Illyrian Language - An Insight into a Lesser Known Indo-European Language
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- čas přidán 2. 12. 2023
- 🔍 Let's get stuck into the secrets of the Illyrian language with Learn Hittite! 📝
🗝️ Join us as we explore this ancient language, recently featured in a Roman army film, with insights from Croatian linguist Ranko Matasovic. Discover the challenges of studying Illyrian, attested through glosses and a handful of words.
📚 Dive into debates on its geographical reach, historical context, and connections to languages like Venetic and Messapic. Explore linguistic theories, from Illyro-Albanian links to the influence of Celtic.
🌐 Learn about a fascinating (but false) Illyrian inscription and gain glimpses of the language through glosses. We will also talk about Pan-Illyrism, which was a ‘fashion’ amongst linguists to throw anything looking indo-european that couldn’t be placed elsewhere into the category of ‘Illyrian’
🔍Find out how Matasovic approached creating Illyrian text for a film and the intriguing linguistic landscape. Don't miss our recommended articles for a deeper dive into Illyrian mysteries! 📖✨
📖 References and Selected Reading List:
⭐ Ligorio, O. (2023, November 16-18). The (Re)construction of Illyrian for the Motion Picture Illyricum. Fundamentals and Advances in Balkan Linguistics, Belgrade University.
⭐ Katicic, R. (1976). Part 1 Ancient Languages of the Balkans. Berlin, Boston: De Gruyter Mouton. doi.org/10.1515/9783111568874
⭐ Bidjin Laura, I., Matasović, R. i Matović, P. (2022). Prevođenje na latinski i ilirski jezik za film Illyricum. Latina et Graeca, 2 (42), 152-155. Preuzeto s hrcak.srce.hr/292044
Krahe, H. (1955-1964). Die Sprache der Illyrier, 2 vol. (Wiesbaden: Harrassowitz). Vol. 1: 1955; Vol. 2: 1964
Krahe, H. (1955-1964). Die Sprache der Illyrier, 2 vol. (Wiesbaden: Harrassowitz). Vol. 1: 1955; Vol. 2: 1964]
Russu I.I. (1969). Illirii; istoria - limba și onomastica - romanizarea [The Illyrians; history - language and onomastics - the Romanization](București: Editura Academiei).
Pokorny, J. (1938). Zur Urgeschichte der Kelten und Illyrier. Halle: Max Niemeyer.
Ognenov, L. (1958). Ilirskij nadpis ot severna Albanija [The Illyrian inscription from North Albania]. In Izsledvanija v cest na akademik D. Decev (Eds.: V. Beševliev - VI. Georgiev) (Sofija: Academy Press), 333-341.
Leonidas-Romanos Davranoglou, Aris Aristodemou, David Wesolowski, Alexandros Heraclides, (2023). Ancient DNA reveals the origins of the Albanians.bioRxiv 2023.06.05.543790
Gavranovic, M. (2007). Kontakte zwischen Zentralbosnien und Zentralitalien in der Spätbronzezeit. In Piceni ed Europa.
Heiermeier, A. M. (1952). “The British and Goidelic Element in Ireland”: Notes and Suggestions on T. F. O’Rahilly’s: Early Irish History and Mythology. The Journal of the Royal Society of Antiquaries of Ireland, 82(1), 37-44. www.jstor.org/stable/25510805
Mesihović, S. (2023). Tajna natpisa broj 46417 / Secret of Inscription number 46417. University of Sarajevo. www.researchgate.net/publicat...
#protoindoeuropean
#illyrian
#balkans
#linguistics #ancientcivilizations #ancientlanguages
#albania #albanianhistory
Illyrian, Thracian, Scythian...seems like all three are claimed by various modern nation-states as ancestors. But how can we be sure?
We can't be sure, at least in the case of Illyrian
@@LearnHittiteyeah right😂 how come only Albanians always clame that are the Illyrians and nobody has an idea where we come from. Did we just fall from the sky one night or were we there before all others 😂
Thanks for the video! It seems like things are more or less about where they were when I was in college back around the year 2000 (although I was an Engineering major, so probably not the best position to know the latest and greatest in Indo-European studies).
Regardless, these ancient minority languages which are scarcely attested are a dime a dozen, and Illyrian is one of the more important ones (for example, the languages of the Sea Peoples are even more of a mystery).
I guess that save for a sudden discovery of a cache of Illyrian texts, this is where the state of the art will remain for the foreseeable future...
Fantastic video!
Glad you liked it!
10:45 Deu a dai sounds to me like Dheu a dai, meaning Earth is heroic/noble. Or read back to front Dai i dheut, meaning ~Hero of Earth, or earthen hero.
Dai is also pretty archaic and mostly used as an adjective nowadays, not as a name in itself. Dai also sounds like Dhi-a to me, meaning goat.
Sir , i like your videos really much. Could you consider making a video on the also mysterious Thracian or ancient Macedonian language ❤
Thracian will be the second video in the new year! Expect it towards the end of January.
@@LearnHittite thanks for your work sir. I will tell my friends about this channel.
Thank you very much for your support!
👍👍👍 Interesting!!
Do you know anything about Hurrian?
A video on Hurrian will appear in the first week of the new year!
Brilliant video. So, am I correct in my understanding that you more or less think Albanian should be considered it's descendant?
The evidence is extremely limited so we have to bear that in mind but put it this way, if someone asked me for some reason to recreate a sentence in Illyrian - I'd do exactly what Matasovic did and base it on Albanian.
@@LearnHittite I lean this way myself. It also used to be widely thought that Albanian descended from Thracian, but, not sure how much of a thing that still is. Anyway, excellent work, thank you.
First fix map and then greek population never existed in balkan. All balkan were illyria
@@historyofillyria2737First learn history!😂
Zašto ne učimo više o našim precima ilirima koji su živili ba ovim prostorima u školama nije mi jasno učimo o markomanima i latinima nije mi jasno?
Refer to Leibniz for albanian language
Also the latest publication in Science journal which qualifies albanian, together with helenic and armenian languages, as more than 8000 years
The Albanian connection is dubious to say the least. The small amount of words recorded makes it easy to swing the theory in any way you want. Just by using your own examples I can explain 'sica' with Slavic root word meaning 'to cut' *sěkti. 'Sabaia' can be explained with Slavic word for 'oat' *zobъ, being an oat-beer of sort.
Edit: Sibina as spear can also be explained with South Slavic 'svib' meaning dogwood. Dogwood was widely used in the ancient world for spears and the 'v' in old Slavic was most likely pronounced as /w/ which is why it is often omitted in Greek writings.
Slavic ? Come on man , dont make the whole world foolish as you are
In this ring if we translate from Albanian language Nana -mother Ana-side then inicials of names ,old end nau in yous cik - gerl so wen you translate Side doter giv uan tribe tou nather tribe Ep - giv
Bardhyll king have 100% translate bardh-white yll-star whitestar
Nënë
Only Albanians use names Like Agron, Liburn, Dardan, Ilirë, Teuta So there is no doubt that Albanians are descendents of Ilirians
Nationalist sentiment leads people to name their children in a way which fits their narrative even if there's no cultural or historic basis in doing so. None of those names were used in the past.
Indeed we are , and its only matter of time now for the truth to come out for what it is , the greek propaganda its coming to an end preatty fast.
@@iliadmalka you speak of truth ? But you have no proof … I can show you Ancient Greek can you show me ancient Albanian ?
@@davidscwimer1974 proof !!? Well if language its not enaugh for you ( by the way its the only language in which all those proofs u have of about greeks make sense ) just wait , time will give u tons of proofs . Untill than i wish u well.
@@iliadmalka time 😂 this theory has been around since the communist era in Albania! How much time do you need ?
It’s funny how nobody has been able to prove the Albanian Illyrian theory properly … everything is just conjecture
The Albanian language has a strong resemblance to the Messapic language,Illyrian or not,it has ancient roots and its attested early.On the other hand there is absolutely no proof that the irish and scottish people descended from celts,as there is no recorded celtic migration in these lands,the celts were propably primitive tribes which spoke different languages and went extinct.But also the Illyrian ethnonym is wrong,because in these lands there were organised Kindoms such the Ardiaean Kingdom,the Kingdom of the Dardanians,and the Kingdom of the Taulantians,no such thing as" Illyrians" they were called Illyrians by others.The film Illyricum do not illustrate the true culture of these people, and portrays them as uncivillised as the celts or the germanics,and mind you the terms "celts" and "germanics" are not correct as we do not know how these tribesmen called themselves
It’s probably closer to a Greek dialect then any other language
I’m surprised you haven’t mentioned that the Greeks knew and wrote more then anyone else about the Illyrians
What a strange little comment. It's not a dialect of Greek but a sister language.
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 greks
Kings and queen names only albania has these names ilir teuta agron bardhyl genti
A lot of modern Greeks(Arvanites) have Albanian ancestry, and the modern Greek language is constructed with a lot of Albanian elements in it. Most likely the ancient Greeks were part Illyrians as well, the Dorians for example, associated with the words Dru- ( wood, woodland, etc. ), Dor- (hand, to give etc. ) and the -ian(they are). Illyrian/Yllirian/Hellenes/Ellines --very similar words and meanings, probably different variants.
Greci 😂😂😂😂😂stato religioso creato dal inglesi tedeschi francesi ed russi 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Deny it all you can, the real Illyrians are the Albanians. MESAPIK MES A PIK IN ALBANIAN MEANS MIDDLE or peak.
Ilyrian ore albanian language is the first language of humaniti go se the tre of language the sekond is armenin and tre is tocarian.
😂
Go ask one historian about this a now you dont belive this
@@user-iy4qc9ig4e I’m asking you
Nonsense, Basque is the "oldest" surviving European language.
@@davidaxelos4678 don’t try and use reason and logic with these brainwashed people.
could be possibly protoalbanian...but why not consider a uralic language deriving from the step?protohungarian and prototurkish have the word ANA which means mom (in hungarian its actually ANJA) but apart from that,BİCAK resembles the turkish form for knife and spear could be MİZRAK...
🇦🇱🦅🇦🇱🇦🇱🇦🇱🦅🇦🇱🇦🇱🦅🇦🇱🙏
Try to find Olga Luković-pjanović book:"Srbi narod najstariji."(Serbs,the oldest nation).
Book will be interesting to you as linguist!
😂
If world history began in the 8th century AD, perhaps this would be true, but history begins at least 5,000 years earlier! You Serbs are 4,200 years too late.
Hahaha
She should have known that serbia comes from russia 😅
Maybe elsewhere.Not in the Illyrikum where they faced like barbarians about VI century.There is no archeological ore historical data to conferm.Have serbs fought against romans ore Alexander the Great. Don't be ridiculous.
Propagande !
Why do you say that !?? Give some evidence?
No such thing as ancient Albanian
I was only going to just downvote this comment, but then I thought I would try and find out what's actually going on in your head? Does your comment add anything at all to the discussion about Illyrian language? or are you implying that Albanian has no historical roots? The Albani and the Abroi, considered as proto or early Albanians, were first attested in the 6th century BCE, is that not ancient enough for you?
@@sylwianawrocka2599 there is no
Proof that the extinct Illyrian language is linked in anyway to modern Albanian. The claim of a direct and continuous linguistic connection between the ancient Illyrian language and modern Albanian is not universally supported by linguists and scholars. the evidence is insufficient to establish a direct evolutionary link. The Illyrian language is poorly attested, primarily through ancient inscriptions, making it difficult to discern its precise linguistic features and relationship to other languages. Additionally, the development of the Albanian language involved significant influences from Latin, Greek, Slavic, and other languages due to the region's history of cultural exchange and conquest. There is no evidence for this bold claim. Relaying on old communist propaganda is not history. You can downvote the truth … now days the truth means very little to people like yourself
@@davidscwimer1974 But your comment merely stated 'no such thing as ancient Albanian', the video is well researched and actually just does a kind of meta analysis of modern, peer reviewed and published research. Your comment added nothing to the discussion. No evidence, no citations just a random and vague comment.
@@sylwianawrocka2599 really .. check again is there no implication that Albanian is some how an ancient language?
Hi there! What exactly did I say where you seem to have issue? I will just give you a quote from Routledge 'The Indo-European Languages' Second edition - 'Two main theories consider Albanian as a descendant of either Illyrian or Thracian langauges, respectively' and then the author recommends reviewing the work from Matzinger 2009 and 2012. Olander 2016, groups Albanian on the 'Illyric' branch ultimately descending from Paleo-Balkanic - but they stress caution with the label 'Illyric' due to lack of sufficient linguistic data (just as I said in my video). Mallory and Adams in the Encyclopaedia of Indo European (1997) states regarding lexical items 'by far the strongest connectionsncan be argued between Albanian and Illyrian' but again stresses to be conservative with any conclusions. Ultimately, Albanian descended from one of the Balkanic varieties of Indo-European brought to the region by whoever replaced the pre-Indo-European speakers of the region. I think nothing here in my statement is controversial and agrees with many leading names in IE studies, although some will disagree for sure but I try not to present minority views.