Are Washers Built to Break? Inside a 1984 Washer vs. Now
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- čas přidán 28. 06. 2022
- As offered and requested, I attempt to take apart 2 machines made by Whirlpool from their Clyde Ohio plant to show the differences as best I can between a modern Whirlpool Washing Machine, and an older style Kenmore-branded Washing Machine.
The teardowns didn't quite go the way I wanted them to, but hopefully, you get some ideas about the differences between these two systems. They both wash clothes, but certainly have a lot of different components involved!
Not sure which washing machine to buy? Here are a few I suggested in a previous video!
US/American Topload Washing Machines:
Speed Queen TC5003 Set: bit.ly/3NB5PQw
Amana NTW4516FW: bit.ly/3lSvsRm
Maytag MVWP575GW: bit.ly/38QtHRM
LG WT7400CW (Impeller/Washplate): bit.ly/3lQe2o6
LG WT7005CV (Agitator): bit.ly/3NJSPbI
Front-Load Washing Machines:
LG WM3400CW: bit.ly/3z11y4T
Speed Queen FF7008WN: bit.ly/38YFbCx
Combo Washer/Dryer Stacked Unit:
LG WKEX200HBA WashTower: bit.ly/38OuW3W
Affiliate Disclosure Form: bit.ly/3oXeu3B
** Links to external websites and parts may result in me receiving a commission on sales. - Jak na to + styl
When my dad died he left us instructions to buy mom a new dryer to replace their 30 yr old Kenmore. Well, mom loved her Kenmore, no way would she give it up. She passed 10 yrs after dad and that dryer was still kickin'!
The components of my top load laundry machines and drying machines are made of case hardened solid hot forged and-or hydraulic pressed stainless steel alloy. They were designed, developed, and mass produced for our military for 24-7 non-stop use to clean up everything regardless of what we throw at them (heavy all terrain military survival boots, utility belts, heavy uniforms, arctic gear clothing, rubber shoes, rugs, heavy military issued blankets, etc) and they are still as good as new and still kicking like brand new after more than 65 years. The factory making them (there are 7 of them) are still making them based on their original designs and original materials and specifications STRICTLY followed on how to make and treat these stainless steel alloy materials into components. The revolving seals are made out of metal with cross hatch precision machining after they were case hardened and annealed-tempered (no quenching). Everything about them is OLD SCHOOL engineering using an all analog mechanical and electro-mechanical controls, etc.
@@darthvader5300 what machine????
@@GraflexGuy I believe he's talking about speed queen.
@@CookieManCookies those speed queens are tanks!!
@@darthvader5300
That's awesome Darth!
Old School all the way!👍🏼😃👍🏼
My repair technician told me to buy a new washer, as replacing the circuit board would cost over 300 USD.
I did the only logical thing I could think off as hardware/firmware engineer, which was to reverse the heck out of my washing machine. Threw out the original garbage circuit board, designed my own circuit board version in Eagle cad, used only solid state relays instead of mechanical relays, ... For less than 150 USD total...
I've now an 18 year old washing machine that has WiFi, BLE and ZigBee ... It's also configured to remain in standby, until my smart meter and solar panel setup commands it to power on. Saved me a lot of money on my energy bill so far...
What brand washer is it? This is super interesting and I'd love to know more.
Market that! Sell it! Open source it.
That's awesome!
Heck yeah! I love breaking things down and trying to fix it. I learn so much. I wonder if I would have loved engineering. I always won engineering projects through out school.
@@KevinKimmich44024 +1 to selling plans or the whole thing!
My son and I completely stripped down my old mid-eighties Whirlpool washer to the bare empty frame, then rebuilt it with a new motor, clutch, switches, etc. It was a real chore, but doing so showed us just how well those things were built. The rebuild was straightforward enough, and it has been working perfectly now for years.
I'm 79 yrs old, and can remember the first Kenmore refrigerator that I bought, it had a 25 yr warranty on the compressor nothing ever went wrong on that fridge, just looked old - my 4 yr old whirlpool has had 5 new circuit boards installed to date. The cost of these 5 new boards just about would pay for that old Kenmore.... the Samsung didn't last 2 years, and no repairman would honor the warranty! I think new appliances are designed to make repair parts easier for the repairmen to replace, at about $200 per trip!
Samsung has their own contracts and will assign company to have a tech to come out for warranty work. We had a Samsung fridge go through compressor fail after a couple of years. The tech determined that he couldn't fix it and Samsung scheduled a Samsung employee to come out from New Jersey to Texas. However, they couldn't carry the refrigerant (R600a, also called isobutane) on the plane so they opted to replace it, including the cost of spoiled food. The same model was no longer available, so we got a slightly smaller model and a partial refund to compensate for the price difference.
I know people rip on Samsung appliances and service, but our experience has been good.
My 34 year old Kenmore refrigerator is still running as good as new. No problems with the original compressor. Never used a repairman. I have had to replace the door gaskets & cams, thermostat, water valves, door switch, defrost timer, compressor fan motor, ice maker control & auger motor, and water lever.
my grandparents moved the art deco westinghouse 53 fridge to the basement in 66 where it still chugs away in need of defrost to this day. the horn rimmed GE 66 replacement needs a capacitor because it hums and wont start but its been sitting there like a broken monster cadillac for several years now while the 53 westinghouse relieves for its own 50 year old replacement. my grandpa was an 09 model.
They're not easier for repairmen to replace. There's also absolutely no reason why a properly designed board would need replacing, since solid state electronics can and will last longer than their mechanical counterparts, AND they would be cheaper. Every dollar you pay over it, and every penny saved, is simply pocketed by the company. And I do mean penny for the latter, it costs almost nothing extra to make a proper reliable board. Even if it goes wrong, it costs little to have it show an error code that'd detail exactly what circuit's failed and how, and repairing it would often take the difficult, difficult task of... Swapping one (1) component on the board. This isn't some unachievable ideal, electronics in industry are almost all designed to this standard.
My moms Frigidaire fridge has been around about 30 years now!
Occasionally I do a video like that, where everything goes wrong and you wreck it in the process of trying to take it apart. But your video was absolutely fine to view.
Those pesky electrolytic capacitors on the low voltage side of the electronic power supplies fail because they have to deal with the current flowing in and out of them 10's of thousands of times a second. It means they have to be low ESR (Equivalent Series Resistance) to do the job without getting too hot. When they start failing it's an avalanche effect until they puff up or blow their top.
Their life is a LOT harder than the ones on the high voltage side which only have to deal with 120Hz ripple.
Nice to see you encouraging smaller creators! I really think this channel is an up and comer.
Totally agree. The sad part is a nice MLCC in parallel (just a few cents in bulk) would probably extend the lifetime quite significantly by reducing the ripple current of the electrolytic.
Nice to see you here, I enjoy your videos, but you'll never see this comment.
@@tonysolar284 Oh yes I will.
@@bigclivedotcom Well played. I hope you have a good day.
I'm a mechanical guy and really got tired of repairing my and my friends failing units My last purchase was a Speed Queen and I have been completely happy. USA made and it works great! Old school timers and mechanical switches work. Really folks its a washing machine not a space shuttle. KISS. "Keep it simple stupid".
ironically the first space shuttles were as advanced as a washer (from a more modern cherry picked point in time)
True words. When I have to diagnose a HVAC or washer, it always seems to be that $240 control module. Wish it was still a simple $30 electromechanical part.
Speed Queen is great if you buy their base models with the mechanical timers and switches for sure....we sold a few but many didn't want to pay that kind of money...my next washer/dryer will be a Speed Queen for sure.
A local auto detailer still uses an old Speed Queen wringer washer to wash his shop towels with, says its better than any of the newer stuff out there.
I love it haha KISS 🤘🤘I like simple old school tried and true stuff today's engineering absolutely sucks and things are way over complicated
The industry does that on purpose. They want you to replace them every 3 years and spend money on repairs. I know it's ridiculous, but that's the way they think. Ever notice how they start developing problems shortly after the 1 year warranty expires? Although LG seems to be pretty good. And Speed Queen? They're the queens of reliability now
I worked 10 years as an appliance tech in the 1980's. Working on all brands and types and I can say the reason the old stuff lasted so long is because they did not cheap out on the quality of the parts that made up the unit , The parts were usually made of that old material that manufacturers used , what was that called again ??? Ohhhh yeah Metal.
And back in the day people were willing to spend a little extra to get quality products. Today people focus on the lowest price. It used to be the higher the price the better the quality.. But now there is crap out there selling for premium prices. So consumers have to take days/weeks doing research. Not like the old days when we walked in to Sears or Montgomery Wards and just picked out a refrigerator, stove, or washer and knew it would last for 20-30 years. Greedy manufacturers working with the Chinese equals disposable garbage we have to buy again every 5 years.
@@steadyeddie7453people still are willing to spend more for quality, it's just not an option outside of the extreme premium brands.
@@steadyeddie7453 yes, I would pay more for a higher quality product, but price gets you features you never use rather than quality.
My last dishwasher broke because of the motor - searching on youtube it seemed pretty common. Apparently the thing that broke in the motor is a 1 cent part, and it would last a lifetime if it were 2 cents. Such a waste. I found a video of a guy who machined a new part. I wish I were that handy, but I'm not.
@@bobbycrosby9765 Price vs quality is rarely black and white. I agree, higher cost gets you more features. It can also get you better quality. Not everything out there is junk, but to avoid it you pay more. I was a printing press machinist for 14 years and repaired a lot of the industry equipment. Often I saw worn parts that would have lasted a lifetime if made better or differently. But... if things didn't break them parts sellers and repairmen would be in the poorhouse. Cheers
So sorry to hear of your heart condition, and I said a prayer for your health just now. I am a new subscriber, but have been seeing some of your videos over the last couple of years and have saved several of them for future reference when we need to replace appliances. I appreciate your honest approach and your candid assessments.
My grandpa had a family of eight kids and bought a Maytag washer and dryer in the 1960's. It lasted him over 45 years with just a few belts, a timing motor and one heating element.
Because it was all electromechanically run, he could keep it going without spending a lot.
May tag has been crap, in the last 25 years.
The older stuff used electromechanical parts that were easily and affordably replaceable. So now we have circuit boards and ECM control modules. Ok, not that much harder to diagnose, but what used to be a $30 electromechanical part is now a $200 circuit board.
Those pcbs automatically get replaced. Stick with a true timer switch whirlpool based unit and never have a problem.
I'm a hardware/firmware engineer, it saddens me that people believe old mechanical systems are robuuster than modern electronics.
It's not that newer electronics are less durable by design, it's that management wants everything as cheap and fast as possible. Idem for most consumers these days, who prefer cheap and affordable equipment regardless of it's apparent quality.
My washer broke a couple of years back, the repair technician told me to buy a new one as a replacement control board would cost 300USD. I reverse engineered my old washing machine, designed my own control board in eagle cad... My 18 year old washing machine has now WiFi, BLE and ZigBee... It's also configured to remain in standby, until my smart meter and solar panel setup commands it to power on. Saved me a lot of money on my energy bill so far...
The circuit boards I design for personal use (such as in my washer) will most likely outlive both new and old examples shown in this video. I avoid cheap mechanical relays and use solid state relays with a lot longer lifespan. I keep some additional headroom in voltage and current calculations, and avoid components from reaching troublesome temperatures. Somehow my 'control-board deluxe' costed me only 150USD, instead of 300USD for the 'manufacturers e-waste version'...
@@timmy7201 sounds like you may have a business to create boards for popular washers.. I’d be in to “hack” my washer.
@@toejamr1 I've had the same idea, yet a colleague warned me for possible lawsuits for copyright infringement from the big corporations. Selling custom circuit boards would also require compliance testing, which is kinda expensive...
I've thought about open-sourcing everything for free, but with a money deposit system for financial support. People can use it free of charge, on their own risk. This way I'm not selling any commercial end-product, but rather a solution to a problem. I'm just not sure if such approach is "lawsuit safe", would need a lawyer to go through all paperwork as I as a tech-person can't focus on such administrative nonsense for more than 5 minutes :-( ...
@@timmy7201 ..problem is..they are NOT cheap!..new stuff is WAYY more expensive..and not as good...we get sold "features", not quality..just give me something that washes clothes, and does so reliably, for a long time..no fancy features needed...
I bought a set of Maytags in 1976. Used them, they sat in storage for 5 years while we were in Germany. Got home, plugged them in and worked like new. In 1999 my son graduated from college and gave the set to him for his first home. The washer went for another 5 years , worked great but the tub rusted and that was it. The dryer is still going!
@Maxima I did not know that. Typical homeowner, I thought when the spin cycle finished all the water was drained out. My bad.
Was replacing the drum bearing in a Kenmore front loader. While disassembling, I noticed they had slapped the pressure sensor right next to the upper concrete weight, so when your shocks start to go out, the weight will crush the sensor rendering the washer inoperable. Pretty sleazy. I moved the sensor down lower when reassembling.
I had a thought, which is that the shocks going out could wreck the whole washer (?), so maybe they put the switch there so clueless appliance owners would call for a service tech. Like, they would get their washer serviced BEFORE it bashed itself to pieces internally. So the technician would tell them that both the shocks and switch need replacing at the same time.
@@IrenMasot it's all for parts sales. They could have easily used real shocks instead of literally a nylon washer stuffed in a plastic tube, but that would last far too long. For $140 a set, you'd expect more.
I had a Samsung with a similair sounding spectacular failure. Caused $10k in water damages. Insurance went after them and i even got my deductable back.
Would've preferred not having to replace hardwood though... It still creeks, where as it was quiet before :(
There's a Russian channel on YT he shows how to remanb those shtty "shocks". Basically relines the inner seal with a new oring and hones the cylinder with leather lol
@@aninnymoose720 sounds like you got the best outcome of that situation.
What a great video! I'm a design and test engineer for medical device companies, and anytime I need to come up with something that has to be both reliable and manufacturable, I start by looking at home appliances. Growing up, we always had GE appliances (both my parents worked for GE) and even with six kids, the washers lasted 20 years or more. I still have a GE washer, but after the first one lasted 20+ years, the second one, which while is still going, lasted only a couple years before it started not draining and throwing a "pump start" error. Turns out the pump was clogged with lint, probably a consequence of doing away with the lint trap (?).
You mentioned that you have heart failure and, unless you were joking (why would someone joke about that?), there is a device to counteract many types of cardio failures called a "Left Ventricular Assist Device" or LVAD. I used to work for the company that invented the first practical LVAD (Thoratec, now part of Abbot Labs), and the current model, called Heartmate 3, is a centrifugal pump that, in design theory, is exactly like the water pump on that newer washer. They completely eliminated shaft leaks on the pump by embedding magnets in the pump shaft, but putting the coils on the outside of the plastic housing. The Heartmate uses a magnetically transparent stainless steel, but it's built the same way for the same reason.
You might ask your cardiologist about whether an LVAD would help in your case.
Magnetic drive pumps are available in many sizes, eliminating shaft leaks and isolating the pumped liquid from any material other than the housing and impeller.
I think the GE you parents worked for was a far different company than the one today. Myself also an engineer but im profoundly baffled by all of the useless and unnecessary features that goes into todays products. Its a waching machine for goodness sake. Put the money and the effort on making it last. I have a similar approach to designs that have to last. Over size, simplify, proven. As a EE those 3 things are the foundation of a design to last. The problem with all these new features and unnecessary connectivity is your trying to sqeeze 50 cents here 25 cents there etc etc all that squeezing also squeezes the life out of the product. In some ways i feel for engineers that work in consumer appliances. Must be difficult going to work to make junk.
I had atrial fibrillation. Ablation fixed that, I got a new aortic valve, they ran that up through the vein in my thigh, and now I’m good to go!! Praise God!!
@@EfieldHfield_377 The only new technology I appreciate on clothes washers is their direct drive inverter motors, eliminating a drive belt and a clunky transmission. No friction parts except for the center bearing attaching the motor to the drum shaft. Super efficient because of magnetism, and quiet. The drawback is that it requires a power control board to drive it. Filled with electronics.
@@steadyeddie7453 As a consumer, when it comes to appliances I am willing to pay more for reliability not useless gadgets I never use. Our first washer lasted over 12 years it was designed and made to last. My last two Maytags did not last a combined 4 years. JUST UTTER JUNK. What I have learned is always get the extended warranty and nag the hell out of them anytime something goes wrong. What I have found is they will generally fix it 2 may 3 times, but by the third time they refund your money. I use that same money to buy the next. Contrary to popular belief electronics can be made reliable, again it boils down to how much cost they are trying to squeeze out of it. Generally speaking the approach for designing robust electronics is similar to robust mechanical: oversize, simplify, proven.
When I moved into the house I live in now, there was a Whirlpool Cabrio. It worked for about a month, and the little fist-sized pump that drains it started to fail intermittently. A new pump was *$180*. So I went to the used appliance store, walked up to the guy with the fewest teeth, and said "Whirlpool, direct drive, mechanical timer". His face lit up, and he sold me a battered Kenmore which is, of course, a whirlpool, for $100. It has one big motor running everything, it's noisy, but it's never broken down.
Would have been a lot smarter to replace the drain pump. They are about $15 on Ebay, Amazon, etc. All washers (and dishwashers) use the same pump and there is only a few different mounting flanges. Your new (old) washer has the exact same pump and can fail at any time for the exact same reason.
@@johncoops6897 The cabrio and the Kenmore are entirely different machines, the pumps are not the same. The Kenmore has one large motor driving a transmission, and the cabiro had two small pumps and a motor on the tub. These pumps could not be had for 15 bucks, I did check Amazon and ebay. The lowest price I found was 176.
@@Oddman1980 Yeah, companies do dumb shit to screw customers, like custom sizing of the inlets in a weird size, or odd pinouts, that kind of crap. Sometimes you can bodge a cheap replacement in, with a little know-how, but like most people feel here--and *Timmy* stated directly, the problem isn't that electronic controls don't last as long, the problem is that profit-grubbing companies use the cheapest components possible, absolutely intending that expensive parts will fail in 5-7 years, so that people are forced to replace the entire machine, or, at the minimum, pay the company a hefty additional fee for components/service.
Can't bloody wait for appliance manufacturers to get in on the licensing game. "Oh, you want the *delicates* cycle? That's another $10/year for the "Frilly Panties" add-on. Your base license only gets you cold/cold, permanent press."
Cabrio? Really?
Bought my Dad a 20-year-old used Washer and Dryer for his new (to him) house (20 years old in 1998) and they are still running today 2022. Mechanical systems in the older appliances were so much more reliable than the current integrated circuits & boards of today!
I have this pop up in my CZcams feed this morning. Just say I'm pleasantly surprised and entertained by this. The right to repair and planned obsolescence are two things that are of deep interest to me. Thanks for this video.
I worked as a appliance technician about 20 years ago. The equipment back then was so systematic. They where made to be rebuilt. I loved them. The more computers, the worse they are. Just like cars, you need them to go from point a to b. Simple task but the solution is made overly complex with unnecessary “technology “.
You only ever replaced them when the frame or skirt rusted out
New cars are much more reliable than older vehicles. They are also a little more difficult to work on.
@@PaulRudd1941 I am dead serious lmao. It's a fact, I'm not basing this off of an opinion.
@@PaulRudd1941 I'd say 2000s to present lol.
@@PaulRudd1941 All you have to do is look up how long cars used to last compared to how long they last now. All this talk about stuff used to be better is complete bull shit. People love the nostalgia but it clouds their judgement.
It's really funny to see this video. I have a "matched pair" of washer and drier shown at the start with the black gage cluster and the white bodies. I got the Kenmore set (whirlpool) from Sears in 1984 and they are my weekly cleaning machines. I don't think mine are as rusted up as the one in this video, but I've never had to take them apart to look. Still run fine after 38 years. I also got my Kenmore refrigerator (whirlpool 106) that same year and it turned 38 years old in March. It has had some issues, but I have been able to fix them myself. Lets not forget the Kenmore (whirlpool) dishwasher that's in that same 38 year time frame. You are right when you said that "they don't make them like they used too". Maybe if they killed off all the "venture capitalists" things might get back to normal.
..it's the Government, too, with all their stupid regulations..and all the suckers who think they have to have the latest gadget on everything..I mean, really..a Tablet or a TV on a refrigerator?....
Eh, VC somewhat. But I trace it back to all of the MBAs that graduated in the late 80s/early 90s--the first generation of folks who started introducing spreadsheet software into every single facet of business, with the focus of saving/extracting evey last cent possible. All of the sudden it was possible and cheap to figure out how to super-optimize every single department, process, supply chain, etc. Made a few people really wealthy. Not sure did anything positive for society.
As far as regulation, sure some are excessive and annoying. Maybe we could eliminate some if we invested more in education in general. But most regulations there's a number of families behind them missing their loved ones every Christmas because some cheap-ass executive wanted to take a short cut. I'm happy to deal with some inconvenience to prevent that from happening.
@@jacobyunderhill3999 spreadsheets are good if they're used for good reasons and not just capitalism™ "make more money,
@@webmasale Making money is the entire fucking point of a business, and of the employees filling the jobs it creates. It's not evil, doing unethical things in the pursuit of that goal is.
@@jacobyunderhill3999 As we older electricians say, the NEC and Fire codes have been written in blood.
I run a set of Whirlpool laundry systems that were built in 1971, and are avocado green. Other than a pump, water valve, and a wig-wag, the washer is original. Other than drum rollers and a belt, the dryer is original. They work well, and are run 2-3 times a week. I love watching your stuff, here.
Have you ever read the book 'The Wastemakers' by Vance Packard? He was years ahead of his time and in 1960 was writing about how manufacturers were using 'planned obsolescence' as a part of their products. 60 years later most of what he was predicting was uncannily accurate!
We have become a disposable society. Ever since we went offshore for cheap manufacturing we no longer fix things. Remember Radio Shack? My first flatscreen tv was a 50" plasma for $5,300. A 50" can go for as little as $600 now. We have been conditioned to buy cheap garbage, and when it breaks we toss it and buy another one. China appreciates all our US dollars. Thanks for the book tip. I added it to my list.
I hope you out last all of the machines you fix! But if not you'll be leaving good quality work for people behind. That's something to be proud of!
@OneDayAfterAnother No ones making it off this earth alive.
@@jneusbaum3697 I’m gonna die on the moon. Checkmate dummy
I have that same old Kenmore, bought it 20 years ago, still runs perfect.
Me too!
Me too!
Never get rid of her! I got a Whirlpool from 1996 direct drive, same as this Kenmore. Beast. Absolute beast.
I have a Maytag washer and Kenmore dryer which my parents brought in 1984. They became mine in 2015. Both are have been and are heavily used and still going strong. The only repair made was the lint screen needing to be replaced after mishandling. The older machines are superior and as long as I can get parts, I will never replace them.
@@Goldenwoodz - I have a 1990 Kenmore - aside from replacing the agitator dogs and disabling the lid lock, it runs as new - i believe one saving grace is that my washer and dryer are located inside my home, in a ac laundry room - and i do not overload it ever - 32 years of hard work - (praise be to the Kenmore gods) - lol
My main issue with the new machines is the fact that they run everything from a single control board. That means if it overfills, that board is bad. If it won't start, that board is likely bad. If the motor will not get power, that board is likely bad, etc. On the older style of machines everything was split into cheaper parts. Making you able to change exactly which part of the machine that went bad such as the pressure control, or timer.
They also don't use longer lasting components to counter using a single control board. Liquid caps don't last as long as solid caps. They use cheaper relays that will fail. That wouldn't be as big of an issue if they used many boards.
Buying overbuild motherboards for my PC's has been a money saver in the long run. With the OS tied to it, the PC is essentially gone if that dies. I haven't had one die yet.
The same thing is happening to the HVAC trade. Eliminating contactors, capicators, and basic on/off motors. Switching over to Variable freq drive type garbage. So the $79 basic rescue motor is now $450 - $750 cost. Plus installation. Shits outta hand.
But it does help with troubleshooting when there are only 2 boards and one is the display driver. A GE Profile I worked on kept getting a "clutch error", service code E6. Turned out to be in the programming on the main PC board. When I changed the cycle from Whites/Heavy duty to any of the other 6 choices the machine ran fine. Wasn't worth spending $300 for a new board.
When considering the relative costs of appliances way back in the day, i.e. the ancient fridge you talked about at the end, they were very expensive. The quality was top notch but so was the price. People lament that things aren't built as good as they used to be but, actually, they are but you have to pay the same relative price to get that old school level of quality which nobody wants to do. That said, I have no plans on replacing my Kenmore (i.e. Whirlpool) washer and dryer set from, guessing, the late 80s. Everything is easily and economically replaceable, even for a dunce like me. They were ancient when I got them in 2012 and still going strong. Probably out live me.
There’s also survivorship bias. Us young people today only see the stuff that managed to survive. We don’t see all the crap that didn’t survive so it looks like old stuff is made better.
Yeah, there is still stuff that at least lasts better than the cheapest stuff... like Miele. Often it costs like 2-4x more though.
@James Sheppard Look up survivor bias. You seem to have completely misunderstood what it is...
@James Sheppard Also the first electric fridge was made in 1913. People in the 50's had access to fridges, even cheap ones.
@James Sheppard imagine arguing *against* the concept of survivorship bias... my god, education has failed these humans
I'm in appliance repair, and I would take a older unit over a new one any day.
DITTO!!!
Me too. I have direct drive maytags I'll keep as long as i can. I sale used appliances and really only like to sale the old dd styles
They wash better than the new units anyway.
Until the power bill comes
@@snoochpounder I'd rather pay $8 extra a month to power. When you call me to repair your 3 year old machine you're gonna pay me $130 labor plus parts and then in 2 more years youll just buy another $800 machine.
I have an old Kenmore top loader washer from about 1984. The only problem I ever had from it was the agitator wasn't spinning the tub. I ended up buying the clutches for dirt cheap from my local Sears when they were still around. Still running like a champ.
BOOM!! Bought mine in 1989, and it is still kicking! Replaced the dogs for the agitator. I rue the day I have to replace it!!!
What the !@#$ are you talking about? The agitator never spins the tub.
@@erossinema8797 Yeah, I misspoke. Why don't you take it down a notch, guy? No one's impressed.
i think we have one from that time period . i have had it where it would not spin , but it doesnt happen very often .
A friend of mine gave me a 1980s Kenmore washer/dryer set 10 years ago because they were so old. I'm still using them. I've never had to fix or replace any part on them.
Thank you for restoring my sanity with this video! Our 8 year old Maytag impeller washer recently began screeching during spin cycles. It was obvious that the drum shaft bearings had failed in the transmission. A little research (including the video you mentioned from Steve) and I thought “wow, this transmission replacement should be a piece of cake. The bearings are internal to the transmission so I’ll just pop in a new assembly!” Famous last words. Just removing the impeller plate took over an hour of pulling and prying to separate the plastic splines from the rusted steel shaft. Once that was done, I told my wife that the hard part was over and I’d have the machine up and running in short order. I removed the drum retainer which took another 30 minutes as it, too, was jammed on the rusted splines. Of course, the drum was equally jammed on the rusted shaft, and even using the popular 2x4 and car jack method to try to pull the drum off the shaft -after two hours it became fully seized on the rusted splines and I could only ever get the top of the drum bore to move as far as the top of the rusty shaft before the stainless steel drum deformed from the excessive force. If I could do it all over again, I would grind off the rusty splines so that the shaft could pass more easily through the drum bore. I have repaired all of my appliances for decades and never had so much trouble on what should be an easy repair. The saddest part is that the machine appears to be designed for relatively easy repairs but if it’s been in service for a while, then the shaft corrosion may put a damper on any plans for an easy tranny swap. In the end, this 8 year old Maytag was beyond economical repair. A new washer was delivered two days ago -which is exactly what the appliance makers have planned for all along. Arghhhh….
Great video Ben! As an appliance flipper I have an old matching Kenmore Elite set in my own laundry room. Pristine. They still have the blue film on the consoles!! As long as parts are available they will be in service
Neutral drain kits were not available about a year and a half ago. I'm now sitting on 20...Nyaa! Nyaa!
@@obsoleteprofessor2034 I have a stash of those myself
On the old style machines, you do not have to remove the inner tub to remove the transmission since the spin tube is a separate piece. You just have to remove the agitator and 3 transmission bolts under the machine and it will slide out. On the new ones, the spin tube is built into the transmission which means you have to remove the inner tub and drive block to pull the transmission out of the washer.
Yet another so-called “innovation” to deliberately make maintaining/repairing them pure hell.
I can remember growing up that my parents only had Kenmore washers and dryers. My first recollection was an avocado green pair from the late 60's. Those two machines lasted until the early 80's when they bought a new set which you showed in the video (the machines with the black control panels). Those two machines lasted quite a while. I grew up and was out of the house when they eventually replaced the two "newer" Kenmores. I do believe they replaced them with the "old" unit that you tore down in the video. Kenmore washers were solid machines. That's all my parents had. Those machines were damn near bullet-proof. I can not say that any washer made in the last two decades can really match up with the quality and durability of the Kenmore machines from the 60s thru the 90's. Those machines from that era were really built to last. Is anything these days built to last? It doesn't seem so. Great video. Loved how the old and new tech were exposed. Clearly from this video, you can see that the Kenmore machine with its heritage going back to the 80's was built like a tank compared to the newer whirlpool. Thanks for posting this video!
I have that exact Kenmore washer. Bought it in 2002. It saw 4 sons through HS and still washes for two of us and 3 of them - who work in dirty jobs. Lots and lots of hard washing, normally about 5-7 loads a week. Still works great after a few small repairs along the way. Biggest one was the cams in the agitator. Had it apart last year to replace the mixing valve. That's it for repairs. I'm not looking forward to when I may need to replace it, I know I'll never find anything that will do as well.
Mine has gone through 6 kids and is still going strong. We had the same repairs as well as we replaced a rusty drum. But this thing is awesome!
Bought a Whirlpool top-loader probably around 1990 & its only had one issue: a leaky trany while under warranty. Since then no issues whatsoever. My neighbor bought a front-loader Maytag recently that the main ecb died on & was told was too expensive to replace. It's ridiculous that no one repairs these ecbs & what the manufacturers get for them.
Used to rebuild those Whirlpool washers at the appliance shop....loved working on them, they were simple, easy to fix, and parts are very reasonable. Only had a few transmission issues, and kept a spare transmission on the shelf so we had one in stock all the time as it seemed to take forever to get a replacement when needed. Most times it wasn't the transmission itself but the clutch assembly that would fail, also an easy repair, and very reasonably priced. These were the machines we'd rebuild and resell and we'd sell several a week, people love them because they work, they do a great job, and handle the heavier loads that many people run through their machines.
I think your videos are informative AND entertaining. Really appreciate the effort with all the special effects and close ins. I've been in this trade for 20 years and am starting to slow it down now, But even still I find that this old hand can still learn a thing or two.
Sorry to hear about your heart issues, Ben. I have inoperable heart disease so can relate on some level. If you can help your situation through diet and exercise, I'd recommend it. You look too young to be having trouble with the ticker.
Really like your channel..tons of good info and from your regular posters too is icing on the cake. Great discovery.
Best ✌️👍🙏
One thing that is often overlooked with the statement "they don't build things like they used to" is that they don't cost what they used to, either. From the 1985 Sears catalog (the same "$170 less" page shown in the video), that washer was on sale for $329.99. That's $946 in 2022. But that's discounted by $100, which would make the "regular" price $1233 in 2022 dollars.
The modern washer is just over half that price. Some of that price saving is in using components that don't last as long. A better capacitor might add a dollar to the price. A better relay, maybe two. Do that for a dozens of tiny components, and now you have a machine that's $100 more, but functions identically to the cheaper one for the first few years. Between two otherwise identical appliances, one with a 1-year warranty (Whirlpool's current warranty length), and one $100 more with a 5-year warranty, most will go for the cheaper model, so that's what companies make.
The average consumer ONLY cares about price. Brand loyalty used to be a thing, but now it really isn't. If you asked today's consumer if they'd pay double for something that lasts 5 times as long, they'd say "yes", but if you put those two items on a shelf, they'll buy the cheaper one. This is mostly because they don't research their purchases any more. My mother would read reviews and had a subscription to Consumer Reports. Now people just buy the cheapest model. This is also why China has more new millionaires per year than any other country.
Also, you have to take into account survivorship bias.
There was a lot of crap sold in the 50s-80s. But most of that crap has mercifully landfilled by now. The same has yet to happen to the crap of today.
@@hexane360 "has yet to happen"? I throw away appliances every year. Some small, some large. The only appliance I've bought in the last 20 years that hasn't been replaced is my Dyson vacuum. It's an original DC07.
@@aaronbritt2025 Brand loyalty doesn't exist anymore because brand reputation is no longer something that the manufacturers are concerned with. They have the machines made with the cheapest parts. Some of that is consumers' desire for lower prices but it started with the manufacturers maximizing profit.
And quite frankly I wouldn't believe the "lasts twice as long" claim.
Given the choice there's enough people to buy the more expensive one that will last longer
Whoa boy, this brings back memories. Back in 2005-2007 I worked with my older brother at a locally owned furniture/appliance business that heavily featured Maytag products (their main manufacturing facility was about 30 miles away at the time). They had recently purchased Magic Chef appliances, and some genius decided it would be a good idea to basically combine a Magic Chef washer with a Maytag one to replace the old "Dependable Care" units that people loved and were pretty much indestructible. These things were an absolute horror show, and we had many, MANY irate customers who had "updated" from an old Dependable Care model to the new model, only to have it self-destruct within months. We picked up one unit where somehow the wash basin had detached from the frame during the spin cycle and it looked like a someone had bashed it in with a sledgehammer. Then there were the "new" Maytag front-load washers (that I think were actually made by Samsung?) that sometimes walked all the way across the basement and caused the entire house to shake like there was an earthquake... Yup things aren't made like they used to be!
Sorry, I found "that sometimes walked all the way across the basement and caused the house to shake like there was an earthquake" absolutely comical.
I had a washing machine that broke, the house I bought came with one like 10yrs newer. That broke too, I went to fix it only to realize they were exactly the same machine so between the two I made one work!
I liked my old washer where i could run the spin 3x and the clothes were so nearly dry, they barely needed any drying time, makes laundry day go much faster.This video is amazing thanks for sharing this information!!!
The transmission drive (for those who think plastic/phenolic gears are weak) resembles another machine with cockroach life expectancy: Pull the timing cover off of a 300 inline 6 Ford, and you will find this EXACT setup! Phenolic cam gear and metal crank gear.
So long as torque is kept under control, nylon gears work well, even when meshed with metal, and are more tolerant of degraded lubricant, allowing for much reduced maintenance. Heat is a big factor that can degrade nylon gears, so some thermal protection is necessary for long life.
Pull the cover off your garage door opener. You are going to find phenolic gears.
I put 400.000 miles on one of those 300" straight 6 Ford engines and the only thing that Wasn't worn out when we pulled it apart was the cam timing gears. We .040 overed the cylinders and threw it back together with a new cam and gear set and pistons. It should go another 400k with no problem. I only changed the gears because I was replacing the cam.
I've seen those plastic gears completely gone
I replaced a bad graphite bearing in a dishwasher pump with a nylon drill bushing. It lasted over two years before the nylon actually wore the stator shaft to the point that that it would no longer sit straight on the housing.
That Kenmore is so similar to mine. I've had to replace the springs, inlet and outlet hoses, clutch, and agitator dogs, but it's still kicking. Bought it new in 2005, and hope it lasts another 15 years.
Another factor to consider when bemoaning the fragility of newer washers is the Energy Star requirement. In order to score well on the Energy Star scale, newer washers have to use DC motors which in turn require electronic controls to facilitate agitation, and the drag caused by drive train components can be reduced by using more plastic vs steel. The result is a washer that will last maybe six or seven years, if lucky.
So what good are energy savings if you have to replace the damn thing every few years?
@@WhittyPics If they calculated the energy costs of manufacturing a new washer it wouldn't be very efficient. But they don't. Just more planned obsolescence.
@@WhittyPics , exactly as mentioned in the video. You can save about $50 but that's a drop in the bucket for the short period the new ones last. And if you have to start replacing control boards, every single penny of that savings has just gone out the window. Those things are pricey.
@@WhittyPics woah woah woah woah woah woah woah woah wrongthink detected you cannot question the experts or else you are committing both wrongthink and misinfromation.
@@jadedandbitter why would they calculate the costs of making a new one? they are saving the environment, nothing matters when they try to do that!!! who cares if its a _little bit more_ pollution and waste than before at least they are saving the environment. saving the environment is a good thing therefore they are good, questioning this is VERY BAD. *Mouth Mohels* are gross and should be banned because it is fundamentally and morally wrong to perform a circumcision with the mouth.
The Kenmore/WP Series 90 (or really any of those era Kenmore/WP machines) machines are my absolute favorite. Best balance of features and durability. I’ve refurbished 3 washers and a series 80 dryer because I like them so much. Running a Series 90 W/D for my house now.
Over the years I've repaired several washers and dryers. Not as my job, just end user fixing things. I learned a couple of tidbits from this video to tuck away in case i need them. Thanks.
I have a 30+ year Kenmore and still running with her matching Dryer.
My 1983 Maytag is running great which we bought new. All we ever replaced is one drive belt and water input solenoid. The old Maytag has a front panel that is held by two Philips screws that you can get to most of the parts. My brother in law has one from the 70's which he is still using. They don't make them like they used to.
My Kenmore washing machine is from 1971.
It came to me after 15 years from a 4 kids family. Since then, its run 2x per week. Still works fine.
The dryer is GE from1963 I’ve overhauled it once. Basically new belts, oil its bearings and vacuum it out every year or so.
Thanks for the incredible amount of time and effort it must have taken to make this Outstanding video!
My mother has a Maytag washer that she bought new in 1974. Only repairs it needed in 48 years was two belts.
Shocking that the newer machine welded itself together in just FOUR YEARS. I understand the manufacturing simplicity of the control design to save perhaps 90% in assembly costs, but I cannot imagine any cost saving that would explain the transmission failure. There's a CZcams channel (Rose Anvil) that bandsaws boots in half to examine their construction. That would have been interesting here.
I'll do that at some point for sure
As a (former) appliance repair tech, I can say that the materials used on the transmission shafts of older machines vs newer machines leaves a HELL of a lot of room for rust or galvanic corrosion between the drive block and the drive shaft/spin tube. It probably saves the manufacturer less than a dollar per unit produced, but costs the consumer hundreds on repairs that go awry when machines won't cooperate in disassembly.
This made me smile ! I have a fully working 1976 Maytag washer and dryer....have a much newer Amana pair at second place,....which have needed water valves and door switches after a few years. also the body is very cheap, thin metal and bends just sliding it around. The older Maytag's were definitely built simply, with quality components and last decades,...50 years plus in my case!
I happen to be using an old Maytag set from at least 30 years ago. They're rough, but they work each and every time. I have a video replacing the rollers on the dryer in my playlists.
Definitely interested in the vintage GE fridge 👌 videos.
Bought an LG fridge in 2018 without thinking much about it, I figured they seem like a solid company so why not try it out. To date it’s broken down three times now.
@@JT-mt6ku The 1947 Frigidaire I bought 10 years ago still works perfectly.
Me too! That's the same exact fridge my parents had when I was growing up. Sometime in the mid-sixties, it got demoted to the basement for beer-cooling duty. When my parents split up in the late eighties, the old girl was donated to the local JayCees. Not sure how long it lasted from there -- maybe it's still going. Seems like those old fridges, once they made it thru the first few years, they would run forever!
Thank you sir I appreciate it and you have a great speaking voice very clam and peaceful learned alot.
My parents had a washer and dryer from 1978 that they used up until 2016 - just replacing small parts here and there. Pretty amazing.
Thank you Ben. I really like your videos and desperately need your opinion and knowledge with appliances.
Just the best video on this subject/content on CZcams..Thank you..
Awww thanks
When I worked at the appliance shop several years ago, one of the many jobs I had on the side from scheduling service calls was rebuilding Whirlpool washers and dryers...why? Everybody wanted them. We had a few people come in for a new washer/dryer, but most wanted their old ones fixed because they worked so much better. We had people move to the area that traded in their newer stuff for older stuff because the new stuff didn't work as well, and they got tired of the repair bills. We have a lot of dairies where I live, they tend to go through washing machines pretty frequently. Usually they would bring in a machine once a month to have it rebuilt. One of the dairies decided to buy one of those new agitaterless washers...about 3 days later the owner of the dairy called and said he was pretty agitated with that new agitaterless machine LOL. It didn't clean nearly as well, and often took several attempts to get the stupid thing to even start a cycle. Needless to say that machine ended up back at the shop and they went back to the old school washers with an agitator and that only took a few minutes to replace the motor to transmission coupler and get it going again.
All that electronic garbage in these new machines shortens their lives drastically. When that control board fails that costs $200-400, why would a customer pay that much for a control board when the washer was only $300-400 to begin with...so they go buy another one. Those control boards fail more frequently than not, charging a customer an hourly labor fee to remove the board, replace whatever component(s) that failed, then reinstalling it doesn't make any sense....sure the part might be $5, but the labor involved in tearing the washer apart, diagnosing it, then desoldering and soldering on the new component(s) adds up, and most times when one thing on those boards fail it'll take out others too. A mechanical timer is much more reliable and has a much lower failure rate, as does all those other mechanical settings, as opposed to everything on that 1 board where if one thing fails the whole washer is useless...many times one of those mechanical switches fails, the machine is still usable, minus that one setting. We had a lot of customers with 30+ year old washers and dryers that would elect to have a faulty timer replaced, long before they'd ever consider buying a new machine.
A drain pump replacement on a Whirlpool/Kenmore machine is a 5-10 minute job. We replaced a lot of electronic drain pumps, lots of transmission controls, control boards (not just in washers and dryers but in refrigerators and ovens as well). My 30 year old GE range still works great, it don't have a single electronic component, all the controls are manual switches.
Those new energy saver washers don't save any energy at all, you end up having to wash the same load of laundry twice or sometimes three times to get them clean, you waste more water and electricity than if you would have just washed them in an old washer once...same goes for the dryers. That auto dry feature never works like its advertised to do, you end up repeating a drying cycle just to get the clothes dry, the sensor thinks that one thing that contacted it was dry, but in reality the whole load is still wet.
A lot of refrigerators now use multiple control boards, the main control board where power comes in, is one of the huge failures we see. Power surge will knock them out. It got to the point where our service tech kept a soldering iron and fuses with him because that's all that would fail typically was a 5 cent fuse...the stupid control board itself was several hundred dollars, and oftentimes took a few days to get...well that's one time where a fix like that was great, kept the customer from loosing several hundred dollars in food from a non-working refrigerator all for a 5 cent fuse....completely ridiculous design...should have a resettable circuit breaker, or an easily replaceable fuse instead of a soldered on board fuse. LG being the biggest culprit it seemed.
I can't tell you how much I miss my Sears Lady Kenmore set from 1990. They were totally bomb ass -- never any problems for 14 years
The city where I grewup Sears had huge appliance store and I also worked at a shop where we repaired also sold reconditioned washer and dryers !
"people come in for a new washer/dryer, but most wanted their old ones" great stuff
@@hardrays We sold more rebuilt old washer/dryer units than we sold new. Proves the new stuff ain't that great, and when you combine it with nonsense electrics it makes something as simple as washing your clothes impossible when a circuit board says oh no you don't LOL.
Great video. Appreciate all the effort in the comparison between the two machines.
thanks. Nice video showing the differences even though it did not work out as you had planned. nice work!
I don't have the data to prove it but it seems to me the newer HE machines don't save you enough money to offset the cost of replacing them so often, as compared to the older and repairable machines that you'll have for 20+ years.
For toploaders it's probably right due to the massive hit on reliability. Front loads are generally a bit more reliable and efficient and probably are efficient enough to save a little money. The same probably is not quite true for refrigerators though because of how much electric old ones use.
@@bensappliancesandjunk Isn't it only when refrigerators starting adding automatic defrosting in the late 50's-early 60's that fridges became energy hogs? Some of those late 40's GM Frigidaire models with the "Meter-Miser" are comparable to modern units.
@@ashleyhathaway8548 I can investigate that in a few weeks. But the defrost mode usually introduces about 400w of heat to melt the ice, but only for 20-30min. That is not a lot in the overall scheme of a refrigerator, as a modern refrigerator runs on about 150-200w of electric constantly, if that. I'll look at my 1948 GM vs. a 2022 French Door then maybe a few others that I have from the early 2000s.
Yup - not to mention the massive environmental hit of not recycling them into squat and of the energy/resources of building + shipping them all every 1-3 years.
Great video all around, but special props for quoting "of whom much is given, much more will be expected".
My family has a fleet of 5 or so Maytag washer and dryers my grandfather and dad have kept running for 50 years. We just bought a new Maytag washer and dryer, and while I love the high efficiency and tech, the lid lock has already failed on my 1.5 month old unit, making it worthless for nearly 3 weeks. That bullshit component alone has me somewhat regretting not getting a speed queen instead.
A very good breakdown on electrical systems. This is true in ALL applications and tech. As a device gets smaller and more features the worse it is to try and find a issue on tiny components for repair.
I never knew I'd watch this type of video start to end. Like, I don't even have a washer.
Thanks for such a quality product, I really enjoyed it.
Love those old style washing machines. Haven't bought a new washing machine in over 30 years. When I'm driving and see an old one on the curb. I'll pull over, and tilt it so I can see underneath. If it looks to be in good, and all there and not rusty I'll load it on my Truck. Parts for the old washers aren't expensive, and a lot of them are still available. For the price of a new washer, what ever you save on electricity is lost in replacement. Get another green got you.
7:00 you can totally bypass the lid lock. I did it on mine, just instead of cutting the wires just cut off the tab that actually locks the lid. The washer still thinks it's locked.
I feel like that's fair game for all the times I lost a sock in the washer
I wouldn’t play around with something like that. Should put a *try at your own risk* kind of thing
@@jimhill6586 no one said you were, stupid 5 year old
@@IntelliPocalypse if you aren't an idiot you shouldn't have any troubles after removing the lid lock. If anything you will realize how much easier everything is without one.
@@nigyouknowwhatcomesnext3886 how is it easier? I just put in my clothes and forget about them
Thanks for showing me the components on my washing machine (the older style). It started to wobble more now... So I gotta take it apart to fix that. Shouldn't be too difficult thanks to you. Either way... Some common sense would of guided me since it's straight forward stuff for me. Thanks for the tear down as well. You got yourself a new subscriber. Cheers 😊
As a washing machine repair guy with 38 years experience, I offer this point of view. In the 80s and earlier the cost to buy appliances, washing machines, refrigerators ect was an ENORMOUS undertaking. Therefore spending a 1/4 or 1/2 the valve of that appliance was the sensible thing to do. In the past I had customers that happily owned a washing machine for 20 or 30 years,,,, proudly telling me that their prized washing machine only had the pump replaced 3 X , the gearbox and motor replaced only once each oh yeah also had the timer mechanism replaced twice,,, “but it still works “
Here’s the thing, each repair in today’s dollars $$$ was a large percentage of the cost of a new washing machine.
So I ask what’s better value ? Spending the equivalent of the cost of a new machine to repair an old one (in today’s dollars) to keep a washing machine lasting 30 years, or buy a new washing machine every 8 or 9 years???
The wash up (excuse the pun) is washing machines have ALWAYS BROKEN, it’s just a fact of anything mechanical or electrical, the difference is , back then it was unaffordable to buy a new washing machine, and now days it’s so so cheap in comparison to buy a new washing machine.
I would like to see you get your hands on a Maytag top loader from the 1980s with the helical drive transmission. Magnificently simple and durable machines.
It would be a short video, as you say, magnificently simple.
I inherited one of these (& dryer) the only failure I have had (I should say, the only failure this machine ever had) is the timer discs wearing out in the washing machine (it was used daily for most of its early years). And surprisingly, I could still get a genuine maytag part for only about $64cdn, not bad for a 30+ year old machine.
If anything is going to do it in, it'll be rust as with the machine in the video, not from leaks but the humidity/condensation that occurs during normal use.
@@alexb.1320 Mine is 40 years and still running like a champ.
@@alexb.1320 My co-worker has a matched set but they're the puke green color right out of the 70's LOL.
@@wildbill23c Ah, flashback Avacado. No question what era you are in when you see that color. =-)
@@JohannnesBrahms My grandfather has at least 4 sets (also 40+ years old) that various members of my family use. On the rare occasion they fail, my grandfather takes them apart and figures out the issue. My dad then gets on eBay and purchases the part, then my grandfather gets it running again.
Our new Samsung washer got a stuck hot water valve inside just after the 1 year warranty was up. They Samsung dryer has trouble doing one thing: Drying anything. The moisture sensor doesn't work right so it NEVER fully dries anything. I would never buy a Samsung washer/dryer again. I miss my old Maytag Neptune series.
Samsung appliances are poorly designed and support is terrible. I also own a Samsung washer and dryer and will never buy a Samsung appliance again. The Kenmore set I bought in 97 and used almost 20 years was much better. My mother in law is still using the dryer. A coworker has also sworn she will never buy from them either after her very expensive fridge didn't last more than 3 years.
Never ever buy a Samsung or lg appliance.
We had to rebuild after a tornado and had all Samsung appliances. In 5 years I went through two condenser fans in the fridge, the over the stove microwave gave up the ghost, the relay controlling the heating elements in the oven shorted out and sent 220 bolts to the PCM/PCB and set it on fire, while I was trying bake a pizza, and replaced the heating element, element housing, thermostats, thermistor, high limit switches…. I had the dryer cabinet apart so many times that the sheet metal screws didn’t want to work anymore. I finally gave up on it when the PCB started started circling the drain.
Have Maytag non smart washer and dryer and replaced the Samsung appliances in the kitchen with whirlpool.
The dishwasher is an LG and I’ve had to replace the entire bottom end because the sump pump cracked and it threw a code. So I ordered the complete sump, pump, and motor assembly off Amazon and replaced it.
I’m a CZcams certified home appliance repair man.
Check your dryer vent. And not just behind the dryer. If you can access where it vents outside make sure it is opening all the way. If you can’t get to that then call a dryer vent cleaning company. That will most likely help with the drying.
@@jmcurleypoker mayby he has one that vents to the room instead
Around 2000, my family bought a set of used machines from a thrift store. The washer cleaned everything you could throw at it, and the lint filter was amazing. These were already 15 years old when we bought them and we put another decade on them. I really miss the washer lint filter.
When my parents bought our old house back in 2000. They bought a washer and dryer new. They lasted all the way up to 2015. Every washer and dryer after that broke. One washer only lasted a few years before it would constantly lose balance. No matter what it would lose balance. They bought a new dryer and after a year stop heating. I had to repair one dryer for them last year.
I used to work for Part Select. I retired last year - one year after Steve did. Steve Ash stars in the videos that the company has on their web site on how to do repairs. I could always tell the newer videos from the older ones because Steve has less hair in the newer ones, and what he does have is more white. (I have all my hair; but it's completely white, so there is that.) It's a small town and the videos used to be made in the basement of the call centre that was owned by the company which owns the Part Select brand, so you tend to see the same faces for many years. Good video, except that you don't mention the direct-drive washing machines. They don't use belts. I don't know what is the difference in operation (speed, etc) between belt-driven washers and direct drive; but I know how to fix one having spent so long selling parts for them. Thank you for doing this one.
Some of the belt drive units tend to spin slightly faster, but the speed selector usually fails in them, quite a common repair it seemed when I worked for an appliance shop. The common repair on the direct drive Whirlpool stuff was the coupler between the motor and transmission, and lid switches because people slam the lids down on them all the time.
@@muziklvr7776 , thanks! Really enjoying mine. Would totally recommend it. :)
Before I was born the parents purchased our property in the 90s and it had a mid 1970s GE Heavy Duty Filter-Flo top loader washer. We replaced everything over the years, including literally tearing the house down, but we kept the layout of the basement, and in it, the GE Filter-Flo. Yup, thing survived a change of owners, house demolition, years of abuse washing heavy soppy towels and rugs, and keeps banging clanging and rocking away. Very loud especially in full spin with its classic clack clack clack but never once broke down. Ironically we've replaced two "newer" washers in the same time that sit next to it.
You make such complete videos, very thankful. I was saddened in your intro when you mentioned your heart condition 😢 May God bless you, brother xxx 😘 Much love from Longueuil, Canada 🇨🇦
Repair tech here, the thing that killed appliances in general were the energy star requirements put into place. They required manufacturers to use less water and electricity which inevitably forced them to redesign perfect units.
Car world sounds like that
I think it was more of a “mutual exploitation of the intent” type of deal, but yes.
@@d.p.9567 I am driving a 2002 Honda Civic. It has 104,000 miles on it. My first car was a Ford Maverick. That had 100,000 miles on it. You could get in my Honda and drive it across the country without a problem. The Ford maverick had shot piston rings rust holes in the floor, terrible fuel economy, Oil leaked everywhere. We have to stop pretending old cars were great. I grew up driving cars from the 60s and 70s yes they were easier to work on. But they had to be. The cars today if you actually maintain them have three times the lifespan. They will certainly go three times the miles.
You have heart failure? That's a bum deal. I know you have to play the hand you're dealt, but it really sucks that life isn't fair. Well, good for you by doing good with your time and helping people with educational videos.
Excellent video! You look quite sharpe in technician dress and your technical acumen and insightful analysis are even sharper. Subscribed.
Great video. Thanks was interesting to watch. In my OLD washing machine pre 1984 that is still working now I had one problem that the motor coupler broke and I had to replace it. Sear had a GREAT CZcams explaining how to do the job and it worked. Took about twice as long, about 2 hours, but worked and for around $10 I got the machine working again. I wish you would describe the comparison of this part which seems to be relatively simple to repair item. Thanks again for your great video.
I’d take that Kenmore Direct Drive washer anyday over a new one. I have a beautiful 1996 Whirlpool version of this Kenmore and still runs awesome!! We love it, nothing cleans better from today’s market or form the last decade since HE corrupted the industry. Speed Queen and all the older machines clean just as good as these Whirlpool made direct drives. Badass washer!!
Worth noting, $330/430 in 1985 (the sale/MSRP price listed in the SEARS Catalog that you showed on screen) is equivalent to $930/1200 in 2022 dollars. A random low end top-loading Whirlpool is $550/750 (at the time of this comment, which is effectively what my apartment washer is). That's a ~$400-500 base savings for a product that is vastly more intelligent (self-rebalancing is amazing), quieter, has more than twice the tub capacity, uses less detergent, and, as discussed in the video less water and vastly less electricity (90-95% less????).
The energy cost for the 1985 washer is quoted at $67 ($188!! 2022 dollars) vs $30!! in the energy star guide.
I get people love when their confirmation bias about things lasting longer is true, but it's as or more important to consider the actual progress that's been made. As for electric components failing, fundamentally there's nothing stopping companies from using correctly sized components. It's like LED bulbs being run way over spec (thanks Big Clive for that information!), it's an unfortunate decision by companies but that doesn't mean incandescent bulbs are better (I mean, I still love them, but I love my lights that change color and dim through the day infinitely more).
I agree 100%
You aren't really saving money on the older system even if the new one doesn't last as long.
It’s even more apparent when you look at cars. In the 50s, aka “the golden era of the American car”, you’d be lucky if it lasted more than 5 years without rusting though. The designs were pretty snazzy though, most likely as a form of compensation as well lol
I'm an automotive technician so the car thing I understand completely. Old cars look nice and are easy to work on but that doesn't off-set the many many negatives that come with old cars.
Well researched, peoples rose coloured glasses view of history is amazingly short sighted
Incandescent bulbs _are_ better at accurate color reproduction. Most crap LEDs have bad tint and poor CRI
This was a really fantastic analysis. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
Thanks for all your hard work making this video.
We had a Maytag set from the 60's and decided to leave it at our old house when we moved in 2010 to our new place. The only thing I ever did with the old Maytags was belts. There was a lot of washing done with those machines. But we left em and bought a set of these garbage Whirlpools. They are not efficient at all. No matter what I do, I can't stop the washer from banging around during the cycle and the clothes come out wet. The dryer takes forever of course with wet clothes. There is no function on the Whirlpool to spin again like on the old Maytag...you could let it finish its cycle and go reset it to spin again. We should have taken our old machines to the new house. This new stuff is trash.
Try going to a pawn shop and getting an old one like that. Can't be more than 150$.
Doing a old vs new washer comparison...and you use a 2002 vs 2017. Even though the 2002 may have several design similarities , But there are definitely some build quality differences. I've tinkered with old Washing machines from the 70's and 80's and they are more durable and easier to work on.
I have that old Kenmore Elite and it's still kicking after decades of use. I only had to replace the water pump and the timer in its life. Solid machine.
Wow, I didn't know that old style top loaders were still made! Our 27 year old original Maytag top loader washer and front load dryer are still going strong at our cabin.
And thank goodness they do. Modern front loaders are unrepairable mold factories.
The old washer’s transmission gear is “plastic” likely glass reinforced nylon. The new one actually just uses lower grade plastic or some zinc or sheet metal crap.
The VMW gear case has nylon gears, and Whirlpool manufacturers them for $6 per complete unit.
The components of my top load laundry machines and drying machines are made of case hardened solid hot forged and-or hydraulic pressed stainless steel alloy. They were designed, developed, and mass produced for our military for 24-7 non-stop use to clean up everything regardless of what we throw at them (heavy all terrain military survival boots, utility belts, heavy uniforms, arctic gear clothing, rubber shoes, rugs, heavy military issued blankets, etc) and they are still as good as new and still kicking like brand new after more than 65 years. The factory making them (there are 7 of them) are still making them based on their original designs and original materials and specifications STRICTLY followed on how to make and treat these stainless steel alloy materials into components. The revolving seals are made out of metal with cross hatch precision machining after they were case hardened and annealed-tempered (no quenching). Everything about them is OLD SCHOOL engineering using an all analog mechanical and electro-mechanical controls, etc.
This reminds me of how LED light bulbs are advertised. They print that these LEDs will last for like 150,000 hours and are a 60watt equivalent. Well, the LEDs themselves may theoretically last that long, but in reality will only last as long as their weakest part. Which, in my opinion, is the driver. And, like he says, that tiny little electrolytic capacitor will only last a few years before drying out and smoking. I honestly think that all this is well known by the manufacturers.
Most LED bulbs that I’ve bought go out quicker than incandescents. Many of them are DOA. I keep buying them though.
Thank you for helping people and being forward about your health.
Thanks for taking the time to make this video.
My grandmother had a set of laundry appliances that she purchased in the late 50s. They served her reliably for decades. In the end, the washer eventually failed due to rust. The supports on the washer frame rusted and would no longer retain the large springs that hold the wash tub, causing it to bang around. We were able to use eye bolts to get a few extra years from it before it eventually was too much work to maintain (welding and such). 50+ years was money well spent :)
BTW, the Speed Queen suspension is hands down the best design in the industry for maintaining the spin at high speed EVEN during out of balance.
Absolutely the commercial made units I used at work didn’t even vibrate in spin. Quality at its finest
@Wayne B I agree. The Maytag Commercial looks interesting but it's still just a jazzed up Whirlpool. The place I bought my Speed Queen set from the owner also owned a laundromat with the same model that I got but had the coin boxes and commercial front panel. They said they were in there for 13 years of daily use with no problems.
@PinkPower4 Yes, I knew and was surprised to find out that the TC5 isn't truly like the old 'classic' SQ in that it does have electronics. I could probably get by using the 'invertor' reversing motor machine as my clothes are rarely heavily soiled. That is the one thing I will say about that old SQ is it is pretty rough on the laundry. I'm content with it though. I had more problems with the dealer than SQ or Alliance, in fact they were pretty cool (SQ). I had a problem 3 months out of warranty and the dealer wanted to charge me $426 to fix a machine I (then) paid $765 for. I was prepared to buy another machine (not from them). I called Alliance loaded for bear ready for a fight and without even an argument the guy just says "yah, sure we'll cover it. It's only 3 months out of warranty." I was shaocked. They were totally cool. The place I bought them from wasn't. I had to call SQ and advocate on my own behalf. It wouldn't have been anything for the seller to just call up the factory and do what I did. They wouldn't even make the call. I wouldn't even buy a coffee maker from them after that. I mean I try to support local to an extent but not going to get screwed for it. And I tell everyone else to steer clear. One other funny incident with them happened a year before this washer problem. I was looking for a dishwasher. I settled on a particular Bosch that was new for 2017. They had it at Lowes for about $999 and also BestBuy for the same price. I called this local dealer inquiring about the model and they said they had one. Not really. It was the 'old' version from last year (a few years earlier) for $1200 and I WOULD HAVE TO PICK IT UP. I ended up getting it from BestBuy 2 days later delivered for $999 for the latest model. I let the woman know why I wasn't buying from her.
I just got back from a weekend at our family cabin. The refrigerator / freezer in there was purchased used and given to my grandparents as a wedding present in the 1940s. I only know of it being repaired once and it has been constantly plugged in and running in the cabin for the past 30 years.
I literally have that exact same Kenmore (well at least once that looks extremely similar) and the matching dryer. They came with the house when we bought it in 2004 and I believe both units are from sometime around 1996-1999. Literally never had a problem woth either one and I use them once a week AT MINIMUM. Glad to know they'll be around a while longer
As interesting and informative as this was I think I missed the entire point. You showed both washers had pros and cons, but I don't think you pointed out why the older machines last longer than the newer ones. Is it the electronics? The motor size? The amount of electricity used? The wires? I'm honestly feeling like I'm supposed to guess here rather than you just saying exactly what is causing the new machines to wear out faster.
Edit: Oh and you've earned a new subscriber. Thx for the lesson, Teach. 😁
Well from what I've seen in this video and what I've seen from ripping apart and scrapping old washers I can back up your findings with how the newer machine might be more efficient, the older machines are just built like tanks in comparison and are actually meant to be repaired and maintained. Energy efficiency might be nice, but if it can't be kept going for more than a couple years at a shot then what's the point?
Right im pretty sure its to meet emission standards but how is a machine with lots of plastic going to pollute less when its breaking every 3-5 years
I have Miele Washer/Dryer that admittedly cost a lot of money but after 12 years it’s still working as perfectly as when I first bought it.
You get what you pay for.
I have almost the same model as the new whirlpool you show here. I'm not sure if the design is a year or two older or a year or two newer, but it's very close. Mine is considerably easier to disassemble. The inner tub in mine isn't held in by the nut but by an adapter plate with a cross pin made of tough plastic. It might not be as maintainable as older washing machines (this was the first time I've taken one apart), but compared to pretty much anything else I've fixed it was a dream. The technician's manual inside the outer housing was amazing. All the parts that could fail I found to be modular and easy to replace, and it was very easy to source parts. Each part that was a module had a connector that was keyed so you can't mess up the wiring. All the things on the main circuit board that are likely to fail are through-hole components and easy to desolder and test and replace. It was the easiest thing to repair that I've repaired in a while and I fix a lot of random stuff.
We bought brand new Maytag washer and dryer in 1984. Proceeded to have 4 kids and they lasted 27 years of intense use before any real issues when we decided to replace them with a "new" set of Maytags. WHAT A MISTAKE! Those new machines were both a POS, and didn't last 5 years before they were in the garbage. And that was after our kids were grown and out of the house! Nothing at all compared to the older models. The newer ones are all show, and no go. I think this is the case for ALL brands.