ELDRAZI INCURSION - Ideas and Precon Upgrades - Modern Horizons 3

The last of the Modern Horizons 3 precons, Eldrazi Incursion is the first time we've seen Eldrazi legends with a color identity that isn't colorless. Let's explore some options for our Eldritch Overlords and see what we can do to please them.
Decklist:
archidekt.com/decks/7988540/e...
#magicthegathering
#commander
#modernhorizons3

[@canuckguitarist3759]

Wouldn’t you only get one creature on top with conduit of ruin?

[@twilightscallmtg]

You're correct. I didn't remember it was a top of deck tutor effect when I was rounding up cards. It's still worth running to get your Eldrazi of choice that fits the game, but not worth copying. Thanks for pointing out my goof. Pinning this so it's pointed out.

[@CrapsGoodxD]

Apparently you can go infinite with skittering invasion with ulalek and echoes of eternity, dont ask me how though im noob haha

[@twilightscallmtg]

Not sure either. I just spent 20 minutes thinking about how it could work and I'm not seeing it because you're only getting the 1 cast trigger. You aren't casting the copies because the way both cards are worded, and that was deliberate. Otherwise one spell could infinitely re-trigger either Echoes or Ulalek.
At most, if you copied the Echoes with Ulalek first, I think you only get up to 8 total (1 for the original cast, 3 from Ulalek triggering and paying 6 into it (per rulings that say 2 echoes causes 3 triggers from other colorless permanents), and 4 from Echoes seeing each other and making them each trigger the spell copy line twice.
It's a lot of tokens but not infinite.

[@CrapsGoodxD]

@@twilightscallmtg Yea its very confusing I asked some judges and they said that that specific combo does not end on an infinite in itself.
But if you already had infinite mana, you apparently can Keep infinitely copying the stack

[@CrapsGoodxD]

@@twilightscallmtg
Still trying to understand it myself im pretty new to the game, this is very confusing, I tried to play out an opening hand scenario and let a judge check if my stack looked correct and he said it looks right.
This is only with 7 colorless mana starting the stack, so with a lot more or infinite even it gets so wild.
This is what I wrote:
Colorless mana left after initial eldrazi creature cast 7, and then increments of paying ulalek trigger cost 5>3>1
On field: ulalek, reflections of littjara and 3 echoes of eternity
eldrazi creature spell
littjara trigger to copy creature spell
ulalek trigger (pay 2 colorless)
echoes #1 copy ulalek
echoes #1 copy creature spell
echoes #2 copy ulalek
echoes #2 copy creature spell
echoes #3 copy ulalek
echoes #3 copy creature spell
Resolve echoes 3 copy creature spell
Resolve echoes 3 copy ulalek (paying 2 colorless)
stack update:
eldrazi creature spell
littjara trigger to copy creature spell
ulalek trigger
echoes #1 copy ulalek
echoes #1 copy creature spell
echoes #2 copy ulalek
echoes #2 copy creature spell
coppied eldrazi creature spell
coppied littjara trigger to copy creature spell
coppied ulalek trigger
coppied echoes #1 copy ulalek
coppied echoes #1 copy creature spell
coppied echoes #2 copy ulalek
coppied echoes #2 copy creature spell
Resolve coppied echoes #2 copy creature spell
Resolve coppied echoes #2 copy ulalek (paying 2 colorless)
stack update:
eldrazi creature spell
littjara trigger to copy creature spell
ulalek trigger
echoes #1 copy ulalek
echoes #1 copy creature spell
echoes #2 copy ulalek
echoes #2 copy creature spell
coppied eldrazi creature spell
coppied littjara trigger to copy creature spell
coppied ulalek trigger
coppied echoes #1 copy ulalek
coppied echoes #1 copy creature spell
another copied eldrazi creature spell
another copied littjara trigger to copy creature spell
another copied ulalek trigger
another copied echoes #1 copy ulalek
another copied echoes #1 copy creature spell
another copied echoes #2 copy ulalek
another copied echoes #2 copy creature spell
another copied coppied eldrazi creature spell
another copied coppied littjara trigger to copy creature spell
another copied coppied ulalek trigger
another copied coppied echoes #1 copy ulalek
another copied coppied echoes #1 copy creature spell
then resolve entire stack? Since no mana left other ulaleks in the stack dont copy anymore, loop is broken.

[@twilightscallmtg]

The issue is you aren't casting the copies. They are simply created. Once the original set of triggers resolves, there's no more ways to copy. You can't keep paying into Ulalek at will to keep copying. It triggers one cast, even with Echoes doing copying stuff. So once you resolve Littjara, multiple copies of Echoes, and copied triggers off Ulalek, you would need the mana to restart copy stack with a brand new cast spell and reactivate Ulalek for that cast.
So with your initial scenario, you will have the original creature, 5 Ulalek copy opportunities (original + Echoes trigger copying), and 9 Echoes copies (each one sees the other 2 and triggers 3x), and the Littjara trigger, so 16 creatures created then it should stop and need a new cast to restart and copy a different creature 16x (if you have the mana).
I hope I have that right. Copy effects are crazy difficult when they start multiplying.

[@CrapsGoodxD]

@@twilightscallmtg haha yea indeed, but a copy of ulaleks trigger with echoes does initiate another stack copy once that choes copy of ulalek resolved, granted you do still have to pay colorless.
Im not 100% skilled in this but I asked in a judge discord, perhaps you can discuss the correct ruling with them, perhaps they are wrong?