I think the "Hi-Wall" was JMB's very first hit. I'm still in awe of how one mind could conceive so many incredible innovations. Rifles, shotguns, pistols, machine guns, he did it all. Successive generations of firearms designers stand on his shoulders.
The word "genius" barely does John Browning justice. Looking at the whole of his work, from this simple falling block to the .45 ACP and the BAR, we are even more amazed.
BC thank you for the 1885 Winchester review and detailed look at the action it helps a lot to see how the early guns work and you explained it well. Some of us are just learning this stuff and the history. Bill
I picked up one of these today at a great price. Mine looks similar but has the crescent steel butt plate and tang. There is also a Browning tang site installed on it. I can't wait to shoot it. Thanks for your video.
The Winchester 1885 is such a beautiful gun! The gentleman's gun The Marksman that only needs one shot! I think everybody should be that way. Thanks great video
I owned a hi-wall 1885 in 219 Donalson Wasp with a bull barrel and a set trigger that could shoot one hole five shot groups. I was young and inexperienced, didn't know that it was a collectors piece and let it go for a song in 1961. Still crying!
Congratulations! It's a great rifle and really nice to shoot. I have some friends that use the high wall to hunt and also target shoot. I'll ask them what their experience has been on effective range. I imagine with a nice, high-quality 45-70 hunting load you can do pretty well. Obviously the trajectory won't be as flat as some other current popular cartridges. I'll let you know what I find out. If anyone else has good info, please feel free to post.
These are the fourth iteration of John Browning's design, the first being his original batch of rifles made in Utah before the patent was acquired by Winchester. The second iteration was the redesign by Winchester engineers to facilitate manufacturing at scale... and the changes were improvements to the original design. The third iteration occurred during the development of a takedown version where the leaf springs were replaced by coil springs and were no longer attached to the barrel. The fourth iteration happened at Miroku to again facilitate mass production using modern machining technology, and also to make the design more resistant to accidental discharge if the user's thumb slipped while lowering the hammer. Browning went to Miroku for the same reason they went to FN in the early days... they needed high quality manufacturing and craftsmanship at a lower price than their current situation (Western Europe, before that the US). The Japanese-made firearms (the Citori, the 1885, etc., are as good or better than anything that came out from FN up until the turn of the century) and today they make world-class firearms. Certainly the repro 52s were better made than their Winchester progenitors. The 1885 High Wall and Low Wall rifles of today are the best ever made by Browning or Winchester... only the custom Meacham and perhaps the CSA/Sharps rifles are better made, yet they don't have the latest improvements in the design (they are true to the Winchester 2nd-gen guns). I have several and love them as fine mechanical items and good shooters, too... more accurate than, say, my Ruger #1s.
That 2nd category of modern .45-70 rifles can handle the hot handloads and +P factory ammo and take down the big game. In the third category, are the really blazing handloads that only the Ruger No1 and 3 AND the 1885 hi-wall can withstand. So the old .45-70 can wear a multitude of hats that take it from being a modest whitetail "brush" rifle to taking the African Big Five. Of course, the .45-70 is a strictly short-range cartridge.
I finally found someone who makes a stainless steal picatinny rail for these . murphy precision . and a good price too ..anybody looking for one check him out . Cameron is a awesome guy !!!
Nice! I'd love to have a single-shot .22. Do you have a video of the Low Wall on your channel? I'll have to take another look through. I'd love to see it! Almost bought one of the pint-sized sharps reproductions at the last Dallas gun show. I'm kicking myself for not picking it up since I never see them. It had beautiful case coloring which is rare on repros and it was at a reasonable price.
I dug up Brian Pearce's Nov 1999 G&A article wherein he states that the .ever-versatile 45-70 can be thought of as three different cartridges depending on the power level. The standard factory loads which have historically been kept mild in view of the "trapdoor" Springfields and other old rifles still floating around. Then the post-1972 Marlin 1895s (which the author credits with kicking off the .45-70 revival), current 1886 Winchesters, Browning 1886 repros and Shiloh Sharps repros.
It is a heavy rifle in general as it has a heavy octagonal barrel. To me it feels heavy but well-balanced. I don't feel the muzzle pulling the front sight down. The balance seems to be perfectly placed at the forend stock about halfway down the rifle. After a while of holding it though, you do get the feeling it's muzzle heavy. I think that's just muscle fatigue though since when you first pick it up it balances perfectly to me.
The 405 grains is a representation of the 45 caliber bullet's weight. The 70 grains denotes the blackpowder charge (the second number in the classic 45-70 name from 1873 or so). Sounds like they were shooting a classic load in terms of bullet weight and blackpowder charge.
Of course much loading data on the 1873 vintage .45-70 Springfield remains available via gun books, shooting periodicals, and the Internet. This historical, venerable, and versatile military caliber continues in use practically 140 years after it's development at Frankford Arsenal in Philadelphia, Pa. Two other 1873 caliber also remain in use today: both the .45 Colt and .44-40 Winchester. The .50-70 Springfield preceded the .45-70 and was officially adopted in 1866 via the U.S. Army.
Update to 2022. Continuing on my comment above. Yes.....the .45-70 Springfield, especially when loaded in a modern reproduction rifle like this Browning Model 1885 above, can still be utilized today in the 21st century for hunting North American big game in the lower 48 states, Alaska, and Canada. Examples would be deer, elk, moose, caribou, buffalo (bison) and even bear. Especially in black timber where shots are limited to say less than 150 yards. Even today in the 21st century there is still a place for historic single shot rifles, though the above of course in a modern reproduction of it's historical 19th century predecessor. Being built of modern high strength steels and vastly improved metallurgy, this is superior to an original in regards to strength, safety, and durability. Remember: No substitute exists for accuracy and proper shot placement. It's the first shot that still counts.
Thanks for sharing that. I was wondering the differences of a rolling block vs falling block vs trap door vs high wall vs low wall vs sharps. There are so many terms and understanding what is what. I did not know there was a low wall. I did hear of a high wall but did not know what that ment. Thanks Peace, Reese
yea ive looked around a little bit and they are definitely worth the dollars you put into it.... like they say, your not buying a whatever, your buying a Browning... thats the one gun i would be willing to pay that much for without a question...
I just purchased an 1885 High Wall from a room mate. This seems to be a pretty solid rifle. Does anyone have any info on external ballistics and effective ranges? I'm thinking this might be an interesting addition to my hunting gear. Any info and guidance will be greatly appreciated.
there is a video of these guys shooting 1000yrds with target sights....... they used 405 grain bullet with 70 grains of black powder.... i dont know what that means, but it can definitely reach out there.
Thanks! It doesn't have the classic set screws that you could add a tang/vernier sight. It does have a more modern set up for a scope though. You can see the screws at the top of the receiver.
My b-78 had the curved metal buttplate and it would bruise your shoulder with the lightest loads. With no way to put on a pad I found a nice piece of wood on gunbroker, with a cheekpad, filled the hole with #9 shot, put a limbsaver on it, stretched another one over that, and went shooting. I freebored it and shoot 300 gr barnes solid spitzers. I only seat the bullet about 1/8 in the case on top of a huge load of H-4198. It will easily punch holes in the steel buffalo out at 1,000 yds. I got a lee 500 gr. spitzer mold, and am going to shoot them gas checked, at about 1300, so I don't shoot up the range targets.
As this rifle is not imported to the UK, I bought the Uberti replica instead. It's almost as pretty, but lacks a few of the features found on this rifle. Sadly, the Browning version is spoilt by all the crappy rollmarks on each side of that otherwise lovely barrel.
With so any changes from the tried and tested original 1885 Winchester, I am surprised that they can call it an 1885, the lack of a top tang is a bad omission ,what can you attach your aperature sight too?
It's attached at the underside of the stock. Makes for a clean look. I haven't noticed any problems and I've fired some stout 45-70 rounds through it. The fit is still tight as new.
oh i guess that messed up my comment.... i meant, i dont know what that means in the conversation... i know that 45-70 means... i probably could have worded that better
John M. Browning was granted the patent on this rifle on October 7th, 1879. He had designed it originally a year earlier in 1878. This Browning Model 1885 .45-70 single shot is better than the originals produced by Winchester from 1885 to 1920. They are fabricated of modern high strength steels, and may have superior fit, finish, and quality. Ideal for hunting elk, moose, and bear in timber, including buffalo. This and the Ruger No. 1 single-shot remain the premier modern .45-70's.
I finally found someone who makes a stainless steal picatinny rail for these . murphy precision . and a good price too ..anybody looking for one check him out . Cameron is a awesome guy !!!
I own one of these rifles. They are a work of art.
I think the "Hi-Wall" was JMB's very first hit. I'm still in awe of how one mind could conceive so many incredible innovations. Rifles, shotguns, pistols, machine guns, he did it all. Successive generations of firearms designers stand on his shoulders.
The word "genius" barely does John Browning justice. Looking at the whole of his work, from this simple falling block to the .45 ACP and the BAR, we are even more amazed.
BC thank you for the 1885 Winchester review and detailed look at the action it helps a lot to see how the early guns work and you explained it well. Some of us are just learning this stuff and the history. Bill
Great comments! I love the .45-70 cartridge and all of JMB's designs. He was a truly amazing man and firearms pioneer/engineer.
I own an 1885 Browning that was made in the 1980s. It is a beauty to look at and a joy to shoot.
I own several 45-70 rifles but this rifle is at the top of my wish list.
I picked up one of these today at a great price. Mine looks similar but has the crescent steel butt plate and tang. There is also a Browning tang site installed on it. I can't wait to shoot it. Thanks for your video.
That is a very beautiful gun. I have never seen the mechanics on this gun. It was very interesting on how it worked. Thanks for the great video. :)
Very nice. Great video. I don’t think anyone else has a video on this.
The Winchester 1885 is such a beautiful gun! The gentleman's gun The Marksman that only needs one shot! I think everybody should be that way. Thanks great video
I owned a hi-wall 1885 in 219 Donalson Wasp with a bull barrel and a set trigger that could shoot one hole five shot groups. I was young and inexperienced, didn't know that it was a collectors piece and let it go for a song in 1961. Still crying!
Thanks! I appreciate the kind comment =) It is a fantastic rifle to shoot!
Beautiful rifle. The 1885 high wall is on my bucket list. The Miroku Japan made rifles are outstanding. John Browning was a true genius.
You are really killing me with these videos. :)
Congratulations! It's a great rifle and really nice to shoot. I have some friends that use the high wall to hunt and also target shoot. I'll ask them what their experience has been on effective range. I imagine with a nice, high-quality 45-70 hunting load you can do pretty well. Obviously the trajectory won't be as flat as some other current popular cartridges. I'll let you know what I find out. If anyone else has good info, please feel free to post.
These are the fourth iteration of John Browning's design, the first being his original batch of rifles made in Utah before the patent was acquired by Winchester. The second iteration was the redesign by Winchester engineers to facilitate manufacturing at scale... and the changes were improvements to the original design. The third iteration occurred during the development of a takedown version where the leaf springs were replaced by coil springs and were no longer attached to the barrel. The fourth iteration happened at Miroku to again facilitate mass production using modern machining technology, and also to make the design more resistant to accidental discharge if the user's thumb slipped while lowering the hammer.
Browning went to Miroku for the same reason they went to FN in the early days... they needed high quality manufacturing and craftsmanship at a lower price than their current situation (Western Europe, before that the US). The Japanese-made firearms (the Citori, the 1885, etc., are as good or better than anything that came out from FN up until the turn of the century) and today they make world-class firearms. Certainly the repro 52s were better made than their Winchester progenitors. The 1885 High Wall and Low Wall rifles of today are the best ever made by Browning or Winchester... only the custom Meacham and perhaps the CSA/Sharps rifles are better made, yet they don't have the latest improvements in the design (they are true to the Winchester 2nd-gen guns).
I have several and love them as fine mechanical items and good shooters, too... more accurate than, say, my Ruger #1s.
beautiful rifle!
perfect for what we needed it for
Hi-wall is usually the heavier rounds while low-wall is for smaller calibres . I have a 25/06 Winchester 1885 in hi-wall and a low-wall 1886 in .243 .
Thanks! You can still find these at gun shows. I can't remember the price but I think you can find them under $1500.
Beautiful
Beautiful rifle indeed!
Thanks!
That 2nd category of modern .45-70 rifles can handle the hot handloads and +P factory ammo and take down the big game.
In the third category, are the really blazing handloads that only the Ruger No1 and 3 AND the 1885 hi-wall can withstand. So the old .45-70 can wear a multitude of hats that take it from being a modest whitetail "brush" rifle to taking the African Big Five. Of course, the .45-70 is a strictly short-range cartridge.
that's how guns should be that is absolutely beautiful
Thats is A beauty. I have seen one in 2506
Thanks. That's very useful info.
I finally found someone who makes a stainless steal picatinny rail for these . murphy precision . and a good price too ..anybody looking for one check him out . Cameron is a awesome guy !!!
I love the MADE IN JAPAN on the barrel !
A beautiful rifle
Nice! I'd love to have a single-shot .22. Do you have a video of the Low Wall on your channel? I'll have to take another look through. I'd love to see it! Almost bought one of the pint-sized sharps reproductions at the last Dallas gun show. I'm kicking myself for not picking it up since I never see them. It had beautiful case coloring which is rare on repros and it was at a reasonable price.
I dug up Brian Pearce's Nov 1999 G&A article wherein he states that the .ever-versatile 45-70 can be thought of as three different cartridges depending on the power level. The standard factory loads which have historically been kept mild in view of the "trapdoor" Springfields and other old rifles still floating around. Then the post-1972 Marlin 1895s (which the author credits with kicking off the .45-70 revival), current 1886 Winchesters, Browning 1886 repros and Shiloh Sharps repros.
It is a heavy rifle in general as it has a heavy octagonal barrel. To me it feels heavy but well-balanced. I don't feel the muzzle pulling the front sight down. The balance seems to be perfectly placed at the forend stock about halfway down the rifle. After a while of holding it though, you do get the feeling it's muzzle heavy. I think that's just muscle fatigue though since when you first pick it up it balances perfectly to me.
I have one in 45/70 also its a tac driver and it may be 8lbs but it doesn’t feel it and its skinny like a broomstick feels good in the hand
The 405 grains is a representation of the 45 caliber bullet's weight. The 70 grains denotes the blackpowder charge (the second number in the classic 45-70 name from 1873 or so). Sounds like they were shooting a classic load in terms of bullet weight and blackpowder charge.
Thought the "45" came from the caliber, not the bullet weight
God Bless John Browning. RIP
Of course much loading data on the 1873 vintage .45-70 Springfield remains available via
gun books, shooting periodicals, and the Internet. This historical, venerable, and versatile
military caliber continues in use practically 140 years after it's development at Frankford
Arsenal in Philadelphia, Pa. Two other 1873 caliber also remain in use today: both the .45
Colt and .44-40 Winchester. The .50-70 Springfield preceded the .45-70 and was officially
adopted in 1866 via the U.S. Army.
Update to 2022. Continuing on my comment above. Yes.....the .45-70 Springfield, especially when loaded in a modern reproduction rifle like this Browning
Model 1885 above, can still be utilized today in the 21st century for hunting North American big game in the lower 48 states, Alaska, and Canada. Examples
would be deer, elk, moose, caribou, buffalo (bison) and even bear. Especially in black timber where shots are limited to say less than 150 yards. Even today
in the 21st century there is still a place for historic single shot rifles, though the above of course in a modern reproduction of it's historical 19th century
predecessor. Being built of modern high strength steels and vastly improved metallurgy, this is superior to an original in regards to strength, safety, and
durability. Remember: No substitute exists for accuracy and proper shot placement. It's the first shot that still counts.
Thanks for sharing that. I was wondering the differences of a rolling block vs falling block vs trap door vs high wall vs low wall vs sharps. There are so many terms and understanding what is what. I did not know there was a low wall. I did hear of a high wall but did not know what that ment. Thanks Peace, Reese
please ! It's not a oct tae gon al barrel ! It's pronounced Oc ta gon al. Sandy
makes me want to cry
yea ive looked around a little bit and they are definitely worth the dollars you put into it.... like they say, your not buying a whatever, your buying a Browning... thats the one gun i would be willing to pay that much for without a question...
I just purchased an 1885 High Wall from a room mate. This seems to be a pretty solid rifle. Does anyone have any info on external ballistics and effective ranges? I'm thinking this might be an interesting addition to my hunting gear. Any info and guidance will be greatly appreciated.
there is a video of these guys shooting 1000yrds with target sights....... they used 405 grain bullet with 70 grains of black powder.... i dont know what that means, but it can definitely reach out there.
that is so cool... i want one.. the most i would pay for any gun is 1500... but hopefuly i could get one for under $2000
Is the forend sturdy enough to use a sling support and not make contact with the barrel? Thanks 👍
I have to keep up =)
Nice !
Does the rifle have a tang extending backwards from the receiver?
Thanks.
Thanks! It doesn't have the classic set screws that you could add a tang/vernier sight. It does have a more modern set up for a scope though. You can see the screws at the top of the receiver.
The Winchester version called the traditional hunter does have a tang.
My b-78 had the curved metal buttplate and it would bruise your shoulder with the lightest loads. With no way to put on a pad I found a nice piece of wood on gunbroker, with a cheekpad, filled the hole with #9 shot, put a limbsaver on it, stretched another one over that, and went shooting. I freebored it and shoot 300 gr barnes solid spitzers. I only seat the bullet about 1/8 in the case on top of a huge load of H-4198. It will easily punch holes in the steel buffalo out at 1,000 yds. I got a lee 500 gr. spitzer mold, and am going to shoot them gas checked, at about 1300, so I don't shoot up the range targets.
Very nice!! I haven't taken this out to that long of a distance but it must be a whole lot of fun!
I have the B78 Browning in 22.250.
As this rifle is not imported to the UK, I bought the Uberti replica instead. It's almost as pretty, but lacks a few of the features found on this rifle. Sadly, the Browning version is spoilt by all the crappy rollmarks on each side of that otherwise lovely barrel.
Hello,
Would you say this rifle is too muzzle heavy....would you say it's a well-balanced rifle? Thanks.
I have one just like it in 7mag
With so any changes from the tried and tested original 1885 Winchester, I am surprised that they can call it an 1885, the lack of a top tang is a bad omission ,what can you attach your aperature sight too?
I was thinking the same thing as I watched. I have one of the new 1885's in 405 Win. and wanted to put a tang site on but???
How is the butt stock solidly attached to the receiver without a tang?
Do you think this might be a problem in any way?
Thanks.
It's attached at the underside of the stock. Makes for a clean look. I haven't noticed any problems and I've fired some stout 45-70 rounds through it. The fit is still tight as new.
uribengal I
Are they still making them
oh i guess that messed up my comment.... i meant, i dont know what that means in the conversation... i know that 45-70 means... i probably could have worded that better
seems the comblain rifle
John M. Browning was granted the patent on this rifle on October 7th, 1879. He had designed
it originally a year earlier in 1878. This Browning Model 1885 .45-70 single shot is better than
the originals produced by Winchester from 1885 to 1920. They are fabricated of modern high
strength steels, and may have superior fit, finish, and quality. Ideal for hunting elk, moose,
and bear in timber, including buffalo. This and the Ruger No. 1 single-shot remain the premier
modern .45-70's.
Trigger. ???
I finally found someone who makes a stainless steal picatinny rail for these . murphy precision . and a good price too ..anybody looking for one check him out . Cameron is a awesome guy !!!