@@LearnEverythingAboutDesign It truly does, I started with the blueprint video on the Porsche, and then moved on to your widebody series and the miata scan duckbill. I'm currently working on a BMW project and you've helped me immensely.
I Love your videos. They are really Helpful. I followed your video series on form mastery and surface modelling and I was able to model an Irazar bus body . Thanks alot
I knew you were a dirt bike fellow! Husky FE250 here. By the clues on your pegboard, it seems you ride a KTM 350, also in Enduro or Hare Scrable. And you also enjoy a Yamaha TW200 (I saw a certain box up there... :-). Your videos are on another league! Excellent. Thank you.
I sure am :) Funny enough I am more a motorcycle guy than car guy but this channel had more responses to car modeling. Currently I have a 450sxf that has a tag on it. that is my moto/dual/supermoto bike. And a 250xc for the woods. The tw200 is my wifes bike. Its a fun stable little bike. and i have an old gpz750 still. I worked at a few bike shops in my younger days and used to ride a lot more moto but that shifted to supermoto and trails more these days (sadly more mountain biking than anything).
Amazing Video. first In depth scan "review"/ Guide I have found. learned a lot in the 45 minutes just watching. I will try out the Paper balls as you suggest and see if that helps. I have been trying for almost 2 weeks since I got my scanner to scan a motorcycle sidecover and just having a rough time at it. I am often losing tracking and having to pause and go back. . Im curious about your Laptop specs and Memory.
you can also try bits of painters tape on the part as long as its an area you can easily remove/fill after. So either constant curve OR flat section. I will be doing another video on a black engine case for my GPz project but its a ways off. My laptop is a 2017 i7 with a quadro p4000 card. 32gb ram. the processor "boosts" too around 4.2ghz i think and when scanning its pegged.
Always appreciate the clarify in your demonstrations. Kudos for providing the scan data for real perspective. It was disappointing to see choose medium resolution on precision machined component. Yes, you should always hand check assembly features. Please show the extreme resolution CrealityScan is touting for this scanner. You could even use the same part for a direct comparison in the next video (med vs fine). Keep up the good work!
Thanks for the comment Greg! One reason I didn't use "small" mode on this is because of the size. While the otter does have the various sizes which do correlate to the precision values, it has a harder time tracking objects that take up a lot of the frame. So the reality is the process/resolution is a bit tied to the size of the object. I will however go back and grab some more scans of this on small and maybe update some links/info as that is a very valid point! thanks!
@@LearnEverythingAboutDesignappreciate the clarification. If I'm reading this correctly, it's meant for table top (turn table) objects and possibly limited to ~5 in^3? Very interested to see more on the capabilities.
@@xfsr20box Hey Greg, I recorded a follow up video that will go live early next week. I scanned the triple clamp on small/med/large mode and also did a feature vs marker tracking. The Otter has 3 size modes which do change the point distance captured in 3d BUT its not as simple as picking the small mode to get the smallest resolution on larger objects. It affects the trackin algorithm and other things. What you will see in the video next week is that with such a narrow field of view on "Small" mode it has a hard time tracking the object. it does ok with markers. Note that in Medium mode i do also show a mesh section sketch with a fit arc and measure it vs the real thing. The scan showed 53.9234mm and the measured value was 53.9242mm. The otter does have a "turn table" mode but i feel i get better results manually moving it around, and it doesn't come with one so you would need to have one. In my experience the higher end turntables controlled by the software work better than these ones that just constantly spin.
Hi Matt! Awesome video. Comparing with the work you did with revopoint scanners one thing stands out - a lot less noise, no? They just need to work on the software features you mentioned and I will def. get one to complement my einstar. Regards. Luis
Hey Luis, The noise comes from a few places. Scanner calibration can offer up noise if its off, but the illumination as well. The Otter seems to handle shiny surfaces really well while the revopoint scanners need a scan spray. Once there is spray involved they should be fairly similar, but without yes it would appear like a little less noise. However I will say it is very much surface based. I scanned a mountain bike pedal that was orange plastic and there was more noise on it than with the black triple clamp.
let's not get into the mindset that it has to be expensive for it to meet a certain user grade. This is what has created the avenue to make it difficult for good products to become competitive for the average user to get into a space. Most expensive stuff are not expensive because they are good, they are expensive because of corporate overheads, due to brand and marketing and sometimes the intent to fence new entrants to become reputable.
In a general sense yes, but in the scanner segment I would disagree to a certain extent. Are expensive scanners worth the money they charge? To some yes but the gap is getting much smaller. The ROI certainly drops quite a bit. I think that is where Shining 3D has settled into the market as a more affordable professional scanner offering with their freescan laser scanner at $17k vs the Creality Scan Raptor at $1500 or so. Hardware between these consumer scanners and the "Pro" scanners is getting closer. But I will use a welding example. You can buy a 140amp mig welder from your hardware store. It welds and if you are welding thin plate up to 1/4" it is likely fine for most projects you have around the house. But a pro welder that will also weld 1/4" plate and thicker, while it will perform the same job, has a lot of differences. In the welding case you are talking about a higher duty cycle. You can run the machines 100% of the time. Hobby units at the hardware store can be run for maybe 1min and have to cool for 10min (10% duty cycle). Both are welders but there are some fundamental differences that would make the 140amp hardware store welder off the table for a professional welding to make a living. The same is true for scanners. These scanners are great for someone who wants to do scanning for their own projects, but they aren't really in the same place as a professional scanner. If you are charging an hourly rate to scan, speed is a big factor, ease of use, quality of data etc. Now is a professional scanner worth $50k when you can get a scanner like this for under $1000? That is really up to you and what you need to do with it. You could scan/process the same part much faster with higher accuracy with "higher end" scanners. And while the .02mm number might seem close going from .02 to .01 is actually a huge leap and .02 is only achievable on smaller parts easily. As i mentioned in the video software is a big thing that divides these scanners at this price point from something used in a professional capacity. Even for a program like quicksurface which is meant to be a next step after scanning you are looking to spend over $4000/year for that. Would you do that for an $800 scanner? Having said all that I do believe some of the big name scanning companies are charging way more than they should for their offerings simply because they can. Scanners on the market from Creality, Revopoint, Shining and others are certainly shaking that up. Until the software is improved on all fronts I still think there is a bit of ways to go before any big company will be hurt by the offerings. Same with 3d printing. "pro" 3d printers are astronomical in start up cost and materials and actually running the things. Has the influx of so many desktop machines really hurt the sales of say HP mjf printers? I don't know but I doubt it.
Just to add one more point. I prefer to use tools like Fusion vs Solidworks, which I own both. I certainly don't think a higher price justifies quality. I had to pay $8000 to own Solidworks for 2 years and I locked in my Fusion price as an early adopter for $310/year. Does Solidworks do a few things better, yes, but the only reason I have it is for client work that require solidworks. Many companies charge a premium because they feel they can and I am glad to see lower price competitors help level the playing field. I think in 5-10 years we will see that with Scanners. But in the case of Fusion vs Solidworks, Fusion wasn't from some startup company trying to get into the market. Similar play from Shining3d with their einstar scanner. They offered an entry level scanner at the bottom of their lineup. I think in years to come we will see some of the big names be forced to drop their prices and offer entry scanners to get into the segment. I think if they don't their tools will become very niche and obsolete.
@@LearnEverythingAboutDesign Yes, your response indicates we cannot take it on face value alone. This is all the point i wanted to stress, so that consumers don't feel they always have to chase “expensive” as a way of telling good from bad, but rather learn to match requirements with purchase decisions.
You can, but I find with objects like this you would have to do multiple scanner positions to get all the geometry. The Creality scanner tracking is actually pretty good and moving it by hand seems to work very well. Also the Cr-Scan Otter doesn't come with a turntable or tripod for the scanner, at least not in the kit they currently sell. So you would have to have those things. It has a 1/4-20 thread on it. When you do the tripod and turntable method though you can't really use the small paper pieces to help with tracking. For me I would use a tripod if you could capture all the detail from a single scanner position otherwise it isn't really worth it. just my 2c.
Does otter have issues with the buttons? They're capacitance... but it's hit and miss with mine And I cant stop the fkr from spinning... even with bits of paper 😂
I have noticed that the contract buttons only work if the scanner is in the green/blue range. if its outside the good range they don't seem to respond. I figured that was a "design" thing. Other than that when its in the good/optimal range away from the object they seem to work normally. The spinning sucks! The paper fixed it for me as long as the scan size puts at least 2 of them in range. It can be anything really as long as the scanner picks it up and its unique. Toss the little owl figure it comes with in the scene and that should help too.
How So? And which scanner(s) do you feel outperform it? Right now on the marker the Revopoint Miraco and this Scan Otter are the only ones I am aware of that have multiple depth cameras to allow you to scan small to large objects with the same scanner. The miraco being 1300 - 1600 but being a self contained unit has many pros. The otter being 800-900. Curious to hear which scanners you feel make this one garbage.
I absolutely love your channel. I've learned so many things and your topics are easily searchable for the solution I need if I run in to trouble.
Happy to help! Thank you! CZcams doesn't like long titles but if you know what you are looking for they do help :)
@@LearnEverythingAboutDesign It truly does, I started with the blueprint video on the Porsche, and then moved on to your widebody series and the miata scan duckbill. I'm currently working on a BMW project and you've helped me immensely.
@@jamesg3391 Glad to hear it! If you ever want to share the project (pics not files) you can always email me support@caducator.com
Great video as always mate, really appreciated and super helpful
Glad to hear it!
I Love your videos. They are really Helpful. I followed your video series on form mastery and surface modelling and I was able to model an Irazar bus body . Thanks alot
Great to hear! Thank you!
I knew you were a dirt bike fellow! Husky FE250 here.
By the clues on your pegboard, it seems you ride a KTM 350, also in Enduro or Hare Scrable.
And you also enjoy a Yamaha TW200 (I saw a certain box up there... :-).
Your videos are on another league! Excellent. Thank you.
I sure am :) Funny enough I am more a motorcycle guy than car guy but this channel had more responses to car modeling. Currently I have a 450sxf that has a tag on it. that is my moto/dual/supermoto bike. And a 250xc for the woods. The tw200 is my wifes bike. Its a fun stable little bike. and i have an old gpz750 still. I worked at a few bike shops in my younger days and used to ride a lot more moto but that shifted to supermoto and trails more these days (sadly more mountain biking than anything).
Amazing Video. first In depth scan "review"/ Guide I have found. learned a lot in the 45 minutes just watching. I will try out the Paper balls as you suggest and see if that helps. I have been trying for almost 2 weeks since I got my scanner to scan a motorcycle sidecover and just having a rough time at it. I am often losing tracking and having to pause and go back. . Im curious about your Laptop specs and Memory.
you can also try bits of painters tape on the part as long as its an area you can easily remove/fill after. So either constant curve OR flat section.
I will be doing another video on a black engine case for my GPz project but its a ways off. My laptop is a 2017 i7 with a quadro p4000 card. 32gb ram. the processor "boosts" too around 4.2ghz i think and when scanning its pegged.
Always appreciate the clarify in your demonstrations. Kudos for providing the scan data for real perspective.
It was disappointing to see choose medium resolution on precision machined component. Yes, you should always hand check assembly features. Please show the extreme resolution CrealityScan is touting for this scanner. You could even use the same part for a direct comparison in the next video (med vs fine). Keep up the good work!
Thanks for the comment Greg! One reason I didn't use "small" mode on this is because of the size. While the otter does have the various sizes which do correlate to the precision values, it has a harder time tracking objects that take up a lot of the frame. So the reality is the process/resolution is a bit tied to the size of the object.
I will however go back and grab some more scans of this on small and maybe update some links/info as that is a very valid point!
thanks!
@@LearnEverythingAboutDesignappreciate the clarification. If I'm reading this correctly, it's meant for table top (turn table) objects and possibly limited to ~5 in^3? Very interested to see more on the capabilities.
@@xfsr20box Hey Greg, I recorded a follow up video that will go live early next week. I scanned the triple clamp on small/med/large mode and also did a feature vs marker tracking.
The Otter has 3 size modes which do change the point distance captured in 3d BUT its not as simple as picking the small mode to get the smallest resolution on larger objects. It affects the trackin algorithm and other things. What you will see in the video next week is that with such a narrow field of view on "Small" mode it has a hard time tracking the object. it does ok with markers.
Note that in Medium mode i do also show a mesh section sketch with a fit arc and measure it vs the real thing. The scan showed 53.9234mm and the measured value was 53.9242mm.
The otter does have a "turn table" mode but i feel i get better results manually moving it around, and it doesn't come with one so you would need to have one. In my experience the higher end turntables controlled by the software work better than these ones that just constantly spin.
@@xfsr20box czcams.com/video/PdtUit4OTO0/video.html
Hi Matt!
Awesome video. Comparing with the work you did with revopoint scanners one thing stands out - a lot less noise, no? They just need to work on the software features you mentioned and I will def. get one to complement my einstar.
Regards. Luis
Hey Luis, The noise comes from a few places. Scanner calibration can offer up noise if its off, but the illumination as well. The Otter seems to handle shiny surfaces really well while the revopoint scanners need a scan spray. Once there is spray involved they should be fairly similar, but without yes it would appear like a little less noise.
However I will say it is very much surface based. I scanned a mountain bike pedal that was orange plastic and there was more noise on it than with the black triple clamp.
let's not get into the mindset that it has to be expensive for it to meet a certain user grade. This is what has created the avenue to make it difficult for good products to become competitive for the average user to get into a space. Most expensive stuff are not expensive because they are good, they are expensive because of corporate overheads, due to brand and marketing and sometimes the intent to fence new entrants to become reputable.
In a general sense yes, but in the scanner segment I would disagree to a certain extent. Are expensive scanners worth the money they charge? To some yes but the gap is getting much smaller. The ROI certainly drops quite a bit. I think that is where Shining 3D has settled into the market as a more affordable professional scanner offering with their freescan laser scanner at $17k vs the Creality Scan Raptor at $1500 or so.
Hardware between these consumer scanners and the "Pro" scanners is getting closer. But I will use a welding example. You can buy a 140amp mig welder from your hardware store. It welds and if you are welding thin plate up to 1/4" it is likely fine for most projects you have around the house. But a pro welder that will also weld 1/4" plate and thicker, while it will perform the same job, has a lot of differences. In the welding case you are talking about a higher duty cycle. You can run the machines 100% of the time. Hobby units at the hardware store can be run for maybe 1min and have to cool for 10min (10% duty cycle). Both are welders but there are some fundamental differences that would make the 140amp hardware store welder off the table for a professional welding to make a living.
The same is true for scanners. These scanners are great for someone who wants to do scanning for their own projects, but they aren't really in the same place as a professional scanner. If you are charging an hourly rate to scan, speed is a big factor, ease of use, quality of data etc. Now is a professional scanner worth $50k when you can get a scanner like this for under $1000? That is really up to you and what you need to do with it. You could scan/process the same part much faster with higher accuracy with "higher end" scanners. And while the .02mm number might seem close going from .02 to .01 is actually a huge leap and .02 is only achievable on smaller parts easily. As i mentioned in the video software is a big thing that divides these scanners at this price point from something used in a professional capacity. Even for a program like quicksurface which is meant to be a next step after scanning you are looking to spend over $4000/year for that. Would you do that for an $800 scanner?
Having said all that I do believe some of the big name scanning companies are charging way more than they should for their offerings simply because they can. Scanners on the market from Creality, Revopoint, Shining and others are certainly shaking that up. Until the software is improved on all fronts I still think there is a bit of ways to go before any big company will be hurt by the offerings. Same with 3d printing. "pro" 3d printers are astronomical in start up cost and materials and actually running the things. Has the influx of so many desktop machines really hurt the sales of say HP mjf printers? I don't know but I doubt it.
Just to add one more point. I prefer to use tools like Fusion vs Solidworks, which I own both. I certainly don't think a higher price justifies quality. I had to pay $8000 to own Solidworks for 2 years and I locked in my Fusion price as an early adopter for $310/year. Does Solidworks do a few things better, yes, but the only reason I have it is for client work that require solidworks.
Many companies charge a premium because they feel they can and I am glad to see lower price competitors help level the playing field. I think in 5-10 years we will see that with Scanners. But in the case of Fusion vs Solidworks, Fusion wasn't from some startup company trying to get into the market. Similar play from Shining3d with their einstar scanner. They offered an entry level scanner at the bottom of their lineup. I think in years to come we will see some of the big names be forced to drop their prices and offer entry scanners to get into the segment. I think if they don't their tools will become very niche and obsolete.
@@LearnEverythingAboutDesign Yes, your response indicates we cannot take it on face value alone. This is all the point i wanted to stress, so that consumers don't feel they always have to chase “expensive” as a way of telling good from bad, but rather learn to match requirements with purchase decisions.
Can you scan the part on a turntable, or do you have to move the scanner to retain orientation in space?
You can, but I find with objects like this you would have to do multiple scanner positions to get all the geometry. The Creality scanner tracking is actually pretty good and moving it by hand seems to work very well.
Also the Cr-Scan Otter doesn't come with a turntable or tripod for the scanner, at least not in the kit they currently sell. So you would have to have those things. It has a 1/4-20 thread on it. When you do the tripod and turntable method though you can't really use the small paper pieces to help with tracking.
For me I would use a tripod if you could capture all the detail from a single scanner position otherwise it isn't really worth it. just my 2c.
Does otter have issues with the buttons? They're capacitance... but it's hit and miss with mine
And I cant stop the fkr from spinning... even with bits of paper 😂
I have noticed that the contract buttons only work if the scanner is in the green/blue range. if its outside the good range they don't seem to respond. I figured that was a "design" thing. Other than that when its in the good/optimal range away from the object they seem to work normally.
The spinning sucks! The paper fixed it for me as long as the scan size puts at least 2 of them in range. It can be anything really as long as the scanner picks it up and its unique. Toss the little owl figure it comes with in the scene and that should help too.
The scanner is actual garbage compared to existing options
How So? And which scanner(s) do you feel outperform it? Right now on the marker the Revopoint Miraco and this Scan Otter are the only ones I am aware of that have multiple depth cameras to allow you to scan small to large objects with the same scanner. The miraco being 1300 - 1600 but being a self contained unit has many pros. The otter being 800-900. Curious to hear which scanners you feel make this one garbage.