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Trouble Reading With Progressive Lenses, Optical Says Everything Is Correct! Let's Talk Lens Design!
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- čas přidán 14. 08. 2024
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This was so helpful, I've had these exact issues and don't wear my glasses as a result. Now I have the knowledge to know what my options are and whether I'm being sold something beneficial for me.
It’s like the Wild West out there! Good luck my friend. I’ll be here if you need any assistance when the time comes! 😎
Still dont understand from this video what we have to do to get more reading area in our progressive lens apart from tilting them down. What should we be looking for in terms lenses that offer more than a pea size reading sweet spot. It is such a struggle.
Think of this more as a "Know there is a better way" video and the information is extremely helpful. A good independent optician can work magic with lenses, the problem is most larger chains and even some independent practices will only offer a handful of lenses, severely limited the possibility of a really good result. That's not how I do things, and have a catalog of thousands of designs I can choos from as bases and fine tune for each person. Those doing this, however, are very far and few between, thus more general terms and recommendations used here.
A year ago I bought a pair of progressive glasses from an online retailer. Sent them back 3 times because the near zone was too low. Each pair got better, but I still had to put adhesive pads on the fixed bridge to raise them up… figured this is what you get going for the cheaper option (not having an in-person specialist fitting the lenses correctly to my face.
This year I decided to get an updated pair of lenses in-person in hopes of fixing this problem, which was mentioned at the time of sale.
I bought varilux xr lenses that cost $700 (a huge jump in price).
I feel like I have the same exact problem. Distance and intermediate fields are great but the near field seems small and very narrow. I feel like I have to hold my phone far away from my face to read. It’s also hard for both eyes to be in the near field zone at the same time(laterally). If I shift my head/eyes so the blurry eye can see the near field clearly, the other eye ends up going out of the zone and becomes blurry.
I’ve been back once and they’ve adjusted the frames to angle the lenses back like you described, now I’m getting some glare on the lenses… I can’t win.
I wish there was a simple solution.
Can the eye dr simply have the near field come raised up?
Should the near field zone on varilux xr lenses be so narrow?
Thanks for the video!!!
The Xr by design prioritizes intermediate and will definitely have a smaller near zone. If the measurements for near position are off everything goes out of wack quickly. I don’t fit these at all because there is less control by the fitter with them. Dumping the near is part of how they make it have less motion issues and peripheral distortion so it’s a mixed bag there. Frame size plays a roll with the variable fit lenses as well, and adjustment can help, but at the end of the day, relying on a computer to design the lenses with no user input will get you here on occasion. It works well for many or most, but when it doesn’t “basically nothing works and nothing we can do”… because that’s how the computer says the lens should be.
I've been wearing progressives for about 5 months now - 1.67 high index. The sphere prescription is -7.5 with a segment height of 28 on a 40 mm height and 50 mm width round frame. The add is 2.25. I've had it re-done twice and still have to pick up the glasses about a 1/2" to read clearly. The optician adjusted the nose pads so that the bridge sat 1/2" above my nose and the top of the frame was 3/4" above my eyebrows. I read clearly but I looked ridiculous so I immediately changed it back. Even if I pick my head up and look down, picking the glasses up results in clearer print. These were done at Costco.
I have another pair - same prescription but done by Target which uses a form of Varilux. The only difference is that these frames are a 53 mm width. My vision is clearer overall (including reading (but I when I pick up the glasses about 1/4", print is clearer). Could this be because Target uses a form of Varilux and Costco uses their own Kirkland process? The last information I can find is from 2021 and Costco seems to use Mitsui Chemicals' MR™ High Refractive Index Ophthalmic Lens.
I'm not a fan of larger frames as I have a narrow face. With a 53 mm width, there's too much space on each side of the frame where you can see through the glasses. I'm considering ordering cheap pairs of distance and reading glasses in a 41 mm round frame, as that fits my face perfectly.
They both use a private label form of the varilux comfort FYI (most all budget lenses today at large chains are either a variation of the varilux comfort or essilor natural, which for all intents and purposes at milder powers that these places restrict to working with are largely the same lens. The difference definitely comes down to fit and lens size here. A truly personalized lens with proper measurements would make a nice difference here and reduce the variation from pair to pair. But cost will be significantly higher than either of those options for a relatively minor improvement depending on just how much that bothers you.
I’ll say your ending paragraph is a glorious solution optically speaking that I think you would enjoy regardless if you’re a very particular user… I think EVERYONE deserves a cheap small pair of SV lenses that in their proper situations significantly outperform most other multipronged solutions out there.
Thank you for the explanation, but it does not make me feel any better. I am on my 4th pair of progressives and must say I am angry at whoever designed these lenses. What a scam it turned out to be. I'm a HUGE reader, but it's been YEARS since I've been able to enjoy reading. First of all, no one through all my eye exams or glasses purchases told me what progressives were or how they worked. For years I have been blaming the optician or the optical places that my glasses weren't right, but now I see the blame lies squarely with the lens designers. And my thought is - how dare they! How dare they make a lens that requres some people to have to buy TWO PAIRS OF GLASSES just to get through the day. I have NOT been able to adjust to progressives and whenever I've complained the optician/doctor/optical place tells me to GET READERS. Oh, so now I have to pay for two pairs of glasses so I can read a book. Artificial Intelligence is now in charge of our vision! Right now I am wearing my glasses from 4 prescriptions ago because they are no line bifocals. My prescription sunglasses are from back them, too and I still wear those. The optical lens manufacturers are scamming us, people! Make a big stink about it!! It's only the squeaky wheel that gets the grease.
I wouldn't say it's a scam as much as it was a move towards "getting away from the line" and making a lot of sacriices to do so... because function be damned in the name of fashion. LOL! It's actually funny because in europe opticians were MUCH slower to adopt the progressive due to it being an inferior optical design!
Great video. Do you have a video to demonstrate how to do that tilt adjustment?
Not yet! Need to fix that!
I kinda wish you threw somebody under the bus. I’ve had the same frames for a few years and went from Lens Crafters to Costco to get replacement lenses. The first pair were awful, they redid them, but I still have to pick up my frames to read. Not at all impressed with how they measure!!! Seems cheesy. Did NOT have to do that with the LensCrafters lenses. So what you say may be quite true, they are using different types of lenses. And the ones at LC seem to be better for my shorter Tiffany frame. Thank you for explaining the different types of lean
I try not to throw people under the bus when I can help it 🤞🏻😂.
i've been wearing progressives for over a decade and i have to say i hate them. i still can't figure out where to look to read and/or use the computer. i have developed neck issues from looking up to use the mid and near portions of the lenses. i have come to a conclusion that some of this is because i am only 4'11'' tall. here is an example: i have to sit significantly lower in desk chair for it to be "ergonomic" therefore i sit much closer to the top of the desk. this is true for everything in my life. my arms are shorter, so i don't read at the same distance as a man who is 6'2''. i can't get an eye professional to even comment on this. would you?
Sorry for the delay! This is actually a really fun one. Very few actually take into account the distance you’re really working at when setting an add power and they just default to 16”. You’re getting much closer than that (and I suspect a pretty small face as we’ll limits your lens size to fit well). A lens design choice can be made to improve some of this, but the power also needs tweaked with this in mind. I would consider addressing the next time you have a refraction that your actual reading distance is very close, show them and make sure they test at this distance. (Opticians can adjust the add power as well for use distance but you’ll find it’s a rare bird that can/will do so). With the proper add power and lens design you’ll be in a whole new world!!
I am a bit concerned because I knew my reading RX needed to increase, so very excited to get my new RX - and new eye glasses (I have been wearing progressive glasses for many years now. Well, the store is a big box store and we have been really happy in the past. However, this time, I picked out a really larger lens (like you said, the styles are getting larger and larger) I had to do exactly what you said- push my brand new eye glasses up to read. The girl at the store told me, because I bought two pair - there is nothing she can do. Her exact words were "Just use your other pair to read" this makes me realize two things- most people must not have my horrible vision- I need to wear my eye glasses 24/7 and my reading RX is worse than my distance. I currently have a phone call out because I am going to return this pair of eye glasses for a full refund and just use the other pair (the smaller lens are fine) Let's hope I get a refund. Eye glasses for me are as important as a wheelchair for a person who has broken legs. I even get excited to finally get a new pair because I need them all the time.
It’s unfortunate but just the way many generic lens designs are calculated today. You can get a larger lens that works and does the job, but never in a variable automatically designed corridor lens (most of what’s available today, all that’s available at big box today). Generally for hyperope it’s more of a problem, but can be a problem for anyone for sure. Good luck with finding a better fit/design 😁
@@ThatGlassesGuy03 how would one know when we try on frames without our Rx in them? My favorite pair are really older ones with a small lens and I'm often told that progressive glasses need more space. If it's my job to know..what do I look for on my Rx and on the frame. I have a small face and was only looking at the width ..i.e. I get 49
Well, the problem is it’s a lens design issue more than a frame chosen issue. A good optician with a big book of lenses can make it work easily. You’ve got the right idea of keeping principles in mind, and bigger isn’t always better. I find a lot of both ends of the spectrum will ramble off “bigger is better” I.e. very green, or very well salted opticians. The rub is, the very salted guys remember lens designs that were fixed and only designed for a 24mm fitting height period. In this example you either fit 24 high or larger or you lost part of the progression (not true today). The very green optician is trained that they use a lens and it figures out what is needed, also not entirely true, as in your case it maximizes the corridor length too far creating more near zone issues than the corridor length provides benefits by being longer (softer, better distance fields, better dispersion of cylinder error induced by the add channel, etc).
Great video! Do you have a video that shows/ demonstrates how to perform that tilt adjustment?
I’ll work on making a short for that specific adjustment soon 😁
I had readers first. Then I got progressive. After wearing progressive for 2 days, I can NOT see out of the readers! Everything is blurry!
Well generally a full proper prescription is going to be much sharper than just off the shelf readers. Makes sense you would get use to that and not be able to see with the incorrect power ;)
I’ve had varifocals and bi focals and they’re great for distance but I can’t read with them on. I have to lift my glasses up. I’ve complained to the optician but they don’t understand what I mean 🤷♀️
Oooph. Time for a new optical shop 🥶. If lined bifocals aren’t even working they’re fit way wrong ☠️
Maybe people pick frames where their pupil is in the center of the lens? Also don’t people have different shoes for different situations? I see no difference with glasses. Maybe a set of glasses for work and a set of glasses for computer/reading. Which btw most people I feel don’t know that there’s a distance difference between reading a book and reading what’s on the computer and they are not the same.
I have the same question as Mandoleen. Hope to see your answer. Thanks!
You can tell by the comments, most of the people on here are people that like to read. The longest comments I have ever seen. I am one of you. Pissed off about how shitty glasses are today and all of the money i spent.
It's a struggle and lots of things to take into account to improve it that just aren't really done across the board so much today :/
Hyperoptic here. Would purchasing smaller frames (not as long) help?
It still comes down to lens design but g generally a more narrow frame with automated lens selection will generate a shorter progressive that *should* achieve this. But it may not.
@@ThatGlassesGuy03 would progressive lens be considered as automated lens? Thanks
I have the opposite problem. I will not even touch a frame is the lens "B" is not at least 40mm. When the channel gets short, the "optical swamp" on the sides gets worse. Ask Laremy-K! He says "never" for a 10mm corridor, & preferably should be 18mm. (Not only is there more astigmatism, but the pupil spans multiple powers on short channel. This causes "trifoil error"). I agree! Been There Done That with a 2.5 add for 25 years. Regarding "sunglasses at the beach", I totally disagree! The sunglass & clear glass should have the SAME curve. Progressives only work if you are willing to "permanently" program the brain, & use them ALL the time. Mixing up curves is the last thing you should do. The ONLY case where progressives don't work for is looking at your own face in the mirror. Your statement about "premium" progressives are spot on! I have had poor results from the most expensive brands. You did not mention "hard" versus "soft" designs (can't even determine what is offered. Can't get "progressive maps" like used to be available). The more expensive ones tend to be "hard", while the cheaper ones "soft". I cast my vote for the "soft"! AO Omni was the best, then discontinued!
Good ole John and I have disagreeing opinions on a few things, this isn't necessarily one of them (I do still use their lenses afterall). But specifically for the hyperopic eye with a limited ability to rotate short is more beneficial than not. 40mm is a good safe spot, but the length of the corridor isn't necessarily related to the B measure. I do also agree the "safe" spot is no less than 10 above pupil center for distance, and a 10-12mm corridor is the "sweet zone" for many (don't get too hung up on that measure though, I'm talking about actual optical progression corridor, not the total design length most refer to here, this number does not include the drop, nor the size of the reading zone).
I avoided hard and soft as a topic largely because the mass of lenses out there today are hybridized designs thanks to freeform surfacing that feature both hard and soft zones to control astigmatic error within the channel, also in reality most of the upper tier lenses (varilux X comes to mind) try to be as soft as possible... and it's great for those with vertigo that want to try out a progressive... but that's about it. :P . Just refit an avid Zeiss Individual 2 wearer with a good ole IOT Endless Steady just this week and he's been absolutely enthralled with the changes. Mind you that's because it was easy to choose a design based on what he didn't like about the Zeiss lenses :) Bonus points because he was mildly hyperopic with a good amount of astigmatism but a thankfully lower add (1.5). Lenses were 36mm B set at 24 high with a shorter corridor lens, taking advantage of and leaning on the camber blanks to control the residual peripheral astigmatic error in a way that offered the most pleasing peripheral experience he's ever had.
Ahh the good ole AO Omni, I've heard many things about it but never got to touch one. A golden era lens in it's own right that swims happily in the older optical circles that most don't even ackowledge... right up there with the eye pleasing magic that was the AO Calobar filter.
I'll save the base curve debate for another day, rest assured.. I disagree for most people. No rule is dead set in this world, as making the brain comfortable matters
@@ThatGlassesGuy03 I used AO Omni for 15 years. I found out about it in a pilots "consumer bulletin equivalent" magazine in the -80's. Was pleased from the beginning. (My trouble started with eyestrain at 10 feet, not reading). The secret of this lens is that instead of making the top half distance with the dividing line horizontal to the "swamp" area. they angled the "swamp" upward on the sides. I never minded the blur on the distance at the sides. This lowered the astigmatism dramatically, & broadened the mid-area. I did need to do something "off the book". I had optician set lens spacing at 62mm, not my 68mm IPD because the channels didn't align. (If you want more scoop on how I determined this, I can tell.) I tried everything when this was discontinued, without success, until I found Enchroma. Their Rx sunglasses were magic in the progressive department. Logo on lens was "RV". Could not find that on progressive identifier (is it IOT?) My plan was to find logo, then get clear pair with same curve. I gave up & use their "indoor lens" for the "clear" pair. Never saw better, despite not needing the color part of these! (I was -3.5 at 30, but have lost all of that & am now +0.5).
@@ThatGlassesGuy03 Okay, so I watched your video and said, "Yes, that's me!" I have to lift my glasses to truly read. I have found progressives to be great for distance, and being out and about in the world, but a total nuisance for near reading/vision. I have told my optician each time about this problem, and they supposedly gave me more distance to get to reading faster. But, it's still a lot of moving my head up and down to find that spot and simply easier to just hold my glasses up to read. That area of my life is just blurry-ish. I have had readers, and computer glasses (Don't get me started on my computer glasses). That said. Please, help me! I would like to find an eye doctor that knows how to properly address this problem. What do I ask or look for before I make an appointment to feel certain I'm going to the right eye doctor? Should I avoid doctors that are affiliated with the big brand lens manufacturers (none of my formers were)? I've tried three eye doctors on my VSP insurance, all owning fancy stores in pretty parts of the city with 5-star yelp reviews. So much for that! And a quick aside, would a Warby Parker Dr. even be able to come close to my needs? I have a feeling I know the answer, but I might be dropping insurance. I would love your advice. Blurrily yours, M.
My Progressives work fine for the distance and for reading but for computers, it's impossible. Very dissappointing.
Narrow intermediate channel is pretty common trade off for large open distance and near zones. Like a pincushion there. If you’re happy with using it everywhere else a specific computer pair that lives at the desk is the “easy” fix :)
@@ThatGlassesGuy03 Sure. I have the feeling that they gave me just a clear intermediate channel. Can't see through it, to the computer at all, even if I move the lenses around a lot and adjust the angle. I bought them on ebay. That could explain it.
Progressives have been a real problem for me to adjust to for a dozen or more years. The swimming effect and the crappy peripheral vision is simply unacceptable to me.
I have a simple, non-frustrating and cost effective solution.
BIFOCALS. No swimming! No crappy peripheral vision! No hunting for the zone. And I can move my eyes and not my head like a bobble-head doll.
100% correct! Good ole line bifocals are still a killer solution! Some newer lens tech is getting there, and what’s funny is we actually saw a push of people wanting lines for the vintage look before COVID. It was a drop in the bucket and short lived unfortunately when the world fell to turmoil 😂
@ThatGlassesGuy03 I wish you were local to me. I certainly have my own opinions, malleable, of course. And I appreciate the learned opinions of those on the other side of the counter. Although I am perhaps in a group often considered a "problem." That means that (besides being very well educated) I'm old, and I have IOLs, but am far from feble of mind or body.
My most concerning problem, of many with progressive lenses, was that I found myself stumbling going up stairs. Going down is frightening. Not so with bifocals in a frame where I can see the ground beneath the frame.
I've had glasses to corret my -5 eyes since I was 6. As such, I got used to seeing microscopic things such as red spider mites on cacti. In college, I would hand spot b&w negatives. I chose single focus IOLs with a reading distance focus; my new eyes are -2 with slight astigmatism. I would miss being near sighted after a lifetime af near sighted hobbies.
I currently have several pairs of spectacles. My first pair post surgery are Ovvo frames (chosen because they seem to be abusable) with Style Mirrors (lie! Gen 8 amethyst with a ruby flash), distance only. Also, I have dark mirrored sunglasses for distance and a really funky tiny round retro looking frame for fun with a custom purple + pink lens. I can remove my glasses to read. All were purchased during covid when most optical shops were afraid of new customers.
At long last, I found one local optical shop that said, "I can get whatever you want. HALLELUJAH! I now have a thick aluminum frame, acetate temples with glass photo-grey bifocals and a 35mm segment set 2mm lower than standard. I wear these the most. They work almost always. The only issue I have is in the grocery store because there is that middle distance that is lacking enough acuity at middle distances. I'm thinking about some task specific progressives for middle (10-12') and close vision, just for shopping. And will soon find a frame and order Corning "Thin and Dark" bifocals to last my lifetime, before glass is absolutely gone forever.
All the "affordable" chain shops and many high-end shops feed their customers a hard sell line of BS. "Nobody makes glass lenses anymore."
Some do.
"We won't sell glass because of liability."
I've had glass lenses for 65 years and never had glass lenses break.
"You won't like bifocals because of the jump."
OK, wrong.
"Glass lenses can't be coated."
Mine are, and every camera lens is coated and have been for a century or more.
"They make you look old."
I am old.
"You'll hate glass photochromic lenses because they change too slowly."
So what, they work.
Then they try to sell indoor tints. Yadda yadda yadda...
There are more old farts than me out there with IOLs, but have found no advice from opticians on-line about fitting us with lenses. But, maybe I'm a weird case. I'm sensitive to chromatic aberration, am very light sensitive and really require a high add for my hobbies, large format photography, jewelry making, and gardening.
@@akahina haha for the record I do remote fittings for anyone anywhere now, and we’ve had incredible success with it 😌. I’ve been doing it off menu through email for years, but feel we’ve got the process fine tuned enough for a full roll out and have the booking page on my website.
I will say, today we do have difficulty finding anyone that will do AR coated glass, just because of the failure rate of current US based glass coating technology (if money is no object Germany is the move but alas going there is off the table for many). You definitely sound like my favorite kind of person to work with, and I would love to make a pair of grocery glasses for you 😌😂. Regardless I’m thrilled you found someone local to knock it out too!! We’ve got some pretty amazing new lens tech in plastics that has shifted my focus away from glass just due to current limitations, but I would never tell anyone we just can’t get it 😂. Caveat with progressives and IOLs. The more advanced the lens. The less it works. Sounds backwards I know, but the short version is the design is calculated for your eye based on the rx supplied, and assumptions are made. The problem is… you have a -5 eye 👁️ not a -2 eye.
@ThatGlassesGuy03 No no! My IOLs have corrected me to -2.25 & -2.
@@akahina correct. Your physical anatomical eye. Is still a -5 eye for lens design calculations in regards to rotational centers, axial length, etc. I wouldn’t expect most opticians to grasp this much less someone not familiar with lens design in the slightest. Don’t worry, it’s just one of those things that every other shop overlooks when choosing lens designs.
I wish I knew about all the different types or Progressive lenses. Just picked up my 1st Progressives., and they are horrible. I think my problem is the tilt. It helps when I did tip them. Omw to LensCrafters to see if they can adjust them.
Anyone here with a hogh prescription and astigmatism, having problems with Lenscrafters Progressives?
Lenscrafters still uses several different types of progressives, and their “best” option is far from terrible. I would say there are definitely some better options for high power with cylinder though. Adjustments are absolutely paramount with that kind of power though, so hopefully they can tweak it and get you sorted 😎
@ThatGlassesGuy03 Just got back, learned I have the next tier under Varilux. They adjusted the arms a bit to make the glasses sit differently but still getting better vision by lifting the physical frame ever so slightly. Any idea why lifting the frame gets better and has different results than just tilting the head? (Speaking specifically at the reading portion of my lenses), but it does slightly improve the distance and mid... please any input is much appreciated. I have to go back tomorrow. They want me to speak to someone more experienced.
P.S. came back to edit, I found out pulling a bit more away from my face improved it too... so possibly needing a prescription change?
They did not do a seperate reading test during my exam. They told me they fill the reading prescription according to age... 🤷♀️
Sounds like you’re more into the prescription than anything here but a bit tough to say with the info I’ve got :) the fact lifting them up physically and pulling them away does it would be the same as changing the power in the lens quite a bit.
With all that said, I’m still lost🙄😵💫
Time for a better optical shop 😜😎🎉🎉
Does the corridor and near zone also contain cyl. if needed, or is it only possible in the distance portion?
Cylinder power is throughout. Fun trivial fact, the progressive channel is created through "unwanted" cylinder power 🙃
By not telling us the manufacturer and lens name or model, you are defeating the usefulness of this video. We need to know which lens to tell the store to order. No, the employees don't necessarily know this - more often that not they don't. They just know what limited info they have been told by the store.
Most stores don't have access to the lenses I do. Find a competent store. Period.
I'm gonna back TGG up on this. The names of the lenses won't help you, since they're super proprietary. If your optician doesn't have an account with the labs that produce them, there's a high likelihood they won't know the lens exists. That's the difference between low- to mid-tier opticals and high-end bespoke opticals.
To use a bad metaphor, it's like going to a Toyota dealership and telling them you want to order a Maybach. They might have heard of the car, but there's no way they can get it.
Too much verbiage and not enough hard fact.
Trying to keep it broad enough and applicable for everyone. The deeper problem is even most opticians don’t get the facts and are left with pseudo white papers that are basically marketing propaganda.
Hard fact, most progressives are designed for broad appeal and adaptability with no regard for users needs and optics.
If you’ve got a specific question you want answered just ask. 😎 unless I’m making lenses for you, me telling you exactly what needs to happen isn’t going to change anything. Better to discuss the principles at play broadly, but I’m always open to more specific questions and topics 😄
So how do I hire you to make my lenses for me? I've had progressives for years and had to do exactly as your stating, the old lift the glasses up so i can better read my computer monitor by looking through a lower part of my lense. But now I went back for a new pair as it was time for a new prescription. I mentioned to them my problem with reading the monitor and they assured me the new prescription would fix it. No it didn't and I told them as soon as I put them on. They gave me the old... can you see out in the parking clearly... "yes", can you read this little piece of paper from your lap... "yes"... but then i held the paper up at monitor height and said "I can't read it now"... And I got the old "try them for a few days and call us back". I will and will tell them the lenses are a piece of crap and didn't address my issue. But my guess is that they won't have a solution because it's the only lense they have to work with based on what you're telling me. So I guess I just have to live with this.@@ThatGlassesGuy03
@oliverotiloppi194 I’ve got a bit of a multipronged process for remote customers to go through so we can get everything just right, but to start out shoot me an email and the prescription and we can discuss from there 😎 - matt@thatglassesguy.net