I would like tubeless spoked wheels and would carry spare tubes. If patching does not work or if I damage a rim, I always can try the tube. Just gives me more options.
Having had many punctures with tubeless tyres and experienced slow deflation that I can plug easily at the side of the road, and seen/experienced nasty crashes/rapid loss of control with tubed tyres - on safety grounds - tubeless every time. It's not black and with though. Solid video, Pavlin.👍
Great video Pavlin, I carry a repair kit for tubes and tubeless tyres, even though all my bikes now have tubes. One ride I can across a bloke who had a flat tyre that was tubeless, and he was rather worried on how he could fix the problem, simple as I put in a string plug and used my air compressor, 10 minutes later he was back on the road. Tubes however take a little more time and skill, I always change my own tyres at home using the same levers and tools I carry on the bike. For long remote trips in the outback I carry two spare tubes for the front and rear as well as a patch kit, hand pump and mini air compressor.
A conundrum indeed, it is what it is, you have what you have. You just have to try and mitigate the problems as best you can. After that it's in the lap of the gods. That's life. Cheers!! Pavlin all the best 👍👍👍
Nice video Pavlin. As you highlight both have positives and negatives. I think for Europe tarmac / light off roading tubeless wins for me just because it's easier to plug a puncture and get going.... I have never ventured outside the EU but in more remote countries I can see some benefits for tubed tyres especially for off road riding where, as you highlight, spares can be hard to find. The main advantage for me of tubeless is I can carry a small repair kit and know in 90% of cases I can fix a puncture quickly and get going again without needing tools to remove the wheel and tyre etc. Ride safe ✌🇬🇧
Yes, I agree. Motocross bikes don't use tubeless. And neither should ADV. But they are fine for streets. The dangers of tubeless are: 1) bent rims. 2) difficult to inflate if the bead is broken. 3) sidewall punctures. 4) large punctures. 5) tubeless tires are more difficult to take off and replace. They are not good for swapping tires between road+dirt. And a tube will not help because the valve holes are bigger in tubeless rims and will damage a tube. They are not made to protect tubes. It's ok to go from tube to tubeless, but not tubeless to tube.
Great video. I've ridden nearly 400,000km on motorcycles both on and offroad, and of the maybe 10 flats I've had, not once did I have tubeless tires and wished I had tubes, but every flat tire I had with tube tires, I wished I had a tubeless (as they all could have been plugged in 5 minutes. If I was to travel to very remote areas with a tubeless wheels, I'd carry tools and tubes just in case. I've seen a guy on facebook who got a flat front tire on his Tenere 700, and he ended up in the opposite lane, it all happened in under 3 seconds, lucky him there was no cars coming and he could stop safely, otherwise he'd probably be dead. For a tubeless tire to do that you need to ride on a knife or something and even then the safety beads on the rim will help keep the tire in place, something tube rims do not have so tire can be ripped off the rim pretty fast if your at an angle. In terms of safety, I'd give the tubeless a much higher rate (though nothing is 100% safe). I have a DR650 and I'm trying to find a manufacturer that will make true tubeless wheels for it, with the safety bead (until then, I use tire sealant in the tubes). When it's 35C, no shade, and mosquito infested, I'll prefer plugging a tire than removing the wheel, every single time :) Personally pure dirt bikes are the only bikes that should still use tubes, cause you run them at lower PSI, and generally speaking you're never 10h from home when you ride a dirt bike.
This is a well-debated subject. The bent rim risk is next to nil unless you air it down. Repairing a tubed tire in mud on the road is not a great experience. Stopping for a repair that takes at least 1 hour or more vs. 10 minutes is no comparison. I rewatched this video and have decided to get tubeless wheels for my Tenere 700.
Choose your bike and prepare it accordingly. Perhaps the most important thing is to practice with your repair solution before you go, and not have to effect your first repair in the middle of nowhere. There is always a way, though. Excellent topic Happy travels 👍
I think it depends on your personal experience. I had five flats in my motorcycle career so far. Three with tubeless tires, where I was able to fix just one of them. And two with tubes, where I was able to fix them all. So I stick to tubes! Even though tubeless “seems” to be easier!
Great video Pavlin, as always and my thanks. My Super Tenere has tubeless tires (spokes don't go into air chamber). On really long remote trips I carry a spare front tube. I always carry plugs, a patch kit (yes, tubeless tires can be patched on the inside), tire levers/breaker and a small compressor. Like you and others have said, the best precaution is knowledge and experience fixing both with the tools you carry.
Thanks Pavlin for your video. IMHO The best option is spoked rim with tubeless tyre. Greater safety, lower tyre temperature resulting in longer life, easy repair. If the rim is bent, you can fit an inner tube and continue your journey.
Why spokes; Spokes removing the dent from a rim is not easy and the spoke tension will all be out causing wobble and eccentricity. If you place a tube inside a spoke ed rim the the spokes may puncture the tube.
As soon as I get my T700 Ténére I'm going to order Alpina tubeless wheels for it. I travel a lot solo in Latin America during the winters, and don't want to be stuck trying to lever a heavy sidewall 50/50 ADV tire off a rim 100KM from Ciudad de Nowhere. For me personally a plug kit and compressor are the way to go. Also it saves the weight of all those extra tools you have to bring. Yes, you could bend a rim and end up unseating a tubeless tire, but in my experience that's rare. I bent a rim on my Goldwing in Baja California pretty badly and it still held air only losing 1 psi per day. Only my humble opinion.
@@elindenstein Alpina Wheels. They are sold by King Wheels in England. Haven't used them yet, but they were modified a few years ago with double O Rings to prevent air leakage in the event of a hard bump on something.
I was wearing your “another day another adventure” shirt when I had a rear tire blow a tube out quick. The tube split! A big nail went it. I was going 68mph on a highway on the way back from a 2000 mile adventure ride doing the NE BDR. I changed the tube on the side of the road.. that shirt is now my lucky shirt. I wear it every Sunday riding enduro. True story!
I've had good experience with a tube but taking the core of the valve out and filling in 100 to 150 cc of MTB tubeless sauce. In the tubes the sauce lasts a long time without drying out and it seals flats very reliably because it dries between tube and tyre. Not saying this is better or worse but has worked well for me kind of combining the 2 systems. Another tip with tubes is that you can sometimes patch them by just pulling off one side bead with the wheel still installed and the bike laid down. Careful with tank or carb leaks so that the rig dosen't burn down. Just another option that some people like and others don't. Greetings from England, AndyB
Very good video Pavlin!! My choice is Tubes 😊. Seen to many issues with TL guys haven’t been able to pop the tire out in the field, and also the bent rim issues. If I had to go TL, and on a long trip, I would carry at least a front tube 😊
I also have the T7. I immediately changed my OEM tubes to ultra heavy duty tubes and carry the OEM tubes as spares. The UHD tubes add security and the OEM tubes are lighter to carry as spares, along with a comprehensive repair kit/levers. As with other responders to this post I also change and balance all my own tyres at home, tubed and tubeless (SuperTenere). It is a good skill to practice and become comfortable with.
Heavy duty inner tubes does not belong on high power adventure bikes! They offer no extra protection but increase the risk of heat build up and a possible blowout considerably.
In 30 years of driving on tubeless tires, it happened only one time that I had to stop to change tire. In those 30 years, I had ten or more nails, screws and other sharp objects that got stuck in my tires and I kept driving for days or weeks before noticing. That includes two motorcycle tires. So, I would without hesitation clam that tubeless tires are better. Not to mention that Tenere 700 was big turn off for me with tubeless tired. At least not for $12k USD on the road.
There's truth there. I've had two nail and screw punctures and both of them held air just fine on tubeless tire. That being said, they're very prone to go flat in street tires as compound is so soft. I've also had about I think 5 flats that have happened on tubeless street tire after riding on gravel. Soft street Tyre and if you've ran out of thread depth in middle, the risk is very real. Luckily those will happen very slow speeds and and they usually run out of air very slowly. So I gotta give point to tube tires when they're close to their end. Though yes, category of tires is also different, I know.
Recently I trired tire fix foam for bicycles - it worked like a charm. Friend was able to drive 80km with punctured tube and I personally about 20 (and it was really big hole in tube). So, now I am not going anyhwhere without it, since it gives me opportunity to reach more comfortable place to fix tire instead of doing it by the road.
Agree ,I always carry a can with me, Got a flat on a road trip once on a Sunday when no services open and I didn't have tools with me (my bad), put the tyre goo in and 2000km later it's still holding air.
Depends on the riding. I was a tyre fitter in my early life. Many problems came from old, badly inflated tyres of both kinds. For Offroad tubed may be better for low pressure without breaking the bead. BUT in UK, motorways have no escape route. So better to have good quality tubeless tyres as they deflate (usually) more slowly in heavy traffic at high speed giving more chance of reaching safe place to stop. Many would say Mousse, but not always legal for road use. 👍👍
The trick is to run tubeless and carry tubes. One of the biggest issues is running a stiff adv tire and not be able to seat the bead. Its easy to make a rim tubeless with 3M tape but I wouldn't do it without the safety lip for the bead which usually you won't find on front rims.
Seems like most people are leaning to spoked tubeless wheel (with center straight valve) with a spare tube in case of emergency. For me its worth converting on my DR650. Changing a tube was a pita last trip and conversions seem fairly easy with the kits now. effort installing a TL kit in my garage to < effort required to install a tube on the trail in 90% of cases.
Simple answer is to use tubeless tyre but carry a spare tube as well as a tubeless repair kit. I have a Ktm and still managed to use a normal tube in this situation
I was thinking the same thing. Just as an emergency remedy, this should work. So obviously, tubeless is the way to go. Just carry a spare tube. Am I right, or am I overlooking something here!??
Great subject Pavlin. Here is my take and experience. I have used both and never had a puncture with tubeless, maybe luck was involved. I have had many punctures with tubes because 50 years of riding most of my bikes have had them. I have had blow outs like you described and rode miles with a flat front to get to civilisation. What I have discovered is the quality of tubes. I always, always use good quality tubes made of rubber not the cheap variety. The cheap tubes tend to split when punctured and deflate fast. Good quality tubes when punctured grip the item causing a puncture and there is more chance of a slower deflation.
The vast majority of on-road punctures occur in the rear tire. Not sure why, but the data supports that the rear is most vulnerable. The front wheel is more apt to get a dented rim. So, the natural solution is a tubed front wheel, and tubeless rear wheel, and carry a tube that will work in both the front and the rear, just in case, as well as plugs for the rear. And a pump. And tire irons. And patches. And a cell phone and a credit card.
I own two bikes. One tube and the other tubeless. I change my own tires and have fixed flats on both. My kit has what it takes to repair both. I feel it is a skill any serious rider needs to master.
I fixed over 100 punctures in a 3 year trip from uk to Cambodia from 2000 to 2003 with tubes in a dominator. I did several over 4500m and its hard work. In all those punctures I never had a dangerous one thankfully. One bent a rim that would have buggered a tubeless. I now have a CRF1100L and paid 2k to go tubeless.
taking off at high way speed cuz of tyre exploding on front wheel...well, lets just say that changing the tyres is the least of my worries. id go tubeless any second of a day
What i most value in your discussion is you offer options to consider. What "Works" on a cruser on the hiway with a lot of help options may be a disaster off road in the remote outback Also you mentioned "Weigh the options for our own situations, type bikes, locations and riding profile Few of the CZcams experts offer "Options" Well done
Yep, saw a video of a guy stranded on his GS in the outback because the tyre came off the rim or he took it off to put a tube in (can't remember),he tried everything to re seat it but couldn't , eventually got a lift to a farmers workshop to put it back on with a big compressor ,the small compressors won't do the job.
I had a similar motorway experience in Switzerland with a tube front wheel that deflated very quickly, and I am alive because the bike went againsy the right hand side guardrail. After that, I only bought tubeless bikes
Hi mate. As always, an excellent information must needed indeed. In my opinion, either way, tube or tubeless, you GOT TO BE PREPARE! Always been practical in what we carrying. Like n a prior episode, tools are very important, a life saver for you. In the road, even 5 min from your home could happen the same thing 3000 miles away on a trip. Focus in what I need for a typical situation, we are not gonna think on a worst case that put our lives in danger, but anything can happen on the road. In a minimalist mind there is always a solution that will bring you safe and sound to your home or near hostel so you can enjoy a hot cup of coffee and share your experience. Be ready guys
A brave topic to cover, given how polarised opinions are on this! Everyone's puncture experience is different, leading to different points of view (often fiercely defended) but the reality is, as you say, that there are pluses and minuses for both. I have tubeless on my road/sports bike, and tubes on my 'adventure bikes'. I am not afraid to repair a tubed tyre at the roadside, even though of course it is far more difficult than a tubeless repair. Usually. No-one likes having to put their gloves back on with black hands, just as no-one likes to be stranded, unable to fix their machine. The less straightforward aspects of this choice are the wide variety of situations any puncture can throw up, in either tubed or tubeless. A puncture on a motorcycle is a capricious event, and no one solution suits every circumstance. Tubeless tyres (and one-piece wheels) are usually better made: often 'rounder', better balanced, and suit higher speeds. Lighter and better. But - not in all situations, like the sidewall puncture you mention, or a hole that cannot be repaired with your tubeless repair kit. They are not safe to deflate so much for rougher, muddy or sandy tracks, or creek crossings, and are very difficult to remove (and refit) without a workshop - a bead breaker, high-pressure air, and preferably a fitting machine. Some tubeless rims are very difficult to remove and refit tyres to by hand, with a shallow centre 'well' in the rim form. The front tyre of my (Ducati) road bike a case in point, now on its 27th set of tyres. It is very difficult to 'break the bead' with the old sidestand trick if you are alone, and your bike only has one wheel on it... Tubed tyres allow for roadside repair, albeit with some difficulty, without needing the sort of equipment tubeless tyres might. Tubed tyres can be deflated for difficult terrain, and don't need such high pressure to 'pop the bead' onto the rim during a repair. The bead can usually be broken just with your heel. Being the older solution, they are cheaper to produce, making the bike more affordable. I think the decision re tubeless vs. tubed goes further towards tubes, if you have spoked wheels, and the more off-road riding you do. But there is no doubt that tubeless tyres are better for high-speed road motorcycles. For off-road, not so much. Spoked tubeless 21" front wheels aren't as strong as centre-mounted spokes, and all tubeless spoked wheels are harder to 'true' than conventional spoked wheels. Perhaps that is why the larger Suzuki V-Strom you mentioned has one of each - tubed 21" front, and tubeless rear. Thanks again for your input on these 'thorny' topics. (Thorny - puncture - my little joke)! 😎
Seems to me that tubeless tires are the best if you also carry a spare innertube and tyre levers for that 10% emergencie when the tubeless cant be fixed. You should always be covered then!
I once had a front tube explode on my previous KTM 990 adventure at around 120km/h and I had the "calmness" to immediately sit at the back of the seat to minimize the front contact patch with the road. That helps a lot. The tire had been "warning" me in the previous days. It was slowly losing air but I thought I just had to re-air it back until the tube was fixed or changed. I was wrong and ever since I was taught not to assume the most optimistic scenario. The tire blew in heavy urban traffic (in a main straight) and managed to get to the right lane after passing the middle (I was on the left) but as I was decelerating the front tire got off the rim (probably because I was continuously steering the bike towards the right) and I fell (albeit at a very low speed - around 30-40km/h). Luckily me and the bike came out ok. P.S. That's why enduro bikes use rim locks. I use them on my 500EXC and even though they make the tire vibrate on the street, it's a piece of mind.
I prefer a tubless tire, sometimes remounting the tire is more difficult and I have pinched the tube putting the tire back on and had to repeat the removal and patching of the tube. Great video, like you, I am not going to change a wheel to be able to use tubless tires if the motorcycle comes with tubes, but I would much rather patch or plug the tubless tire than to patch a tube.
This is a great video with a good pragmatic message, thank you Pavlin. For me, it’s tubeless all the way. I commute on the bike (with some motorway), my travels are on tarmac in reasonably civilised parts. My puncture risk is about 98% nails, screws and other sharps. I can plug those with the repair kit and for the other 2% I’m not too proud to call the tow truck. I’ve also been a bicyclist (gravel, MTB, commuting) year-round my entire life and while tubes there is par for the course I’ve decided to avoid them like the plague for motorcycling. Does it limit my choice in bikes? Yes. But in 2024 with the amount of great bikes out there that might not be a bad thing.
Ok, I say to you a question like this; If you had to ride all around the mountains of Nepal, Tajikistan, Pakistan, Turkmenistan, India &, you had to ride every road & track & you had to finish otherwise they cut off your hands, what would you use then?
I have a ktm tubeless rim and switched to tube. I find it much easier to change tube on the road and to quickly seat the bead when in the woods. Happy riding.
@Matthew-wn8oq yeah, honestly I've had way better luck with it. I think I'm in the minority. Part of it may be I've had the tubeless system fail on me after getting a flat and damaging the spoke gasket, twice. Lol at least I know the tube will always seat the bead again and I find it more reliable. 🤷 if I road less offroad I'd probably prefer the tubeless though.
I only have one bike has go to work, dates, travel and play. I don't have time to find a place to where I can pull my wheel off, take my tire off, and patch a tube. Going to work, no time, on a date no time, tubeless just plug it all good, off road can always put a tube on a tubeless rim and tire if you tear the tire. In 40 years I have never torn a tire though.
This summer I suffered two flats on the road. Tubeless tires. One I was about to do a field repair to get home. The other I had to have someone pickup the bike as the repair didn't hold. I've practiced changing tires at home and figure I have a better than 50/50 chance of doing it out on the road. Setting the bead on a tubeless tire can be sketchy sometimes -especially without access to a powerful compressor.
One thing was left out on this otherwise good video: one can air down a tire with tubes much more - down to 0,5 bar if tire locks are installed - then a tubeless tire. That’s a big advantage off road. I once experimented on my R1100GS and could sit down my tubeless tires down to 1,0 bar before I rode the tires off my rim… Tubeless with a spare tube that fits both wheels - you can ignore the off center hole for the valve - is the best way to go in my opinion on a long trip….Alle the best
I think the 2 different views on tube or tubeless comes from your background in riding, road riders prefer tubeless and more off road prefer tubes. Tubeless is great until you have a more complicated situation than just a hole from a nail or a screw, a cut in the tread or even worse the sidewall becomes more of an issue or a dented rim. The easy solution is to just put a tube in that is true but a tubeless tyre is not easy to break the bead of the tyre from the rim and not all that easy to pop back onto the rim, plus you have to carry the tools and spare tubes to do the job , defeating the point of tubeless tyres. Tube type tyres are easier to break the bead and pop back on the bead and you tend to carry the tools and spare tubes to do the job anyway with a bike with tubed tyres. If you want a quick easy repair on a tube tyre care a bottle or can of tyre sealant, it has saved me a few times, gets you out of trouble until you can replace the tube.
I run a mousse on my Enduro, it is not an adventure bike, but man,, no more problems! Go with Tubeless and bring a plug kit and if it is not repairable you can have a spare tube to put in there.
For my style of riding now I would prefer to have the new style of spoked tubeless. Being able to use a simple plug to get you home would be a dream for me. I'm just too old to spoon rubbers on my big ADV bike. Doing simple dirt bike tires in my garage is hard enough. I'm not sold on the tubeless conversion kits. If I can ever afford another new bike it will have spoked tubeless rims.
The story you said about the front wheel explosion sounds like a game of chance, too much out of rider's control. Guess I'll stick to cars and bicycles for travelling. I wonder if the heaviest motorbike flats can be self serviced.
What is your opinion of the Tubliss system? Downside is that it must be kept up to 100 psi which is maybe not always practical in high altitude, upside is that because it forces the rim out at 100 psi there is much less chance of a rim being distorted in contact with a rock, also tyre runs cooler and lasts longer. They are not technically approved for road use but I think that has more to do with US Department of Transport bureaucracy than reality and there are plenty of people riding with them on bikes like KTM690 etc. The risk "balance" is a personal decision but personally I would take that risk any day over a tube blow out at speed and intend to fit them on my 690 before my next big adventure. What are your thoughts?
I once got a puncture in my front tube on the off ramp off the Autobahn. It was essentially the same situation as yours. The front just exploded like that. It was all luck that I didn't fall on my face. In the corner the front gave away but caught grip again and nearly hade highside. My tube looked similar as well. It had multiple holes
@@motorcycleadventures I meant I carry them , I wasn't suggesting everyone should. Everyone has their own solutions to getting a flat tire , the only thing worse than a flat in the middle of nowhere is a cracked case in the middle of nowhere.
tubed tires,- carry at least two tubes.- that gives you the chance to not pinch a tube ,- that is easy to do ! ( fix the old one later.} or patch it in case you pinch the new ones. tubeless,- make sure you know how to use the repair kit right .
I fancy the new Transalp and thinking about it I am not put off by it's tubed spoked rims, looking back at the previous gens of transalp and I owned a 650 before, they all came with tubed spoked wheels and it never even concerned me or crossed my mind.
i have tubeless tyres. i had nail in it. but didn't have repair kit. i used fill air every 100 km at a petrol station and kept right at 80 to 90 kmph. bike felt normal. rode nearly 300 km back home and fixed it at home. 10 minutes plug job. if it was tube you can't do it
Pavlin, an excellent video and I can understand why you could not commit to one side of the issue. The subject is in itself open to much debate. I have owned 04 Tube Type (TT) and 05 Tube Less (TL) bikes from 1992 till date. I have ridden them all over India from Siachen Base Camp till Kanyakumari and Dwarka to Tawang. Fixing punctures during the 90s era on Indian roads was an absolutely must-have skill without which you were stranded, possible for days. And I have fixed my share of them, about 19, if I recall correctly. 15 of them on the TT bikes, 04 on the TL bikes. 02 were on my old Kawasaki RTZ 125 with my wife sitting by my side sipping tea from a flask while chatting with me and handing me tools. Also, all my motorcycling friends have TT or TL or both types of bikes, depending on their uses. Some ride highly modified KTM 39 Advs with TT wheels on technical trails while others ride the same bikes on highways and soft trails while still others ride only on highways. Their experiences enrich and educate me immensely. The one common thread binding all three types of riders is this: if you are a careful, sensible and informed rider, who does lots of advance prep before riding whatever type of terrain it si that you do, the single most dangerous enemy of TL wheels, namely the rim bend, will almost never, ever happen to you. And the strongest supporting view of this came from a hardcore trails rider who rides his KTM 390 Adv over the most demanding terrain; some of his photos looked like the goat or ibex paths in NatGeo documentaries. He has bent one rim one doing an especially ambitious rutted section and after a jump, the front rim got bent and the tire went flat. After that, he was extra careful about this aspect; the hassle of putting in a tube and limping to the service station to get a new rim was for him, simply not worth the pleasure gained from that adrenaline-fuelled rush over such sections. During my last Gujarat and Rajasthan ride in March this year, I had a small puncture in the rear of my KTM 390 Adv. Minor air loss but I don't ride with the bike injured in this way so halted by the wayside. Coincidentally, there was a Royal Enfield 350 owner who had halted near me with an identical issue. I saw him struggle with the tools - rear wheel bolt spanners, tyre levers, soapy water to check the exact location of the puncture, the adhesive pads, the gum paste and most importantly, the removal and fitment of the wheel and the tyre and tube and back again in reverse. And he was looking longingly at me finishing my job in 15 minutes and getting ready to ride. Of course, I helped him so he saved a lot of time and sweat and blood pressure. This and some similar experiences in the past fortified my decision to have only TL tyres on any bike that I will own and ride in remore areas. Yes, I carry a 19 inch tube for dire emergencies and I am lucky that it has never been used. Do write about your experiences in repairing your T7 TT punctures😀
Can tubed tyres heat up the inner tube and then it fails? That’s what I was told, so tubed tyres and long fast tarmac journeys are not the best mix - this type of journey suits tubeless?
Hi. If i csn give You my advice. Keep the front tube but to prezent front tyre air escaping so fast just seal the spokes with 3D boat silicone. I did that and its much slower loosing air that way.
The BIGGEST Disadvantage of Tube type tyre is that it can Explode at any Moment at High speed.... On the Streets I have seen many Fatal Accident of Riders Exploding their Front Tires.... Whereas Tubeless tyres Never Explode....Leave All the other Reasons aside, this is the biggest disadvantage of a tubetype tyre.... & now I am actually afraid of riding on A tube type tire
Just my 2 cents from experience in altitude. Got a flat in Bolivia at 4500 meters, I had one of these compressors that work with the bike's batter, that saved my ass that day as I had no spare tubes with me. I agree with you that there's no "better" option, tubeless is easier and faster to repair I will only say that.
To me it's very simple thing. Riding in even semi normal conditions, hands down the tubeless. Flat repair is so simple and here's the thing for me. Fast. You can pop normal cheapo fix in within 10 minutes easily and continue riding. Many claim that you tubeless patched tires are dangerous but imo that's bs. Of course one shouldn't ride like 200kmh anymore, that's for sure. Then there's the tube model. It has its use, but to me it's only on heavy conditions like actual Enduro riding where risk of rubbing rim against rocks, twigs etc. happens easily. But I absolutely hate patching them, cause it's always tire off the rim. Tedious patching, couldn't imagine how annoying that would be in rain for instance. Almost impossible. Another thing is that what I've experienced tube tire failures, it's not enough to repair the inner tube. You also usually need to try ti find the damage in the tire too or failure will usually happen soon after again. I'm not BMW guy, but I gotta hand them that their solution about spoked tires while being tubeless is absolutely great idea. Looking how spokes are in them, it's evident that it is very hard to damage rim at its edge cause of the location of spokes. Brilliant idea. All in all. "normal usage" tubeless is by far the best choice.
My tiger 800 is tubeless so i carry a spare tube and three patches all different sizes and glue them to the inside of the tube and then insert the tube, the patches stop the tube seeping through the hole in the tyre.
I ride a sidecar, have had it for 34 years, I run tubes in the front tyre, I had the tubeless front tyre lose pressure in a left had bend (sidecar on the left), so the front was under load, it popped off the rim and I flipped the sidecar at 90km/hr. I survived with a broken back, broken lung and fractured ribs. I recovered and still ride, I've raced classic bikes and vintage motocross, I still ride the sidecar hard, mostly solo, and it is either sliding or in the air when in the mountains, I use a lot of body movement to transfer weight and it had very heavy stearing, requires a lot of strength, but is immense fun to ride. My choice is to run a tube in the front, I have had flats since the crash, but never anything as dramatic. Without the sidecar, I would probably not use tubes.
I can understand why a tubeless tyre on a sidecar would not be ideal as the cornering forces on the tyre are completely different to a solo, and would tend to roll the tyre off the rim.
Cycling quite fast yesterday behind a white car, I looked down for a few seconds then, looking up slightly, my eyes captured a big, white freshly painted ‘20 MPH’ on the road’s surface and, in that moment, what passes for my brain, remembering what it’s like to cycle into a stationary vehicle, processed it as the white car, stopped. My heart almost leapt out of my chest. Such are the games our minds play with us.
I always use wheels that can carry a tube on long trips. Where I'm from, that's a deliberate choice to carry an extra set of underwear instead of a tube. Wheel damage is a different topic. I was surprised to find out some bikes have "soft" rims and their forums recommend changing for rough terrain.
Tubes and rim locks. Spoke wheels, too. If an alloy wheel breaks, in most areas you are just out of luck. Almost any spoked wheel can be repaired by straightening spokes to get back to a shop.
The mtb world is a couple of steps ahead of the motorcycle world regarding this topic. For long distance adventure riding it is a must to ride tubed, but here is the kicker, you need to add tire sealant inside the tube. You'll never have a flat again unless you punch a crater into the tire. For motocross or racing tubeless is a must since the tire dynamics will change from tubed to tubeless (better grip with a tubeless configuration)
Well, you are politician indeed. After my experience with tube and tubeless tires I can surely say: I prefer tubeless tires definitely. If you catch flat tire in most of cases it is easy to repair without disassembling the wheel with very light and small fixing kit. If shit happens in most of cases air pressure is dropping very slowly and you are able to look for gas station or garage. One of the main reasons that I have changed my Africa Twin to Africa Twin AS was tubeless tires. I had enough of that to carry two spare tubes, spoons, patches, air pump and other such stuff. Weight always matter. Do you remember?
Great video Pavlin, indeed it is a very divisive subject and the great thing about it is that there is no right or wrong choice, it comes down to personal preferences and risk evaluation. I am surprised that after your experience you still ride on tubes though lol. I am aware of the pros and cons of both and for my kind of motorcycle usage and travel style (moderate off road at times) my choice is tubeless all the time. A possible solution for motorcycles with tubes would be to convert at least the front rim (there are several kits on the market) to tubeless and carry a repair kit plus front and rear tubes.
I have had many punctures with tubless tyres! Realy easy to plug sith a small kit without getting the wheel off the bike! Also I had some reinforced tyres that I could run at about 50 Km/h even flat! Now I have tubes and always carry 2spare tubes! I also run sealant in the tubes! Also i had a bent steel rim that i hit with a hammer and it was ok!
Last summer I was riding my KTM 390 Adv and hit a pothole while going too fast and dented my rim. It broke the bead and flattened the tire. The people I was with helped me put a tube in and I was back on the road. I carry both kits with me now just in case.
I do a lot of solo riding. I just order tubeless rims for my tenere700. I got a flat the other day and had to tow my bike to my house. I decided to learn how to change the tire at house. I ordered the eastbound service kit but was not able to break the bead with it so I was like fak it. Tubless rims it is. I don't want to change a tire in 100 degree California heat somewhere with no shade or on a freezing cold day or in the dark. The tubeless wheels were $2k but it's totally worth the money.
A difficult choice. I have a 22model 1290. Yes the valve is offset. It would be good if manufacturers made provision for a tube valve in a tubeless rim. An air tight plug could be removed if a tube needed to be fitted.?
Hi Pavlin Take a look at Bike Seal puncture prevention system 500. I’ve had it in my 2016 A/ Twin tubes for 3/4 years. No issues with centrifugal force, balance or anything as some may argue. Also had tyres replaced, no issues. I like to think it might work for a straightforward puncture. Cheers Barry. UK.🏍
I have 3 bikes - BMW K1200R, Honda CBR 1000F, and Triumph Trophy 1200. They are heavy high-speed machines, and without doubt, Tubeless is the way to go. However, if I had a lighter bike and went off-road, I would consider tubes.
I have gone “political” and down the split tube “ghetto” method. A tube is cut open around it’s circumference and spread out so that the tyre can be mounted on top of it before the excess tube is sliced off. The tube is then doing it’s normal job of keeping the bottom of the chamber from leaking air out through spoke nipples and valve hole while acting as a seal between rim and tyre bead. It has been four months now and several hundred miles with no air lost from my Honda CT125’s wheels. I do however carry a spare tube in case damage cannot be plugged. Many YT videos, especially from Asia where the practice is very common - they also sometimes add a home brew sealant of baking soda and water!!
Hey, I lived in the UK for many years. Have bought GS1200 Adventure on the tubeless tires. Two weeks after the purchase I got a nail in the tire. The tire was almost new but now had a hole in it. Guess what .. the tubeless repair kits are banned in the UK - apparently they are unsafe. The BMW said I have to buy whole new rear tire..
Tubeless for me, and I don't ever want to go back to tube-type. Sooooo much easier to simply plug a tire rather than removing it, and pulling out the tube to repair it. I was really tempted by the new V-Strom 800DE, but the tube-type tires are a deal breaker for me. I'll stick with my V-Strom 1000 for now.
besides higherway vs offroad, there is also the question of availability of spare parts for example here in Algeria you can find parts for yamaha and BMW bikes easily in the north of the country, but only chinese bikes rule here in the south (sahara), also contrary to many believes, most chinese bikes here have cast wheels (tubeless), spokes are only on dual sport bikes (which are a minority) i saw sunless tires with spoked wheels on some yamaha 660cc bike here but it's a rare sight
I've ran tubeless tires/wheels pretty much of 40 years now. I've had tube tires along the way. Currently my Tenere T700 is tube type but I have new tubeless wheels for it. I've had flats on both types. I carry tubes just in case a hole is too great to properly patch. Life in the middle of no where is like that. Be prepared for the situation. Motorcycling is a very marginal sport. When Pavlin was at 5000 meters in the cold snow and ice low oxygen he was on the fringe of life. Same for the desert heat. You do what you have to. Be ready, be safe. Motion Pro Bead Breakers/tire irons. Cycle Pump air compressor from Aerostich, Best patch/plug inserts you can get. Yeap, glue that works in cold.
@@johnstaring3210 Hann hubs/wheels with Excel rims. ordered thru Off-The -Road in Germany. Much more affordable than Woody's Wheels in USA I believe 1.85 in. x21 frt, 4.25x18 in rear
I started using lube on my dirtbike like you do with musses, this eliminated pinch flats but remember I do have a rim lock it makes a difference! for long distances I don't know if I would make same thing with my tube on my f800gsa. Thanks for video as usual.
Tubeless with moose.. in my day tire moose was a self sealing foam injected into the tire or tube.. now they're a foam rubber tube like rubber band inside the air filled tubeless tire.. it's what ALL the Pari Dakar bikers use for 20 odd years now.. tubeless because.. you never get an exploding blowout AND 99% of the punctures are easily & quickly fixed with a plug.. no worries in dirty conditions & bead seating or sealing
So can you put a tube in a tubeless tyre on a tubed rim, without any reduction in speed rating for the tyre or worry about the inner tube getting too hot? Are modern tubeless able to take a tube? Or is there a safety issue? I ask as on the Africa twin forum lots use tubeless on the base model, with a tube! But research I've done suggest that tubed tyres are made different....they have a very smooth inner so there's no rubbing, friction....heat to the inner tube! Should I worry putting a tubeless on a tubed rim?
I would like tubeless spoked wheels and would carry spare tubes. If patching does not work or if I damage a rim, I always can try the tube. Just gives me more options.
Good decision!
For a tubeless you need a sealed rim which means you won’t be able to fit an inner tube on the rim.
@@ardencassie5150 false, you can actually fit it without problems. as long as the valve hole is in the middle of your rim.
Having had many punctures with tubeless tyres and experienced slow deflation that I can plug easily at the side of the road, and seen/experienced nasty crashes/rapid loss of control with tubed tyres - on safety grounds - tubeless every time. It's not black and with though. Solid video, Pavlin.👍
Thanks for sharing!
You can't go too low (air) on a tubeless tire. That's a safety problem in off road conditions as traction = safety and control.
Great video Pavlin, I carry a repair kit for tubes and tubeless tyres, even though all my bikes now have tubes. One ride I can across a bloke who had a flat tyre that was tubeless, and he was rather worried on how he could fix the problem, simple as I put in a string plug and used my air compressor, 10 minutes later he was back on the road. Tubes however take a little more time and skill, I always change my own tyres at home using the same levers and tools I carry on the bike. For long remote trips in the outback I carry two spare tubes for the front and rear as well as a patch kit, hand pump and mini air compressor.
Thanks for sharing!
Wow!
The “Count Dracula” of tyres!! What a voice! Great info too 👍🏼👍🏼
I have tubed rims and I'm confused on what tyres I can use! Do you put tubed in a tyre that's tubeless?
Yes, when you buy an Adventure bike it will usually come with tubeless tires with a tube in it.@@terrystratford1235
A conundrum indeed, it is what it is, you have what you have. You just have to try and mitigate the problems as best you can. After that it's in the lap of the gods. That's life.
Cheers!! Pavlin all the best 👍👍👍
Thanks for taking the time, Marc!
Nice video Pavlin. As you highlight both have positives and negatives. I think for Europe tarmac / light off roading tubeless wins for me just because it's easier to plug a puncture and get going.... I have never ventured outside the EU but in more remote countries I can see some benefits for tubed tyres especially for off road riding where, as you highlight, spares can be hard to find. The main advantage for me of tubeless is I can carry a small repair kit and know in 90% of cases I can fix a puncture quickly and get going again without needing tools to remove the wheel and tyre etc. Ride safe ✌🇬🇧
Thanks for taking the time, Darren!
Yes, I agree. Motocross bikes don't use tubeless. And neither should ADV. But they are fine for streets. The dangers of tubeless are:
1) bent rims.
2) difficult to inflate if the bead is broken.
3) sidewall punctures.
4) large punctures.
5) tubeless tires are more difficult to take off and replace. They are not good for swapping tires between road+dirt.
And a tube will not help because the valve holes are bigger in tubeless rims and will damage a tube. They are not made to protect tubes. It's ok to go from tube to tubeless, but not tubeless to tube.
@@chadkline4268 great points!
Great video. I've ridden nearly 400,000km on motorcycles both on and offroad, and of the maybe 10 flats I've had, not once did I have tubeless tires and wished I had tubes, but every flat tire I had with tube tires, I wished I had a tubeless (as they all could have been plugged in 5 minutes. If I was to travel to very remote areas with a tubeless wheels, I'd carry tools and tubes just in case. I've seen a guy on facebook who got a flat front tire on his Tenere 700, and he ended up in the opposite lane, it all happened in under 3 seconds, lucky him there was no cars coming and he could stop safely, otherwise he'd probably be dead. For a tubeless tire to do that you need to ride on a knife or something and even then the safety beads on the rim will help keep the tire in place, something tube rims do not have so tire can be ripped off the rim pretty fast if your at an angle. In terms of safety, I'd give the tubeless a much higher rate (though nothing is 100% safe). I have a DR650 and I'm trying to find a manufacturer that will make true tubeless wheels for it, with the safety bead (until then, I use tire sealant in the tubes). When it's 35C, no shade, and mosquito infested, I'll prefer plugging a tire than removing the wheel, every single time :) Personally pure dirt bikes are the only bikes that should still use tubes, cause you run them at lower PSI, and generally speaking you're never 10h from home when you ride a dirt bike.
Cheers for the info.
This is a well-debated subject. The bent rim risk is next to nil unless you air it down. Repairing a tubed tire in mud on the road is not a great experience. Stopping for a repair that takes at least 1 hour or more vs. 10 minutes is no comparison. I rewatched this video and have decided to get tubeless wheels for my Tenere 700.
Both have some pros and cons
Choose your bike and prepare it accordingly.
Perhaps the most important thing is to practice with your repair solution before you go, and not have to effect your first repair in the middle of nowhere.
There is always a way, though.
Excellent topic
Happy travels 👍
I will agree that the practice is a must.
I think it depends on your personal experience. I had five flats in my motorcycle career so far. Three with tubeless tires, where I was able to fix just one of them. And two with tubes, where I was able to fix them all. So I stick to tubes! Even though tubeless “seems” to be easier!
Thanks for sharing!
Great video Pavlin, as always and my thanks. My Super Tenere has tubeless tires (spokes don't go into air chamber). On really long remote trips I carry a spare front tube. I always carry plugs, a patch kit (yes, tubeless tires can be patched on the inside), tire levers/breaker and a small compressor. Like you and others have said, the best precaution is knowledge and experience fixing both with the tools you carry.
Thanks Pavlin for your video. IMHO The best option is spoked rim with tubeless tyre. Greater safety, lower tyre temperature resulting in longer life, easy repair. If the rim is bent, you can fit an inner tube and continue your journey.
Thanks for taking the time!
Why spokes; Spokes removing the dent from a rim is not easy and the spoke tension will all be out causing wobble and eccentricity.
If you place a tube inside a spoke ed rim the the spokes may puncture the tube.
As soon as I get my T700 Ténére I'm going to order Alpina tubeless wheels for it. I travel a lot solo in Latin America during the winters, and don't want to be stuck trying to lever a heavy sidewall 50/50 ADV tire off a rim 100KM from Ciudad de Nowhere. For me personally a plug kit and compressor are the way to go. Also it saves the weight of all those extra tools you have to bring. Yes, you could bend a rim and end up unseating a tubeless tire, but in my experience that's rare. I bent a rim on my Goldwing in Baja California pretty badly and it still held air only losing 1 psi per day. Only my humble opinion.
Okay
Have you done this yet?
@@elindenstein Yes, I have the new wheels.
@@LATAMbiker Which company did you go with? I’m considering this right now too. How have they held up?
@@elindenstein Alpina Wheels. They are sold by King Wheels in England. Haven't used them yet, but they were modified a few years ago with double O Rings to prevent air leakage in the event of a hard bump on something.
I was wearing your “another day another adventure” shirt when I had a rear tire blow a tube out quick. The tube split! A big nail went it. I was going 68mph on a highway on the way back from a 2000 mile adventure ride doing the NE BDR. I changed the tube on the side of the road.. that shirt is now my lucky shirt. I wear it every Sunday riding enduro. True story!
Thanks for sharing it!
I've had good experience with a tube but taking the core of the valve out and filling in 100 to 150 cc of MTB tubeless sauce. In the tubes the sauce lasts a long time without drying out and it seals flats very reliably because it dries between tube and tyre. Not saying this is better or worse but has worked well for me kind of combining the 2 systems. Another tip with tubes is that you can sometimes patch them by just pulling off one side bead with the wheel still installed and the bike laid down. Careful with tank or carb leaks so that the rig dosen't burn down. Just another option that some people like and others don't.
Greetings from England, AndyB
Thanks for sharing!
Very good video Pavlin!!
My choice is Tubes 😊. Seen to many issues with TL guys haven’t been able to pop the tire out in the field, and also the bent rim issues.
If I had to go TL, and on a long trip, I would carry at least a front tube 😊
Fair enough!
I'm a tubes man, My Triumph has tubed tyres and I wouldn't want to buy a kit to change them. but can see your point in this
Do whatever is good for you, Peter!
I also have the T7. I immediately changed my OEM tubes to ultra heavy duty tubes and carry the OEM tubes as spares. The UHD tubes add security and the OEM tubes are lighter to carry as spares, along with a comprehensive repair kit/levers. As with other responders to this post I also change and balance all my own tyres at home, tubed and tubeless (SuperTenere). It is a good skill to practice and become comfortable with.
what about UHD tubes and long motorways at speed?
@@nemerkha he didn't think about that...
Thick tubes creat much more heat . My advice is stick to regular tubes and don't lower your tyre pressure off road. But you have spares so no problem.
Heavy duty inner tubes does not belong on high power adventure bikes!
They offer no extra protection but increase the risk of heat build up and a possible blowout considerably.
In 30 years of driving on tubeless tires, it happened only one time that I had to stop to change tire. In those 30 years, I had ten or more nails, screws and other sharp objects that got stuck in my tires and I kept driving for days or weeks before noticing. That includes two motorcycle tires.
So, I would without hesitation clam that tubeless tires are better. Not to mention that Tenere 700 was big turn off for me with tubeless tired. At least not for $12k USD on the road.
Fair enough!
There's truth there. I've had two nail and screw punctures and both of them held air just fine on tubeless tire. That being said, they're very prone to go flat in street tires as compound is so soft. I've also had about I think 5 flats that have happened on tubeless street tire after riding on gravel. Soft street Tyre and if you've ran out of thread depth in middle, the risk is very real. Luckily those will happen very slow speeds and and they usually run out of air very slowly. So I gotta give point to tube tires when they're close to their end. Though yes, category of tires is also different, I know.
Shame, you are really missing out because the T7 is amazeballs.
@@jimigrill I tried it. Didn't like it. I do love my Super Tenere.
Recently I trired tire fix foam for bicycles - it worked like a charm. Friend was able to drive 80km with punctured tube and I personally about 20 (and it was really big hole in tube). So, now I am not going anyhwhere without it, since it gives me opportunity to reach more comfortable place to fix tire instead of doing it by the road.
Thanks for sharing!
Bok Slavkec! Can you tell me what's the name (or brand) of this foam. I will defenitely take it with me on my next trip.
Agree ,I always carry a can with me, Got a flat on a road trip once on a Sunday when no services open and I didn't have tools with me (my bad), put the tyre goo in and 2000km later it's still holding air.
Depends on the riding. I was a tyre fitter in my early life. Many problems came from old, badly inflated tyres of both kinds. For Offroad tubed may be better for low pressure without breaking the bead. BUT in UK, motorways have no escape route. So better to have good quality tubeless tyres as they deflate (usually) more slowly in heavy traffic at high speed giving more chance of reaching safe place to stop. Many would say Mousse, but not always legal for road use. 👍👍
Fair enough!
@@motorcycleadventures Other ooptions now than mouse. A mechnical seal wont damage the tube or go off after a set time and cause balance problems.
Thanks for mentioning different scenarios of flats.good points!
Glad it was helpful!
The trick is to run tubeless and carry tubes. One of the biggest issues is running a stiff adv tire and not be able to seat the bead. Its easy to make a rim tubeless with 3M tape but I wouldn't do it without the safety lip for the bead which usually you won't find on front rims.
Thanks for taking the time!
Seems like most people are leaning to spoked tubeless wheel (with center straight valve) with a spare tube in case of emergency. For me its worth converting on my DR650. Changing a tube was a pita last trip and conversions seem fairly easy with the kits now. effort installing a TL kit in my garage to < effort required to install a tube on the trail in 90% of cases.
Fair enough!
Simple answer is to use tubeless tyre but carry a spare tube as well as a tubeless repair kit. I have a Ktm and still managed to use a normal tube in this situation
Good!
I was thinking the same thing. Just as an emergency remedy, this should work. So obviously, tubeless is the way to go. Just carry a spare tube. Am I right, or am I overlooking something here!??
Great subject Pavlin. Here is my take and experience. I have used both and never had a puncture with tubeless, maybe luck was involved.
I have had many punctures with tubes because 50 years of riding most of my bikes have had them.
I have had blow outs like you described and rode miles with a flat front to get to civilisation.
What I have discovered is the quality of tubes. I always, always use good quality tubes made of rubber not the cheap variety. The cheap tubes tend to split when punctured and deflate fast. Good quality tubes when punctured grip the item causing a puncture and there is more chance of a slower deflation.
Agree!
The vast majority of on-road punctures occur in the rear tire. Not sure why, but the data supports that the rear is most vulnerable. The front wheel is more apt to get a dented rim. So, the natural solution is a tubed front wheel, and tubeless rear wheel, and carry a tube that will work in both the front and the rear, just in case, as well as plugs for the rear. And a pump. And tire irons. And patches. And a cell phone and a credit card.
And....and...
I own two bikes. One tube and the other tubeless. I change my own tires and have fixed flats on both. My kit has what it takes to repair both. I feel it is a skill any serious rider needs to master.
I agree!
I fixed over 100 punctures in a 3 year trip from uk to Cambodia from 2000 to 2003 with tubes in a dominator. I did several over 4500m and its hard work. In all those punctures I never had a dangerous one thankfully. One bent a rim that would have buggered a tubeless. I now have a CRF1100L and paid 2k to go tubeless.
Thanks for sharing!
taking off at high way speed cuz of tyre exploding on front wheel...well, lets just say that changing the tyres is the least of my worries. id go tubeless any second of a day
What i most value in your discussion is you offer options to consider.
What "Works" on a cruser on the hiway with a lot of help options may be a disaster off road in the remote outback
Also you mentioned "Weigh the options for our own situations, type bikes, locations and riding profile
Few of the CZcams experts offer "Options"
Well done
Thanks, Mike!
Yep, saw a video of a guy stranded on his GS in the outback because the tyre came off the rim or he took it off to put a tube in (can't remember),he tried everything to re seat it but couldn't , eventually got a lift to a farmers workshop to put it back on with a big compressor ,the small compressors won't do the job.
I had a similar motorway experience in Switzerland with a tube front wheel that deflated very quickly, and I am alive because the bike went againsy the right hand side guardrail. After that, I only bought tubeless bikes
Thanks for sharing!
Hi mate. As always, an excellent information must needed indeed. In my opinion, either way, tube or tubeless, you GOT TO BE PREPARE! Always been practical in what we carrying. Like n a prior episode, tools are very important, a life saver for you. In the road, even 5 min from your home could happen the same thing 3000 miles away on a trip. Focus in what I need for a typical situation, we are not gonna think on a worst case that put our lives in danger, but anything can happen on the road. In a minimalist mind there is always a solution that will bring you safe and sound to your home or near hostel so you can enjoy a hot cup of coffee and share your experience. Be ready guys
Thanks for taking the time!
Very good information but I would carry a spare tube for tubeless rims depending on where I will be riding. You give a lot of very good information.
Thanks for watching!
A brave topic to cover, given how polarised opinions are on this! Everyone's puncture experience is different, leading to different points of view (often fiercely defended) but the reality is, as you say, that there are pluses and minuses for both. I have tubeless on my road/sports bike, and tubes on my 'adventure bikes'. I am not afraid to repair a tubed tyre at the roadside, even though of course it is far more difficult than a tubeless repair. Usually. No-one likes having to put their gloves back on with black hands, just as no-one likes to be stranded, unable to fix their machine. The less straightforward aspects of this choice are the wide variety of situations any puncture can throw up, in either tubed or tubeless.
A puncture on a motorcycle is a capricious event, and no one solution suits every circumstance.
Tubeless tyres (and one-piece wheels) are usually better made: often 'rounder', better balanced, and suit higher speeds. Lighter and better. But - not in all situations, like the sidewall puncture you mention, or a hole that cannot be repaired with your tubeless repair kit. They are not safe to deflate so much for rougher, muddy or sandy tracks, or creek crossings, and are very difficult to remove (and refit) without a workshop - a bead breaker, high-pressure air, and preferably a fitting machine. Some tubeless rims are very difficult to remove and refit tyres to by hand, with a shallow centre 'well' in the rim form. The front tyre of my (Ducati) road bike a case in point, now on its 27th set of tyres.
It is very difficult to 'break the bead' with the old sidestand trick if you are alone, and your bike only has one wheel on it...
Tubed tyres allow for roadside repair, albeit with some difficulty, without needing the sort of equipment tubeless tyres might. Tubed tyres can be deflated for difficult terrain, and don't need such high pressure to 'pop the bead' onto the rim during a repair. The bead can usually be broken just with your heel. Being the older solution, they are cheaper to produce, making the bike more affordable. I think the decision re tubeless vs. tubed goes further towards tubes, if you have spoked wheels, and the more off-road riding you do.
But there is no doubt that tubeless tyres are better for high-speed road motorcycles. For off-road, not so much. Spoked tubeless 21" front wheels aren't as strong as centre-mounted spokes, and all tubeless spoked wheels are harder to 'true' than conventional spoked wheels. Perhaps that is why the larger Suzuki V-Strom you mentioned has one of each - tubed 21" front, and tubeless rear.
Thanks again for your input on these 'thorny' topics. (Thorny - puncture - my little joke)! 😎
Thanks for sharing your opinion!
Very rational and reasonable. Thank you for posting!
Glad it was helpful!
Seems to me that tubeless tires are the best if you also carry a spare innertube and tyre levers for that 10% emergencie when the tubeless cant be fixed. You should always be covered then!
Agree
I once had a front tube explode on my previous KTM 990 adventure at around 120km/h and I had the "calmness" to immediately sit at the back of the seat to minimize the front contact patch with the road.
That helps a lot.
The tire had been "warning" me in the previous days. It was slowly losing air but I thought I just had to re-air it back until the tube was fixed or changed. I was wrong and ever since I was taught not to assume the most optimistic scenario.
The tire blew in heavy urban traffic (in a main straight) and managed to get to the right lane after passing the middle (I was on the left) but as I was decelerating the front tire got off the rim (probably because I was continuously steering the bike towards the right) and I fell (albeit at a very low speed - around 30-40km/h). Luckily me and the bike came out ok.
P.S. That's why enduro bikes use rim locks. I use them on my 500EXC and even though they make the tire vibrate on the street, it's a piece of mind.
Thanks for sharing!
I prefer a tubless tire, sometimes remounting the tire is more difficult and I have pinched the tube putting the tire back on and had to repeat the removal and patching of the tube. Great video, like you, I am not going to change a wheel to be able to use tubless tires if the motorcycle comes with tubes, but I would much rather patch or plug the tubless tire than to patch a tube.
Thanks for sharing!
This is a great video with a good pragmatic message, thank you Pavlin.
For me, it’s tubeless all the way. I commute on the bike (with some motorway), my travels are on tarmac in reasonably civilised parts. My puncture risk is about 98% nails, screws and other sharps. I can plug those with the repair kit and for the other 2% I’m not too proud to call the tow truck. I’ve also been a bicyclist (gravel, MTB, commuting) year-round my entire life and while tubes there is par for the course I’ve decided to avoid them like the plague for motorcycling. Does it limit my choice in bikes? Yes. But in 2024 with the amount of great bikes out there that might not be a bad thing.
Thanks for sharing!
Ok, I say to you a question like this; If you had to ride all around the mountains of Nepal, Tajikistan, Pakistan, Turkmenistan, India &, you had to ride every road & track & you had to finish otherwise they cut off your hands, what would you use then?
I already done all of these roads on tube tires.
I have a ktm tubeless rim and switched to tube. I find it much easier to change tube on the road and to quickly seat the bead when in the woods. Happy riding.
Thanks for sharing!
You find it easier to change your tube out than plug your tire?
@Matthew-wn8oq yeah, honestly I've had way better luck with it. I think I'm in the minority. Part of it may be I've had the tubeless system fail on me after getting a flat and damaging the spoke gasket, twice. Lol at least I know the tube will always seat the bead again and I find it more reliable. 🤷 if I road less offroad I'd probably prefer the tubeless though.
I only have one bike has go to work, dates, travel and play. I don't have time to find a place to where I can pull my wheel off, take my tire off, and patch a tube. Going to work, no time, on a date no time, tubeless just plug it all good, off road can always put a tube on a tubeless rim and tire if you tear the tire. In 40 years I have never torn a tire though.
Fair enough!
This summer I suffered two flats on the road. Tubeless tires. One I was about to do a field repair to get home. The other I had to have someone pickup the bike as the repair didn't hold. I've practiced changing tires at home and figure I have a better than 50/50 chance of doing it out on the road. Setting the bead on a tubeless tire can be sketchy sometimes -especially without access to a powerful compressor.
As I said pros and cons with both options. Thanks for sharing your experience!
One thing was left out on this otherwise good video: one can air down a tire with tubes much more - down to 0,5 bar if tire locks are installed - then a tubeless tire. That’s a big advantage off road. I once experimented on my R1100GS and could sit down my tubeless tires down to 1,0 bar before I rode the tires off my rim…
Tubeless with a spare tube that fits both wheels - you can ignore the off center hole for the valve - is the best way to go in my opinion on a long trip….Alle the best
Thanks for sharing!
Another great video, thank you and greetings from Lithuania.
Thanks for watching!
I think the 2 different views on tube or tubeless comes from your background in riding, road riders prefer tubeless and more off road prefer tubes.
Tubeless is great until you have a more complicated situation than just a hole from a nail or a screw, a cut in the tread or even worse the sidewall becomes more of an issue or a dented rim.
The easy solution is to just put a tube in that is true but a tubeless tyre is not easy to break the bead of the tyre from the rim and not all that easy to pop back onto the rim, plus you have to carry the tools and spare tubes to do the job , defeating the point of tubeless tyres.
Tube type tyres are easier to break the bead and pop back on the bead and you tend to carry the tools and spare tubes to do the job anyway with a bike with tubed tyres.
If you want a quick easy repair on a tube tyre care a bottle or can of tyre sealant, it has saved me a few times, gets you out of trouble until you can replace the tube.
Great vid mate and I just had to check my KTM rims, luckily the valves are in the center haha. I take tubes as a backup with tubeless tyres.
Good!
I run a mousse on my Enduro, it is not an adventure bike, but man,, no more problems! Go with Tubeless and bring a plug kit and if it is not repairable you can have a spare tube to put in there.
Fair enough!
Thanks for the video . In my opinion tubeless is a best option for me.
Thanks for taking the time! Use whatever is good for you!
For my style of riding now I would prefer to have the new style of spoked tubeless. Being able to use a simple plug to get you home would be a dream for me. I'm just too old to spoon rubbers on my big ADV bike. Doing simple dirt bike tires in my garage is hard enough. I'm not sold on the tubeless conversion kits. If I can ever afford another new bike it will have spoked tubeless rims.
Fair enough!
@@motorcycleadventures your responses are brilliant.
The story you said about the front wheel explosion sounds like a game of chance, too much out of rider's control. Guess I'll stick to cars and bicycles for travelling.
I wonder if the heaviest motorbike flats can be self serviced.
It is what it is!
What is your opinion of the Tubliss system? Downside is that it must be kept up to 100 psi which is maybe not always practical in high altitude, upside is that because it forces the rim out at 100 psi there is much less chance of a rim being distorted in contact with a rock, also tyre runs cooler and lasts longer. They are not technically approved for road use but I think that has more to do with US Department of Transport bureaucracy than reality and there are plenty of people riding with them on bikes like KTM690 etc. The risk "balance" is a personal decision but personally I would take that risk any day over a tube blow out at speed and intend to fit them on my 690 before my next big adventure. What are your thoughts?
I don't have my personal experience with it and I cannot talk. I always prefer to play it safe and have something that it proven.
@@motorcycleadventures Fair enough but they have been in use very successfully for 9 years now so isn't that proven?
There are many bad reports about them as well. As I said, I prefer to reply on what I know.
@@motorcycleadventures Really, can you give me a link to them please.? So far I have only heard positive things so I need to learn the other side.
I cannot! I don't safe everything I read or hear.
I once got a puncture in my front tube on the off ramp off the Autobahn. It was essentially the same situation as yours. The front just exploded like that. It was all luck that I didn't fall on my face. In the corner the front gave away but caught grip again and nearly hade highside. My tube looked similar as well. It had multiple holes
Thanks for sharing!
Always carry tire moose balls when traveling out in the middle of nowhere. Piece of mind 😊
Okay
@@motorcycleadventures I meant I carry them , I wasn't suggesting everyone should. Everyone has their own solutions to getting a flat tire , the only thing worse than a flat in the middle of nowhere is a cracked case in the middle of nowhere.
tubed tires,- carry at least two tubes.- that gives you the chance to not pinch a tube ,- that is easy to do ! ( fix the old one later.} or patch it in case you pinch the new ones. tubeless,- make sure you know how to use the repair kit right .
Thanks for sharing!
I fancy the new Transalp and thinking about it I am not put off by it's tubed spoked rims, looking back at the previous gens of transalp and I owned a 650 before, they all came with tubed spoked wheels and it never even concerned me or crossed my mind.
Thanks for watching!
Prepparation my friends is the key. I put SLIME in all my tyres, tube or tubless, on or off road. Never had a flat tyre or bang. Since now....!!!!
There is always first time.
i have tubeless tyres. i had nail in it. but didn't have repair kit. i used fill air every 100 km at a petrol station and kept right at 80 to 90 kmph. bike felt normal. rode nearly 300 km back home and fixed it at home. 10 minutes plug job. if it was tube you can't do it
Thanks for sharing!
On the fence a bit there Pavlin😅 it was one of the reasons why i never bought a T7, i love tubeless😉
Fair enough!
Pavlin, an excellent video and I can understand why you could not commit to one side of the issue. The subject is in itself open to much debate.
I have owned 04 Tube Type (TT) and 05 Tube Less (TL) bikes from 1992 till date. I have ridden them all over India from Siachen Base Camp till Kanyakumari and Dwarka to Tawang. Fixing punctures during the 90s era on Indian roads was an absolutely must-have skill without which you were stranded, possible for days. And I have fixed my share of them, about 19, if I recall correctly. 15 of them on the TT bikes, 04 on the TL bikes. 02 were on my old Kawasaki RTZ 125 with my wife sitting by my side sipping tea from a flask while chatting with me and handing me tools.
Also, all my motorcycling friends have TT or TL or both types of bikes, depending on their uses. Some ride highly modified KTM 39 Advs with TT wheels on technical trails while others ride the same bikes on highways and soft trails while still others ride only on highways. Their experiences enrich and educate me immensely.
The one common thread binding all three types of riders is this: if you are a careful, sensible and informed rider, who does lots of advance prep before riding whatever type of terrain it si that you do, the single most dangerous enemy of TL wheels, namely the rim bend, will almost never, ever happen to you. And the strongest supporting view of this came from a hardcore trails rider who rides his KTM 390 Adv over the most demanding terrain; some of his photos looked like the goat or ibex paths in NatGeo documentaries. He has bent one rim one doing an especially ambitious rutted section and after a jump, the front rim got bent and the tire went flat. After that, he was extra careful about this aspect; the hassle of putting in a tube and limping to the service station to get a new rim was for him, simply not worth the pleasure gained from that adrenaline-fuelled rush over such sections.
During my last Gujarat and Rajasthan ride in March this year, I had a small puncture in the rear of my KTM 390 Adv. Minor air loss but I don't ride with the bike injured in this way so halted by the wayside. Coincidentally, there was a Royal Enfield 350 owner who had halted near me with an identical issue. I saw him struggle with the tools - rear wheel bolt spanners, tyre levers, soapy water to check the exact location of the puncture, the adhesive pads, the gum paste and most importantly, the removal and fitment of the wheel and the tyre and tube and back again in reverse. And he was looking longingly at me finishing my job in 15 minutes and getting ready to ride. Of course, I helped him so he saved a lot of time and sweat and blood pressure.
This and some similar experiences in the past fortified my decision to have only TL tyres on any bike that I will own and ride in remore areas. Yes, I carry a 19 inch tube for dire emergencies and I am lucky that it has never been used.
Do write about your experiences in repairing your T7 TT punctures😀
Thanks for sharing!
Tubeless spoked wheels with a kit and a pump or co2 inflators
Can tubed tyres heat up the inner tube and then it fails? That’s what I was told, so tubed tyres and long fast tarmac journeys are not the best mix - this type of journey suits tubeless?
If you ride very fast yes.
Hi. If i csn give You my advice. Keep the front tube but to prezent front tyre air escaping so fast just seal the spokes with 3D boat silicone. I did that and its much slower loosing air that way.
Ok thanks!
The BIGGEST Disadvantage of Tube type tyre is that it can Explode at any Moment at High speed.... On the Streets I have seen many Fatal Accident of Riders Exploding their Front Tires.... Whereas Tubeless tyres Never Explode....Leave All the other Reasons aside, this is the biggest disadvantage of a tubetype tyre.... & now I am actually afraid of riding on A tube type tire
I agree about the safety.
Just my 2 cents from experience in altitude. Got a flat in Bolivia at 4500 meters, I had one of these compressors that work with the bike's batter, that saved my ass that day as I had no spare tubes with me. I agree with you that there's no "better" option, tubeless is easier and faster to repair I will only say that.
Thanks for sharing!
I carry tubes and the tools to change them, never needed them yet.
You will.
I just bought tuneless after. Repairing a pancture on tube tyre 6 time in one week...
Good!
To me it's very simple thing. Riding in even semi normal conditions, hands down the tubeless. Flat repair is so simple and here's the thing for me. Fast. You can pop normal cheapo fix in within 10 minutes easily and continue riding. Many claim that you tubeless patched tires are dangerous but imo that's bs. Of course one shouldn't ride like 200kmh anymore, that's for sure. Then there's the tube model. It has its use, but to me it's only on heavy conditions like actual Enduro riding where risk of rubbing rim against rocks, twigs etc. happens easily. But I absolutely hate patching them, cause it's always tire off the rim. Tedious patching, couldn't imagine how annoying that would be in rain for instance. Almost impossible. Another thing is that what I've experienced tube tire failures, it's not enough to repair the inner tube. You also usually need to try ti find the damage in the tire too or failure will usually happen soon after again. I'm not BMW guy, but I gotta hand them that their solution about spoked tires while being tubeless is absolutely great idea. Looking how spokes are in them, it's evident that it is very hard to damage rim at its edge cause of the location of spokes. Brilliant idea. All in all. "normal usage" tubeless is by far the best choice.
Fair enough!
My tiger 800 is tubeless so i carry a spare tube and three patches all different sizes and glue them to the inside of the tube and then insert the tube, the patches stop the tube seeping through the hole in the tyre.
Thanks for sharing!
I ride a sidecar, have had it for 34 years, I run tubes in the front tyre, I had the tubeless front tyre lose pressure in a left had bend (sidecar on the left), so the front was under load, it popped off the rim and I flipped the sidecar at 90km/hr. I survived with a broken back, broken lung and fractured ribs. I recovered and still ride, I've raced classic bikes and vintage motocross, I still ride the sidecar hard, mostly solo, and it is either sliding or in the air when in the mountains, I use a lot of body movement to transfer weight and it had very heavy stearing, requires a lot of strength, but is immense fun to ride. My choice is to run a tube in the front, I have had flats since the crash, but never anything as dramatic. Without the sidecar, I would probably not use tubes.
Thanks for sharing your experience!
I can understand why a tubeless tyre on a sidecar would not be ideal as the cornering forces on the tyre are completely different to a solo, and would tend to roll the tyre off the rim.
Your story of the occasion of your unwillingness to believe an inconvenient truth is something I recognise so well. In motorcycling and in life too.
If you say so...
Cycling quite fast yesterday behind a white car, I looked down for a few seconds then, looking up slightly, my eyes captured a big, white freshly painted ‘20 MPH’ on the road’s surface and, in that moment, what passes for my brain, remembering what it’s like to cycle into a stationary vehicle, processed it as the white car, stopped. My heart almost leapt out of my chest. Such are the games our minds play with us.
I always use wheels that can carry a tube on long trips. Where I'm from, that's a deliberate choice to carry an extra set of underwear instead of a tube. Wheel damage is a different topic. I was surprised to find out some bikes have "soft" rims and their forums recommend changing for rough terrain.
Right on
Tubes and rim locks. Spoke wheels, too. If an alloy wheel breaks, in most areas you are just out of luck. Almost any spoked wheel can be repaired by straightening spokes to get back to a shop.
Fair enough!
Prefer tubeless but always carry spare tubes and a way to repair. Remote locations require preparation.
Good!
The mtb world is a couple of steps ahead of the motorcycle world regarding this topic.
For long distance adventure riding it is a must to ride tubed, but here is the kicker, you need to add tire sealant inside the tube. You'll never have a flat again unless you punch a crater into the tire.
For motocross or racing tubeless is a must since the tire dynamics will change from tubed to tubeless (better grip with a tubeless configuration)
What kind of Tyre Sealers? Do you have a brand?
Well, you are politician indeed. After my experience with tube and tubeless tires I can surely say: I prefer tubeless tires definitely. If you catch flat tire in most of cases it is easy to repair without disassembling the wheel with very light and small fixing kit. If shit happens in most of cases air pressure is dropping very slowly and you are able to look for gas station or garage. One of the main reasons that I have changed my Africa Twin to Africa Twin AS was tubeless tires. I had enough of that to carry two spare tubes, spoons, patches, air pump and other such stuff. Weight always matter. Do you remember?
Fair enough!
Thanks for the valuable information
Any time!
Great video Pavlin, indeed it is a very divisive subject and the great thing about it is that there is no right or wrong choice, it comes down to personal preferences and risk evaluation. I am surprised that after your experience you still ride on tubes though lol. I am aware of the pros and cons of both and for my kind of motorcycle usage and travel style (moderate off road at times) my choice is tubeless all the time. A possible solution for motorcycles with tubes would be to convert at least the front rim (there are several kits on the market) to tubeless and carry a repair kit plus front and rear tubes.
Thanks for taking the time!
So, Goldilocks, how do you like your porridge?
I made my F800GS Adv tubeless and already rode 30.000km without any problem!
Good to hear!
I have had many punctures with tubless tyres! Realy easy to plug sith a small kit without getting the wheel off the bike! Also I had some reinforced tyres that I could run at about 50 Km/h even flat! Now I have tubes and always carry 2spare tubes! I also run sealant in the tubes! Also i had a bent steel rim that i hit with a hammer and it was ok!
Thanks for sharing!
Last summer I was riding my KTM 390 Adv and hit a pothole while going too fast and dented my rim. It broke the bead and flattened the tire. The people I was with helped me put a tube in and I was back on the road. I carry both kits with me now just in case.
Thanks for sharing!
I do a lot of solo riding. I just order tubeless rims for my tenere700. I got a flat the other day and had to tow my bike to my house. I decided to learn how to change the tire at house. I ordered the eastbound service kit but was not able to break the bead with it so I was like fak it. Tubless rims it is. I don't want to change a tire in 100 degree California heat somewhere with no shade or on a freezing cold day or in the dark. The tubeless wheels were $2k but it's totally worth the money.
Fair enough!
I can fix a tubeless tire most of the time. I can't fix a tubed tire most of the time. Tubeless it is.
Fair enough!
A difficult choice. I have a 22model 1290. Yes the valve is offset. It would be good if manufacturers made provision for a tube valve in a tubeless rim. An air tight plug could be removed if a tube needed to be fitted.?
It is what it is Christopher!
Hi Pavlin
Take a look at Bike Seal puncture prevention system 500.
I’ve had it in my 2016 A/ Twin tubes for 3/4 years.
No issues with centrifugal force, balance or anything as some may argue.
Also had tyres replaced, no issues.
I like to think it might work for a straightforward puncture.
Cheers Barry. UK.🏍
I will check it out.
Was thinking the same, Slime type product.
I have 3 bikes - BMW K1200R, Honda CBR 1000F, and Triumph Trophy 1200. They are heavy high-speed machines, and without doubt, Tubeless is the way to go. However, if I had a lighter bike and went off-road, I would consider tubes.
In your case tubeless is a must.
What is that black big part on the wall?
I have gone “political” and down the split tube “ghetto” method. A tube is cut open around it’s circumference and spread out so that the tyre can be mounted on top of it before the excess tube is sliced off. The tube is then doing it’s normal job of keeping the bottom of the chamber from leaking air out through spoke nipples and valve hole while acting as a seal between rim and tyre bead. It has been four months now and several hundred miles with no air lost from my Honda CT125’s wheels. I do however carry a spare tube in case damage cannot be plugged. Many YT videos, especially from Asia where the practice is very common - they also sometimes add a home brew sealant of baking soda and water!!
Thanks for sharing!
Hey, I lived in the UK for many years. Have bought GS1200 Adventure on the tubeless tires. Two weeks after the purchase I got a nail in the tire. The tire was almost new but now had a hole in it.
Guess what .. the tubeless repair kits are banned in the UK - apparently they are unsafe. The BMW said I have to buy whole new rear tire..
Hmmm, never heard this before, interesting!
Certain types of repair kits are dangerous. The basic cord type is pretty safe as it requires only a small repair hole.
I'm in the UK & I've never heard this🤔 sticky rope plugs are okay I'm fairly sure.
Tubeless for me, and I don't ever want to go back to tube-type. Sooooo much easier to simply plug a tire rather than removing it, and pulling out the tube to repair it.
I was really tempted by the new V-Strom 800DE, but the tube-type tires are a deal breaker for me. I'll stick with my V-Strom 1000 for now.
Pros and cons always!
besides higherway vs offroad, there is also the question of availability of spare parts
for example here in Algeria you can find parts for yamaha and BMW bikes easily in the north of the country, but only chinese bikes rule here in the south (sahara), also contrary to many believes, most chinese bikes here have cast wheels (tubeless), spokes are only on dual sport bikes (which are a minority)
i saw sunless tires with spoked wheels on some yamaha 660cc bike here but it's a rare sight
Thanks for sharing!
Tea ready let's go !!
Cool!
I've ran tubeless tires/wheels pretty much of 40 years now. I've had tube tires along the way. Currently my Tenere T700 is tube type but I have new tubeless wheels for it. I've had flats on both types. I carry tubes just in case a hole is too great to properly patch. Life in the middle of no where is like that. Be prepared for the situation. Motorcycling is a very marginal sport. When Pavlin was at 5000 meters in the cold snow and ice low oxygen he was on the fringe of life. Same for the desert heat. You do what you have to. Be ready, be safe. Motion Pro Bead Breakers/tire irons. Cycle Pump air compressor from Aerostich, Best patch/plug inserts you can get. Yeap, glue that works in cold.
Thanks for sharing, Sam!
Sam, I would be interested in knowing what your tubeless rims for the T7 are. TIA.
@@johnstaring3210 Hann hubs/wheels with Excel rims. ordered thru Off-The -Road in Germany. Much more affordable than Woody's Wheels in USA I believe 1.85 in. x21 frt, 4.25x18 in rear
I started using lube on my dirtbike like you do with musses, this eliminated pinch flats but remember I do have a rim lock it makes a difference! for long distances I don't know if I would make same thing with my tube on my f800gsa.
Thanks for video as usual.
Thanks for sharing!
I have tubeless on my bike. But have for backup a spare tube that i can place if i can't repar my tire or bend a rim.
Good!
I have motorcycle with tubeless for the freeway and if I do Dirt I have a verys 300 with tube and heavy duty Tubes they thiker
Good!
This is very wise information!
Thanks, man!
I would like tubes and fill Slime tire sealant in it. Also carry spare tubes with me
Ok
Tubeless with moose.. in my day tire moose was a self sealing foam injected into the tire or tube.. now they're a foam rubber tube like rubber band inside the air filled tubeless tire.. it's what ALL the Pari Dakar bikers use for 20 odd years now.. tubeless because.. you never get an exploding blowout AND 99% of the punctures are easily & quickly fixed with a plug.. no worries in dirty conditions & bead seating or sealing
Moose is not an option for road riding.
So can you put a tube in a tubeless tyre on a tubed rim, without any reduction in speed rating for the tyre or worry about the inner tube getting too hot? Are modern tubeless able to take a tube? Or is there a safety issue? I ask as on the Africa twin forum lots use tubeless on the base model, with a tube! But research I've done suggest that tubed tyres are made different....they have a very smooth inner so there's no rubbing, friction....heat to the inner tube! Should I worry putting a tubeless on a tubed rim?