S4 E19. We test custom engine controls on the AMR500 supercharged diesel Honda insight.
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- čas přidán 25. 05. 2024
- Season 4 Episode 19. Jimbo test the custom built electronic engine controls on the 719 cc supercharged Kubota diesel engine in the Honda Insight. Along the way ,Jimbo encounters problems and tries tweaking the software on the Arduino UNO he is using to run the engine controls. Will a code change fix the problem, tune in and find out.
Robot Cantina
207 S. Sedgwick Ave
P.O. Box 28
Haven KS, 67543 - Auta a dopravní prostředky
I'm on vacation visiting my octogenarian parents, Dad says "Whatcha watching?"
"There's a madman in Kansas who's swapped a compact tractor diesel engine into a first gen Insight."
Dad: "Oh, cool! Turn it up."
He’s one of us!
I like you guys. My dad is in his 60s and while I thought this kind of stuff is right up his alley, he didn't seem too interested. I'm glad you get to share it with your pop 😎
Fuel economy - yes please.
Do you thing you can get it to 100+ mpg?
I helped my Dad pick up a yacht today, beautiful little wooden thing, hand built by the owner with *His* dad 30 odd years ago. He's to old to sail her, just wants her to a good home (although Dad paid 2x his asking price, and it still was a bargin). Turns out we all followed some of the same CZcams channels. not Robot Cantina unfortunately, but I thought It pretty cool 3 guys in their 80's, 60's n 30's were all on the same page. I think he was pretty pleased his tub was going to a good place. I almost felt we were driving off with his daughter...
When you are the one doing your own programming, I don't think it's Orwellian. Let's see a performance setting and a fuel sipper setting! Awesome work, Jimbo!
Agreed.
I third the simple 1-3 settings.
Same if they release the source code
Fuel sipper? It's already running in the 3 L / 100km territory...
@zoe..d I bet he could squeez a couple more mpg out of it. Why not?
I need a compilation of every time Jimbo lets out a disappointed "Hmmm..."
May do that.... Hmmm
HAHAHAHAHA 👍
Yes! Push the limits of fuel efficiency
Personally, I’d like to see all of the capabilities of this neat little car tested.
Happy Memorial Day weekend all you Cantina nerds.
Same to you my friend
🤓
I'm absolutely interested in fuel economy results; it's a different kind of high performance and frankly the kind of performance this vehicle was designed to provide. But I'm along for whatever ride you take, Jimbo.
Agreed 👍🏾 fuel economy is also a performance challenge
As a big fan of knobs that make more power when you turn them……I approve! 🤣
I have a turbo boost button in both my 7th gen Accord and my first-gen Insight.
It's the button that turns the AC off. :D
@@IstasPumaNevada yep, I have a 99 f350 with the 7.3 powerstroke. My knob takes it from stock up to 400ish horse. Gotta love turbo noises!
@@IstasPumaNevada I had a Saturn that I did the same thing🤣 ac off when you’re passing!
Wow, that storm was nasty. Glad you are safe, Jimbo.
I like having an eco button when I'm broke at the end of the month.
Regular Drive mode around town.
And Sport mode when I need a little extra.
Lol idk why , but I feel this deeply and it made me bust out laughing when I read it 😅.. peace and love
Im on eco mode right now....lol
@@will7its i been on eco mode for a couple years now...
@@Dratchev241 Yeah, 😆I hear you.....
I just drive a manual. You have to watch your mood to change your driving mode.
I would definitely love to see you maximize fuel efficiency
mode-switch: Performance/Efficiency sounds like an amazing feature to have!
Put a button that says "maximum overdrive" 😂😂😂
I had a real chuckle at the end because Usagi Electric released a video titled "Software Problems? Hardware Solutions!" simultaneously with this one.
Knowing you had a bad storm and survived it has eased my withdrawal symptoms. Glad you're okay and you're back with another episode. It's really been fun living vicariously through you and these projects.😁
“I prefer not to rely on a software fix to correct a hardware problem.” As an embedded systems firmware developer, that is 90% of my job! 😂 We already have 1000 of those bad PCAs, fix it in firmware!
LOL, When I said that, I originally flashed a picture of a Boeing 737MAX... My brother convinced me to edit out the picture of the airplane.
@@robotcantina8957 Don't worry it would have been removed by a recently implimented CZcams AI program that would have then labled your account as "racist".
@@WalkiTalki LOL.... its scary, but probably true.
Embedded hardware engineer here. I'm always amazed at how the software team misuse hardware features that were added to make the software easier/more efficient/feature rich. 😂
👍 for chosing not to fix hardware problems in software 😂
Jimbo, Memorial Day weekend, and tall cup of Joe.
Let the Sunday, commence.
Lol I was 41th to see this 😁 Greetings from Hungary (metric world)
Greetings!
Fantastic video. I’ve been programming for 30 years and I always get a little thrill when I can make a tiny change in my code that has a significant effect in the “real world”. Computers were intended to make our lives easier, after all!
I rewire guitars and basses for friends (and occasional customers). CTS is the brand name potentiometers used by Fender, Gibson, Rickenbacker as OEM on older units, and current "custom shop" and high end versions of their products. The company has been around since they were "Chicago Telephone Service" and are an aerospace supplier these days, that still makes potentiometers as part of their catalog. They make what's called 'A' (audio curve) and "B' ( linear curve) potentiometers in all standard resistances. Audio has a curve stacked more towards the upper half of the curve for volume and tone applications, because you aren't looking down at the controls on a guitar when you dial in a specific value. Linear tends to be used in applications that require more "precision" control.
Their 1/4 inch shaft "American Spec" has been an industry standard since tubes were cutting edge technology. I replace the smaller "mini pots" used on lower level instruments to save money because of their higher quality of manufacture, and better feel and precise control.
At $5-10 (US) they're a nice upgrade when you value precision.
Anyways, Happy Memorial Day.
The pots I'm using were salvaged from some high end industrial equipment. They are the linear type.
Bravo on your success!! While the extra week wait was sad, the end results was well worth the wait. Your technical explanation and graphics of how all this kit fits together is top notch. Please keep going to see how far you can push this experiment. Its always “good TV” watching how things develop in your workshop (the good, the bad and the ugly). Well done getting your gnomes, with their cardboard aided design kit, geting everything to fit. You may need to give them a bit more on screen time as compensation for their assistance behind the scenes.
I was concerned that the IAC valve would not have enough strength to fight against fuel rail pressures, but I think in this configuration its only adjusting the governor stop, not actually adjusting/fighting fuel rail pressures (but that’s just a guess). So this should work just fine for a governor stop as you have proven.
Of course the enginenerd in me is wondering about NOx levels in the exhaust, or is that even important for fuel economy testing on a budget (I understand not the focus of this project, but it might be useful as you search for “mo pow-wa”)? For on the cheap, a rolling coal test, should also give you a feel of how well the combustion is working. I know I’ve seen in the past a NOx sensor that had a CAN buss interface for an arduino (with code examples) but I can’t seem to find it at the moment. It might be an interesting value to know down the road if the project ever shifts to squeezing every bit of mpg out of that little engine.
I’m always looking forward to next weeks sunday morning adventures...
The gizmo is both a hard stopping point for the rack and it can push the rack back when required. At some point in the video I do mention that I was able to adjust the position of the rack when the accelerator was floored. The IAC motor seems to have enough power to push back on the rack and overrule the governor.
That's some pretty impressive engineering there mister. Talk about fine tuning.
Seeing all the storm-felled wood makes me think of a future project; fuelling a car with woodgas, sure it's been done many times, but everyone's take on it is often very different... :D
Happy Memorial Day Jimbo, family and to us viewers. It is coming along great Jimbo. I am glad your safe through those storms. I look forward to next week. To answer the question, yes a video on making the mpg the highest you can would be great. Thank you Jimbo.
Thanks 👍
Excellent! Keep it up! Nothing like more data! The goals are performance on acceleration, top speed, and NO rolling coal. We're getting there.
I still love the way this engine pulses as it runs. LOL IN some of the shots, it looks like a heart pumping. :)
You just keep banging it out of the park. Great videos for sure. Have a blessed week.
Thanks, you too!
Amazing knowledge... Can't wait for this baby to go 0-60
Fingers crossed!
OOooo more technical stepper programming stuff. great video brother!
I like how you keep the vids short and get us just the right amount of info ,and i know how much time you are actually spending you are dedicated my friend .thanks again and have a good memorial day!
That storm looked like it caused a lot of havoc! Glad you guys are fine and your home is fine. Still absolutely loving this series. I’d love to have the extra money to be able to send you a forged crank for that kubota diesel but I’m only a custodian that gets VA pay with a chunky house payment. If I won the lotto I’d for sure send you anything I can to keep this content going. Love your work you are a man of brilliance with this project.
Thanks!
Jimbo should do a road trip with the insight. That would be a cool video.
Once we get it sorted out that's the plan.
Power tour!
The most important part of engineering, nap taking. Following in a close second is math.
LOL, so true!
You can't invent and design great things when you are tired.
Honda Engineers: "Write that down"
I agree, I had a Civic with an IAC that was not electric. It had a wax pellet inside. When cold the pellet shrank and when hot expanded to block the idle passage. I am pretty sure Honda engineers can't write.
Being from the north east, stay safe out there in tornado alley
I would actually love to see this car tuned for fuel economy. It would be really interesting to be able to switch the car from a tune made for max power and a tune made for max fuel economy/city driveability. Loving the homebrew electrical engine control. Feels like there are so many interesting possibilities. And in such an interesting car to boot. Keep up the good work.
Aspects such as fuel efficiency are important. I also like the thought of something to clean the air, & I want to share the concept I have been curious about real quick. Running the exhaust gasses through water to remove deposits. I know it contaminates the water but it can run through several containers in series & any that lose all their water can have the Resin? physically taken out via a quick canister exchange. Any way, something I might work on in the future. "The person who sees the work is the one best suited to do the work"- The Ringing Cedars of Russia
I enjoy seeing the creativity that goes into these custom projects here, so thank you for following your thought & sharing!
@11:42 A cartoon? GREAT!!! I was born in 19 and 50. Back then Parents were more about discipline than they were about instruction. I got most of my practical life instruction ... from cartoons. Since I mostly watched Bugs Bunny and the Road Runner, I think you know what I learned. Well, I am now 73 and I made it this far. I guess the cartoons worked!
Don't buy ACME products or get on the wrong side of talking rabbits. Seems like good life advice to me.
@@nerd1000ify Don't forget ... gravity doesn't work until you look down.
Yep, keep pushing the limits. You're doing great
You dont understand the smile on my face each time I see a new video dropped, this guy consistently puts out interesting videos and keep me from skipping through. Keep doing what you love!
As far as adventures go, just be glad you're still in Kansas.
And your little gnomes too.
It was worth the wait! Thanks for not rushing out a video. Not sure what I learned but I KNOW I learned something. 😂 I always feel smarter after watching a Robot Cantina video. Phil
I'm always interested in fuel economy in case one finds themself in a full on Mad Max scenario! Sorry to hear about the storm Jimbo.
Im usually here sooner, but I had to bust up some rock this morning. Wouldn't miss this for anything though.
I'm loving the content. I used to love to "tinker" with things back in my younger days. Making something work is one thing, making it work right is better. Glad I found your channel to come along for the ride (so to speak).
Happy you all survived the storms!
I really enjoy the electronic side of this project. I especially like putting a little bit of electronics on old school diesel engines to keep the tree huggers off our backs. I like rolling coal on occasion, but every stop light gets a little old and makes people want to take away your vehicle and give you an electric car. Thanks Again for the Videos, Jimbo. I hope you and your family had a good Memorial Day Weekend.
You are a part of my Sunday morning Coffee every week. Keep it up and thanks for the interesting videos.
Drinkin' mine and watchin' right now 😂
Good to see the diesel insight coming along nicely.
Wooo! Happy memorial day! Beautiful build and thanks for bringing it to us, i look forward to watching the video with my momster, a joint, and w sandwich
Yes ...... push the limits. No donuts . That ended badly. G
The main thing is as long as Jim is happy with the progress and still having fun along the way, while introducing more technology and headaches. If it becomes a drag getting around electronic set backs then it's time to give it up.
Personally seeing a beautifully simple and elegant mechanical diesel engine improve performance without getting complicated or covered in sub systems and extra layers of complexity is where the fun lies with such a project. If the electronics don't bring significant benefits then they are not worth the time, money and hassle involved.
Please absolutely experiment with the limits of fuel efficiency. While it isn't your goal, it is a significant part of what attracted me to watching these videos and I'd love to see how far you can go.
Absolutely you should push the limits of fuel efficiency! And while you're writing that code, don't forget to include the part that detects if the car is having an emissions check and cleans up the exhaust as much as possible. 😁
Gotta love a propf of concept. Sorry you gotta rip the front end of the Insight apart, Jimbo.
Go for all three: economy, ultimate top speed AND power for passing.
That's the plan!
Sometimes an experiment forces you two steps backward to go four steps forward.
Nice, waited all weekend for this.
I am a nerd for efficiency and power. You could do a couple IF statements based on throttle input and can have the best of both worlds 😊
That's the idea!
149k subscribers! Less than 1,000 to 150k. Congrats Jimbo! This channel has earned every one of these views by being top notch back in the 2,500 subscriber days.
Thanks!
Yes Jimbo! Next step, closed loop control:
* MAP sensor and PID control the boost pressure.
* Smog meter on the exhaust to PID control the fuel rack control.
😂
I definitely would love to see more content on the software side of things and how you can tune this engine with your code. It would be cool to see a button on the dash for fuel economy mode and for efficiency mode and superpower mode or something like that. Most casual viewers watching this video. Drive a modern car that's completely computer controlled and to see somebody with a software background make their own code from the bottom up is really cool. Love this build so far!
On a channel chasing speed it's hard to celebrate going slow. But the test was about dropping power, and that was a success, now on to MORE POWER!!
Yes to the fuel economy software! Personally it be hard to rest knowing better numbers were possible but i didn't do it
Man your showing the organic birth of manual into electronically governed engines through practical thinking and basic built upon skills. I’ll always say that you do what fascinates you and I’ll watch it. But I would also love for you to have both a power “Sport Mode” and “Eco” mode through testing and clever software to drive economically but kick her into race mode and surprise someone lol.
This is the most fascinating episode yet Jimbo. I can't actually believe I was pissed off when the dual carb on the Renault was put on the backburner for winter. It's now a case of, "What Renault?" I couldn't care less about it.
Richard Holdener 'aint got nothing on this channel.
Glad you and yours are safe Jimbo, Summer storms get nasty our way too.
14:50 - add a couple switches to pick mode, fuel efficiency, city mode, maximum power, weird mode, etc.
So he's basically building an ECM. :)
A very simple one. This old school diesel engine has a fully mechanical injection system and we can tweak it a little bit with the electronic controls.
I am sorry you had to endure the bad weather. I am glad you are okay. My husband and I watch your videos first thing on Sunday mornings. I hope you have a great Memorial Day!
Gale banks approves.
Putting a little diesel engine in a car or truck is something I've been wanting to do my life! Love your channel I've learned a lot
Thanks, good to have ya back after your power problems, We appreciate ya Jimbo.
You could track the gas peddle position. In the 1st 1/2 the range or so, you can make it do economy. If you push past some limit it can go for power. You can then add an extra return spring so that the gas peddle gets harder to push when you pass the boundary. This way, everyone is happy.
Thanks for the videos. 👍 i missed you last week 😢.
For what it's worth I support the idea of taking the microcontroller augmented Kubota powered Insight into the the mysterious world of even higher MPG. To me, augmenting mechanical systems with microcontrollers is a rich vein for low cost, high fun tinkering/car modification.
Many years ago I built an analogue electronics gizmo to initiate and then modulate water injection flow on a turbocharged car based on a 5 psi pressure switch and a positive temperature coefficient (PTC) temperature sensor in the inlet manifold. IIRC it had proportional and integral control action and it worked very well. We were even able to prove on a university engine dyno that this approach was optimal for metering the water on a sensibly tuned turbocharged engine. The only problem was that the penalty for over-injecting water was so small as to be hard to measure. Implementing that same functionality on something like an Arduino would be so much easier than what we did, but Arduino technology didn't exist at that time.
Jimbo I think you can have the best of both worlds, push the limits of fuel efficiency and performance. Basically create two tunes and flip between them with a sport mode button.
That was actually a great improvement. Proving a concept requires a lot trial and error steps. This is going to work eventually. I wouldn't be surprised if the Big Three engineers are not watching this series to see how they can design a small engine they can then optimize using the same tools you are using. Imagine a car being commercially designed to operate with the efficiency you are currently testing.
Love this, great production too!
The poor car is also doing all this in thick hot and humid air. This is a game changer in many aspects, it adds a lot of complications, that are taken care of here very well.
I love this stuff. Thanks for the funky projects
Good R & D work Jimbo.
Keep up the good work 😎
Another great video, keep them coming sir
Your videos rock! Thank you sir
Great video. I'm with you on the loss of power last week. We missed the cell that went through Greenfield IA, by about 5 miles. It tore up a lot of electrical infrastructure so it took a few days of hard work by our local electric Cooperative to get things back to working.
Happy memorial day weekend to you all and I'm glad you made it through the storm!
Absolutely awesome episode mr jimbo
😊 thanks for another great Sunday
Thanks jimbo! Always appreciate you.
I am impressed. Your videos and experiments are really super!!
Thanks for the video! Glad you survived the storm! 👍🏼👍🏼
Glad you are safe man!
Thank you for taking your time with all of the obstacles! Life happens. Great video and we look forward to the next one!
You really are pushing the envelope Jimbo. I hope they clear your town of the fallen trees soon.
As far as sensors go, maybe you could mount some sort of magnetic encoder (like an AS5600) to the stepper motor to control it in closed loop, this would absolve you from having to count steps and would eliminate any error that comes from doing it
The software keeps track of the steps so no need for a feedback device. The IAC motors I'm using provide a decent amount of torque with the leadscrew. Also, there is Zero room for anything else.
@@robotcantina8957 Fair enough. It's really turning out great
This is exciting.
Push the limits
I honestly can't wait for the next video because it's gonna be 4/20 ❤
there's no limit switch on the stepper motor so if you move the idle air control stepper and power cycle it won't know that it's not at 0. You should do what printers do and on startup, run the gizmo all the way out to its max or min travel until it hits the end stop and then just jog it over to the correct position from there.
That's exactly what my software does. On power up, it retracts the motor until it stalls and that sets the Zero position. From that point it I count the steps the motor moves. keeping track of the motor steps is how I know where the motor is at all times. When I changed the code, it upset the ratio between the knob and the stepper motor and now I'm sending the motor more steps than it can actually move. this pushes the motor beyond its calibrated range.
I have had three IAC's exceed travel on my GTPs. Can't say if it was a difference in manufacturing or if I used the wrong IACs. The lead screw can pop out just enough not to retract. They still function after finger pressing the screw back in.
@@robotcantina8957Ohhh gotcha. Thanks for the reply. Loving the series and looking forward to seeing more from the Renault v twin.
Awesome work, Jimbo! The IAC has a total throw of about 3/8”. Converted to metric, that’s 9.5mm. Divided by 256 steps, end to end, is roughly 0.04mm per step. This number might help you in calibrating the software side of things. I think it’s worth pursuing the fuel economy side of things, because it’ll demonstrate that there’s no such thing as the mythical “100 mpg carburetor”. You’ve got the lightest and most aerodynamic car commonly available, with a really efficient small diesel. This car probably has a chance of being one of the most fuel efficient ICE cars to ever exist, at least at steady-state highway speed. How about some sort of accurate, inline, fuel flow meter, that the Arduino could read in real time? Real time MPG readings. 👍
A long time ago when I did a bunch of tech stuff on busses we used in line flow meters. In order to measure the flow properly you need to use a positive displacement flow meter and they tend to be very expensive.
Well done, its very impressive in your skills. You should be proud