Why 3D printer time estimates are wrong and how to fix them
Vložit
- čas přidán 20. 07. 2024
- You slice a model to 3D print, observe the time estimate, only to return when it should be done to discover it has run over time. If you are trying to meet deadlines, an accurate print time prediction is essential. For everyone else, it’s a quality of life feature. In this video we explore the reasons the estimate is inaccurate, and a range of ways to fix it.
0:00 Introduction
0:37 Slicer calculation method and inaccuracy
3:43 Discrepancy 1 - Start gcode sequences
4:56 Discrepancy 2 - Speed vs acceleration
6:05 Discrepancy 3 - Jerk/junction deviation/SQV/MISC
Prusa calculator: blog.prusa3d.com/calculator_3...
7:07 Discrepancy 4 - miscellaneous
8:21 Gathering data for a fix
8:51 Simplify3D
Simplify3D forum post on preset values: forum.simplify3d.com/viewtopi...
9:07 PrusaSlicer / SuperSlicer
10:02 Cura
10:52 RRF print simulation
11:17 Octoprint plugin
Print time genius: plugins.octoprint.org/plugins...
Buy quality and affordable filament from X3D. Buy 3, get 1 free and a free sample pack with every order: www.x3d.com.au
Get Quality Resins from 3D Printers Online. 5% off storewide for Teaching Tech subscribers [Code: tech5]
3dprintersonline.com.au/
Take a look around and if you like what you see, please subscribe.
Support me on Patreon: / teachingtech
There is another way, using the Klipper Estimator post processing script. Similar to RRF's simulate, it pulls the klipper config from the machines API, simulates it really quickly using Klippers kinematics in mind, and provides an estimate that is within a minute across 24h or so.
Initially made by Annex Engineering, the Voron community uses it alot now too
I’ve been using Print Time Genius since you first recommended it and it’s been fantastic. Prints under 5 hours are generally within seconds of predicted. A print that takes 10+ hours has been no more than 2 minutes off some even being seconds from predicted. It took a few prints to become accurate but it just gets better and better.
Appreciate the video!
In Cura, the final time seems to be just about perfect every time from my experience (not accounting for heating/autoleveling). The progress bar on the printer seem to only care about layer numbers though.
I've heard the progress bar / time remaining on printers often only cares about bytes/commands/lines read.
This then means that square, low-to-none infill layers will be way faster than estimated if the same model includes circular and/or high infill layers.
Post Processing Plugin has script Display Progress On LCD, which will put gcodes to file to display remaining time and progress (as calculated by slicer). Choose best method depending on printer firmware and hardware.
I have the same more often than not it's even faster that the cura times.
@@kimmotoivanen same, it works well for me.
my cura is way off
Surprisingly the print time in prusaslicer is spot on for my ender3. the issue I have is that the machine itself shows a crazy long estimate that eventually catches up by the end of the print.
I was recently trying to find a way to fix this, and now I have something try! Thank you. Running Klipper w/inputshaper @3k accelerations makes my prints finish 1/3 faster than what Cura states.
In Superslicer you can set the machine limits (under printer settings) in terms of acceleration and jerk (no option for setting junction deviation though). There are then options for how Superslicer uses these under "How to apply limits" which include options for whether they are used for print time estimates or written to g.code.
I use them for print estimates and keep actual settings used during print as being defined by my machine firmware. So long as the SS settings and my m,achine settings match up pretty well, then the print estimates seem to be very close.
I don't know if you can set these things in Cura, but thought I'd point it out as another area of potential difference and I suspect that most slicers use some estimate of acceleration and "cornering" in their estimates.
Superslicer is so cool. Always learning watching your channel. Thanks Michael.
Very insightful video. Thanks for all the great tips and references.
For the Ender 5 plus cura seems to correctly calculate print times. I never had anything take substantially mire or less time than the estimate
Interesting and useful subject elaborated very well, nicely done
Just a FYI, the Print Time Genius plug-in for Octoprint triggers a bug when using TH3D firmware. On my Ender 3 I would randomly have the hotend cool down mid print while the temp remained static in Otco and on the LCD. The screen showed to be at 200º+ but I would start to hear the extruder click away until one day I I used a multimeter to see that the heater wasn't getting any juice. I only found this out recently. It even triggers the problem with the plug-in disabled.
Hi Michael, great tutorial as usual ... any tips for ideamaker?
Michael this is great info, thanks very much as I am a newbie to 3D printing and was wondering why my Cura slicer was saying one time and then when the printer my Ender3v2 started printing the time was like 1-2 hours longer, I was thinking I did something wrong... do you have a video to help with all of these settings to show me what should be in each of the settings.. like a noobie how to set up the slicer with what values to put.... I did notice in this video you put the speed to 250 instead of 500.... these are the kind of things I would very much like to know and I am sure that many others would like to know this kind of stuff....
I usually print relatively small objects (read: under 3 hour prints (stock ender 3)) so the deviation is usually within 10 minutes at most, so it doesn't bother me enough to change it.
Thanks Mikey for this I am new to 3d printing and gcode editing didn't know I should do it. NP++ 101 uses now 102!
even the acceleration of the extruder motor can influence time, since i had implemented linear advance all my prints take longer. I don't know how to set it in the slicer (i use PrusaSlicer) to have more precise times
I use Klipper (ender 3) and Orca slicer. Acceleration setting 0 in slicer however I set acceleration and speed in machine setting for estimation. Prints are almost double faster then slicer estimation. I think you should revisit this video and make updated video for Orca/Klipper and stuff like that. Just for comparison, slicer time: 3h6m and print time: 1h24min for 'flexi rex improved' (ender 3, 100mm/s, accel 3000, input shaping/pressure advance tuned and slicer retraction)
Thanks Michael ... I didn't realise the PrintTimeGenius 'learned' on the job.
the video is a great help
I find that setting in PrusaSlicer didnt change the estimate, I just assume because I am using an MK3S+ though that the same branded slicer already is setup to work off the limits of a same branded machine.
Only just pressed play, but thank you for making this video!
Love the Mount Panorama reference. Now I want to print a 3D model of The Mountain
Ive never had issues with print times cura has been pretty dead on maybe im just lucky but the thing that im trying to understand is why the print time on the printer display is always so off ive ran a 12 hour print and in the beginning my printer would tell me 24 hours but quickly change as it would get to sections of the printer as if it only calculated based on the current layer as if it were to just repeat it for all the remaining layers however the actual print time usually matches my slicer almost to the T
I've also found Cura with my Ender-3 Pro is pretty accurate, not that I've ever used a stopwatch, but its a good guide.....
would really appreciate a ski mini e3 v3.0 video on setting it up with bl touch. can't find useful info anywhere
i have a weird issue that results in my printer just doubling up the layer count after printing starts which feels like really weird and i mean doubling or possibly more as print times go from an estimated 9-14 hours to 4 days
does klipper has something similar to pring genuios? i used octoprint and moved to klipper. in cura it says 2 hours, klipper 3.5 hours... how to correct it?
Thanks for these explanations, very usefull. as cura also predicts the weight (and is not always correct) is there a way to make that also more precise? because changing filament during a print has never really worked for me.. The sensor gives the alert (on a cr10S pro) only when its already inside the tube and you cant get it out without unscrewing everything. Also if i don't hear the alert immediately it can continue heating the nozzle and the bed for hours until i see there is no more filament. What i am doing now is i weigh the spool, with the filament, (i know the weight of an empty spool) . I add 5% to the prediction and check if i have enough. It would be great if there was a way to make the prediction more precise!
Luc
If you set up the correct values within a self added material, the weight should be very correct.
Downside is, that for every new filament you have to add it to the materials in cura and select it.
@@FireN2k9 Yes,, thanks, but the problem is, some materials have the details on the box.. some others dont. i meen the density... often 1.24g/cm3, in pla i often use the creality filament. I havent found the density for that filament. Yes i have written to creality, but no answer. so i am using the cura default of 1.24 but. when weighing the spool, it is pretty correct on big prints, but on smaller ones (figures) it can be off by 25%. (i have a second scale and often check if the values are not completely faulty). But i actually only need it when the spools get quite close to the end. like less than 10% left.
Luc
In cura how do I work out my acceleration and Jerk settings thanks
Bad time estimates: The only thing I have seen is Combing mode with 'avoid printed obstacles' in Cura.
With this on, estimates could be off by 30% or more!
'Avoid obstacles' can generate moves that seem to find the longest possible route.
Thats Printer Settings plugin doesnt seem to be there anymore. Can you still get it? I like how is asks for XYZ just like it is on my machine.
I thought that's about printer time estimates, not slicer time estimates. Cura time predictions for my Ender 3 v2 were almost spot on, maybe slightly pessimistic. Printer's own predictions are all over the place though.
how about for OrcaSlice? I cannot find an option like PRUSASlicer
SuperSlicer for the win again!
hello, great informations ! I've a problem with my sidewinder X2, PrusaSlicer give me 7h40 but my print is 11h30 !!! 48% more !! I've check with pronterface all the info are the same as in my prusa profil... my print start with the good timing job but it's increase ... I'm a little bit lost do you have a solution ? thank you
@TeachingTech high linear advance-settings (k >= ~0.2) will also increase the real printing time dramatically, because it basically alters all other speedup-values. High k-Values on sloppy bowden printer can easily double ort triple you printtime in the end, with no other settings changed!
Thank you for this information!
klipper estimator does fast estimates for print times and shows lots of useful data on your print
I was gonna shout this out too. It calculates how long each feature type takes, and gives very accurate estimates for print times. +1 for klipper estimator.
Took me a while to figure out how to use it with Cura. The docs on it are garbage. But once I figured it out (and man was it actually easy) such a great post processing tool!
What about when a print takes over double the estimated time? I worry my extruder arm is bolted too tight
we need to demand pre-made profiles for prinmttime acceration form every manufacturer!
CURA almost always predicts the time perfectly for my Ender 3v2, the only time it gets it wrong is when i cranked Accel and Jerk to print a Speedboat.
While the printer itself seems to do: Last layer x number of layers left= time
Via octoprint with the plugin to get accurate time it is astonishingly accurate
Post Processing Plugin has script Display Progress On LCD, which will put gcodes to file to display remaining time and progress (as calculated by slicer). Choose best method depending on printer firmware and hardware.
@@kimmotoivanen damn thank you so much!
I was asking myself if it exists but never actually looked it up
I'm using Prusa Slicer 2.3.0 but I don't have 'Machine Limits' as an option for printer settings. I don't have a Prusa printer so my printer is a custom config.
Switch to expert mode view
@@TheMidnightSmith I'm in expert view and its the only tab missing
@@andrewferraro8568 that's super odd, I have 3 custom machines with that tab available. Under printer settings.
Cura keeps giving me a time estimate of "0 minutes". Is there any way to fix this?
Just had a 3 hour print (which is a lot for what it is) turn in to a 7:30 hour print!!! Its insane i actually think i broke a thing!
The short answer without even watching the video: Set your acceleration rates in your slicer to match the ones in the printer. And also don't try to ask speeds faster than what's the maximum speed in your printer.
I always assumed the slicer solely dictates the acceleration. Live and learn!
came to say tyhe same thing lol. ive told people is SO MANY groups that. its quite an easy fix lol
How do you know the printers acceleration?
Had the same problem it reckoned 3 hrs and 8 mins but take about 11 hrs
I think the key here is that most users don’t really care, your explanation is detailed (and welcomed by those who appreciate such), but the average user wants simplicity and repeatability. As a car aficionado it’s like mega squirt, 95% of people will only load the default map as they don’t know how to change the variables in a way that won’t launch their pistons through the crank case!
In order to make 3d printing mainstream we need to cater for the “norms” and recognise that engineering is about perfecting in the background.
As such I salute your diligence and knowledge, but feel that you could make a greater difference by consulting in order to provide a “buy now for 15% greater accuracy bonus by selecting this power up” model.
I don’t like this model it recognise that this is the average consumer, and the best way to advance 3d printing is to get one in every home.
No a popular opinion but I totally feel that 3d printing is the future.
I agree with Stephanie Boyd - with 6 printers I can't keep every thing running. It's like asking my wife if she is happy. I can't depend on the answer
You know what would solve this problems faster printers. That is what we want to see like the new creality 250 mm amd phenomenon 400mm per second.
mm/s is mostly not a meaningful measurement of print speed; mm/s² (acceleration) is a lot more important for anything but giant simple shapes.
Today I learned why square shapes take longer than curved shape ones: sudden deacceleration
I never really concerned myself with print times when I saw the time discrepancies
My Creality printers are perfect but Kobra Plus takes 50% longer than the estimate and uses more filament than expected which can be a problem if you don’t have enough filament left on the roll. Until I got the Kobra it was never a concern.
As always there is an octoprint plugin. I love octoprint.
basics maths should be described as "quick maffs"
How about this one.
Cura 3hrs 54min
Klipper 56min
💕👍
wish octoprint had something to estimate time better
11:45 I'll never need to print for any deadline. Otherwise I wouldn't have 2 3D printers collecting dust for a year.
so far my favourite one is a print that was stated by cura to take 36 hours. i'm currently at 34 hours and it's 50% done.
is it done alredy or no
Holy what’s the print
Bro what are you printing planet destroyer full scale model 😂
generally my prints are faster than the estimate so not as big of a problem.
POT OF GREED??? WHAT'S THAT?
Mine is consistently half the actual printing time
Do you ever plan on getting rid of this shitty intro?
Channel good any way.