In-depth VR6 Turbo Swapped Fiero
Vložit
- čas přidán 2. 08. 2024
- Here is significantly more information about my VR6 Turbo swapped Fiero.
In this video, I go over what all was involved in swapping a Turbo VR6 into my 88 Pontiac Fiero. This is a fairly technical in-depth video about this Fiero, so I am sorry for anybody that finds this boring, watch the other video for my story about the car if that is what you enjoy more. I hope you enjoy the video and consider coming back for more content like this.
More story behind the car and some ride along footage in my other video of the Fiero:
• Schwaps Collection #1:...
Music Thanks to Wintergatan / winterga. .
Find us on Instagram: @schwamotorsports
And on Facebook: @schwamotorsports
Wow, this is definitely one of the most creative engine swaps I’ve ever seen. The VR6 engine is one of my favorites. Very creative thinking for sure. I hope you enjoy it man.🥳🎉🏁🏆
Thank you, I love it, good sounds and great power and you can't argue with the nice gearing spread for the fiero and the little bits of modern-ness that work their way through are a nice bonus :)
I've been just stumped with which GM engine would make a good, manual transmission Fiero. I finally gave up on the idea of using a GM engine. They make good engines, but not what I had envisioned. I thought about an Alfa V6 out of a front wheel drive 164, but finding one will be a challenge. And then there is the VR6. Excellent engine mated to an excellent gearbox. Great choice for swap. That narrow angle really helps with the fit. Of course, that intake....has a new set of challenges, especially with a fancy plastic manifold. Good job. This car looks well sorted.
Thanks, yeah and if you went with the simpler 12 valve motor the intake manifold actually fits since the head is a fair bit skinnier. I have I have no regrets with the 24 valve, but I would recommend others go the easier route :p Alfa would be cool too, but finding them in the states really would be tricky!
Staggered intake runner lengths were used on the MK3 AAA 12 valves to compensate for the staggered cylinder layout. On the AFP 12 valves (MK4), VW switched to equal length intake runners and compensated for the staggered cylinder layout by using different camshaft profiles for the front and rear cylinder banks to equalize the air flow. I believe the same is true for the BDF 24 valves, judging by the shape of the factory intake manifolds.
In other words, equal length intake runners are ideal on AFP and BDF VR6's (or AAA's with AFP cams). I would personally use a cast aluminum short runner intake on a turbo VR6 😂
I knew about the different cam profiles on the AFP motor, I am not sure if people have found the 24v motors to be that way, I have a feeling when they did the 24v they found that mixed length runners provided two different rpms of a "torque boost" giving a broader power band. Since the 24v also has an intake flapper it works around different intake principles too, but with my set up, I love the noises the car makes with the long runner intake and I wouldn't change that at all, short running intakes on VR motors just lose some of the wookiee sounds from my experience.
Oh and I have no idea if a short runner would even fit in the Fiero, its a totally different size constraint than most VR owners deal with :p
That's amazing build & a cool car...Thanks for sharing... your shop looks like what I imagine my own version of Willy Wonka 🏭 to be like. 👍
Thanks! I love my madness, its a bit out of hand, especially right now, but I feel in the next couple years its gonna even get better :)
looks awesome! I purchased a brand new White 1988 Fieri GT in 1988 and loved that car. I had a miller woods turbo kit installed in it in 1989. I miss my 1988 GT.
Very cool! I actually used a modified Miller Woods kit on this car when it had the aluminum head 2.8l gm V6 in it. If you check out the first video on the car I show some about the turbo V6 I did :)
Very very cool and interesting build!!
Thank you, I try and keep all my builds interesting, can’t just be cookie cutter swaps all the time :p
Nice build, and your car looks great.
Thank you, its been a journey and I love how the car has turned out :)
The coupe front clip looks so freakin cool on the GT. That's the main issue I've had with the GT is that the nose looks way too long.
Yeah, I love a well done GT, but I just really love the tucked under almost Pantera shape to the bottom half of a coupe, but its hard to argue with the fastback, so we have best of both worlds here :)
Really great option for a fiero swap. Thank you so much for informing the community on this more modern swap, giving us more options for these great looking and performing cars. You have a very indepth video that is very helpful and useful. I hope to see more videos from you on other aspects of your cars transformation. Its extremely important that we save these cars, and that aftermarket support grows to modernize and improve the fiero to a point beyond what Pontiac had envisioned for the 1988 GT. I'd love to see modern aftermarket cradles, fully adjustable and complete suspension packages, modernized front compartments with placements for oversized radiators, oil cooler and transmission cooler, with proper air ducting, better interior choices to modernize the interior of the fiero, to make it simple to convert your 1984 red fiero into a 1988 format.
Hey? Whose SAAB Sonet in the photos?
You saw our Sonett :p It will be getting featured on the channel :) and yes it would be nice if the Fiero's got the support of some of the other cars from the same era, but thats what makes our cars unique so we have to trade that off and enjoy what makes our special :)
Dang dude this is sweet!!
Love the VR and 02M platform, my brother and I turboed his Jetta and is making awesome power. Super strong engines that sound great!!🏁⚙️🏁
Oh yeah, the power is insane, ive been getting it tuned in more and its crazy when the turbo and engine come into power together and harmonize together its pulls like crazy!
@@schwamotorsports7792 This engine and drive train swap appears to be very good to excellent.
->am very aware of the more 'clunky', less smooth, large movement manual transmissions from GM including in the Fiero, though improvements compared with 1970's versions in their compact and subcompact vehicles. -> had driven the later Fiero GT, especially the 2.8 L , V-6 -> it was a 'spunky' roadster, but certainly had more potential, which the engineers developed and desired - but GM Corporate seem to block, along with the cancellation - SADly too.
-> also am well aware of the VW Rabbit-Golf, though not the GTI versions - drove them extensively, also with my father's purchase and ownership of one too.
->thus, one of my questions about the trans-axle and specifically about the clutch from the GTI You swapped into this Fiero
-> is the same basic type and 'feel' clutch used in the GTi as with the Rabbit-Golf ?
-> many of my sub compact vehicles were Japanese, mostly Toyota, along with one Mazda and my first [German] Opel Manta and have driven many Honda, Nissan, and others too. All of these had comfortable, very usable, functional, smooth operating hydraulic clutch activation, though the VW Rabbit clutch was mechanical, cable activated, it was very smooth, well designed, very usable, functional, with good operation.
All The Best
Sincerely
@@newtonfirefly3584 so the later GTI actually uses a hydraulic clutch as well, so the feel is very smooth, honestly it just feels natural, granted I am using an oem replacement, not an upgraded unit, but it’s handling the power so far :)
@@schwamotorsports7792 Thank You for Your reply.
Also the hydraulic clutch types are my preference too.
I have a 12v sitting my garage(with transmission) and I just got an 86 fiero with the iron duke lol, I can’t imagine how great these cars must feel when converted to wookie
I feel the boost is a bit crucial, Fieros weigh a bit more than most vw’s but with all the bits together it’s amazing :)
I met a guy name Dave in NJ that did this swap some time ago. Not sure if he added a turbo but without it there are a lot of better swaps for a Fiero, both in power and ease of installation. My hats off to you for putting this swap together. My 86 1/2 GT has a 3.4 from a 95 Camaro which is a real easy swap. I port matched and polished the intake/exhaust and put high lift rockers on it to improve flow.
Any dyno results once it was sorted? 0-60, 1/4 mi times?
Dave McClung had a 12v 2.8 VR6 swapped Fiero, he managed to do it years before me, he never ended up adding a turbo and I would agree, the VR6 is a cool engine NA, but not a power house and requires boost to make it worth the extra effort :p The 3.4 is a great swap to get the original sounds and grunt of the Fiero but just amped up a bit, its very hard to argue with :p
Haven't done anything more than virtual dyno on some power pulls, but I need to get more comfortable pushing the car and test it more, the math suggests(based on car weight, drag, and frontal area) that it puts down 300whp at 7000rpms with just 7 pounds of boost.
@@schwamotorsports7792 Small world. That is almost certainly the Dave I met. Tall fellow with long blonde hair and a pretty wife. Probably in his late 30's to mid 40's now. Lived in south Jersey.
Dave and his family are very nice people. He worked on my 87gt when I was in n.j. I am from Florida
I have been considering a VR6 swap as well for my 88. Specifically the 2012+ Passat 3.6 with the DSG. What are you using for engine management? It was nice to see what you did on the intake as that was a big concern of mine with the VR6, that intake goes on for miles.. Do you have a more detailed build in written form? Like a forum build thread? Any problems after some time shaking down the swap? Thank you for sharing.
So there is a chance the 3.6 intake would fit, since it doesn’t have the “power port.” As for management I’m running megasquirt, which is awesome but it can’t handle the dsg directly or the direct injection of the 3.6l, you would be best off using an oem tuned ecu with the 3.6 and if you had to make a custom intake manifold for it. I have a 3.2 turbo dsg in my Audi TT and the ECUmaster stand alone is supposed to be rated to handle the dsg and it just really doesn’t do a great job of it. Oem is the way to go if you want that transmission :)
Shame not enough room for a second turbo of the same type. Not a criticism, but I'd have left the quiet turbo alone. As for the intake manifold if it worked, but it's your car. Absolutely love the colour, what is it? Would a standard VR6 swap (as though there is such a thing) without the heavily modified intake and turbo have required any cutting into the boot/trunk? Would an even smaller turbo but two of them fit in? Would 3 even smaller turbos work or even be feasible?
So lots to unpack here :) the color is Lotus Elise Laser Blue, and I love it too :) I would love to go twin or even triple turbo, I have a way to do it in my head with it being twin with a third to come in at higher loads, but not in the fiero :p
A smaller turbo would definitely remove the need for cutting the trunk, and I am questioning going smaller for a little more response and torque down low, we will see what happens and I’ll keep everybody updated :)
Question on your axles did you simply cut and weld the fiero and vw axle halves together?
Or do you do some hub work?
Half Fiero axle half, I wanted to keep it simple and not deal with custom hubs or anything. Eventually I’ll get custom shafts to fit the factory vw cvs and factory fiero cvs
Since this is running an MS I am assuming you are uaing a.gm iat sensor for intake temps.
Have You logged your intake temps? Curious What it is with your intercooler in that location.
Also how much boost?
Whats all that white stuff on the ground at the end of the vid?
I’ve actually been meaning to check, I’ve finally pushed the boost up to 15psi and haven’t done a ton of logging since then, once this white stuff gets off the ground I’ll get it out and log some pulls :)
Any info on your widebody? Did you cut, pull the flare, and fiberglassed it?
I will be doing a video about the wide body itself so keep an eye out :) But since the Fiero is SMC it doesn't always play well with fiberglass, so we used a second rear clip and set of fenders and bonded them to the original pieces and used SMC specific filler to smooth between.
Is it the 2.8 or the 3.6 liter? Nice build
Just the 2.8l, they are much more cost effective for a test build and didn’t require any custom parts to the intake to add port fuel, I’d love to swap to a 3.6 eventually but the turbo spools so quickly currently I’m fine with the small displacement :)
super c est ce que je veux faire
Go for it! its a great match to the Fiero
Hey buddy, how did you do the wiring harness,to match to the fiero . How did you get it to start with the wiring harness
Wiring in Fieros is a little easier than it should be, the design of the car makes swaps simple. There is a connector over by the battery(called the c500) it is how the engine integrates with the cabin, so gauges and starter and things like that. Then under the center console by the engine computer there is another disconnect(called the c203) and it is where the engine integrates more with the chassis, so like fuel pump, fuses, and AC.
You keep those pieces of the original engine harness and integrate the new engine harness into that.
Honestly, other than the actual connectors and their location there is no difference between my VR6 harness and the 3.9l V6 swap harnesses I’ve done. Plugs in in the same places, use the same wires, and the same computer :)
@@schwamotorsports7792 thanks alot,but you used a different ignition coil right
Absolutely, since it’s an aftermarket ECU I can run just about any ignition set up I want. I started with a 2008 Chevy Impala ignition coil, but I am currently running 6 LS ignition coils :)
Wait... so you bleed off boost and increase lag just to hear the turbo?
Are you talking about the anti surge housing? Since boost is more a function of how much air the turbo crams into the intake I don’t think it bleeds off any boost, and I guess it could slow down the building of boost, but it won’t effect at all the rate the turbine spins up since it didn’t change anything on that side, so I doubt it caused lag. If you ever look into compressor maps you will find an anti surge housing will expand the range of efficiency of a turbo. And actually to the exact point of your question, when you appreciate your car for more than just being “fast” you would happily trade some hp for a better sound, and I’ve done it on more than one car :) so yes I’d bleed off boost and increase lag just to hear the turbo better :)
@@schwamotorsports7792 before your video I had never heard of that type of compressor housing. After looking into it I was a little right that efficiency is slightly negatively effected, but completely offset by longevity of the turbo because it won’t surge.
And as far as you wanting more sound than performance, I totally get it. When I saw your design I incorrectly assumed the boost bleedoff would be higher than it actually is.
Car sounds great BTW. Keep that Fiero on the road!
Thanks, yeah the anti surge has a number of perks and the whistle is just a side perk :p and thanks I won’t let it go by the wayside, I’ve actually turned the boost up and it’s a monster these days :p
Looks like a mini Corvette !
Some people wouldn't like those two compared :p but the coupe bumpers really do look very corvette like :)
I love unusual swaps in FIero's. I've seen a couple K20 swaps too. Would love to see a 2ZZ swap
Having had a turbo 2zz in my Elise, it’s just not enough torque for the weight of a fiero, there are ways to get high rpm motors into Fieros, but the 2zz I fear is just lacking(without a ton of internals work to support good power). Then again, maybe the supercharged set up would be nice, but at 1000lbs heavier than an Elise it’s gonna be a tall order with that little of motor :(
@@schwamotorsports7792 Thanks man. I honestly never realized that. I thought the Fiero was around 2400lb