Why Everyone Says Zato-1 is Terrible Now
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- čas přidán 8. 07. 2024
- #fightinggames #guiltygear #guiltygearstrive
Zato 1 was a very polarizing and high performing character in previous versions of Guilty Gear Strive, but now he has all but disappeared. What happened?
Thanks to my teammate Jonathan Tene for the help for the vid, check him out on YT and Twitter here
YT - / @jonathantene944
Twitter - / jonathan_tene
0:00 - iNTRO
0:30 - What type of character is Zato and what is good about him
3:50 - Season 3 Changes
11:14 - Reactions to his nerfs and why people thought he got nerfed the way he did
12:10 - The Winter Patch
14:18 - Is there hope for Lato 1
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Edited by ChadDrawsThings - / chaddrawsthings
Thumbnails by Tsuntenshi - / tsuntenshi
#gaming #lordknight - Hry
Last GG vid for a little bit since we got some new games coming out, but don't worry, I'm still on the game. Are you team #FreeEddie or should Zato stay dead?
Again shoutouts to lord Jonathan Tene for the assistance on the vid.
(also pls subscribe)
Free Eddie!
Leave Eddie as is and give Zato his wings back , nerfing both of them in the same patch was ridiculous
Zato needs his legs back. all he has now is Leap Frog in neutral
I wouldn't mind buffs to Zato as long as he remains having to respect defensive system mechanics and Eddie downtime is still meaningful.
I think it's deserved for the Zato-1 mains that were still huge crybabies while playing a guy who got 2 top 8 placements in Evo one year, but they should rebuff him, carefully. Wild assault for a guy whose next best approaching option is 6H or something (I don't main Zato) sounds like a huge benefit in relation to other characters.
As a Ramlethal main, I do like comparing other characters to her as people seem to think she's top 5, even though I only heard about her winning a big tournament over a year and months into the game's lifespan (not to say she's bad at all). She already had better approaching moves than Zato, just sometimes needs rc to be safe from them. So comparatively, Zato probably takes more from gaining wild assault, in my opinion. More of a gain to pressure, combos, wallbreak because he can get closer but Ram doesn't need to tbh.
His float is still annoying, he can open a moving wall of armor that he can cancel, sword super is still great, CRAZY damage, his HS is hella active and his 2S is a very good poke, damage has been lowered so he can live longer (especially if he decides not to wa) so Zato has more chance to wall stunlock/combo you for wincon. Zato-1 mains need to get on antidepressants or something if they can't think positively and try, I have never believed a Zato downplayer since Strive.
Rams can't ignore burst anymore either, things change. We got a lockdown move mid screen? I've seen Zato throw Eddie behind someone and mix them before that. Zato's always had better mix-up than Ram, her mids are just built different. He can wallbreak off 1 drill Eddie into grounded jabs if he wants, and for me at least, he's always been unpredictable. He's good, bottom 10 or 5 in Strive would still be GOOD by fighting game standards. Zato mains just need to chill and ig play a new character if he isn't fun anymore, this isn't anything like the 'literally unplayable' low tier ass of the olden days, any Zato main can still win.
. . . And after writing this, FreeEddie. I WANT Zato-1 to be good, the better my opponent and their character is, the better it feels to beat them (except HC pre-nerfs). Bugs me to the moon when anyone tries to blame their main or credit my character for my win, I'd prefer if everyone thought their character carries
For what it's worth the cooldown being the same as xrd isn't entirely true, in xrd eddie came back during hitstop, while in strive he does not. So strive cooldown is effectively a good amount longer than xrd despite appearing the same
Biggest thing imo is the character just loses to bursts. Losing eddie to a blocked burst is such a dumb interaction.
I think that Zato should get Eddie back in 3-4 seconds again considering how common burst is built now.
Nothing like getting punished for baiting burst.
Give me the tools to live in the past 😔😔😔
Oof 😔
It’s all gone down so deep i can’t see anymore
Daisuke you cheeky bastard, forshadowing how he would kill my character
As a zato main, im fine with them increasing eddie cooldown.. as long as we keep our tools for protecting and replenishing eddie! The one-two punch of lazier eddie in combination with being forced to block baited bursts/YRC AND command grab no longer replenishing eddie AND having flight time reduced was so brutal. Its like if they doubled the blood cost of nago's moves.. and removed the blood drain from command grab at the same time.
Zato players were punished for their perpetual downplaying, and it's rather harsh.
Can we do this with Sol now? Tired of people downplaying sol when he can do 70% combos off a 4 frame
@@liljon042 downplayer, its a 3 frame.
@@Alsry1 3 FRAMES? what the hell
@@liljon042you must not have been here at launch. I have "3f 5k" burned into my brain from how much people whined about it.
@@evilded2 oh no I was there at launch. I just don't keep up with the community at launch since most launch communities are super toxic.
zottom-1
Arcsys has a habit of releasing games with top tier or broken puppet characters, and then all but deleting them from the game a couple patches later
Xrd Zato also suffered from the same fate.
Continuum Shift 1 Rachel kek
Carl's still top three to this day...
This is the curse of zato in every game, ac and rev 😢
Zappa though
Other things that could have been mentioned:
Key normals like his P buttons getting nerfed
The introduction of WA locking him out of burst more often
Losing Gold Burst -> Sword super; Zato was definitely one of the best abusers of gold burst in previous patches
The burst attack level scaling rework: Zato *used* to be able to get Eddieless conversions via c.s/5k j.d, regardless of if the defensive option was baited with BTL or c.s/5k jc. Now he cannot wall break or reliably convert for big damage in these instances.
The invite hell thing actually is kind of a pain in the ass, since invite hell was already a normal hit launcher when done meaty, but the buffs actually changed the routing/timing for the launch.
Can Zato still win games? Of course, his offense has gone from best in class to like 3rd or 4th best offense in the game. I don't think the BTL change was accidental, I think Arcsys was generally pretty worried about him baiting burst/defensive options to maintain offense. Additionally, Arcsys has been making 5H sword super less and less interactable over the patches, making it more viable to loop pressure (it still has a gap if you have reversals, but still).
Personally, just giving us BTL back as an option to bait defensive mechanics would be fine. Everything else *can* be played around, or selected better for, but our routing got incredibly homogenized, more predictable, and less burst safe while being more punishing if we got bursted ends up being like 3 or 4 compounding nerfs in one.
I mean considering all of the nerfs, giving BTL back the capability of ignoring burst (and, if I am being being greedy, also making Eddie come back faster while using it) would probably not make him busted asf. It just feels like right now, his entire kit has been completely bogged down by the system changes.
@@konakonizumi1869 nah
I think giving break the law back and making his command grab auto regen Eddie would already make him way more viable. Zato's strengths came from the fact that he interacted with the system mechanics in a way that most characters outside of top 5 didn't. If he called out your YRC or Burst, you're done for. Now, you as the opposing player gets a slap on the wrist and back to neutral where Eddie hasn't come back yet. Bursting or YRCing Eddie out is almost a win-con against him. Why would you pick a char where his main selling point was how overwhelming he is when he gets going, if he loses badly agaisnt the overrall defensive mechanics of the game while reaping no substantial rewards for calling it out?
Fr arcsys really killed him before o even tried to learn and i cant find any resources
Break the Law might be a reference to the Judas Priest song Breaking the Law.
Zato did not deserve what was done. I struggled facing him but I had respect for the people playing him, they worked hard for their damage.
They were not working that hard before😂
@@having765 I have some news for you, no character in this game works hard
I kind of feel like Zato was a perfect designed character before season 3, clear flaws that could be exploited but he could work around them, but the combination of nerfs and system changes destroyed him. :(
@@80me16 Personally disagree, it was really easy for him to have you block 1 thing from a neutral position and run uncontestable 50/50s on you into big damage rinse repeat and even if Eddie died he still had some of the best buttons in the game, flight and invite hell to reasonably stall until he could just do it again. I think the only thing they should revert back for him is Break the law and maybe not have Eddie die from burst considering they're fullscreen now
@@alexreda7805 I think Faust and Testament generally work pretty hard
Help our boy…
Thank you for this vid.
Honestly as a mid level player that just returned to the game a couple of weeks ago the changes feel like an overkill of the character; it's not as if he's unplayable or can't win anymore, the damage is still there, but it feels like i have to work so much more than my opponent to win, plus these changes emphasize the worst aspect of the character imo, the run away style when eddie is dead. I'm no expert, but probably shaving 1/1.5 seconds off from eddie recovery and bringing break the law to its working condition (because rn honestly the move has no purpose and feels like a demo version of what it should be) should be enough
@konakonizumi1869 bruh this vod is season 2
@konakonizumi1869GOATAGON HIMZUMI IN THE WILD
I did not expect to hear the Lamment of Innocence ost here, I absolutely adore it.
People put L at the beginning of the character’s name because of Faust in S1. Laust kinda looks like the word last, and some people thought he was bottom one then.
I think the L stuff isn't BECAUSE of Faust lol, but yeah it was one of the bigger ones at the start of the whole trend
it's from Hook and east coast dbfz
season 2 lamcha
i always thought it was meant to sound like the word "Lost" which is funnier to me lol
1. Zato has a big problem with strive mechanic: burst killing eddie, yrc killing eddie, rrc bypasses oppose when opponent airdash-giving everyone free air super against zato. At least make eddie recover faster if it's hit by a defensive mechanism
2. Flight change is great imo because now the delay before drop down is shortened and can catch your opponent off guard. There is no way to cancel flight without hitting one of the attack buttons.
3. Btl switch is.... almost useless? It's great for catching opponents off guard at far range playing defensive, but doesn't exactly do anything that current eddie can't in combo
4. Invite +2 is cool. Playing neutral feels much easier and I didn't know why before this vid.
I see Daisuke’s vision I picture a future where is zato gone reduced to ashes never have to fight one ever again and it’s working I won’t stop until the zato isn’t even a cliff note in strive meta
Someone couldn’t handle the mix and resorted to blaming the beasts.
@@feedingz7132 zato players have only themselves to blame they downplayed him to hell and back and got nothing for it
Zato should die and Eddie should take over his corpse again.
based
great coverage
The first time I heard a bad character with an “L” in replace of their first letter was my main Faust. KizzyKay was the first person I heard that from😂😂
The disconnect of perceived character strength between casual and pro levels is insane. It does make ASW's job of balancing between the two extremely hard.
Still though, as much as I hated fighting Zato as a very casual player it sucks for Zato mains to have their man die from a patch like he did in canon that one time xD
Zato bros... THEY DONT WANT TO SEE US EAT
I played Gran for a week, so I didn't watch some of your videos, LordKnight, but I'm back now, so no need to worry :)
Good soundtrack choice at the start. I love Lament of Innocence.
7:08 the way he said it im cackling. They way they did my boy Eddie is criminal
This may be due to junking his effort to payout ratio, especially compared to pre-Strive (which generally dumbed down Zato and others IMO)
But characters like Zato are played due to how the difficulty is rewarded well, junk that and there goes 99% the interest. By this measure, nerfs hit them harder than simple types.
These characters often have targets on them for nerfs because the majority, who prefer simpler characters, hate dealing with lockdowns, heavy mix ups, etc.
Topic is on my mind as same thing happened to Idol Showdown's Aki
That's general stuff before getting into season 3's new stuff
Would love to see you on a podcast collaborating with other FG players as guest hosts talking about various topics weekly
If they wanna give him a new move it could just be a variant of break the law that speeds up Eddie meter charge and is unaffected by burst, at the cost of being unable to move.
Idk, that might be too busted.
I learned the game to play him and I've lab him for hours and hours before playin him onlin, I've dropped the game the moment the nerf dropped. It was already really hard to learn the basics as it was now it's horrible to play him as a new player.
Pickup Jacko or Asuka brother. Or wait for Zappa
Balancing a character based on how strong they were in the previous game is such a stupid thing but it happens way too often.
zato rn feeling like the ending of his song
Zato's low points feel so bad that it makes it not fun to play even when you win
It bothers me when I hear people say that things in the patch notes weren't there when they are. The break the law change was in the patch notes just not under Zato's. It was the universal change that made it so that YRC would hit characters who are strike invulnerable, because BTL functions as invincibility not like a super low profile or something. I think blue burst always hit invun but for that BTL avoided the hit box so in that case it was the full screen part that affected the interaction.
Anji gets to spin past YRC for free and Faust gets to tank a burst after pull, I'm not saying they don't deserve it, but I want my shit too
yo that catherine music
As a Ky main who downplayed our character into being even LESS honest despite what we say, this just sounds like a shenanigan issue, condition Arcsys better next time
Nah kybro, season one sucked. S2 was at least mid.
@@pairofrooks Exactly dude we propaganda'd our way into a higher tier
@@lemone630 it's not propaganda if it's true tho
the break the law thing was in the patchnotes btw
because it's not a change to break the law, it's a change to yrc and burst
it said that they can not be invuln'd through anymore in general
My guess on intent is that they didnt wannna see people white assault through those
Thank you for addressing our suffering. We have been ruined, bruised, and battered by the season 3 patch. But we must hold out brothers, they could fix our Boi. Even if they don't, we must keep moving, we must keep fighting, WE WILL CARVE OUR OWN WAY!!!!
I believe "breaking the law" is a reference to an old judas priest song also called braking the law, but it's just a guess.
His situation after getting bursted is so sad
I think he deals with deflect shield better than most characters.
In the clip you showed the opponent was still in block stun so Zato1 could of just ran up for additional strike throw pressure
Compare that to other characters who may need to play the f.s/6p/2s rps game after getting deflect shield'd and ide say he wins out there. Esspecially since that means that 50% less burst the opponent now has just to block more?
Just an observation im not saying it doesnt hurt his mix just that compared to others it looks like he deals with it better than most.
Good vid LK!
ZATO MAINS, ASSEMBLE!!!
I'm fine with nerfs, but they really just killed him again. There's just no juice worth the squeeze with zato in this version, even with decades of experience. I'm just waiting till he's playable again.
Haven't tuned in for a couple of months, I dig the salt and pepper beard + hair.
I never get to face him now and i'm mad because I wanna practice the matchup so bad since I played marlinpie* and he kicked my ass with it.
Zato did get a new move, the break the law switch with eddie thingy, it just sucks.
Wasn't zato really good in xrd before they nerfed him to the ground? I don't actually know because I never played xrd, but that's what I heard.
He was yes.
Iam team #free zato though I liked seeing him doesn't feel like guilty gear without him. Same thing happened to kokonoe/ Leroy. You just saw zato too much. But the Nerf was unessary system machanics made already made him harder play
It makes me sad that they made me quit my main. I was really close to celestial on Zato
Anjis Kou being my favorite anti air in the game helps a lot of Zato’s air stalling, same with Millias
Why he doing the “Jeice!” in the thumbnail though?
My rough impression of Zato in Xrd was that he had a dead-even matchup meta with Bedman. Either one of them could win.
If they could maintain that meta in Strive, I think Zato players will be fine moving forward.
LK IS SO FINE. I LOVE WATCHING YOU PLAY IN TOURNEYS
Just reverting BTL nerfs would be big
Just make eddie easier to recall... Why is the manual recall, which literally removes hakf your character, unsafe from everything on block? It should be safe when done empty out of nothing in neutral.
I literally shout this from rooftops.
Bruh I wish he was lato that gun got an incarnon form
A lot of this video reads like "Why Zato deserved it"
I mained zato but quit strive entirely because they just want everyone to play boring characters like ram, may, nago. Taking away everything interesting in the game, like axel bomber loops, making all the complex characters either bad, or at least, never worth it when you can just pick one of the previously mentioned characters and get celestial with a controller in the drier.
Ikr, I’ve poured my heart and soul into Bedman, but got tired of the struggle. As soon as I switched to Ram (I was only lvl 15 on her), floor 10 was no longer an issue. I decided to use Bedman for the celestial challenge since I have honor, but he, of course, lost to a Nago
Blaming the beasts? Yes. I am. The beasts are boring.
I stop playing for netcode issues tbh
Calling Nago and Ram boring is wild man
@@AubergineMans you must be new. Idk how anyone finds SH throw sword, or Beyblade into sssss or command grab fun and engaging
As someone currently playing through the castlevanias, I did not expect to hear lament of innocence at the start lmao
a good comparison to Zato is Carl since they both manually control their puppets, while still playing completely different from each other.
zato and may feel so bad to play now
Its sad to not see all the legends compete with zato, guess this gg wasnt make it for all legacy players
What Did they do to him? They took Eddie away
patches happened to Eddie
When he said shawty example it was because Baiken was the other character
RELEASE EDWARD FROM THESE SHACKLES DAISUKEEEEE
Started playing literally last night and all I've been using is zato is that wrong
#FreeEddie
PLEASE #FreeEddie but i didn't know how to fight him so i don't miss him. It's just the right thing to do
Buff Tager
Cf3 plz
He's no longer breaking the law 😭
Its actually kinda crazy how you also have to learn the PR patch culture matchup nowadays. Ky mains downplayed him as too honest and got heavily rewarded. GL players downplayed him to the bottom to bring him to the top
Zato players downplayed him for years but what did they get? Nerfed even deeper into the shadows. Skill issue I guess next time get better propaganda…?
Get a more honest character.
Y'all forgave too many shenanigans
Zato wasnt a bad character when Zato clowns were downplaying him.
Zato is also like Potemkin because nobody likes to play him so people nerf him.
@@heracrossz7701Potemkin is who I see the most, even in floor 10
Eyyyyy its a real guilty gear game now, zato went from top tier to trash in a single patch.
Doesn't matter if they keep nerfing zato they'll still be players cooking out there with him
ayo
Not gonna lie i'm glad this character got nerfed, but i still want the zato bastards to have fun, so arcsys please #FreeEddie, but keep the flight bad that thing is obnoxious.
damn i started playing zato a couple months into the game because of how braindead it was at launch, sad to see the character is in such bad shape now.
So you’re saying that the only thing keeping Zato top tier was 1) not actually having to manage his resource 2) being un-burstable? Why couldn’t they let him keep that?
They murdered my boy in cold blood
This was a preemptive nerf for the crazy ass new move: Invite heaven. Idk what it does, but it gonna be busted.
Strive players will always be afraid of characters returning to their TRUE GG Form
# freeeddie
Worst character you say ?
I always wanted to learn Zato, this might be the time.
Thanks for the breakdown, haven’t been keeping up with the patch notes, been a while since I ran into Zato.
He’s still good, Zato players want you to think he’s the worst character in the game while you block 7 mixups into eddy recall over and over while he builds 13 bars of meter
Lmao, except you forget yrc and burst immediately gets rid of eddie and leave Zato on his own for about 7 seconds. You literally can't bait anything with Zato because even if he the read is correct, he still loses eddie on block. Just watch his matches against slayer, its probably the hardest matchup in the game.
Zato players were cooking too hard we had to nerf them
They butchered my boy😢
Buff bedman
I dropped him entirely in season 3 and i kinda stopped playing the game since because Zato was pretty much the only fun character for me to play aside from Goldlewis and Bedman. I think Asuka is cool and Sol is fun but eh
I don’t have any problem with having to wait a bit longer for Eddie. Just don’t make me lose Eddie for blocking YRC and burst, I made the right play, why am I getting punished?
he's paying for his sins
Nerfs kill characters, nerfs kill games
I think the Eddie nerf time is good but nerfing other neutral options may have been much 😭
i don't personally like how zato was able to force noninteractions for the majority of season 2 and as much as im not keen on letting him have those tools back for free, he is one of the characters right now who should reasonably stand to gain something from the coming patch.
based on current patch trajectory, arcsys definitely wants him to be interacting with the rest of the roster more often so if he's going to going to get improvements to BTL then he's going to get something taken away somewhere else that makes the threat of what comes after successfully using BTL not hit the opponent as hard as it would
conversely if arcsys wants to maintain how things like BTL works currently then they could do things like maybe giving back a second on eddie's gauge but changing oppose to drain eddie's gauge more depending on what eddie gets hit by when using it or maybe something else like nerfing sun void somehow or do something very different like making zato's own moves better and making something like drills less active maybe
in any case, i think zato is positioned to receive a net buff in the next patch but i doubt it will be only buffs for him next patch
Giving Eddie one second faster recovery but nerfing Oppose or Sun Void would be a net nerf.
They kneecapped the man and im not mad about it
I don't feel bad for zato he is paying for his sins and all the zato doomers got what they kept talking about now but I am surprised he got nerfed ark system top tiers are almost never nerfed out of top 3 or 5
That Zato pack hittin rn, rest in piss you wont be missed
scrub detected
@@hichembelaidi2128your char got cooked cope🤡
Super Scrub Detected 🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡☢️☢️☢️☢️☢️☢️
Seems balanced to me 😀
Zato players are welcome to come play plus r and xrd. They're better games too ❤
What I got from this video is that Zato used to be able to nullify defensive system mechanics and his main weakness (Eddie downtime) was negligible. Now he has to deal with system mechanics and Eddie dying is really bad for him. Sounds good to me.
He wasn't able to just nullify them he just had really good ways around them and he was balanced around that fact. Eddie downtime was also not his main weakness, just part of it. They were awful changes,
Bro has white hairs in his 30s?
Zato can stay dead unless they adjust flight height imo(sorry Tene)
Yes, because flight duration nerf and jab nerfs and system mechanics and Eddie being gone for ten years still isn't enough for you to be able to fight this character?
@@alexreda7805 Correct.
@@Kolos1001 praying that you'll one day be good at the game 🙏
@@alexreda7805 me too ty
Everyone is worst on strive compared to the real guilty gears 😏