DJI and analog CAN fly together. Stop FPV interference!
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- čas přidán 25. 07. 2024
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00:00:00 - Interference: the biggest problem in FPV
00:01:06 - What is interference
00:02:16 - What does interference look like?
00:06:20 - Three conditions that cause interference
00:07:34 - Frequency means channels
00:10:27 - Real-world example: R1 vs. R8 at 25 mW
00:11:15 - Real-world example: R8 vs. R8
00:12:18 - Have I earned your support today?
00:13:26 - Avoid DJI 8 / Raceband 6
00:14:39 - Use R8 / DJI 7 to avoid WiFi
00:15:52 - Best practices for channel allocation
00:19:02 - Proximity: closer means more interference
00:21:02 - Real-world example: effect of proximity
00:21:32 - Real-world example: my quad is flying far away
00:22:19 - Real-world interference between DJI and analog
00:25:38 - Best practices for Proximity
00:26:49 - The biggest mistake DJI / Walksnail pilots make
00:28:00 - Everybody should reduce output power
00:28:54 - Doesn't pit-mode fix all this?
00:29:32 - Best practices for output power
00:30:47 - What do you care most about?
Been a lone wolf pilot for 5 yrs now, anyone else?
Me, 2 and a half years
Never flown with anyone.. trying to.l but no luck so far
yep lol doing fpv since 2015 never flown with anyone .🤷♂️ and never have been able to try dji fpv 💸
2 years now
Yep...
Three weeks ago in Manizales, Colombia, we held a race and we had HDZero, Analog and DJI pilots flying at the same time. Yes, we know that in MultiGP USA nobody can't race with DJI but we didn't forbid them or made them buy analog stuff, we were like "Hey, come on, just fly with us" and that's all, it was cool.
We raced HDZero R1, Analog R2, DJI 6 and Analog R8 200mW. The racetrack was 60m2 and it worked well :)
there is this app for Android called FPV Video channel sorter. Basically you add pilots and bands that each pilot can tune in and it will give suggestions for each pilot which channel to use and have maximum frequency separation.
That seemed genuine. I’m that dji guy, it’s all I have. And so the others just make it easy by taking turns and making sure we’re vocal about plugging in things mid flight. Van Nuys has a great rc place called Apollo IX, and the regulars there will surely make you feel like you can hang, regardless of what you bring. Bring a full heart and an open mind. And beer. Shout out to Mike and the boys.
Still need to come through!! I’ve been solo for years now
Thanks jb. I been flying solo for about 11/2 yrs. Just recently met some new piolets that have been doing the same thing. All newbies. We always were confused about what to do. Now I can show them this weekend the rite way.
Awesome jb. And thanks agian.
Flushfpv.
Thanks for taking the time and putting the legwork in to make this common knowledge!
I regularly fly in a mixed group (dji/analog/hd0) and we have no problems up to 6 pilots. On the other hand everytime I visit racing fields I have to argue about the possibility of mixed flying and some people literally jump off the flight line when they realize there is a guy with a naked Vista in his switchback ;-)
Thanks JB for bringing it back to the basics that many forget - or just dont know yet.
This is one of those videos i wish you did years sooner. Mad at you for taking so long, but happy you did this. funny how I could have used this a few months ago. Seeing those patterns are very important. thanks JB
"FPV Video Channel Interference Best Practices" Joshua Bardwell
5 years ago
@@Ryet9 that one is only analog dude
I was literally just doing research on this last night.
modded a cinewhoop that has a digital and an analog VTX to test penetration through houses and was curious what channels would interfere the least with each other.
This video is on point! 👌
I love your dronebuilds
@@drippyash7376 haha thank ya! Glad they've helped 🙌🙌
Fantastic work, Joshua! Thanks a bunch for all the effort and testing! 😃
Weirdly, here I get less interference around band F channel 4... I really don't know why.
Anyway, stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Thank you Joshua. Excellent detailed video on a painful subject to analog flyers at a RC airport. Especially with new DJI pilots who don't know better.
Fantastic core information for any flight line, Joshua! This video will serve as an essential reference for years to come. Thank you, sir!
Very thorough video excellently explained. This would have saved me hours of research before I ran an FPV festival a year ago. I will be sharing this 👍
This is great! Thanks for your time and effort in doing this research. Hoping for a table showing the combination especially on analog and dji.
Worthy of note that HDZero also has F2 and F4 frequencies available for IMD6 frequency allocation (R1,R2,F2,F4,R7,R8).
🫶Joshua, you are such a great leader to soooo much people who learn all this. Thank you so much that you share your knowledge 🙏 greetings from Germany. Here are 3-5 channels wich bringing continuous content to this. But non of them are going so deep. And i bet they all learned much from you in the past.
Sorry for my bad english.
Thanks for the amazing video. I was following all these advice's but i had to collect information from so many other people. I think this is the fist video have everything all in one
"Yeah I'm flying. I'm having such a good time." @ 21:44. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
This is good technical content, fresh stuff like your 2000 rates video, keep going even though I know its hard on youtube to keep new content you have it down.
The chart incorrectly lists Sharkbyte as being different from R1-8. HDZero/SB are now exactly the same as R1-8 and F2/4.
This error on this chart has created a lot of confusion with new users and is super annoying.
BTW, the group I fly with just does analog low (R1-4) and DJI high (DJI 5-8). This isn't perfect, but it gets everyone in the air.
Thanks Joshua, I don't fly with anyone at this time but I want to so this was pretty eye-opening.
I must commend you for a great job doing these test.
very thorough and informative.
this is the JB Goodness
Bravo Sir.
Excellent information JB!
When I was first learning about how the signals worked I tried putting analog w gopro on a digital quad with air unit. I couldnt understand why i couldnt get it to work how i wanted even though the channels were far from each other. it was mainly that the receiver was right next to the goggles. it was so frustrating but make more sense now that i understand it better.
Also having a real pit on your quad is very useful along with having low power on disarm set-up on your quads.
Excellent information! I'll be sharing this.
I fly analog and so it's easy to get blasted.
Ty from Spain for share your knowledge!!
Right on Jb . This was great 👍🏻
This. People need to see this. Way too many 50Mb/s DJI pilots at 1200mW and say that they're on channel whatever and we shouldn't be impacted, allthough 3 other pilots now are falling out of the air.
I was at the park saw a guy flying I walked out to talk fpv and learn.I saw his drone fall.He when to get it and packed up but didn't want to talk.And now to day you told me why.Thank you.
Awesome video, JB, Thanks! :)
Our clubs policy to analogue v DJI digital is to put all the analogue on the lower end of the frequency and the digital on the upper end of it.
Analogue vtxs start at its lowest frequency and move up to their chosen frequency, with DJI the system switches on in the public channel at the top end of the frequency and moves down to its chosen frequency.
We also have other rules such as:
everybody switches on together (at 5-10 second intervals)
Our takeoff/landing area is about 25 foot away (much to the annoyance of the fixed wing pilots who think the two should be the same).
Nobody uses pit mode or auto temp control (as switching from low power to full power kicked analogue out the air regardless of the frequency)
Everybody sits at least 2 meters apart.
Nobody powers up if “off sequence” (I.e. if you don’t get powered up in the power up zone, you wait for the next flight).
Since we’ve implemented these rules, nobody has taken anybody else out of the air.
That sounds pretty German to me ;-) but as long as it works I won't complain!
Goggles 2 and 03 air unit don't do this boot up to channel 8-thimg anymy
Awesome video as always my dude!
This is an excellent video. Thanks for making it
You’re awesome! Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
In my experience, I've flown with DJI pilots, all very knowledgeable, I myself been flying for 7 years. We know what we're doing. And still, it may happen one day all good, excellently range, excellent video. And the other, I see those horizontal lines all the time. It's annoying.
What a fantastic well made video. I will try to follow these tips. This video took a lot of effort to make. Glad I'm a Patreon, my money is put to good use with Bardwell at the helm.
Super helpful video that all pilots should master 🙌 I've got a question about DJI interference tho. We typically fly 2 pilots on DJI 1200mw 50mbps on 1 and 3. We'll be fine flying together for hours, the same 2 people, the same spot, the same quads. Then all of a sudden, we'll both have a slideshow of lag. The screen will still say 22-29ms delay, but we both feel it and immediately have to land and switch to 25mbps to be flyable again. I understand DJI also has a sync pulse on R6 that I think is used for telemetry, and my current hypothesis is they stop taking turns and talk over each other. Anyway, curious if you can explain the behavior
Very informative and helpful video. For now I mostly fly by myself. Periodically I'll fly with my son in law. But I retire soon which brings the potential of flying with others, this info gives me the tools I need to not be "That guy." 🤓
Joshua I love you! You are my idol XD. This video is pure gold.
Great video. I hope it becomes your most watched one.
I think you have been watching our race meets, we just had our State Champions which Thomas Bitmatta won. Racing head to head with 7 Dji pilots and a heap of analogue pilots
I'm surprised they haven't developed a FHSS (frequency hopping spread spectrum) for video transmitters system like they use on radio transmitters
This vidja was needed and appreciated.
Thank you for this helpful video 💯👻👍 Happy fly to everyone!
Can't even afford one drone, but I love the sport and the show. Thanks for the info josh
Christmas is coming 😉
Awesome, thanks!
I'm that Walksnail guy on the flightline. Well, I actually did learn something today lol
joined your patreon :) been flying 6 years so... Thx!
Thanks!
Great tutorial. Any band scanners on the market? If I want to scan the field before flight -- (is it reasonable)
I was flying r6 with some friends who have dji and nobody warned me that they were going to demolish my signal luckily he swapped off quickly and all was good so glad i did research on it cus I didnt know about dji defaulting to r6 (dji8)
"Yah I'm flying! I'm having such a good time!" As Bardwell runs around; Bowhahah 😂 Great information, thanks for putting this video together!
Thats a great video. What about the suggestions of channels made by Oscar Liang for flying with multiple people and avoiding harmonics by using different bands? The page is called: "5.8GHz FPV Channels & Frequency Chart (Analogue & Digital)" I would have loved to hear about that.
You put a lot of work into this video - Thank you. I got some answers to things I'd been wondering about. One thing I'm still curious about is whether band/channel choice makes any difference in video reception/quality (in analog). I typically fly B4 (analog) as I fly solo mostly. Is there any reason to change to R#?
R8 avoids WiFi. Also, some vTX output more power on lower frequency, so in some cases you get more range on R1.
@@JoshuaBardwell I learned the R8 trick after I kept knocking my wife out of conference calls when I'd plug in...
she: high powered executive, working from home on conference call with London times...
me: want to play with my tinywhoop...
Plug in...
Her: god damn the internet just went out... can you fix it???
me: unplug whoop
her: THANK YOU!!!! Best IT person ever....
@@JoshuaBardwell Thanks for the info.. You learned me something today.
Great topic and very educational as usual. Do you have any idea why DJI calls Ch 8 Public? Before this video I thought it meant that is safe to start on and goggles are just listening. Apparently I guessed wrong. So what du the mean by the Public label?
Hey JB I picked up your frame, and I’m building my first quad. It seems like the arms are able to move a very small amount even with the wedges in. I sent a quick email about it the other day with a video is this something I should be concerned about? It seems very minor but I’m curious about vibration.
Yeah, it's sooo goood to be true.
And then Done!
So, to avoid trouble, everybody should fly analog or HDzero and simply don’t use the same channel as anybody else. That way: no issues and spectators can access any feed 😜
This video reminds me of something i've been thinking about a lot lately. Recently, on my first FPV gig I was flying over water some of the time. During one battery, my video got stomped (looked just like when dji transmits/plugs in) thankfully I was over dirt in the parking lot and could safely disarm. But it scared me so bad & made me want to implement gps for position hold or RTH on my "cine" rigs. This is something that would be so useful in fpv and is often overlooked imo. Would I be limited to inav + GPS module to implement this?
beta flight has gps rescue function check it out
Hay Josh I have a dji mavic pro 2 and am having trouble getting replacement batteries any idea as to what can be done with this drone as far as cannibalizing it for an fpv drone?
Been flying with other pilots on dji with my analogue gear for years now, just ask the dji pilots to go on 25megabit at the other end of the channels that you are :')
I got lucky the other day i guess....i flew on 800 analog with r polarization on band 5 right next to analog on band 3 w 400 right polarization and dji on band 1 w left polarization and we were all right next to eachother and i even chased my dji buddy around...new to fpv and im learning there is soo much more to learn and edit after watching i guess we got it right
in europe R7 & R8 are not only outside of whats used for wifi, they are also outside of whats legal to be used.
Great vid
Are you going to make a video about the Cetus x because I am trying to get into fpv what are your thoughts
Is there a way to find out if a VTX outputs more power on lower frequencies?
Buy the immersionrc power meter.
What about flying with mavics and dji fpv?
Should R8 works perfectly?
Thanks for the help!
I learned something today 👍
Can you post a link to that frequency chart?
That obviously took a fair bit of research and experience - but its really complicated and likely will not be remembered on the day. Can it be boiled down into a sort of pre-flight checklist? I fly analog and so far always solo, because here in UK there just aren't that many pilots in my area. I do use a pre-flight checklist though, to make sure I'm complying with all the rules and flying safely. If this could be condensed into a "cue card" that I can keep in my kit, then when that day comes that I meet another pilot, we will have a handy quick reference.
Yes. There are sections in the video named "best practices". That's the checklist.
23:58 - vtxs on far separated channels. 24:38 - vtxs on the same channel. Was that interference with them on the same channel or highly separated channels?
edit: Okay I watched it a few times, and I see where the transition happens. Just wasn't clear from the dialogue.
Thanks jb! I'm mostly a lonely pilot
Can you do a revieuw of the insta360 one rs please?
For future videos, it would be nice to see a picture-in-picture view of in goggles and the field of you walking about.
Been to events where there has been 3 on Dji and 3 on analog in the air at the same time.
does the dji o3 work the same as the vistas?
Analog will be around for long time because in a hobby that is considered one of the most expensive on the planet as long as there is a market for cheaper equipment, they will keep cranking it out.
what channel do dji photography drones use?
There problems have already been solved years ago for control links. Tracks and flying fields used to have frequency charts. Now we have frequency hopping and things like that. Can any of this be applied to VTXs?
The problem is that video links require much more bandwidth than control links. Digital video links use spread-spectrum and really make the most of the available bandwidth, but at the end of the day there's only so much you can squeeze into the spectrum.
That one DJI pilot who keeps accidentally flying on DJI public channel 8 and then gets mad when you knock him out.
Do the digital vtx all have the betaflight option to be at lowest power till armed like analog?
Not in Betaflight but DJI has an option in the goggles that you can toggle on/off that will keep the vtx at low power until armed.
Thanks for your time. Here's a comment, a like, and a subscribe.
There needs to be more split style analog cameras for analog.
Me and my buddy, only one. And trying to plan a day we’re both free is rare
It’s kinda a bummer 4 of us on analog all sitting together and 1 lone dji in the woods n he’s a good guy just my opinion, any word on orqa digital? Thanks :)
/methinks someone plugged in on Joshua recently and he's just venting some frustration! :D
Would just each person using different circular polarized antennas help any like if there is 2 pilots one uses one and the other uses the other?
If there are less than 3 or 4 pilots, it's not necessary to go to this length. If you want 6 or 8 pilots, then using alternating polarization can make a difference.
If you are in a space with limited multipathing (no large metal objects nearby) it will help, assuming you are using antennas that maintain circular polarisation well, as LHCP signal entering RHCP antennae will experience destructive interference equal to removing circular component from the signal (typically circularly polarised antennas don't maintain perfect circularity especially off plane). As each reflection switches polarity of the signal LHCP to RHCP and vice versa in heavy multipathing you will be receiving odd numbered reflected signals.
Does anyone know if interference can occur between DJI camera drones and DJI FPV? I more often run into this situation than other FPV fliers.
I was just wondering about this! Sounds like from your experience it does.
I always use E4 or E8 and never have problems flying with friends that have both digital and analog, because those channels are completely out of the range
My drone "friends" (maybe soon to be former drone friends) will power up to change channels with a drone that was using DJI1200mw 50Mb channel 2 when they were flying previously, if they find out I'm on channel 3 (which is DJI 25Mb channel 3 because I'm trying to be nice to others who are flying with me). That's a conflict. I'm tried of crashing so I don't fly with them often any more.
You just can't fly with people like this. It's a shame.
Surprised you didn't mention elrs vtx admin as a way to switch channels without interfering.
Joshua, the spectrum analyzer on my rapidfire shows DJI using channels 1 & 2 for 50Mbps. Am I wrong?
The 50 Mbps channels are twice as wide as 25 Mbps so I think you're right.
Will power lines interfere with fpv dji digital? I keep falling outta the sky when I fly over this set of power lines?
There could be some kind of mobile data thing maybe
All this talk about output power and frequency reminded me about ham radio licenses. So my question is do I need a ham radio license to fly at higher output power in the US? Or do I even need one at all?
To use an analog video transmitter, the FCC expects you to have a ham license. For Part 15 certified systems like the DJI FPV system, you don't need one.
Thanks
The issue about digital is the protocol still owned by the company that do not want to share it. I hope someday there will be a community that create somekind open source and free to use.
Oh, you mean, you can maybe use HDZero?
@@RomainCavallini thank you for the information. But actually i hope that some kind of opentx or edgetx for digital video transmission. So any brand or manufacture can create the product for it. Or betaflight, ardupilot, cleanflight, inav and so on. 😊
I don’t know why this keeps coming up? Of people check signals and digital flies at 25 instead of 50 it’s not a problem. We had a mixer of 8 pilots in the air analog and digital.
hey! this video talks a lot about how DJI stomps analog, but what about the other way around? does analog stomp on dji? if so, to what extent?
Yes it can interfere but DJI in general is better at staying flyable in the presence of interference.
@@JoshuaBardwell ok thx! I just switched from dji to analog for financial reasons, my fpv friends (all using dji) are now complaining that they will get interference from me xD I'll be sure to send them this video, so informative! thx !
This cost me 1 motor and a frame when someone powered on his Avata next to me while I was midair...
Thumbs up JB, Great advice