Pakistan is lucky to have honest and selfless military people who love the country. They have safely invested Pakistani money in Papa John's pizza franchise, real estate in London, Canada, and Dubai. They also own an island near Australia. These investments have made sure that Pakistani people don't waste their money on luxury items such as wheat flour, vegetables, electricity, clothing, and education.
It was incredible to finally hear a middle-class perspective from academia. The entire podcast was captivating from start to finish. Whether it's a Zoom meeting or an in-person conversation, what truly matters is the quality of the discussion.
Cannot gaslight Pakistanis anymore, the cat is out of the bag. Although there is so much negativity in Pakistan at the moment, your podcast was worth my time. Your's & your guest's assessment certainly is clear, concise and correct.You are bright & have class! Thank you !! Massive love & respect from Florida.
Hope you also apologise to the people who were always speaking up against this fake regime since ages and you kept calling them ghadaar, kaafir and other words.
Stability in Pakistan is only possible if ESTABLISHMENT detaches itself from Great Game; Deutsch itself from US+UK establishment. It means leave it to the people,
also if public prioritize their country too over their own selfish goals, and instead of looking for their lives in europe and serve their own country in their little capacity. we need look at the situation as a whole.that's my opinion
Establishment will not do it because they have Assets worth $500 Billion in Western Countries + Dubai If they stop playing the Game of the West then the West will Freeze $100 Billion worth Assets and will stop Giving the Top Generals Millions of Dollars Every year that they currently give.
زبردست۔اللہ تعالی اپ دونوں کے ساتھ ساتھ اپ جیسے دانشوروں مفاد عامہ کے علمبرداروں کو اپنی حزانوں سے نوازیں۔پتہ ھۓ اخلاص سے بڑہ کر کوئ دولت نہیں اور اخلاص کی اصل معنی جو بھی کام کرو صرف اللہ کی رضاء ملحوظ خاطر ھو۔دونوں جہانوں کی کامیابی کا ایک ھی راز۔۔شکریہ
we were the people who never thought about politics, but with the evolving conditions and politics of Pakistan i would say these podcasts are gems to view the world to know the history and to understand from a different and bigger level. Although today there are less views on these type of videos, but am happy someone is providing such valuable content and we as few viewers learning something great, which will definitely help to grow our mind, Thank You Muzamil
An excellent discussion backed by strong academic insight. Intellectual conversations like this are essential, especially in these pivotal times. All signs point to the conclusion that the current system in Pakistan is on the decline, making way for a new order. The military, in conjunction with think tanks, is at the helm of this transformation. However, the path ahead is far from smooth; it's filled with challenges and uncertainties. While the outlook for Pakistan next year appears promising, it’s important to recognize that social engineering is a gradual process, and rapid fixes are not realistic.
Hello Muzamil, this is such an interesting discussion and what a lovely guest who is so generous with his thoughts and time. Please have him as a regular person on your platform. Love all the questions your raising too. What a friendly and civilised conversation? Keep it going.. I’ve always followed Moeed Pirzada but now I will follow you too.. thanks
Wrapped up beautifully.... that "intellectual debate void in our society and channeling your thougts via data driven analysis" was so thought provoking. Keep up the good work
The most viable solution for the survival ,progress and betterment of our country is to prioritize our country's interest over anything else and start trading with our neighbors. I cannot comprehend the fact that pakistan can aquire one of the cheapest energy in this region directly from Iran wether be it fuel , natural gas even electricity and its been decades we havnt done so, because we need western permission as if we disobey our masters we will cease to exist. More over we must explore other emerging economies to export our products.Lets break our shackles of western slavery. Thanks very much Muzamil and Mr.Adeel Malik for this great discussion
Muzamil! Fantastic chat! Great guest! It’s so nice to see Pakistani-British academic based in the west giving us a different (but familiar) perspective.
Important Feedback - BIG Picture This was probably the best podcast on TBT to date, at least in the top 3. The best part was such a precise & balanced comparison with Egypt. Your guest has no ego, open to challenges and propagates HOPE. Such people need to be promoted. Kindly call him again to clarify many half touched topics. What I learned? Though we have issues in education, economy, justice, healthcare and so many more areas, all these are interdependent. No one issue can be resolved (root cause) and fixed as priority over other. Most of your other podcasts discuss these topics. With that said, your intelligent guest in this podcast clearly shows us a different direction. In current situation, the thing that needs to be fixed on priority over others is "Political Consensus". Such consensus, further has two dimensions: 1. Consensus in foreign policy - what we want as a country? 2. Consensus in a NEW social contract - what the people want from the ruling class? Mind you it is not a consensus in political economy, which is certainly an important aspect, but doesn’t work after a point when basic human rights are met. I say this because this is the focus of most of your other podcast. We can no longer go to friendly countries bringing Billion dollar or dirham grants without informing our people what we negotiated in return. The return cannot be politician's family’s impunity or personal gains anymore. Once we reach a consensus, a clear direction will establish and promote a healthy political environment for true leadership. The natural outcome of which will be the solving of all other chronic issues mentioned above. What I didn’t understand? How will we reach such consensus in both these dimensions? And for this reason, I request two actions from Muzammil. 1. Please call your guest again. 2. Make it a point at TBT to ask all politician guests on what is that state of consensus as per them and what actions are they taking to reach it. We need to actively & openly talk about it. Another point I did not understand was that your guest has a point of view that the current crisis may be the beginning of great success in the long run for Pakistan, as an evolution process. But he also argues that the foreign players intend to keep Pakistan in the state of strategic inaction. Does this mean evolution to success is anarchy (as the title of podcast suggests) or khooni inqelab or what else is it? What’s the way forward in his view, particularly if the foreign players give another temporary relief? General Feedback: 1. Kindly add the link to the guest’s article (referred several times) in the description. 2. The context you set for your question, is often raising many questions, but you close at one question. A few times your guest also stated this during the podcast. I suggest either shortening the context to a single question or asking multiple questions on the full context, and then allowing the guest to address each of them one by one. Love your content! 😇
Thanks it was a pleasure to hear someone so refined, educated and knowledgeable talk in such a positive manner about Pakistan and its future. These were time-bombs planted in the system by the colonists.InshaAllah we will overcome all these hurdles and rise like a phoenix.
Muzamil! You asked the right question, I think there will be a great Pakistani leader who would change the country in short period and I wish you best.
Anchor here has been continuously expressing, asking questions in English with few Urdu sentences where guest replied very gracefully in Urdu I hope views and interviewer pay attention to this message from this Oxford Professor
As a host it would be more interesting if you ask short open ended questions and let the guest express himself fully. Most (not all) lengthy questions are the host world view, which is much narrower than the guest.
Muzamil, I'm impressed with what and how Dr Adeel responded and articulated his answers and analysis on various topics but equally impressed with the way you presented very intelligently all the questions that in turn had the best and very intellectual response from the interviewee. However, I admit that I never knew that clever and smart podcaster like you exist in Pakistan, so bravo. Keep up the good work.
20:13 Thanks for accepting/recognizing that we have a diverse ethnic background and thanks for talking about it, unlike some other podcaster who I feel like they are working on an agenda or are biased and think we all are south asians or something and completely refute the presence of Arab/Persian and other central asian ethinic backgrounds people living in Pakistan. Yes we are Pakistanis now but completely rejecting the fact of this diversity and also throwing in the Syed card that we have more Syeds in Pakistan than anywhere else in the world and making fun of it does not negate the fact that many of us are infact from Arab/Persian/Central Asian background, not sure why some of our brothers have trouble digesting this truth. Pakistan exists outside punjab/sindh too and we have a very diverse ethnic background especially in KPK and Balochistan.
Exactly lol my forefathers came to subcontinent from the Cities of samarkand and bukhara, my father and even grandfather used to tell. Even my mother side of relatives quote this thing as kind of cracking joke on us that "your family comprises of foreigners"
Many of us had our grandfather recently migrated from Iran/Tajik/Uzbek etc. When this land was India, people from surrounding places used to visit this place they knew the language, even farsi was commonly understood in some parts of india. Some decided to stay here for business purposes or for better future or came to join their other brethren fighting for a cause. Although we now are Pakistanis but if you would ask anybody where were your forefathers from what do people expect us to reply? Pakistanis are scattered they have no sense of unity, you want to dig deep where a person is from and then make fun of the fact when someone says where their family is from. There is a beauty in diversity but for some nonsesical podcasters it is a joke, they tell us how you can't force any community to change their ways or their language, at the same time they make fun of the fact and refuse to accept that we have different ethnicities living here who were from other part of the surrounding world, what hypocrites!! Make up your mind first.
@@ahmedmuhammad9877I don't know where these people get their ideas from. You will find almost no family in Pakistan that is not of Arab, Persian, Turk, or Central Asian ancestry. That's what makes PakIstanis different from Indians.
@PS-ej2xn Its because Punjab and Sindh probably do not have many people from these origins and since Punjabis and Sindhis were here for centuries they think rest of Pakistan is like them as well. I actually do not understand their reasoning, their only weapon is to use Syeds as an example which again does not negate the fact of people from Middle Eastern/Central Asian origin living in Pakistan. They are confused individuals, I am not sure how with such intellect they still have biases.
@@PS-ej2xn NaPak badzehniat:"Dukan pakodon ki....... baatein karodon ki" Kalme pad pad ke..... tokri bhar ghaas kha kha ke....... mulk bana tha - LEKIN afsosssssss
I think, the main problem is the dependence on violence and use of violence to achieve even the best social / political objectives. Jinnah was an extremely selfish person who resorted to violence even in the short period he lived after August 47, he invaded Pakistan’s own people in Pakhtunkhwa and Baluchistan to force secede. It is for this reason that it is impossible to achieve the objective of uniting the diverse communities it consists of today. In my opinion Pakistan needs a leader like Willy Brandt who apologised to the society for the violence and injustices suffered by the people of Germany in the last about 50 years in Germany.
I usually don't like your views but this podcast was really great. such an educated guest and what a wonderful choice of guest. I agree with him but Muzzamil, you need to be get rid of love for PML-N
شکریہ مزمل! یہ بلاشبہ ایک نہایت ہی غیر جانبدار اور عمدہ علمی گفتگو پر مبنی نشست تھی۔ آپ علمی محاذ پر ایک اچھی کاوش جاری رکھے ہوئے ہیں، جو کہ قابل ستائش ہے۔ میں یہ سمجھتا ہوں کہ پاکستان اپنی تاریخ کے ایک فیصلہ کن موڑ پر پہنچ چکا ہے اورایک ایک کرکے وہ سارے عوامل وقوع پذیر ہورہے ہیں جو ایک نئے نظام ی بنیاد ڈالنے کیلئے ضروری ہوتے ہیں۔ اب پاکستانی عوام نہ صرف اپنے ساتھ ہوتے آئے مظالم اور ناانصافی کا شعور رکھتی ہے، بلکہ سماجی رابطوں کے پلیٹ فارمز کی بدولت زبان بھی۔ وہ دن دور نہیں جب عوام تمام فیصلے اپنے ہاتھوں میں لے لیں گے۔انشاءاللہ
Thank you Muzamil, it was a great discussion and what I loved in the interview was, you people put forward a solution to the problem instead only pointing out the problem. We are lacking intellectual discussions which is needed.
So glad you interviewed Adeel Malik. I don’t want to suffer through the pseudo-leftist Raza Ahmed (Rumi) but really wanted to hear Dr. Malik’s views. Learned so much: Creative destruction, Lack of land reforms, patronage politics etc etc.
21:11 the civilization that existed is called Indian civilization called Hinduism. Delhi didn't come and rule Pakistan.Infact Central asians came and ruled Delhi.
Interest by Pakistanis is because the country is held hostage by Army generals for power with no regards for future of Country. Political process has stopped and will of the people is in jail
Thanks for bringing Professor Adeel Malik saheb on your show. Seldom see such informed & meaningful discussion in our media. Wish we had more distinguished personalities like professor Malik.
I am always waiting for your podcasts especially since I listened to one podcast you said that every weekend you will have at least three videos podcast.😂❤ Love from Sindh. Sir muzamil ❤
India is a great example of cohesion and political stability, a good part of this is India's inclusive education. In an unrelated matter, it is quite amazing that the existential threat that Pakistan poses to the region and the world is its nuclear arsenal, which has not been addressed, not even as a footnote by the discussant. An unstable Pakistan would be a hazardous enterprise. Both India and the US are well aware of this.
Pak army retires after lieutenant Col if they are not corrupt themselves or allow corruption , but now army support outside Pakistan is diminishing so it can only be reverse by popular civilian world leader like IMRAN KHAN.
Thank you so much muzammil for inviting such a learned man. We need discussion like this. I remember listening to his father Professor Fateh when i was kid. Tub mujhy unki sari batain samjh tu nahi ati thi but even at that time i used to get vibe of a very honest man and now seeing his son no wonder i can say that he raised his sons in a very good way. Lots of prayers for all of them. Also i wouod request muzammil to invit tariq malik also we want mentors and seniors like them to learn things.
پروگرام کے ہوسٹ مزمل حسن نے بہت اچھا کام کیا کہ ایک قابل علم والے اور پاکستان کی ترقی کی خواہش رکھنے والے پروفیسر عدیل کا انٹرویو کیا ۔ میرے ادنی شعور کے مطابق پاکستان بننے سے پہلے ہندوں کے شدید تعصب کی وجہ سے مسلمان معاشی طور پر بہت پیچھے تھے ۔ مذہبی تعصب بھی نفرت کی حد تک بہت شدید تھا۔ اس لیے ہم اپنے مذہب معاشی اور کلچرل کی حفاظت کنے کے لیے ملک بنانے میں کامیاب ہو گے۔ ملک بننے کے بعد پچھلے تمام سویلین اور فوجی حکمران ہماری معاشی تباہی کے ذمہ دار ہیں بشمول عمران ۔ جنرل ایوب کے دور میں زرعی اور صنعتی ترقی کی بنیادیں رکھی گءی لیکن اس کی امریت اور محترمہ فاطمہ جناح کو دھندلی سے ہرا کر بنگلہ دیش کی علیدہگی کی بنیاد رکھی ۔ ذولفقار علی بھٹو اگر ایٹم بمم نہ بناتے تو اج انڈیا ہمارے ساتھ اس سے بھی زیادہ ظلم کرتا جو اسرائیل فلسطین کے ساتھ کررہا ہے ۔ پروفیسر صاحب کی بات میں بہت وزن ہے کہ معاشی تباہی کی اخیر پر ملک چلانے والے سخت پریشان ہوکر ملک کو بچانے کی جنگ میں وہ سخت درست فیصلے کرنے لگ جاتے ہیں ۔ جنرل عاصم منیر اور شہباز شریف نے ڈالر کا ریٹ اور سمگلنگ روکنے کے لیے موثر اقدامات کیے نہ کرتے تو مہنگای اور زیادہ ہوتی ۔ اگرچہ۔ مافیاز اپنے ذاتی مفاد کے لیے سخت رکاوٹیں پیدا کررہے ہیں پورا سسٹم بیورو کریسی سیاسی لیڈر میڈیا سب ذاتی مفادات کی خاطر کام کررہے ہیں ۔ لیکن اللہ تعالی کا شکر ہے جنرل عاصم منیر اور شہباز شریف ملکی مفاد میں فیصلے اور عمل کررہے ہیں ۔ پچھلے تمام سویلین اور فوجی حکمرانوں نے قرضے لیے لیکن ووٹرز کو خوش کرنے کے لیے ترقیاتی کام کرواے حلانکہ ان قرضوں کے پیسوں سے ایسے کارخانے لگاتے جن کی پیداوار کو ایکسپورٹ کرتے۔ جونیجو دور میں ڈاکٹر محبوب الحق کی ایسی تجاویز نہیں مانی گءی۔ ہماری مجبوری ہے کہ ہم نے چاینہ امریکہ یوروپ سعودی عربیہ یو اے ای سے تعلقات مضبوط بنانے کی ضرورت ہے۔ میڈیا سارا دن مایوسی پھیلا رہا ہے حکومت کے اچھے کاموں کا ذکر نہہں کرتا ملک میں تیل اور گیس کی نءی درفیاتوں کی خبروں کا ڈکر بار بار نہیں کرتا ۔ پاکستان نے امریکہ کی جنگ لڑ کر ہم نے اپنا بہت جانی مالی نقصان کیا لیکن۔ جب امریکہ کی ہمیں سپورٹ کی بات اتی ہے امریکہ میں انڈین اور یہودی لابی ہمارے خلاف امریکہ سے فیصلے کرواتی ہیں۔ مزمل حسن صاحب سے گزارش ہے ہر پروگرام میں اچھاءی کی گنجایش ہوتی ہے اپ کچھ باتیں اپ ہاکستان کے خلاف غلط کر جاتے ہیں افغانیوں کو با عزت طریقے سے چلے جانے کی گذارش کی گی اپ نے اس سلسلے میں حکومت کے دلاءل کا ذکر نہیں کیا ۔ کی افغانی بھایوں کے لیے اب افغانستان میں حالات ٹھیک ہیں وہ ہم پر معاشی بوجھ ہیں ڈالرز اور اسلحہ کے اسمگلر اور دہشت گرد ان کے اندر اجاتے تھے ایک بالغ نظر صحافی ہر ایشو کے بارے دونوں نظریات پیش کرتے ہیں۔ اپ خود کم بولا کریں مہمان کو زیادہ بولنے دیں اواز کچھ دھیمی رکھیں اپنی مزید اصلاح کے لیے اپنے پروگرام کی ایڈٹ مجھ س کروایں
Hi Muzamil, Please also make a podcast or a short sort of video about the firewall that has been recently installed in Pakistan. There’s a lot of speculation, would really appreciate if we could get a technical analysis from an expert. Thanks!
😅 another difference is Turkey, India, Indonesia did reforms when they had few months of foreign exchange reserves left and shattered economy but Pakistan is still not doing the reforms and going in the that direction. It means k "hum nahe manain gy, hum nahe sunain gy, hum nahe karain gy"
I have a theory I call the "Threshold Theory of Change." In my view, Pakistan has reached a critical point where a significant number of people are fed up with the elite capture by pro-Western rent-seekers. While change may take time, I believe it has now become inevitable. I really appreciate the discussion, as I have long held similar views about the political and economic situation in Pakistan. One key point raised was the need to break free from our dependence on the West once and for all. With the collapse of pro-military narratives, this is becoming a reality before our eyes. While we don't yet know how we will handle the outcome, I believe we are heading towards this landmark change in Pakistan's politics.
Please keep your questions short & to the point. Your questions are very good but too long winded. Also, please your sound issues. Great work & wonderful guest .
The colonial establishment which includes military and civil bureaucracy with elites have to dismantled, to move forward. The million dollar question is how. It has to be public uprising starting from Lahore and Pindi to be successful. Don’t know if this will happen in my lifetime. Otherwise we are doomed.
Muzammil Bhai, when you have a podcast with an economist, please ask: Given the current economic situation, what should be the strategy for the common Pakistani in such uncertain times?
After point of disappointment the last 5 mins wraps everything . One should be a leader in one's own field . Thx for bringing the fertile minds on board. Regards
Agar mein aur meray forefathers 1947 se elite status enjoy kar rahy hein, to phir ub mein ye kaisy give up karon? Mein to kisi b hud tak Jaon ga. Aur apna qabza aur control state per rakhon ga. Bloody revolution is the only scenario jis ko ata dekh kar mein abroad bhaag Jaon ga... otherwise No
Sufia' ikrams were one men army. With The Divine Help, and by their own selves where ever they went by love, wisdom, genoricity, perservance and patience they concored hearts of people by millions. You and me are living examples of such outreach.
Intellectual poverty. While physical poverty is not acceptable in this century, poverty of the mind even less so ! Let us try first by clearly separating Arabic customs from Islamic principles, and then build a society based on educated and skilled people.
The Professor's volume and your volume were on different levels. Please record the audio separately for each participant (it is possible) so that each can be brought to the same audible level while editing.
Pakistan was ahead of India till Computers and IT came ( Late 1990s ) Computers and IT was the Turning point and that began India's Growth Story. Pakistan only relied on American and British Aid, while India began setting up Big IT Centres like Bangalore ,Hyderabad, Gurgaon, Even Bangladesh setup Huge Textiles Centres. Pakistan should open up Borders to Bring in Afghans and also Allow India to Trade with Afghansitan and Central Asia and Pakistan can Collect Toll Taxes. India also needs Oil and Gas from Iran, and if a Pipeline is developed from Iran to India then Pakistan could earn money, and also have leverage over India.
Pakistan was never ahead of India. Yes for some years GDP of Pakistan higher than India that was because USA and other Western Countries gave massive aid without any accountability to fight Korean war and then Afghan war. No questions were asked. Lot of money went in to pockets of Military generals.
😅 point is 1947 sy pehlay bhe punjab angrezo ka loyal raha hai. Or aj bhe proud krtay hain apni Imperial British army roots py jis mey ja k tipu sultan or delhi mey wars ke or muslims ko mara.
Kabhi history parhi hai kis ne kaha punjab angrezon ka loyal tha ,the biggest role in freedom of Pakistan was from punjabis , the most sacrifices were made by punjabis , there are big names for independence movement from punjab mgr apki Dimag mn jo fatur hai na wo apko sachai dekhna nai deta.when Pakistan was made most of the beyracracy was Urdu speaking,army generals were Pashtun.remember it’s about ideology not ethnicity
A peanut brain makes a statement full of bigotry and prejudice. It is this mindset that creates divisions and is a hindrance in developing a cohesive national ideology. Keep playing the victim card and remain retrograde !
How can any one respect unpatriotic generals ! Look at the history of these men in role of army chief the king, who literally runs a one man show! The past incompetent and big ego loss half the country ! Yet no shame , the worst ex chief Bajwa who throw out a working government,replaced by a man who to go to jail on the same day as PM! Current unbalance placed in job by ex PM, Nawaz , who was not in power, a retired general, who was given the job for his hate for ex pm IK, who put IK in jail on fake cases did 5/9 false flag operation, and throw out whole election , because he is the king ! The caliber of generals have deteriorated to mad men with greed for looting and retiring to foreign country !
Pakistan is lucky to have honest and selfless military people who love the country. They have safely invested Pakistani money in Papa John's pizza franchise, real estate in London, Canada, and Dubai. They also own an island near Australia. These investments have made sure that Pakistani people don't waste their money on luxury items such as wheat flour, vegetables, electricity, clothing, and education.
@thomashunter5645, simply well said Sir 👍
😂😂😂😂 what a joke
very badgaleez e bamufqqat hujoom uz hajamat e Jinnah ur Azam
Well said.
lol honest and selfless militry Pakistani. Which world are you in my friend 😂
It was incredible to finally hear a middle-class perspective from academia. The entire podcast was captivating from start to finish. Whether it's a Zoom meeting or an in-person conversation, what truly matters is the quality of the discussion.
Kanjer mulk dushman, buzdil FAUJI duffers nay mulk ko rakah/ ashes may tabdeel ker dia hay. They don’t care about the mulk🇵🇰 in ki bala say 😡
Cannot gaslight Pakistanis anymore, the cat is out of the bag. Although there is so much negativity in Pakistan at the moment, your podcast was worth my time. Your's & your guest's assessment certainly is clear, concise and correct.You are bright & have class! Thank you !! Massive love & respect from Florida.
Hope you also apologise to the people who were always speaking up against this fake regime since ages and you kept calling them ghadaar, kaafir and other words.
Stability in Pakistan is only possible if ESTABLISHMENT detaches itself from Great Game; Deutsch itself from US+UK establishment. It means leave it to the people,
also if public prioritize their country too over their own selfish goals, and instead of looking for their lives in europe and serve their own country in their little capacity. we need look at the situation as a whole.that's my opinion
Establishment will not do it because they have Assets worth $500 Billion in Western Countries + Dubai
If they stop playing the Game of the West then the West will Freeze $100 Billion worth Assets and will stop Giving the Top Generals Millions of Dollars Every year that they currently give.
That will never happen
زبردست۔اللہ تعالی اپ دونوں کے ساتھ ساتھ اپ جیسے دانشوروں مفاد عامہ کے علمبرداروں کو اپنی حزانوں سے نوازیں۔پتہ ھۓ اخلاص سے بڑہ کر کوئ دولت نہیں اور اخلاص کی اصل معنی جو بھی کام کرو صرف اللہ کی رضاء ملحوظ خاطر ھو۔دونوں جہانوں کی کامیابی کا ایک ھی راز۔۔شکریہ
we were the people who never thought about politics, but with the evolving conditions and politics of Pakistan i would say these podcasts are gems to view the world to know the history and to understand from a different and bigger level.
Although today there are less views on these type of videos, but am happy someone is providing such valuable content and we as few viewers learning something great, which will definitely help to grow our mind,
Thank You Muzamil
An excellent discussion backed by strong academic insight. Intellectual conversations like this are essential, especially in these pivotal times. All signs point to the conclusion that the current system in Pakistan is on the decline, making way for a new order. The military, in conjunction with think tanks, is at the helm of this transformation. However, the path ahead is far from smooth; it's filled with challenges and uncertainties. While the outlook for Pakistan next year appears promising, it’s important to recognize that social engineering is a gradual process, and rapid fixes are not realistic.
Hello Muzamil, this is such an interesting discussion and what a lovely guest who is so generous with his thoughts and time. Please have him as a regular person on your platform.
Love all the questions your raising too. What a friendly and civilised conversation? Keep it going.. I’ve always followed Moeed Pirzada but now I will follow you too.. thanks
Great to see and learn from the analysis of such intellects. Hope it continues!
Wrapped up beautifully.... that "intellectual debate void in our society and channeling your thougts via data driven analysis" was so thought provoking. Keep up the good work
کرپشن، جرائم اور انارکی پاکستانی ڈی این اے کا حصہ ہے۔ کچھ نہیں بدلے گا کیونکہ ہم نے بہت سے مواقع ضائع کیے اور قومی مفاد پر ذاتی مفاد کو ترجیح دی۔
Muzammil, you are an absolute legend! Massive thanks for inviting Mr. Adeel and for this podcast!
The most viable solution for the survival ,progress and betterment of our country is to prioritize our country's interest over anything else and start trading with our neighbors.
I cannot comprehend the fact that pakistan can aquire one of the cheapest energy in this region directly from Iran wether be it fuel , natural gas even electricity and its been decades we havnt done so, because we need western permission as if we disobey our masters we will cease to exist.
More over we must explore other emerging economies to export our products.Lets break our shackles of western slavery.
Thanks very much Muzamil and Mr.Adeel Malik for this great discussion
Muzamil! Fantastic chat! Great guest! It’s so nice to see Pakistani-British academic based in the west giving us a different (but familiar) perspective.
Important Feedback - BIG Picture
This was probably the best podcast on TBT to date, at least in the top 3. The best part was such a precise & balanced comparison with Egypt. Your guest has no ego, open to challenges and propagates HOPE. Such people need to be promoted. Kindly call him again to clarify many half touched topics.
What I learned?
Though we have issues in education, economy, justice, healthcare and so many more areas, all these are interdependent. No one issue can be resolved (root cause) and fixed as priority over other. Most of your other podcasts discuss these topics. With that said, your intelligent guest in this podcast clearly shows us a different direction. In current situation, the thing that needs to be fixed on priority over others is "Political Consensus". Such consensus, further has two dimensions:
1. Consensus in foreign policy - what we want as a country?
2. Consensus in a NEW social contract - what the people want from the ruling class?
Mind you it is not a consensus in political economy, which is certainly an important aspect, but doesn’t work after a point when basic human rights are met. I say this because this is the focus of most of your other podcast.
We can no longer go to friendly countries bringing Billion dollar or dirham grants without informing our people what we negotiated in return. The return cannot be politician's family’s impunity or personal gains anymore. Once we reach a consensus, a clear direction will establish and promote a healthy political environment for true leadership. The natural outcome of which will be the solving of all other chronic issues mentioned above.
What I didn’t understand?
How will we reach such consensus in both these dimensions? And for this reason, I request two actions from Muzammil.
1. Please call your guest again.
2. Make it a point at TBT to ask all politician guests on what is that state of consensus as per them and what actions are they taking to reach it. We need to actively & openly talk about it.
Another point I did not understand was that your guest has a point of view that the current crisis may be the beginning of great success in the long run for Pakistan, as an evolution process. But he also argues that the foreign players intend to keep Pakistan in the state of strategic inaction. Does this mean evolution to success is anarchy (as the title of podcast suggests) or khooni inqelab or what else is it? What’s the way forward in his view, particularly if the foreign players give another temporary relief?
General Feedback:
1. Kindly add the link to the guest’s article (referred several times) in the description.
2. The context you set for your question, is often raising many questions, but you close at one question. A few times your guest also stated this during the podcast. I suggest either shortening the context to a single question or asking multiple questions on the full context, and then allowing the guest to address each of them one by one.
Love your content! 😇
Thanks it was a pleasure to hear someone so refined, educated and knowledgeable talk in such a positive manner about Pakistan and its future. These were time-bombs planted in the system by the colonists.InshaAllah we will overcome all these hurdles and rise like a phoenix.
Muzamil! You asked the right question, I think there will be a great Pakistani leader who would change the country in short period and I wish you best.
Anchor here has been continuously expressing, asking questions in English with few Urdu sentences where guest replied very gracefully in Urdu
I hope views and interviewer pay attention to this message from this Oxford Professor
This podcast has answered a number of questions I've had for a while. Thank you
As a host it would be more interesting if you ask short open ended questions and let the guest express himself fully.
Most (not all) lengthy questions are the host world view, which is much narrower than the guest.
Muzamil, I'm impressed with what and how Dr Adeel responded and articulated his answers and analysis on various topics but equally impressed with the way you presented very intelligently all the questions that in turn had the best and very intellectual response from the interviewee.
However, I admit that I never knew that clever and smart podcaster like you exist in Pakistan, so bravo. Keep up the good work.
Bohat Shukriya Guys, really appreciated & really worth listening. Thanks alot 🙌🏼
Love the high quality of discourse on TBT
20:13 Thanks for accepting/recognizing that we have a diverse ethnic background and thanks for talking about it, unlike some other podcaster who I feel like they are working on an agenda or are biased and think we all are south asians or something and completely refute the presence of Arab/Persian and other central asian ethinic backgrounds people living in Pakistan. Yes we are Pakistanis now but completely rejecting the fact of this diversity and also throwing in the Syed card that we have more Syeds in Pakistan than anywhere else in the world and making fun of it does not negate the fact that many of us are infact from Arab/Persian/Central Asian background, not sure why some of our brothers have trouble digesting this truth. Pakistan exists outside punjab/sindh too and we have a very diverse ethnic background especially in KPK and Balochistan.
Exactly lol my forefathers came to subcontinent from the Cities of samarkand and bukhara, my father and even grandfather used to tell. Even my mother side of relatives quote this thing as kind of cracking joke on us that "your family comprises of foreigners"
Many of us had our grandfather recently migrated from Iran/Tajik/Uzbek etc. When this land was India, people from surrounding places used to visit this place they knew the language, even farsi was commonly understood in some parts of india. Some decided to stay here for business purposes or for better future or came to join their other brethren fighting for a cause. Although we now are Pakistanis but if you would ask anybody where were your forefathers from what do people expect us to reply? Pakistanis are scattered they have no sense of unity, you want to dig deep where a person is from and then make fun of the fact when someone says where their family is from. There is a beauty in diversity but for some nonsesical podcasters it is a joke, they tell us how you can't force any community to change their ways or their language, at the same time they make fun of the fact and refuse to accept that we have different ethnicities living here who were from other part of the surrounding world, what hypocrites!! Make up your mind first.
@@ahmedmuhammad9877I don't know where these people get their ideas from. You will find almost no family in Pakistan that is not of Arab, Persian, Turk, or Central Asian ancestry. That's what makes PakIstanis different from Indians.
@PS-ej2xn Its because Punjab and Sindh probably do not have many people from these origins and since Punjabis and Sindhis were here for centuries they think rest of Pakistan is like them as well. I actually do not understand their reasoning, their only weapon is to use Syeds as an example which again does not negate the fact of people from Middle Eastern/Central Asian origin living in Pakistan. They are confused individuals, I am not sure how with such intellect they still have biases.
@@PS-ej2xn NaPak badzehniat:"Dukan pakodon ki....... baatein karodon ki"
Kalme pad pad ke..... tokri bhar ghaas kha kha ke....... mulk bana tha - LEKIN afsosssssss
@TBT Podcast
Great, watching this kind of podcasts for sometime now. I believe this series will go a long way in developing right future path.
Pakistani army need Imran Khan more then Imran need Army
Pakistan is very important in it's own head 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Arguably the best episode and guest to date.
I think, the main problem is the dependence on violence and use of violence to achieve even the best social / political objectives. Jinnah was an extremely selfish person who resorted to violence even in the short period he lived after August 47, he invaded Pakistan’s own people in Pakhtunkhwa and Baluchistan to force secede.
It is for this reason that it is impossible to achieve the objective of uniting the diverse communities it consists of today. In my opinion Pakistan needs a leader like Willy Brandt who apologised to the society for the violence and injustices suffered by the people of Germany in the last about 50 years in Germany.
I usually don't like your views but this podcast was really great. such an educated guest and what a wonderful choice of guest.
I agree with him but Muzzamil, you need to be get rid of love for PML-N
what an amazing podcast. I wish it could get millions of views from pakistan. People need to listen to such intellectuals.
شکریہ مزمل! یہ بلاشبہ ایک نہایت ہی غیر جانبدار اور عمدہ علمی گفتگو پر مبنی نشست تھی۔ آپ علمی محاذ پر ایک اچھی کاوش جاری رکھے ہوئے ہیں، جو کہ قابل ستائش ہے۔ میں یہ سمجھتا ہوں کہ پاکستان اپنی تاریخ کے ایک فیصلہ کن موڑ پر پہنچ چکا ہے اورایک ایک کرکے وہ سارے عوامل وقوع پذیر ہورہے ہیں جو ایک نئے نظام ی بنیاد ڈالنے کیلئے ضروری ہوتے ہیں۔ اب پاکستانی عوام نہ صرف اپنے ساتھ ہوتے آئے مظالم اور ناانصافی کا شعور رکھتی ہے، بلکہ سماجی رابطوں کے پلیٹ فارمز کی بدولت زبان بھی۔ وہ دن دور نہیں جب عوام تمام فیصلے اپنے ہاتھوں میں لے لیں گے۔انشاءاللہ
Thank you Muzamil, it was a great discussion and what I loved in the interview was, you people put forward a solution to the problem instead only pointing out the problem. We are lacking intellectual discussions which is needed.
As a starter, let’s all respect the Constitution of Pakistan 🇵🇰
So glad you interviewed Adeel Malik. I don’t want to suffer through the pseudo-leftist Raza Ahmed (Rumi) but really wanted to hear Dr. Malik’s views. Learned so much: Creative destruction, Lack of land reforms, patronage politics etc etc.
21:11 the civilization that existed is called Indian civilization called Hinduism. Delhi didn't come and rule Pakistan.Infact Central asians came and ruled Delhi.
Nikal
Chal
@vaishakh3
kis ko samja raha hai .
they all are jiadies just in diffrent clothes
@@goals27hijda awam come on street for sar tan se juda on fake blasphemy case
@@ViewsGoogler tera sir?
@@ViewsGoogler aja juda kron
Our great leader Imran Khan Sahib Zindaabad ❤❤❤
Interest by Pakistanis is because the country is held hostage by Army generals for power with no regards for future of Country. Political process has stopped and will of the people is in jail
Thanks for bringing Professor Adeel Malik saheb on your show. Seldom see such informed & meaningful discussion in our media. Wish we had more distinguished personalities like professor Malik.
I am always waiting for your podcasts especially since I listened to one podcast you said that every weekend you will have at least three videos podcast.😂❤ Love from Sindh. Sir muzamil ❤
India is a great example of cohesion and political stability, a good part of this is India's inclusive education.
In an unrelated matter, it is quite amazing that the existential threat that Pakistan poses to the region and the world is its nuclear arsenal, which has not been addressed, not even as a footnote by the discussant. An unstable Pakistan would be a hazardous enterprise. Both India and the US are well aware of this.
Very informative. Great job.
We should speak the truth without any fear if we really love this country.
This gentleman, Mr. Raiss thought are enough to open eyes for middle-class people of pakistan 🇵🇰.
Amazed! Literally I was blown away when i accidentally discovered your vlog/ channel.😊
Most objective & enlightened discussion
Pak army retires after lieutenant Col if they are not corrupt themselves or allow corruption , but now army support outside Pakistan is diminishing so it can only be reverse by popular civilian world leader like IMRAN KHAN.
Kanjer mulk dushman, buzdil FAUJI duffers nay mulk ko rakah/ ashes may tabdeel ker dia hay. They don’t care about the mulk🇵🇰 in ki bala say 😡
Thank you so much muzammil for inviting such a learned man. We need discussion like this. I remember listening to his father Professor Fateh when i was kid. Tub mujhy unki sari batain samjh tu nahi ati thi but even at that time i used to get vibe of a very honest man and now seeing his son no wonder i can say that he raised his sons in a very good way. Lots of prayers for all of them. Also i wouod request muzammil to invit tariq malik also we want mentors and seniors like them to learn things.
Thoroughly enjoyed the conversation. Brilliant
پروگرام کے ہوسٹ مزمل حسن نے بہت اچھا کام کیا کہ ایک قابل علم والے اور پاکستان کی ترقی کی خواہش رکھنے والے پروفیسر عدیل کا انٹرویو کیا ۔ میرے ادنی شعور کے مطابق پاکستان بننے سے پہلے ہندوں کے شدید تعصب کی وجہ سے مسلمان معاشی طور پر بہت پیچھے تھے ۔ مذہبی تعصب بھی نفرت کی حد تک بہت شدید تھا۔ اس لیے ہم اپنے مذہب معاشی اور کلچرل کی حفاظت کنے کے لیے ملک بنانے میں کامیاب ہو گے۔ ملک بننے کے بعد پچھلے تمام سویلین اور فوجی حکمران ہماری معاشی تباہی کے ذمہ دار ہیں بشمول عمران ۔ جنرل ایوب کے دور میں زرعی اور صنعتی ترقی کی بنیادیں رکھی گءی لیکن اس کی امریت اور محترمہ فاطمہ جناح کو دھندلی سے ہرا کر بنگلہ دیش کی علیدہگی کی بنیاد رکھی ۔ ذولفقار علی بھٹو اگر ایٹم بمم نہ بناتے تو اج انڈیا ہمارے ساتھ اس سے بھی زیادہ ظلم کرتا جو اسرائیل فلسطین کے ساتھ کررہا ہے ۔ پروفیسر صاحب کی بات میں بہت وزن ہے کہ معاشی تباہی کی اخیر پر ملک چلانے والے سخت پریشان ہوکر ملک کو بچانے کی جنگ میں وہ سخت درست فیصلے کرنے لگ جاتے ہیں ۔ جنرل عاصم منیر اور شہباز شریف نے ڈالر کا ریٹ اور سمگلنگ روکنے کے لیے موثر اقدامات کیے نہ کرتے تو مہنگای اور زیادہ ہوتی ۔ اگرچہ۔ مافیاز اپنے ذاتی مفاد کے لیے سخت رکاوٹیں پیدا کررہے ہیں پورا سسٹم بیورو کریسی سیاسی لیڈر میڈیا سب ذاتی مفادات کی خاطر کام کررہے ہیں ۔ لیکن اللہ تعالی کا شکر ہے جنرل عاصم منیر اور شہباز شریف ملکی مفاد میں فیصلے اور عمل کررہے ہیں ۔ پچھلے تمام سویلین اور فوجی حکمرانوں نے قرضے لیے لیکن ووٹرز کو خوش کرنے کے لیے ترقیاتی کام کرواے حلانکہ ان قرضوں کے پیسوں سے ایسے کارخانے لگاتے جن کی پیداوار کو ایکسپورٹ کرتے۔ جونیجو دور میں ڈاکٹر محبوب الحق کی ایسی تجاویز نہیں مانی گءی۔ ہماری مجبوری ہے کہ ہم نے چاینہ امریکہ یوروپ سعودی عربیہ یو اے ای سے تعلقات مضبوط بنانے کی ضرورت ہے۔ میڈیا سارا دن مایوسی پھیلا رہا ہے حکومت کے اچھے کاموں کا ذکر نہہں کرتا ملک میں تیل اور گیس کی نءی درفیاتوں کی خبروں کا ڈکر بار بار نہیں کرتا ۔ پاکستان نے امریکہ کی جنگ لڑ کر ہم نے اپنا بہت جانی مالی نقصان کیا لیکن۔ جب امریکہ کی ہمیں سپورٹ کی بات اتی ہے امریکہ میں انڈین اور یہودی لابی ہمارے خلاف امریکہ سے فیصلے کرواتی ہیں۔ مزمل حسن صاحب سے گزارش ہے ہر پروگرام میں اچھاءی کی گنجایش ہوتی ہے اپ کچھ باتیں اپ ہاکستان کے خلاف غلط کر جاتے ہیں افغانیوں کو با عزت طریقے سے چلے جانے کی گذارش کی گی اپ نے اس سلسلے میں حکومت کے دلاءل کا ذکر نہیں کیا ۔ کی افغانی بھایوں کے لیے اب افغانستان میں حالات ٹھیک ہیں وہ ہم پر معاشی بوجھ ہیں ڈالرز اور اسلحہ کے اسمگلر اور دہشت گرد ان کے اندر اجاتے تھے ایک بالغ نظر صحافی ہر ایشو کے بارے دونوں نظریات پیش کرتے ہیں۔ اپ خود کم بولا کریں مہمان کو زیادہ بولنے دیں اواز کچھ دھیمی رکھیں اپنی مزید اصلاح کے لیے اپنے پروگرام کی ایڈٹ مجھ س کروایں
This is a guy we need to start a think tank in pakistan
Hi Muzamil, Please also make a podcast or a short sort of video about the firewall that has been recently installed in Pakistan. There’s a lot of speculation, would really appreciate if we could get a technical analysis from an expert.
Thanks!
People don’t know what’s authentic and what’s a myth at this point lol
Professor Sahab incredible researcher and a very very efficient personality .
Best talk ever … keep it up Muzamil Hasan 👍🏽👏🏼
Had a quality time with you intellectual ppl
1:14:11 Not 'Cheap' Goods
Superior Quality and Affordable Indian Goods
India's GDP Per Capita is $2750 ( $4 trillion divided by 1.45 Billion )
Pakistan's GDP Per Capita is $1400 ( $350 Billion Divided by 250 Million )
What's your point
Superb podcast. Pakistan needs more such intelligent discussions on social media channels.
Great discussion with a very learnded scholar on Pakistan's real issues. Bravo
Very insightful!👏 Loved the podcast!
I was craving such academic discussion, thank you
😅 another difference is Turkey, India, Indonesia did reforms when they had few months of foreign exchange reserves left and shattered economy but Pakistan is still not doing the reforms and going in the that direction. It means k "hum nahe manain gy, hum nahe sunain gy, hum nahe karain gy"
I have a theory I call the "Threshold Theory of Change." In my view, Pakistan has reached a critical point where a significant number of people are fed up with the elite capture by pro-Western rent-seekers. While change may take time, I believe it has now become inevitable.
I really appreciate the discussion, as I have long held similar views about the political and economic situation in Pakistan. One key point raised was the need to break free from our dependence on the West once and for all. With the collapse of pro-military narratives, this is becoming a reality before our eyes. While we don't yet know how we will handle the outcome, I believe we are heading towards this landmark change in Pakistan's politics.
Only overseas Pakistanis can save the country now
one the best pod of your sir Masha Allah v good
Very balanced Analysis. And quite true unfortunately.
Please keep your questions short & to the point. Your questions are very good but too long winded. Also, please your sound issues. Great work & wonderful guest .
Pakistani always looking for hand out from west .
زبردست ڈسکشن، ریمارکس اینڈ انالائسز، عمدہ ۔ شکریہ 👍
The colonial establishment which includes military and civil bureaucracy with elites have to dismantled, to move forward. The million dollar question is how. It has to be public uprising starting from Lahore and Pindi to be successful. Don’t know if this will happen in my lifetime. Otherwise we are doomed.
Such a productive discussion. Thanks for highlighting these topics.
Rewarding discussion. Learnt a lot. Please continue to engage such kind of people. 👍👍
کزارش ہے کہ مہمانوں سے مساءل کا حل حاصل کریں اور حل والے حصے کو زیادہ وقت دیں
Very good detailed analysis but with the strong grip of Zardari- Shareefs-Tyrant Generals, change of political and social situations appears difficult
very informative and thought provoking
Mind blowing views about world power structures
This is Truly educational podcast. it was great to listen him . in sha Allah pakistan will rise again
Muzamil bhai I will second you on "This is super super insightful".
Moral of Story- failed state and anarchy in 🇵🇰
I only listen your complete podcast if it is with @Adeel Malik
Muzammil Bhai, when you have a podcast with an economist, please ask: Given the current economic situation, what should be the strategy for the common Pakistani in such uncertain times?
Unhony video banayi hi is per pehle b 2-3 month pehle hi. Pehle channel Tu check kr lo yar....
Super bahut aala, very intectual discussion with contemporary references and solutions
Invaluable content… brilliant!
Waching from 🇮🇳,nice conversation and hope our naighbour and we can live peacefully ❤
After point of disappointment the last 5 mins wraps everything . One should be a leader in one's own field .
Thx for bringing the fertile minds on board.
Regards
Agar mein aur meray forefathers 1947 se elite status enjoy kar rahy hein, to phir ub mein ye kaisy give up karon?
Mein to kisi b hud tak Jaon ga. Aur apna qabza aur control state per rakhon ga.
Bloody revolution is the only scenario jis ko ata dekh kar mein abroad bhaag Jaon ga... otherwise No
You are doing absolutely fabulous job
Sufia' ikrams were one men army. With The Divine Help, and by their own selves where ever they went by love, wisdom, genoricity, perservance and patience they concored hearts of people by millions. You and me are living examples of such outreach.
Intellectual poverty. While physical poverty is not acceptable in this century, poverty of the mind even less so ! Let us try first by clearly separating Arabic customs from Islamic principles, and then build a society based on educated and skilled people.
The Professor's volume and your volume were on different levels. Please record the audio separately for each participant (it is possible) so that each can be brought to the same audible level while editing.
Pakistan was ahead of India till Computers and IT came ( Late 1990s ) Computers and IT was the Turning point and that began India's Growth Story. Pakistan only relied on American and British Aid, while India began setting up Big IT Centres like Bangalore ,Hyderabad, Gurgaon, Even Bangladesh setup Huge Textiles Centres. Pakistan should open up Borders to Bring in Afghans and also Allow India to Trade with Afghansitan and Central Asia and Pakistan can Collect Toll Taxes.
India also needs Oil and Gas from Iran, and if a Pipeline is developed from Iran to India then Pakistan could earn money, and also have leverage over India.
Pakistan was never ahead of India. Yes for some years GDP of Pakistan higher than India that was because USA and other Western Countries gave massive aid without any accountability to fight Korean war and then Afghan war. No questions were asked. Lot of money went in to pockets of Military generals.
@@R.kandaswamy Yes, thats what i meant.
Pakistan was ahead because of Billions of Dollars of U.S Aid
NaPak badzehniat:"Dukan pakodon ki....... baatein karodon ki"
Wow. This was enlightening
Such a Nice Discussion:
I believe changing at door steps now knocking.
As podcast need true leaders respective or concern departments.
😅 point is 1947 sy pehlay bhe punjab angrezo ka loyal raha hai. Or aj bhe proud krtay hain apni Imperial British army roots py jis mey ja k tipu sultan or delhi mey wars ke or muslims ko mara.
Kabhi history parhi hai kis ne kaha punjab angrezon ka loyal tha ,the biggest role in freedom of Pakistan was from punjabis , the most sacrifices were made by punjabis , there are big names for independence movement from punjab mgr apki Dimag mn jo fatur hai na wo apko sachai dekhna nai deta.when Pakistan was made most of the beyracracy was Urdu speaking,army generals were Pashtun.remember it’s about ideology not ethnicity
A peanut brain makes a statement full of bigotry and prejudice. It is this mindset that creates divisions and is a hindrance in developing a cohesive national ideology. Keep playing the victim card and remain retrograde !
How can any one respect unpatriotic generals ! Look at the history of these men in role of army chief the king, who literally runs a one man show! The past incompetent and big ego loss half the country ! Yet no shame , the worst ex chief Bajwa who throw out a working government,replaced by a man who to go to jail on the same day as PM! Current unbalance placed in job by ex PM, Nawaz , who was not in power, a retired general, who was given the job for his hate for ex pm IK, who put IK in jail on fake cases did 5/9 false flag operation, and throw out whole election , because he is the king ! The caliber of generals have deteriorated to mad men with greed for looting and retiring to foreign country !
Isn't the common identity and unifying factor answered by "Pakistan ka Matlab Kya?", isn't it the hatred of Hindus and India?
Very interesting & thought provoking- thank you:)
Until and unless we don't except " National Question" crises never end in our country
Big big mistake in thumbnail
" Is military rule ending Pakistan"
Correct this kindly
Thumbs up... At least something positive to watch today 👍🏿👍🏿
Beautiful conversation