Another point to consider on larger layouts, with more locomotives running, or on a layout with multiple power districts, your bus wire size and feeder wire size should be picked based on the current load you expect to see in any given power district. If you have a section on your layout where you might have more than just a few locomotives running, your current load may be fine to use 14 or 16 AWG bus wire, but if you have long runs from your DCC booster to your "end of track" for that power district, and have lots of locomotives running in that area, or use resistors across your car wheels for signal detection purposes, you may need to increase the bus and feeder wire sizes based on the total possible load that area will see. For high load areas, you get more voltage drop in the wire as the current goes up with smaller gauge wire. That can result in a lower than desired voltage at the locomotive wheels than your DCC / DC system might like to see, making the locomotive run slower. Your video Boomer gives a great overview, but some care does need to go into bus and feeder wire sizing based on expected current draw and the length of wire run from the power source / booster to the end of the powered area if you run lots of locomotives. A good wire gauge table can provide information on voltage drop / foot for given current loads. As you say, for a 20' shelf layout, with a few running locomotives at a time, your bus wire selection is fine, but "your use may vary" is needed on larger layouts, or other higher load conditions.
You have the best video on CZcams on this particular subject simply explaining the wiring. Thank you sir! Back into the hobby after a 30 year break and this helps big time! Take care.
Great analogy Boomer, the water main as an example to explain current to the layman electronics, is indeed like pressure and flow disperse through pipes!
I learned early on that electrical integrity and robustness is the primary factor when we enjoy our layouts. Now I take it for granted, because the trains always run, other than the odd period track cleaning. Cheers.
Boomer, Thank You for clearing up the number of feeders to a single piece of track. Many comments on CZcams suggest only one set of feeders per several feet of track. That never seemed right to me for obvious reasons. I'll be starting to wire soon, and this tutorial has saved me a lot of grief!!! Thanks
Thank You. Some would disagree with this method of "over" wiring each turnout and track section, etc. That is fine, but I have never had a problem this way. Furthermore, I wouldn't know otherwise because I don't wire otherwise. Cheers.
Easy to trouble shoot if problems occur. Solid electrical integrity on each turnout. I spend alot of time in the turnout when I operate so I want conductivity integrity. It also ensures against the odd "cold" solder and drop out of feeder. Furthermore, I can cut isolation gaps anywhere, if I want to add a block without further wiring. Cheers.
Safe to assume there is going to be a video on soldering technique / install for the feeder wires to the turnout? I also am guessing you probably don’t go for suitcase connectors to the bus considering the difference in wire gauge and the reliability theme…
Hi there. Love, love , love your Channel! Quick question. You mentioned in Vlog #19 that you cut your own PC Board ties from sheets. How do you do that? I have lots of PC Board material, so I plan to do the same. I've tried with various hand tools, but the stuff tends to twist and curl on me. Your insights would be much appreciated. Cheers.
Do you have a table saw, small band saw or scroll saw? I cut mine on a table saw. I use 3M spray adhesive and glue it to a scrap panel board and then run it through a table saw with a zero clearance plate. The next best bet might be to use a small hobby band saw with a fence to cut them.
Personally I never direct wire a turnout, because like any other piece of track it will need to be replaced eventually. I drop feeders on the flex track that is coming into and out of the turnouts. and as close as I can to the turnout. Also, I dont isolate my rails with 2 exceptions, turnout frogs and programming tracks. The reason is built in redundancy, if I damage a wire on one piece of track, there is another spot close that it can pull power from. And every piece of flex track has a pair of feeders hooked to it.
Personally, I have never had to replace a "scratch built" turnout yet. Commercial turnouts almost always fail, scratch built, rarely ever do in my long experience. Furthermore, I like to isolate my turnouts with independent power in case there ever is a problem. Additionally, I can drop in a "toggle" switch anywhere (with this method) for a separate block or program track. Never had an issue with electrical integrity either. Cheers.
I have to isolate my rails because I am using block detection and I have to know when a train is on the turnouts so it doesn’t get thrown with a train on it and also if I do have a short it’s easier to diagnose in smaller isolated sections
@@boomerdiorama Hey Boomer, I have had 2 turnouts break the solder joints on my throw bars in the last two years on my scratch build turnouts, I never really trusted that method. Now I am going through all of them with your pinned method and will never worry again. Thanks for the tip
Yes. One would work, but what if one gets yanked out from messing around underneath, or a cold solder etc. I like a little redundancy built in. I take all my layouts past and present (concerning reliability) for granted now because I never had an issue due to the former practice. Cheers.
Don't forget that the nickel-silver rail also has a resistance in it as well. Multiple feeders attached evenly across a 3' long piece of flex track reduces the resistance the rail causes even more, but there is a diminishing return, and most layouts don't have significant loads unless you are running multiple locomotive lashups were you have 3 or 4 locomotives drawing power from one section of flex track.
Rafael, you can get pre cut ties at Clover House also besides fast tracks, shipping from Canada to state’s can take a while, Clover House has a nice assortment of different tie widths and thickness for different scales
What´s the cost of additional wires and solders of let say 50 turnouts, versus electronic safety devices that must fit in 100 locomotives ? Gadget costly and that can breake. I prefer simpler cheaper less complicated Boomer´s way. A roll of wire + solder flux + solder cost nothing in comparison and you can get at any Lowes...or go to hobby shop, or mail order, your electronic device being banged in subzero weather during shipping... Wire is the best by far. Those gizmos are good on bad track with bad current. I think.
In this hobby if I can scratch build it I will. I know I am sort of old fashion this way but it brings me great joy to build a turnout that works great and I never think about it again. I have become somewhat of a fan of "frog juicers" as well since they switch the frog polarity automatically with no shorts. ;-)
Another point to consider on larger layouts, with more locomotives running, or on a layout with multiple power districts, your bus wire size and feeder wire size should be picked based on the current load you expect to see in any given power district. If you have a section on your layout where you might have more than just a few locomotives running, your current load may be fine to use 14 or 16 AWG bus wire, but if you have long runs from your DCC booster to your "end of track" for that power district, and have lots of locomotives running in that area, or use resistors across your car wheels for signal detection purposes, you may need to increase the bus and feeder wire sizes based on the total possible load that area will see. For high load areas, you get more voltage drop in the wire as the current goes up with smaller gauge wire. That can result in a lower than desired voltage at the locomotive wheels than your DCC / DC system might like to see, making the locomotive run slower. Your video Boomer gives a great overview, but some care does need to go into bus and feeder wire sizing based on expected current draw and the length of wire run from the power source / booster to the end of the powered area if you run lots of locomotives. A good wire gauge table can provide information on voltage drop / foot for given current loads. As you say, for a 20' shelf layout, with a few running locomotives at a time, your bus wire selection is fine, but "your use may vary" is needed on larger layouts, or other higher load conditions.
This sounds like good analysis and wise advice for sure. Thank You for sharing this. I appreciate it! Cheers ~ Boomer.
You have the best video on CZcams on this particular subject simply explaining the wiring. Thank you sir! Back into the hobby after a 30 year break and this helps big time! Take care.
Wow, thanks! Welcome back to the hobby! Cheers ~ Boomer.
Great analogy Boomer, the water main as an example to explain current to the layman electronics, is indeed like pressure and flow disperse through pipes!
I learned early on that electrical integrity and robustness is the primary factor when we enjoy our layouts. Now I take it for granted, because the trains always run, other than the odd period track cleaning. Cheers.
Been wiring my turnouts this way including juicing my frogs for years. Bullitproof in performance.
Live frogs are great indeed!
Boomer, Thank You for clearing up the number of feeders to a single piece of track.
Many comments on CZcams suggest only one set of feeders per several feet of track. That never seemed right to me for obvious reasons.
I'll be starting to wire soon, and this tutorial has saved me a lot of grief!!!
Thanks
Thank You. Some would disagree with this method of "over" wiring each turnout and track section, etc. That is fine, but I have never had a problem this way. Furthermore, I wouldn't know otherwise because I don't wire otherwise. Cheers.
Wonderful review, I will re-watch this several times. Thanks
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great and simple explanation 👏 👍
Glad it was helpful!
Great timing! I was looking for exactly this level of detail for the task at hand. Thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
Thank-you, Mike.
Cheers.
I compare this Vlog to a good recertification class, a re enforcement of the known but also added updates with a different perspective as well.
Thanks for that! It makes it all worth while sharing then. Cheers.
Expertly done, amazing stuff 👍
Getting close to test runs . . . fun . . .fun . . . fun!
Nice really nice job brother
Thank you! Cheers!
Very good explanation and wiring guide lines or minimums i call it. Good topic
Thanks! 👍
Nice overview of wiring, very helpful. Why do you like to isolate your turnouts.
Easy to trouble shoot if problems occur. Solid electrical integrity on each turnout. I spend alot of time in the turnout when I operate so I want conductivity integrity. It also ensures against the odd "cold" solder and drop out of feeder. Furthermore, I can cut isolation gaps anywhere, if I want to add a block without further wiring. Cheers.
As usual first class understanding of layout, have you a video showing how you tap/connect to your bus wire? As I'm a newbie to model railway. Thanks.
I'll be soldering the droppers to the bus. I leave them open but offset from each other. No chance for a short that way.
I like it.
Cheers!
Safe to assume there is going to be a video on soldering technique / install for the feeder wires to the turnout? I also am guessing you probably don’t go for suitcase connectors to the bus considering the difference in wire gauge and the reliability theme…
The soldering technique is in this video: czcams.com/video/wuy0xyApOdg/video.html
Interesting. Isolate the whole switch. This could fix pass issues. Thanks.
I have always done it this way. No issues. Cheers.
Hi there. Love, love , love your Channel!
Quick question. You mentioned in Vlog #19 that you cut your own PC Board ties from sheets. How do you do that? I have lots of PC Board material, so I plan to do the same. I've tried with various hand tools, but the stuff tends to twist and curl on me. Your insights would be much appreciated.
Cheers.
Do you have a table saw, small band saw or scroll saw?
I cut mine on a table saw. I use 3M spray adhesive and glue it to a scrap panel board and then run it through a table saw with a zero clearance plate. The next best bet might be to use a small hobby band saw with a fence to cut them.
You can buy them online here as well: cloverhouse.com/Cart/index.php?cPath=49_50
Personally I never direct wire a turnout, because like any other piece of track it will need to be replaced eventually. I drop feeders on the flex track that is coming into and out of the turnouts. and as close as I can to the turnout.
Also, I dont isolate my rails with 2 exceptions, turnout frogs and programming tracks. The reason is built in redundancy, if I damage a wire on one piece of track, there is another spot close that it can pull power from. And every piece of flex track has a pair of feeders hooked to it.
Personally, I have never had to replace a "scratch built" turnout yet. Commercial turnouts almost always fail, scratch built, rarely ever do in my long experience. Furthermore, I like to isolate my turnouts with independent power in case there ever is a problem. Additionally, I can drop in a "toggle" switch anywhere (with this method) for a separate block or program track. Never had an issue with electrical integrity either. Cheers.
I have to isolate my rails because I am using block detection and I have to know when a train is on the turnouts so it doesn’t get thrown with a train on it and also if I do have a short it’s easier to diagnose in smaller isolated sections
@@cvrailroadinhoscale8338 That is correct! All the more reason to spend the time to wire with this method. Cheers.
@@boomerdiorama Hey Boomer, I have had 2 turnouts break the solder joints on my throw bars in the last two years on my scratch build turnouts, I never really trusted that method. Now I am going through all of them with your pinned method and will never worry again. Thanks for the tip
@@cvrailroadinhoscale8338 Thank You. The pin method increases the strength ten-fold. Cheers.
Excellent subject. Where do you purchase the pc board sheets?
I get mine here: smi-elec.com/ I would phone them and ask. They seem to have everything for electronic subjects.
@@boomerdiorama Thanks Boomer! Cheers.
Hi! Why do you have feeders at both ends of the stock rail, wouldn’t one work?
Thank-you, Mike.
Yes. One would work, but what if one gets yanked out from messing around underneath, or a cold solder etc. I like a little redundancy built in. I take all my layouts past and present (concerning reliability) for granted now because I never had an issue due to the former practice. Cheers.
Don't forget that the nickel-silver rail also has a resistance in it as well. Multiple feeders attached evenly across a 3' long piece of flex track reduces the resistance the rail causes even more, but there is a diminishing return, and most layouts don't have significant loads unless you are running multiple locomotive lashups were you have 3 or 4 locomotives drawing power from one section of flex track.
@@littlewingpsc27 O.K. Fine. But for DCC and multiple units I like it this way. Cheers.
You mention cutting PCB into ties. What tool do you use Boomer?
A table saw. You can also use a straight edge with a very sharp (Olfa) utility knife.
Rafael, you can get pre cut ties at Clover House also besides fast tracks, shipping from Canada to state’s can take a while, Clover House has a nice assortment of different tie widths and thickness for different scales
What´s the cost of additional wires and solders of let say 50 turnouts, versus electronic safety devices that must fit in 100 locomotives ? Gadget costly and that can breake.
I prefer simpler cheaper less complicated Boomer´s way. A roll of wire + solder flux + solder cost nothing in comparison and you can get at any Lowes...or go to hobby shop, or mail order, your electronic device being banged in subzero weather during shipping...
Wire is the best by far. Those gizmos are good on bad track with bad current. I think.
In this hobby if I can scratch build it I will. I know I am sort of old fashion this way but it brings me great joy to build a turnout that works great and I never think about it again. I have become somewhat of a fan of "frog juicers" as well since they switch the frog polarity automatically with no shorts. ;-)
Thank You for this Boomer.😃
No problem 😊