Acheron ult bot.
And while he might be better on paper right now, I don't think it's better to pull him over Ruan Mei. Ruan Mei can virtually slot into any team and buff them to heaven.
JQ though? What else would you use him for that could justify the jades? What other team could reasonably want him at this point, more than any of the harmonies? I honestly can't think of any, lmk if there are some out there.
That's the biggest problem, I think. He's a 5*, he takes plenty of pulls, but he doesn't add that much to the game... As much as I want to pull him, I simply cannot justify the jades spent. I think that's why so many people are negative. So many were excited for him, only to see him do so badly. Even if he does "much better in practice", you cannot deny that he was done rather dirty, especially in comparison to the harmonies who constantly get OP traces.
one team i think u should consider is duo dps teams. though robin is the best rn, i actually imagine him potentially him doing well in a “Jingliu blade team” < i normally wouldnt ever play something like this even if i could but it seems interesting
I cant argue about ppl saying he’s not worth the jades compared to something like Ruan mei. but there are other factors that would go into a character like aesthetics or personality which some ppl may not like for say ruan mei, making some justify getting him regardless. i do wish he got treated a bit better, but that sadly just isnt possible due to acheron being so dang strong. If acheron was a bad character or just ok, they couldve made this guy op af to “fix her”.
@@yun3_ See... that's my problem. I'm that audience who was going to pull him for aesthetics. I was straight up willing to swipe. But with these changes, I just cannot.
He's still expensive to get because he's a 5*, and he just doesn't fit anywhere besides those two teams. Even the JL + Blade team is a lot of cope, and already relies on having two specific characters.
That's what makes me, along with many players, so bitter. Being so hyped for a character we fell in love with, only to be slapped across the face not once, not twice, but 5 times.
I know it's Acheron's existence that doomed him - but I don't think a singular character being powerful justifies an entire niche of (premium) characters being doomed to mediocracy. An entire archetype of characters shouldn't suffer because of a singular character. And people are upset, because that's exactly what's happening right now, leaving so many spots unfilled that some players sorely miss.
the jl blade thing is cope but more so to highlight his ability for work in duo dps comps.
and yes, it really sucks that (dmg amp) nihility will be greatly hindered by acheron at this point as to keep the game in a healthier place. meaning nihility dmg ampers may never be as good as our premium harmony units
@@yun3_ Yeah, Ik it's just an example. It's just that in all scenarios I've seen people put him in, he's there for the sake of being there. And that's awful by itself. No premium character should be THAT niche.
I think that's why it's not just warranted, but necessary for people to speak about how badly JQ was butchered. If not enough people make this a problem, then this will simply become an ongoing trend and nihility will be that one path with DoT and mediocre, niche premium units.
@@user89389 I mean he's still a premier Acheron unit, great For Ratio if you don't have Robin, he may still be great if you have Robin since you have to build two teams and your robin may be needed for something else. Then there Jl Blade, or Jade Blade since both of them don't need harmonies(jl cause her numbers are already through the roof so the buffs don't matter much to her. And blade cause he only needs hp buffs, which no harmonies give... ). He's a better Pela in all ways, so where you wanted to use Pela he can be used. And he can be pretty comfortably sorted into DoT as a replacement for Ruan Mei, so you could put your Ruan mei in another team
I'm in a lot of pressure. I have an E2S1 acheron (by accident), I don't have trend LC, and no sparkle either. I'm targeting E0S1 sparkle and E0S1 jiaoqiu. My current jade savings is at 33k, 16 pulls, and another 100 from starlight exchange. Lingsha is also around the corner. So many good characters arriving one after another it's so hard to keep up 😅
yah gud luck 🙏 , and dang that is A LOT from the exchange. i think you should secure JQ>Sparkle> jq lc > sparkle lc. sparkle lc is gud but bronya lc is gud too so its not a must if u don’t manage to get it 👍
As for me, Jiaoqiu in practice is very good in a pack with Acheron and Pela together. In addition, jiaoqiu can be a replacement for e0zhuanmei in dots and e0 robin in the same place
Thank you for the video
curious who's gonna be the best partner for jq on an e0 acheron team, esp in pure fiction. been using pela + bs and i can see myself replacing either of them
i think both could be replaced equally in Pf. if u gave solitary healing to black swan, i think thatd put her on par with pela(due to her 11 er trace) ulting wise. generally, id have to assuming pela simply bc her def shred is higher :)
I'll be pulling regardless, I'm glad his kit isnt as bad as it seems 😭
nu uh, compared to V1 this version much worse, he supposed to acheron best support but now he was black swan but on fire
Stop spreading misinfos he is better than bs in acheron team wtf@@yubiyubi4796
@@yubiyubi4796So basically if you have Black Swan, he kinda skippable?
@@TheMattVis not at all,idk what that person is on, Him and Blackswan serve different functions, He's a vulnerability debuff applier with great uptime and multi target applying, Blackswan is a dot DPS.
I would like a opinion.
I'm on guaranteed and thinking about getting Jiaoqiu.
Rn I'm usin SW/Pela with him but ngl the uptime in her ult it's just bad.
*My SW has 155 speed and Pela 160, I know its not the best*
It takes so much time to her ult to stack.
Do you think is a good investment to use my guaranteed on him? I'm planning to focus on Acheron and FF.
*I would only pull for him, not his LC*
so yah this would be my opinion. i personally dislike sw(love her char tho)
1.rng implants, kms cuz most teams are rainbow nowadays. she is praying on my downfall
2. ult takes a long time to get without e1
3. my personal experience (sw almost always performs worse than my pela in moc and like better in 2 mocs than pela in the past year
JQ is really dang gud from the gameplay i’ve been seeing the past week. he is the bis in acheron alongside either robin/pela and for dot, = to ruan mei, if not better. i think he’ll be a good investment for you tho but this is just my opinion ☺️
edit. he also has a lot of room to grow with e1 and s1
Sampo looking good
Nice work! Here’s a like and sub.
Very good video. A lot of points I agree with.
Would Herta Nihility LC be awesome to JQ as well? Considering his Ulti provide DoT and Acheron will just delete most enemy in his field easily so JQ likely will get Ulti up more faster right?
Yep. You can get most likely get 2 turn ults pretty consistently and even 1 turn ults from the reddit thingy I saw. Just keep in mind ur ehr will be a bit lower but that shouldnt be an issue in PF as the enemies are common enemies and as such dont require as much ehr
we will see when he drops
as a jiaoqiu defender and lover, im so happy seeing the ppl in the comments changing their minds about him 🩷
it honestly is pretty crazy. back when this video released, oh boy was there quite some negative comments. now i would say a lot of the sentiment is that he’ll be pretty solid :)
He's the slight upgrade over well built 4* any 5* should be. Fine, QOL, but not game breaking.
But considering the existing options, his main issue is his pull value, and he's clearly out of the Harmony Waifu's league : they are too powerful and versatile, except in specific niches.
This won't be a problem for spenders, but f2p have to consider the account value of pulling a unit, tho jades are kinda hard to get.
Yah most ppl are finally coming to the conclusion that he’s fine but his harmony competition is pretty tough.
Are you going to keep making videos in this series? If so what is your next pro-JQ video about?
I don't "think" I will make anymore videos on JQ in the same manner I have bc I don't think it will be too necessary as I just went over like general facts on why he's pretty gud. There are other in theory stuff like DOT(dotcheron) which im not too qualitied in.
new.reddit.com/r/JiaoqiuMainsHSR/comments/1e3ueye/something_about_the_theorycrafting_for_jiaoqiu_is/
But if there is any other content stuff you'd want to know more about, I can def make a vid on it
@@yun3_I think it's a good idea to talk about the difference between additive bonuses and multiplicative bonuses.
People just underestimate the value of 50% vulnerability.
@@YASUOMURAMASA I think this a good idea but I don't think I can make a long form video out of it alone. this can maybe be explained in like a minute or two with an example. I can maybe make a video over the best ways to increase ur dmg and look at different aspects of the dmg formula if that sounds interesting?
@@yun3_ This topic is really helping your channel grow and I myself have referred your videos in Reddit and I have seen others do the same. I think it's worth it to keep making videos in this area if you are up for it.
Although you touched on it maybe doing a longer video on how to regain the stacks in PF that the nerf limited such as LC solidarity healing, a speed build and or using the wind set on him.
@@illusica Honestly great idea. Will build gui a bit and buy the lc rq to make a video. Although It may be pretty short video like 5 minutes tho. But it will get word out at least :)
Personally i still think he is a decent upgrade but i already have an SW and plea combo i know he has AOE vs single target of SW but i still think it won’t really affect my account much if i didn’t have him i’d rather save up for archeon rerun and go for her LC
Every time everyone gets a news balance always complain, just wait to release, we'll find out, and Hoyolab team still in progress to give him right balance before to release him
With all my respect, I dont think you can justify pulling a 5 star Pela, when you can use the jades for Ruan Mei or Robin, Jiaoqiu is simple a super bad pull, lets hope no one waste currency (unless he is your favorite then favorite > meta) because you can use Pela instead.
Edit: keep in mind that is 180 pulls to guaranteed a character and you are asuming he will have his LC so another 160 pulls.
Yah thats perfectly fine, for many, he is indeed less value. but i heard some in the comments saying they have both dot and break teams. this allows the dot team to get their 2nd limited support while rm can be in break. so it just really depends
the main point for my 2 vids was more so for the to people that believe he’s trash tier, and to tell people that he’s better than what most people think. I don’t deny he has less utility
@@yun3_ he is not trash at the end of the day, 5 star multiplier and some other utility, your calculations and justification are completely okay. My point is more for new players that look at the new shiny unit and dont know that Ruan Mei is basically a must pull.
Again, nothing against you, very good video for those struggling to decide.
@@andersonsamuel123I agree. the problem I think is heis branded as a 5* Limited, if he was say a 4* or a non Limited 5*, I think his roles is perfectly slot.
It just with his kit right now, the status of 5* Limited is just too much.
Obviously if people want to pulled for his design is another matter though.
In Genshin, I love Dehya design and purely pull because of that, but I know she is not the best unit.
A acheron lover will become a jiaoqiu haver no matter what 🎉
based
Acheron jiaoqiu robin galla seems really good in pf but moc remains to see how much better in moc compared to a free pela
Jiaoqui will be my saviour as 3 of my active teams want ruan mei in them. I hope to at least free her of my Acheron team so that my break or DoT team can have her. I will also try his DoTs, I hope they’re not underwhelming. At least he has a built in atk% increase. Additionally idk why no one else is mentioning this but am I the only one who constantly has to reset because their Pela constantly dies due to low stat? Just me? Ok… maybe I shouldn’t have given her ice dmg orb
good plan. nah thats based af giving her ice dmg, though i understand most just got ehr, spd, and hp/def. nihlities in general feel so squishy. i personally stuggle with uptime in moc 12 sometimes, either 100% or 50% ult uptime
I think Acheron's existence possibly ruined all future nihility debuffing units....
yah, nihility dmg ampers specifically will be kept in check cuz of her existence😞
Since i have both Acheron and a Kafka/swan team I'll try to first pull his sig (for Swan if anything) and if i get it I'll try to pull him. Im not willing to go all in on him so if i lose the 50/50 that's it
good plan :) may ur pulls go well💸
@@yun3_thanks:D
Well i love his animations but thought of not pulling since he is nerfed a lot but i think i might consider pulling him because hey at the end of the day its just a game :)
And hey thank you for the info mate
The most important problem I have seen from reading his new kit is that he is in theory, a good Acheron buffer, but a bad character. Unless you can stand on your own as a good character in variable team, you aren't that good. This is the same thing with Firefly pre release and her emergency patches. She went from being pretty mediocre, to being good but really HMC dependant, to being good, but having HMC/Ruan Mei make her way better, you now can actually bring other characters instead of that 1 team and it would still work somewhat. JQ usage outside of Acheron is just extremely questionable for a limited 5 stars. And now after his nerf, even his use with Acheron is questionable. He is not a bad character, just a really narrow sighted designed character, also while being shortsighted after the nerf. The worst thing is that, his V1 is perfectly what a good character should be, a unique, good in other team debuffer that can heal while not restricted to being just a 5 stars Pela.
I love ff having her at e2, but just losing 1 of those supports in moc(ruan mei) means i now 2 cycles in moc 10 rather than 0 cycle in moc 12. this is also replacing the “less” important one. imo, not having both honestly puts her effectiveness even below 4* damage dealers.
Jq usage outside of acheron teams is perfectly fine as they can still work in any team pela wouldve, which is like any team. and his performance with acheron even with the nerf as mentioned in the video hardly changed, still being her best support
v1 never had healing, it was just simply leaked in theory how the kit was going to be
Jq stonger defender of today, vs... I dont think anyone has ever defended him this hard before.
I want to say, the example on the video with bosses transitioning and losing debuffs (argenti in this case) didnt mean anything in reality. Pela being fast acted first and got her ult and applied the lc's debuff before any dps could go.
Not saying this will always be the case just funny how it invalidated the concern in this case.
I simply state why he is stronger than most the doomposters are making out to be. Im not arguing that he provides as much value as ruan mei, the best char in the game, but he is still rly good and not trash tier.
for the pela in MoC, Ive had runs where Ive just done 2 enhanced JL skills and ult on argenti bc pela was not getting her ult anytime soon
Yall making everything so personal 😭 if he was a waifu you d never comment such a cmnt
I don know why you using s1 cause most people who using pela and gui are completely f2p so they don even get the lc like me and you can say in the replies that "oh well I get lc" most don't like me
i just used s1 just for their best case scenarios as i even have gui with jq sig. pela cant use his lc anymore after v3 and her best option is still resolution. my little chart is also includes resolution lc. i said this elsewhere but looking at the chart, u lose around 9% dmg so dont feel like its mandatory. just note that u dont get that ehr 👍
hi I have a question, i think the enemy can only genereate 1 stack per turn, that being said can the enemy genereate acheron stacks from trend light cone after get stack from jiaoqiu ult ?
czcams.com/video/fzVGPcaFlvA/video.html&ab_channel=Aorus
at the 1:54 mark, aventurine gets hit with trend lc while JQ ult is up. It only got the 1 stack for the ashen roast. :)
@@yun3_ yeah I better stick with my e2 gepard lol TT
You keep making these comparisons with "Nihility" or "debuffers" when the majority of people would care the same if he were an astronaut or a bard.
His actual job in the game is an amplifier and he is absolutely not in the same ballpark as Sparkle (let alone Ruan Mei and Robin who are both on a whole 'nother level).
I don't care if he is better than Pela or Guinaifen; hell, it's the same to me if he is arguably better than Silverwolf. I have Silverwolf and I wouldn't pull for her in a million years (as of 2.4) when we've had Ruan Mei, Sparkle and Robin in the span of half a year, all of which provide a tremendous value to any account.
To put it succintly, the reason why there are so many "doomposters" is because he is one of the worst units at the moment of release, in my personal opinion the very worst (Jade would be in strong contention and Topaz would be the only other option depending on your outlook on the game).
sparkle in regards to buffing is single target, while jq provides it to the entire team. so while jq increases EVERYONES dmg by 64%, sparkle increases your dps of singular character using e0s1 and around 100%. robin on the other hand is buffs ALOT, dunno if my math was like 100% dmg increase for ur entire team excluding her own personal damage. But in reality, he's not that far off. That down time with robin is atrocious if u don't have sig lc and a fua team, and even, there may be down time, which if u take into account brings it closer. Then that brings into account the action advance which would then seperate the two further again.+ robin is hella sp negative if u want decent uptime.
Regardless, he is not as good as our currently 5* harmony characters, but he is in the same ball park. JQ while not being as good still provides a lot of value to an account. Just bc option a. is better, doesn't mean option b. is bad and as such is not valueable. U may call him unnecessary which is fine but he the best support in 2 teams mind you. acheron and dot.
The issue is everybody has their own pov's and their reasoning why they dislike how he currently is. There reason why am talking about him with his nihility counterparts is because ppl constantly are comparing him to Pela and Gui. As such I have to address that, especially when a LOT of people are wanting to use him with acheron. in which he is a LOT better.
the thing is, being bad on release doesn't matter too much as we can see how kafka and topaz have both aged well, while others who were meta during their time subsequently feel off. JQ is fine now and may even find a better niche in the future.
@@yun3_ I do agree, he is BIS for Acheron and by a significant margin, but most people expect characters nowadays to be BIS for quite a few teams, and incredibly close for others. Jiaoqiu does not seem to fit these criteria.
Source for him being better than Ruan Mei in DOT? Hunterkee's calcs put him around 6% below Ruan Mei, and practice seems to support this as he seems to have a similar clear time only when going specifically against Fire weak enemies (who are not weak to either Wind or Lightning), i.e. Ruan Mei's worst case scenario and Jiaoqiu's best case scenario.
Your comparison with Kafka and Topaz is flawed IMHO. I don't see Jiaoqiu aging well at all. His gimmick is pretty much being an Acheron slave (via stacks generation), provides zero utility and he is not even BIS for Ratio (who also loves debuff application). If anything he will be relegated to second fiddle once Acheron gets another support, and perhaps removed from her teamcomp entirely if she ever gets two better Nihility supports. Add a specific support unit for DoTs and he won't even be able to sub in for Ruan Mei in such teamcomp.
www.reddit.com/r/JiaoqiuMainsHSR/comments/1e071np/kafkswan_vs_sud_moc122_e0_rm_vs_e0_jq_vs_e6s1jq/
here is gameplay for DOT and where i got my opinion from. I just saw the chart from this Hunterkee, seeing how RM was slightly better than JQ. For my basis, in the videos testing, it was e0s0. I would've assumed if it was e0s1 for both characters, I would assume the JQ would pull ahead bc that lc is a 24% dmg increase for ur entire team generally, compared to what his personal damage could contribute, as rm's 24% dmg bonus isn't too much in the grand scheme of things.
I def see ur pov but it will just depend on what hoyo plans to do in the future and when.if they decide to take another year to add another debuffing support. He indeed does not provide any utility, with my reasoning with him being fine is that the fact that gui and pela are so highly regarded "ik its bc they are 4 stars" even to this day yet also provide no utility. Though ik not many people actually use those two( i still use pela)
@@yun3_ See, there is a reason that they choose these enemies (I've also seen him against Argenti). Fire weak but not lightning weak? Hmm, wonder if this favors Jiaoqiu and restricts Ruan Mei's performance. Some misleading showcases tried to do the same with Robin. It's obvious that Ruan Mei's ideal scenario would require for all DPS to be on-element.
Breaking is incredibly important in any Ruan Mei's team composition and it's particularly relevant in DoT. Breaking the enemy gives them DoTs that can be proc'd several times (by the enemy on its own turn and Kafka's Skill/Ultimate, Ruan Mei's extended break also exacerbates exploiting DoTs).
The team didn't break Meme a single time. Do you see how ridiculous that is to showcase Ruan Mei's potential?
Despite all that, Ruan Mei still had a better performance in the video you link'd (20% and way closer to a cycle less). Imagine if the opponent was Svarog; do you think Jiaoqiu comes close to Ruan Mei when the enemy is both weak to lightning and wind?
@@user-gu5zt3iy8m It's dont believe that it was misleading in the sense that it was intentional. This is simply just fighting against the 2nd side in the future moc and seeing how the 2 characters would perform. For it to be actually fair, you'd need either a fire/ice weak enemy or just use in theory crafting.
I'd disagree saying that in u saying that RM break is "incredibly" important in any team with RM, though i gotchu with the dot point. My reasoning is that against high toughness bosses, you will not be breaking them until near the end of their hp which they will just switch to their 2nd phase and AA all the way up. Thats if u break them at all, ex sam. I am not trying to deny it's important bc u are doing like 10% more damage and taking much less, but not like mandatory to see her good side imo
hi i have a question!! i have e2s1 acheron and i pair her with e1s1 bronya, e6 pela with resolutions lc, and aventurine with trend lc. is it worth it to pull e0 jq for me? im still considering his lc as well but im not sure yet
new.reddit.com/r/JiaoqiuMainsHSR/comments/1e7tonl/a_post_showing_everything_about_jiaoqiu/
I hope u can use ^^ bc it seems like a well compiled list of info that can be useful for u to decide if u want him or not
this is just my opinion so take keep that in mind.
I think ur team is already rly strong, but IDK how ur SP economy is and also if you are running a -1 spd bronya. If you are running say a 135 spd acheron and 134 spd bronya, you may actually run into sp issues which I think jq can be better than pela in this situation. I use a JL and e2s1 bronya with pela and can say that I sometimes struggle with SP if my sustain were to ever skill. But if u are using a faster bronya and a slow acheron, you may be better of pulling sparkle instead. BUT i have seen people say that even with e2 acheron, JQ performs better than a sparkle would in that slot.
new.reddit.com/r/JiaoqiuMainsHSR/comments/1e77o82/theres_a_lot_of_misinformation_and/
I think he will be a good pull for ur acheron if u dont mind spending the jades for him.
@@yun3_ I see thank you so much!! I was also considering sparkle but im not sure if shes worth it either since bronya buffs more than her technically and the only reason sparkle is used more is her sp regeneration but since I have an e1s1 bronya I get sp back more often,,
my general team I stated earlier does have some sp problems, I have speed boots on Acheron to slightly gain more stacks faster but maybe I should switch to attack after all? esp if I get sparkle. so I guess if I decide to pull for e0s0 jq and e0s0 sparkle and replace pela and my bronya would this be better overall?
@@ganyuluvr5594 I think the consensus is that sparkle would provide more for ur account
the 3 routes to go would be
1. sparkle + Jq
2. sparkle+ Pela
3. JQ+ Pela
edit.
sry forgot theres also
4. bronya+jq
I think if u dont mind using Pela, u should go sparkle for a bronya upgrade(gotta switch to atk boots tho)
If u don't like pela and want/need an upgrade, then go for JQ to replace Pela. (this will likely reduce ur sp issues (3 turn ults require 2 skills and a basic, but if running pena/vonwaq, getting hit makes it 2 basic 1 skill
u may need to 4 turn ult to be extra sp positive if u plan on still using bronya. If JQ and bronya doesn work, U can still do Pela + JQ which I think is her best team imo.
I think Sparkle/bronya can fix a acheron who isnt too well built, while using a jq +pela really tests how gud ur build is.
also based, I love ganyu too. 😤
@@yun3_ so the routes are ordered from best to least, correct? I think I still will prioritize e0 jq over e0 sparkle first because I have a limited amount of jades but I still really like his character overall :> so I im probably pulling for him still.
but an e0s0 sparkle would be better than my e1s1 bronya overall? also would jq and pela really be better than bronya and jq? I feel like it’s a waste for an e2 Acheron to not run a harmony
@@yun3_ and HAHAH twin 🫶 i love yuyu
First!!!!! Yay!! I can't believe you created this video on no sleep. Honestly the quality it pretty good.
I love all the references you provided too. If you want to make another video on this series you could expand upon his fast build with solitary healing in PF. From what I'm seeing this build option is giving people some hope.
Hello :) Gonna head to bed. so tired. will check comments when I wake up
He was interesting as a somewhat healer for dot + acheron team... now he's just, not interesting enough :')
Quick question, do you think JQ can use In the Name of the World well? I bought Aeon and Calcus from the Herta shop recently so I can’t buy solitary healing for a while (until they’re superimposed and I have enough again), and Tutorial is stuck to Pela so I can’t really spare him that. But I do have an extra Welt sig I have been desperate to find a use for since it spooked me twice in a row on standard (I also have an s2 EoP tho…)
hello. If u plan to get jq, he actually can do really with pela (jq can do 2 turn ults if u want) if u give him tutorial and pela resolution(her best lc bc u can always trigger her energy regrn trace). for Welt’s lc, i wouldnt recommend using it bc the need for ehr is from that 60% base chance thingy from his ult which the lc wont help in. also his skill wont be doing the most dmg. eop would be better than welt’s lc.
solitary>eop pf
eop>solitary else where with many enemies like moc/ apoc shadow
hope this helps🫡
@@yun3_ Ah yeah that makes sense. I’ve had this LC for so long I’ve considered just trashing it for exp (I rarely use Welt so superimposing his would change nothing). I don’t like swapping lcs bc I forget to swap back a lot but I might as well level resolution and get my Pela a new chest so I can see how she feels without it so JQ can get it if EoP doesn’t work out.
@@animalpetdrakenstar6598 maybe save the lc just in case a future unit can actually use it well 👍
Other said he bad while this said he still good I’m gonna wait for his release and judge him from there.
He he can’t help me with I’m looking for I’ll just skip him and get the new Lingsha
I have a question: Is he worth using at e0s0 compared to Pela at e6s5?
I‘m almost (with the exception of buying the monthly pass once) f2p, and probably don’t have anywhere near enough pulls to get both him and his lc. So I just want to know how big the difference is compared to Pela at e0s0.
Also, since I only started playing in 2.0, I don‘t have tutorial lc.
Being pretty ftp, i honestly would recommend you not pulling him(hes still gud btw) unless u really like him or are using Acheron. he is a good sidegrade imo to a few teams to our harmony supports. but if you specifically want to upgrade from pela, it wouldnt be too much higher IF YOU play/build pela rly well. also lacking utility compared to our current 5* harmonies
@@yun3_ I really like his design and Acheron is basically my main team. Along with me quickly finding Pela more and more boring and her not having the best build there are quite a few things that would somewhat justify pulling him. Not to mention that I have all the 5* Harmony units (Except Sparkle, because I only started playing the game when her banner was basically over).
I wonder who is stronger with Acheron?
Pela with 56% def reduce
Or Jiaoqju with 50% ultimate dmg buff
35 dmg + 15 ultimate dmg
def would be JQ which is to be expected as a support that was tailored for Acheron and being a 5*. my chart in the beginning shows how it would be in theory (pls note that JQ sig lc is off by 5% cuz i messed up), but in game, the lack of uptimes sometimes will put jq quite ahead
Don't forget that Jiaoqiu provides much more stacks for Acheron compare to Pela which is really good in Pf. You would need to build him really fast so you can get his next ult faster to reset the trigger count.
I still say he's an upgrade from Pela in general.
Thanks for this information, could you make 1 with JQ vs black swan for acheron teams? i am not sure if i should just go for black swan and skip JQ if BS can also do similar
I can just explain here if that's fine and hopefully u can make a better decision off of that. 1. enemies spawning in with Arcana and Ashen Roast do not give Acheron's another stack. 2. For JQ, it must be the enemy taking their turn with JQ's field being up. 3. Arcana also does not generate acheron any stacks when the dot blows up, with Black swan only able to increase acheron's stack with a skill and ult. (idk about basic atk). As such, for acheron specifically, he may be a sizeable bit better for acheron, due to 1. debuffing more/his vulnerability multipliers are higher and 2. he can trigger acheron stacks when enemies take their turn.
@@yun3_what about with her epiphany? When it comes to the elite enemies that can take 2 turns, you can use Acherons ult on their turn for BS’s epiphany buff. Does that help BS much?
@@coldbacon4869 that 25% vulnerability is just a straight up 25% dmg increase so it indeed is RLY big which closes the gap between them by quite a bit. The main issue is just playing around this mechanic may not be the most comfortable, and u can only do it to 1 enemy at a time.
Ill be excluding lcs here but jq's 50% vulnerability(when ulting) is just 50%dmg increase, with BS epiphany on enemy turn. 25 vuln + 20 def shred results in a 40% dmg increase.
hope that helps :)
What is acheron best team now?
Acheron, jiaoqiu,??, gallagher.
Gallagher cuz i find him more statisfying to play than aventurine
Edit: e0s1 acheron, with sustain.
Imo, it would be Acheron, Jiaoqiu, Pela, and ur Gallagher. doing this, u can run tutorial lc on jiaoqiu, and even if u dont have it, it will be the best dmg wise and stack wise for ur acheron 👍
I am a bit conflicted about if I should pull Jaoqiu or not.
I have a E1S1 Acheron, E6S5 Gui with SU nihility lc, E6S5 Pela with Luka's lc and a E0S0 Sparkle.
Actually, what would be better for my Acheron team: investing in E2 Acheron or pulling Jaoqiu, as a Pela upgrade or Gui upgrade?
Hello, I’ll first exclude the stack generation which JQ def makes the most for acheron compared to all 3 options, that being (sparkle+acheron, pela, and gui). this is def rly important but a bit hard to quantify.
I can only really go over scenarios and if they fit you, then I think upgrading to JQ would be a good choice.
1. if you struggle with pela uptime or acheron ult doesnt sync up well with pela ult, then switching to jq may be the way
2. do u have trouble generating gui stacks? like do u kill enemies before they have 3-4 stacks? jq generally should always have max stack of ashen roast on all enemies, so if u sometimes cant kill bc of lower gui stacks, then u can switch out gui.
i think if u dont struggle in those areas, u can probs just go for e2 acheron to use sparkle. but i must say imo, if ur not using sparkle/bronya with an e2 acheron, e2 is really wasted. while other 5* harmony units buff more than our nihiltiies, u will be losing acheron stacks. this is something sparkle “kinda” helps. this will make it so sparkle is kinda glued to e2 acheron unless u wanna feel like u wasted ur pulls for e2 if u just use say pela and gui anyway.
hope that helps :)
@@yun3_ Thanks, you helped me. Truth be told, I should've pulled for Jaoqiu from the beginning, but as soon as Feixiao's drip marketing got out, all my plans were shattered. Aside from that; if Feixiao doesn't turn out to be a broken hunt, I think I'll pull for Jaoqiu and replace Gui (I have some skill issue with her dot's stacks). By the way, thanks again.
4:35 thats why I build pela with 4 set eagle 😂
If I have Acheron E2S0, Sparkle E0S0, Silver Wolf E0S0 and Fu Xuan E0S0. Would you rent me to get Jiaoqiu?
I think if u plan on using mono quantum and consistently implanting lightning, i dont think he would be necessary. Though he definitely is an upgrade to silver wolf, it’ll just be up to u if he is currently needed for ur account :)
I think one of the main issues comparing Jiaoqiu and Pela in PF is the stack generations. Pela can better use the wind set for a better rotations, while jiaoqiu you need to chose between damage and utility (or even the weird build with SU LC).
That said, Pela is not even the best option in PF to begin with, it is DoTcheron (Acheron, Kafka, BS, anything) - you can see by both prydwen and CN clear stats. Jiaoqiu might be a good sidegrade, but I don't think he is exactly necessary when she already has a team that can clear 40.000
this is true but we gotta consider for pf at least, this is 2 limited 5* while jq* is just one, which can also be used really effectively outside of pf
@@yun3_ Aren't pretty much all these calcs with Jiaoqiu's signature in mind? That's a pretty similar amount of pulls to just getting Kafka and Black Swan.
@@user-gu5zt3iy8m yah thats pretty true, but most kakfa and bs swan mains are probs using their sigs as well. so it could be up to 4 5*
For now i can only afford e0s0 for my e0s1 accheron so is it better than e6 pela?
You play jiaoqiu with pela preferably and he is better than Pela for Acheron.
e0s0 will only be slightly better than pela excluding uptime. if ur short on pulls, i dont think u should feel pressured to pull for him.
He is better, but he could just as easily be paired with pela, since stacking def shred is so good
@@user-uv6qu3wb5d remember he has vulnerability, not def shred, so it actually wouldn’t stack like how pairing pela and sw would 👍
Sorry but the characters in the next patch seem way more valuable. I would venture to say that Sparlke has way more value this update than any new character if you dont have her but pull for who you want. Don't really like his design, VO and already have a great team for my e2s1 acheron. Ill keep saving. Good vid though.
That’s a fair point. i don’t know moze’s kit too well rn, but lingsha doesn’t look too amazing from a value perspective.
If enemy died without Pela landing the debuff does that really matters
the issue is that there will be many scenarios where pela not landing means u dont have enough damage to kill the enemies. whether it meaning u cant 1 shot the enemies or taking another cycle
If already have E0S1 Archeron then E2S1 Archeron play buff and Action Advance is much better than pull E0S1 JQ.
I was getting mixed messages on reddit on which would would be better, but I think the tldr of it would be both results would be very similar. But remember that ur getting 3 characters going for e2 + sparkle rather than 1 with JQ
@@yun3_ there is Bronya bro. And E2 release Archeron form a lot of limit. Archeron is too strong that why they balance JQ around her
@@thienluong3796 yah thats pretty true but you make have sp issues if u go the fast acheron route. I also dont know how much of a dmg loss it is if u do run speed acheron tbh
@@yun3_ Archeron E2S1 you can brute force pretty much everything. DPS is overflow so I don't think we should care about DPS lose.
And about the SP isue is not big deal. The classic slow DPS and 160+ Bronya and Pela 160+ Eagle set deal with it pretty easy.
how about fast black swan e1 with Kafka's lc with Acheron?
could you clarify what u mean by that? If you mean how much of a dmg increase it would be for acheron, we can just get her skill shred and e1 which would be a 40% dmg increase. But if u time her acheron ult on the enemy turn while they have black swans' epiphany, it jumps 75%. Idk why cuz it should be 65%, but regardless, pretty gud and u def can make it work. Though I will say getting JQ's lc on blackswan would actually be a REALLY big upgrade in terms of damage for ur acheron
Hi! I don't have Acheron, I just wanted him to help put negative statuses with Dr. Ratio, does he work with him or do I keep saving for another m character?
Hello :) Yes he should work fine with dr ratio.
I hope this is right so take this part with a grain of salt. if i am interpreting the gameplay right, He only applies 1 debuff/ that being ashen roast.( i dont believe his ult vulnerability is a seperate one) and he can apply 2 debuffs with his LC. 3 if what i said was wrong including lc.
i think he’ll work rly well with fua like topaz, albiet not as good as robin ofc. but i do personally think that JQ Tingyun and Ratio would be his best Hyper carry team when not running the RRAT team👍
@@yun3_ thank you very much ^^ I thought that with the latest nerfs it would not work with Ratio, that's why I asked, thanks again c:
Problem is that I just cannot justify sacrificing so many jades for a not so substantial increase to my account. E2S1 acheron is so overkill that JQ is just not worth the cost of a limited character, plus with the 2.5 drip marketing he’s being pushed even further under the rug… He is certainly not the worst character in the game but for what he is he is just not worth spending so much limited currency for myself and many other players
100% valid opinion :) I just don't like the doomposters making him out much worse than he actually is, that's all.
I don't have archeron, and I also ain't planning on pulling on her, i just hope JiauQ can be a solid unit by himself and probably be a useful second dps/debuffer
I personally believe he will after what ive researched :)
It's your decision at the end of the day, but I think it would be a way better option to pull for Robin or Ruan Mei's reruns. That or wait for the next limited 5 star Harmony. The fact of the matter is that Silverwolf and Jiaoqiu are not competitive at the moment when compared with these units in neither sheer damage amplification nor in utility.
People be mad at every unit that are not OP these day i mean he's is alright Im still thinking he's better than silverwolf but still not in rm League
The problem is he is a Limited 5*, I think it's better if he is 4* or non limited 5*.
Limited 5* is not a unit where they have niche kits.
Who wants to spends money on something limited but a very common usage?
Imagine you found a "limited" mop because it has a good grips, but still a normal mop, would you buy it?
It would be better to make a limited edition of a mop with a better function like maybe have an auto dry function where most normal mop doesn't have it.
The point is, it doesn't need to be OP, but putting niche kit to a 5* limited is kinda weird.
Is Jiaoqiu better than gui in dot teams? Because i was planning on replacing her.
from what ive seen, jiaoqiu is very comparable to ruan mei in that team and the better performing one just comes down to the enemy resistances. So i would say so :) though i assume there are plenty of videos testing it out if u were to go find em
I'm still going to pull. I have this nagging feeling in the back of my head that it's going to be another Kazuha-style release, and I regretted that for so long. That, and I eventually want a full team of Foxians hiding behind their fans looking coy, while wrecking the enemy.
He even has the same eng va so maybe ;)
What is the damage/AV difference over two MOC cycles between E0/ S5 resolution JQ vvs E6/S1 Pela (JQ sig)?
Pela cannot use JQ lc as it requires the wearers’ dot on the enemy, meaning only JQ, BS, and gui can use it. if u play moc and find urself having trouble with pela uptime, cuz i def do at times in mc using ratio/jl, JQ could be a sizeable upgrade. if u dont find urself with uptime issues, i would reccomend not going for him unless i rly like him
As an e2 ach haver, if JQ cant replace a sustain, then he is unnecessary.
Unfortunately he is still worse than Pela for Jingliu which I considered pulling him for (back in the days where he was supposed to have healing I was very hyped), so I probably will skip him. Good video (i also watched your previous vid), sub + like.
ps: 0:32 can you share how you calculated that? I calc'd with bronya buffs on blade and the difference is around 10% for basic/skill and 20% for ult for Blade on JaoS1 vs PelaS5Resolution, Jao with S5Reso is just barely better than Pela tho (1-13%).
Honestly it just depends with Pela and Jq. when I got the first half of moc 12 this time around, my run is either 100% uptime or i get bad rn and uptime is near 50%. with my pela ult not being in line with jl, it hurts
for the second part, ur math is right. so at e0s0 jq, it kinda just comes down to uptime, with ur actual damage not being too far off. Using my jl in moc 12, if my rotation gets messed up bc of cc for 1 turn. My overall pela uptime drops to like 30-50%. double enhanced JL skill without pela against argeni and do smol dmg.
for my math, we gotta essentially separate the 2 types of dmg amps, buffs and debuffs. So when doing all my nihility calculations, everyone had imaginary stats which totaled to 100kdmg with 100cr. Afterwhich I can just put in the different debuffs and ur own stats will not matter.
the issue is once u add self buffs that change ur atk, dmg%, crit. This is dependent on ur current build, bonuses in the kit, and buffs bc of diminishing returns for said stats.
@@yun3_ thx for the reply!
So with pela and JQ having both their BIS LC JQs sig and resolution in pearls
Jiaoqiu is better by how much and is it worth pulling to power creep my pela?
itll just depend. if u got uptime issue with pela, then he’ll improve ur experience by a lot. but if not, he’ll still provide more stacks to ur acheron. i cant quantity it but there are lots if showcase on reddit to look at👍
I'm still gonna pull for my boy and his light cone, I'm just wondering about team comps. I'm not good with doing good teams but I thought of my E2S1 Acheron, Jiaoqiu, a sustain and Tingyun so that Acheron get Tingyun's her skill and Jiaoqiu Tingyun's ult. Would that be ok for PF or sth?
i have a video coming up maybe tmrw to explain how to make his ult uptime in pf a non issue. but to explain shortly, either use solitary healing or tutorial lc. i do recommend with e2 acheron, u try to use a sparkle tho rather than tingyun bc JQ generally will not need help with energy. ur best bet imo is to just use pela/bs + him together and gove him tutorial lc👍
one thing about jiaoqiu that wasn't exactly clear for me from the wording is his third trace
it says that whenever an enemy enters the fight and JQ's field is up, that enemy will get applied with the highest stack present of ashen roast
but I'm not sure if this counts towards the 6 ashen roasts limit from the ult or not
if it doesn't count he should be pretty strong for PF still
could you confirm for me?
this does not. the 6 stack limit will only occur on the enemy turn specifically. if you are asking the limit for acheron, just like black swan, enemies entering the field while applied with arcana and ashen roast, will does not generate acheron stacks
ty for the quick answer
too bad that it doesn't generate stacks though :
Im an acheron main and ive had high hopes for jiaoqiu. I was almost thimking of skipping him yesterday night but i saw this video this morning and thought, "my wife needs a new handbag"
you are way better off pulling for e2 acheron, leaving you freedom to add a harmony on your sparkle or ruan mei on you team, than pulling for jiaoqiu. acheron with jiaoqiu = e2 acheron
Based. Gotta treat ur wife right with only the best
@@kyoga5714performance wise, it will still be pretty similar but getting a whole new nihility dmg amper is much more worth account wise than an e2
how's he work with kafka??as like a dot (kafka, ruanmei, jiaoqiu, sustain) ?? i assume he contribute less dmg than BS with kafka? but if the number dont fall so far, i probably picking him over BS, cause its a bit more versatile(so you can use him as dot with kafka in PF and MoC, use it as supp for acheron in PF and MoC aswell) than BS. (i see somewhere that BS gonna get her rerun, so that's why)
From what I've gathered, a Kaf, BS, JQ, sustain is > Kaf, BS, RM just slightly. I dont know exactly how well he replaces BS as ur right, trading dmg for an entire team buff can potentially just be slightly worse. Asking my friend who has black swan and Kafka, he says that his generally gets to 25 stacks of arcana with ult up if things go right. I don't know the in theory damage difference as I'm not really a dot player but I can just list the factors which would determine who would perform better if that helps in a dot team if that helps
JQ's dot multi is 180 while black swan is 240 main target and 360 adjacent(with 3 arcana stacks), and at 7 stacks(generally with ult up), the 240 multiplier is increased (12% perstack). Honestly, looking at that is REALLY big difference for just using those numbers, and even with JQ's debuff multipliers, I think he may be much worse than a black swan for ur scenario.
My friend says that kafka just enables black swan and BS is the main source of the dmg.
Hope this helps u decide a lil bit even though it is not the conclusive
@@yun3_ alright, thanks man
well to bad guinaifens the goat 🐐🗣️🗣️🔥🔥
Jay Q 💀
WOAH. HE WASNT IN GAME YET. IT WAS THE SAFEST OPTION ;-;
in order to compare them to pela or gui you have to do s0 not everyone is whale cringe
i do have my dmg comparison chart where he does use resolution instead. I also am using gui at e6s1 when talking about the comparisons👍
I’m an F2P Acheron main who will most likely not pull for Jiaoqius sig LC (if I do consider rolling for him at all). Will Black Swan be just as efficient or am I better off pullling for Jiaoqiu?
I think as a ftp player in general, JQ will be a better option has he is much more universal like a pela with his debuffing capabilities being much higher than blackswan, as such can be used in more teams where BS is only really used in dot/acheron. This is not including how jq also gets more stacks for acheron specifically by quite a but. Hope that helps u decided. I'll answer more questions if u got any :)
@@yun3_ I guess I will pull for JQ. thank you! :)
I'm still on the fence my acheron is E2
I've seen more people coming around saying that he better than sparkle at e2 acheron, though I cannot verify the claims.
though here is a showcase with e2 acheron and sparkle with jq vs pela, with him performing better than pela
czcams.com/video/mhRiR7wNZW8/video.html&ab_channel=KEI4GAMES
Now nihility character in future will be balanced based on archeron rip nihility
I believe on the “damage amp” type def ones will. but example, welt with his unique mechanic doesnt really benifit acheron too much, so more unique types if nihility wont imo
With hmc making everyone in your team do 100k+ seeing this guy do so little is disappointing. But then again I probably won’t win 50/50 anyway 🤷
My Acheron E2S1 team is Sparkle E0S0, Aventurine E2S1, Pela E6 with Pearls S5.
Is Jiaoqiu really an upgrade for Pela in this team? E1S1 maybe?
At the moment almost everyone says that he is not worth the Jades.
Sparkle's E2S1 would e.g. be better...so should I save and skip JQ?
Yes he is an upgrade especially in pure fiction. MUCH more so with E1S1. its like rly gud. But i dont u NEED to upgrade pela unless u really want to
inregards to jade value, it just depends on ur acc ig. ex. if u have a dot team and now can spare ruan mei from it onto say a break team.
for getting 2 more sparkles + pela, probs will perform similar to a to a e1s1 Jq e0s0 sparkle. But he is a whole nother character who can be used in many teams so i hope u keep that in mind :)
@@yun3_ Thx for your anwser. I have a DoT team but made the decision to focus on the Acheron & Firefly teams.
The Firefly E2S1 team is Ruan Mei E2S1, Harmony MC E6, Gallaghar E6.
These two teams can clear every content at the moment but I still want to improve them if it is worth it.
There is rumors for an 5* Gallaghar upgrade in 2.5
How does he compare to the acheron kafka black swan team? Would it be an upgrade or a downgrade to get him in the scenario
from what i’ve been hearing, i believe he is around a side grade to ruan mei in a dot team and an upgrade at a higher investment such as e1s1👍
@@yun3_ thank you :)
Quick question is it worth to pull for jq e0s0 for my e0s1 acheron?
I already have silver wolf , bs, pela
I dont think it would be worth unless u really want him. of the 3 u got rn, Imo, pela is a must, so the next slot goes to either sw or bs.
sw in ur team, depending on ur sustain, can be a full rainbow team (lightning,ice,quantum, (ex. img for aven). U will not be implanting a lightning anytime soon which is something to consider. Though sw is generally good for acheron, me personally, seeing how moc usually has 2 elite enemies, i personally am not a fan. +poor ult uptime and rng(my personal complaints)
so for bs, if u time acheron's ult when it is the enemies turn for the epiphany buff, she will be pretty gud. going off the top of my head, i think bs debuffing wise is like 20% worse than jq' and jq can generate more stacks than a BS can.
using that info, i hope that helps u decide
@@yun3_ im not at the point where i really want him , just asking for opinions
Still pulling regardless of debuffs. But do I need his lightcone to get the best out of him?
it’s only 9% better than him using something like resolution but u wont get that effect hit rate. if u go say eotp, u get that ehr, but that difference will then probably jump to 16% ish just using head math. its 100% up to u if u think its worth or not
i’m f2p w acheron, should i pull him or would it be better to not risk it and just save for a sparkle rerun ?
as a ftp player, I assume u dont have e2 acheron. sparkle can be rly good for acheron only after e2, so if u dont have that, I would recommend JQ 👍
Will there be a V6? Im running e1s1, pela, guinaifen, gepard. Do you think its better to get jiaoqiu to swap guinaifen of just get his weapon for guinaifen?
there shouldn’t be a v6 as all previous characters and their betas ended at 5. I think just getting a new character would be wise for any account, even if his sig lc can be very good on gui.
@@yun3_ ah well that sucks, was hoping for another change
So my favorite type of support nihility (dmg amp) will forever be cucked by acherons existense sigh. Pls tell me he beats ruan mei in dot at least
He does :). and if u do have ruan mei, u can now move her to a diff team like break
@@yun3_ oh how delightfull, do you have numbers though, my e1 ruan mei can now be put with my ip3 team cus I dont have Robin. Still super mad that debuffers cant be as good as harmomies in general but oh well
@@a-lance-user4265 www.reddit.com/r/JiaoqiuMainsHSR/comments/1e071np/kafkswan_vs_sud_moc122_e0_rm_vs_e0_jq_vs_e6s1jq/
here's a link to people who got the gameplay and n"umbers". hope thjat helps :)
after looking at it, i will say if both characters would be e0s1 rather than ftp lc, it would be in favor of jq.
Is black swan with his lc along with pela s5 resolution better than jiaoqiu acheron black swan team?
no it would not for acheron specifically. this would be due to the lower dmg increase as pela is a 4*. But she does rly well for a 4*. and if u want to get JQ lc for BS, i think itll be a great option as 24% vulnerability is just a 24% final dmg increase
I have e0 s1 Acheron, Ruan mei, and Black swan i also have pela at either e5 or 6. is Jiaoqiu still worth it ?
for acheron specifically, i think most ppl are finally getting around to “yes, he is def worth for acheron.” i think it’s up to u if he’s needed for ur team or if you need another upgrade for another team but at a higher priority. if you rly need an acheron upgrade, then i think it would be wise to get him👍
@@yun3_ Quick question, I have E2S1 Acheron, E0S0 Sparkle, E0S0 Silver Wolf, and E1S0 Trend Gepard. Is he still worth pulling for my account and how many more ults will I get compare to my current team? I was thinking of saving for e6 acheron tbh, but if not I go for E2 Sparkle and probably still save for E6 Acheron in a rerun or 2.
@@georgebuii Actually, in my opinion, I dont think u need to pull him. but ofc this is up to u
Using gepard still is based af, as i see most ppl running aventurine with trend. Gepard’s trend lc doesnt stack with JQ’s ult with acheron, so ur only just getting more consistency. But if u want to replace Gepard and trend and sw as such. i think only then will it be worth👍
for the amount of ults, it’ll really depend on the mode. from pure fiction, i can confidently say JQ generally gives 20-28 more acheron stacks from the ult alone. i dont know how much in moc as itll just depend on how fast u kill stuff and the amount of enemies
hope this helps
Is his e0 s1 still worth it like umm i kinda wanna get e2 acheron and maybe sparkle is just better
I think it just depends. Idk if u have e0 or 1 acheron, so I'll just assume 0? so you may be spending 140-280 pulls on e2. regardless, you are pulling a whole new character who can be used in multiple teams vs acheron e2 where u can now use sparkle. Both performances will be very similar but, imo i personally believe jq will still slightly outperform still even using jq pela at e2 vs sparkle pela
@@yun3_ i have acheron at e1 and i think ill.hopefully wait for a better debuffer cuz theres a lot of room for improvement
Solitary healing boost the ER gain of jiaoqiu ?
yep, it can be very practical in pure fiction though i wouldnt recommend it else where
Me personally, I think he’s fucking shit.Now he can clear faster than pela no doubt he IS better but the issue isn’t him anymore, its his position as a limited 5* the standards have been significantly increased and he just doesnt fit the requirement, unless you’re someone who loves 0 cycles or likes this guy (then pull for him because pick who you like over meta) you’re not gonna pull for him because he isnt worth it.He isnt even worth 160 jades as another limited character would just be better.The issue isnt that he’s bad, he’s just not good enough, they never should have changed him from V1 and if they did they should’ve nerfed his personal damage, nothing else I have no fucking clue what hsr was thinking.This is fucking tragic and unfair I was never planning to pull for him but this is just bullshit
ur right in saying that he may not be worth the pulls as many others have. I will say tho, depending on who you are, he can still be worth the 160 pulls, ex. if u use a combination of dot, break, and acheron. On my first video going over his changes, not much actually changed in regards to his kit besides his personal damage. The main way he could've competed with the other limited harmonies is if he simply had much higher vulnerability multipliers, but that simply would've completely powercrept our current 4* nihilities making them "useless" in ppl's eyes with the introduction of a strong jq. Slight healing would not have helped anyone outside of ppl who like doing 0 sustain/cycle teams which I personally do. I would say I wish he was stronger for the jq fans out there.
@@yun3_ I kinda agree with the combo part but honestly imo I’d just spend the extra resources to build pela/gunaifen because those two alone help with those playstyles.Unless you’re a new player he’s a great hybrid it’s still so stupid the way they treated him.They made him super niche and I hate it because he can only squeeze one cycle MAX two.His only benefit is that theres a decent amount of teams you could use him in since yk debuffer but really sad seeing him drop to his current levels