Ford Exits Brazil as China's Largest EV Maker Buys Factory for EV Production
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- čas přidán 11. 09. 2024
- Ford Exits Brazil as China's Largest EV Maker Buys Factory for EV Production
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It's amazing how the pace of one empire declining vs the other empire rising is quickening! The world desperately needs to move to be multi-polar.
Careful what you wish for... I personally don't care for communist dictatorship controlling my life
😂.. China still has a billion plus living on less than 20 dollars a day. Their real estate, municipal debt, and shadow banks are all in trouble especially considering their demographic collapse. Your comment isn't based on reality
Ja, genau.
agree! for the better of the rest of the world!
Here's the thing about Brazil. Our cheapest brand new car takes 4 years of minimal wages to get, that's without factoring interest rates that are also high.
BYD cars will probably be the only EVs we will actually be able to afford.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б There's many reasons. The two I can think of is that Brazil's resources are generally not high value like oil and gold. And those that are probably controlled by organized crime rather than legitimate tax paying companies. Furthermore, I don't think Brazil got the same amount of trade free or benefits that China rec'd.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б This is what you have to consider when Brazil is the subject: the country has 210 million people, there's a lot of poor people... BUT 20% of the people are rich... meaning: Brazil has population of rich people of around 40 million people.
That's more than the population of most European countries.
@@ricnyc2759Less than 10% of Brazilians survive on 50 dollars a day or more. I think you should re-think your math and your 20% number. What did you base that statistic on? I used FGV and IBGE income data.
Have you seen the price of BYD's cars in Brazil? Closer to 9-10 yrs of minimum wages to buy a BYD car.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б well, you have the usual culprits such as covid, inflation, high(er) levels of debt and so on but something quite unique to us is our bloated tax policy system nicknamed "custo Brasil" (brazilian cost).
With declining demand Ford probably had no other choice but to close and sell factories.
From what I hear and read, the BYD cars are gettihg pretty good, and pricing is very competitive.
So saving plants that Ford abandons is good for the local economy if people there can resume their work. Does it matter if the company is American, Chinese or European? And in the end, fair competition is good, even if you don't like who is winning.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б A company is not a country. BYD still needs to play by the rules outside of China.
@@денисбаженов-щ1бas long as a country not using force to open up other's economy, politics, other have choice to trade or not to trade, and that is ultimate fairness.
The BYD cars selling in Brazil are going for approx 10 years of minimum wage. The charging infrastructure is almost no existent. Let BYD spend some of that cash and give some jobs to Brazilians but it's not a guaranteed ROI by any stretch. Custo Brazil is real.
Ford EV division is the main cause for their demise you can thanks sleepy Joe for it 😅😂
@@денисбаженов-щ1б
You are really a victim of propaganda.. sorry for you..
President Lula personally wanted BYD cars in Brazil
Lula hopes Chinese help to establish a EV supply chain.
Every Brasilero wants BYD in Brasil.👍
Ford needs an EV version of the Fiesta.
Yup the last st was a badass looking little compact hatch esp the 2dr. It wouldn't sell in the U.S. but almost everywhere else?
The fiesta was Ford's top selling compact car of all time. A small pack 200-220 mile single motor ev at 20-25k or less would sell very well.
An answer to the bolt I’d buy that!
@@stevenjones916 I'm waiting to buy one in the USA. Probably a million other people too. But Farley says no, we're only selling "upscale" vehicles.
The damning question is: are they going to make money out of it?
In Brazil's case, Ford was losing hundreds of millions USD every year, while making small ICE - conventional! - cars.
At least in the short run, Ford's decision proved to be correct - now they are turning a profit in Brazil, by selling only imports - F150s, Mavericks, Mustangs, Transits, etc
@@claudiopiccoliromera2646 China is already moving to establish supply chains in South America. Chile is a huge Lithium exporter. They have copper etc all over the continent that the US has been stealing for decades. While destabilizing governments to maintain control of their resources....
Why does this feel like a giant game of Monopoly, and all of the Chinese brands are winning?
Its a pain in the arse for antichinese don't worry 😂
All systems eventually die....all of them. They are then replaced by newer more vibrant systems.
Because greedy rich people and politicians in US. I came to US in late 80s, I saw they moved most manufactories to China or 3rd world countries. I talked my American colleagues that will hurt America for long run , but my colleagues told me, they only keep high technology, high profits and financial industry in US. I replied to them not every American has good education and smart enough to do high technology job, eventually you will pay for what you are doing now.
Hi Viking.
We have absurd subsidies for OEMs in Brazil.
Those subsidies are in theory ending.
That drove Stellantis GM and VW to rush over the government for an extension for those subsidies.
The subsidies are given in form ox tax exemption and total about 1billion dollars a year.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б we have intelectual capacity, but we have no political will and a lot of corruption that will not allow the rightful development of a national brand.
Not at lest in a near future
Good. I hope they start closing down factories in the USA
One of your best videos yet! Thank you.
Glad you liked it!
10:12 Salvador not EL Salvador
You'd be surprised to see how much BYD is selling in Brazil right now. It's insane.
VW & Ford think there is a general slowdown with EVs when it's their products that appear to be the issue.
VW is also cutting prices to reduce inventory, particularly in China where their EVs are inferior and not selling.
@@stevenjones916VW has a history of packing the dealerships….
“Sales” are not to customers but to dealers who get credit from VW…
Jeffm5 • They don't think anything wrong, because it is all done intentionally, it is all a huge manipulation. The EVs are intentionally made expensive and with low range so they don't get adopted by the masses.
It is 100% the bribing Oil Cartel money at play in this highly orchestrated manipulation.
@@stevenjones916From 200k to 300K it's not as optimistic as you implied.
Ford EV division is losing 4 to 5 billion dollars this year alone hence there's no demand for EV yet 😅😂
Interesting how BYD can succeed in exact same factory Ford failed. Same with Tesla’s first factory in Fremont.
An excellent place to examine the choice of EV vs Ethanol. Brazil is by far the leading renewable ethanol producer. Unlike most western countries and China; Brazil currently offers no subsidy for purchase of EVs, though they do not charge the 35% import duty for EVs. So this would be a toe to toe competition between the more viable green alternatives - The Toyota Prius running on Ethanol is probably the greenest most viable car type on the planet right now.
no, ethanol is a dead end, it takes more energy to make ethanol then you get back when you burn it. also if you are making ethanol you are not growing food, thats another expensive.
It’s not that simple.
Electric vehicles here and ICE cars actually are ridiculously expensive.
An 8k dollars Jac electric vehicle in China is being sold for 30k dollars in Brazil.
Let's shut you up in a confined space with any ethanol burning car and I'll be in my bolt also in a confined space.
We both roll all the windows down and power on the cars for an hour. Whoever lives drives the cleaner choice. It won't be you btw. 👍🏻
@@scottmcshannon6821right. All that water used to water a crop that will be used by vehicles and not people. Fresh water is scarce.
Felling old trees in the Amazon to replace it with sugar cane to make ethanol is not exactly green
Now this is a great story great
EV ARE TO Expensive, regardless of car maker , everyone wants an EV, but can not afford it,
I don't want an EV
Lol. All Good, everyone has a choice, we thing, big business & Government dictate it just for money and profits, its the little people keeping the streets clean 😉👍. AND IT YOU NEED TO KEEP RUNNING EQUIPMENT ALL DAY LONG YOU NEED BETTER TECHNOLOGY.
I think you also need to take a look at what BYD and other intending EV manufacturers are up to in Thailand. Things are all rather secretive here, but it is known that BYD are in the process of setting up a plant here. I imagine that BYD also intend to use existing local plants now somewhat underused by Ford and GM. The GM plant had a history of being able to turn out different brands that were not exactly native. But I really don't know the deal because local English language media and bloggers really don't go into any tech issue in any practical depth. I suppose they too buy into this deliberate obsolescence notion so popular with western think-tanks these days. In a very short time, there are a significant number of EVs on the road here, but also all the paranoia about battery safety.
Hey.. it's your country Brazil.. you want to align closer to China.. Good Luck! lol.. oh I get they'll help your economy now.. good luck in the future.
At least they don't have to buy overpriced EVs from the Western brands
Hahaha, so Americans are willing to help for the present and the future of Brazil? I literally laughed my ass off
Great honest report
Thanks Mate!
Legacy auto will make they’re last stand in their foundation countries. Tesla and Chinese EV will probably shut them down!
Your accent saying CAMAÇARI is very funny 😂😂😂...CAMAÇARI is the city were the former Ford factory was
By the way cars in Brasil are far from being cheap, in fact they are very expensive considering average wages
FYI the "Xi" in Xi Jinping is pronounced like "she" not "yee".
I was gonna buy a f150 lightning. I couldn't find a single base model that's not jacked up in price. The next trim up is like $7k more. Decided to get a model 3 that had a discount and got delivered in 3 days. 34k after taxes and rebates.
If Ford just made tons of base models, I am sure they would have sold like hot cakes. 43$ for a fullsized truck (after rebate) would have been awesome. Too bad they want me to pay like 55k or even 60k for a truck. Zero freaking chance.
Ford are losing 35k for every vehicle they sold even with premium prices just imagine if they were to lower their prices from 100k to 50k they going to be losing at least 80k per vehicle 😂😅
@@oneviwatara9384 nah they break even on the top trims. The problem is that they do lose money on the lower trims and so they don't want to sell them. I think only 5% of the trucks they make are the basic trim.
And it's not like the truck actually costs 100k+ to make. It's a new prod line that has low volume. Once they sell enough trucks, the margins will come back. The problem is that they priced it so high that no one wants to buy it.
I really want a base trim lightning but they don't exist lol.
@@changen4125
Wrong, Ford EV have been losing billions of dollars every year in 2023 they going to lose another 4 to 5 billion dollars despite taking $9.2 billions loan from US taxpayers money this year to helped them expand their production.
Do they also predict what the impact of future solar waste will do to our lives and economy in 25 to 30 years. We are talking about an unfathomable amount of solar panel waste when the panels cease to yield enough energy to work properly. We still have a huge plastic waste problem. What makes us so confident we can realistically achieve this for solar?
Cheers mate
Hey Sam. I’m an Aussie looking to purchase Tesla shares.
I’m wondering if I can ask you a couple of questions.
Not sure how I can make contact outside of comments.
Regards Ron
Ford needs to just focus on making Maverick pickups in hybrid and EV.
Its easier to sell a $40k EV 4 door maverick than a $60k Mach-e
Automakers and companies always think the answer to their profit goals is seeking out the wealthy/high profit margin goods/services. Meanwhile, in this post pandemic world, I think companies need to focus on more realistic/affordable vehicles/products/services. But to be fair, legacy automakers are generally saddled with heavy pension/healthcare/union costs that these newer companies with generally younger workforces don't have to deal with.
keep in mind something, you might want to do a video about it.... CATL(state owned china), got a huge contract in Bolivia, they are planning to make batteries in Bolivia, partnership wtih stated owned Bolivia Lithium company.
that is huge...china is gona create industrial chains in southamerican countries, to feed the internal market.
CATL isn't state owned. It's publicly traded company
CATL isn't owned by Chinese government, you Western MSM brainwashed
Kick in the ass. 😂
Chinese banks have probably siezed it, because they got shafted in China after moving everything there 😂😂😂
Would love to see your take on the elephant in the room that is depreciations on used EV s.
If/when I replace my low mileage 2007 Honda Fit, the new vehicle will likely be a Tesla M2 [or whatever its name turns out to be]. I will own it for at least 15 years - depreciation is not a concern for me. Why would you want to trade in a car that is still working OK? Why did you buy it in the first place? Did you not do your homework?
Elephant used EVs? How about overpriced new ICE that crash in value when you drive off the lot? You may be misinformed or under informed.
@@jrb_sland I like to run a new car ,I change every 2 years.
@@snookmeister55 EV depreciate a lot more than ice.Tesla are the exception.
@@e.u.sheridan9727not anymore. Tesla has been cutting down prices the last few months. Those who bought Tesla say 2 years ago now find themselves owning an older car worth more than a brand new one...on paper
Hello mate
Sam, what’s wrong with Ford? They don’t understand what people are actually wanting when they buy an ev today, clearly. Iv seen and been inside their Mach E vehicles and the interior is really nice (impressive, and even better in my opinion than Tesla model y) but their rear seat space is tiny, their trunk boot space is tiny also, and it’s just not a good car for a family suv for families that have 1 or 2 children or child seats they need to put into the rear. If the mustang Mach e had normal size rear doors and the same boot space and rear seat space as model Y then I’d have no problems at all buying one, but the reality is that it doesn’t, it’s not even close and in turn the pricing here in nz is so much cheaper for a model y vs the Mach E that it’s not even close or funny. Ford sadly just looked at what it thought would be cool to release without getting the real world specs right for what buyers are wanting to pay money for, and now it’s very hard for them to change those specs sadly without costing a fortune. With the lightning again it needed charging at least 200kw dc fast charging speed (or more) and also bi directional wirh v2L support and an option with at least around 130-150kwh long range battery for those wanting or needing the longer range, again they totally missed what their clients actually wanted for real world specs sadly.
And the union would like a 40% increase in wages.
UAW is the death of vehicle manufacturing.
Ford the American company that is making its cars in Mexico
Love your channel Samuel, but please, check your pronunciation of words (eg detente). Not doing so makes otherwise great quality content look like amateur hour.
Reminiscent of GM/Freemont
Jim is sh!tting it an I liked the Ford Capri
Pickups are crucial for Ford. If EV's are indeed the future, and the company can't find a way to make the Lightning more efficient and affordable, it's dead. It's just a matter of time.
Only reason pickups are critical to Ford and GM and Ram is because USA keeps a 25% import tarrif on pickups / large SUVs in US only. Is no help in Brazil.
i would suspect Tesla has a small group assessing current auto plants for purchase. Buy the ones that would be easiest to convert to making Tesla models and of course in desirable locations and situations.
Tesla learned from the Nummi plant - and hopefully won't repeat the lesson...
@@brilanto I don't believe that, because one plant was not that suitable, that all plants are unsuitable. If they think like that, BYD will eat their lunch.
Nothing is wrong with Ford. They are well made cars.
What is proven?
I'm not worried about Ford. It is a large mature auto maker & can manage its own affairs, even into bankruptcy if it so chooses. Not my problem - my tiny spare investment capital is invested in $TSLA, not $F, nor $GM.
If Ford had a small maverick truck EV.
If Ford built a Focus or Fiesta sized EV in the USA.
Sigh.
Legacy autos may not be hopelessly doomed, but they are rapidly running out of time. For Ford to only have 3% full EVs in 2024 and Toyota to have even less may spell doom for them both. Government bail outs may happen, but they are far from guaranteed.
BEV supply chain is mostly Chinese, which is a big problem for Japan. See Zeihan's interesting take on this. It seems to explain the Japanese infatuation with hydrogen or anything not reliant on China.
@@snookmeister55Woww .. what a big excuse for Japan's blunder on EV .... But ofc losers always give excuses 😂😂😂
I’ve had (have GMC Duramax 4C4)a couple of Chevys and really liked them but I don’t think I would buy another GM product. I don’t like the way the company is run. Our politics is/are so screwed up! The side which is out of power refuses to help pass any legislation, no matter how much it hurts the country. Just to make sure the opposition doesn’t get credit for doing anything.
Jim farley isn't all that hype what they said ...no better ceo than alan mulally
Brasil is one of the most hostile countries towards manufacturing on the planet. They have lost so many factories. Part of the problem is their nutty tax structure, whereby sales tax is paid on parts by the manufacturers. Here in the USA wholesale transactions are exempted, and only the final retail sale pays sales tax. But in Brasil when a car company buys a tire for their car, they are supposed to pay the tax, and then keep track of it. It makes a huge accounting headache.
Brasil is part of Mercosul, a trade group that allows members to ship cars between countries duty free. So Brasil has a lot of vehicles brought in from Argentina like their popular HiLux truck. China will eventually gain a foothold in a mercosul country and from that starting point take over south america. There are already quite a few chinese brands in South America.
And your point is what... exactly.
My point is that Brasil is not going to be a big car manufacturing territory. It has to reform its tax rules. The Chinese will just do minimal assembly to evade the 100% import duty on cars. Bahia has no infrastructure for manufacturing at all. it is lightly populated, nothing but beach resorts.
@@witcheater
Paying taxes on parts - imagine the evil audacity...
ha byd will do well there then. china does the value added tax on manufaturers as well.
you don't seem to understand the immense bookkeeping hassle it is to track the sales tax you paid in components in brasil. In less backwards countries, the sales tax is paid when the final product is sold to the customer, and all along the supply chain they use what is called a resale license to exempt the transaction from sales tax.
Brasil has raw material export and only one notable industrial company, Embraer, which is sufficiently computerized to track the 100,000 parts that go into an airplane.
Eventually Brasil will figure this out, and then we might see some Brasilian products.
@@brilanto
BYD will want to be employing Chinese workers
Ford needs to regroup and be smaller and more profitable. Not worry about Ford. They managed to last a long time and it is unlikely they will go down without a fight.
Has anybody watch Bjorn Nyland’s review of the BYD Atto 3? This car has a lot of problem and this reviewer doesn’t seem to like this car at all.
Yeah no one cares about him he is Antichinese through and through 😂
@tttran60 I think I’ve seen another video later on and he actually praised it (drive until the battery died video)
@@cocoaiscool2709 Good to know, we need more EV companies that make affordable cars.
@@tttran60definitely!
Bjørn test Atto3 in Thailand, late 2022: Good results
Bjørn test Atto3 in Norway, 2023: Very bad results
Brazil, ...another BRICS member building China's Belt-and-Road Initiative. BYD now publicly committed to the utter destruction of the US/EU 'vehicle' market, globally(!) China is building roads connecting continents, and they intend for Chinese cars to be 'king-of-the-road'(.) Chinese are generally demure and circumspect; "tit-for-tat", however this latest statement from BYD is the last chapter in the "art-of-war", and the legacy of Huawei will never be forgotten in China. "350M Chinese consumers are never wrong"(.)
Once Giga Mexico starts producing a affordable car,South America will be able to buy a great quality car at a cheap price
Ford is not exiting Brazil. This is a repeated misreporting of the facts by numerous parties that borders on malicious. They are ONLY closing plants. Regional headquarters, engineering, marketing etc. stays in Brazil, and products are coming from neighbouring countries in South America. Some of this is just shoddy translation, like a recent article reporting that Ford is moving a plant to Bahia state. Nope, the word is transferring, as in transferring ownership. Also a BYD deal is not done, and it is not a closed EV plant as many are saying. Nor is it likely BYD will build EVs there even if a deal does go through.
Brazil isn’t good market for other than popular necessities products. 66% of the population makes minimum wage of $250 per month. It’s Impossible to buy anything else then Bare Necessities.
You can see the disaster unfolding before our eyes , unfortunately the CEOs at ford will be retired in a few years and dont really care about Ford , why would they ? 😢
Jim farley wasn't all that hype that media and other represented . He was brought as he is from Toyota. There will be no ceo like alan Roger mulally
@@tesla_models capitalism system doesn’t work! 😬
Unfortunately, Sam, you are actually coming at this from exactly the wrong direction !!!
You keep saying that EVs are popular ….. however, the general public are actually turning off these type of vehicles
It’s not just that Ford can’t sell them or VW can’t sell them or in fact, many other well-known manufacturers like Toyota are actually going to give up manufacturing them in any volume …. The real issue is that the general public do not trust these vehicles and are not prepared to pay the prices that are being charged when they are new and are very worried about the massive depreciation once you have bought an EV
So the future for EV is in general, although not totally clear, is certainly not very bright, possibly with the exception of Tesla who have an absolute domination on the market at the moment
It’s simple fords don’t sell because they are too expensive. An electric F150 is not $40,000 dollars more truck than a gas F150. The gas F150 is too expensive. The dealers are greedy. So no one buying anything, car wise.
Polestar 2 owner. I don’t think you fully understand the American sentiment on EV’s. We know our electrical infrastructure is old and can’t handle all the EVs. We know that no money is being put towards the infrastructure. We have brown outs in certain states during peak demand. Our charging network is not developed. We were pushed to nuclear to be our future at one point. That failed. We have only decrease coal usage by 1% since the seventies. Yet our coal mines are all but shut down. Other countries are still building coal plants. We know that most of the rare earth mines have been bought up by our economic rival. The one metric that is most important to Americans while buying a car is range which is lacking in EVs. We also know that gas and oil will continue to be produced for other purposes than fuel. What would happen to the EV market if the next administration makes the US energy independent again rescinds the tax breaks? IMHO if you really wanted clean energy first would have to be the power plants, then the infrastructure, followed by the EVs. In this case the chicken needed to come before the egg.
The Chinese auto industry is changing the world order, legacy makers and especially Japan brands are being very quickly replaced with China brands....and the pace is picking up. The US is very lucky to have Tesla, even they have most of their production in China.
Batteries, autos, buses, solar panels.....all industries that are being dominated by Chinese makers. IC chips and aircraft to follow the same path.
Wierd move by Ford, given that Brazil will be the LAST place to switch from gasoline to electric autos. They have worked hard to develop about the only biofuel industry which is widely acknowledged to be sustainable since a) is based on sugar cane, the most efficient vegetable conversion of sunlight to sugar b) in Amazon basin, so no artificial irrigation needed.
If there was any market where Ford etc ICE makers should succeed, it is Brasil.
Producing cara in Brazil was never about local sales, but all about cheap labor. Same thing with everything western businesses outsourced to China and other Asian countries. They just got good at it and are now winning the game.
Ford only has itself to blame for their failure.
Creators document dealerships over run with over priced top spec pickup trucks. Costing $70 to $120k.
To make matters worse, dealers are adding market adjustments.
In one case a special edition Shelby F150 was price adjusted an additional $30K making it a $150k pickup.
Meanwhile the average American is getting crushed.
A society built around the spreading of a persons life farther and farther apart. So you can’t survive without a vehicle to get around.
Ask a dealer if they have an affordable Ford Maverick and watch them laugh.
But Ford isn’t the only one.
All of the legacy auto makers are a decade behind Tesla. Hoping to catch up and fund their move to EVs by selling overpriced, unreliable and not vey practical pickups and SUVs.
Suddenly they all realized out sourcing everything in their cars is a giant anchor to progress and innovation.
I’ve held on to a 2002 vehicle. My next will be a small motorcycle. Just like when I was in my teens and went everywhere via a motorcycle.
60mpg makes so much sense. If and when Tesla opens their robotaxi network I’ll be one of the first to sign up.
Their only worth pennys on the dollar because they don’t make sense,If they’re such a smart move Tesla would be buying them. Elon has said initially Fremont was inefficient and not conducive to building BEV’s to scale. Hence we have giga Texas,Berlin,Shanghai,soon Mexico andIndia.See a trend here.
Ever heard of BRICS? China and Brazil supporting each ither? But it's because Ford isn't msking EVs and has dealerships.
What rubbish.
@stevenjones916 According to Statistica, it's something like 45% of all light vehicle sales. However, the average annual income in Brazil is around $22k USD, and the leading EV seller is apparently either from Volvo or Polestar, hardly budget brands.
Considering the takeover by a leftist government, the stats might be a bit suspect. It's not like they've ever been honest about much of anything, except their desire to gain total control.
@@stevenjones916 i believed less than 0.5%. it about the same percentage all around the world, except china, EU, US, UK, India , OZ. EV is still not a necessary in undeveloped country.. cause the cheapest chinese ev here in indonesia cost double the price from china. araound 16k-21k usd (that's the Wuling Mini ev) the chepest ICE car here is around 10k usd. Tesla starts from 150k-200k usd.
@jonitan76 Ouch. Hopefully there's no idiotic mandate to buy them. That would be ruinous...
Cheap peanut made in usa
Toyota is more dangerous than Ford. In the competitiveness of automobiles, software accounts for an increasing proportion. Japan does not have a software ecosystem, but the United States does.
As long as Ford lobbied the government and drove Toyota Hyundai out of the United States, Ford would be able to live very well in the United States.
I honestly am beginning to think you're a tesla plant...
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