I've Changed My Mind On This Debate
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- čas přidán 7. 05. 2024
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YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW GOOD TIM DUCAN WAS
Unc was losing it
Unc really been going thru it these last weeks😂😂😂
Fr
@@LegoFilms511 It’s a meme lol
chill bro you didn’t even watch the video
Wemby is 20. This f-ery won’t go on for much longer. Thank God!
I was like, man he gonna be in goat debate but I forgot about longevity, I agree, but, if I want the best team for 10 years wemby is definitely my first pick
@@micahheyward5342that’s quite literally the joke brother
huh? corny ass comment. bro dont even know the context of this statement
@@micahheyward5342yeah thats what hes referebcing
@@micahheyward5342it went over your head Micah
It's ironic how a video that's about "bad takes" is sponsored by a betting site. 100/10
Money is money
@@bilalprob fair
Timmy was one Ray Allen shot from not only having 6 rings but having a full sweep of LeBalco James in the finals.
I also think the fact that the Spurs haven't done jack shit since Duncan left them maybe argues he had more to do with their success than Pop or the organization.
Yeah but it happened tho.. that's like saying GSW would've have win the 2016 finals if LeBron didn't block Andre
@@FalconPaladinyea let’s jus forget that the rest of the big 3 also retired and after duncan retired their best player left after they made the wcf and were up 20 against the avenger warriors before kawhi got hurt in 2017 (without tim duncan) shut yo ass up
@@FalconPaladin orrr u know... the rest of that team also aging and leaving?
Ray Allen saved lebrons legacy wouldn't even be in top ten other wise
jimmy is so good at constructing arguments that he could say Javale McGee was the goat and I’d somehow end up agreeing with him… 😂
Sheep mentality
Did you just admit that you’re a sheep?
No
@@ryankayombya7576fr hahaha, these guys think he’s proving something with those meaningless charts, jimmy changes his narrative every video
Dawg I haven’t seen you since 2020
The CZcams algorithm has to be confused AF considering I watch NO other sports content. But by god, it KNOWS your video gets top slot.
Check out baseball doesn’t exist
@@z.r.r4593 fr, don't play baseball, don't watch it and I think it's boring, religiously watch that man tho
@@howaboutthis9233 Ay! BDE is one of the best YTers out there. I'm Australian. Baseball doesn't exist in this country, but I've watched 95% of his video's 😂
I hate baseball, love that channel...its funny because until now i was sure i was the only one@howaboutthis9233
Channel: GOAT is 🔥
Y’all forgot that Tim Duncan never missed the playoffs in his whole career, and every single season the Spurs were a 50+ win team. Both of those are NBA records. I don’t think it’s outlandish to have Tim Duncan as high as Top 5.
He’s not saying Tim Duncan was overrated as a player, his point emphasizes that timmy has become overrated in the all time rankings as how I perceive it. While timmy was good, he was just not the “Best Player on the League” type guy for some years. Note that I said SOME not EVERY YEAR. Jimmy states that he is a beneficiary of the Spurs System and that is a fact because let’s be honest. You would not pick Tim Duncan over Kareem, Hakeem, and Shaq or players of that caliber. While timmy is the system, and you could not replace any other player in his spot he’s just not that DOG if you know what I mean which matters in this all time rankings in jimmy’s case of course. For instance in 2007 nba finals when Tony Parker won the finals mvp, why didn’t Tim Duncan win it? What’s his reasons? I mean the Spurs played against a sub par finals team. Or what about when they lost to an 8th seed on 2011? I mean would a 60 win team with shaq lose to an 8th seed? I don’t think so. That’s what I mean when he is an beneficiary of the Spurs System because although he’s the head and he created it, some players on the all time rankings are the SYSTEM. Like I said earlier you could not replace timmy within the system but for instance he doesn’t have HOF teammates, can he go on a tear like KG did? Can he do what Dirk did? Nah. Although timmy is great and he is a TOP 10 player of all time, he just doesn’t crack the top 5 for many reasons.
Ps just explaining jimmy’s point not trying to get into an argument
@@hasbulla1308 buddy what the actual fuck are you talking about. TIM DUNCAN IS THE SYSTEM. To never miss the playoffs in your whole 17 year career and to win 50+ games in every one of those seasons speaks for volumes of how dominant Tim Duncan really was. No player you just listed is in that conversation period. You take Tim Duncan out of San Antonio and I guarantee you the Spurs don’t win a single title. The fact that you’re sitting and believing the words coming out of your mouth is blasphemy. “Not that dOG” that “DOG” has done stuff no one will ever come close to doing again. That “DOG” found the fountain of youth and was able to be productive through is long career and was always a key asset to the team’s success even in the twilight of his career.
That “DOG” was a
*5× NBA champion
* 3× NBA Finals MVP
* 2× NBA Most Valuable Player
* 15× NBA All-Star
* 10× All-NBA First Team
* 3× All-NBA Second Team
* 2× All-NBA Third Team
* 8× NBA All-Defensive First Team
* 7× NBA All-Defensive Second Team
* NBA Rookie of the Year
* NBA All-Rookie First Team
Tim Duncan is better than Kareem, he’s better than Hakeem, he’s better than KG and he’s certainly better than Dirk. You can basically alternate between Shaq and Duncan for all I care. I find it laughable that people try to discredit what Tim Duncan and the Spurs have done when all they did was play basketball the way it was supposed to be played. Tim Duncan was not a “System Player” he was the System, and everybody else just revolved around him.
cs his team was amazing lmao 😂 he's not top 5
@@theplug193 you’re stupid. He made every single one of his teams great. Bum take. With your logic every player that was on a good team isn’t top 5. Casual 💀
You explain everything so well and keep the point clear. Thank you.
“Corners are usually set shots to a wide open man”
Klay: sprinting to the corner to take a leaning off balance 100% contested three for the millionth time
And then he misses the next 6 wide open 3s.
(warriors fan salty about his constant slumps)
@@TwistedForHire He may be playing like shit right now. But at least 3 out of them 4 rings never would have happened without him. There is no curry without klay, he is exactly how pippen was for jordan.
Key word usually
@@G-LewFacts all these casual fans have the memory of a goldfish, either that or they’re really ungrateful
@@G-Lew True but he's still annoying with his shot selection. Your past greatness does not excuse poor decision making
Some commentator said of the Warriors in 2017 finals, along the lines of "The Cavs need to play absolutely perfect to win any games. The Warriors need to play average to sweep". I'm a die hard LeBron fan but that team was unbeatable. No team outside of all-star teams had a chance against them. Super high scoring, efficient, AND solid defense. Only Draymond could destroy that team.
💯
So the spurs giving them wits and the rockets before CPs injury just didn't happen huh?
Spurs 2014 could have beat them, or at least made it a 7 games series
The Cavs literally scored 82 in a single half in their only win of the series. That's what it took to get one win on that team
@@tridra5714That's Crazy to think of , Man , I'm so glad that I witnessed them in that year , A Locked in "2017 Warriors" is Terrifying. 2014 Spurs is the only team that I think can win "Twice" against that team. (4-2)
Duncan was the system they got players that fit his game
Except the fact that he wasn't the best play on that team for the last decade of that run. LOL
@@scottb3034 lol He was the undisputed best player on 4/5 championships and was still one of their top players for the last one. If you think otherwise then you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
@@colton6867
Yeah he was like the 2nd/3rd Best player on the 5th Ring also
He was the Best Player on the 2013 Spurs that blew the lead because of kawhi missing 10 free-throws 😂.
@@colton6867 look at the finals MVP, those state otherwise. And arguably parker was better in 2007 beyond just the Finals MVP. He took a hit in production after he turned 28. He played another decade. Had he maintained the play he had his first 8 years for another 7 you can talk. Unfortunately he didn't.
Duncan is beyond overrated. He'd be the 3rd best spur of all-time had kawhi stayed. And that's with him above gervin.
@@scottb3034 You realize Andre Iguodala won a finals MVP in 2015 over Steph Curry right? You going to argue Iggy was the best player on the team? As far as the 07 championship there is no argument for Parker over Duncan, that statement is absurd. Duncan was 1st team All-NBA, and finished top 4 in MVP voting that year and was robbed of DPOY. There is no debate between him and Parker as to who was best on the team.. None. I don't even wanna argue Kawhi over Duncan. You honestly believe a guy who's lucky to play 50 games in a season is better than a guy who was winning MVPs and championships in Shaq and Kobe's prime with no other all-star on his team?
I like this video. You bold af with these takes bro lol. And you backed up what you were saying with stats as much as you could. Big respect.
I don’t hate the Wemby take, but I think its funny that he turned out to be this good after you had a whole video about tempering expectations of him at the beginning of the season.
He's definitely going to have a few all time great seasons, but you still have to question the longevity. I'd bet he doesn't win any championships or MVPs or DPOYs after he turns 30.
@@denisl2760who knows but if his longevity continues he will be the goat. What he is doing as a rookie is incredible and if he keeps this up and improves into his prime and plays at this level or above for 15 seasons he would be top 5 easily
@@denisl2760I don't think he'll slow down too much until those pesky mid 30s, can see him winning 10× DPOY and 8× MVP.
@@denisl2760agreed, he has to absorb some of kareem longetivity if he want to win a championship after 30
Wendy being good from the very beginning was one of the easiest things ever to see happen.
I’m no genius. I’m no basketball mastermind. It was just obvious as hell, that’s all.
The corner 3 was always the hardest shot to me. Never understood while everyone side the opposite
i played center in highschool. i couldn’t shoot a 3 for my life… unless it was a corner 3. they’re the easiest
Same; they always throw me off 🙁
he literally showed the numbers in the video bro
Agree. I always had trouble with getting the depth right. I'd rather shoot a slightly longer shot from up top. My best shot was always slightly off to the side near the top of the key; a little bit of angle on the board helped my depth perception a lot. I also always worried about stepping out of bounds in the corners.
Yeah I saw that take and I immediately agreed. The problem abt coner threes is that it is either in or an airball. Non corner threes have swish, bank, better chance of bouncing off the rim, and more space to shoot
Dude I don't even really follow basketball much at all but your videos are amazing. Wish we had someone like you for NHL content.
Solid hot takes. I agree with the 2017 Warriors case the most. Forget accomplishments, just a 7 game series....that's rough. Maybe Showtime Lakers is your best heads up shot and ironically point production can be an issue.
1997 Bulls with Bison Dele. They have the scoring with Dele, they can go small without actually going small and their defense was way better than Golden State's.
start: 0:00
end: 15:23
THAT’S CRAZY 😝😝😛🤑😝😳😲😯😯😲🤯🎉🎉
CRAZY 😯😯😳😲🤯😯😳😲🤯😯😲😲😳🤯🤯😳😳😲
That’s crazy
The fuck?
🙏🙏🙏
Anyone who says corner 3s are the easiest 3s to make has never picked up a ball in their life. When you’re in the corner the basket might as well be invisible, its so impossibly hard to have a good percentage as a everyday baller from corner 3. It takes crazy skill and practice to be consistent in the corner
it ain’t that hard not gone lie
Nah corner 3 was my favorite tbh
Shot 40% from 3 in my college days, loved the corner and had a higher percentage from the corner.
You thought u did something , didn't u
I agree, corner three harder than the straight on or diagonal
TD - Disagree
LBJ - Agree
Corner 3 - Agree
Wemby - Subjective
2017 GSW - Disagree
I remember the video you made on wemby before anyone knew him and it just astonished me on how he can do everything already at such a young age and at THAT height and now to see him in the league thriving is amazing and for you to predict it is kinda crazy too 😭😭
This guy needs to get on ESPN he’s very logical. I’d much rather listen to him than anyone on ESPN
They have narratives to play, he is better off on CZcams
Yeah but you don't know if he's also good on air. Preparing, Making and editing CZcams videos is very different than being live. I'm not saying that he definitely can't, I'm just saying you can't assume he can make that transition.
All these youtubers you like are much better off staying far away from espn. Like the guy above me said, it's all about narratives. Jj Reddick I think is a good example. I used to really love his podcasts, he always came off to me as a smart guy ( I never liked the guy as a player). He is an absolute clown on espn. Not sure if his podcasts are similar to what they once were, stopped listening, but the difference is night and day with the content.
Nah Tim Legler is on ESPN
Hxmy needs to get that top tier tnt money
I think part of Tim Duncan's rise through the All-Time rankings is that he did it all for one team, which u don't think should matter, but gets in there subconsciously
Imo though Tim Duncan's career is the best blueprint of what you want out of a 1st Overall Pick for your organization
Also it helps his case the spurs quickly became a mediocre joke after he left
LeBron fan overrated Tim because he kept getting in Bron ahh 😂😂😂
@@imhotepnixonSpurs we’re the 2nd best team in the NBA in 2017 after he retired and might have won the title if Zaza didn’t injure Kawhi in WCF vs KD GSW and all they did was drop Duncan from the roster in the off season he was blessed to be in the best situation in the NBA and load managed and played light minutes the back have of his career
@@davis2k1234 that team was still heavily influenced by him, each year removed from him retiring they got more and more dog shi, people made this same mistake with brady and the patriots
The Duncan argument can also be said for Nowitzki people forget that he used to be seen as the same tier as Harden for years until 2011 (which is still an impressive run) but people forget it
The reason Dirk is viewed the way he is is BECAUSE of what happened in 2011 not in spite of what happened of in 2011
He proved himself to be better than a Harden tier player during that playoff run
@@wedge5547 yes and no im not saying he wasnt good but people tend to waaaay overrate him this days im sorry but i cant see him as a top 15 player ever (some even put him just outside the top 10) in a way the same thing is also happening with Ginobli and people saying he was better than Nash flr exemple
@@petiteexplication6249not saying you’re lying but who’s saying manu > Nash😭😭 Nash has an MVP and that already eliminates any argument towards manu
Almost everything he said during the Duncan segment could be used to describe Tom Brady who most people have as the greatest or second greatest of all time. Probably not an apples to apples comparison between NBA and NFL, but I find that interesting to think about.
Ppl don’t forget it. The average of age of nba fans online is just getting younger. Older ppl just don’t have time to sit online and chit chat all so you get 14 year old basketball reference sleuths who start to rewrite history
you just explained why the corner 3 is the easiest.... its because it's the most likely to be open... I thought everyone knew that
I've watched your videos for years without leaving a comment. This is the one that gets me to do it. You are absolutely right about corner 3s.
Jesus loves you.
leave more comments. join the community
Please papi comment more often I love your engagement into our community bubba
no hes wrong, anyone that says they are hard is just not a shooter
@@OliverWulff Oliver please spend some time understanding what he's saying. He didn't say corner 3s are hard, he said they are not the easiest 3pt shoot on the court, and he also back its up with stats... and common sense to be honest.
"I'm taking WEMBENYAMA" sounds a lot to me like "GIVE ME IGOUDALA"
Somewhere I hope that, like me, upon seeing this MJ took this personal
with the fate of the universe on the line
I WANT IGUOYAMA
MJ’s gonna take it personal and invest a billion into a time machine and average 36 his rookie year
Stop worshipping humans. Wemby is the clear #1 overall pick in a historical NBA draft
They're nothing remotely comparable, cus wemby has a legitimate chance of beginning the goat
I'm an athlete but not even close to being a basketball hobbyist, but I swear I couldn't even gauge how I would shoot those corner threes, but I could hit half court shots with sheer upper body to wrist motion (badminton), so I can say you're on point on all of these.
You got me checking my like button again on the 2017 Warriors take, 'snooze of a season' go dubs!
Totally agree with the corner 3 take, just from personal experience. Give me a top of the key 3 any day of the week.
If u play ball yk the corner 3 being the easiest is a complete lie
As someone who plays basketball, the corner three is the easiest three pointer
??? Quite literally the easiest bruh
Facts
@@j0rboeasiest is subjective “closest to the basket” is more accurate
it depends honestly, but you gotta have the right amount of power for a corner shot. not too many friendly bounces like the other spots around the arc
I've seen Tim Duncan being put on the 5-8 spot on top ten lists for over a decade.
I know friends that think his top 3-5. But 5-8 is very much a good spot for him
I think 5 - 8 is okay. Certainly somewhere in the top 15, probably in the top 10, but higher than 5 seems like a stretch to me. Top 5 career I'd buy; top 5 player not so much.
He is behind MJ, Lebron, Kareem, Shaq, Magic, and Hakeem by a safe distance. That’s 6 right there.
@@pigs6486he’s better than magic
@@pigs6486He's ahead of Hakeem (by far) but probably behind Bird. Bird has an underrated peak before his back.
I respect all the takes Jimmy, a real ball knower can usually make these decisions in their mind based off a logic developed from watching/playing the game for 20+ years
I was thinking that exact thing about the corner three when I was playing ball today
I have always thought the top of the key 3 is the easiest 3 point shot.
Me too
That always hits back or front rim for me. Wing 3 been the easiest for me atl
I think the elbow three is easier. You have more depth perception when you look at the rim and the backboard from an angle instead of head on. Plus, it's where most threes are shot.
Facts, top is easiest.
It’s all psychological.
I like right corner, but left corner hates me.
I also like left 45, but somehow right 45 makes me uncomfortable.
Everyone’s weird in a different way.
I think its better that Lebron returned to Cleveland and won a ring there after “the decision” without that people would just view him as a ring chaser the same way KD is viewed right now.
yea we likely would never have seen a 3-1 comeback if he stayed in miami. That finals was historic, probably the best.
Yep. When pushing a dude into top 10 top 5, people need to see a player win the "hard" way.
Lebron win Clevland's first Chip against the 73 win Golden State, Kobe get 2 rings without Shaq. Curry get a Chip at 22 without KD.
Dude he only went back to Cleveland because they had Kyrie and the No1 pick aka Klove trade he worked out before hand that was just his next super team it was pure coincidence it was Cleveland
Lebron in 2010 “Akron is my hometown not Cleveland I don’t owe that city anything”
Lebron in 2014 “Cleveland im coming home” FRAUD
A lot of people do view him as a ring chaser. Only difference between him & KD is that he managed to win rings with more of those teams.
KD managed to be on the best of all those teams, but he couldn't take all the people pointing out how he joined an already ELITE team that won a ring without him. But hey, he got 2 rings out of it so good for him.
@@davis2k1234they construct that roster because of him LMFAO
i completely agree with all of these, he builds his opinions and evidence so well
Okay, I really like Jimmy's videos, but this whole Tim Duncan segment just felt really wrong, like, where did that list from 2:51 come from? Duncan at 15th? What is the source? Most lists that I found from 2015-2017 had Timmy around 10th and 9th, actually, to this day Timmy is still considered in that range. So I have no idea what Jimmy is talking about, did he just pick some random instagram comments thinking they represented a large part of the fans? I always thought that most sane fans had Duncan at 10th to 7th.
What are the sources for the lists at 5:04, why are you taking a list that has Ginobili at 3rd seriously? Why does that last list have 12 players? And how are those list the "fan consensus"? There is literally no credibility to those top 10.
Also, if we followed the logic of a player's ranking rising after retirement meaning that said player has become overrated, Kobe would also be considered overrated, just look at those lists at 5:04, in 2015-2016 Kobe wasn't even in most lists (and the list that had him at 7th also had Ginobili and Iverson in the top 10), but suddenly he's around 7th and 6th for those 2023-2024 lists, so, is Kobe overrated?
I've never seen a consensus that Tim Duncan is the 3rd or 4th best player of all time, so I don't know if I'am the one out of the loop or if Jimmy created a narrative just to make a video about it, but that whole segment just felt like he cherry picked some dumb takes and just ran with it.
Someone with sense thank you🙏🏽
I am seeing a lot of 5th or 6th but never really top 3 unless they are out of their minds. Me? Have him just outside of the top 10 with curry and maybe someone like durant.
@@scottb3034Nah I have seen people saying Duncan is the goat quite a few times. Actually more than you could imagine
@@crimsonkid1863 Well they don't know what they are talking about then. He isn't even the greatest spur ever.
The 2017 Warriors were so fucking good, it was our generations version of the beetles, literally the avengers cast to stop LeThanos.
Sorry - I can't "Let it be" - it's The Beatles.
I don't blame them, if not for that league change that the warriors brought in terms of play style, LeBron is sitting on 2-3 more chips imo because he was beginning to lose his mind lol
Stop spreading these lies. The Warriors didn't need KD to beat the Cavaliers.
The only team that gave the warriors a sweat was the Rockets
@@RulingClassMentalityeven Draymond admitted that they needed KD to win moving forward. Go watch it and you stop spreading nonsense.
What people in the US don't know about Wemby is that he was playing in the Euroleague at a high level 2 years ago in Asvel. He already had played against great european players and systems. However, last year he decided to go to a smaller French team that played no European leagues and had just one game a week. This allowed him to fully prepare himself physically for the NBA without losing the opportunity to play against grown men. I saw him play live when he was 16-17 and he was stunning to see
How did the competition in the Euroleague differ for his development than what he's experiencing in the NBA? I ask, because I too have noticed there's a certain 'polish' on players that come from the Euroleague system that even in players not athletically gifted helps them succeed in the NBA.
I always figure that the high European draft picks played euro league at least 2-3 years at some point
@@isaacjohnson7573 I wonder what would happen if there were transfer portals for players (and unless there's some NIL adoption it'd be a moot point) to go play overseas leading up to draft availability to better refine their games.
@@CharlesSweet I will speak only from my experience so it'll be a little sample size but yeah, it's totally normal for Euro young players to be more polished than US young players. When I was 16 I had the HUGE opportunity to change team and go play for a team that was competing in a higher level competition.
Now, the way basketball and franchises are structured here is different from the US. You don't have high school/college championships and tournaments, you've got different tiers of levels for basically each year for teenagers, up until under19. So silver, gold and Eccellenza (a national tournament, with the best players, kinda like D1) this for every year so under 13 silver, gold and eccellenza, 14, 15 and so forth until 19. Every franchise usually has an Adult team too and they compete in adult championships, it goes like this: Serie D, C2, C1, B, A2, A (whereas D is lower and A is pros, a tier under Euroleague, here you find Armani Milano, Virtus Bologna and so on).
Now, every franchise has the freedom to do whatever they want with their youth, this means that you can find franchises that let very young players (15, 16 ecc) play with Adults or full teams with very young players compete in adult championships. I did that.
When I was 15 I got the chance to play in C1 with adults cause I was a young promising player and then the next year a Serie B team called me to be one of the young players of the team (every adult team has to have at least two under 21 on the roster, that's a rule).
Let me tell you, that changes the way you play, you go from playing with 16/17 year olds to 25 to 35 semi pro players that have been playing at a super high level for years, even older pro players, and that casts a different light on the way you see the game, everything is faster, everyone is stronger and a better player than you and there's far more tactic than you've ever experienced before.
I think the reason rookies from the US are rougher is this, yeah, maybe they're freshmen playing with seniors, but that's it, they're not playing with adults in their prime or a little after it with lightyears of experience over them.
This said, it be far better if schools here had championships and teams and tournaments too.
@@federicobravi5752 Absolutely outstanding - thank you for sharing this with me. I 100% agree that a more systematic approach (like the one you just outlined) would improve the quality of draft stocks here in the US.
He drops the lebrón bomb and starts talking about the 3 point line then 😂 you gotta love this guy lmao
Isn't the corner much easier not just because it's nearer but because it was nearer you can shoot with a higher arc which increases the room for error for the ball to go in.
i actually yelled in agreeance with you as soon as you said that corner threes arent the easiest
for me they're the worst top of the key are the easiest as a guard
@@GoulaLegamer Same. This week, when I had a shoot out with my teammate it was the first time I was much better from the corner than from the rest of the court, with 7/10 and 8/10, I was shocked, not because I hit 7 or 8 out of 10, but because I did it from the corner. F the corner 3, I prefer the backboard as a reference to shoot better (I don't bank shots, but it helps me as a reference).
I see where you all come from, but it is the easiest. He also said why, because in the corner, most of the time those sharpshooters get a clear look. That's why they say it is the easiest one. If you ask me, it's not, but to those guys in the NBA, it is.
I always airball corner threes
yeah, one of the points he brought up was the backboard, you can be a little off, but you can soft bank a 3 point shot, but from the corner, the bank 3 is far less likely to go in, so I totally agree with his points as even playing at the playground, get balied out by the backboard, but not sure I ever had if I tried shooting a corner 3.
As a Spurs' fan, the 2017 Warriors were impossible to beat beat because they had Zaza Pachulia.
I wish we could have had a healthy Kawhi Leonard for that series.
@@jacobrowe7538 ik spurs were leading, over 7 games i dont see the spurs taking that home
@@jacobrowe7538 We weren’t winning that series. The warriors were too overpowered.
The Warriors were the better team no doubt, but the Spurs totally could've won 2 games and made the series competitive. @@nicyee3701
Spurs would have won if it wasn’t for him.
I’m a Wemby stan but Magic had a FMVP without Kareem, Wilt averaged 37 & 27, and Wes was MVP. Maybe this century, but not all time
The corner three take is wild. I agree that its not the easiest three (I think wing threes which let you have depth perception but don't force you to look at the rim front-on are the easiest), but only the straight-on three is harder.
in an alternate universe the draymond argument doesn't happen, they don't get injured in 2019, and we'd be waiting right now for wemby, jokic, and luka to knock off the warriors from their 8th b2b ring this year
Those 2019 playoff injuries were some serious hexes man, even as someone rooting against them I felt bad. 5 All Stars on the team and all of them injured at one point
Tim Duncan was BAD!
Pure facts. Unless an organisation was assembling the best of the best together (somehow), nobody was knocking off the Warriors
Oh yeah 100% and if draymond doesn’t get hurt in the 3-1 finals they win that. They would be considered the greatest dynasty ever if all of them didn’t get hurt but that’s not what happened and I’m not a warriors fan or a warriors hater either I’m indifferent about them (I used to like them but matured a bit) and they did get hurt and now we have to live with them honestly having a crazy downfall
It was karma for ruining the NBA for years I guess. It sucks knowing beforehand who is going to win the ring, there was absolutely no contest.
(inb4 warriors fans assaulting my DMs)
2016-17 Warriors Were a single win away from sweeping the playoffs. They made the Cavs look hopeless. They were unfair, and I hope I never see another team like it.
U dont have a problem with lebrons miami or yall just remember the warriors superteam smh
@@ishaankulkarni9387 the miami lebron team was not a superteam, it was just arguably a decent construction around the arguably best player of all time in his prime. the warriors team had two top 3 players at their peaks simultaneously with one of the best defenders ever and another of the best shooters of all time, as well as solid role players across the board. the fact that the warriors team almost swept back to back in the playoffs while healthy and the miami lebron team lost in the finals when healthy and came very close to losing a few seasons later shows the gap
Isn't that the year that ZaZa injured Leonard when the spurs were up by 20 something?
@@maurygoldblat8982 lemme guess you got that from the rebound video😂
@@nish8399 That Heat team was a superteam bro
With the playoffs around the corner, I really want Jimmy to follow the rule of threes and make another video predicting who will win the chip this season.
You have to make a video about the west standings bro😭 cause it's crazy
When KD Joined that warriors team. I lost all the motivation to watch nba games.
But when i learned that team is breaking down 1 after another in the season where they lost to the raptors in the finals. That's where i started watching again.
No cap. Literally made me stop watching basketball until the Finals agains Toronto
I stopped watching when Miami created their big 3
@@ballngm64you stopped watching for no reason. The Miami Heat big 3 was not as “unfair” as the 17’ warriors, you still had three HOF’ers on the Celtics, Spurs, the young OKC, Kobe n Pau in LA, etc.
@@ballngm64just lying for attention
facts as a mavs fan we beat that miami team and that gave us and all the other teams hope that it could be done. that warriors team with kd was so good you didn’t even want to watch the games because you already knew the outcome
I felt like Jimmy was supposed to post this by April 1 but instead post this just hours before April 1. Funny AF
Absolutely, most of the time he got good point but Lmao that Tim Duncan take was horrible ! Especially knowing spurs history for years they didn’t do anything great that’s a winning culture with a young coach and a lot of help from stars ?! 😂
@@holypopy fr Tim duncan is easily top 6 all time
I dont watch Basketball but your videos are so good
2:47 Anyone else notice that Karl Malone is ranked at 13th?
If you had to draft a player purely from their rookie season there's no chance you take anyone other than Wilt Chamberlain. Man averaged 37pts 27rbs and was the league MVP.
Yeah, but everyone sleeps on him because of the era. Also isn’t as versatile as Wemby and was already 23. It’s a good point tho
Preach
bro if we done with the 90's, we done with the 60's a thousand times over. Wemby crossing that boy out his shi.
@@Billi84-MaBoi In all honesty, Wilt was an athletic superhuman. Wemby might have a deeper bag than rookie wilt, but wilt was way stronger and more athletic.
Yea against who?
Wilt averages 38 and 27 his rookie year and was also a freak of nature. Give me him 1st overall
playing against plumbers
I think Wilt is possibly the best athlete to have ever played, but he doesn't have the finesse snd shooting that Victor does. 1 v 1 I think Wilt breaks him, but on a team, Victor stretches the floor and controls the paint on D better (only because of his length)
@@codynorton5402 I agree that Victor has displayed better “talent” but I think with today’s advances in training wilt could easily develop the finesse and shooting of victor while remaining the greatest athlete the game has ever seen.
@@jamesondale7320he already had that in his era.
Played for the globetrotters and up until the 70’s he was a primarily a jump shooter
He also played against guys who wouldn't even be good enough to play D1 ball today
So when are you uploading a 2024 nba playoff prediction video
Wooow, your video can make a grown man question his whole life… good job man I’ m glad to follow your videos. Sending love from France 🫶
I don't get the "timmy D was surrounded by a winning culture," argument trying to TAKE AWAY from his greatness, when the same thing is used to ADD to MJ and Kobe's greatness.
Jordan made the bulls winning culture, Duncan was drafted in it
@@spideyspits1667I don’t know why that is presumed to be true. Popp is no doubt a legendary coach but most of his coaching career (and virtually all of his success ) coincided perfectly with Duncan.
Yup lol. Apparently Phil fucking Jackson, Scottie fucking Pippen, and Shaquille fucking O’Neal were all a bunch of bums being carried by MJ and Kobe, but Timmy was secretly being boosted by Pop and players better than Shaq and Pippen (Manu, Tony, Bowen, Rich J…. 😂)
@@spideyspits1667the Spurs were horrible when Duncan was drafted lol.
@@spideyspits1667 spurs hadnt made it to the western conference finals in like a decade before Timmy was drafted. He won FMVP in his third year. He was drafted into a consistently alright team and made it into a perennial contender, on the back of his consistency and fundamental play.
Dude was a day early on April fools 🤣
Bro it’s the 30th 💀 there are 31 days in March
@@josephyoung6122 america is not the only country in the world
Dude was a day early on his day early April Fools comment
@@guythatlovespotatono shit
@@Splodetimezones exist,
ignorant American npc!
2017 Warriors got me back into watching basketball after over a decade. That team was just madness to witness.
THANK YOU for mentioning the corner three. Not a hot take imo.
I do agree that the 2017 Warriors are most likely the best team in basketball history BUT if there was a team to beat them in a 7 game series, it would be the 2014 Spurs.
good take
2014 spurs would probably be my pick too
Stop it, washed up dirk took this team to 7
They were such a thing of beauty
Hell nah
That corner 3 is a trap lol. 100% agree with ya brotha
This guy is the definition of a casual fan.
He's casual now because he doesn't agree with you anymore? Yall 90s glazer were all over this man
i did not see the corner 3 discussion coming.
We are currently witnessing the slow passing of the torch from Lebron to Wemby. That's my take
Not really a take, just an observation
Watch him break like a twig in a couple years
Lebron doesn't even have the torch right now you fool. Jokic, Luka and Giannis are all better than him right now
Y'all were saying that about Zion 😆
For the way I see it, Lebron is definitely passing the torch to Luka Doncic. It's his generation and we'll praise him once he wins a title
Duncan wasn't "widely considered" to be "around 15th" when he retired. He's generally been around 8th for a decade plus: Bleacher Report had him 8th in 2013, ESPN had him 8th in 2016, CBS had him 7th in 2017, SI had him 10th in 2016, Bill Simmons had him 7th in 2010. Really unusual TikTok-like take from you.
Among the general fanbase though Duncan was DEFINITELY not top 10 when he retired, he quickly crept up the rankings though and Jimmy's take isn't wrong even if what he said about being 15th was.
The 'tiktok' take would be the opposite, saying timmy is top 5 all time😂
My point is, I don’t think he “crept up” the rankings. I’m not sure how you would go about measuring “general fan” sentiment, but my comment above is not cherry-picked; I’ve never seen a list from a “popular” outlet that had Duncan in the 15th range. It’s really hard to be universally seen as the GOAT PF (which he was before he retired) and be outside the top 10.
Tim Duncan was pretty much unanimous top 10 nearly top 5 when he retired
look up bruce bowen's top 5 all time. Even Tim duncan's teamate (bruce bowen) puts Kobe over Duncan. Duncan was great, but thrived because he literally was under Popp and the greatest offensive system ever.
Not to mention duncan "led" team USA to bronze in 2004 with lebron (the one time we saw Duncan NOT play under Popp. He failed (USA always got gold before that).
I think the rise of Duncan in the rakings is correlated to lebron fans honestly. Duncan's two main strenghts are consistency and longevity (same as Lebron's arguemnts for the GOAT). Thats why it took Gen Z kids to move Duncan up the list to also argue for Lebron to be higher than MJ (who didn't have longevity since he retired twice and early).
My hot take is that none of these are hot takes. An excellent video and breakdown of information and opinion, but not hot takes. Great vid as always, Jxmy!
The Duncan segment alone has me questioning your existence. Lol well done sir. You are the youtube goat for a reason
Wholeheartedly agree with that Bron take. The Heat had some more good years in them. I don’t think he should’ve left the Cavs and the 2020 Lakers team not lasting another season was just crazy. If Bron was more patient he could’ve had way more chips.
I think just for LeBron’s case, the Heat could have had even more great years, but not for Wade and Bosh. By 2014, Wade’s body was really breaking down on him badly and he already missed a ton of games in the last Big 3 season. His injures likely would have stayed the same even if LeBron stayed which probably would have reduced his role on the team. As for Bosh, his blood clots were always going to happen no matter what, so he would have likely would have only had one good season with LeBron had he stayed.
He had to get his home city a ring my guy. it was always the mission
The 2020 team wasn’t his fault. They didn’t have the cap space and players were asking for way more since they just won a chip
Agree and Lebron is my guy. I just think the first stint with the Cavs showed him that an organization making the wrong moves could literally break his career, so he felt like he needed to take charge. Makes sense, but I do think he's been wrong more than once.
if a single player is able to make decisions over the actual gm, that is simply a bad gm
Tim Duncan never had a losing season, 5 championships and 1 loss, Best PF of all time Tim Duncan is not overrated by any means.
Him never having a losing says infinitely more about the team than it says about him, Jordan, lebron have had losing seasons but duncan doesn't hold a candle to them, he definitely is slightly overrated
Tim Duncan was not a power forward, he was a center. He only played the 4 out of respect to David Robinson.
He is overrated by kids today, because of old folks like me saying how great he was.
Did you not watch the video? He also agrees Duncan is a top10-15 player. But people putting him top3 is going too far imho.
LeBron fans don't care about losing...duh
Interesting theory about the 3pt shot, would be cool to see the data
I respect your opinion about the 2017 Warriors, and can see why you'd feel that way, but I just can't see the 1996 Bulls ever losing a series to ANY team.
"Duncan Benefited From The System"
System = Tim Duncan
🤯🤯🤯
yeah that is like saying James Harden benefited from the system but in Harden's own words "I am the system"
Lmfaoo
Yep it's as dumb as saying Steph benefited from the warriors system.
But I do agree that duncan is not top 5 all time, he's on the same tier as kobe so probably 7-9
Yea im sure getting drafted to a team with fuckin THE Admiral DAVID ROBINSON as your Center and getting a top 5 of his era PG in Tony Parker and the last foriegn player to lead his team to a olympic gold in Manu Ginobli didnt help AT ALLL😂😂😂😂😂😂
@mical2great WTF Said Duncan Never Had Help? And Parker And Manu Were 2nd Round Picks. Nobody Projected Them As HOFers When 1st Entered. Tim Duncan Also Got MVPs And FMVPs While Playing With David. So You Tell Me Who The Alpha Was Before U Comment Something So Stupid Smooth Brain
Love your content and you give great NBA retrospect. Wishing you the best in life Jimmy, Love your vids
“You would have felt the massive role that the Spurs system and Popovich’s coaching excellence played on Duncan”
I’m not calling Tim Duncan the GOAT whatsoever, but MANY people used to attribute the Patriots success and dynasty in equal portions to Bill Belichick/their system to Tom Brady. We all know how that turned out once Brady left. The same can be said about Spurs organization as well. We just didn’t get to see Duncan on another team while he was still in the league.
Your videos never fail man. My 30 minute lunch and dinner at work while watching your new videos lowkey highkey be the highlight of my day. Straight peace and entertainment. Appreciate you fam
I 100% agree on the corner 3. Something about it that I barely see the rim for some reason, probably because I can't see the backboard. It's easier to sink 3s from the upper right or left than corner 3s.
The thing is this was NEVER an argument. Corner 3 was always the toughest.
i think a lot of the Tim Duncan love is because of the rise of advanced analytics which put Tim Duncan's value in a new light. He's not my GOAT but in certain and relevant emerging stats, he is the most valuable player of all time. As a stat oWAR and dWAR are still being worked on in basketball, but Tim is higher than anyone who's ever played, and thats seriously good
The rise of Tim Duncan's status is mostly due to the polarized nature of GOAT debates.
I recently heard someone argue for the NBA "Put up all the individual stats you want, you play Basketball to win". I kinda like that logic and with that in mind, Tim Duncan won over 1000 games in his career at a 72% winning percentage. The spurs were basically an automatic 50+ win team during his career
@@beefhammer270 that has a lot to do with the organisation. Like if your numbers are not good u aint really doing that much as fans think. not talking about duncan casue his prime was insne
he isn't....he's 24th in oWar and 2nd in dWar for an aggregate of 6th.
Even with advanced analytics he doesn't shake out as most valuable or a top 4. And things like WAR or VORP are very much a longevity thing which is why he is so high but not the only way to measure value. Sure being pretty good for a long time is great but being amazing for a shorter time may be even more valuable and better. Just ask a Jordan or a Magic. I would take their shorter, higher peak careers than duncans really long, steady one.
Agreed on the 2017 Warriors.
Jimmy is the only CZcamsr whose videos I instantly click as soon as I see them. Also, he is the reason I started watching basketball more regularly.
Thanks Jimmy, you're the 🐐
Whattt this is crazy, just now finding you again jimmy I remember watching your vids years and years ago with the classic saxophone music intro🥲i remember that vid you talked about your journey growing up playing football and basketball and then eventually getting to Washington state as a high jumper, def one of my fav vids from you. Great vid man, gonna be binging your vids now lmao
I guess this is where the term “LeGM” comes into play. 😭😭 7:15
I am on the Wemby train, big time. This kid is special, and I think we'll all be impressed with his career, when all is said and done.
we're already immensely impressed, tf do you mean we'll all be impressed, we've BEEN impressed
The "Popovic's coaching excelence" argument 1 minute and a half after exalting Kobe... Who happened to win all his championships under Phil F'n Jackson... Who also happen to have coached Jordan in all his championships
Everyone win with good to great coaching and at least decent teamates. Stop that sh*t right there
100% agree. Same as saying Steph is overrated because he played in a good system..
That one made no sense to me
LeBron had dumb and dumber for two of his four 👀
For a guy who's meant to be this profound basketball thinker that was an extremely tired and casual take. When Duncan got hurt and missed the playoffs the year after winning his first championship that supposedly great Spurs team he had with David Robinson couldn't get out of the first round against a 5th seeded Suns team whose best player Jason Kidd didn't even play in the series, they really weren't that good.
Then there was that bullshit about Duncan benefitting from continuity even though he later admitted LeBron left Miami because it was a disadvantage for him to stay on the same team, by his logic Jordan shouldn't be the GOAT.
Yeah, but without Pop and without Phil, Duncan led Team USA to a humiliation and Kobe led it to redemption
IMO Duncan is definitely between 5-8, put him anywhere in there and I’m happy with it. Only thing that bothers me about Duncan is Kobe is constantly brought up about playing with Shaq yet no one ever brings up that Duncan always had support.
Tim Duncan and Pop reminds me of Tom Brady and Bill Bellichek. I know Pop and bellichek are two of the greatest coaches of their respective sports, but would they be viewed like that if Brady and Duncan were never there?Brady is viewed as the goat but Tim Duncan is disrespected because of the system he was in, and to be fair Brady left New England and won a Super Bowl while Timmy never left San Antonio, but don’t disrespect Timmy Jimmy
I think the thing is that he is not disrespecting Tim, He gave him his flowers just said that people take it too far
also with timmy, spurs where never near the finals, until he was drafted there.
Not for nothing but I'm a Spurs fan and the system hasn't been looking that great without TD .. No matter how good the system is, you need great players to execute the plays so I agree with you.
The Difference is that Brady won 7, duncan only won 5.
look up bruce bowen's top 5 all time. Even Tim duncan's teamate (bruce bowen) puts Kobe over Duncan. Duncan was great, but thrived because he literally was under Popp and the greatest offensive system ever.
Not to mention duncan "led" team USA to bronze in 2004 with lebron (the one time we saw Duncan NOT play under Popp. He failed (USA always got gold before that).
I think the rise of Duncan in the rakings is correlated to lebron fans honestly. Duncan's two main strenghts are consistency and longevity (same as Lebron's arguemnts for the GOAT). Thats why it took Gen Z kids to move Duncan up the list to also argue for Lebron to be higher than MJ (who didn't have longevity since he retired twice and early).
@@zohkkenthe Spurs were 2 wins away in 1995....what do you mean never near?
Oh and the gervin spurs made the conference finals 3 times. 2 wins away in 83, 4 wins away in 82 and in 1979 they lost the eastern conference final in game 7 to the washington bullets.
People think the corner three is easier?! Are you serious? Like... really?
this video is so refreshing
Jimmy is the only CZcamsr who’s bad takes are actually good takes…
The only one he missed on was the lebron one cleveland was the best move for him
He missed on the Duncan one.
Nah the Timmy D take was horrible lol
He has LeBum over Timmy, peak redditor move.
That Tim duncan take was nasty
The move is to CLE needs more context, bc the warriors overpowered stopped him from collecting at LEAST two rings while he was in his prime. if he wins 2 more rings in that stint (and he came very close) the conversation is shifted completely
I agree the conner 3 is not the easiest, especially in a game environment
That last take was as real as it get‘s, 100% agree the 2017 warriors were what domination actually looked like if it was a basketball team.
under modern rules, easily the best team, not sure in a different era with a dominant center or more contact allowed by officials those guys would all be lining up behind the arc when a "snakebite" foul doesn't get called and the 3's don't fall.
1996 Bulls are better
@@hepwo91222their floor spacing would kill any defense. Modern athleticism can hardly keep up with curry running around. kd would score at will. That dominant center is wasting his time guarding Zaza while the rest of his team is getting cooked. Until they put demarcus cousins in who could go to work in the post.
Yet they still couldn't 3 peat. Pathetic!
The warriors were lucky af they didn't go up against luka or wemby
That's his worst take on this list. Warriors had only 2 superstars where past and future teams have had more.
After hearing the Tim Duncan take, I understand why you kept it in the drafts lol
If you have Duncan top 5 all time then he is overrated. Sorry but he isn't top 5
@@GetCaughtLacking Still swept your boyfriend Lebron
@@kkuwanalmao, i love how the only Explanation you could think of someone not having him in the top 5 is because they are a LeBron fan😭😂
@@user-ut5lh9xr3sWell Kobe has been dropping and hated on since he retired/died Kobe was in the discussion for No2 all time in 2011 now people saying Duncan better there was nobody post 2008-2016 saying Duncan was better then Kobe
@@GetCaughtLackingWhy Duncan can’t be top 5?
You are 100% right about the 2017 warriors.
I always agree with you, but this last hot take? I'd go with the Bulls over the Warriors. I guess the only one who really knows is Steve Kerr.
Thx jxmy, always great when you post
Thank you Jimmy for mentioning that the corner 3 is the hardest 3 to take I used to tell my teammates and they did not get it !!!
I didn’t hear any hot takes here. I wholeheartedly agree with these takes, but maybe Jimmy has molded my brain through out the years but who knows🤷♂️. Great video keep up the work 💪
if you wholeheartedly agree that there is no argument for tim duncan being top 5 all time, youre out of your mind... sorry to say it, and i dont care about accolades at all
Man I need to know what that background music that starts 1:43 is
Needed this vid. Especially on spring break!
Man, you are right. Saying all of this out loud made me think you don't know ball.