is there a way to get this combo done consistently RAW against enemies not wearing any metal? basically i'm asking how can we get hard to remove metal on any target.
Pin someone down and use the uncommon magic item immovable rod, cast heat metal. It can hold 8000 pounds and needs a DC strength of 30 to move the rod.
@@dejanbeep6293 it can actually be various ways. It could be a god, it could be power of nature, it could be an artifact ect. Clerics and druids are a bit similar cause in ad&d they were just slightly diffrient so it becomes confusing. I think worked metal would still break their divine connection since it's far as unnatural you can go. So ye, druids channels divine power
@@dejanbeep6293 no one actually reads how it works lol. Lorewise you can even take an oath pansexuality as a paladin, just your dm needs to homebrew that lol. But canon wise it is possible.
This is really funny and reminds me of something I had planned for a roleplay thing I was doing with friends: a fae lord that will claim random things as payment for favors, such as stealing what would be someone's death a moment before it happens. Or for something fitting here, stealing a spell as it was cast
@@TaosoftheVoid lol I love this idea. Surely a formula for some incredibly wacky encounters. I just imagine them showing off what they've taken like The Collector, "and here we have the death of one Warblegrim Erranis" Person being shown this: "oh my that looks like it was a painful way to go!" "They're thriving"
Better thing about heat metal, it pairs with shatter. Shatter destroys unworn items, so they are forced to either take all that damage, or just lose their weapon/armor.
Grapple another party member, Monsters or NPC Bosses are usually tougher or have higher hp than players, so take a party member hostage, if the druid doesnt want to cook his buddy alive then he has to make a choice, also is the Boss alone? wtf? if that is the case then just lie down and die.. A mage henchman casts dispel, the druid flies around and not taking threats, his other party members takes all the beating, effectively reducing their pool of hit points, its not OP depends on the competence of the world villains..
To be fair, that on a grand scale is something that works to explain "why doesn't this work?" "Oh it does, technically, but the gods don't really take kindly to it and the last time someone used it as their main strategy the gods collectively lit him up so bad that nobody tries anymore.
@@donovan1345 yeah. Plenty of ways around heat metal. You could put a javelin or an arrow with a metal tip in em but they can be removed rather easily and aren't worth the spell slot I think.
Tip for DMs: It takes 5 minutes to take of Plate Mail *while keeping the armor intact*, if the enemy doesn’t care, the could probably start cutting and slashing and tearing at the leather holding the armor in place and get it off way faster
you cant cut or slash a metal plate, that's the whole point of wearing one, the best you can do is cut at the straps, which, is far harder to do, because they are put in places that make it harder to do, as that's one of its few weakpoints. as a side note, this would probably not work in real life, because NOONE wears a metal armor on their skin, they use some padded cloths, because, this exact thing happens when they wear armor under the sun. so you know. its a great idea, that just wouldnt really work.
I think if the damage rolls are low, one could absolutely say that the padded cloth underneath protects them from the majority of the damage, and if the rolls are high, perhaps the armor was so hot it started to burn holes through the underlayer, or things shifted during combat and some of the red hot metal made contact with the skin in a meaningful way. I love finding ways to creatively explain the dice result rather than worry about reasoning why it shouldn't have happened, so long as the math is relatively balanced.
@@skyrhinoceros i would hate to play at your table. a roll of 2 is two damage ignoring armor. Full stop. This isnt cheating. It makes sense. stop nerfing player ingenuity.
@@RichardLeslieWhereat if we start dipping into realism, I could rule as a DM that they start taking levels of exhaustion instead. Since that would make it significantly sweatier and harder to breath in heavy armor.
@@piranhaplantX if we wanna take it into realism, the platemail wearer will have layers of padding between them and the metal, mostly of leathers and cloth, making them very insulated against the heat of the metal.
@@johnathansanford8206 I think you missed my point, as I'm responding to someone who mentioned gambeson (the name for the main portion of padding) While that may, temporarily, protect you from severe burns, on the body. That does not protect you from the air around the metal, and in your helmet, from getting warmer and exhausting you. Which was already an issue for people fighting in full platemail to begin with, the added heat would make it worse. It would also get progressively warmer on the body, causing you to overheat faster. Hell, you could probably die from heatstroke within the duration of the spell. Long story short, this is why we don't quote "realism" too often when discussing D&D mechanics. 5e especially is way too simplified to account for things of this sort, without some awkward homebrew.
@@johnathansanford8206 bro. If the metal is red-hot then it don't matter about padding. You're still wearing an oven at point. Red-hot metal is hot as fuck the padding wouldn't save you from the sheer heat of it
Heat metal is amazing overall. I remember one time our DM had put us in a crypt whose corridors looped around, and the final boss was a metal construct monster. So our druid cast heat metal and we just ran. This turned what should have been an epic boss battle into a massive Benny Hill.
There is a reason both DnD and PF state you have to cast on metal *equipment.* Tell me, why would a metal construct actually be hurt by being heated? What flesh is there to burn? Also if you're talking 5e? Iron Golem is not only immune, but healed by fire for exactly that reason.
@@Handles-Are-A-Stupid-Idea Uh, wasn't an golem. I think my DM took the stat block of a shield guardian. As for why it would hurt, we figured it was basically melting it, warping its plating and joints and whatnot until it broke. (also 5e rules says heat metal targets a "manufactured metal object, so I guess RAW it wouldn't work since creatures aren't objects, but hey, it felt like it made sense)
I had a D&D party do something similar once. They shoved a vial of acid into this guy's mouth, tilted his head back, and then smashed it. The most needlessly painful and horrifying death ever, and I had to narrate it...
How to be The Hug Of Death. Step 1: Play as Animated Armor Step 2: Have bard as teammate Step 3: Have the bard heat you up Step 4: Charge at enemies and hug them
"Welcome to Dungeon Master Therapy. How can I help you today?" "I made a campaign that added Transformers as an enemy race, and now all my players are using Heat Metal."
@@joshuagiehll3737 No, but they do overheat, and melt. Plus, I doubt that their internal wires, cogs, and whatever else they have under their armor doesn't necessarily handle heat as well.
2D8 is not a lot of damage and implies that it is not hot enough to melt most metals. One would think that a non-organic, mostly metal creature would largely be immune or resistant to this kind of heat attack. It’s not like fleshy things burning.
My wife just got this spell, and used it on crooked knights to get into a town. Another party member used a scroll with 'silent', rendering them a slow, agonizingly quiet death.
As a dm who loves cyborgs and has had this happen a few times, I can relate. I ended up having the cyborgs target the casters first, using ranged weapons.
after having my players use that technique a few times (thank you Zee Bashew for the suggestion) i surprised them when their latest victim just hit a button on his shoulder and the armor just fell off (cast-away armor). sure, he lost some of his AC... but they were not prepared
yeah, this is my typical approach as a DM for several campaigns. Let them have their fun, and reward them for finding and executing a cool technique, but the world is responsive, so once word spreads, enemies will respond and find a counter strategy, such as straps that can be removed in a turn, etc etc. more importantly, it raises the stakes, and encourages the party to A) keep finding new things to keep the game fresh, and B consider not just what is fun but how the world responds to their actions(this one may be less important to some tables but for mine we love the feeling of a responsive world that makes sense).
Exactly, I was pretty sure castaway armor is a thing in 5e officially as well, as a mundane 'enchantment' to apply to armor, so while this idea is pretty good, still easily counterable after the first cheese
Next step: NPC Artificer makes self-propelled armor that latches onto the one concentrating on Heat Metal. A contested grapple to not get armored up, and restraint should they fail and drop concentration.
@@aaronwilliams8887 I wish I had a DM as cool as that. All mine did was make things resistant or immune to what we found out because they can't think of a way to stop it and it became extremely less fun when it became DM vs. Players.
This is why you get hold of a Mithral Breastplate if you use medium armor - specifically because of the fact that the spell requires you to *see* the metal that you are targeting. Mithral armor, specifically Chain Shirts and Breastplates can be worn under clothing, rendering it immune to being targeted by the spell.
WHY would you need to do metal armor under your cloth, if you already use a padded suit INSIDE the metal armor to begin with. do people really dont know how armor works?
Even better idea as a DM running a high level game; Have an enemy with heal metal fight alongside an iron golem. Cast heat metal to give it free healing every single round. Then make sure the caster doesn't die.
An iron golem is a creature and not an object, so it is not itself a valid target. But if you give it "extra armour", that would be a valid target, and this also gives you a flavour reason for buffing its HP/damage/AC to make it an actual challenge for high level play. Now, imagine if he had three caster friends, and the other two gave him delayed blast fireballs to hold, one in each hand!
@@saltypork101 my forever GM proposed the twisted idea of an Iron golem with a fire mephit housed in an empty cavity of the golem. ...he's min-maxy with his combat encounters
@@satan3763 i like to think its a demon tempting him to commit funtime and knows of the chastity belt and casts heat metal on it to make him take it off so its easier to get him to commit the sin
@@laynebonham3968 This is the beauty of it. You take warcaster, dip into artificer and craft a belt of fire resistance. You are not losing concentration, you are simply an Iron Maiden from hell itself. At early levels all you need is Heroism and you are good.
Honestly tho, this is probably one of the more realistic ways someone would use magic in combat, as well as one of the more accurate depictions of how scary heat is irl
@Fractal Paradox oven mittens are used because they work. Its be uncomfortable, but you wouldnt be scalded, and itd take minutes for you to start baking alive good and proper.
@ijones36 Yeah, I think we are talking about different scales of heat here. Mittens work for your average baking temps (up to like 400°C, but usually around 180). Red hot steel a thousand or more degrees, in direct contact with your gambeson, would likely set it on fire, and _severely_ burn you, and even if you are able to throw yourself into a river or something and escaped burns, you'd be dealing with lots of smoke in your eyes and lungs, plus the heat, which even if isn't enough to burn you alive in seconds, would be extremely uncomfortable. Nobody would just get up and resume fighting after that.
Honestly? If an NPC lost an action and 4 or 5 points of armor class due to ripping off their armor, I'd be ok with it. My spell would still have had a massive effect on the fight. Think of it like this: imagine a spell that could give an enemy -5 AC for the rest of the fight and make them lose an action. Without a saving throw. What level would that spell be?
Ah, but they have disadvantage on ability checks, and so one could just argue that flexing to destroy the armour would be an ability check. NPCs and monsters have to make them too, after all. And it might even cost their entire action to do so.
@@marcosdheleno While true, the size of the substance being heated would also factor into things realistically. Something that weighs 2 lbs being made red hot is generating much less heat than an object that weighs 40 lbs being heated to be red hot, presuming they are made from the same material, so larger objects being heated should technically do more damage than smaller objects. Because D&D is not meant to be a realistic physics simulator.
That is what grappling is for. And someone with heary armor usually has a high strength as well. So while the caster may run away, if his friends are left behind the hot armor will give them a hug.
I mean theres also just....using your reaction to deck the squishy spell caster as they try to flee melee range from having to touch your armor, and having a low ass AC because they tried to use wildshape to run faster, forcing concentration to drop, but that works too lol
@@lonelywolf1784 He used a level 9 example. This isn't even that good anyway at low level, how often are your enemies going to survive the damage for long enough. 2D8 on a bonus action isn't the most insane thing in the world. Spike growth is much better.
@@Kitusser spike growth sucks for damage. Terrain denial, sure, it's alright, but it'll only do 2d4 damage damage for every 5ft they move, and even if they fail the save to notice it as hazardous they likely aren't just gonna run back and forth through your spikes.
@@Kitusser Which would equate to 16d4 damage, which is less than HALF of the maximum possible damage for Heat Metal (20d8). The advantage that Spike Growth has here is when there's multiple targets, provided you're casting it in a choke point and your enemies don't succeed on the wisdom save.
That reminds me of a mechanic in Metal Gear Solid 5, dunno if happens in other games too. But in that one if you take out a lot of enemies via (for example) sniper headshot, they begin wearing helmets, so you have to change tactics over time or enemies adapt.
he doesnt even need to do that. all he need to do is know that you dont wear metal armor over your bare skin. you use some padded cloth. because, metal armor gets hot under the sun. so you know, people already countered that when designing and wearing armor.
@@kinsan89 cloth is a great insulator. and it works both ways. thngs like gamberson were still used under metal armor to avoid burns from sun heat. it all depend on how hot you can make it. also, metal is great at transfering heat, so, if anything, most of the heat will be lost to the air, as opposed to the person inside.
I learned this lesson when I came up with the idea of putting diverse self-concentrating glyphs of warding onto the "surface" of my artificer's gear... Then the BBEG suddenly revivified himself off a glyph on his cloak.
Yeah, my DM tried copying my sheet once. I did actual D&D judo on him. 46 CMB anyone? I conveniently forgot to include his whole item list too, so it was really fun when his toon was tied up with what's essentially a medieval bike lock (braided iron)
Wildshaped Druid using heat metal: "Ha ha! You're on fire!" The Hot metal Knight upon giving up on the Druid who has fled: "Come 'ere, wizard! I've a real nice hug!"
@@janschievink1586 I actually had a player in my campaign ask me if his Warforged Druid could cast heat metal on himself. . . Sadly it doesn't work since it has to be an object and while he is classed as a construct he's still a creature. Then he told me his Warforged is also female, so I had to allow it after that.
@@Noobie2k7 LOL surprise sexism. On a more serious note I was under the impression armor and weapons still counted as objects but the racial ability integrated armor prevents their removal without the wearers intent were you still using the Unearthed Arcana version?
I used Heat Metal as a paladin to break into a vault. The vault guard had gone down, but the key got bent out of shape in the process. I have the bright idea to cast Heat Metal and use my 19 strength to very carefully bend the key back into shape. The key is put in the lock and we prepare to loot when one of the players (who has actually done some blacksmithing) points out that the key should be incredibly brittle now. After a bit of back and forth, the DM splits the difference and has the key break off in the vault door, permanently forcing the lock open. Better hurry to the next area, because the next patrol that passes by will definitely notice and raise the alarm. Didn't matter to us, because we still got our loot with minimal effort :P
The artificer in my party abuses the SHIT out of this spell. He's in heavy plate and can regularly get bonus AC effects, so no one can hit him to break concentration. Best incident was when we were facing a lich riding a white dragon: "so, does that saddle have metal on in?" (GM groans) "yes…" "Awesome :)"
This is why you wear a gambeson under the plate. No metal touches the skin, and the gambeson is a good insulator. Just run up and hug someone the Druid likes. I hear they like trees.
@@noecarrier5035 Normally linen. Every suit of plate has a gambeson or similar garment underneath. It'll smoulder after a few rounds. The thing about gambesons is that they get soaked in sweat after a while, so the spell isn't so much barbequeing the fighter as much as boiling them in their own sweat the first round or two.
OK but you don't put pizza on the heated metal in your stove, the fact that it's IN the stove is good enough to cook it. Now imagine that your suit of armor is now a stove.
"Its too much to give Druids access to Fireball! Its too powerful, give them Revivify and Plant Growth instead!" Meanwhile the druid: "That's some nice armor there that takes 5 minutes to throw off."
@@Kitusser Not really. Its a 100ft radius for no damage and its difficult terrain-like feature applies to ALL creatures that pass through it, including you and your allies. Yes you've slowed the enemies down, I hope to god you didn't do this indoors, but if you did it outdoors I also hope you were far enough away to have it matter and have decent enough ranged attacks to hit targets over that area. Not saying its bad, but an immediate 8d6 smack to the rack is applicable in many situations as provided you didnt nuke your own party using it, you just dealt a ton of damage to multiple foes and possibly just created a massive fire hazard for foes to move through (if you wanted it of course). You think difficult terrain is nasty? Imagine difficult terrain but its chipping at your health as you move through it AFTER you got dunked on by 5e's equivalent of your average real life hand grenade.
You forget, Warforged have an 'integrated armor' ability, which requires 1 hour to don or doff armor of any kind. Which makes heat metal really friggin hurt
I remember I did this in a cave system with my Druid. We were chasing a BBG fighter dude, I casted it on his armor and wild shaped into a spider and hid on the ceiling like 50ft away from him. Good times
two more details about this spell that I love: One, you cannot quench it so even the person wearing the plate armor of toastiness jumps into a lake, it doesn't stop. Now they have to worry about drowning. Two, it says a piece of metal, so if some mage decides to flex in their shiney metal tower..... Yeah... circumstantially an evil spell.
in my homebrew tabletop rpg, i've made one of the basic elemental spells with this exact hidden intent in mind. it's called fire hand, and covers the hand of the caster in fire for a number of turns. while the effect is active, that hand specifically is immune to heat and fire, and has all the properties and interactions of fire, it also deals a low set amount of damage on contact. it's presented and worded as a utility thing that kind of encompass the idea of an affinity with fire, being able to handle hot things, easily lighting fires, using fire as light source, and so on. but i basically did that hopping some player would make a grappling mage out of it one day.
Twinned Spell wouldn’t work, but not for the above reason. The rules state that the effects of the same spell cast twice don’t combine, the example given being two castings of a Bless spell doesn’t give a 2d4 bonus. But Heat Metal affects an object and causes damage to something touching it and the damage is on the caster’s turn. Twinned Spell specifically states that it is used with spells that target creatures, and a metal object is not a creature (though possibly an exception for constructs made of metal). If Heat Metal was casted twice on the same object, it wouldn’t deal double damage, but if it was casted on, say, a shield and a suit of armor by two separate mages, there’s no reason it wouldn’t deal double the damage since the target is two separate objects and the damage occurs on two different turns. I don’t see any reason casting it like this would fall under the category of same spell effects, because this spell operates similarly to Spiritual Weapon and I can’t imagine anyone saying that someone can only take damage from one Spiritual Weapon per turn even if they get hit by two in a single turn. But, again, Twinned Spell wouldn’t work since it allows you to target two creatures, and metal objects aren’t creatures
@@thetruezoneinyou can, but not on the same creature, thats why heat metal works, because it targets a piece of metal, and a creature can be wearing more than one piece of metal.
I won a PvP session as a bard with Heat Metal and run. I also once stood inside a stone pillar and the five seconds of “oh shit” in my DM’s eyes as he tried to work out how he was going to get me to come back out again rather than just waiting for the other players to pick each other off was golden.
@@ryynerwicked2762 They were both one-shot pvp sessions where the aim was to win against your fellow players, I would not do this in a normal campaign. My DM used to run them when too few people could make our regular sessions because they didn’t take too much prep time on his end and several of the players (including me) were very new to the game, so it gave us a chance to get more familiar with combat and other classes/races/features.
For any DMs that have this done to them, remember that the 5min. Doffing of plate armor or any doffing, is the time it takes to take the armor for re-use. You could take an action and cut the straps holding the armor together, just remember to lower the AC of the creature in that case as they can't use it without some repairs at that point
@@LastnameIchose alright, so maybe 3 or 4 rounds then, because it's a process of cutting a few pieces of leather strap, which would also be weakened by the heated metal
Even easier method. Heat metal just doesn’t work like that because what fucking psycho is just wearing the plate on their bare skin?!?! Congrats, the plate armour is hot now and the target will start sweating like crazy because of their gambeson
Here's a session/combat encounter idea: the party is in a crowd, traveling through the city, when the tanks plate mail suddenly begins to burn red hot. Have them roll initiative, but the only "enemy" on the initiative table at first is the Heat Metal damage counter, where it'll deal damage in the round. What does your party do? Do they hunt down the caster? Try to dispell it? Maybe for the sake of the encounter you could say the caster needs to stay within 60 ft of their target, or maybe the caster panics as soon as they think they're noticed and run, so the party only needs to get relatively close to finding them. But no matter what they do now, the assassination attempt was clear.
There's actually a Common magical item that can counter Heat Metal: The humble Cast-Off Armor. A bit pricey at low levels... but hey, so's plate too, right?
If you have the Transmuted Spell Metamagic option, you could overcome otherwise fairly common resistances. (For 1 sorcery point, you can change any damage type of a damage spell that is covered by chromatic orb into another that is also covered by chromatic orb). That, and it can become a much more brutal spell than it already is. For example, forcing armor to suddenly surge in electricity or suddenly secrete acid sounds much worse than being cooked with heat. Maybe even turn your opponent into a walking loud speaker with thunder damage to blow their mind metaphorically and VERY literally? Who knows? Your alignment is always thrown into question when you pick up this spell and use it on armor.
If I recall corrextly, back in 2nd and 3rd edition, Heat Metal was one of the spells that could be cast in reverse. Meaning you could chose to heat the metal red hot or encase it ice.
The range only applies to when you first cast the spell Player's Handbook p.203 Once a spell is cast, its effects aren’t limited by its range, unless the spell’s description says otherwise. And while it does have a limit of 1 minute that's still a average of 90 damage and you can get back into 60f of the target and recast upping the damage too 180 on average at 3rd level with the enemy being completely unable to do anything
If I had a Druid player use Heat Metal on an armored foe I'd make sure to include more of them in future sessions. Especially if they're a non-Moon subclass that needs to make good use of their spells. Giving each party member opportunities to get use out of their niche abilities against specific targets makes the game more fun. High AC means harder for the martials to fight, so the magic user having the right tool to handle them is good for teamwork. No idea when this will get off the ground, but planning a campaign for new players to D&D and/or just new to 5E, and one is planning to play a Stars Druid, so I hope I can be blessed with the problem of dealing with Heat Metal.
You really don't have to. If you give the creature an extra 30 hp, you have nullified the heat metal damage. So if you really want to go against the player, you just have to bump up the HP of the monsters. More importantly if they run away, that is actually a bonus to the monsters as they now have one less PC to absorb their damage.
This wouldn't actually work the way people think. Out of combat it's essentially as everyone believes. But the number of times you can realistically do that is very small given the amount of time it takes and other factors. In any sense of reality, the DM can simply say "ok, but they aren't directly touching the metal so they take no damage outside of "condition" ". This is because metal armor almost NEVER directly touches the skin, it's padded with cloth and leather for comfort and to help it stay in place. That stuff will stave the heat for at least a round or 2 before I'll give and say they take the damage from the transfer of heat. That's at least the way I'd go if I had a player try to use the spell like this. But let's say you don't do that and just take the full damage. How long does any particular non-boss encounter usually last? Maybe 3-5 rounds depending on encounter. And they are guaranteed a chance to do something before you move again (unless something happens), so you might not always get the chance to escape. And if the DM is smart they'll have at least 1 ranged opponent in case you try flying. Really it's impractical and takes way too long to kill someone. Way better to just accept their AC/turn loss with some damage or disarm literally anyone holding metal than trying to burn them and wait.
@@Inaktha I would disagree. The spell description itself says you can choose heavy or medium metal armor. Therefore while historically there was padding, that doesn't exactly exist in D&D. And if it did, the spell still says you can target heavy or medium armor, so any padding is clearly except from saving you from the damage. The spell would work exactly as most people think, because the spell itself says that it does. Granted, the game doesn't assume you are going to cast it, turn into a fast animal and run away. Granted, only a moon druid can get away with it. All other druids need to survive a round before they can retreat. More realistically, in game, the druid might be able to retreat, but the rest of the party probably cannot. So, eventually the party is going to go after the druid if they survive anyway.
@@maximumforce8275 From the players perspective that's power tripping. Instead have the roasting knight beg for his life. Go into great detail about how he screams and the horror the player is inflicting. Return the trauma back to the players. Have any other intelligent creatures watching back down, flee, or also beg to stop the spell if they all surrender. Because who wants to be slowly cooked to death? Remember, your encounters do not have to be generic bad guys being bloodbags. One of my favorite scenarios are the starving bandits. Players kill any one of them and the 'smaller, younger'/'bigger older' bandit rips off his hood and yells 'DAD!'/'SON!' and the bandits give up because they were all family/villagers. If the party wipes them the village they head to is missing a lot of people for some reason.
@@Greekphire I mean, as long as they discuss it with the group about how heat metal is OP so they're adding saving throws to it, it works You idea is cool, though
I just fell in love with the Iron Golem when I read about it in the MM, so i started planning lots of ways to got it indestructible, including Heat Metal -ing it, buuuttttt I don't have an Iron Golem. Teach me how to get one, master.
DM could easily say that since it has a range of 60ft, you have to stay within that 60ft and maintain at least partial line of sight to do that damage for the bonus action.
I would like to do a heat metal then grapple them as a dragon born that has immunity to fire. They continue to take damage since they are grappled and can’t take off their damage
That's why the original version had a time limit on it. To keep it from being OP. It was meant to disarm opponents with metal weapons and do a little bit of damage in the process. It also had a heat up time before it would cause damage. It would last 7 rounds with the first and last not causing any damage. The 2nd and 6th rounds would do 1D4. The 3rd, 4th and 5th rounds would do 2D4. So you could do a total of 8D4 heat damage. Magical stuff did give you a saving throw to not be affected, and it didn't work at all on Elven chain mail or any metal that wasn't ferrous, made with Iron. So, if you happened to have a silver or Titanium set of armor, you didn't need to worry about it at all.
Oh I remember this combo. So I was playing a moon druid in a party where the paladin was pretty arrogant, thinking he was invincible with a 20+ AC. Well, all it took was one near death experience with the "easy to hit" druid cooking him alive to shut his trap. We are still good friends to this day.
Like others have said. THIS is the reason they don’t wear armor made of metal. There’s a legendary spell out there that can incinerate you if you get caught.
My love of this spell in one group i played with legitimately led to a rise in the use of alternative materials, such as chitin, and even the creation of chitin farms and people breeding larger and larger insects, crabs, and other creatures with shells or exoskeletons
Just a quick tip for all DMs : Plate armor is worn over some sort of clothes that can be protected against high temperatures, especially if you are preparing for a group of adventurers of a level that allow second level spell (level 3 I believe) Rendering the spell effectively useless. Heat metal is a spell that is to be used by DMs in certain very specific conditions, as are a lot of spells btw.
I don't get why, but there's a lot of people that think this is a bad spell because "not everything is wearing metal armor". But even if they are not, casting it on a creatures weapon can be pretty decisive quite often. For a second level spell it does good damage, but the unavoidability of the damage makes it amazing damage even. It can cause creatures to become unarmed (effectively removing the dice from their attacks damage) or give them disadvantage on all attacks and ability checks. The biggest disadvantage of the spell is in my opinion not even the 'only metal' part (almost all dangerous creatures use weapons) but fire immunity, since fire immunity cancels the secondary effect by negating fire damage.
Casting it on weapons always depends on the DM. In my experience, every DM I've had that I've tried that with has said that the only thing I did was give the enemy a flaming weapon because the weapon had a leather handle or a handle made of some other hear insulating material.
@@sarunokoguard211 against an axe that ruling would be 'fair enough', but I have never even heard of a sword that doesn't have a mostly metal handle. Thin wrappings aren't going to protect your hands when steel is so hot it is glowing. Furthermore, the damage is dealt "when you cast it" and "as a bonus action", so it doesn't deal extra damage if they attack you with it, since you aren't using the bonus action while you are being touched. And if they do argue that the heat wouldn't go through the wrapping, swords are designed so that your hand is finely packed between the pommel and the guard, most likely touching both and both being made of metal.
@@Olav_Hansen I mean, logically a flaming weapon would hurt, unless you wanna go all rules lawyer. Personally, our party like to twist the rules if they make logical sense so the flaming/hot weapon would still deal more damage
@@TechnoArpan You are saying that logically it would deal more damage, but it wouldn't. Logically it would make a cut and then immediately cauterize that wound, resulting in reduced damage. It would still hurt a lot, but it would literally be less damaging then being cut by a normal sword would. You are acting like it's logical, but because of that pursuit you actually end up making it more unrealistic. Swords are meant to do quick cuts, so there won't be extensive wounds besides the cauterized parts.
Everyone with metal armor have to wear gamberson or other padding under the steel, so it should at least give him turn or two before jest start to build up and burn him. And i guess create wather casted under the armor should be just enough to deal with it somewhat. At least thats how i would rule as a dm
What makes this more fun is if your able to catch them in iron bands of binding first and they fail the strength save you technically trapped them in medium metal armor
Honestly I feel like this is an evil combo for the BBEG more than the PCs. Here's why Cook 'n Book doesn't work every time: -You aren't doing very much damage per turn compared to other 2nd Level Concentration spells. It won't kill the target instantly. -While you have thoroughly wrecked the day of one enemy, there's probably a lot more than one enemy you're dealing with. -If you wild shape into a horse and spend your action running away, you're putting your party at an action economy disadvantage because the burning guy, while they will have DIS on attacks, will still have the option to attack the other PCs. What would have been, say, a 4 vs 4 became a 3 vs 4. Also because of how monsters are built, monsters are always going to be more bulkier than PCs and suddenly having one PC spend their turn running around will cause more harm than good. -If you don't run away after casting Heat Metal, you're inviting the enemies to focus fire on you to try and break concentration. Anyone up for some witch burning? Now Heat Metal isn't a bad spell by any means. If you want to kill one important bad guy NPC, and if they have metal armor, THIS would be the way to do it. It's just the kind of spell that needs full party planning to be devastating. It's not a "Cast and profit" type spell like Flaming Sphere or Hold Person. Now Imagine if the BBEG had this spell and was feeling sadistic... that would be bad.
Cook n' Book at it's finest. I'll take one Death Knight, extra crispy. You can just deliver it to our discord, here's the link: discord.gg/XZahjbx8ee
Immoveable object + heat metal = DAMAGE
is there a way to get this combo done consistently RAW against enemies not wearing any metal?
basically i'm asking how can we get hard to remove metal on any target.
So is this the level 3 build to follow the level 1 and level 2?
Pin someone down and use the uncommon magic item immovable rod, cast heat metal. It can hold 8000 pounds and needs a DC strength of 30 to move the rod.
Or cast from hiding so they don’t know where you are to attack to break concentration.
"Pfft, druids. With their silly tradition of not wearing metal because I dunno, it might offend a tree or something."
"Oh you think THAT's why?"
It's because they lose their powers since divine power and stuff
There is a one god that allows metal armor tho.
Not sure how 5e changed tho
@@lorekeeper685 ok but that god wouldn't matter anyway due to druids channeling nature not divine power right?
@@dejanbeep6293 it can actually be various ways.
It could be a god, it could be power of nature, it could be an artifact ect.
Clerics and druids are a bit similar cause in ad&d they were just slightly diffrient so it becomes confusing.
I think worked metal would still break their divine connection since it's far as unnatural you can go.
So ye, druids channels divine power
@@lorekeeper685 oh wait forgot they can channel nature deities, my bad lol
@@dejanbeep6293 no one actually reads how it works lol.
Lorewise you can even take an oath pansexuality as a paladin, just your dm needs to homebrew that lol.
But canon wise it is possible.
A method colloquially known as "cook and book"
COOK AND BOOOOOOOK
hey that noble deserved it
@@elliotthood1719 *sigh * Cook and book
The best thread by far 🤣
Or "Fry and GOOD BYE"
"The invisible goblin shaman that was definitely there the entire time appears and casts dispel magic on the armor."
then proceeds to disappear in a ninja smoke bomb
Im using this (stuffs comment into bag of holding)
This is really funny and reminds me of something I had planned for a roleplay thing I was doing with friends: a fae lord that will claim random things as payment for favors, such as stealing what would be someone's death a moment before it happens. Or for something fitting here, stealing a spell as it was cast
@@TaosoftheVoid lol I love this idea.
Surely a formula for some incredibly wacky encounters.
I just imagine them showing off what they've taken like The Collector,
"and here we have the death of one Warblegrim Erranis"
Person being shown this: "oh my that looks like it was a painful way to go!"
"They're thriving"
@@TaosoftheVoidokay I love this idea and I need to use this as a "I will take my payment later" sort of thing
Oh, yeah!
As we colloquially call it at my table, the "Find Piercings" spell.
(Animated Spellbook) D&D 5E HEAT METAL
czcams.com/video/kMqE-xerANk/video.html
Sounds awesome but im wondering where thjs first appeared in a session
And also for what reason
@@heinrichwelgens1754 Forge cleric, bad sense of humour, annoying NPC.
He had one. On a nipple.
@@heinrichwelgens1754 piercings are usually made of metal :)
"Welcome to Dungeon Master Therapy how can I help you?"
My D&D group melted the Final boss of my campaign.
Oh, I'm so, so sorry...
Better thing about heat metal, it pairs with shatter. Shatter destroys unworn items, so they are forced to either take all that damage, or just lose their weapon/armor.
Can’t they just Dispel Magic?
@@TheBucketOfTruththis magic is too advanced for final boss
Grapple another party member, Monsters or NPC Bosses are usually tougher or have higher hp than players, so take a party member hostage, if the druid doesnt want to cook his buddy alive then he has to make a choice, also is the Boss alone? wtf? if that is the case then just lie down and die..
A mage henchman casts dispel, the druid flies around and not taking threats, his other party members takes all the beating, effectively reducing their pool of hit points, its not OP depends on the competence of the world villains..
It's so unfair, we had a DM basically say "That spell doesn't exist anymore due to war crimes". Now we have to think up new and inventive war crimes.
Oh so it's like the electrum wars. Maybe it was banned due to an event in the electrum wars
To be fair, that on a grand scale is something that works to explain "why doesn't this work?" "Oh it does, technically, but the gods don't really take kindly to it and the last time someone used it as their main strategy the gods collectively lit him up so bad that nobody tries anymore.
Lame ass DM
Why not just say it won’t affect anyone already touching it?
the Canadian mindset
Me - A Warforged Paladin
"Haha, I'm in danger!"
Technically it's not touching your skin... Might have to ask your DM how that works. The spell does not actually damage the metal
If your DM rules that the heat doesn't damage you, you can literally grapple your enemy to death!
I mean, you could say that the armor is part pf your body
@@Lord_necromancer The Integrated Protection feature says to don armor you must incorporate it into your body so I'd say it can't be targeted.
If it's part of Your body it's not an object
"I got this op strat guys!" "You come across a group of ogres." "Are any of them wearing plate armor?" "No."
And only works if there is one enemy, or they have metal armor on, in the first place.
Are they holding metal weapons? You can still make them drop their damage dealer.
@@jamesleibee890 Hill giant with a tree club says nope, no metal anywhere
@@donovan1345 yeah. Plenty of ways around heat metal. You could put a javelin or an arrow with a metal tip in em but they can be removed rather easily and aren't worth the spell slot I think.
You can also just remove the armor before the spell finishes casting
Tip for DMs: It takes 5 minutes to take of Plate Mail *while keeping the armor intact*, if the enemy doesn’t care, the could probably start cutting and slashing and tearing at the leather holding the armor in place and get it off way faster
And this still lowers their AC, so it’s not like you’re canceling out the value of the Heat Metal spell
@@bananabanana484hmm would i rather be easier to hit or just cook without doing a thing…
you cant cut or slash a metal plate,
that's the whole point of wearing one,
the best you can do is cut at the straps, which, is far harder to do, because they are put in places that make it harder to do, as that's one of its few weakpoints.
as a side note, this would probably not work in real life, because NOONE wears a metal armor on their skin, they use some padded cloths, because, this exact thing happens when they wear armor under the sun.
so you know. its a great idea, that just wouldnt really work.
I think if the damage rolls are low, one could absolutely say that the padded cloth underneath protects them from the majority of the damage, and if the rolls are high, perhaps the armor was so hot it started to burn holes through the underlayer, or things shifted during combat and some of the red hot metal made contact with the skin in a meaningful way. I love finding ways to creatively explain the dice result rather than worry about reasoning why it shouldn't have happened, so long as the math is relatively balanced.
@@skyrhinoceros i would hate to play at your table. a roll of 2 is two damage ignoring armor. Full stop. This isnt cheating. It makes sense. stop nerfing player ingenuity.
Heat Metal holds the position of "It may not always work, but when it works, it just works"
Because gambeson
@@RichardLeslieWhereat if we start dipping into realism, I could rule as a DM that they start taking levels of exhaustion instead. Since that would make it significantly sweatier and harder to breath in heavy armor.
@@piranhaplantX if we wanna take it into realism, the platemail wearer will have layers of padding between them and the metal, mostly of leathers and cloth, making them very insulated against the heat of the metal.
@@johnathansanford8206 I think you missed my point, as I'm responding to someone who mentioned gambeson (the name for the main portion of padding) While that may, temporarily, protect you from severe burns, on the body. That does not protect you from the air around the metal, and in your helmet, from getting warmer and exhausting you. Which was already an issue for people fighting in full platemail to begin with, the added heat would make it worse. It would also get progressively warmer on the body, causing you to overheat faster.
Hell, you could probably die from heatstroke within the duration of the spell. Long story short, this is why we don't quote "realism" too often when discussing D&D mechanics. 5e especially is way too simplified to account for things of this sort, without some awkward homebrew.
@@johnathansanford8206 bro. If the metal is red-hot then it don't matter about padding. You're still wearing an oven at point. Red-hot metal is hot as fuck the padding wouldn't save you from the sheer heat of it
If you are fighting outdoors you can become a giant badger and go underground for full cover :)
Remembering Tulok's Knuckles build...
I've actually seen a friend of mine use this to defeat a level 7 npc in a duel
Druid: *wildshapes into a bird*
The DM: And the knight whips out a flintlock and rolls a nat 20
Heat metal is amazing overall. I remember one time our DM had put us in a crypt whose corridors looped around, and the final boss was a metal construct monster. So our druid cast heat metal and we just ran. This turned what should have been an epic boss battle into a massive Benny Hill.
This, I like this. 👏
I imagine how pissed your dm was
@@elhuracanhumano1997 At first? Quite a bit. Eventually, this turned into a "best dnd moment" for him
There is a reason both DnD and PF state you have to cast on metal *equipment.* Tell me, why would a metal construct actually be hurt by being heated? What flesh is there to burn?
Also if you're talking 5e? Iron Golem is not only immune, but healed by fire for exactly that reason.
@@Handles-Are-A-Stupid-Idea Uh, wasn't an golem. I think my DM took the stat block of a shield guardian.
As for why it would hurt, we figured it was basically melting it, warping its plating and joints and whatnot until it broke.
(also 5e rules says heat metal targets a "manufactured metal object, so I guess RAW it wouldn't work since creatures aren't objects, but hey, it felt like it made sense)
I actually interrogated an npc by jamming coins in his mouth and threatening to cast heat metal. My DM most definitely needed therapy after that.
You have to see the metal you are heating.
@@KalHarTheDragon You cast it while it is on his tongue, then you make him swallow.
Nahhh you are a sociopath
@@KalHarTheDragon he could hold the NPC's mouth open
I had a D&D party do something similar once. They shoved a vial of acid into this guy's mouth, tilted his head back, and then smashed it. The most needlessly painful and horrifying death ever, and I had to narrate it...
How to be The Hug Of Death.
Step 1: Play as Animated Armor
Step 2: Have bard as teammate
Step 3: Have the bard heat you up
Step 4: Charge at enemies and hug them
Huh, does that work?
"Have the bard heat you up" can actually have two meanings
The animated armor to the bard wearing it:
"No need for flattery, you're already inside me."
"Welcome to Dungeon Master Therapy. How can I help you today?"
"I made a campaign that added Transformers as an enemy race, and now all my players are using Heat Metal."
Why would heat metal harm a transformer? It's damage comes from cooking the fleshy bits under the armor. Transformers don't have fleshy bits.
@@joshuagiehll3737 No, but they do overheat, and melt. Plus, I doubt that their internal wires, cogs, and whatever else they have under their armor doesn't necessarily handle heat as well.
Easy, make the Transformers resistant/immune to fire damage
2D8 is not a lot of damage and implies that it is not hot enough to melt most metals. One would think that a non-organic, mostly metal creature would largely be immune or resistant to this kind of heat attack. It’s not like fleshy things burning.
@@arthurbrandonnielsen So make it buff damage per every heat-up. And make some super-fast enemies. Like, flying ones. Decepticons charge!
My wife just got this spell, and used it on crooked knights to get into a town. Another party member used a scroll with 'silent', rendering them a slow, agonizingly quiet death.
The most fun part is when your dms love making cyborgs and then are somehow surprised when you cook them from the inside out with the spell
As a dm who loves cyborgs and has had this happen a few times, I can relate. I ended up having the cyborgs target the casters first, using ranged weapons.
Ah good ol Hot potatoe in Shadowrun. Always a nice trick to pull on those cyberd up elite guards.
A DM might rule that if the metal is part of the creature, it's not an object. That it only applies to held or worn objects.
after having my players use that technique a few times (thank you Zee Bashew for the suggestion) i surprised them when their latest victim just hit a button on his shoulder and the armor just fell off (cast-away armor). sure, he lost some of his AC... but they were not prepared
yeah, this is my typical approach as a DM for several campaigns. Let them have their fun, and reward them for finding and executing a cool technique, but the world is responsive, so once word spreads, enemies will respond and find a counter strategy, such as straps that can be removed in a turn, etc etc.
more importantly, it raises the stakes, and encourages the party to A) keep finding new things to keep the game fresh, and B consider not just what is fun but how the world responds to their actions(this one may be less important to some tables but for mine we love the feeling of a responsive world that makes sense).
Exactly, I was pretty sure castaway armor is a thing in 5e officially as well, as a mundane 'enchantment' to apply to armor, so while this idea is pretty good, still easily counterable after the first cheese
Next step: NPC Artificer makes self-propelled armor that latches onto the one concentrating on Heat Metal. A contested grapple to not get armored up, and restraint should they fail and drop concentration.
@@LocalMaple ......Or Artificer that sends the armor to latch on...then heat metal's it......
Going full Mark 42 Iron Man 3 with it
@@aaronwilliams8887 I wish I had a DM as cool as that. All mine did was make things resistant or immune to what we found out because they can't think of a way to stop it and it became extremely less fun when it became DM vs. Players.
"HAHAHA!! You'll never pierce my ARMOR!!"
"....pierce?" devious smiles....
Somebody called a Pyro. now BURN
You do realize that thing is Fire Elemental Myrmidon, right?
This is why you get hold of a Mithral Breastplate if you use medium armor - specifically because of the fact that the spell requires you to *see* the metal that you are targeting. Mithral armor, specifically Chain Shirts and Breastplates can be worn under clothing, rendering it immune to being targeted by the spell.
WHY would you need to do metal armor under your cloth, if you already use a padded suit INSIDE the metal armor to begin with.
do people really dont know how armor works?
Even better idea as a DM running a high level game;
Have an enemy with heal metal fight alongside an iron golem.
Cast heat metal to give it free healing every single round.
Then make sure the caster doesn't die.
Bravo good sir
An iron golem is a creature and not an object, so it is not itself a valid target.
But if you give it "extra armour", that would be a valid target, and this also gives you a flavour reason for buffing its HP/damage/AC to make it an actual challenge for high level play.
Now, imagine if he had three caster friends, and the other two gave him delayed blast fireballs to hold, one in each hand!
@@saltypork101 my forever GM proposed the twisted idea of an Iron golem with a fire mephit housed in an empty cavity of the golem.
...he's min-maxy with his combat encounters
@@byronsmothers8064 Sounds like a fun encounter.
You could also build an iron golem and do this as pc's with a manual of iron golems.
Imagine casting heat metal on some dude's steel chastity belt.
Yikes
But... but how would you know he is wearing that?
@@99xplord ;)
@@satan3763 i like to think its a demon tempting him to commit funtime and knows of the chastity belt and casts heat metal on it to make him take it off so its easier to get him to commit the sin
Chastity belts are only worn by women, because you know, it's a hole.
Okay, hear me out. A Warforged Grappling build that casts Heat Metal on itself.
Wouldn't it damage yourself? Causing Con saves to keep concentration
@@laynebonham3968 This is the beauty of it. You take warcaster, dip into artificer and craft a belt of fire resistance. You are not losing concentration, you are simply an Iron Maiden from hell itself. At early levels all you need is Heroism and you are good.
Honestly tho, this is probably one of the more realistic ways someone would use magic in combat, as well as one of the more accurate depictions of how scary heat is irl
any DM worth his salt is going to point out you don't wear armor on bare skin and say that they're not actually exposed to anything hot.
@@AkujiMalice oh yeah, like a bit of gambeson will do much more than oven mittens when there's red hot steal inches away, all around your body.
@Fractal Paradox oven mittens are used because they work. Its be uncomfortable, but you wouldnt be scalded, and itd take minutes for you to start baking alive good and proper.
@ijones36 Yeah, I think we are talking about different scales of heat here. Mittens work for your average baking temps (up to like 400°C, but usually around 180). Red hot steel a thousand or more degrees, in direct contact with your gambeson, would likely set it on fire, and _severely_ burn you, and even if you are able to throw yourself into a river or something and escaped burns, you'd be dealing with lots of smoke in your eyes and lungs, plus the heat, which even if isn't enough to burn you alive in seconds, would be extremely uncomfortable. Nobody would just get up and resume fighting after that.
@@ijones36 My oven mitts have caught on fire before because I accidentally touched the oven rack.
It's unfair until you get a DM that watches too much anime and makes the NPC "flex" to destroy his armor.
Honestly? If an NPC lost an action and 4 or 5 points of armor class due to ripping off their armor, I'd be ok with it. My spell would still have had a massive effect on the fight. Think of it like this: imagine a spell that could give an enemy -5 AC for the rest of the fight and make them lose an action. Without a saving throw. What level would that spell be?
@@weeaboooverlord7810 nah, their AC is now 25 because of their natural armor, it’s side gig or something
Ah, but they have disadvantage on ability checks, and so one could just argue that flexing to destroy the armour would be an ability check. NPCs and monsters have to make them too, after all. And it might even cost their entire action to do so.
That would actually be awesome tho
@@KahadiWell, the DC would also be lower due to you heating (thus softening) the armor.
"Unstoppable" is a big word for a dispellable effect.
its also a pretty pointless thing to anyone who actually knows how metal armor works in real life.
@@marcosdheleno While true, the size of the substance being heated would also factor into things realistically. Something that weighs 2 lbs being made red hot is generating much less heat than an object that weighs 40 lbs being heated to be red hot, presuming they are made from the same material, so larger objects being heated should technically do more damage than smaller objects. Because D&D is not meant to be a realistic physics simulator.
That is what grappling is for. And someone with heary armor usually has a high strength as well.
So while the caster may run away, if his friends are left behind the hot armor will give them a hug.
I like the way you think!
I was specifically coming to the comments to try and find a good counter for this lol nice one
@@ShannonBlake444 Throwing the mage off the roof helped as well. 😋
I mean theres also just....using your reaction to deck the squishy spell caster as they try to flee melee range from having to touch your armor, and having a low ass AC because they tried to use wildshape to run faster, forcing concentration to drop, but that works too lol
@@aster1760 It's 60 foot range on sight. No touching required.
DM: “Your enemy is resistant to fire and casts dispel magic”
That's why he said "Low level"
@@lonelywolf1784 He used a level 9 example. This isn't even that good anyway at low level, how often are your enemies going to survive the damage for long enough. 2D8 on a bonus action isn't the most insane thing in the world. Spike growth is much better.
@@Kitusser spike growth sucks for damage. Terrain denial, sure, it's alright, but it'll only do 2d4 damage damage for every 5ft they move, and even if they fail the save to notice it as hazardous they likely aren't just gonna run back and forth through your spikes.
@@Jorvalt It's difficult terrain. Depending on environment, enemies may be forced to run through the whole thing which is about 40ft.
@@Kitusser Which would equate to 16d4 damage, which is less than HALF of the maximum possible damage for Heat Metal (20d8). The advantage that Spike Growth has here is when there's multiple targets, provided you're casting it in a choke point and your enemies don't succeed on the wisdom save.
Yeah, do this a couple of times and suddenly the DM starts throwing leather and cloth wearing ranged enemies at you.
That reminds me of a mechanic in Metal Gear Solid 5, dunno if happens in other games too. But in that one if you take out a lot of enemies via (for example) sniper headshot, they begin wearing helmets, so you have to change tactics over time or enemies adapt.
he doesnt even need to do that. all he need to do is know that you dont wear metal armor over your bare skin.
you use some padded cloth.
because, metal armor gets hot under the sun.
so you know, people already countered that when designing and wearing armor.
Seems like a win - win scenario if you ask me.
@@marcosdheleno it would still turn your armor into a convection oven lol
@@kinsan89 cloth is a great insulator. and it works both ways.
thngs like gamberson were still used under metal armor to avoid burns from sun heat.
it all depend on how hot you can make it.
also, metal is great at transfering heat, so, if anything, most of the heat will be lost to the air, as opposed to the person inside.
Just remember players: if you can do it, so can the DM.
The fighter, cleric, and Paladin sweat profusely.
Yes, I was happy to be a Tiefling...
I learned this lesson when I came up with the idea of putting diverse self-concentrating glyphs of warding onto the "surface" of my artificer's gear... Then the BBEG suddenly revivified himself off a glyph on his cloak.
@@piranhaplantX druid is also in shit don't forget you probably have a metal weapon or some metal fittings on your clothes or maybe an amulet
Yeah, my DM tried copying my sheet once.
I did actual D&D judo on him. 46 CMB anyone? I conveniently forgot to include his whole item list too, so it was really fun when his toon was tied up with what's essentially a medieval bike lock (braided iron)
Wildshaped Druid using heat metal:
"Ha ha! You're on fire!"
The Hot metal Knight upon giving up on the Druid who has fled:
"Come 'ere, wizard! I've a real nice hug!"
Me (the war forged who has integrated armor) starts running towards the forest while laughing like Stewie Griffin.
@@janschievink1586 I actually had a player in my campaign ask me if his Warforged Druid could cast heat metal on himself. . . Sadly it doesn't work since it has to be an object and while he is classed as a construct he's still a creature.
Then he told me his Warforged is also female, so I had to allow it after that.
@@Noobie2k7 LOL surprise sexism.
On a more serious note I was under the impression armor and weapons still counted as objects but the racial ability integrated armor prevents their removal without the wearers intent were you still using the Unearthed Arcana version?
I used Heat Metal as a paladin to break into a vault. The vault guard had gone down, but the key got bent out of shape in the process. I have the bright idea to cast Heat Metal and use my 19 strength to very carefully bend the key back into shape. The key is put in the lock and we prepare to loot when one of the players (who has actually done some blacksmithing) points out that the key should be incredibly brittle now.
After a bit of back and forth, the DM splits the difference and has the key break off in the vault door, permanently forcing the lock open. Better hurry to the next area, because the next patrol that passes by will definitely notice and raise the alarm.
Didn't matter to us, because we still got our loot with minimal effort :P
If it cooled down on its own, it would have been annealed, you have to quench it for it to be brittle. Your friend got it backwards.
Ah yes, the 2nd level “change alignment” except it only affects you and changes your alignment to evil
The artificer in my party abuses the SHIT out of this spell. He's in heavy plate and can regularly get bonus AC effects, so no one can hit him to break concentration. Best incident was when we were facing a lich riding a white dragon: "so, does that saddle have metal on in?" (GM groans) "yes…" "Awesome :)"
He's in heavy plate, unless that stuff is designed to be taken off quickly there's no reason someone can't just do the same to him. >:)
@@TheCraftySam I'm waiting for our GM to try that, I assume the artificer has a plan
Yeah, that's the point you know your DM is ready to quit
This is why you wear a gambeson under the plate. No metal touches the skin, and the gambeson is a good insulator. Just run up and hug someone the Druid likes. I hear they like trees.
A gambeson made of various natural fibres? Like cotton?
@@noecarrier5035 Normally linen. Every suit of plate has a gambeson or similar garment underneath. It'll smoulder after a few rounds.
The thing about gambesons is that they get soaked in sweat after a while, so the spell isn't so much barbequeing the fighter as much as boiling them in their own sweat the first round or two.
OK but you don't put pizza on the heated metal in your stove, the fact that it's IN the stove is good enough to cook it. Now imagine that your suit of armor is now a stove.
@@sleepy1697Who tf tears apart their stove to cook food in it?
@@jazzyj7834 What are you talking about?
"Its too much to give Druids access to Fireball! Its too powerful, give them Revivify and Plant Growth instead!"
Meanwhile the druid: "That's some nice armor there that takes 5 minutes to throw off."
Wildfire Druids, man…
Conjure Animals says hi.
@@jonghyeonlee5877 Tell it im ignoring its existence until it ruins all my combat *next time*.
Plant growth is better than fireball in the situations it is applicable.
@@Kitusser Not really. Its a 100ft radius for no damage and its difficult terrain-like feature applies to ALL creatures that pass through it, including you and your allies. Yes you've slowed the enemies down, I hope to god you didn't do this indoors, but if you did it outdoors I also hope you were far enough away to have it matter and have decent enough ranged attacks to hit targets over that area. Not saying its bad, but an immediate 8d6 smack to the rack is applicable in many situations as provided you didnt nuke your own party using it, you just dealt a ton of damage to multiple foes and possibly just created a massive fire hazard for foes to move through (if you wanted it of course). You think difficult terrain is nasty? Imagine difficult terrain but its chipping at your health as you move through it AFTER you got dunked on by 5e's equivalent of your average real life hand grenade.
You forget, Warforged have an 'integrated armor' ability, which requires 1 hour to don or doff armor of any kind. Which makes heat metal really friggin hurt
I believe that not all, Light armor Warforged are Tree based or leather armor, so they are safe
DM: why do you carry a bucket of metal pebbles everywhere?
Me: None of ya business!
I remember I did this in a cave system with my Druid. We were chasing a BBG fighter dude, I casted it on his armor and wild shaped into a spider and hid on the ceiling like 50ft away from him. Good times
two more details about this spell that I love: One, you cannot quench it so even the person wearing the plate armor of toastiness jumps into a lake, it doesn't stop. Now they have to worry about drowning. Two, it says a piece of metal, so if some mage decides to flex in their shiney metal tower.....
Yeah... circumstantially an evil spell.
Jumping into water would give them resistance to fire damage (PHB 198 Underwater Combat). Might still drown tho.
@@UmbraPhi True about the resistance. I forgot about that.
Towers aren’t objects, they’re buildings.
@@UmbraPhi but it's fire damage without fire? 🤔
@@johnathanbasilhawkinsthe3r675 buildings are objects ostensibly, can you point me to where the distinction is argued?
The “Cook and Book” strategy.
Don’t mind me just writing this down
*my local dm standing a few feet behind me with a shotgun*
And this is how your DM throw a Vampiric Half Dragon Tarrasque Lich in the next encounter
"Heat metal?"
*laughs in Monk
*laughs sadistically in Long Death Monk
"*laughs in aarakocra monk that can just fly away and not get hit*
"A Monk?"
*laughs in any other class because they aren't a monk
@@garyco766
"Hahaha ugh..."
**Wizard dies from 5 points of laughing damage***
Alternatively, a Warforged Monk that now has (possibly) added fire damage to their flurry of blows
This is where the target bear hugs one of your party members.
in my homebrew tabletop rpg, i've made one of the basic elemental spells with this exact hidden intent in mind.
it's called fire hand, and covers the hand of the caster in fire for a number of turns. while the effect is active, that hand specifically is immune to heat and fire, and has all the properties and interactions of fire, it also deals a low set amount of damage on contact.
it's presented and worded as a utility thing that kind of encompass the idea of an affinity with fire, being able to handle hot things, easily lighting fires, using fire as light source, and so on. but i basically did that hopping some player would make a grappling mage out of it one day.
Heat metal + irresistible dance = one good time
You cold also get metamagic adept at level 4 (or CL or VH) to change the damage type to get over immunity and resistance
also, twin spell for double damage, since it targets a piece of metal and not a creature, you can cast it on both pieces of armor
@@afasdfasafd314 in D&D RAW rules you can’t stack ability’s or spells with the same name
Twinned Spell wouldn’t work, but not for the above reason. The rules state that the effects of the same spell cast twice don’t combine, the example given being two castings of a Bless spell doesn’t give a 2d4 bonus. But Heat Metal affects an object and causes damage to something touching it and the damage is on the caster’s turn. Twinned Spell specifically states that it is used with spells that target creatures, and a metal object is not a creature (though possibly an exception for constructs made of metal). If Heat Metal was casted twice on the same object, it wouldn’t deal double damage, but if it was casted on, say, a shield and a suit of armor by two separate mages, there’s no reason it wouldn’t deal double the damage since the target is two separate objects and the damage occurs on two different turns. I don’t see any reason casting it like this would fall under the category of same spell effects, because this spell operates similarly to Spiritual Weapon and I can’t imagine anyone saying that someone can only take damage from one Spiritual Weapon per turn even if they get hit by two in a single turn. But, again, Twinned Spell wouldn’t work since it allows you to target two creatures, and metal objects aren’t creatures
@@thetruezoneinyou can, but not on the same creature, thats why heat metal works, because it targets a piece of metal, and a creature can be wearing more than one piece of metal.
@@theaspie3121 you are right, my bad, shame that the best metamagic option only works with spells that targets 1 creature.
I won a PvP session as a bard with Heat Metal and run. I also once stood inside a stone pillar and the five seconds of “oh shit” in my DM’s eyes as he tried to work out how he was going to get me to come back out again rather than just waiting for the other players to pick each other off was golden.
U must be soooooo fun to run games with ....
@@ryynerwicked2762
They were both one-shot pvp sessions where the aim was to win against your fellow players, I would not do this in a normal campaign. My DM used to run them when too few people could make our regular sessions because they didn’t take too much prep time on his end and several of the players (including me) were very new to the game, so it gave us a chance to get more familiar with combat and other classes/races/features.
Another combo with this that I did was throw daggers at someone and use heat metal on them, pretty funny actually
For any DMs that have this done to them, remember that the 5min. Doffing of plate armor or any doffing, is the time it takes to take the armor for re-use. You could take an action and cut the straps holding the armor together, just remember to lower the AC of the creature in that case as they can't use it without some repairs at that point
One turn won't do it. Each piece has multiple straps, and you're doing WHILE cooking.
@@LastnameIchose alright, so maybe 3 or 4 rounds then, because it's a process of cutting a few pieces of leather strap, which would also be weakened by the heated metal
Much easier method;
The enemies are wearing long sleeved tabards. The only visible metal is their helmet, which they can remove as a free action.
Even easier method. Heat metal just doesn’t work like that because what fucking psycho is just wearing the plate on their bare skin?!?! Congrats, the plate armour is hot now and the target will start sweating like crazy because of their gambeson
Most of the plates are on two harnesses on the hips and shoulders as balancing and repairs on a strap is much easier than the metal proper
I think we should call this the brazen bull combo.
Here's a session/combat encounter idea: the party is in a crowd, traveling through the city, when the tanks plate mail suddenly begins to burn red hot.
Have them roll initiative, but the only "enemy" on the initiative table at first is the Heat Metal damage counter, where it'll deal damage in the round. What does your party do? Do they hunt down the caster? Try to dispell it? Maybe for the sake of the encounter you could say the caster needs to stay within 60 ft of their target, or maybe the caster panics as soon as they think they're noticed and run, so the party only needs to get relatively close to finding them.
But no matter what they do now, the assassination attempt was clear.
*laughs in leather armor and DEX*
laughs in wearing nothing cause dragonborn with dragonhide feat
Laughs in Lizardfolk Druid with no armor other than scales
Laughes in no armor wood elf wizard with 20 dex at level 1
Laughs in dashes 60 ft away
Laughs as a naked wizard.
* Dies from 1d4 damage *
There's actually a Common magical item that can counter Heat Metal: The humble Cast-Off Armor.
A bit pricey at low levels... but hey, so's plate too, right?
funny story, my dm once made very guard in the city have cast-off armor specifically because of heat metal
**Writes that down** Thank you good creature for this boon!
Armorer artificer get it as a class feature
"And they say there's no consequences for the rich..."
If you have the Transmuted Spell Metamagic option, you could overcome otherwise fairly common resistances. (For 1 sorcery point, you can change any damage type of a damage spell that is covered by chromatic orb into another that is also covered by chromatic orb). That, and it can become a much more brutal spell than it already is. For example, forcing armor to suddenly surge in electricity or suddenly secrete acid sounds much worse than being cooked with heat. Maybe even turn your opponent into a walking loud speaker with thunder damage to blow their mind metaphorically and VERY literally? Who knows? Your alignment is always thrown into question when you pick up this spell and use it on armor.
is why i like playing Lawful evil. Evil cause I do not care that im slowly cooking someone in their own armour.
And this is why you should always be prepared with Dispel Magic
I mean if you’re full decked out in heavy armor then you aren’t a class/enemy type that’s likely to have spellcasting anyway.
@@InquisitorThomas they can have minions/allies of that class
my man's discovered good old cook'n'book!
tired: Walk towards the enemies and get hit
wired: Walk away from the enemies and don't get hit
I've always wanted to use a heat metal combo with an ice spell to break someone's armor
Interesting idea
If I recall corrextly, back in 2nd and 3rd edition, Heat Metal was one of the spells that could be cast in reverse. Meaning you could chose to heat the metal red hot or encase it ice.
Love this!! Gets my nerd flowing nice and early while I'm supposed to be working.
Fun fact, this spell has a range of 60ft and lasts up to a minute
Finally someone with the ability to read.
The range only applies to when you first cast the spell
Player's Handbook p.203
Once a spell is cast, its effects aren’t limited by its range, unless the spell’s description says otherwise.
And while it does have a limit of 1 minute that's still a average of 90 damage and you can get back into 60f of the target and recast upping the damage too 180 on average at 3rd level with the enemy being completely unable to do anything
@@josemarperezfuentes772 turns out you only have to be within 60 for the initial casting
@@SRVaris How many enemies at low level have 180 hp? None. How many fights last long enough for this to be relevant? None.
@@SRVaris Thank you! :) I didn't know that.
"Who taught you to fight like this...?"
"The witcher you slew."
*casts igni at helmet, turning the man's head into an elven hotpocket*
Another reason to carry a bag or two of ball bearings........Enhanced Interrogations now have a new meaning.
me with an aarakocra bard with this spell: time for YOU to become the baked bird
*Gamemaster casually deleting plate armor from all enemies for next battle*
If I had a Druid player use Heat Metal on an armored foe I'd make sure to include more of them in future sessions. Especially if they're a non-Moon subclass that needs to make good use of their spells. Giving each party member opportunities to get use out of their niche abilities against specific targets makes the game more fun. High AC means harder for the martials to fight, so the magic user having the right tool to handle them is good for teamwork. No idea when this will get off the ground, but planning a campaign for new players to D&D and/or just new to 5E, and one is planning to play a Stars Druid, so I hope I can be blessed with the problem of dealing with Heat Metal.
Ya don’t have to, just make a new type and use heat metal on their front liners.
You really don't have to. If you give the creature an extra 30 hp, you have nullified the heat metal damage. So if you really want to go against the player, you just have to bump up the HP of the monsters. More importantly if they run away, that is actually a bonus to the monsters as they now have one less PC to absorb their damage.
This wouldn't actually work the way people think. Out of combat it's essentially as everyone believes. But the number of times you can realistically do that is very small given the amount of time it takes and other factors.
In any sense of reality, the DM can simply say "ok, but they aren't directly touching the metal so they take no damage outside of "condition" ". This is because metal armor almost NEVER directly touches the skin, it's padded with cloth and leather for comfort and to help it stay in place. That stuff will stave the heat for at least a round or 2 before I'll give and say they take the damage from the transfer of heat.
That's at least the way I'd go if I had a player try to use the spell like this.
But let's say you don't do that and just take the full damage. How long does any particular non-boss encounter usually last? Maybe 3-5 rounds depending on encounter. And they are guaranteed a chance to do something before you move again (unless something happens), so you might not always get the chance to escape. And if the DM is smart they'll have at least 1 ranged opponent in case you try flying.
Really it's impractical and takes way too long to kill someone. Way better to just accept their AC/turn loss with some damage or disarm literally anyone holding metal than trying to burn them and wait.
@@Inaktha I would disagree. The spell description itself says you can choose heavy or medium metal armor. Therefore while historically there was padding, that doesn't exactly exist in D&D. And if it did, the spell still says you can target heavy or medium armor, so any padding is clearly except from saving you from the damage. The spell would work exactly as most people think, because the spell itself says that it does. Granted, the game doesn't assume you are going to cast it, turn into a fast animal and run away. Granted, only a moon druid can get away with it. All other druids need to survive a round before they can retreat.
More realistically, in game, the druid might be able to retreat, but the rest of the party probably cannot. So, eventually the party is going to go after the druid if they survive anyway.
New Heat Metal: you now have to be within range to deal damage.
Nice of you to give my new players ideas to break my game :P. Keep up the good work, love your content
Remember you could always just say no. Or make that creature have to make a save.
@@maximumforce8275 From the players perspective that's power tripping.
Instead have the roasting knight beg for his life. Go into great detail about how he screams and the horror the player is inflicting. Return the trauma back to the players.
Have any other intelligent creatures watching back down, flee, or also beg to stop the spell if they all surrender. Because who wants to be slowly cooked to death? Remember, your encounters do not have to be generic bad guys being bloodbags.
One of my favorite scenarios are the starving bandits. Players kill any one of them and the 'smaller, younger'/'bigger older' bandit rips off his hood and yells 'DAD!'/'SON!' and the bandits give up because they were all family/villagers. If the party wipes them the village they head to is missing a lot of people for some reason.
@@Greekphire yes making a restriction on a spell that otherwise has no easy counter that makes anyone holding metal take damage is power tripping
@@Greekphire I mean, as long as they discuss it with the group about how heat metal is OP so they're adding saving throws to it, it works
You idea is cool, though
You sir, are a Pelor-damned madman!
May Lolith feast mightily on the Chaos you bring to any DM.
Just remember, "what's good for the PC, is good for the DM". Or something like that.
My new druid-bard changling will be a formidable foe
Ah yes the "Cook'n'Book"
I just fell in love with the Iron Golem when I read about it in the MM, so i started planning lots of ways to got it indestructible, including Heat Metal -ing it, buuuttttt
I don't have an Iron Golem. Teach me how to get one, master.
there is a magic item that allows you to build a golem in the DMG.
Yeah, I read that part, but jeez. 120 days. My party is going to hate me
@@cezar7517 *finger guns* downtime activity.
When the druid casts heat metal and the wizard casts immovable object. Congrats you made a brazen bull
DM could easily say that since it has a range of 60ft, you have to stay within that 60ft and maintain at least partial line of sight to do that damage for the bonus action.
Yah that seems fair to me. At very least line of sight for the bonus action damage
Not Raw
Player's Handbook p.203
Once a spell is cast, its effects aren’t limited by its range, unless the spell’s description says otherwise.
it does not say that anywhere @@SRVaris
I would like to do a heat metal then grapple them as a dragon born that has immunity to fire. They continue to take damage since they are grappled and can’t take off their damage
But Dragonborns only habe resistance iirc. So you'd still take half the damage
@@nothingnothing4155 ability
That's why the original version had a time limit on it. To keep it from being OP. It was meant to disarm opponents with metal weapons and do a little bit of damage in the process. It also had a heat up time before it would cause damage.
It would last 7 rounds with the first and last not causing any damage.
The 2nd and 6th rounds would do 1D4.
The 3rd, 4th and 5th rounds would do 2D4.
So you could do a total of 8D4 heat damage.
Magical stuff did give you a saving throw to not be affected, and it didn't work at all on Elven chain mail or any metal that wasn't ferrous, made with Iron.
So, if you happened to have a silver or Titanium set of armor, you didn't need to worry about it at all.
Gotta love being able to cook your enemies alive like a rotisserie chicken and getting away with it 😊
Easier : wild shape into a mouse, or any insect, you'll be as good as invisible on the grass.
Oh I remember this combo. So I was playing a moon druid in a party where the paladin was pretty arrogant, thinking he was invincible with a 20+ AC. Well, all it took was one near death experience with the "easy to hit" druid cooking him alive to shut his trap. We are still good friends to this day.
Like others have said. THIS is the reason they don’t wear armor made of metal. There’s a legendary spell out there that can incinerate you if you get caught.
Except that’s exactly how their opponent kill them, they just hug them
My love of this spell in one group i played with legitimately led to a rise in the use of alternative materials, such as chitin, and even the creation of chitin farms and people breeding larger and larger insects, crabs, and other creatures with shells or exoskeletons
Ahh yes the good old "Cook and book"
This is literally the reason I'm going to be playing a druid in my upcoming campaign.
u bad
I joke with my friend about how an npc with a gold tooth would be completely done for if someone wanted to use heat metal
At one point I was considering playing a grappler with steel gloves and use heat metal on them, then play a tiefling for resistance xD
Cast it in a random town guard with subtle spell and just sit back and watch the show.
Why beat the BBEG by stopping them when you can beat them by being more evil?
true but there really aren't that many enemies in the monster manuals that wear armor as opposed to having natural armor.
yeah, its mostly against humanoids I guess
@ the way i rule it, it doesn't even work against constructs. like animated armor or warforged.
Just a quick tip for all DMs : Plate armor is worn over some sort of clothes that can be protected against high temperatures, especially if you are preparing for a group of adventurers of a level that allow second level spell (level 3 I believe) Rendering the spell effectively useless.
Heat metal is a spell that is to be used by DMs in certain very specific conditions, as are a lot of spells btw.
I don't get why, but there's a lot of people that think this is a bad spell because "not everything is wearing metal armor". But even if they are not, casting it on a creatures weapon can be pretty decisive quite often.
For a second level spell it does good damage, but the unavoidability of the damage makes it amazing damage even. It can cause creatures to become unarmed (effectively removing the dice from their attacks damage) or give them disadvantage on all attacks and ability checks. The biggest disadvantage of the spell is in my opinion not even the 'only metal' part (almost all dangerous creatures use weapons) but fire immunity, since fire immunity cancels the secondary effect by negating fire damage.
Casting it on weapons always depends on the DM. In my experience, every DM I've had that I've tried that with has said that the only thing I did was give the enemy a flaming weapon because the weapon had a leather handle or a handle made of some other hear insulating material.
@@sarunokoguard211 against an axe that ruling would be 'fair enough', but I have never even heard of a sword that doesn't have a mostly metal handle. Thin wrappings aren't going to protect your hands when steel is so hot it is glowing. Furthermore, the damage is dealt "when you cast it" and "as a bonus action", so it doesn't deal extra damage if they attack you with it, since you aren't using the bonus action while you are being touched.
And if they do argue that the heat wouldn't go through the wrapping, swords are designed so that your hand is finely packed between the pommel and the guard, most likely touching both and both being made of metal.
@@Olav_Hansen I mean, logically a flaming weapon would hurt, unless you wanna go all rules lawyer. Personally, our party like to twist the rules if they make logical sense so the flaming/hot weapon would still deal more damage
@@TechnoArpan You are saying that logically it would deal more damage, but it wouldn't.
Logically it would make a cut and then immediately cauterize that wound, resulting in reduced damage. It would still hurt a lot, but it would literally be less damaging then being cut by a normal sword would.
You are acting like it's logical, but because of that pursuit you actually end up making it more unrealistic. Swords are meant to do quick cuts, so there won't be extensive wounds besides the cauterized parts.
Aw yes! The good ol "cook n' book"
Druid: "I cast Heatmetal"
DM: "Counterspell!"
Group: "Fuuuuuuuu!"
Everyone with metal armor have to wear gamberson or other padding under the steel, so it should at least give him turn or two before jest start to build up and burn him. And i guess create wather casted under the armor should be just enough to deal with it somewhat.
At least thats how i would rule as a dm
Me: *uses disintigrate on the amour* "that druid is a jerk"
What makes this more fun is if your able to catch them in iron bands of binding first and they fail the strength save you technically trapped them in medium metal armor
Honestly I feel like this is an evil combo for the BBEG more than the PCs. Here's why Cook 'n Book doesn't work every time:
-You aren't doing very much damage per turn compared to other 2nd Level Concentration spells. It won't kill the target instantly.
-While you have thoroughly wrecked the day of one enemy, there's probably a lot more than one enemy you're dealing with.
-If you wild shape into a horse and spend your action running away, you're putting your party at an action economy disadvantage because the burning guy, while they will have DIS on attacks, will still have the option to attack the other PCs. What would have been, say, a 4 vs 4 became a 3 vs 4. Also because of how monsters are built, monsters are always going to be more bulkier than PCs and suddenly having one PC spend their turn running around will cause more harm than good.
-If you don't run away after casting Heat Metal, you're inviting the enemies to focus fire on you to try and break concentration. Anyone up for some witch burning?
Now Heat Metal isn't a bad spell by any means. If you want to kill one important bad guy NPC, and if they have metal armor, THIS would be the way to do it. It's just the kind of spell that needs full party planning to be devastating. It's not a "Cast and profit" type spell like Flaming Sphere or Hold Person.
Now Imagine if the BBEG had this spell and was feeling sadistic... that would be bad.
Remember, if you use this too often, make sure to buy cast-off or non-metal armor so the GM can’t use it against you.
it is also the most cruel way to torture a warforged
Just remember, anything that can be done by the players can also be done to the players