Umbar, City of Corsairs - Region Spotlight
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- čas přidán 30. 09. 2023
- Umbar was the city of Corsairs in Middle-earth, let’s explore its history! Thank you all so much for watching, let me know your thoughts about Umbar! As always, a great thanks to the online artists whose visual works made this video possible! If you are one of the artists, please let me know and I will post your name and a link to your work in this description!
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Last time I was this early, the two trees were still around.
Nerd
I’m kidding friend
Ah Umbar! Beautiful this time of year! And the Orcs are especially friendly
I sometimes wonder how much of Umbar had been converted to the worship of Melkor by the King's Men by the late Third Age, versus how much of the city's population resented Sauron's dominion more than any grudge against Gondor.
Can't wait for this new region to come up in LOTRO !
"Not just orcs, but men as well."
A region where everyone knows the location but not many know its history. Really enjoyed this spotlight 😃
Feel light a show showing the conflict between here and Gondor would b a great story or show to watch. It's so foreign and different from anything we know in the north or west. Endlessly fascinating.
What a missed opportunity from Amazon! They could have portrayed the beginnings of the people who inhabited the coast of Harad. There is a writing by Tolkien from the point of view of the people of the south: Tal-elmar.
And how they fought against the colorization of Númenor. They could show the resentment of the tribes in the region and how Sauron took advantage of this to corrupt the people of the south. But I bet they won't do any of that.
Tha would take them a rly good group of writers, and they are not willing to risk this, the good and old green screen low effort spetacula rule
The colonization of that area has only just started…Rings of Power shows the first time Númenor set out from their island
you assume that the writers actually cared about what Tolkien wrote
@@MrCoxmic and you’re assuming they don’t, the major struggle the season had was pacing, most other criticism boils down to “they didn’t do exactly what Tolkien wrote in the Silmarillion, they only adapted what was actually published during Tolkien’s life time!” You know, the only thing he okayed being released to the public. I’m sorry but an edited series of notes, that I love don’t get me wrong, are/is not gospel. It’s the first season of a show, those usually aren’t the best season just look at Star Trek lol
Nah, he paid shill boi.
I've always wondered about umbar
How big it was
How fortified it was..
It must've been a really tough nut To crack by land and sea like Carthage or Constantinople
Yah, I always thought of Umbar as the Carthage to Gondor's "Rome" too.
Thank you for Sharing, Umbar is being released in the 16 years and counting Lord of the Rings Online video game this November, as well as a Corsair inspired class, the Mariner. Exciting to learn of its history.
The reclamation of the final unclaimed land of Gondor would make a great final expansion for LOTRO. Super excited
Come to Umbar for your next vacation! Tired of endless rainy days in those green forests and wet mountains? Umbar is the place for you! What happens in Umbar, stays in Umbar! Gambling, girls and pipe weed are all available in our flesh dens and weed hovels! Win big at our hot spots! Watch a gladiatorial fight in one of our many coliseums! Fights to the death! Blood sports between the best fighters in Middle Earth! Orcs! Trolls! Men! Dark Elves! Monsters from the Dark Lands! If you crave excitement and decadence, you’ll love our shows!
Wooooo 🎉our kings posted a video
Umbar is one of those places that I wish we knew more about. We only ever see history from a combined Elvin/Westernesse perspective, but like the saying goes, history is written by the victors. I have to imagine that Umbar, in its own way, thought it was "doing the right thing" by fighting Gondor so bitterly. Their side of the story, whatever it may be, is probably quite fascinating!
With Sauron finally defeated for good, his malign influence would wain and I suspect there were many in Umbar happy to see the old rulers gone. I think eventually Umbar would be fully integrated into the Reunited Kingdom. I wonder more about other settlements that were likely ruled by the descendants of the Kingsmen that were farther south than Umbar. There had to have been more down there.
Always wanted to know about Umbar excellent vid Yoystan
Btw, interesting theory, is Thorongil's attack on Umbar's fleet a reflection of the famous attack by Francis drake on the spanish fleet which preceded the Spanish armada?
What was called at the time the singeing of the King of Spain's beard.
Famous mariner and explorer, also known as a battlefield commander? Lightning attack on a rival, shortly followed by a main fleet attack in a time of war; a main fleet attack which failed miserably!
Obviously the parallel isn't perfect, Aragorn didn't' sink the corsair ships at sea in the war of the ring, but it was an interesting thought I had when you mentioned the prior rade on Umbar, and particularly Aragorn's attack on the ships.
Thanks
I've always imagined Umbar as a gray area, a midway point between the far southern lands of Middle Earth and the northern kingdoms. I also imagine Umbar featuring in a Middle Earth series like Rings of Power, but with better writing and characters, of course. For instance, traders from Far Harad--some who have traveled to Gondor and beyond in the past, could stop at Umbar (or work to avoid it) as they go north. I picture an expedition ala Marco Polo. A young man of Far Harad recounts his tales and, being a stranger in a strange land, can ask questions for the show's audience.
I always found the relationship of Gondor and Umbar very similar to the relationship of Rohan and Dunland.
Excellent video as always keep up the amazing work!!
Despite the coincidental similarity, the name Umbar is not related to the Quenya word Umbar, which means fate.
Check it out: I bet some of the rich dwarves in Erebor and the snowy Grey Mountains went on winter vacation down to the hot, tropical lands of Umbar! Lol 😂 love your channel and the endless epic LotR content you put out! 🔥🤘🔥🤘
Oooo yea I love me some nice good Umbar. Down under in Umbar where the nights be hot
If we do get more middle earth movies/shows/games it would be cool to explore the east of middle earth a lot more.
Doesn’t need to be cannon it would just be cool exploring Rhûn.
Epic content 🎉😍
Interesting and still common in today's world. Enemy neighbors from the same roots. Unsolved problems are simply postponed to later generations. Thank you for nice narrative
That’s VERY true! Similar situations and conflicts occur frequently throughout history, it’s very interesting.
I beg you for Rhûn and the lands further east for your next video 🙏 thank you! Great content!
Well, that last question seems pretty straightforward. They were caught up in the War in the North, and there weren't enough Elves to spare to help Gondor, or Rohan ironically.
Indeed, I think that’s part of the answer! But what of the most powerful Elves other than those in Rhiannon such as Glorfindel and Elrond? I’m going to try to do a deep-dive into that as well 🙂
Well met, Yoystan!
Umbar and the "Near Harad" were kind of the THIRD Numenorean realm in exile. While those that dwelt there were certainly descended from King's Men, I'm betting only a few were servants of Melkor after Sauron corrupted Tar Calion. But the ancient hatreds still lived. Instead I picture a realm much like Gondor, where Numenoreans mixed with the Men who lived there, some lines being "purer" than others. Thus, when Elessar came to the Throne, my theory is that he brokered some sort of detente, calling upon shared ancestry. "You do you, we do we, and we make peace with other southern realms". And as with all places, I'm betting TRADE would play a big part. "Let's both work together and we both can become fabulously rich" kind of thing.
It would have been nice if Tolkien had the Black Numenoreans bring some "magic" artifacts with them to Middle Earth during the breaking of the world
My dear learned scholar, this was fascinating. I thought I'd read through all of Tolkien's works but the details of Corsairs apparently got by me. Where did you unearth your sources?
One imagines that the Umbarites could have imagined themselves as the heirs of Numenor's Kingsmen, much like how Gondor and Arnor considered themselves the heirs of the Faithful of Numenor.
Man, Umbar and Gondor the Battle for the Ages: Literally they kept Battling Back and Forth!!!
Thanks Mellon for this Video, Until Why didn’t the Elves play a Larger a Role in the Leguardium?...Marion Baggins Out!!!
*Also by the time of the next Video I will be busy with my 23rd Birthday!!!*
Random thought:
When Earnil reconquered Umbar, at the moment he breached the walls of the city . . . did that constitute an Umbar Puncture?
😜
Finally managed to watch it. If one sees our world as being in the 7th age of Arda, then Umbar should be at the place the Philistines lived, so in the modern day Gaza Strip.
You really do have to wonder about those Black Numenoreans who survived the destruction of Numenor in Umbar and other places. Like... it's one thing to follow the king in his folly. But when it's made evident that Sauron played them all for fools in order to annihilate Numenor, you can't help but wonder if some of them didn't finally get the message and repent, or go to Gondor and switch sides back to the Faithful.
I'm referring to early Third Age Numenoreans, obviously by the time of Castamir whoever remained south was irredeemably fucked up.
I suspect it was something similar to the mainland Numenorians themselves: regarding the judgement as just an enemy action from the "false gods" while Melkor reincarnate in the form of Sauron would save them. It probably helped that those in Middle Earth didn't actually see the judgement, but would surely have felt the effects of the world being changed, so it's likely Sauron was able to give them an altered account.
Umbar means "Upper" in Quenya.
So many little cities & regions in Middle earth that are never mentioned...they deserve they're time in the sun as well. 💯
Hey man, amazing vid btw. I have a question for u guys, tell me. Do u really think that the wars happen suddenly and without preparation from a higher secret power? Like a controllers?
Why im asking this, because Tolkien was a member in a secret society and he know alot and tried to put alot of knowledge in his stories.
I wanna see how many people actually can see the truth in his stories and what he hid underneath.
Many of Tolkien's themes come from his own personal experience or from history and myths.
Corsairs/Haradrim near constant wars are probably a stand in for the Crusades from the Middle Ages on our Earth. Muslims and Christians fighting for control of Israel/Jerusalem seem similar.
Hopefully Aragorn had better luck in the Fourth Age than we do now in the Middle East.
2:57
5:38-5:39
Who were the costars based on though? Like what historical nation I mean? Or just pirates in general?
Hmm that’s a great question. Likely, if Númenor is something like Rome, we might assume Umbar was akin to some Mediterranean port-city.
@@MenoftheWest My bet is Carthage. Or the Late Bronze Age Sea Peoples.
Tolkien expressed a view on this in the collection of notes published as 'Nomenclature of the Lord of the Rings'. There, Tolkien wrote "They are imagined as similar to the Mediterranean corsairs: sea-robbers with fortified bases", ie. they're reminiscent of the Corsairs of the Barbary States, centred on Tunis, Algiers and Tripoli. These corsairs were active for approximately a couple of centuries from the 1500s, terrorising the coasts of France, Spain and Italy, and even further afield.
Don't forget the Great Chudistan War.
Hoi
I hope that you check out the materials written for the middle earth role-playing game from back in the day when you make these videos as, since they were licensed by the J.R.R. Tolkien estate, they are Canaan. They are far more Canaan than the Peter Jackson movies.
That would be the Iron Crown Enterprises (ICE) materials. While the Tolkien Estate may have classed them as canon at the time, I'm not positive the current estate administrators view them as 100% canon. Changes in who holds and administers rights & licenses can result in retroactive de-canonization (see: Star Wars).
The rights to make the game were the same rights used to make the movies so no, MERP is not inherently more canonical than the Jackson movies.
@@istari0 Most, if not all, the stuff that happens in those three terrible Hobbit movies has nothing to do with the cannon of LotR. They're a joke.
@@istari0 MERP is far closer to the cannon than any of those movies. They are more creative and interesting. Jackson didn't add anything to the cannon. He just used what was there. They three LotR movies are great. The three Hobbit movies are trash. THE MERP BOOKS ARE AMAZINGLY RICH, WELL WRITTEN, AND EVEN BETTER RESEARCHED.
I've got some of that stuff, including the Umbar module. It all really meshes well.
Today is the 6th of October
So corsairs are numenorean or descendent from them ?
Descendants
so the Corsairs were originally of the Faithful?
Just the opposite. It was a stronghold of the Kingsmen.
@@istari0 That was the Black Numenoreans. Corsairs come there after Gondor's kin strife. Since they went to Gondor after the Downfall of Numenor (but later left), they had to have been descendants of the Faithful
@@GM-db4bv Númenor had many colonies in Middle-Earth by the time of its fall and while there was a general divide between the Faithful living farther north and the Kingsmen farther south, there was a lot of mixing in and around what became southern Gondor. The support for Castamir the Usurper was much stronger in southern Gondor, where there were many Gondorians descended from the Kingsmen.
@@istari0 his support was in the south but he himself lived in Gondor proper and was from Faithful ancestry so not of the Black Numenorians of late S.A.
@@GM-db4bv My comment was not specifically about Castamir, whose ancestry by the time he was born may or may not have included descendants from the Kingsmen faction.
One must be careful in "fixing" the world, it can often be seen as conquest by others.
No coastal city has ever survived without a source of freshwater from a river. Tolkein was a total muppet when it came to economics