Why You are Still Stuck in Shutdown (and what to do)(SNB209)
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- čas přidán 23. 10. 2023
- You're depressed. You're learning about and applying the Polyvagal Theory with little change to your shutdown state. In this episode, I will share a few things you are doing to keep yourself stuck (unintentionally) and also a couple things you can do about it.
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This and other content produced by Justin Sunseri (“JustinLMFT”) (i.e; podcast, CZcams, Instagram, etc.) is not therapy, not intended to be therapy or be a replacement for therapy. Nothing in this creates or indicates a therapeutic relationship. Please consult with your therapist or seek for one in your area if you are experiencing mental health symptoms. Nothing should be construed to be specific life advice; it is for educational and entertainment purposes only.
Justin Sunseri is a Licensed Marriage & Family Therapist registered in the State of California (99147). - Jak na to + styl
The thing about “feeling” the shutdown is probably why I am in shutdown (hope that makes sense)…..I feel disconnected from my emotional state when I am in shutdown. i suspect it is fear/terror, as I am slowly starting to feel safer in my body, so am feeling a bit of terror.
It's a slow process, best of luck to you.
Me too!
I'm the family scapegoat and after going no contact I have been in fight and flight response for far too long. I spent a year doing EMDR and that got me stuck in freeze response.
I have just found TRE (allowing my body to shake) and it feels good.
Finding safe people is the most difficult task; in a hiper technological connected world, human interaction seems impossible. Btw, being a woman on her own, I only attract covert narcissists and caty busy bodies women.
I like your shirt (I lived in SF).
I am also getting wonderful results from the processes in Peter Levine's Freedom from Pain and Healing Trauma. The pain one addresses physical pain directly, but I've found it powerful for emotional pain too. Both have mp3s of meditations and body instructions.
I have done quite a bit of TRE too; but find Levine's stuff creating different openings into safety that I didn't get with TRE. I think they are all useful; whatever order you find them is your path. Wishing you well.💕
I wouldn't say you attract covert narcissists, saying this is putting you in a victim mindset and not allowing you to have the power to decide resulting in hopelessness. Healing childhood trauma / attachment trauma will keep them away. Also, secure people "attract" narcissists too but they have strong boundaries that makes them end contact with any kind of person that presents red flags whether narcissist or not. Hope this helps.
I found EMDR way too activating for me. Somatic Experiencing works best for me. Like myself, you are probably an anxious attachment style, which will attract avoidants/narcissists. I have zero tolerance for drama, so I exit those situations immediately and I avoid tv, social media, etc.
I like what TRE does for me
Exactly, I can’t even stand myself anymore!
I am stuck not broken... love that stepping stone in my selfcare. You sincerely enlightened me with the way you captured my attention and then brought me even further along by the following insights and I am learning. THANK YOU.
You are so welcome!
Thank you very much for this practical explanation that gives me hope. My mother died a few months ago and I think I'm in a shutdown feeling a lot of fear about everything (story follows state). I've had several sleepless nights over the past few weeks which is very debilitating and makes the world seem that much scarier. I've been going out for morning walks connecting with surroundings and was relieved you mentioned how that could help. I am feeling very numb in these early months of grief.
You're very welcome.
I get stuck with what safety feels like in my body, causes me to stress and resist it more.
Accessing safety is often very odd, uncomfortable, and overwhelming for people who are getting unstuck. It comes up a lot in my community.
I heard that the safety feeling makes us feel vulnerable, which is another form of fright.
@@EvinFox I relate to this comment so much- as soon as I start to feel whole and excited, the terror kicks in and I go back into shutdown. I can’t seem to get out of this cycle unless I’m living isolated and alone, avoiding being around others and creating a life in which I don’t have to rely on anyone at all for my safety. Having walls around me feels like the only way I can manage the cycle.
@@Ninsidhe@EvinFox 100%! I worked with a trauma therapist who helped me understand that states other than our default can feel very unsafe at first. That’s because apparently the nervous system interprets “familiar” as “safe.” So it takes time to unlearn and then create new routes to safety. The good news is, with practice it gets easier. I still find myself in shutdown often, but not always. And I found that when I focused on being nice to myself, instead of beating myself up, that things seemed to get smoother. Go slow, be gentle. Things will unfold.
Whoa. (minute mark 9) I realize I beat myself up no matter how much I did do. Even if it was a lot, I say it should have been more. And that's when I give/do from a place of shutdown or fright. ugh.
I get empowerment from your talk on shutdown - it’s helpful to hear you talk about it in such a normative non-self depreciating fashion. I really like the grounded consistency in your channel here.
I'm so glad! Thanks for the lovely comment.
What if you're not safe. Literally. You're unemployed or homeless, or under constant threats? Is there no way to come out of a shutdown if your body is right and you're not safe?
I don't want to say it's impossible, because it's not. But it would be incredibly difficult, especially if substances are involved.
I think having all of the basic needs being met makes it easier. X good luck x
Coming out of Sleep I go into High Anxiety and confusion about which problems I can handle and what is the proper path forward for me ? 😢
Ashwagandha root extract may help you stay calm.
I feel the same way.
I dont really know how this works, but even you talking about this made me feel so much unfomfortable feelings in my body- anxiety and more... I am just sitting trough this, but this is something very interesting. I feel more connected to my body.
Glad to hear you are feeling more connected to your body! It can be overwhelming when it's new info.
Thank you for pushing through to record this episode to help us. Much appreciated.
My pleasure!
Starting Wing Tsun class finally helped me come out of shutdown into fight mode, in a very safe and friendly environment.
Nice! Happy for you and thanks for the comment!
That's good to hear. If I might suggest, when you feel better/more confident, consider moving to boxing/muay thai/brazilian jiu jitsu. These might help even more, since there's more dynamic contact involved (could make you even more confident, being mildly hit and witnessing nothing special or terrible will actually happen). For the same reason, you need to find a gym where teachers and people are really really sane, chill and friendly!
Thank you for this
No problem 😊
New to this channel. I hope to learn from this channel ❤
I hope so too!
Justin, I believe I am in shutdown but not sure. Would an inability to engage in play be a signal? I used to be a very playful person, loved to play with animals, kids, my friends/partner. Now I cannot play at all. When I try to be playful I just shutdown and I really have to force myself but it feels so difficult. I also now struggle even with conversations/socialising and even eye contact. I was a very social and playful person before. I don’t even feel like a person anymore 😢
Play requires access to both the sympathetic state (flight/fight) and the safety state. In shutdown, one has difficulty with accessing both those states.
I'm really enjoying your videos. I've suspected vagus nerve damage in myself for a few years now but am new to the polyvagal theory. I am currently doing the SSP and working with a therapist. Luckily, I have had very little trauma in my life but I have had some accidental head injuries. Is it possible that damage from the injuries could cause a person to be stuck in shutdown?
I'm finding your videos super educational! I have a few questions, just want to make sure if this is what feels like to be stuck in shutdown mode.
I'm feeling a sort of numbness in my chest and I can't feel the physical reaction to my emotions (emotional numbness) but there's also this physical numbness in my chest who also doesn't let me feel things, doesn't let me feel, like, the rush of cold whenever I'm nervous, anxious, excited or scared. It's like I'm a robot that can't feel anything. I know what I feel in my mind but I can't feel it in my body, it's like there's a lump in my chest and even feeling my own heartbeat is hard sometimes (but everything seems perfectly fine, all my exams were good and there's nothing wrong with it) but this feeling of numbness and emptiness scares me so much, it's so weird. It was triggered by a heavy health anxiety and a fear of having a serious undiagnosed hearth illness that led me to be in this state. Is this what it feels like to be in shutdown?
I am exact same! I remember trying to explain to a friend that when I’m laughing my mind knows it’s funny but I don’t feel it in my chest. So hard to explain but I think you know what I mean. Also triggered by health anxiety, thought I was dying for many months (on reflection I was having a nervous breakdown and in extreme state of panic). All my love thank you for the connection
I've been using a vibration plate to come out of shut down. I've been dealing with pretty serious shut down and I've been passing out a lot over the last few months and was unable to do anything. Using the vibration plate daily has helped a lot and I can be more active. I think it's worth looking into.
Curious about what a “vibration plate” is…I’ve never heard of it.
Hi 👋.... im suffering very bad, from a shut down.
I was a city bus driver for decades,... then, i thought ( like many coworkers) retirement. OMG... it's horrible! And i stressed so hard , trying to get back, ... but wasn't able, and lost my seniority. I lost myself, my structure, purpose, social interaction, identity, etc. I have Anxiety, insomnia,... and horrible depression. I have no desire to do anything or go anywhere. Im just stuck. Unable to want to live.... have you ever heard of this?.. im don't enjoy doing the activities i once loved to. This is horrifying to me.... 🙏
Those symptoms sound like severe depression. I've been there three times and come out of it. Keep persisting and get professional support if you can. I have hope for you.
@@latasha9898 😕 Thank you so much for caring for me... im not handling this very well,.. It really was my life, and now at 62, It's not good because I'm constantly thinking of my coworkers, and my routes,... and my seniority position I gave up... I was so active before!
You have been here before?... Depression?... this is horrible.
You have hope for me🙏... i feel so hopeless,.... and I fear all medications 🥺
@@klanderkal Yes, depression is awful when it's like this. What you are going through is not a small thing. No one can handle severe depression very well. It also sounds like grief. You've lost a big part of your life and identity. Healing will take time. Obviously you're looking up support via CZcams, so you're already reaching out. Maybe there is support in your community. I'm in the UK, I called a crisis line Jan and they put into contact with further support and community groups. Is there any possibility of maintaining contact with co-workers? Maybe management could send out an email to staff to see if anyone would like to create a social event one a month/week etc. The most important thing is that you treat yourself kindly, and when you feel up to it, discover new things that give you joy. Maybe reach out to make new connections, and medical support. You don't need to take medication if you don't want. Talk therapy is supposed to work also. If you can afford it. You could also contact grief organisation.
@latasha9898 🙏Thank you so much for caring for me.. Yes, you're so right , this is very hard to deal with, sever depression ablbd anxiety, and correct- grief.
I'm not handling this well. I was at least going for walks, and trying to go to the gym,... but, now I don't want to walk, and lately , when at gym,... I froze up. I was stuck on a machine, with no desire to live. It's so terrible for me. I'm always afraid, insecure. I don't have a life at all , as before. I miss my job and coworkers... and the whole lifestyle I had. This depression, has stolen my joys other than work. My hobbies, activities, even desires. I don't want to see anyone anymore , because I'm so depressed ., and I look sick now. 174lbs, top physical shape, to 152, frail and weak. My hair turned grey, and my muscles are gone. I was a Champion athlete b4,.. now im just suffering 24/7. I have been calling crisis lines many times, but I'm afraid to commit to anything. I'm getting worse, as now I'm mad at myself for everything that has happened. I ruminate the whole story always, and it's all I talk about. I'm so upset that I actually could have returned!!!!, and didn't have to retire, but I was miss informed, and was told wrong information..... I threw in the towel, when I didn't have to. I have insomnia , it horrible too. I cannot sleep. My anxiety is severe also... and the daily torment of stress is bad. I just Cannot change my thinking, I'm always very down from how Great, happy, healthy, fun life... to no job, extremely unhappy ,un healthy, grief, sorrow, guilt, apathy, self hate, shame remorse... Depression is so horrible. I'm up now, with no want/desire/motivation to do anything. I don't like living. I'm terrified to go through the Antidepressant trails, side effects and having to take such medications for long periods of time ! Scares me... also, I've heard from neighbor, she couldn't get off, the withdrawals were bad. I'm in a catch22. Thank you for such kind words, 🫶. I'm not doing well.... I haven't been getting more than 2 hrs a night. Everyone is I know, are extremely worried for me, and I feel someone is going to call the authorities to step in. My son [22] is frightened to witness his Dad suffering so hard. He's talked with his sister ( attending college, different state)... about taking me in somewhere. I asked them not to do it..... they made me promise to brush teeth/shower and go for daily walks... and they won't. I'm starting to get so frustrated with this life, I'm starting to talk outloud to myself even yell. It's scaring myself., like I'm kookoo. I'm so afraid of my condition, and health. Im afraid to get help, I'm afraid of life moving forward. I don't want to be seen in public,... and I don't like being at home. Thank you for caring about me... I do need help. 🙏🫶💐🥺
@@klanderkal Gosh, that's a lot to deal with. I'm glad you have support. Don't beat yourself up about past decisions. You made it based on the information you had at the time, and not what you know now. In time, that regret will hopefully be replaced by new experiences. I have taken a few different antidepressants. They worked well in lifting my mood, but as I've got older, I get bad headaches as a side effect. Not everyone gets headaches though. I never needed a strong dose, so when coming off, I would taper them down very gradually. That's important because coming off them cold turkey gives these awful brain zaps. I found that tapering them very slowly over 3-4 months works well enough to not notice the effect coming off them. I would end up splitting a 10mg pill into quarters for the last few weeks before taking nothing. I understand your fear though. A friend of mine has grief and depression, and has managed without medication, but it's not a quick fix. She does a lot of walking, swimming and has a dog to keep her busy. There is also a lot of research going into psychedelics because they have been trialled and found to be effective for depression. The UK are on second phase trials. The side effect risks are low. It's a natural form of medication, and in some ways experimental. Maybe there is a trial you could sign up for if you feel it could help. If not though, thats fine also. I'm up for trying it, but my friend is not. It has to be a personal decision. I hope you are able to make that next step for support. Just remember that all the feelings you have are normal for someone with depression. I have a couple of safety phases which I focus on when I feel really low. one is that I know things can turn around and joy returns, because thats happened before. the other is to be kind to myself and accept that some days just need to be written off - I guess thats the topic of this video. Another thought I've recently started using, is to think each day, was today a day worth waking up for? It reminds me that although there are bad days, there are also ones worth getting up for. Grief and trauma take time. If you are kind to yourself and take small steps, they joy should start to creep back into your life. It may take a while, put it will. That is my hope for you. It sounds like you are a person that has worked hard, and deserves to live a joyful life.
I'm trying to leave my body permanently. This is way too tiring.
Me too-
Is being numb to both positive and negative emotions a sign of shutdown?
What is shutdown? How does it feel? Can it be in the body, like not being able to get into first gear?
I have a other videos on shutdown. This one might be helpful - czcams.com/video/3aFDl4Me39Y/video.html&themeRefresh=1
Thank you, it doesn't sound like what I'm going through but your advice was still helpful
Bonjour. Merci pour vos vidéos qui me paraissent intéressantes. Serait-il envisageable de mettre une traduction écrite en français qui permettrait de saisir la complexité de votre propos pour les non anglophones ? Merci à vous.
Bonjour, je ne parviens malheureusement pas à créer quelque chose comme ça. Cependant, chaque vidéo CZcams possède une transcription qui peut être copiée et collée dans une application de traduction. Je ne peux garantir l'exactitude de la traduction ni de la transcription de CZcams. Mais cela pourrait être la meilleure option, du moins à ma connaissance. (J'ai utilisé Google Translate pour cela)
@@JustinLMFT merci. Je ne connaissais pas cette transcription. Ce n'est pas parfait, mais c'est mieux que rien.
I knew this would just be an ad.
You do need to work with another person (preferably a more preferably one) to enhance the level of change & learning required to get unstuck. A lot of this is about humility & grace... relinquishing or ego which keeps our defenses up & in stuck mode.
Wow. You're supposed to be enlightened...and you care about sports? And, you let it affect your emotions?
Enlightened people don't like sports? (And did I claim to be enlightened lol) (and what is "enlightened"?) Damnit this comment might have inspired a whole episode...