OrthoBS keyboard review (IBM capacitive buckling springs)
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- čas přidán 21. 10. 2022
- Skip to 10:01 for a typing demonstration.
Today we look at some chimaeric abomination that was sent to me over three years ago. Capacitive buckling springs.... but at what cost? Hope you enjoy the video :) .
Intro by Kyle Carter
Outro by Facundo Cabanne
My keyboard reviews: bit.ly/1TbOtft
My switch teardowns: bit.ly/2C1QGHz
My TOP X videos: bit.ly/2FmpZfd
My XL typing demos: bit.ly/2OoAW3w
My tutorials and featurettes: bit.ly/2OrkLUh
My unboxing videos: bit.ly/2TSrr0m
I'm Thomas and I do videos and reviews on mechanical keyboards ranging from the most sickening modern RGB gaming keyboards to vintage hardware relics, or sometimes keycaps or keyswitches ranging from Cherry MX to Alps SKCM to IBM buckling springs and anything in between.
Follow me on Twitter for updates on my keyboard videos! / chyrosran22 - Věda a technologie
This layout is not my cup of tea, but anyone who makes an ortholinear keyboard and sends it to Thomas to review deserves some respect for bravery.
Maybe the jankiness of it is part of the joke. Otherwise there are pretty solid ortho boards out there; the Boardwalk for example is compatible with like 90% of the 60% cases out there - get a plate and a PCB and you can shove them into one of those 2 kg CNC cases as well.
A keyboard that slows Chyrosran to Chyroswalk.
Underrated comment
It's not as bad as the Chyroscrawl that came from the orbitouch xD .
The ortholinear community confirmed through non bias, totally legit and 100% genuine studies that ortholinear keyboards are a billion times better than regular keyboards.
🤡⌨
The 40% community confirmed through non bias, totally legit and 100% genuine studies that 40% keyboards are a billion times better than regular keyboards.
As a peer reviewer for one such study, I can confirm these results
@@jonb9879 as a 40% user, please feel free to use my data as part of your study. 40% keyboards are a billion times better than regular keyboards :p
sarcasm aside, I am still interested in Ortho keyboards. if you have videos about studies on this topic please share
Oh I didn't realise we could send in our own keyboard designs in order to torture Thomas. 34 key, hand made, with gateron browns in the mail.
Looking forward to his review.
Is that perhaps the “pure piece of ass turdage”
honestly my favorite thing about 40% keyboards is that they physically aren't useable at all with my language, because you need the number keys to type all the extra characters that you pretty much need in every single word. Thankfuklly i'm typing this on a brick of a 1980's hall effect board that does have all the keys i need. :))
You could try switching to a more ergonomic language with fewer letters.
I’ve seen some people use 30% with some cool layering that I could see working for Cyrillic (sometimes I type in Russian). A layout with a lot of layers does add to the mental stack of whatever you’re doing so pros and cons to everything! UwU
Curious to know what 80s hall effect board you have?
@@torpedo996 A Zbrojovka Brno 262.9. They speak a modified IBM PC protocol so they're quite easy to adapt and they are honestly some of the smoothest keyboards ever created unless you dislike the pretty heavy weighting. The later 262.12 even has a modern layout, being used with the Consul 331 PC AT clone, but with some keycap switching and remapping i find the 262.9s pretty easy to adapt to and they look a lot cooler. They definitely do need lubing and 90% of the ones you find nowadays are pretty destroyed from dust ingestion being used with industrial machinery that the PP-06 and SAPI-86 backplane based PC compatibles mostly controlled.
There are 40s for Cyrillic and Norde
Oh yeah, I forgot that project existed. Shame it never went anywhere, the concept would have worked a lot better if buckling springs had other keycap profiles available.
Finally a keyboard with a layout that
makes sense the keys aren't all over the place.
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I've been using Corne and similar keyboards for a few years now, so these videos are the funniest because I can laugh not only with you, but also at you
patiently waiting for a chorded keyboard to make an appearance on this channel
I'm assuming you mean a stenographers keyboard, and not simply one with a cable
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3:00 I don't think this is your first time covering a 40% since I remember you doing a review of the Planck 40% a while back which was the same form factor. It's quite a hard video to forget since you did it on helium!
Haha I guess you're right! Looks like I managed to forget it though! XD
Yeah when I heard him say that I was like, I remember another 40% that he used a while back that was very similar with no lettering keycaps and the same struggle.
One thing I notice about Thomas' reviews is that modification on changeable layouts isn't his thing. You develop a set of muscle memories and then modify your keyboard bidings to conform to them. That's what's so great about all of the boards that have editable layouts. I'm typing this on a 40% currently (Cornelius from foostan) and it has to a form factor that you're enthusiastic about. Personally my typing speed shoots way up when I'm on a layered keyboard. Chording isn't as bad as it seems. You have to want to challenge your muscle memory (left thumb is space and right thumb is enter, for example). Once you've developed that new muscle memory you modify the layout. Superficially my key bindings looks mostly like this one but certain critical keys are in different places or function keys/arrows are grouped for one handed usage while the other hand activates a layer. If you're a luddite then this form factor definitely isn't for you. I had no idea this project existed, now I'll have to look it up. Incidentally, I do like using other form factors/keyboards, including my Lekker and 60HE.
Yeah, I agree. I'm typing this on a UHK, and after a while you setup your own scheme. After that it is just learning how to type on it proficiently. One thing that I wondered is why the keyboard that Thomas tested has the arrow keys at the rightmost corner. That's just weird, I have them layered under the JKLI keys, with FDS as shift, control and alt respectively. I can use them without even lifting my hand, in other words. The only thing that I still have trouble with is the function keys. These need to be layered, but pressing e.g. control-alt-F6 in my debugger...yeah, that gets complicated.
I agree with that. Maybe I'm not as drastic as going down to 40%, but even on a 75% I see myself using for example IJKL on a layer as arrows instead of the dedicated arrow keys. It doesn't take much to learn honestly.
You have reviewed a 40% Ortholinear keyboard before; the Planck keyboard with Zealios while you were high on Helium btw 😆.
Still considering a top 10 or top 20 Worst Keyboards of all time?
Eh, I kinda wonder how futureproof it would be xD .
@@Chyrosran22 If you end up doing it, ask Ben Valleck to send you a 1% keyboard, he actually has a video typing on one - if you get it made with shit switches I think there's no way for it not to be future proof
@@Chyrosran22 Adding to prgnify's point, I would love to see you actually try to relearn typing on something that is completely alien like the Ben Vallack boards or a dactyl manuform.
@@Anteksanteri yeah, no :p .
@@Chyrosran22 Just make you add a very big "Waning!" sign should that video will come to fruition. Or maybe since you've encountered more bad switches, an updated version of the Worst Switches of All Time 🤔
I still believe that my top 3 for Worst Keyboards of all time based on your videos are the Laser Keyboard, The Orbitouch, and the Maltron. You may end up hugging the Smith Corona Leafspings on your bed if you do it 😂
have you had a look at the silentiumpc keyboards like the gk630 or 650, they are pretty well known as being very good bang for the buck
i would argue, having used a preonic keyboard from drop for YEARS now, that ortholinear has almost completely removed my wrist-pain from typing. i only miss the F-keys from time to time; they aren't that useful unless you want to get into BIOS, and then you have DEL still.
boot into windows. click on start menu. press shift and click on the restart option. computer will boot into recovery/diagnostics boot. from there you can select "boot into bios/uefi" , and the computer will reboot into bios for you.
@@TristenSinanju dont mention the great satan, linux akbar
I daily a 40% ortho and it’s actually doable for basic typing. Main reason I do is because I play a *lot* of games and the ortho layout is the most comfortable for my gaming hand posture. I have a second purely work setup with a proper keyboard plugged into my laptop.
I use a 40% ortho for everything now, and the main hurdle to using it all the time was learning the layers. When I got my first planck, I had a hard time with coding just because I didn't know how to use the layers, but now its pretty normal.
Great project!
Great to see you as always Tom. That's an interesting board, but I think you'd like it more if it had fewer keys.
Yes, this veritable cornucopia of keys confuses and disorients me! XD
I really hope you make a review of the Pain27.
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thankfully, the inventors of the number pad had some sense and chose not to stick with the pointless left slanted stagger that plagues the rest of most keyboards to this day, despite being relic of mechanical typewriters. But for some reason, correcting the slanted aberration for the rest of the keyboard is a bridge too far for many.
Nice vid. Ortholinear alphas work alright when paired with a decent mod layout like Keebio’s FoldKB, but the layering necessary for keyboards this small just seems silly except for some individuals where it becomes a fun quirk. I can’t deal with not having arrows and easily usable mods
The Planck layout is super uncomfortable, and the true final form of ortho is a 36-key Minidox in Colemak.
Please review the new Asus RX optical switches, both linear and clicky. They all have a scissor style stabilizer in the switch and apparently have zero binding and very little wobble.
I have often wondered how space aliens used those ortholinier control panel keyboards placed at random all around their future tech '70s spaceship interiors. Now I know. Badly.
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Wait why do you have a UMP-45 on Receiver 2 ? Is there mod support for this game like the first one ?
Yes, it's a mod made by Szikaka. Head over to the Wolfire discord to check it out! :D
I'm not one for the "double numpad" format, but this is a fun project
wasnt the planck the first 40% ortho you have taken a look at?
he was brain-damaged by breathing helium that time so he doesn't remember
@@an2qzavok LMAO
Ortholinears in a single piece board is pointless. I'm not sure why people prefer these things over aesthetics. Ortho makes a lot more sense in the case of split keyboards though
What a great day
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That's a rather nice macropad... oh no... it is not a macropad.
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can you review the class80 keyboard?
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I kind of want to take this further. I would machine a block of tungsten carbide and make it into an dactyl ergonomic keyboard with beam spring switches, a solenoid, n-key rollover, rgb, wireless and other features. Then I would force Thomas to review it. It'd weigh like 5 kilos even if it were a corne keyboard or something similar. I bet he would still rant about the layout.
At a recent meetup I saw a 60% with a solid vibranium case or something that weighed 18 lb (8 kg).
Spirit of the Old School lives only in contactless keyboards.
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7:22 did that one barrel just move in the plate? Not really surprising since the bottoms of F barrels are curved, holding them in a flat plate doesn't seem like the best idea.
Probably. As I've said elsewhere, the design was made for steel plates. Even the resting spring force of all of the flippers+springs actually adds up to a pretty incredible amount of force. the only way to get acrylic plates to work halfway decently would be to drill through the corners of some of the barrel inserts to put screws through the center of the assembly. More screws may have also helped, but the number used works fine for the intended steel plates (as does the size and location of the screws, which were intended to reduce the overall height and bezels as much as possible with the assumption of building it out of steel) and there are plenty of other reasons to not use acrylic anyway.
By the way, the bottoms of the barrel inserts aren't actually curved. they just have an angle lip toward the south side. They sit almost completely flat otherwise. The reason it might have budged is due to play created by the acrylic bending, not due to the shape of the barrel insert.
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“basically it’s QWERTY except more fucked up” 😂
i would imagine this would be good for gaming, since gamers don't really need a keyboard for typing text, but need a keypad with like 20 buttons on it. surprised to hear it is not ideal for that. it sounds absolutely amazing though, not for everyday use, but simply amazing sound.
I like ortholinear keyboards, I just wish there were any 100% ortho keyboards. I don't want to have to deal with all those layers..!
This was invented by olkb. And is my daily driver. The Planck and the Preonic. As a programmer, i'm far faster at tasks without using the keyboard. its bespoke. not quite as fucked up as you think lol. It's very well thought out.
@Veronika Zaglotova true; i suppose i meant the 4x10 form factor in a small package, and that exact Planck key mapping.... is Jack Humbert's design, aka olkb.
i've tried a planck but i just hated how it was all clumped together and put unnecessary strain on my wrists. ortho layouts just aren't for everyone.
currently using a 40% alice-style board (called Lain keyboard) and I am enjoying it quite a lot.
@@jorbbie this keyboard is 4x12.
"Its basically Qwerty but more fucked up". 3:41 had me laughing so hard
can you review bloody b930 keyboard with lk libra orange switches?
I asked Bloody for a keyboard a long time ago but they never replied. Might try again.
@@Chyrosran22 whats your favourite clicky keyboard among razer optomechanical and kailh box jade?
I love 40% and ortholinear but Its not for everyone 😢 awesome review
I'm a mission for the most tactile KB ever made, literally. Like imagine this, your phone buttons, the sleep on/off key and that on all the keys on the KB, that's the dream, ultimate tactility, 0 travel, bottoming out instantly, HELL YES! Reccomend me switches for this please lol.
this kind of keyboard would be perfect for my zx spectrum
Hate the orhtolinear nonsense, but custom boards with capacitive buckling springs sounds amazing. Make them affordable, in a real layout for once, and not weigh a ton (like the f77 which I do love) and I'd be all on it.
Clown or lunatic was such a funny way to put it.
Oh God, that pinging noise is the anti-thock!
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I sincerely wish there was an ortholinear tkl keyboard out there to try, because I'm completely down with trying that. I just completely disagree with the use of anything offering fewer buttons than a tkl. I already have problems with finding special characters under the number keys, so let's not multiply that pain.
TKL ortholinear doesn't make sense. 40% already doesn't make any sense.
The point of ortho is for keys to be naturally under the fingers without moving a hand.
This requires fingers to be positioned in parallel to one of dimensions of ortholinear layout.
With 40% it's already stupid as you physically cannot put your hands side by side in parallel. TKL would just add more keys.
The only format that remotely makes any sense for ortholinear is .. keypad/ numpad/macropad with 12 keys maybe or if you want fully functional format - maybe ergodox - split keyboard where halves can be separated and rotated to fit natural hands' positions.
Anything else is just a gimmick.
Check out the XD75, it has roughly the same number of keys as a TKL. No gaps between any blocks of keys so more like a compact 75% form factor than a traditional TKL.
Can you read my will when I die of sepsis from eating rusty nails? Make sure to do a typing test at the end of my will, just slamming your fingers into a book
You okay buddy?
This sure ain't a keyboard for typing out complex passwords.
I like Volta cables for replacing my old micro USB cables, I am a simple creature who just likes to play with the magnet
new chyrosan video got me bricked so fast holy shit
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The 42 key split ortho corne in my bag rn must not be enjoying the sound of this video lmao
For a moment I thought there was a new BS maker out there. It sounds nice at least.
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Finally a proper layout. The 40% is an acquired taste, but thr ortholinear is just the best thing. I prefer it in a 60% form factor, that way you can have arrow keys and a numpad too which regular 60% boards don't offer.
Also programmable keyboards should be the norm and that goes best with keys of thr same shape and size.
Having to memorize some arbitrary layout, trust my own stupidity to change that layout, and then not being able to type comfortably on anyone else's keyboard... I don't see any appeal at all.
@@matthewkriebel7342 That last one is the only real concern. I have a bunch of vintage stuff, laptops, etc. that I hate typing on now because I'm so used to my ortho keyboards. The others, not so much. You create a layout that makes sense to you, so "memorizing" it takes no time at all. And once you land on a layout that makes sense to you, why would you change it ?
@@matthewkriebel7342 You can do it step by step. Even the regular Qwerty/qwertz is better on ortho. I started eith that on the programmable one then slowly adapted to my needs. Removing keys I don't need, putting the numpad to the middle, the enter to the bottom left, etc.
Having to to memorize and follow some arbitrary layout is the main problem, when you can have different ones bases on different needs. Yet many people face difficulties when used to an ANSI/ISO layout and have to use the other one for some reason.
@@tyrgoossens Yes, the layout that works for me is 101-key ANSI. ISO keyboards make my skin crawl, but at least the alphabet is where it belongs. Even American keyboards with "big ass enter" I treat as retro collectibles, not usable boards. I might be interested in trying a 100% or 80% ortho board, if they were cheap and plentiful like ANSI boards. But I don't like layers, I don't like chording, and I can touch type on mainstream keyboards... and I have enough Model Ms to last 10 lifetimes, so that's a "no sale" for me. Solution in search of a problem.
@@matthewkriebel7342 That's not quite correct, it does solve a problem. Particularly for programmers and sysadmins there's a lot of value in having symbols and macros on a layer where you don't have to move your hands to reach them. And if you've already used modal editors like "vi" you already have an intuitive understanding of layers.
It's a niche.
It's a Planck ❤️
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Heh different intro that’s neato
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Please review TVS GOLD PRO KEYBOARD. I've been using it for a long time and it's the best keyboard atleast for me out there. Please share your thoughts about that keyboard. TVS GOLD PRO KEYBOARD, it has white switches and is the most sought after keyboard in India. Please do a review of it. I'd really appreciate if you can.
TVS Gold is basically a Chicony KB-5161. It's not an original TVS design. Chyrosran22 has already reviewed a few versions of it
I agree that he should review the *TVS GOLD PRO KEYBOARD* it's a really good keyboard. He should give the *TVS PRO KEYBOARD* a try.
Ortho-fans every time tells, that keeb need to be designed for his hands, but human fingers isn't placed in line and don't aligned by cols or rows of keyboard. So... I got it! There are not humans! There are robots from alpha centauri! Oh, shi~
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Never understood 40%. I'd give up my mouse for more keyboard space I think.
If that much space is needed, trackballs do exist.
i watched you all the time when i was in high school HOLY SHIT
getting back into the keyboard thing, i used to go by keycap on deskthority - wow how much have i missed out on???
The epic swear at 3:07 is well, epic and creative. You’re really at the top of your game here🎉
The Dutch can't half swear!
The blank keycaps make perfect sense for a keyboard like this. With any keyboard requiring a layershift, you necessarily have to prioritise some keys more than others, and the ones you need most frequently will be user dependent, so being able to swap them without moving keycaps is nice (especially if the keycap profile is sculpted).
I know they'll probably never be your cup of tea, but I think you approach ortho videos incorrectly. Configuring them and tailoring the layouts of them is an important part of understanding and familiarising yourself with a keyboard, and basically no ortho company would recommend just using the default layout.
For example, you took issue with the toggled layer shift key - change it. You had issue with losing your home keys - try moving things like backspace to a thumbkey so you're not shifting as much - thumb clusters in general are incredible for this type of thing.
I'm not trying to be insulting or condescending, but this type of keyboard is a completely different paradigm to say a battleship, and requires a different approach.
You also shouldn't move your hands to backspace on a 40%, or frankly ever. The backspace can be reached with the right pinky finger easily. But I understand moving the hand is probably muscle memory from using larger keyboards.
Not only ortholinear 40% requires different paradigm but also different hands physiognomy.
I'm sure some alien race with 10 parallel fingers in one hand or with two hands that can be positioned parallel and close to each other can appreciate such layout/format more 😂
Humans hands are more suited to ergodox if ortholinear is really needed.
I think if Chyrosran could be a little open minded, a split 40% may help since he wouldn’t be so cramped while typing on it.
That said, I really prefer an ergodox. I can do 90% of what I need on layer 1 then I have a few more for specialty stuff.
@@reav3rtm Yeah, I totally agree with this. I moved from a preonic (50% ortholinear) to a moonlander (~60% split columnar). I don't actually think the preonic was in any way worse than a standard keyboard in terms of ergonomics, the stagger is a hold over from typewriters, nothing to do with anatomy. You can make arguments for and against layer shifts and chords, however split keyboards honestly make such a big difference.
They have their own draw backs - it can be harder to find home, they take up more space and tend to be more expensive. I really wouldn't want to swap back though, the posture is so much more relaxing and I feel the benefits in my shoulders and wrists.
I really don't find a big change going from ortho, to columnar, to staggered - and regularly switch between all 3 with zero hassle, though I also stick to pretty good typing habits which helps. I definitely think columnar/ortho is a big help in visualising and swapping to new layouts.
I have to agree an awesome key switch, but man that typing demo looked painful as all hell with that layout. I'd rather be forced to learn the Dvorak layout with Cherry MY switches than this.
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Lol this is basically my dream board
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I own an ortholinear a staggered 40 and staggered 60. Plus keep around a tkl in case a weak mind visits and needs a loaner.
the sound is torture
You're thinking about this all wrong! It's not a "keyboard" it's a "double sized macropad"
If you're going to have a toggle key, you need to have an LED to let the user know when it's active. just saying
Tell that to Microsoft when they made the wireless 700 set.
@@kornaros96 Indeed I will, I'm sure they'll just ignore me, but I will 😂
I was 100% sure that this guy was being sarcastic until i saw him typing on that keyboard, and now i know why he didnt like the keyboard 💀
That's the last time you get a free gift. LOL!
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Hey guys
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"I think this is my first time covering a 40% keyboard" - No it isn't, you reviewed the Planck with Zealio switches
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watching this while building a 40% contra board..is this a personal attack? :P
No, a general one :p .
I like capacitive buckling springs and I would love to try an ortho board someday... but man, I don't understand the draw of 40% or even 60% layouts. Removing keys is always a compromise. For anything except a laptop, anything below a tenkeyless layout seems like purposely handicapping yourself for bragging rights.
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Same reason people brag about using Arch.
I am indeed both clown, and lunatic.
If you are going to use mass in grams, give the imperial units in "stones" to be consistent. Always found it annoying in physics that they used mass and weight interchangeably. Weight is a force so it isn't mass!
yea... kilograms is mass and pounds is weight... could convert into slugs for mass though for the americans... or newtons for the metric folks to use weight :p
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This is literally blind typing. I just don't understand one thing. If the numbers are not present on this 'keyboard' why is there the hash symbol? Because I think you need the key combination of Shift and the number 3 for the hash symbol on a complete keyboard.
With qmk you can program the keys to input whatever you want even shifted caracteres. This keyboard can have every single function a full size keyboard has and you never move more than 1u from the home row to access everything.
The hash is the ANSI key thatbecomes hash on UK-ISO.
ayo i also have a gold star balm on my monitor lmao
Surprised you didn't go for an easy joke with the name
The joke is intentional. BS is supposed to have exactly the dual meaning you're thinking of.
his hand is literally as big as the entire keyboard
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Silly thing.
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That keyboard sounds like s""" and sounds absolutely fabulous all at the same time.´
Lmao, as good as the switches are, the exact opposite could be said for the format
Makes quite a lot of sense if you spend some time with it.
I'd say the opposite is true lol
@@InvidiousIgnoramus Yeah, it's good for specialised terminal keyboard like multi-keypad or multi numpads, lol. It's like using vi for programming. If you twist yourself to illogical and non ergonomic way of working, you can make it work. But why.
@@reav3rtm it's significantly more ergonomic if you actually look at how your fingers rest on it compared to a staggered layout, especially your left hand. Almost every single ergo board design out there uses at least some ortholinear or columnar stagger elements because it's literally designed around human fingers, not a mechanical necessity for a typewriter to function.
@@InvidiousIgnoramus Exactly, edgodox format is suitable for orholinear. Keypads, numpads, macropads as well because they have not more than four columns of keys, just to be operated with single hand. Now take this 40% "ergonomic" obomination. I would like to see you put your both hands on 40% keyboard side by side to match columns with finger position. And touch-type like that.
40% ortholinear is designed around human fingers, except humans don't have 10 fingers in one hand..
I love 40s and ortho .... and have more hair .... ahahahhajaja
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I thought the BS in the name stood for buckling spring, but this is bullshit. Some people swear by ortholinear, and more power to them, but to me it's pure torture.
they are hipsters and nothing more
Some argument could be made for ergodox because of the way halves are separated to accommodate to each hand's angle. But single piece ortholinear layout with more than 12 keys (keypad/numpad) is pure nonsense.
@@reav3rtm Ortholinear is much more comfortable to type for me, so just for that reason it is not a gimmick. Having the keys stacked vertically in a straight line helps guide my fingers to the right key when doing proper 10-finger touch typing.
@@iTurnGayForBisu the lack of stagger straight up sabotages my ability to use it, but I don't think it's objectively bad just because I can't cope with it. I think both 40% and ortholinear have a lot of merit for those that don't have that hangup. That's a big part of why I was willing to design this board in the first place. That, and I was copiously drunk when my friend asked me to do it right on the heels of finishing another capsense buckling spring pad card.
ortho BS
The sound is terrible. WTF?
To whoever made this joke keyboard, congratulations for making the first keyboard to be motivated by teh lulz.
Just because it isn't popular doesn't mean it isn't better. Your inability to learn ortholinear says more about you than about the board. Staggered boards suck
Should the typing demonstration take just a bit longer and Sigur Rós' "Svefn-g-Englar" would be the order of the day...
Haha did you like that trailer? XD
@@Chyrosran22 Yeap! That was a standout for sure!! (and God knows there were quite a few classics around here 😂)