VKB Gladiator NXT: Standard OR Premium For Star Citizen?
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- čas přidán 17. 04. 2023
- Should you get a VKB Gladiator NXT Standard or Premium joystick for Star Citizen? In this comparison video I show the differences and make a recommendation.
I have been using a righthanded
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I have two VKB Sticks. One EVO and the other is a EVO-upgraded NXT (Gimbal Upgrade Kit). Both are premium. Best Sticks for the buck.
Just a quick tip for keybinding: Set axis and then add functions button for button you feel comfy with and makes sense for you. Only use buttons/functions on the sticks when you are in a fight. Nothing is more frustrating then release your grip to push a keyboard button in the middle of a fight. I recoomend for the first binding: Axis, fire weapons (group 1+2 on same button), afterburner, countermeassures, power triangle, ping, pin/unpin and lock/unlock highlighted target, decoupled and QT-drive. Nothing more in the beginning and slowly add bindings for other shipsystems one by one.
Virpil: Gold Standard
VKB: Silver standard
Thrustmaster: Bronze standard
I’ve had my T16000s for going on 4 years now and love them for what I do… There not the best but there allow you to get in and fly. If your looking to be Space Trucker, Shuttle Pilot, Hotdrop pilot or ex-fill pilot, refueler or anything non combat related the Thristmasters is all you need. If you want to do anything combat related upgraded to VKB or Virpil.
Got to disagree. VKB and Virpil are probably silver standard as they are at the same quality level. There are better products by other companies out there but they are really expensive.
Honestly I would take a logitech 3d pro extreme over a t16000m. The thick spring makes it so much more precise and I've owned both since 2016. The t16000m has a little play in the zero position for comparison.
As for VKB or Virpil. Both are great options with great customer support. Personally I would say a vkb joystick does everything a virpil joystick can do. The only real difference is between their pedal designs. The virpil pedals are far better.
I have to disagree with @Valor - as I have VKB Gladiator NXTs, VKB Gunfighter MK3s, a Virpil Alpha w/WarBRD base and the new Virpil T50CM3 base with Alpha Prime Grip, the VKB Gunfighter MK3 w/ Modern Combat Grip Ultimate shows exactly why VKB comes out on top. When placed next to the Alpha Prime of Virpil, it's very easy to see that Virpil's metal manufacturing techniques are no where near as refined as VKBs. This come from geographical location. They just don't have the same metal manufacturing techniques in Belarus that are available in China. When placed side by side, the Virpil Alpha feels cheaply made and unbalanced compared to the MCG Ultimate from VKB. NOT that Virpil is cheaply made, or even a bad product. They make phenomenal products. But this is like a comparison of Ferrari v. Lamborghini. The versatility of being able to swap out entire hat modules on the MCG Ultimate is also a win, being as Virpil makes you use their configuration and POV hat (which I don't use) while VKB gives you the option to swap things around. And, you have more buttons/hats on the MCG Ultimate. Now, here are two things where Virpil is a bit better imo, even though they don't affect me at all - they have a mouse wheel available on the Alpha/Alpha Prime, and thr big one, the have MATCHING left and right sticks on their metal grip offerings. Where VKB only offers the MCG Ultimate in the right hand format, forcing you to use a Kosmosima Grip (SCG) for the left. For me, it's no big deal, but for alot of people having matching sticks do matter. I'm content to wait for the left hand variant of the MCG Ultimate (if you play Star Citizen, you are definitely good at waiting....). Also, I have to stipulate this is Virpils first iteration of a metal grip. It WILL get better and better each time. So for me the question is, will Virpil catch up before VKB releases that left handed variant of the MCG Ultimate? And lastly, these two companies make amazing products, and really, personal preference, such as size of Grip, etc., will play a huge part of which one you should select. But I clearly think in no way, is VKB considered a Silver standard, and neither is Virpil.
@Simon I think what @Valor was including was the main stream flight/space sim gaming companies, not companies like Northrup Grumman, Lockheed Martin or other companies that build real simulation replicas. I could be wrong though.
An SC dev once said to me that he believes the Kosmosima grip is by far the best grip for 6dof games due to the smaller throw of the stick (smaller movements are required to manoeuvre). The same could be applied to the T16000 but they lack the amount of controls the VKBs have. I had budgeted for the Virpil Alphas but bought the Gladiators based on that advice and I'm super pleased with my purchase.
I have the premium, but I understand the appeal of the standard version. It was a huge dilemma to choose between them.
The thing about the standard is that I remember it cost $120 back when the lackluster T.16000M cost $70. When you compare the amount of features the NXT standard has, its quality and longevity (Thrustmaster products just don't last), then you'll realize the value the NXT standard brings to the table.
As for the "Premium" features, the two-stage trigger is great, I loved the one on the Saitek X52 and I love it here, the mini-joystick can be handy for looking around your cockpit when you don't have TrackIR, but not so much flying and the thumb HAT switch does not feel too great, and is replacing a fine button. When you're in the US, $30 is about right for these, but when you're in Europe, you get charged 40€ extra for these relatively small items, which is what a whole Logitech 3D Extreme Pro used to cost a long time ago, bringing the price to 213€.
Btw. there used to be the Gladiator-K, built on the original Gladiator mkll base which had 13 buttons + a shift button whereas the NXT base only 3 buttons and 2 encoders, thus 7 buttons in total. As someone who doesn't like playing with HOTAS, nor do i have enough room on my desk for it, I really miss those buttons. I tried to purchase the Gladiator K or the conversion kit for a long time, but it was never available so I ended up with an NXT.
I also regret being one of the early adopters. I didn't consider myself to be one back in the day because it had been on sale for at least a couple of months when I ordered mine. The NXT owes its smooth operation to the special grease they use called Nyogel 767a. The first batch produced didn't have it, but in November 2020, people on the forums were reporting their units had this nice dampened feel to them, so it was apparent VKB had started using it. I ordered mine late in November. It arrived in December with a "November" sticker on it, but no dampened feel for me. My unit has the standard junk grease they had been using prviously :(
The award for the absolute worst value in the history of the entire Joystick industry since its conception has to go to the Gladiator NXT to EVO Upgrade Kit. $49 in the US is bad, but €69 in the Europe makes the T.16000M suddenly look like the bargain of the century. All this for a marginally better feel...smh. At that price, I'd expect them to send a technician to upgrade your joystick for you at your home.
I've got premium for left hand for DCS, I don't play SC, but I like the video, reasonably short and focused on controls... an I'm a control freak. Nice analysis.
I have the premium right stick and I just think it's great. It's perfect for the PU in Alpha. I don't want to buy my "forever" sticks until the game is launched. That seems so far off in the future that I'm sure stick tech will be way different then. These really are the best. Also, when you do the setup once, you're good forever even if you get a new rig. I just got a new rig and I didn't have to do the stick setup all over again and that was so great.
Your videos are always awesome. Cheers, homie.
Thanks for the support! Yeah I'm sure by the time the game is officially launched they'll be some even better options on the market!
I agree. I was tired of going through sub $60 sticks every year and didn't want to spend $400+ so I went with the Space Combat version.
Thanks for the comments guys. I've been looking at these. I think I'll be buying today. Your posts pushed me over the line.
So I'm gonna say I'm a Hotas guy! Hosas feels like heavy equipment controls to me at some point might add a yoke and race petals for ground but about to upgrade from Logitech extreme 3d pro single stick to STECS throttle max and gladiator NXT premium so the best use of mini joystick on premium would thing is to look around ship so you can follow target with weapons on gimbals.
Great video, bro. I love the explanation of the two versions of the gladiator; that's exactly what I needed.
The reason I'm looking at VKB is due to the fact that my Thrustmasters simply don't have enough buttons on the sticks themselves. They've got plenty if you're willing to reach down and fiddle around in the dark but I'm looking for readily available buttons, easily accessible during combat. To your point, in the video, if I wanted to fiddle around in the dark, I could just bind that thing to my RGB keyboard. I'm definitely considering the premium, after watching your video. Cheers.
This is the exact setup I have been looking at. So its great to see a practical review. Struggling to find purpose for all the buttons and hats is definitely true. Though personally I would switch out the premium stick hat for the crisp standard four button hat. Easier to not mess up control under stress. Though I use trackir and don't need a free look button.
I use a Premium Left in my HOSAM setup. Swapped out the analog for a standard stick to lessen the chance of activating the wrong thing, having 4 directions on it instead of 8.
But yeah, whether the Premium is worth it depends on the bindings you want on the sticks.
That sounds like a good idea!
I have dual premiums, I probably should post my bindings in case some people like them, but mine are WAY different from his. I have it so that the right hand controls where the ship is looking and associated tasks, and the left hand controls where the ship is going and some associated. Main firing functions are on the right so that I can focus on that hand in combat and sync when I pull the trigger with when my ship is pointing in the correct direction. I can't wait for the new flight mechanics, I'm not a fan of jousting, but that seems to be how most combat encounters in SC go atm.
I have a VKB standard, and love it. Note the Standard can be upgraded to the Premium, through a kit.
I got the premium, both hands. NXT gives you the parts they removed for the upgrade, so you can change your mind later if you want. I really like the ability to program a "shift" button so I can double-up on a lot of the controls.
Loved my NXTs....and love my Gunfighter MK3s even more, and my fiancée now has the NXTs (She keeps eyeing my MK3s though.....damn you VKB!!! Lol)
Cool to hear. I have one left standard. Suppose when I get a right it will be Preem
One of the basic tenets of cockpits: you can never have too many buttons. Anything else is sacrilegious! :D
But on more serious note, thanks for the interesting video. I get questions about joysticks constantly but have not personal experience with VKB products.
Yeah I think 99% of people would agree with you! No problem!
Thank you for this video. i can't wait to get these sticks!
No problem! They are pretty great!
Two standards is plenty I think to map all urgent bindings. Great vid
I've found that I did find bindings for the additional HAT. The additional trigger I found very useful.
The analog mini-stick is a bit less useful, but that perhaps is because I've head tracking - I can see a case for it if you didn't.
Overall, I'm glad I got premium though it isn't necessary - if you have easy access to a keyboard or use voice attack much of it might be a bit redundant.
Ultimately more buttons is better, whenever you don't need to incorporate an Alt button it makes things a tiny bit easier.
Either way is definitely totally viable and they are a great value proposition amongst all the different options.
I have the Premium stick and Omnithrottle usinf BuzzKill/Subliminal bindings and they are great. I did change the Analog Ministicks to the 4 way hats on both.
At least in the US they ship out of China, so delivery does take a week or two.
How do you find the ominthrottle? It looks very interesting! The European store is based in The Netherlands so shipping isn't too bad to the UK. But Brexit has added some hefty import charges.
@@tenpoundfortytwo The omnithrottle is great, comfortable, and the twist axis is up/down instead of left/right for vertical thrusters. IIRC they do sell an upgrade for regular sticks, as well as the quick trigger for the regular stick.
Delivery from China to Philly took only 4 days for me, so I guess it can vary widely.
I have the premium left / right of these and I adore them.
Yep they are pretty great! Big step up over the t16000's!
I have 2 premium sticks for elite dangerous. They work great. Really pleased with VKB.
Just got this one, the throttle one, and pedals. Can't wait!
Very nice! Enjoy!
@@tenpoundfortytwo Will do! You do a wonderful job with these videos! All the best!
Elite V2 with keyboard accessorie is my favorite
your videos are so underrated, you make amazing content. just wanted to say that!
Thanks very much!
At the moment I am running the Trustmaster T16000m dual sticks as that is what the wife got me for a surprise birthday present which I was shocked that she had even thought about it ( I must have been talking about Star Citizen a lot ) so far I am happy with them but looking long term for something better now I have the PC up and running.
I must say Ive been looking at Virpil and VKB . but just getting over the cost of the pc so not for some time LOL
What a great gift! The t16000's are still a good option and a lot better than no sticks!
@@tenpoundfortytwo I even use the bind the are default in SC for them the problem is that some times they switch left to right . now that is a pain in the A
@@Tainted-Soul to avoid inverting create a virtual joystick. the virtual joystick will contain the axes and buttons of both of your joysticks and will be seen by SC as a single joystick. you can find some tutorials on youtube. search as keywords: jostick gremiln vjoy Star Citizen
@@Solar546 thanks I'll have a look
Thanks for doing this comparison.
I got the premiums, but changed out the joystick hat for the regular ones on both sticks. The joystick seems useless for SC. The double trigger is OK. The thumb hat on the stick was, imo, the thing I was paying for. I'd go regulars unless you want to blow 30 bucks for one superior button.
Yeah atm the moment its a bit a of a waste. Maybe could change in the future.
That thumb hat was worth it to me. With 2 modifiers, that's up to 12 actions on that hat, as opposed to just 3 if it were a button. I use it for emotes. 🤷🏿♂️
@@LucidStrike great
No matter, a mounted stick will perform better than non mounted regardless what you’re using. I just found a wooden board and screws from Home Depot and the experience on both thrustmasters and vkbs is twice as good a feeling.
Mount!
I have some mounts on the way!
HOTAS user here. TM TWCS and Premium right. I think I use every button, just not the paddles on the TWCS, but the analog joystick is perfect for thrusting u/d and l/r
I have a t16000m hosas that has orange color not green. I have no idea what is the difference xD. I had them for a few months. So I decided I love hosas. So I ordered 2x constelation alpha prime sticks with 1 twisted axis grip and the best mongus base I could find in the vipril website and adapters and desk mounts. Waiting for them to arrive at beginning of may. A few weeks after I arrive home after a 8 month contract as seaman. Can't wait! Yet I think it will take a lot of time to set it up as hardware and make all key bindings xd . So excited!!!!
Very nice that should be a a great setup! Enjoy!
@@tenpoundfortytwo thank you so much!!! Wonderful videos!
Orange it's the new version
@@Solar546 Ooohhhh so that is the difference. I know I know little of hosas but now I know I know even less xD
Hey, if I am not mistaken, the premium one has some better sensors too except of the buttons.
My understanding it that the EVO bases have been upgraded over the old ones- but I could be wrong!
@@tenpoundfortytwo You are correct. The bases/gimbals have been improved with the EVO line, but the sticks have the same sensors in either premium or base version.
I need you on the Virpils, and please, Hotas And hosas pls.
I'm very happy with me Virpil Alpha Prime HOSAS
I had to make this very choice. Given that the premium sticks are now 40 euros more than the standards, when you're considering buying two this ups the price another good chunk. In the end I bought two standard sticks. Don't get me wrong, I'm very, very happy with them, but every so often I look at them sitting on my desk and think "Jesus Christ, 350 euros for two joysticks. I must be mad!" Over 400 would have been even crazier.
At the end of the day they are worth it to have smooth, reliable axis control with accurate centering and no dead zones. Absolutely essential for precise, accurate and immersive flight, and the standard sticks are just as good as the premiums for that.
In addition, I bought myself a copy of voice attack. All my most essential functions are mapped to my joystick buttons and hats, with many of them being duplicated as voice attack commands. The less essential stuff is taken care of with voice attack and the standard keyboard bindings. I've definitely never felt as if I needed the extra functions from the VKB premium sticks. Of course, if the money is not really an issue for you, then by all means get the premiums.
May i ask, the basis of the stick is it enough in order not to bend left or right when you use it. It seems very narrow base
@@Jimarass The base is mounted to a steel plate (I think it's 3mm thick) so they are quite heavy. These definitely feel like a premium product. Mine have moved sometimes during intense dogfights but it's not something that happens often. They would definitely be best mounted permanently to the desk, but this isn't an option for me.
@@stuartthurstanThank you ! I will go for standard when it becomes available again.
@@stuartthurstan the one I have now Logitech 3d pro has base width 32mm. This VKB seems to have around 18-20 which is worrying
with the cost of shipping them, and the cost of the sticks, you're better off buying the premiums for both. You might not need the buttons, but at some point, you'll say, that would be a good thing to map to my joystick. You'll have the buttons to do it. Alsp. if you want to upgrade to premium, it's more expensive than buying it with the joystick.
Love your work!! And yes you are savvy 😊
It's also my mentality when dealing with star citizen... go all in or go home... so premium it is!!
I tell people if you want a dual stick system and absolutely need to save the $60 then get the standard sticks. They are still better than anything remotely close to them at this price point. BUT if you can afford the extra $60 go ahead and do it. The extra flexibility is worth it. I personally like a thumb stick and find that kind of input more comfortable than some of the other buttons.
One video I would really like to see is a video on weather it would be worth upgrading my VKB base to the Gunfighter base. Reviewers like Noobifier are all hard core in there reviews but I would like to hear some like me who is mostly happy with the VKBs Gladiators opinion on how much improvement the nicer base is?
Yeah the gunfighters look nice! I agree, not many videos about the lower end products.
@@tenpoundfortytwo I am very interested in seeing if it is worth spending the money to upgrade my Gladiators to the Gunfighter base. Looks like the Gunfighter base is out of stock on the website.
Noobifier sounded wildly out of touch in that video, operating on the assumption that literally anyone into $45 Star Citizen would logically be down to spend over $1,000 on sticks. What world he livin' in? 🤦🏿♂️
@@LucidStrike Yes I like Noobifier but He has been in the high end Sims market for a long time. Only using the metal sticks and top of the line equipment. When you are use to that level of Quality it is hard to review a entry level product. His POV is much different than a LOT of people that are just getting into Sims thanks to SC.
Still it is interesting to hear Noobifier Point of view. I learn a lot from his stuff. I though he did a better job with his Gunfigher review. He took the price into consideration much better.
I was thinking Thrustmaster Airbus and someone told me that the twist is twitching so my bro told me that Thrustmaster and Logitech joysticks both sucks. Some told me virpil or vkb. Both are the best. My bro aldo told me that VKB is a better option that will last you a long time. So I agreed to make a decision to buy the Premium and the STECs mostly for MSFS2020, Fighter Anthology and possibly I.may get into DCS. My number thing I would love to do better than any games in the world? Is Blue Angels airshow.
standard is perfectly fine...however the price jump to premium...isnt great value unless you 100% need those extra features
*from a premium owner
This was very helpful. As a new star citizen player, I’m finding your channel very helpful. What would your thoughts be on going with the premium left hand to use as the angled Omni throttle configuration they have and a standard vkb right hand?
Glad the channel is helpful! The omni throttle looks very nice! I suppose it depends on what hand you are more comfortable using for extra buttons? I thought that being right handed it made sense for the extra stuff to be on my right hand- but that's not necessarily the right way to do it.
Yeah I’d prefer two premiums but just trying to save a little. The Omni angled setup is only available on the premium edition.
@davidfrancis2163 ah I see! Yeah I reckon that setup should have you covered!
Good video man ! And nice to see the shout out for BuzZ, he’s a blessing for beginner, I’m always recommending him when People start using sticks.
To address the "just use a keyboard" idea. If you're going to full immersion then you don't want to touch a keyboard once you sit in the pilot seat.
I have two premium sticks and this damned game has so many functions (I use all my bindings)that I've STILL run out of buttons ! :D (Far more comprehensive than Buzzkills. If you want see the lay out DM me and I'll send it over for you to check out.
Yep that's a fair point of view!
How is the purchasing process for VKB in the UK? I've purchased from Virpil a few times (twin Alphas, bases, CM3) and tbh, there's a huge headache with UK customs slapping on 80 odd quid to every item. Made the entire setup very expensive in the end. This was the same pre and post brexit.
Yeah it's a pain. I didn't have to pay anything extra before brexit, but for this stick it was an extra £35ish.
I want these soooo bad.
great content dude
Appreciate it
Also tenpoundfortytwo, with 3.18.1 fixes some of the bugs and 3.18.2 around the corner along with Invictus, I was wondering if you and your group would want to put something together to have a friendly Fleet vs. Fleet? We can do both air and ground if you wanted. If it’s something you’re interested in comment and will see if we can put something together. You can ask your subs if they want to fly with you as well. Just throwing an idea out there. Cheers! 🎊
That sounds like a lot of fun! I've not done anything like that yet so not really set up for it- but I can ask on the discord if people would want to.
Hi there all.
Great vid. Thnx.
How does the weight of these compare to the X52 ?
I don't need the base plate as it's on a stand... but I don't want one that's too heavy... as it may tip my lightweight stand.
Thnx
Same setup here - left Standard, right Premium
Hey Ten, how about Hotas with pedals? I find it much more intuitive
I would love to add pedals at some point, only heard good things!
@@tenpoundfortytwo Just ordered myself a Hotas from Winwing, maybe you should check them out as well. Looks to be very good quality for a great price.
I am wondering if anyone has tried the Gulikit King Kong 2 Pro Controller. The thumbsticks are hall effect so should last a long, long time and it also has a internal gyroscope control input.
If I had one I would set the gyroscope for pitch up/down and roll right/left. The right thumbstick for forward/backward and yaw left/right. The left thumbstick for Strafe up/down/left/right.
Just ordered myself 2 premiums.tired of screwing around with different systems and ending up unsatisfied with them
P R E M I U M all the way.
40€ for a button and a analog stick
Got 1 premium pair with a TWCS
I use every part of my dual premiums. I don't use a keyboard at all once I am flying
That being said, I might swap one analog thumb stick to a hat since I only need one "mouse"
To me it seems like you tried to convince yourself that your one Standard Stick is still enough but everyone who simply opened the advanced keybinds window knows that you want ALL BUTTONS you can get 😅
I would even spend another 7€ to buy the Omni Throttle version, which "saves" another ~40€ compared to buying the OTA separately later.
But seriously, I currently use the Saitek X-55 HOTAS, predecessor of the Logitech X-56 and I like the throttle but it's just a pain to use in space combat, because I had to set 4 strafe axis to a small coolie hat. This also looks ok on paper, but it is not. Sure you can always use the keyboard and at some point you have to, but the point of 2 sticks is to only use it if absolutely necessary, right?
So when I buy the VKBs it will be 1 Premium OTA (left) + 1 Premium (right), not making any more compromises. Saving 2*30€/$ sounds like it's worth thinking about, if you are really short on money, but I am afraid that you would regret it at some point, but maybe that's just me. I save up until I can pay the whole thing. For me the VKBs are already "cheap" High-End sticks, not worth saving even more since you already saved several hundred €/$ not buying the VKB Gunfighter 😉
Thx for making SC + hardware content!
You might be right- I might just be in denial! Your logic makes sense, I think for a lot of people going straight to the premiums (and the Omni) would be the best option.
No problem, happy to make the videos!
cant you just rebind individual keys to match what his buttons are bound to instead of trying to download a scheme? does star citizen not allow you to remind any key to what you want?
That's technically fine advice but no way, I wouldn't give up the analog thumbsticks just to have a mildly less expensive joystick. Sure, you could skip it on one side, but I don't really see the percentage in that.
A good point!
I got one premium and one standard and I don't really play star citizen right now.
Well... I am cheaper than you. I am using one $20 stick. It seems to work fine for me. I am sure I don't know what I am missing, but maybe I am better off not knowing.
I bought two USED T16k sticks one year ago for 65€ and I am waiting for the z axis to broke to buy 2 vkbs, but they do not broke :-)
Does SC provide force feedback?
Seems very clunky compared to the Virpils, but then it might be cheaper than Constellations.
I was taken a back by their shipping costs
I have never heard of buzzkiller, hope he has an x55 set up.
Not sure he does I'm afraid!
Buzzkiller is OG, one of the original content creators from the projects early days.
Premium.