What if WAR PLAN RED Actually Happened? (Alternative History)
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- čas přidán 7. 07. 2024
- One of the most powerful alliances of the 20th and even the 21st century was the one between the United States of America and the U.K. However, this alliance was not an inevitability. There were many times in the two nations history when it seemed war was a certainty. one of these points of tension occurred fallowing the first World War. Tensions became so enflamed that both nations drew up plans for how to deal with a potential conflict. The American plan: War Plan Red. So what if this had become a reality. What if War Plan Red actually happened?
#history #America #USA #Britain #England #War #Alternative #Navy
The only problem with scenario 2 is that its unlikely the US would see many food shortages. US food production started outpacing demand by a lot in the 1920s and early 1930s even with large amounts exported and the government encouraging lower production amounts. Over half a billion bushes of grain were exported in 1918 to 1919.
Good channel man, continue the good work and you getting the bag
Canada would have been smart to enter negotiations immediately when they saw the Empire had turned its back on them. If I was Canada I would actually flip my allegiance versus simply surrendering. It is possible that Canada could have better terms other than absorption into the American Union. If Canada initiated an invasion of the US first, the American wrath would have been severe.
Perfect
I think scenario 1 is the most likely, especially since the USA already after the end of WW1 had larger shipbuilding capacity then the UK if vastly more oriented towards civilian shipping and would have probably pumped out more destroyers and cruisers and maybe even a extra battleship and aircraft carrier before the war would start if not more depending on the time when the war happens.
No Britain would win
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I personally see America easily winning on land in Canada with the home town advantage they could easily be able to capture the vastly under populated country.
However at sea it’s a completely different situation entirely,
Centuries among Centuries of Naval dominance defeating other Empires and the greatest Naval Infrastructure and experience on the planet yeah absolutely not pal.
Without Washington Navy treaty restrictions the Royal Navy would go wild had they seen the American fleet the same level of threat as their previous rivals.
All the American ships like the Lexington Battlecruisers and their battleships would have been met with a British response including.
The N3 class battleships with 18 inch guns and G3 class Battlecruisers (more like fast battleships) with their 16.5 inch guns would have been constructed.
Who knows what else perhaps Britain even builds an improved and actually viable version of the ridiculously under protected HMS Incomparable with her 20
Inch guns.
In short I’m sorry but scenario 2 is the far far more likely one especially if Japan gets involved and all their building programs don’t get disrupted by the treaty’s limitations they could actually do their 8 BB and 8 BC campaign.
With having to defend both the Atlantic and Pacific against such powerful fleets the Americans would be stretched thin and would likely loose in a decisive Battle allowing the Battlecruisers and cruisers to have a field day on US Commerce.
I do see your point tho however I don’t personally see it as a very likely scenario.
@@MCLegend13 The issue with the UK is part of the motivation of the naval treaties, is the Empire just could not keep up with the USA in regards to production, I see your point on design, the UK went ham on ship design in this era and the USA took till the 30s and 40s to get ship design together to a proper peak.
The USA just has way more major ports, major shipbuilding facilities, and more room to expand upon the prior two then the UK does and has more capability to throw money at a problem already at this point then the UK does.
Frankly the USA had equalized things, and was gonna push ahead no matter what, the naval treaty only delayed that, and with no such treaty would inevitably push past the UK not just in the short or long term, but the more immediate term as well.
@@seamusfinnegan1164 thats true I do definitively see that as being a pretty big Risk at first but I disagree for the long term.
Germany too had more significantly industrial production than Britain but they couldn’t out build Britain in ships not even close the moment Germany got close Britain just exploded with atleast 5 more than Germany built each time.
For America having a navy as important for their economy, but for Britain it’s absolutely vital. If Britain really wanted to they could just use the dominions to build up smaller ships like sloops destroyers and maybe even light cruisers,
where as the home dockyards which are far more advanced and definitely could out build America if they absolutely had to would start churning out Heavy cruisers, Capital ships and carriers.
If you remember your still talking about a country that not long before had a we want 8 and we won’t wait campaign for Dreadnaughts which actually resulted in the Revenge class battleships and Renown class Battlecruisers being completed.
Britain wouldn’t allow anything but absolute superiority and had access to German ship designs and easily could if they saw America as having too many dockyards build up the dockyards of the dominions to if not surpass atleast equalise the American shipyards.
Add Japans eight (BB) eight (BC) program to the mix and it’s very unlikely America could outproduce a force of that magnitude especially if we talk about how in a very short amount of time the British made the Grand Fleet.
It’s a very complicated situation but in short Britain if backed into a corner and sees a threat to its naval superiority is when their building is at its best their fighting for their very survival so would likely allow Canada to fall but absolutely not allow anything but total superiority at sea.
I see it Going in 3 ways
In an absolute worse case scenario the British do eventually get destroyed and America starves them out into surrendering with Japan suffering the same fate (beyond highly unlikely).
In a best case scenario the British do the unthinkable and create a trafalgar style result with the Japanese emboldened could also have similar success too. (Also not likely)
The middle ground scenario is that there is a major fleet battle in both coasts but neither Side decisively wins outright similar to Jutland and Americas fleet is contained to their coast in the Atlantic but not outright destroyed. maybe the Japanese have similar success in the pacific with America focused on the larger fleet in the Atlantic tho that’s less likely its a toss of the coin.
It’s a very tricky one to decide I see it definitely could go either way no matter what happens unfortunately for Canada it wouldn’t last long however at sea after many centuries of taking out rival empires the Royal Navy potentially has the edge.
Lol! I love how this scenario starts out with Germany and Britain going to war and in the end Germany wins.
What if Mauryan empire didn't fall in India.
Can you do a video on “if operation/exercise Armageddon happend”
Can you do what if China industrialized part 2
It already did
Hi, that annoying American. My name is Logan Hayes, and I've been a really big fan of your awesome CZcams channel over the years ever since I was a small boy growing up in my hometown, and I was wondering if I could ask you my list about some of my WWII alternate history scenarios for some future videos, if you would like to hear about them from me or not?
Go for it!
@@ThatAnnoyingAmerican
1. what if USA joined Axis instead of the Allies.
2. What if Japan joined the Allies.
3. What if Japan joined the Soviets.
4. What if the Soviets joined the Axis.
If Britain was lost then there would not be a D-DAY, fact!!! America would be all alone if Britain fell and the Germans were battle harderned compared to you Americans 😂
@@logangreene7269how about what if Britain joins the Axis and Revives the old Anglo Japanese alliance.
I been working on an alt hist were Japan and America go to war in 1924 and have the possibility of Britain joining Japan, noce to see other people input
Awesome sause
Canada!
Canada is rightfully American
🤓🤓🤓
Nah it’s not rightfully British or American it’s rightfully Canadian.
tho atleast they had autonomous rights and their own government as they had with Dominion status in the. British Empire.
If America won they would have just been Annexed.
@THAT ANNOYING AMERICAN.
Speaking of AMERICA conquering Canada.
Can you make a video on what if america won the war of 1812.
Also I suggest you make a video on what if america colonized new Zealand.
considering america "discovered" newzealand and Australia.
@@JTL1776 well you didn’t 😂
@@JTL1776 your history is crap lol
"I'm sure all Americans and brits know the rocky start these two nations had."
I'm not even sure all brits know what happened 5 minutes ago, let alone about the american revolution.
I think the same could be said for Americans, to be honest - I've seen a couple of videos where, when asked about which nation they gained their independence from, some Americans replied 'Russia' and 'Korea'. But there will always be people like that in every country across the world - it's only the silly answers that make good content!
Whish I could download 😢
Yeah no, the USA couldn’t be starved out, what were you smoking when you came up with that joke?
‘MERICA!!!
@@dalton6108 Lmao
RULE BRITAINNIA
We could finally be friends with Germany for real this time!
TAA IS BACK
Surinder? Ha! We Americans can't even spell that word! 🤣
Haha I can see that!!! 😂😂😂
‘Murica!
czcams.com/video/dI9aClDIzq4/video.htmlsi=Wh2zvi9Yfm9hCh5v
Rule Britainnia
I find scenario 2 much more realistic right up to the great depression, its true that Britain would not have suffered unlike America so their economy would have been stronger. Plus if Japan allied with Britain, then Japan would not have joined the axis as it would remain a British ally. So when ww2 starts Britain would have millions more men it could send to Europe, sints it would not have to worry about Asia so it could absolutely launch a D day mostly made up of Indians. I think the only deferens would be that Germany would be fully controlled by the soviets.
I seriously disagree that during the height of racism & instability that the US could be cohesive enough to fight off the British empire & Japan.
As if Japan and Britain were also not racist
The US was racist to the point to where it handicapped its resources and manpower in favor of its racist agenda. @@board-qu9iu
That may have something to do with it but the bigger reason why they would be doomed as if no one followed the Washington Naval Treaty. Altho the Americans would get a powerful navy the British response would be utterly horrifying for them. 16.5 inch armed super heavily armoured Battlecruisers, and the much slower but even more powerful and heavily armoured and armed 18 inch gunned Battleships.
That and the Japanese eight eight building program would amount for an absolutely terrifying force for The USN on both coasts.
@@MCLegend13 I don't care about superior numbers because neither the Japanese or the British had the resources and logistics to replenish the navy on the same scale as the Americans. Although a cohesive America can logistically best Japan and the British Empire, the racial politics in place at the time would have prevented it from doing so and handicapped the country from doing so.
@@TheRacy The Japanese sure their Infrastructure would be stretched a bit too far but Britain absolutely could.
please remember your talking about a country that not too long ago was able to churn out the Grand Fleet the most powerful Naval firepower in capital ships the likes of which the world has never seen before or since. It’s bested many empires and has the most advanced naval infrastructure in the world. Britain could easily churn out not only Many capital ships and carriers but also logistic support ships, swarms of Escorts and Dozens of Cruisers.
If they saw the American Navy as much of a Threat as The High Seas Fleet. They could build to such an amount that it could equal to or perhaps even exceed the former Grand Fleet.
Ships like the G3 Battlecruisers, N3 Battleships perhaps a more sane and slightly larger version of Jackie Fishers HMS Incomparable (perhaps even multiple of them with 8 instead of 6 20 inch guns).
Having ships armed with 16/16.5, 18 and even 20 inch guns not to mention a whole swarm of older 15 inch and maybe some retained 13.5 inch armed ships. Would definitely really effect the US Navys operational capacity in the Atlantic especially when factoring in the IJN in the Pacific with their fleet likely at this point Tosa class Battleships and Amagi Class Battlecruisers, Perhaps even some of the Number 13s have been built.
In short the US Navy would be stretched too thin allowing the Larger Royal Navy to gain Naval superiority perhaps setting up a blockade set up in Halifax, Bermuda and parts of the Caribbean to lock the US Fleet to their coastline while British Cruisers and Battlecruisers start descending on their commerce. Idk what happens in the Pacific it could go either way.
Victoria 1/2/3 lore