A Historian Reacts - What if Theodore Roosevelt won the 1912 election? (WhatIfAltHist)
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- čas přidán 15. 05. 2021
- See the original video here - • What if Teddy Roosevel...
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Odds are he probably doesn’t die in 1919 since he never got ungodly sick on his expedition to the Amazon that he would never have gone on in this timeline
Agreed I think alot people forget that's how he died he probably would have lived at least a decade later
Not really roosevelt was rather overweight he would probably die of a heart attack instead of maleria
@@thequestioner5916 i mean thats not as comparable as the truth of him getting sick from an expedition lol
@@thequestioner5916 Yes he was overweight, but that was not uncommon in his day, nor was wealthy men living to their 70s and 80s. Remember too that TR was an avid outdoorsman and began life as a sickly twig with asthma. He was overweight but active.
@@f1y7rap Muscles under that fat. Thick chest muscles helped stop the bullet of a would be assassin.
You are a rising force in the history community general soon we can March on oversimplified the leader of our corner of the internet
It’s absolutely mind blowing how quickly this channel is growing! Mine only grows about 10-20 subs each day 😅
@@HistoryExplained keep it up I'm sure your channel will grow to.
@Guan Van Der Put Same for Mr Terry.
Can't wait for a silver play button celebration
@@matthewjacques287 I appreciate your encouragement Matthew!
@@HistoryExplained h
I feel the necessary companion video for this is AHH’s video on why Wilson was the worst thing to have happened to American politics.
I hope, if he does, it gets followed by one of the Cynical Historian's videos on Wilson.
Didn't know youtube names could be so f*cking long... good to know
WIIIIILLLLLLSOOOOONNNNNNNNN!!!
Dude your name wtf
Um just American politics let's talk world politics
19:31 Because Teddy lost, he went on an Amazon expedition, I read about it in the book, ‘Theodore Rosevelt’s Darkest Journey’ If I am not mistaken, the toll this expedition caused was what killed him in 1919, if he had won the election this expedition would not have taken place, and we can assume he would not have died.
I think that Theodore Roosevelt’s death in 1919 was acerbated by his ill fated and ill advised trip into the river of doubt in South America which weakened and nearly killed him. So to assume that he would’ve died in 1919 if he became president probably is erroneous
Perhaps but to assume that level of butterfly effect is too much for a 30 minutes video
10:09 TR wanted the US natural resources to be available and used by average Americans. He wanted the average American to be able to enjoy the wilderness for vacation and personal use (hunting). TR was also for using the resources for improving the quality of life for average Americans, but not for the exploitation and degradation of the environment by profiteers.
Hmm, that sounds more plausible and true to TR's character, given what he accomplished by creating the National Parks we have in the US today.
While the democrats want to restrict our rights and freedoms so they can dictate our lives
Love this guy, and it’s no wonder he’s blowing up.
I feel like CZcams’s history community has excellent content, but lacks book-level detail due to the medium. This guy adds that level of detail in the important spots and it’s great.
And generally, they are at risk for being demonitized.
@@memecliparchives2254 That's why some of them create Patreon so that they also got some income outside youtube.
Im from Leicester England and I have to say I’m loving the videos right now - you deserve the 100k subscribers- well done!
If the UK opens up for travel I'll be in Leicester in late July!
@@VloggingThroughHistory Great!! Have you travelled to King Richard iii burial site in the past?
I've never been to the UK. The Richard III stuff is definitely on our list though
@@VloggingThroughHistory Yes, it is definitely worth visiting if you have the chance. Once again congrats on closing in on 100k subscribers. I wish you all the best !!
Also, if you get the chance I recommend visiting the RAF museum in London, it’s unbelievable.
Im an 18 year old from Nigeria and i love your videos bro keep it up
~9:41-10:03 Except, unlike the pro-suffrage Roosevelt, Wilson had to be pressured to allow Women's suffrage; the National Women's Party spent several months picketing outside the White House after he rejected their calls for a constitutional amendment granting suffrage in 1917, and about 150 of them were ultimately arrested for "obstructing traffic" (with many of these women participating in hunger strikes while imprisoned). They then moved their protest to a public park, and continued going 6 days a week until 1919.
The only thing which I think would be hilarious is that if Roosevelt won in 1912, we would've had America being lead through both World Wars by Roosevelts (FDR and Teddy)
But that’s assuming TR pulled the US into WWI
@@Venusupreme TR would have brought the US into WW1, and much earlier. While Wilson was keeping the US neutral, TR was forming "military training camps" in Plattsburgh New York to try to get as many Americans with basic military training and outdoors skills in preparation for joining WW1. TR was also VERY vocal about the US joining WW1 often deriding Wilson.
There might not even be a WW2. Sure, Germany might have started something, or maybe the Soviets/Russia, but it wouldn't be the WW2 that we know
@@Venusupreme He would have pulled us into the war in 1914
@@Venusupreme Theodore Roosevelt wanted us in the war way earlier, it would rather be instead of “does Roosevelt want to” but “can he get Congress to agree.”
So basically, if Theodore Roosevelt had a 2nd/3rdish term, the world would probably be a safer and better place, man I hate Wilson so much more now.
Me too.
false. teddy would of set the US up to be significantly weaker industrially, and the US would not of been the power it was in the 30s and would not of been able to contribute to the war effort in WW2 in the same way. the nazis likely would of won ww2 if teddy won in 1912, the domino effect is real.
@@mattmorrison1408 but you need to consider the fact that nazis would have never gained power (in case they even ever existed in this timeline). As said in the video, there would have probably been a second major global conflict, just not quite like the one we have in our timeline
@@mattmorrison1408 TR believed in the US challenging and surpassing England's Navy. It was TR that pushed for the "Great White Fleet" to sail around the world and display American Power. His push for the US to get into the Sp-Am War was so the US could show it was capable of being a global power and was all for the Monroe Doctrine. If TR was president Hitler wouldn't have been a thing and the Nazi party wouldn't have rose to power. What WOULDN'T have happened is the post WW2 US superpower
@@f1y7rap That’s debatable, another world war is likely but I don’t think we could accurately say what that is and how that would turn out
HOW IS THERE ONLY JUST NOW A MOVIE IN THE WORKS ABOUT THIS MAD LAD?
The greatest quality that you have other than being extremely well informed is that you're very respectful, even to the things or people that you don't like. I watched your video reacting to some weird fact about every president of the US and there was 1 president that you didn't like but you still acted respectfully and even gave a few fun facts as well. Thats really wholesome, keep up the good work
Teddy is the definition of manliness
Agreed. CHAD Mustache too! 😎👍
Not an understatement.
The real question is, who would win in a fight between him and President Jackson?
@@Venusupreme I ques it depends on things. Hand to hand I'd say Teddy. Duel with pistols depends on if Teddy has speach in his pocket or not to slow down the bullet.
@@soturiks Teddy would have won hands down if there were an audience.
The thing that Wilson did was re-segregate the Federal government so while the army was segregated the federal departments were not.
Robin Williams before he passed away did a pretty good Theodore Roosevelt in night of the museum, maybe his voice not so much but it definitely had the statue for it
If you ever want to feel inadequate, read a book about the life of Theodore Roosevelt
Absolutely.
Finally, someone who mentions that East Tennessee was pro Union! I hate it when people lump us in with the rest of Tennessee. We were abolitionists.
Almost at 100k! You’ve educated me better than my teacher!
Love that you have started covering whatifalthist's channel now. Since I've discovered you, I've been hooked on your videos. Keep up the good work, and congratulations on the pending 100k subs. Much love from London, UK!
I just discovered your channel and cannot stop watching! Really great content!
Thank you so much Romysh! Glad you're here.
Can't wait for the 100k stream!
Thanks for your reactions
I know you read every comment or at least try to, so I'm hoping you catch this. Been subbed since you were at like 10k and super happy to see you so close too 100k. I've noticed you like to tend to stick to more modern history which is understandable given you're more knowledgeable about those areas I'm assuming, so to change things up I'd love to see you react to "Rome in 20 minutes" by Arzamas. Fantastic overview video that leaves plenty of room for you to expand on whatever the video talks about that you find interesting, or if you want to look something up to discuss it with us in the video. Nonetheless, much love from Long Island and early congratulations on 100k!
Congrats on the fast growth man! Love your videos
Hello from Michigan! Love the videos. Michigan has a battlefield from the war of 1812 on mackinac island. The fort there is awesome to visit, I recommend it.
It's always nice seeing more stuff about T. Roosevelt. Also can't wait until 100k subs! Thsnks for posting
So, interesting premise to assume that had TR won in 1912, he would have sought and won reelection in 1916, becoming the first 4-term president instead of Cousin Franklin. And, like you, my first reaction was similar to yours in thinking that he would not have lived to the end of a fourth term. But the more I think about it, I almost think that TR actually aged more in his years out of office from 1908-1919 than he would have had he continued serving in the presidency. I think he found those years after leaving office very difficult, and strugged to find something to channel his exceptional energies into afterward. He certainly ended up wrecking his health during his ill-fated trip on the River of Doubt during that time. I also agree that we can't underestimate the effect that Quentin's death had on him, and we can again debate as to whether WWI would have dragged on into 1918, the year Quentin died in combat, had America entered WWI earlier with TR at the helm.
I find it hard to believe that TR would have done nothing but watch as Germany, Austria, Russia, Britain and France stumbled into war.
At any rate, had he been in ill health during his last years in office, we certainly wouldn't have seen Edith Roosevelt assuming his duties for him as another Edith did in 1919!
Good point re. TR not sitting idly by as Europe stumbled into War in 1914. June 28 to Aug 4 gives him time and opportunity to insert himself and the US into The Great Stumble or The Great Sleepwalk.
TR might have inserted himself into the Balkan Wars that preceded WW1. Perhaps his mediation there could have short-circuited WW1.
Love this type of stuff
Love your videos!
Definitely do more Whatifalthist! I absolutely love his channel!
Have you seen any videos for Historia Civilis? Great videos on Roman history and would love to see some reactions to his content. Amazing video on the People of the Longhouse which would go well with your knowledge.
I haven't. I'll check them out.
Getting soooo close to 100k, keep it up
I had to put my girl of 38yrs in a home . Watching videos w/you is like having a friend 🧡 to watch with. So I'm less lonely. God bless you, Sir. Plus your videos are just PURE FUN. KEEP IT GOING, my friend. John from Md.
I’ve been saying for years Teddy Roosevelt deserves a movie about him. What an extraordinary man. He’s the only person to win a Medal of Honor and a Nobel Peace Prize! That sums him up perfectly. Also Thomas-Alexandre Dumas DEFINITELY deserves his “own Hamilton” so to speak.(really the whole Dumas family is amazing)
Do more of whatifalthist videos, he is one of my favorite CZcamsrs
Also, his newer videos are significantly better in terms of quality.
Great video
I think Alternative History has a video about this exact topic too. Wouldn't mind a watch'n compare.
The response to your question about segregation:
I was quite curious myself and looked it up. I know Wikipedia isn't the greatest source but according to it, Woodrow Wilson did not re-segregate it, he just made segregation much worse in the military. For example the Army and Navy gave no commissions to African American officers.
Here is the link:
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woodrow_Wilson_and_race
Honestly.. Wikipedia has only gotten better.. And if you check the editing history and the background on the editors first.. Then you have a hard time going wrong with the pages there.
Considering how great of an American TD was, electing him in any time period would change the change the history of the drastically.
11:34 I believe you're correct, Truman actually lost southern votes to third-party candidate Thurmond because he partially desegregated the military.
Speaking of Theodore Roosevelt, did you ever consider a visit to Buffalo, which is one of the few United States cities that is associated with several US presidents? Millard Fillmore died there, Grover Cleveland was the mayor of Buffalo, William McKinley was shot in Buffalo, and Theodore Roosevelt took office in Buffalo.
Great Video :)
Teddy's monument that was out-front of the NYC Library should be brought back, in my opinion.
WE are about to hit 100k . congrats
Hello! Love the title!
Had to come here in anticipation for tomorrow lmao
US early entry in WW1, doesn't necessary the war might end early. The US army was in poor shape at early year of the war. The German itself won't do unnecessary and costly offensive in the west.
Let’s goo, 100k on the way
I have been a big teddy oh, I mean t r fan since I was a teenager and remembered pondering a slightly different scenario where he did run for re-election in 1908, which would have lead to Taft running against Wilson in 12 and winning in a head-to-head matchup.
Yeah the Russian Empire was rapidly industrialising at the time. A common misconception is that Russia was a backwater at the time but it's not really true as Russia was working hard on catching up with the European powers of the time.
could you react to more whatifalthist videos? it would be very interesting to hear your take on some of those?
Actually, the passing of the amendment allowing a permanent income tax was passed before Wilson took office and had been introduced, passed and became part of the Constitution under the Taft Administration.
Best CZcamsr around 😤😤😤
I'm new so I don't know if this was mentioned... But Wilson made the army more segregated than it was (it had started to integrate), and the navy actually wasn't segregated, he segregated the navy
Are you going to Andersonville when you come to Georgia? Definitely recommend it!
Yes. It's my last stop before I fly home. I have 2 uncles who died there.
@@VloggingThroughHistory my dad was adopted and we have just recently found out who his real mom is. Followed the family tree and he has one who died there as well. We live about 30 minutes from there. His uncle in his adopted family was killed holding the bridge in the battle of Remagen.
Considering his request to be able to serve in WW1, (He actually asked congress, but to no ones surprise Wilson denied.) Roosevelt would have absolutely tried to join it himself, hell I'd go so far as to go in on the first or second wave of U.S troops. No doubt in my mind he'd be campaigning through France.
Love this guy
Normally Politicians who are eager to go to war make me sick but there is one crucial difference in Teddy. warmongering politicians today are fine to run into war, sending out young and best to fight, with no sacrifice on their part but Teddy, when war is on, is the first guy to try and volunteer for the frontlines.
One mistake a lot of people make is to assume that everyone who voted for Roosevelt would've voted for Taft and therefore would've defeated Wilson in 1912. What people don't take into account is that Roosevelt was a progressive and therefore also siphoned votes from Wilson too had it been just Taft and Wilson. Taft had no chance in 1912. It would've been much closer had it been just Taft vs. Wilson but he still would've lost.
21:46
I would actually think that Wilhelm II would abdicate.
You made some excellent points and thoughtful alternates. If we are discussing "what ifs", would you consider doing a video about the other alternate? Roosevelt doesn't run, so Taft wins re-election. Either John Flammang Schrank is successful in his attempt to kill Roosevelt, or he is convinced not to run (more unlikely). What would a second Taft term done for America? What impact would that have on the Supreme Court without Taft as Chief Justice? Or is he appointed regardless (less likely)? Curious.. the twist and fates of small changes.
I know you mostly focus on more on early modern to modern history, but I highly recommend the CZcams Channel "Invicta". Invicta does a lot of great content focusing on mostly the Ancient to Medieval history but also dabbled in other things. The video where he invited a Professor on the U.S. Naval Academy to talk about the Battle of Midway is fantastic.
THANK YOU for getting me more interested in Civil war history.
Turns out there is Medal of Honor Civil War Veteran buried just down the road from me. John C. Gaunt, he captured the Enemy colors in the battle at Franklin Tennessee.
Oh there is also a Captain from the Revolutionary War that was buried even closer to my house then Re-interred here in the Damascus Cemetery.
I live not far from you in Damascus Ohio.
*Sorry about my Grammer, I was walking through the Cemetery whilst typing*
What cemetery is he in? My wife’s great great grandparents lived in Damascus.
@@VloggingThroughHistory
The Damascus Cemetery.
That's really cool.
I grew up just over in Alliance and before that Eastlake. Born in Cleveland.
Damascus will likely be my home for the rest of my life though.
@@Jonnydeerhunter I have a Canfield mailing address but we're technically in the SW corner of Austintown Twp. Grew up in Mineral Ridge.
@@VloggingThroughHistory
Very cool. I figured we lived fairly close.
I'm actually a Pilot and if there is ever somewhere you would like to visit that's somewhere less than 500 miles away, I can probably help to make it a day trip instead of a whole weekend. I'd love to visit some of the battlefields of the Civil War or Revolutionary war myself. Just a thought. Might make for a cool video too haha.
I remember Governor Bob Taft. I am a 90s kid from Ohio and I only learned that he was related to President Taft thanks to you.
please do more videos about the US civil war :)
The only youtuber to make me click on all notifications!
Thank you Danny!
Does that mean the Franklin would have taken over immediately after Teddy left office? So how many consecutive years of Roosevelt presidency? Does that mean that America would not want another Roosevelt in office? Would Teddy have halted progress toward the depression? Without the depression, does Franklin have as successful a presidency as he did? Without the depression, does Europe fall so deep that Germany looks for a hero?
Good stuff, got me thinking deep!
Dang it, I thought this was going to be Cody from AlternateHistoryHub. Please consider covering his stuff too.
Nick Offerman needs to play Teddy. Nice video again.
Honestly, while Wilson started the Presidential power push, nuclear weapons really pushed that towards what we see today
The military was segregated, but the federal government wasn't until Wilson came along. Wilson also opposed women's suffrage.
It was actually Teddy Roosevelt that increased the power of the president. Roosevelt actually invaded Caribbean nations quite a bit. See Roosevelt Corollary.
The treaty of Versailles was fully negotiated by Wilson, it just failed to be ratified.
True re. Wilson. Wilson _was_ sick during the negotiations though. Some suspect that he had contracted "Spanish Flu" (H1N1). This did degrade his performance.
He did make compromises to get his League idea accepted plus he supported self-determination, the break up of AH, and the removal of the German Emperor.
Interestingly, Churchill brings the last point up in his books - he wrote that it would have been better to keep the Kaiser's office, but force William to abdicate in favor of his heir and make Germany into a Constitutional Monarchy (like Britain) instead of the US-styled Weimar Republic. I could see TR favoring this idea.
In my view, any analysis of the Treaty of Versailles needs to include a discussion of the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk, easily the more draconian of the two, and the reaction to it.
In 1914, Russia surpassed the US in the rate of industrialization. The French loans rapidly spread the railroads and the military-industrial complex including a substantial navy. Russia would have remained a net exporter of wheat in competition with the US, Canada and Argentina. There would still have been labor turbulence but the Romanovs would have still been dragged screaming into a constitutional monarchy like UK's.
Just curious, could you make a video about the Canadian during the second world war? I hear a lot of stuff like, canadians were the only one to achieve their goal on D-day, 1 man freeing a city (Léo Major) and we had the most elite military, well trained. I would really appreciate it, I can't find any video that sums up the canadian in world war 2, only EU and USA :(
Theodore Roosevelt is my favorite president.
One of my favorites as well. I agree with this video that he's gotta be considered one of the greatest Americans.
@@VloggingThroughHistory definitely the quintessential American.
@@senatuspopulusqueromanus3011 Who your Favorite Russian Monarch ?
12:00 Wilson's segregation policies weren't really about the military, but rather he segregated government offices, with many government agencies like Treasury and Dept. of Commerce using a lack of blacks-only facilities to enforce whites-only employment strategies.
"Correct me if I'm wrong..." The US Navy was integrated even before the Civil War. Wilson ended desegretation in the navy. The Army was segregated until both were desegregated after WWII.
I agree with Roosevelt's foreign policy framework
Very interesting analysis and hypotheses in the video, but I feel like the guy could benefit from using words like "probably" and "likely" more.
i recommend you watch HistoryMarche 2nd punic war videos .SOOOO GOOD!
LIKE THE CUT G!!!!
Yes, the Army was segregated with two "colored" cavalry and two "colored" infantry regiments. There was also a Puerto Rican infantry regiment. The Navy had integrated crews, but after 1878, colored sailors were excluded from combat and operational functions that they had served in since the birth of the Navy. "Colored" included Hispanic and Filippino sailors. They were now restricted to serving as cooks and mess servants. They still had combat duties as did all sailors in a crew, mostly in damage control. There were also segregated National Guard units. But under Wilson tried to shift them into service ops. Pershing went to the map on this and four segregated infantry regiments served with the French and were considered as "shock" troops by the French corps commanders.
Any chance you'd be willing to do a video on Anglo-Saxons and pre-1066?
You should react to some Historia Civilis, he makes videos all about the Roman Empire and that time period
Would have been interesting to see Theodore Roosevelt handling The Great War. I would find that more interesting of the possible alternate timelines. Mind you that the "two terms as President" was never made yet until his cousin Franklin was President. I am fascinated by what ifs in the books played differently. Yes, Spain Britain and all of the Empires at the time would have revolts. We just didn't know if the Imperial Empires would still be standing post 20th century. I LOVE THIS FANTASY THINKING.
An interesting variation is what would have happened if Taft had won.
11:45 I think it was 1948, when Truman desegregated the military. I'm like... 97% sure.
You're correct. 😎👍
Very well done, from another North Eastern Ohio native.
I'm a new sub. Have you done or would you consider a Gangs of New York video? Thanks.
I could do that sometime. Great movie.
Yes please
watch a video on the Nakba!
I tend to agree with the OP, Russia was already on a path toward industrialization and it would’ve happened anyway, but I suspect it would’ve been at a more moderate pace such that they wouldn’t have sacrificed their agricultural base. Russia had been playing catch-up for a couple hundred years already and the influx of western ideas had a large effect on the growing middle class which affected the rest of the population by default. The communist revolution really set the tone for most of the rest of the 20th century in Russia, and it would be interesting to see Russia as a strong and independent country that didn’t solidify power through fear and violence but through taking advantage of their human and natural resources in a more balanced way.
Hi, Could you please share your thoughts about the Czechoslovakian (CSK) chances of withstanding the potential attack from the Nazi Germnay in 1938? Since it is known that a good part of the German Panzer divisions were made of "repainted" CSK tanks from Pilsen and on the German borders Czechs has built pretty strong fortifications. I would say, based on the nearly one million soldiers mobilized and the fact that CSK had for the time a reasonably modern army, CSK could hold Germany back and even go further by saying, if the Germans would not capture the resources in CSK, they would have a hard time to apply Blitzkrieg in France. Any thoughts? I know this topic is a big IF topic, but I am interested what is your point of view of CSK in that time of the history. Thank you.
It’s crazy to see what Whatifalthist is doing today.
Another great Doris Kearns Goodwin book called, "Bully Pulpit" about TR and Taft.
No federal reserve as well, which was created under Wilson
25:11
The US and Japan would definitely have at it around the 40s, maybe even the 30s.
Japan was teh US's main rival for control over the Pacific and under Teddy we would definitely be expanding our territory there.
Not sure how I feel about Leo playing Roosevelt, but he does have the acting chops to maybe pull it off. If he does half as well as Tom Berenger in Rough Riders, I'll be happy
I remember thinking Heath Ledger was a horrible choice to play the Joker, and man was I wrong. I hope I'm equally wrong about Leo as TR.
@@VloggingThroughHistory Agreed, I've been dead wrong about actors before, including Leo. I think he has a unique ability to morph in to the majority of roles he does, just hope it shines through with my favorite presidents depiction.
Robin Williams would be an ideal role for Teddy for a variety of reasons. A shame about what happened to him...
Regarding Russia, I think the Czar would have been deposed or made a figurehead like the Queen of England. In either case, he would lose a significant amount of power due to a form of popular uprisings, just not as violent as it was.