For Christmas sake I'm tired of hearing people whine about these replicated watches. Who would buy a lux watch on the street corner, ebay or a pawn shop? And if you're not buying it from an AD and your purchasing it on the secondary market you'd better get it from a known and reputable dealer and have it authenticated, or don't buy it. Who buys a used BMW without taking the vehicle to a BMW certified-mech and having them check it exhaustively and completely? Stop your crying when you get a so called "great deal" and you did not do your due diligence.
I don’t have anything against folks that BUY clones or “replicas” when they know what they’re buying and don’t try to fool anyone otherwise. Some people just genuinely love that look but can’t justify spending thousands for a time telling bracelet. It’s when people try to SELL fakes as if you’re getting an unbelievable deal on a real watch.
This is absolutely true. But in my opinion this is the role that Homage watches should play. You can have that exact look and feel on the wrist but that logo should not be telling a lie. This is where you cross the line in my books.
@@marcusflack1523 splendid point. I stand behind my Duro collection like it’s my pride and joy; i’m a big guy so a 44mm $50 Sun homage is literally picture perfect and I love them but I love the look of a classic, tough dive watch. I don’t care what logo is between the hands and the twelve. But I definitely think I’d feel gross wearing a dive watch that I liked the looks of if it was pretending to be something it wasn’t. Idk, that doesn’t bother some folks and as long as it’s not a situation of “Yeah so and so has an awesome Submariner… Wait, it’s fake? He said it was real!” (which infuriates me lol), i’m glad they’re happy then.
Completely agree. Unobtainable wants/needs are a rationale for many. I work in pro audio where replicas of existing hardware is now a very common option for engineers when scarcity of an original means having to look at other options. Then there is the matter of the original (particularly vintage) being so knackered that it is good money after bad results to not consider modern well built quality options that attain similar or more often better results. Perhaps this desensitises an entire community of professionals to brand loyalty, which I think is truly absurd all things considered. In this circumstance, I’m referring to equipment needs, not really an option. Opinions will vary on this but the point remains and has become far less contentious in modern times. One of the things I believe applies to luxury items including watches, is that luxury is unnecessary and the indulgence is part of the price tag, it’s not purely quality, it’s absolutely more vanity and egotism. In pursuit of the aesthetic appeal is a devaluing integer in the whole equation, so the replica market responds accordingly. To refer to them as fakes is completely inaccurate and intentionally misleading. I have both on brand and replicas and I have no f*_ks to give about whether the replica is a bother to the aficionado community who regard unobtainable as luxury, that’s not the whole picture imho. I would be happy as a clam in dip to have a super clone minus the on brand logo because for me, I enjoy if not am mesmerised by the form and function of the aesthetic. I don’t wear a watch with any thought of what someone thinks of a watch I’m wearing, it’s 100% about me lol! Such a great episode. I think there is room in the watch world for both on brand and super replicas. I have super clones I got for around 1kAUD that are remarkably well built and I love them for all my own reasons. Watch brands also have a tendency to take themselves way too seriously. More brands really need to consider building multi tiered versions of their products if they are truly that bothered by the replica builders. The replica builders are actually no genuine threat to anyone and in some ways offer buyers are more realistic cost access to quality than on brands, it’s just a fact. Some brand’s really are just taking the piss with their pricing, I get it, they smell money and that’s what they want because creating the allure of luxury is just too easy for the experienced entrepreneur who is probably just as good at separating people from their money as they are at making a product. Again, great episode that could have been even better with perspectives from the super clone / replica world Thanks so much for the video To the AET sound person, please address the harsh sybillance that is borderline excruciating to listen on near field and headphones alike!! Mic placement is the fix but some stronger de essing /plosives control in post would be kindly appreciated ✌️ ❤
I own 3 AAA fake Rolex, I am on some sort of list with my AD but haven’t heard anything from them. I refuse to pay a flipper overs for a watch. The 1:1 replica watches are so close to the real ones hopefully in time it will stop flippers and allow us to go back to the time when you can just get the watch you want slightly off MRSP. And I work hard for my money and I can afford the real watch but hate flippers and dealer antics.
If Rolex would fix their supply chain/production issues so people could ACTUALLY buy models at retail price, and not have to look at the grey market where prices are 3x retail prices. If you could actually buy an OP 41mm at $6k in the store (or say 3-5 years ago, entry level Rolexes were sub-$5k) then the fake scenario wouldn’t occur to the same extent. I’ve been on a AD “waiting list” for 12+ months, and I’m not going to spend thousands buying other things I don’t want to get preference on the list.
I owned a fake yachtmaster when I was in management and working in the shop. It eventually through an end link pin and shattered on the ground. I missed that watch so much I bought a real rolex to replace it, and decided to wear something else while at work. We all start somewhere...
I enjoy micro brands and collaborations as much as some of my “brand” watches and as result there is not a need for a fake in my collection. You asked the question during the episode that is most important about a watch…”does it make you smile”! Rock you favorite watch, regardless of the logo on it! Thank you guys!
Bloody great proving re the smile side of things. Yes I myself are far more interested in finding a watch that resonates with just me. Not what resonates with a colossal marketing spend.
For Christmas this year, my wife purchased a Pagani Design PD-1662 in root beer because I LURVE the GMT Master-II in the same colorway, but even were I to consider the Roller, I'd never wear it. I wear the PD wherever and whenever I want...it cost $130US. If it fails, it's inexpensive enough that I'll also do the calibre swap-out; it's not like I can reduce its value!
Nothing wrong with a Pagani "Design" (LOL) watch, I've got a PD 1664 (Panda Daytona) and I do wear it, but (and I have no idea how this works), it just doesn't feel special (probably 'cause it's not special!) like some other watches I've got do. When in reality I know it actually feels just like any other 120-160g steel, oyster bracelet watch. ***edit*** in fact I just did it, went to glace at the time on the Sub I "know" I'm wearing and I'd put the PD 1664 on writing this post then forgot, so it had stopped feeling cheap, cause the Sub wasn't cheap! ***edit***
@@WestCoastAce27 the Pagani "Explorer 2" really will "fake everyone out" cause no one expects to see an Explorer homage or fake, you presume it's real. And that Pagani is a 100% clone. You wear a Submariner or a Daytona (real, fake or homage) and someone WILL ask if it's real or fake, it'll get spotted. But an Explorer 2? You'll just presume it's real until you get so close as to see the logo. And that's closer than you think.
Sounds like Longines needs to digitize it’s records in a searchable database. I’m glad I stumbled across this channel. Quickly becoming one of my favorite watch channels.
This episode perfectly describes why I buy Christopher Ward. The margin is 100% transparent and... it is fair. Marketing cost also is zero. You pay a great quality watch and you pay Chr. Ward a fair gain. The whole industry should be like that. That would give fakes no room. Ps: I guessed for the starbucks to be gen for the great cyclops. Shame on me. Lol
I’m happy that you guys keep things real. You stated if you made a mistake in your past and you acknowledge it. Thank you 🙏 you are great help to the community.
I think this may be your best ever pre-recorded episode. There was a tone of sincerity and honest fascination in your consideration of the realm of fake watches. The best points revolved around the idea that some people feel the need to own the fake version of a brand to feel like they then have purchase on the tier which that brand represents. What is doubly tragic is that such self-delusion robs those people of the opportunity of owning a gorgeous watch that is within their grasp, like a Tudor Black Bay 36, the Baltic HMS 002 or the Khaki Field Automatic Murph, be it the 38mm or the 42mm. I see similar motions in the school I work in where the children need the brand, when something that is not a famous brand may offer an even better product. When the world is so governed by the need for the perception of quality over the reality of quality, then something is extremely wrong. A superb episode because the sentiment was so valuable and true.
You never disappoint me Raymond. Your degree and level of insight always pushes my thinking just that little bit further. Your point about attainable now watches is so on point. I think for many people buying fakes they actually have little to no idea of whats on offer out there in the watch world. They gravitate automatically to Rolex as its a household brand name in the watch game and they stop there. Thinking that somehow they have made a wise decision. hmmmm. But yeah there is so much quality on offer out there that is affordable, obtainable and very keepable (if keepable is a word)
@@marcusflack1523 Thank you Marcus. I just have never had any illusions about being able to afford something like a Rolex. I've set myself tiers of what I would like to own, mainly because I know what I can afford and what would carry me too far. You know, I hope he doesn't mind me saying so, but George really shone on this one. Everyone was on point, and extremely honest, but George had several fascinating stories to tell; they were amazing. I think it may have been Andrew who pointed out last week that the aim of a successful podcast is the feeling of being in the room and being involved in the conversation. I think that is absolutely true, and this week's episode nailed that sentiment. Also, keepable is a word, which is a shame because I thought you'd nailed a perfectly acceptable neologism.
This for me has been by far the most educational episode yet. I absolutely loved learning more about the fake watch market and yet I feel that a lot of us will come away far more vigilant. It's a terrifying ordeal and one which I can only feel sorry for George in his situations. I loved this episode so much and it's a nice change from the more casual episodes. Keep up the great work👊
Ahhh fantastic that it hit the mark for you George. Yeah this was a great ep for us here with so much to dig into. Thanks for watching and commenting. Means a lot to hear how people like you respond to the content we make. 😊
I too once had a fake Tag Heuer from Bali when I was teenager. Wore it until the battery died (maybe like a year), but then was too embarrassed to get the battery changed! Really great discussion guys, absolutely loving the channel!
This episode is brilliant on so many levels. The fake speaks to the audience, the real watch speaks to the wearer. Agree with others you are taking this series to another level. 😁
@@marcusflack1523 That's my pleasure, thank you Marcus for all the great work you've been doing all this time to make this happen. Hands down the best watch podcast/youtube series ever. ✌🏼
What's the point of owning a luxury watch if you're not going to wear it? Well, where I live, you are subject to lose it at gun point. Therefore, having the original in a safe and a fake on my wrist outside the house makes sense.
This was a great episode. Topic was on-point and all of you added perspectives/experience that make one think a bit deeper. On a more boring point, this was perhaps the easiest episode to watch. You maintained a nice casual tone, like a natural conversation, without stepping on each other and going down tangents. In other words, it was pro without looking forced. Keep going but as Teena Marie told Rick James, "Yeah, well, don't be too slick now!"
Grew up in the jewelry business and have a ton of experience with knock offs. We always lived by two mottos If they’re knocking you off, you’re doing something right. When they’re knocking you off, its time to start working on what comes next.
Andrew, spot on, w'ere being bummed by Rolex, the real Rolex is 7k because they spend 100's of millions advertising/marketing, per year, that's what we're paying for. Great debate guy's
I searched for fake Rolex watches before I bought a GMT Master II because I wanted to make sure I know what mistakes they make so I can be sure mine is real. Many people would be doing this and it may explain why the number of searches are so high. I did the same before I bought my Omega Seamaster.
@@marcusflack1523 no I did not. But by searching I learned that fake omegas don't have a black balance wheel etc. So when I finally bought a watch I was sure it was real. Fakes are so good these days that there is always an element of doubt even when buying from a reputable dealer. It's a shame that this is the state of affairs
I bought a fake Bell and Ross in Bangkok when I was 17 years old. I am not advocating that anyone should buy fakes but it was through that I learnt about other watch brands. Ironic as this may sound, it was the AAA and double AA replica markets that exposed me to the world of watches!
This is a repeating story in the comments. So many people where red this hobby through the world of fakes and now they have amazing collections of the real deal.
The best use of a fake that I have seen is one of my friends has a couple really nice rolex watches and he keeps them safe, but wears the fakes out. So that he does not damage the originals. He only has the fakes as copy’s of the originals.
I love it when a billionaire’s kid shames people for buying a replica. If you’ve always loved a Rolex and can’t afford the real thing, go for it. This idea that you’re some kind of imposter speaks volumes about entitlement and privilege. Personally if I could buy a perfect 1:1 Zeitwerk I would do it in a heartbeat. My heart would leap with joy with every time change and I would love it for exactly what it was, a beautiful recreation of mechanical perfection.
George never answered the question about the difference between his watches and the fake Heuer he purchased. He very deftly dodged it but didn't actually answer it.
Found you guys today and have watched nearly of season 1 and some of season 2. Your content has definitely gotten better and I really enjoyed this episode and the one finding the best diver under 10K, 5k and 1k.
My issue with fakes is when a person or dealer knowingly sells a fake for the same price as the real watch. I feel like that's where most of these celebrities get duped. A lot of them really aren't watch people like that and would never be able to tell the difference between real and fake so they get played
I’m slightly ashamed to admit I’ve bought a fake watch before (with honest intentions). I bought a fake BB58 to wear for a few weeks to see if I liked the feel of it even after the ‘honeymoon phase’. I didn’t want to drop £3k on the real thing and regret it in a months time. Ended up buying the real deal of course… as for the fake, it’s sat in drawer with a kaput movement (of course) 😂
Great discussion guys. Early in my watch collecting journey I bought several fake luxury watches. At that time I fell for the hype surrounding luxury Swiss watches and there was no way I could afford the real thing. I was buying some of the best replicas available at the time and my first purchase was a Tag Heuer Link chronograph. I couldn’t believe the quality and feel of that particular watch which only encouraged me to buy more replicas. With each purchase however I discovered that the watches only had an illusion of luxury. Every subsequent watch had quality issues and many of them serious enough to prevent any enjoyment of the watch. I eventually had to admit to myself that I had wasted my money. I then discovered vintage watches and also the fact that I could get loads of enjoyment from watches at the more affordable end of the spectrum. I have been seriously collecting for over 15 years now. Along the way I have also managed to acquire a couple of expensive Omegas and I don’t really buy much these days as I’m very happy with my collection now.
My friend what a great end to your story. I love your honesty with how the purchases made you feel and interresting that the more you get into thiosgame the more the little things become deal breakers. But def so good that you have found the right way to play the game now. All the best Craig.
When you start collecting the natural desire is to want to build your collection quickly and you usually have your sights set on watches you cannot really afford. I think this is when the temptation of fake watches is very strong. If you can get past this temptation I have discovered it’s not just owning and wearing different types of watches that I enjoy but also the hunt to find the right one. This is especially true for vintage watches. My two favourite brands are Seiko and Omega which both represent excellent value for money.
I guess I don't travel in the 'right circles'. However I've noticed that most 'normal' people don't even seem to recognize if I'm wearing a 'luxury watch'. And then any 'watch people' who would actually care will probably realize it's a fake... So there doesn't seem to be ANY upside? Also, spending $500+ on a 'decent' replica just seems silly. If you're going to spend that much cash then there are many respectable 'real' watch brands to choose from...
I contend that a majority of watches labeled “Swiss Made” in the under $1,500usd range have mostly made in China components. This is especially true for micro brands.
I liked it guys. Love the idea, loved season one but honestly haven’t enjoyed everything in season 2. But this was just right. Just talking, good topic. No stig etc.👌🏻
While fake watches are certainly trademark infringement, it’s amusing to me how much money is spent on a logo when you’re purchasing most Rolex models. When a high quality ETA based fake SUB can be purchased for ~$500 it demonstrates that you’re probably paying at least $7000 for a logo. While I don’t support brand theft, I have less sympathy for a company like Rolex which could put measures in place that would allow customers to purchase a watch from an AD.
Rolex don't want the fake watch industry to go away, they sell all the watches they can make, the fake industry is free publicityand marketing for them. It doesn't hurt them one bit, they benefit from it hugely. As discussed at least 75% (very conservative estimate) of the Rolex's you see out in the world are fakes and most of those wearing them even if they do own genuine watches wouldn't buy a real Rolex (too expensive) or wouldn't wear one 8n that situation. Rolex would rather you wore a fake Sub than a real Tag that's for sure.
Hmmmmmm……..no ! First of all, all the clones are much, much lower quality. They excel at things that you can easily see (but also fall short there) and what you don’t see is in a completely different league. If you compare an ETA movement to a Rolex movement, then I probably just waste my time here. They are not even similar by a country mile. And then there is all the R&D and brand promoting, which is hugely expensive. They created something that is hugely successful, that is a HARD task. It’s easy just to copy from someone else. Without the R&D and the marketing, those clones would not exist too, you do realize that ? Also keep in mind that in watch world specs aren’t the most important. The cheap Casio G-Shock I’m wearing right now is better than any Rolex in any practical application.
Yeah it's true, when we buy a watch we pay for all their marketing we see along gran prix and the tennis... Would they still be king if they weren't so "reassuringly expensive"?
@@d3xmeisterhave you seen a fake 3235 movement, or a 4130, or 3285? All are 1-1 (bar the free sprung balance) and individual parts can be swapped out. In fact the latest clones are totally 1-1, everything can be swapped, it just fits and works.
Problem with the fake market is I now can’t look at a submariner without assuming it’s fake. The sheer volume that are out there fake or not makes in my mind the product less desirable.
I wholeheartedly agree. I think the whole discussion re fakes these days comes down to the wearer. Are you cool with yourself knowing your wearing a lie? Or would you rather have a feeling of authenticity. It’s a conversation that’s more targeted at peoples psychology more than anything I think.
One thing I was wondering if you guys were going to talk about was the point Adrian made about "feeling dirty" wearing a fake. Where does that feeling come from? Is it internal, or external? And additionally, what about the "dirtiness" of brands (specifically Rolex) who will not sell their goods to regular consumers? Rolex doesn't encourage or promote pure commerce (which should be free of prestige and classism), so if Rolex is bring "dirty" in this way, does it make it okay to wear their fakes?
Hmmm I think that dirty feeling comes down to the way you view yourself. I cant speak for Adrian, but for me to wear a fake today would jest never work. To me the point of this watch game is to attain and aspire for that real piece that ticks so many boxes for me. And looking down knowing it aint the real deal just makes me say to myself....What are you doing man? What are you saying by wearing that thing? But each to his own I guess.
I never considered myself a watch collector until last year when I realized I had 2 basic casio watches, 3 g-shocks, a citizen Quartz, and a timex. Now shows like this have me buying my first automatic movement, I now own a wind up pocket watch. Starting to plan my entry into entry level luxury. An upgrade from Pauper Luxury. Love from Mario. Windsor, ON, Canada 🇨🇦
I bought an "homage" from Steinhart of the Rolex Yachtmaster Everrose. Wore it to work (casino dealer) and several people asked me if it was a Rolex. Every time I explained that it was an homage I became less fond of the Steinhart. After a couple days I stopped wearing it. It felt dishonest.
Wow yeah wearing that in a casino context was a ballsy thing to do. If you were gonna get drilled with Watch questions pretty sure a casino has loads of people that know the watch game.
Loved this episode, really entertaining😂 Was dissapointed to see another watch youtuber being indifferent and being OK with wearing fakes in a Q&A episode.
Guys you are great just found your channel - following now. One minor gripe (awesome content by the way) the heads on your logo should represent your individuality more. Three skulls is hard to differentiate at a glance) and also will won’t let you cross over into some territories in the east. try more cool characters using glasses, hair and t shirts and shirts. Ps. I’m in a highly creative business myself. Minor grip aside loving the show
Cracking episode lads. Must say nice to see an episode with the back to basics format. Fakes scare the life out of me and you guys just proved why we should all be concerned. (In my view and in answer to Andrew’s question, it’s never ok…even if it boosts the ego.) Just bought a vintage Kermit from a dealer and am petrified. Can’t understand why brands like Rolex don’t do more to help their customers in this space.
I have to agree with you NVA. When you start climbing the ladder in the watch game it gets increasingly unstable in that regard. The super clones are sooooo convincing. glad the ep held some good information for you.
They don't "do more" for the same reason they don't make any effort to stop (the right) people flipping watches from AD to grey importer (and in many cases doubling the price) and for the same reason the AD's won't sell to just anyone. Because they want the market demand to be that high, it just adds to the prestige. No one in the world would suggest that "fake diamonds" shouldn't exist, 99% of the clear white, flat sided stones in jewellery aren't real diamonds. A diamond carries that much prestige if you see what appears to be one you presume it's a "fake". From the plastic in the ones in your granddaughters play jewellery, to the ones grown in a lab in Pandora (god I hate that cheap, monkey metal/plastic stone junk, but my daughters love it), they must outnumber real diamonds 10,000 to 1. It does not diminish the value of a real diamond one little bit. If anything it enhances it. Same with a Rolex. Those trying to pass superclones off as real in social situations, fine, it hurts no one if they get away with it, only hurts them it they don't! Those trying to sell them as genuine, not fine. If you're buying one outside of an insured situation, take the back off, hack the movement, no adjusters on the balance wheel? Walk away. Seller won't let you? Walk away.
@@fontyyy appreciate the reply and agree with your points. One day I will learn how to hack a movement without worrying risk of destroying a watch 😏… Maybe casting doubt is part of their plan to drive the layman to the massively over priced new Rolex Certfieds sold by their ADs ie if you want certainty you have to come to me and pay well above market. Personally I much prefer Omega and Longines approach ie we care about our customers.
Genuinely interesting chat guys, thoroughly enjoyed it -it was refreshing to hear your honesty too about buying fakes in the past. My experience; I had a friend who travelled to China for work, and he asked if I wanted him to bring me back a watch - at the time I didn't own anything decent really, but aspired to. I asked him for a black ceramic Submariner... original I know. A few weeks later he returned and handed me the watch, for which I'd given him £60GBP for. And while it was a pretty "good" fake, I was filled with disappointment and regret. I wanted to capture that feeling of owning the watch I'd lusted after for so long, and when I had what I thought would do that for a fraction of the cost, it just did not give me that feeling - not out of snobbery, it just didn't feel right, it didn't give me that feeling of accomplishment, that feeling of owning something which will be around for longer than I will and can hand down to my children. I would never have lied to anyone if they asked if it was real or fake, and I wouldn't have been able to be comfortable with having to explain to someone why I'm wearing a fake - I wouldn't have a decent enough answer. That same day, I handed to the watch to my much younger brother who was delighted, and then a few weeks later, I stumped up the cash and bought a genuine Submariner for a good price at the time. This gave me all the feelings I'd wanted and sent me on a totally different journey with my watches from then on. It taught me, that no matter what watch it is, I couldn't bare to wear it if it was a fake. There's plenty of people out there who will tell you you're an idiot for spending that sort of money on a real one, and, even some, who if you gave them a real one, they would say "no thank's, I'd rather not be a chump who just spent 10 grand on a stupid watch, this replica will do". Good for them, but that's not me I'm afraid! Great show guys!
Great level of honestly there. And I think your sentiments will resonate with so many others out there in the watch game. Interesting how the fake seemed to motivate the actual purchase of the legit model hey. There is a comment about that tells a similar story from @TheCameltotem. Check it out.
I actually own a couple of San Martin watches and they are an exceptional build. I do believe they are built to look like it's a lot of very popular watches. However, the quality of their watches is impeccable
Great episode, but you left out one extremely important consideration - the proceeds from the sales of counterfeit goods (including but not limited to luxury watches) fund some of the worst people on the planet, including organized crime, cartels, and international terrorists.
I'm new to watches but have had other interests where the price of the equipment carried status within that group. I saw people with expensive guns who couldn't shoot, expensive bikes who couldn't ride, expensive cars that couldn't drive and I'm sure there are people with expensive watches but no money. In the 6-7 months since I bought my first watch 30+ more followed, mostly used stuff on eBay well below the MSRP. I'd never really sacrifice to have a watch so realistically the absolute top of my price range would be $5K, which works out pretty good for me as I like the offerings from Omega the most and can be found in the pre-owned market well within my price range. Through the 30+ watches I've bought, I learned a lot about what I like and what I don't. I've thought about buying a fake Omega but the good ones cost $450-$600 which is a 1/4 of what a real one can be bought for. That same money would buy a nice used Tissot Seastar or Hamilton Khaki Scuba or a new Islander from Long Island Watches. I plan to sale about 2 dozen of the watches I have and spending that towards one of the Omegas I want and I'm sure at least 2 more of the Islander styles will end up in my watch case.
I received a San Martin BB58 as a gift for Christmas- it’s the same size and dimensions as the original Tudor, except with a sapphire instead of an aluminum bezel and a Seiko NH35 movement. The quality of the bracelet and case were frankly impressive, but the stem failed to consistently turn the movement. And because it was $237 to return it to China (and the watch cost $235), it’s now sitting with a watchmaker getting fixed.
I agree with those comments saying season 2 is even better than season 1 (with the exception of Lucien episode, that one was actually the worst of all for me, but you compensated with a great therapy session last week). I have one kind request/suggestion: could you make a playlist of only the BYOI parts? Oh, and one more question, although I'm sure it was asked before, I just haven't seen it in the comments: Where can I get such cool clocks as GB has in the room where you're shooting? Thank you guys for what you do, AET is by far my most favorite content on the internet! Greetings from the Czech Republic 🙂
Good suggestion re the BYOI. I think that’s something we will do. As many others really resonate with this section. It’s like a surprise in the box. You don’t know what’s gonna pop out but when it does it’s super refreshing.
I would like to remind everyone who buys a fake watch because they can't afford it or dont want to pay for that real watch is that when you buy the fake one and put it on you STILL don't have the watch just remember that in fact now you threw away some of the money you could've use for the real one it's all an illusion.
Just remember when they make you buy 16 tudors and date justs to get on a wait list they’re still not the Daytona you actually wanted to buy, lol. Just remember that whenever you wear your Rolex shitters you bought just to get the good one you actually wanted.
Crazy hearing George’s speech at 27:50 after having received this morning a package containing my first Omega. I can’t afford a current model. I can’t afford a vintage Omega auto. I can’t afford a vintage Omega Constellation “Pie Pan” in good condition, let alone its servicing. But I can afford a cool, vintage 1977 Omega Constellation Quartz Calibre 1330 straight from the Quartz Crisis. And wearing it today, having learnt about these calibres during the research, knowing their meaning in the history of horology, feels so much better than any homage or fake would.
I don't justify the purchase of fake watches. But at the same time I always wonder if it could be considered as a entry gate to the watch world. Greatings from a Bolivian fan!!
Sweet episode. Ive been ‘into’ watches for about a year. Ive had watches all my life though and I think before that point, if someone showed me a Rolex, fake or not, I would have assumed it was legit. Its only being in the ‘hobby’ more thats made me aware of fakes at all price points. Id say the average consumer who wants a *insert luxury watch name* will go for a fake if its cheap enough, to ‘flex’. Its the same as people who have a poverty spec Merc/BM just to say they have the badge!
I do a ton of Seiko mods, my favorite of which is an explorer. In particular, it uses a seiko movement and it says Seiko on an explorer dial which makes it clearly a fake. For some reason I find this acceptable because it doesn't try to deceive anyone into thinking it's genuinely a Rolex AT ALL. I recently built an air king copy that is branded Rolex however and I'm much more conflicted about that one. I would always tell someone immediately it's fake but I hate the idea that someone might pass me on the street and think it's real. But damn it, it looks so cool though!
Man I so wanna get into this modding game as well. Sounds super interesting indeed. Yeah I hear ya about the logo on the dial. Would make my a little nervous as well. Hey why not do a little extra mod on the logo yourself and make a game of it ya know. Really play with the mod and make it your own.
Is it a seiko oem dial? I get that it's not a Rolex, and seiko modding is a big thing, but they have had lawsuits of ppl throwing their brand onto dials/watches and claiming it as a seiko. You get what I mean? You aren't receiving ppl into thinking it's a real Rolex, but it's possible ppl may think its a Seiko. Mods should stick to no logo dials unless if it's OEM produced by seiko.
First: You are really the best Watchcast 👍 I like the starbucks a lot. The dealer gives me only a laugh. So I buy a Steinhart hommage. Now a question myself, get I more fun from the original? For the saved money, I can buy a nice Tag 😉 Even two !
Finally a good episode. Honestly i had a hard time enjoying the first few episodes of this season. Good work on this one, it felt like season 1 again :)
My coworkers brother in-law did exactly what you mentioned (bought a AAA fake of each of the real Rolexes he has, to wear day to day) some people just aren't that interested in brands other than the handful they know. In his mind it's justified, by the fact that they do own the real thing at home. They don't have to feel bad keeping the real watch perfect in a watch box while it keeps value, and they get to wear (and beat up) the fake one while getting recognition for owning the genuine article, not pretending to be something he's not. Hope that makes sense. I don't want to say fakes are a good thing for the swiss watch market, I just want to give the perspective of someone whose well off, who just wants to have his cake and eat it too (for no risk)... Long as you don't wear it in London
So strange that it’s got to this point huh. That even if u own the real thing. You can’t just put it on and rock it in the city. I get your point re the fake is like your insurance policy if someone wants to rob you. But your still going to have the trauma of the mugging right. I think you would be better off wearing a cool micro brand in the city and wear your real thing at the appropriate times. Supporting the fake industry does not feel right in any industry.
@@marcusflack1523 I agree. I get his perspective that as long as he isn't in London, Barcelona, etc. He can wear his watch for "zero risk", but he's still supporting the fake watch market which just feels fundamentally wrong to me. I wouldn't be surprised if many Rolex owners do this (especially in Asia where there's easy access to perfect clones), purely as a way to protect their real collection. The fakes are INCREDIBLY convincing, even to people who know what they're looking for. But it's the point of lying to yourself and everyone else that I can't get over
THANK U GUYS. Loved it as Always. Recently i went into a Cobbler/Key Cutters Shop...He had FAKE Casio F91Ws for Sale.When i asked he told me they were FAKE..! GO FIGURE..!😎🙏🙏🙏
I cannot per personally bash on anyone who buys a fake watch. Some people aspire to have "that watch" but will never be able to afford it and this may be the closest thing in reach. I personally would not buy a fake watch! There are so many good watches out there at every price range (I have gold plated vintage Seiko 5 that cost me £30) that there is no need to buy a fake watch but that it's all dependent on the person’s motivation for wanting the watch! One thing I have learnt over the years is the look of a watch can be way different to the feel of a watch when on the wrist so everyone should go out there and try on as many watches as possible and pick the ones that feel good and speak to them!!
Buzzing with Adrian’s mondaine, my first ever watch was a mondaine EVO2 for my 18th birthday! Recently picked up a 1960s vintage mondaine with a linen dial! Such elegant simplicity for a great price point
The search term "fake Rolex" doesn't really tell whether people searching for fakes to purchase, or they want to learn how to identify fakes so they know they're legit. I don't want to own a fake but I know I've searched for fakes to understand how I can avoid being stung
To provide another perspective on fake watches. I couldn't decide between a Rolex Batman and an Omega P.O. GMT titanium. I ran across a fake Batman, almost perfect in reproduction, for $115.00. Since Rolex won't allow me to borrow a watch for a week to see how it wears, I purchased the fake and wore it for 6 months off and on, always ensuring I let anyone who inquired that it was indeed a fake and why I was wearing it. I concluded I didn't like the sharp edges of the Batman, also, it was hard to acquire the time quickly. So I bought an original Omega P.O. GMT Titanium. If it weren't for that fake, I would've pulled the trigger on the Batman, regretted it due to the feeling on my wrist, and regretted my purchase, eventually trying to sell it. I've had my P.O. GMT for 3 years, not one regret; super comfortable and light.
it's flawed though. It takes ZERO skill to copy a degree paper. If it was hand written and you'd copied even nuance of his hand writing maybe you'd have a point. So, it does take some skill to turn out a 1 to 1 3235 movement that can keep time to Rolex level of accuracy. The quartz watches that are $20 in the fake market in China maybe, the ones that are $600 and can take Rolex parts many times 1 - 1 direct replacement...not so much I don't think.
I’m 25 minutes into the show and truly enjoying the discussion; however, I am completely drooling over the curves, lines, and reflections of that Hamilton Ventura wall clock. I never appreciated the watch before but will be looking into it now. Cheers!
I know I will never spend 50k+ on a gold Rolex Smurf so I bought a Squale 1545 instead and it checks off all the boxes: sapphire crystal, nice blue sunburst dial, and a solid ETA movement. Plus I have the peace of mind I will never get robbed for my Squale. Who cares what people think…lol
Ziarex must be stopped at all costs. People are losing money since their mega clone watches started to be sold as originals on the aftermarket.
For Christmas sake I'm tired of hearing people whine about these replicated watches. Who would buy a lux watch on the street corner, ebay or a pawn shop? And if you're not buying it from an AD and your purchasing it on the secondary market you'd better get it from a known and reputable dealer and have it authenticated, or don't buy it.
Who buys a used BMW without taking the vehicle to a BMW certified-mech and having them check it exhaustively and completely?
Stop your crying when you get a so called "great deal" and you did not do your due diligence.
I don’t have anything against folks that BUY clones or “replicas” when they know what they’re buying and don’t try to fool anyone otherwise. Some people just genuinely love that look but can’t justify spending thousands for a time telling bracelet. It’s when people try to SELL fakes as if you’re getting an unbelievable deal on a real watch.
This is absolutely true. But in my opinion this is the role that Homage watches should play. You can have that exact look and feel on the wrist but that logo should not be telling a lie. This is where you cross the line in my books.
@@marcusflack1523 splendid point. I stand behind my Duro collection like it’s my pride and joy; i’m a big guy so a 44mm $50 Sun homage is literally picture perfect and I love them but I love the look of a classic, tough dive watch. I don’t care what logo is between the hands and the twelve. But I definitely think I’d feel gross wearing a dive watch that I liked the looks of if it was pretending to be something it wasn’t. Idk, that doesn’t bother some folks and as long as it’s not a situation of “Yeah so and so has an awesome Submariner… Wait, it’s fake? He said it was real!” (which infuriates me lol), i’m glad they’re happy then.
Completely agree. Unobtainable wants/needs are a rationale for many. I work in pro audio where replicas of existing hardware is now a very common option for engineers when scarcity of an original means having to look at other options. Then there is the matter of the original (particularly vintage) being so knackered that it is good money after bad results to not consider modern well built quality options that attain similar or more often better results. Perhaps this desensitises an entire community of professionals to brand loyalty, which I think is truly absurd all things considered.
In this circumstance, I’m referring to equipment needs, not really an option.
Opinions will vary on this but the point remains and has become far less contentious in modern times.
One of the things I believe applies to luxury items including watches, is that luxury is unnecessary and the indulgence is part of the price tag, it’s not purely quality, it’s absolutely more vanity and egotism. In pursuit of the aesthetic appeal is a devaluing integer in the whole equation, so the replica market responds accordingly. To refer to them as fakes is completely inaccurate and intentionally misleading. I have both on brand and replicas and I have no f*_ks to give about whether the replica is a bother to the aficionado community who regard unobtainable as luxury, that’s not the whole picture imho.
I would be happy as a clam in dip to have a super clone minus the on brand logo because for me, I enjoy if not am mesmerised by the form and function of the aesthetic. I don’t wear a watch with any thought of what someone thinks of a watch I’m wearing, it’s 100% about me lol!
Such a great episode. I think there is room in the watch world for both on brand and super replicas. I have super clones I got for around 1kAUD that are remarkably well built and I love them for all my own reasons.
Watch brands also have a tendency to take themselves way too seriously.
More brands really need to consider building multi tiered versions of their products if they are truly that bothered by the replica builders. The replica builders are actually no genuine threat to anyone and in some ways offer buyers are more realistic cost access to quality than on brands, it’s just a fact.
Some brand’s really are just taking the piss with their pricing, I get it, they smell money and that’s what they want because creating the allure of luxury is just too easy for the experienced entrepreneur who is probably just as good at separating people from their money as they are at making a product.
Again, great episode that could have been even better with perspectives from the super clone / replica world
Thanks so much for the video
To the AET sound person, please address the harsh sybillance that is borderline excruciating to listen on near field and headphones alike!! Mic placement is the fix but some stronger de essing /plosives control in post would be kindly appreciated ✌️
❤
I own 3 AAA fake Rolex, I am on some sort of list with my AD but haven’t heard anything from them. I refuse to pay a flipper overs for a watch. The 1:1 replica watches are so close to the real ones hopefully in time it will stop flippers and allow us to go back to the time when you can just get the watch you want slightly off MRSP. And I work hard for my money and I can afford the real watch but hate flippers and dealer antics.
You sir make perfect sense.
If Rolex would fix their supply chain/production issues so people could ACTUALLY buy models at retail price, and not have to look at the grey market where prices are 3x retail prices. If you could actually buy an OP 41mm at $6k in the store (or say 3-5 years ago, entry level Rolexes were sub-$5k) then the fake scenario wouldn’t occur to the same extent. I’ve been on a AD “waiting list” for 12+ months, and I’m not going to spend thousands buying other things I don’t want to get preference on the list.
I owned a fake yachtmaster when I was in management and working in the shop.
It eventually through an end link pin and shattered on the ground.
I missed that watch so much I bought a real rolex to replace it, and decided to wear something else while at work.
We all start somewhere...
I enjoy micro brands and collaborations as much as some of my “brand” watches and as result there is not a need for a fake in my collection. You asked the question during the episode that is most important about a watch…”does it make you smile”! Rock you favorite watch, regardless of the logo on it! Thank you guys!
Bloody great proving re the smile side of things. Yes I myself are far more interested in finding a watch that resonates with just me. Not what resonates with a colossal marketing spend.
For Christmas this year, my wife purchased a Pagani Design PD-1662 in root beer because I LURVE the GMT Master-II in the same colorway, but even were I to consider the Roller, I'd never wear it. I wear the PD wherever and whenever I want...it cost $130US. If it fails, it's inexpensive enough that I'll also do the calibre swap-out; it's not like I can reduce its value!
Nothing wrong with a Pagani "Design" (LOL) watch, I've got a PD 1664 (Panda Daytona) and I do wear it, but (and I have no idea how this works), it just doesn't feel special (probably 'cause it's not special!) like some other watches I've got do. When in reality I know it actually feels just like any other 120-160g steel, oyster bracelet watch.
***edit*** in fact I just did it, went to glace at the time on the Sub I "know" I'm wearing and I'd put the PD 1664 on writing this post then forgot, so it had stopped feeling cheap, cause the Sub wasn't cheap! ***edit***
My GMT "Root drink" came a few days ago. Banger of a watch. Just ordered the Lefty diet sprite, should be arriving in 2 weeks lol
Ditto. Fakes everyone out. Have the Pagani Explorer II Polar also. Very solid body, bracelets are nothing amazing and will probably be what fails.
@@WestCoastAce27 the Pagani "Explorer 2" really will "fake everyone out" cause no one expects to see an Explorer homage or fake, you presume it's real. And that Pagani is a 100% clone.
You wear a Submariner or a Daytona (real, fake or homage) and someone WILL ask if it's real or fake, it'll get spotted.
But an Explorer 2? You'll just presume it's real until you get so close as to see the logo. And that's closer than you think.
@@WestCoastAce27 I guess...I don't want to fake anyone out...I like the look and won't afford the Roller...
Sounds like Longines needs to digitize it’s records in a searchable database.
I’m glad I stumbled across this channel. Quickly becoming one of my favorite watch channels.
Actually I believe they have digitised it. Its a free service now if you have a longines they can look it up for you.
Oh yes because computers can't be hacked. Can they, well done you have just legitimatized half the fakes
This episode perfectly describes why I buy Christopher Ward. The margin is 100% transparent and... it is fair. Marketing cost also is zero. You pay a great quality watch and you pay Chr. Ward a fair gain. The whole industry should be like that. That would give fakes no room. Ps: I guessed for the starbucks to be gen for the great cyclops. Shame on me. Lol
As a customer, could you give a brief rating of your opinion
@@detgoat Could you tell me more exactly what you mean with that. I would be happy to do that for you.
Micro Brands are cheaper because they are Micro Brands.
I’m happy that you guys keep things real. You stated if you made a mistake in your past and you acknowledge it. Thank you 🙏 you are great help to the community.
fanbloodytastic feedback. Glad this is hitting the truth mark for you.
I think this may be your best ever pre-recorded episode. There was a tone of sincerity and honest fascination in your consideration of the realm of fake watches. The best points revolved around the idea that some people feel the need to own the fake version of a brand to feel like they then have purchase on the tier which that brand represents. What is doubly tragic is that such self-delusion robs those people of the opportunity of owning a gorgeous watch that is within their grasp, like a Tudor Black Bay 36, the Baltic HMS 002 or the Khaki Field Automatic Murph, be it the 38mm or the 42mm. I see similar motions in the school I work in where the children need the brand, when something that is not a famous brand may offer an even better product. When the world is so governed by the need for the perception of quality over the reality of quality, then something is extremely wrong. A superb episode because the sentiment was so valuable and true.
You never disappoint me Raymond. Your degree and level of insight always pushes my thinking just that little bit further. Your point about attainable now watches is so on point. I think for many people buying fakes they actually have little to no idea of whats on offer out there in the watch world. They gravitate automatically to Rolex as its a household brand name in the watch game and they stop there. Thinking that somehow they have made a wise decision. hmmmm.
But yeah there is so much quality on offer out there that is affordable, obtainable and very keepable (if keepable is a word)
@@marcusflack1523 Thank you Marcus. I just have never had any illusions about being able to afford something like a Rolex. I've set myself tiers of what I would like to own, mainly because I know what I can afford and what would carry me too far. You know, I hope he doesn't mind me saying so, but George really shone on this one. Everyone was on point, and extremely honest, but George had several fascinating stories to tell; they were amazing. I think it may have been Andrew who pointed out last week that the aim of a successful podcast is the feeling of being in the room and being involved in the conversation. I think that is absolutely true, and this week's episode nailed that sentiment. Also, keepable is a word, which is a shame because I thought you'd nailed a perfectly acceptable neologism.
That was nice of you to shoutout Jody. Love his videos as somebody who can't afford Rolex, Omega, Vacheron, Zenith, etc.
I watch his stuff plenty myself. I think hes great!
I love Jody’s videos but I didn’t know he was on this
Great episode as always guys. I would never buy a fake willingly but those 1:1 clones are scary. Like you say a reputable seller is key.
"Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, and fool me three times you're f**ked."
- George Bamford 2023
Love it!
Great episode chaps.
That should be on a t shirt.
Tombstone vibes 🪦
Third time, completely f*cked🤘
@@marcusflack1523 I think so
This was gold.
This for me has been by far the most educational episode yet. I absolutely loved learning more about the fake watch market and yet I feel that a lot of us will come away far more vigilant.
It's a terrifying ordeal and one which I can only feel sorry for George in his situations.
I loved this episode so much and it's a nice change from the more casual episodes.
Keep up the great work👊
Ahhh fantastic that it hit the mark for you George. Yeah this was a great ep for us here with so much to dig into. Thanks for watching and commenting. Means a lot to hear how people like you respond to the content we make. 😊
I too once had a fake Tag Heuer from Bali when I was teenager. Wore it until the battery died (maybe like a year), but then was too embarrassed to get the battery changed! Really great discussion guys, absolutely loving the channel!
This episode is brilliant on so many levels. The fake speaks to the audience, the real watch speaks to the wearer. Agree with others you are taking this series to another level. 😁
🤘
Love the new season, it's on another level. Keep up the good work and looking forward to your next livestream. Your biggest fan from Iran, Sam ✌🏼
Bloody awesome IRAN....YOURE THE MANNNNNm SAMMMM. Thanks for watching
@@marcusflack1523 That's my pleasure, thank you Marcus for all the great work you've been doing all this time to make this happen. Hands down the best watch podcast/youtube series ever. ✌🏼
What's the point of owning a luxury watch if you're not going to wear it? Well, where I live, you are subject to lose it at gun point. Therefore, having the original in a safe and a fake on my wrist outside the house makes sense.
This was a great episode. Topic was on-point and all of you added perspectives/experience that make one think a bit deeper. On a more boring point, this was perhaps the easiest episode to watch. You maintained a nice casual tone, like a natural conversation, without stepping on each other and going down tangents. In other words, it was pro without looking forced. Keep going but as Teena Marie told Rick James, "Yeah, well, don't be too slick now!"
Hahahaha yesssss we may finally be finding our best angles. But def appreciate the feedback Mitch. It does mean a lot for our development. 😊
Grew up in the jewelry business and have a ton of experience with knock offs. We always lived by two mottos
If they’re knocking you off, you’re doing something right.
When they’re knocking you off, its time to start working on what comes next.
Now thats a bloody good motto. Seems like its served you well Michael.
The fact that you guys also have troubles identifying fakes these days reaaaaly scares me. Thanks for the cool, informative and entertaining content.
Yeah scares me too. That’s why a trusted dealer is vital. More now than ever.
That zenith is a thing of beauty!
Big shout-out to all London cab drivers!
You are really having a tough time...
I saw a lot of those CCTV videos on the Fake Taxi channel!!!😳
I'm terrified of buying a fake watch. It's holding me back from buying anything used and not from a boutique.
buy second hand from trusted sellers
Andrew, spot on, w'ere being bummed by Rolex, the real Rolex is 7k because they spend 100's of millions advertising/marketing, per year, that's what we're paying for. Great debate guy's
BTW, I don't buy fakes, but I can understand the normal person that does, however the people/celebs that can afford them, meh!
They don't do any advertising the stupid people do it for them for some discount
@@user-sq5hg4so9q Watch any tennis open. Rolex pays tons in advertising.
Needing a fake Rolex because you get too drunk and keep falling and messing up your Rolex is THE definition of Rolex culture
Hahahahahahaah nailed it. Nailed it. It’s just so true.
I searched for fake Rolex watches before I bought a GMT Master II because I wanted to make sure I know what mistakes they make so I can be sure mine is real. Many people would be doing this and it may explain why the number of searches are so high. I did the same before I bought my Omega Seamaster.
Wow. So you bought a fake to educate yourself? Was it a super clone or something super cheap?
@@marcusflack1523 no I did not. But by searching I learned that fake omegas don't have a black balance wheel etc. So when I finally bought a watch I was sure it was real.
Fakes are so good these days that there is always an element of doubt even when buying from a reputable dealer. It's a shame that this is the state of affairs
I bought a fake Bell and Ross in Bangkok when I was 17 years old. I am not advocating that anyone should buy fakes but it was through that I learnt about other watch brands. Ironic as this may sound, it was the AAA and double AA replica markets that exposed me to the world of watches!
This is a repeating story in the comments. So many people where red this hobby through the world of fakes and now they have amazing collections of the real deal.
The best use of a fake that I have seen is one of my friends has a couple really nice rolex watches and he keeps them safe, but wears the fakes out. So that he does not damage the originals. He only has the fakes as copy’s of the originals.
Buying a watch you’re afraid to wear means you can’t actually afford the watch and you shouldn’t have bought it.
I love it when a billionaire’s kid shames people for buying a replica. If you’ve always loved a Rolex and can’t afford the real thing, go for it. This idea that you’re some kind of imposter speaks volumes about entitlement and privilege.
Personally if I could buy a perfect 1:1 Zeitwerk I would do it in a heartbeat. My heart would leap with joy with every time change and I would love it for exactly what it was, a beautiful recreation of mechanical perfection.
Yeah….but it’s still not the real thing.
George never answered the question about the difference between his watches and the fake Heuer he purchased. He very deftly dodged it but didn't actually answer it.
Found you guys today and have watched nearly of season 1 and some of season 2. Your content has definitely gotten better and I really enjoyed this episode and the one finding the best diver under 10K, 5k and 1k.
Welcome aboard!
gotta love the shoutout to Jody - Just One More Watch, one of the best budget friendly watch channel!
Could not agree with you more Gary. There is a place for everyone at this watch table.
My issue with fakes is when a person or dealer knowingly sells a fake for the same price as the real watch. I feel like that's where most of these celebrities get duped. A lot of them really aren't watch people like that and would never be able to tell the difference between real and fake so they get played
Until they take their watch to get serviced. Then the truth hurts. Ouch.
I’m slightly ashamed to admit I’ve bought a fake watch before (with honest intentions).
I bought a fake BB58 to wear for a few weeks to see if I liked the feel of it even after the ‘honeymoon phase’. I didn’t want to drop £3k on the real thing and regret it in a months time.
Ended up buying the real deal of course… as for the fake, it’s sat in drawer with a kaput movement (of course) 😂
No shame in buying a fake watch. Buy fake watches!!!
best episode so far, also in terms of editing. shout out to the mvps in the background!
Thanks Christian. Nice to have you on board
Great discussion guys. Early in my watch collecting journey I bought several fake luxury watches. At that time I fell for the hype surrounding luxury Swiss watches and there was no way I could afford the real thing. I was buying some of the best replicas available at the time and my first purchase was a Tag Heuer Link chronograph. I couldn’t believe the quality and feel of that particular watch which only encouraged me to buy more replicas. With each purchase however I discovered that the watches only had an illusion of luxury. Every subsequent watch had quality issues and many of them serious enough to prevent any enjoyment of the watch. I eventually had to admit to myself that I had wasted my money. I then discovered vintage watches and also the fact that I could get loads of enjoyment from watches at the more affordable end of the spectrum. I have been seriously collecting for over 15 years now. Along the way I have also managed to acquire a couple of expensive Omegas and I don’t really buy much these days as I’m very happy with my collection now.
My friend what a great end to your story. I love your honesty with how the purchases made you feel and interresting that the more you get into thiosgame the more the little things become deal breakers. But def so good that you have found the right way to play the game now. All the best Craig.
When you start collecting the natural desire is to want to build your collection quickly and you usually have your sights set on watches you cannot really afford. I think this is when the temptation of fake watches is very strong. If you can get past this temptation I have discovered it’s not just owning and wearing different types of watches that I enjoy but also the hunt to find the right one. This is especially true for vintage watches. My two favourite brands are Seiko and Omega which both represent excellent value for money.
I guess I don't travel in the 'right circles'. However I've noticed that most 'normal' people don't even seem to recognize if I'm wearing a 'luxury watch'. And then any 'watch people' who would actually care will probably realize it's a fake... So there doesn't seem to be ANY upside?
Also, spending $500+ on a 'decent' replica just seems silly. If you're going to spend that much cash then there are many respectable 'real' watch brands to choose from...
I never understood why people get upset at what others do with their money. Why would I care if you bought a fake Rolex or if you bought a real one.
Can we make "Gerald Genta" be the new version of drink every time George says "Tag Heuer"?
Bloody hell you’re right. Gents gets a mention almost every ep. What an incredible legacy he left hey.
Best video podcast about watches on the Internet!!!
Yessss thanks so much!
“GP- it’s mouthwash for the eyes”, good lord where did that come from! Thanks for sharing bits of your collection!
I contend that a majority of watches labeled “Swiss Made” in the under $1,500usd range have mostly made in China components. This is especially true for micro brands.
When someone tells me that no one knows that their watch is a fake, I always say:
„But it's enough that you know".
great response.....great response.
Is that watchmaker a Stig fake or a Stig homage?
This is such an underrated comment.
or Stigs lovechild
I liked it guys. Love the idea, loved season one but honestly haven’t enjoyed everything in season 2. But this was just right. Just talking, good topic. No stig etc.👌🏻
Adrian’s Australian accent is about as real as the watches in this episode.
🏆
The best thing about clones and homage Rolex watches are their quality and price.
While fake watches are certainly trademark infringement, it’s amusing to me how much money is spent on a logo when you’re purchasing most Rolex models. When a high quality ETA based fake SUB can be purchased for ~$500 it demonstrates that you’re probably paying at least $7000 for a logo. While I don’t support brand theft, I have less sympathy for a company like Rolex which could put measures in place that would allow customers to purchase a watch from an AD.
Rolex don't want the fake watch industry to go away, they sell all the watches they can make, the fake industry is free publicityand marketing for them. It doesn't hurt them one bit, they benefit from it hugely. As discussed at least 75% (very conservative estimate) of the Rolex's you see out in the world are fakes and most of those wearing them even if they do own genuine watches wouldn't buy a real Rolex (too expensive) or wouldn't wear one 8n that situation.
Rolex would rather you wore a fake Sub than a real Tag that's for sure.
Hmmmmmm……..no ! First of all, all the clones are much, much lower quality. They excel at things that you can easily see (but also fall short there) and what you don’t see is in a completely different league. If you compare an ETA movement to a Rolex movement, then I probably just waste my time here. They are not even similar by a country mile.
And then there is all the R&D and brand promoting, which is hugely expensive. They created something that is hugely successful, that is a HARD task. It’s easy just to copy from someone else. Without the R&D and the marketing, those clones would not exist too, you do realize that ?
Also keep in mind that in watch world specs aren’t the most important. The cheap Casio G-Shock I’m wearing right now is better than any Rolex in any practical application.
Yeah it's true, when we buy a watch we pay for all their marketing we see along gran prix and the tennis...
Would they still be king if they weren't so "reassuringly expensive"?
@@d3xmeisterhave you seen a fake 3235 movement, or a 4130, or 3285? All are 1-1 (bar the free sprung balance) and individual parts can be swapped out.
In fact the latest clones are totally 1-1, everything can be swapped, it just fits and works.
@@fontyyy Hmmm, no. I’ve seen them. What you say only apply to some simple parts. They are far, far from being “1 to 1”
Problem with the fake market is I now can’t look at a submariner without assuming it’s fake. The sheer volume that are out there fake or not makes in my mind the product less desirable.
I wholeheartedly agree. I think the whole discussion re fakes these days comes down to the wearer. Are you cool with yourself knowing your wearing a lie? Or would you rather have a feeling of authenticity. It’s a conversation that’s more targeted at peoples psychology more than anything I think.
1:07:18 "they're still gonna get laid 🤷♂️" 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 love Andrew
I only just found this channel a week ago and have been addicted. Amazing content guys.
What about a video all about the best looking/fitting bracelets and strap options, other than Bark and Jack nato straps?
But that would mean we can’t shill our own products??
@@AboutEffingTime And it would mean that Adrian would have NOTHING to say.
One thing I was wondering if you guys were going to talk about was the point Adrian made about "feeling dirty" wearing a fake. Where does that feeling come from? Is it internal, or external? And additionally, what about the "dirtiness" of brands (specifically Rolex) who will not sell their goods to regular consumers? Rolex doesn't encourage or promote pure commerce (which should be free of prestige and classism), so if Rolex is bring "dirty" in this way, does it make it okay to wear their fakes?
Hmmm I think that dirty feeling comes down to the way you view yourself. I cant speak for Adrian, but for me to wear a fake today would jest never work. To me the point of this watch game is to attain and aspire for that real piece that ticks so many boxes for me. And looking down knowing it aint the real deal just makes me say to myself....What are you doing man? What are you saying by wearing that thing? But each to his own I guess.
I never considered myself a watch collector until last year when I realized I had 2 basic casio watches, 3 g-shocks, a citizen Quartz, and a timex.
Now shows like this have me buying my first automatic movement, I now own a wind up pocket watch.
Starting to plan my entry into entry level luxury. An upgrade from Pauper Luxury.
Love from Mario.
Windsor, ON, Canada 🇨🇦
As a native Detroiter, I am so proud of Shinola. I have the Runwell watch you showed on B role.
I bought an "homage" from Steinhart of the Rolex Yachtmaster Everrose. Wore it to work (casino dealer) and several people asked me if it was a Rolex. Every time I explained that it was an homage I became less fond of the Steinhart. After a couple days I stopped wearing it. It felt dishonest.
Wow yeah wearing that in a casino context was a ballsy thing to do. If you were gonna get drilled with Watch questions pretty sure a casino has loads of people that know the watch game.
Fascinating opinions. Just incredible points of views. Great job lads
Hell yes, another episode!!! Question, when are Bark & Jack straps back? Ivw got a new hamilton khaki auto that is begging for one
Loved this episode, really entertaining😂
Was dissapointed to see another watch youtuber being indifferent and being OK with wearing fakes in a Q&A episode.
Great that it hit the spot with you deskdiver. Nice to have you along for the ride.
Guys you are great just found your channel - following now. One minor gripe (awesome content by the way) the heads on your logo should represent your individuality more. Three skulls is hard to differentiate at a glance) and also will won’t let you cross over into some territories in the east. try more cool characters using glasses, hair and t shirts and shirts.
Ps. I’m in a highly creative business myself. Minor grip aside loving the show
Cracking episode lads. Must say nice to see an episode with the back to basics format. Fakes scare the life out of me and you guys just proved why we should all be concerned. (In my view and in answer to Andrew’s question, it’s never ok…even if it boosts the ego.) Just bought a vintage Kermit from a dealer and am petrified. Can’t understand why brands like Rolex don’t do more to help their customers in this space.
I have to agree with you NVA. When you start climbing the ladder in the watch game it gets increasingly unstable in that regard. The super clones are sooooo convincing. glad the ep held some good information for you.
They don't "do more" for the same reason they don't make any effort to stop (the right) people flipping watches from AD to grey importer (and in many cases doubling the price) and for the same reason the AD's won't sell to just anyone.
Because they want the market demand to be that high, it just adds to the prestige.
No one in the world would suggest that "fake diamonds" shouldn't exist, 99% of the clear white, flat sided stones in jewellery aren't real diamonds. A diamond carries that much prestige if you see what appears to be one you presume it's a "fake". From the plastic in the ones in your granddaughters play jewellery, to the ones grown in a lab in Pandora (god I hate that cheap, monkey metal/plastic stone junk, but my daughters love it), they must outnumber real diamonds 10,000 to 1. It does not diminish the value of a real diamond one little bit. If anything it enhances it.
Same with a Rolex.
Those trying to pass superclones off as real in social situations, fine, it hurts no one if they get away with it, only hurts them it they don't!
Those trying to sell them as genuine, not fine. If you're buying one outside of an insured situation, take the back off, hack the movement, no adjusters on the balance wheel? Walk away. Seller won't let you? Walk away.
@@fontyyy appreciate the reply and agree with your points. One day I will learn how to hack a movement without worrying risk of destroying a watch 😏… Maybe casting doubt is part of their plan to drive the layman to the massively over priced new Rolex Certfieds sold by their ADs ie if you want certainty you have to come to me and pay well above market. Personally I much prefer Omega and Longines approach ie we care about our customers.
Rolex don't care, as GB said, it's not taking away sales from them, only from the indy's/micro brands
Go get it checked out, I hope you have and OG Kermit BTW
Loved the episode!! Some unexpected directions that kept the conversation interesting!
We love the unexpected. Great to have you along for the ride Logan. 🎉🎉🎉
Genuinely interesting chat guys, thoroughly enjoyed it -it was refreshing to hear your honesty too about buying fakes in the past. My experience; I had a friend who travelled to China for work, and he asked if I wanted him to bring me back a watch - at the time I didn't own anything decent really, but aspired to. I asked him for a black ceramic Submariner... original I know. A few weeks later he returned and handed me the watch, for which I'd given him £60GBP for. And while it was a pretty "good" fake, I was filled with disappointment and regret.
I wanted to capture that feeling of owning the watch I'd lusted after for so long, and when I had what I thought would do that for a fraction of the cost, it just did not give me that feeling - not out of snobbery, it just didn't feel right, it didn't give me that feeling of accomplishment, that feeling of owning something which will be around for longer than I will and can hand down to my children. I would never have lied to anyone if they asked if it was real or fake, and I wouldn't have been able to be comfortable with having to explain to someone why I'm wearing a fake - I wouldn't have a decent enough answer.
That same day, I handed to the watch to my much younger brother who was delighted, and then a few weeks later, I stumped up the cash and bought a genuine Submariner for a good price at the time. This gave me all the feelings I'd wanted and sent me on a totally different journey with my watches from then on. It taught me, that no matter what watch it is, I couldn't bare to wear it if it was a fake.
There's plenty of people out there who will tell you you're an idiot for spending that sort of money on a real one, and, even some, who if you gave them a real one, they would say "no thank's, I'd rather not be a chump who just spent 10 grand on a stupid watch, this replica will do". Good for them, but that's not me I'm afraid!
Great show guys!
Great level of honestly there. And I think your sentiments will resonate with so many others out there in the watch game. Interesting how the fake seemed to motivate the actual purchase of the legit model hey. There is a comment about that tells a similar story from @TheCameltotem. Check it out.
Your best episode yet - and that says a lot!
Ahhh thanks Flemming. Great to have you on board🎉🎉🎉
Your shows are getting better and better.
Love it .
🤘
Great that it’s hitting the mark for you Mark. Mark my words we will aim to realest this process for you again and again.
I actually own a couple of San Martin watches and they are an exceptional build. I do believe they are built to look like it's a lot of very popular watches. However, the quality of their watches is impeccable
And your the richer for it!! Cheers!
The Thomas Crowne Affair was in my head at one point of this discussion .....
This show is mouthwash for my brain, keep up the great work gents.
We will keep the hygiene flowing thick and fast. Minty fresh!
Great episode, but you left out one extremely important consideration - the proceeds from the sales of counterfeit goods (including but not limited to luxury watches) fund some of the worst people on the planet, including organized crime, cartels, and international terrorists.
Indeed you are correct. This is a very dark side of the conversation hey. Hmmmmm
I'm new to watches but have had other interests where the price of the equipment carried status within that group. I saw people with expensive guns who couldn't shoot, expensive bikes who couldn't ride, expensive cars that couldn't drive and I'm sure there are people with expensive watches but no money.
In the 6-7 months since I bought my first watch 30+ more followed, mostly used stuff on eBay well below the MSRP. I'd never really sacrifice to have a watch so realistically the absolute top of my price range would be $5K, which works out pretty good for me as I like the offerings from Omega the most and can be found in the pre-owned market well within my price range.
Through the 30+ watches I've bought, I learned a lot about what I like and what I don't. I've thought about buying a fake Omega but the good ones cost $450-$600 which is a 1/4 of what a real one can be bought for. That same money would buy a nice used Tissot Seastar or Hamilton Khaki Scuba or a new Islander from Long Island Watches. I plan to sale about 2 dozen of the watches I have and spending that towards one of the Omegas I want and I'm sure at least 2 more of the Islander styles will end up in my watch case.
That hour + just flew by. Great episode guys.
Zing zing zing🎉🎉🎉
I received a San Martin BB58 as a gift for Christmas- it’s the same size and dimensions as the original Tudor, except with a sapphire instead of an aluminum bezel and a Seiko NH35 movement. The quality of the bracelet and case were frankly impressive, but the stem failed to consistently turn the movement. And because it was $237 to return it to China (and the watch cost $235), it’s now sitting with a watchmaker getting fixed.
Hmmmmm
I agree with those comments saying season 2 is even better than season 1 (with the exception of Lucien episode, that one was actually the worst of all for me, but you compensated with a great therapy session last week). I have one kind request/suggestion: could you make a playlist of only the BYOI parts? Oh, and one more question, although I'm sure it was asked before, I just haven't seen it in the comments: Where can I get such cool clocks as GB has in the room where you're shooting? Thank you guys for what you do, AET is by far my most favorite content on the internet! Greetings from the Czech Republic 🙂
Good suggestion re the BYOI. I think that’s something we will do. As many others really resonate with this section. It’s like a surprise in the box. You don’t know what’s gonna pop out but when it does it’s super refreshing.
I would like to remind everyone who buys a fake watch because they can't afford it or dont want to pay for that real watch is that when you buy the fake one and put it on you STILL don't have the watch just remember that in fact now you threw away some of the money you could've use for the real one it's all an illusion.
nailed it
Just remember when they make you buy 16 tudors and date justs to get on a wait list they’re still not the Daytona you actually wanted to buy, lol. Just remember that whenever you wear your Rolex shitters you bought just to get the good one you actually wanted.
Crazy hearing George’s speech at 27:50 after having received this morning a package containing my first Omega. I can’t afford a current model. I can’t afford a vintage Omega auto. I can’t afford a vintage Omega Constellation “Pie Pan” in good condition, let alone its servicing. But I can afford a cool, vintage 1977 Omega Constellation Quartz Calibre 1330 straight from the Quartz Crisis. And wearing it today, having learnt about these calibres during the research, knowing their meaning in the history of horology, feels so much better than any homage or fake would.
I don't justify the purchase of fake watches. But at the same time I always wonder if it could be considered as a entry gate to the watch world. Greatings from a Bolivian fan!!
Def on the money there. Check out the comment above from @TheCameltotem. His story is exactly what you are talking about.
Sweet episode. Ive been ‘into’ watches for about a year. Ive had watches all my life though and I think before that point, if someone showed me a Rolex, fake or not, I would have assumed it was legit. Its only being in the ‘hobby’ more thats made me aware of fakes at all price points.
Id say the average consumer who wants a *insert luxury watch name* will go for a fake if its cheap enough, to ‘flex’. Its the same as people who have a poverty spec Merc/BM just to say they have the badge!
Hilarious Crocs higher than Nike and Adidas regarding fake list🤦♂️Excellent content guys👍👍👍
I do a ton of Seiko mods, my favorite of which is an explorer. In particular, it uses a seiko movement and it says Seiko on an explorer dial which makes it clearly a fake. For some reason I find this acceptable because it doesn't try to deceive anyone into thinking it's genuinely a Rolex AT ALL. I recently built an air king copy that is branded Rolex however and I'm much more conflicted about that one. I would always tell someone immediately it's fake but I hate the idea that someone might pass me on the street and think it's real. But damn it, it looks so cool though!
Man I so wanna get into this modding game as well. Sounds super interesting indeed. Yeah I hear ya about the logo on the dial. Would make my a little nervous as well. Hey why not do a little extra mod on the logo yourself and make a game of it ya know. Really play with the mod and make it your own.
Is it a seiko oem dial? I get that it's not a Rolex, and seiko modding is a big thing, but they have had lawsuits of ppl throwing their brand onto dials/watches and claiming it as a seiko. You get what I mean? You aren't receiving ppl into thinking it's a real Rolex, but it's possible ppl may think its a Seiko. Mods should stick to no logo dials unless if it's OEM produced by seiko.
Psychology 101, status
First: You are really the best Watchcast 👍
I like the starbucks a lot. The dealer gives me only a laugh. So I buy a Steinhart hommage. Now a question myself, get I more fun from the original?
For the saved money, I can buy a nice Tag 😉 Even two !
That Hamilton clock in the background is telling me to get myself a Ventura
And pull outlet your old Elvis records.
Finally a good episode. Honestly i had a hard time enjoying the first few episodes of this season. Good work on this one, it felt like season 1 again :)
Have no fear. There are plenty of amazing eps to come. It’s only getting better from this point.
My coworkers brother in-law did exactly what you mentioned (bought a AAA fake of each of the real Rolexes he has, to wear day to day) some people just aren't that interested in brands other than the handful they know. In his mind it's justified, by the fact that they do own the real thing at home.
They don't have to feel bad keeping the real watch perfect in a watch box while it keeps value, and they get to wear (and beat up) the fake one while getting recognition for owning the genuine article, not pretending to be something he's not. Hope that makes sense. I don't want to say fakes are a good thing for the swiss watch market, I just want to give the perspective of someone whose well off, who just wants to have his cake and eat it too (for no risk)... Long as you don't wear it in London
So strange that it’s got to this point huh. That even if u own the real thing. You can’t just put it on and rock it in the city. I get your point re the fake is like your insurance policy if someone wants to rob you. But your still going to have the trauma of the mugging right. I think you would be better off wearing a cool micro brand in the city and wear your real thing at the appropriate times. Supporting the fake industry does not feel right in any industry.
@@marcusflack1523 I agree. I get his perspective that as long as he isn't in London, Barcelona, etc. He can wear his watch for "zero risk", but he's still supporting the fake watch market which just feels fundamentally wrong to me.
I wouldn't be surprised if many Rolex owners do this (especially in Asia where there's easy access to perfect clones), purely as a way to protect their real collection. The fakes are INCREDIBLY convincing, even to people who know what they're looking for. But it's the point of lying to yourself and everyone else that I can't get over
The outro is 🔥
Good job, Marcus!
Glad you liked it Saikiranmushkara. Its poeple like you that I make these extra touches for.
@@marcusflack1523 Keep them coming!
What an episode! I watched and rewatched multiple times. Good stuff 🧐
Glad to see there was so much in there for you. We def aim to value add to peoples information streams.
BOUGHT = past tense: to buy
BROUGHT = past tense: to bring
Hey guys love the show. quick question where do you get your watch wall clocks?
most are direct from the brands themselves so they cannot be purchased. Others only George knows I think.
I loved this episode, I am glad I have found you
Ahhh awesome that its hitting the mark for you Maria. More to come.
THANK U GUYS. Loved it as Always. Recently i went into a Cobbler/Key Cutters Shop...He had FAKE Casio F91Ws for Sale.When i asked he told me they were FAKE..! GO FIGURE..!😎🙏🙏🙏
Hahahah not even hiding it huh
Thanks for asking the obvious question on why the fake Tag was not credible from a Bmford standpoint. I was wanting to know the same thing
I cannot per personally bash on anyone who buys a fake watch. Some people aspire to have "that watch" but will never be able to afford it and this may be the closest thing in reach. I personally would not buy a fake watch! There are so many good watches out there at every price range (I have gold plated vintage Seiko 5 that cost me £30) that there is no need to buy a fake watch but that it's all dependent on the person’s motivation for wanting the watch! One thing I have learnt over the years is the look of a watch can be way different to the feel of a watch when on the wrist so everyone should go out there and try on as many watches as possible and pick the ones that feel good and speak to them!!
Buzzing with Adrian’s mondaine, my first ever watch was a mondaine EVO2 for my 18th birthday! Recently picked up a 1960s vintage mondaine with a linen dial! Such elegant simplicity for a great price point
The search term "fake Rolex" doesn't really tell whether people searching for fakes to purchase, or they want to learn how to identify fakes so they know they're legit. I don't want to own a fake but I know I've searched for fakes to understand how I can avoid being stung
Fair point indeed. Many others are in the same box as you.
I’ve been listening to your podcast. I just realized you had a you tube channel. Bravo guys. Love this show!!!!
Fab to have you on board with us in the land of visuals.
To provide another perspective on fake watches. I couldn't decide between a Rolex Batman and an Omega P.O. GMT titanium. I ran across a fake Batman, almost perfect in reproduction, for $115.00. Since Rolex won't allow me to borrow a watch for a week to see how it wears, I purchased the fake and wore it for 6 months off and on, always ensuring I let anyone who inquired that it was indeed a fake and why I was wearing it. I concluded I didn't like the sharp edges of the Batman, also, it was hard to acquire the time quickly. So I bought an original Omega P.O. GMT Titanium. If it weren't for that fake, I would've pulled the trigger on the Batman, regretted it due to the feeling on my wrist, and regretted my purchase, eventually trying to sell it. I've had my P.O. GMT for 3 years, not one regret; super comfortable and light.
Love the content guys, I'm recent fan. Find funny that you guys say f**k so much that some times the editor doesn't catch it 😂
Thought Adrian thoughts on the homage worth to the real watch with the degree analogy was spot on.
it's flawed though.
It takes ZERO skill to copy a degree paper. If it was hand written and you'd copied even nuance of his hand writing maybe you'd have a point.
So, it does take some skill to turn out a 1 to 1 3235 movement that can keep time to Rolex level of accuracy.
The quartz watches that are $20 in the fake market in China maybe, the ones that are $600 and can take Rolex parts many times 1 - 1 direct replacement...not so much I don't think.
I’m 25 minutes into the show and truly enjoying the discussion; however, I am completely drooling over the curves, lines, and reflections of that Hamilton Ventura wall clock. I never appreciated the watch before but will be looking into it now. Cheers!
And you could also crack put your old Elvis records to go with that Hamilton. Bloody nice huh.
I know I will never spend 50k+ on a gold Rolex Smurf so I bought a Squale 1545 instead and it checks off all the boxes: sapphire crystal, nice blue sunburst dial, and a solid ETA movement. Plus I have the peace of mind I will never get robbed for my Squale. Who cares what people think…lol