Making Collet Blocks
Vložit
- čas přidán 26. 07. 2024
- In this video I show you how I made a square and a hexagon Collet Block.
I made them because it presented me with a challenge and to save me the cost of buying a cheap set that may also need to be remachined.
In my videos, I show you what I went through while making items, I never tell any one how to do things, because no two people have the same equipment, materials or time. - Jak na to + styl
I have never seen an auto retractable thread cutting setup. Absolutely amazed. Am now going to watch all your vids
Hi, thanks for watching. sorry for some of the earlier videos…focus and audio.
@@Thesheddweller they say great mind think alike. I thought of something similiar only using a tracing attachment along with an automatic disengaging of the leadscrew drive with a Reversing Single Tooth Dog Clutch similiar to what one would see on high end precision tool room or laboratory lathe such as the Hardinge HLV-H/EM.
Nice project.
I love that single point threading tool setup. Really takes the anxiety out of the process.
thanks for watching
I liked what you have done here. I also have to agree with Phil Case (below) about the threading tool. I have never seen anything like that before: Anxiety or instantaneous panic at the end!
Very nice machine work. It is nice to see a real machinist make his own tooling!!
Hi, thanks for your comments, I've made almost all of them, and I’m still at it.
man, i love that threading aid. its the best lathe ad on ive seen in a long time. im busy rebuilding my boley5lz. once i have her up and running ill defenatly build one of those.
Hi, glad you enjoyed the video. enjoy your future projects.
Nice video! Well done instructions for making your own collet hex and square blocks! Like the quick threading tool!
Hi, cheers
Love the guitar music over the montage at the end!
Hi, thanks for watching.
Very nice I really like the auto retract thread tool holder . Couldn't you have cut the threads first leaving material for the center then do the tapered bore.
Hi Paul
Now I have a second project to take on
Greetings from Ecuador I enjoyed watching .
Hi Bella. Thanks for watching.
Bravo. I was just about to buy a collect block but you have inspired me to give it a go.
Just subscribed
Frank
(Virginia, USA)
Hi, thanks for watching, It might help to read some of the comments on these block you’ll probably find some tips in there. regards
It's a difficult job but you can do it well sir..thanks for the information sir👏👏👏👏👏🤝🤝🤝🤝🤝
Hi, many thanks.
Absolute gem of a video.
Thank you for watching.
Watching this is so satisfying
Hi, glad you enjoyed it. cheers.
Great job 👍 bro .
Please make a video on auto retractable thread cutting tool
Its amazing and I learn some good points.Thanks
Thanks for watching. regards
Автоотвод резца просто класс!!! Зачет
Привет, спасибо за просмотр.
Hold on! What the hell is that snappy thing? Bloody genious!!!
see the video ‘auto retracting thread cutter’ it shows you how I made it, and other info. cheers
Great job. I’m interested in your threading tool setup. Do you have a video describing how you made it? Thanks for sharing.
Hi, yes there is a video and drawings on my website, enjoy
Very nicely done! I will have to go back through your videos and check out all of the items I see you using here
Thanks for watching.
Nice! I've recently made an ER11 version (nowhere to buy these that I could find)... I like your thread cutting setup, that looks like it makes things real easy
thanks. its fairly easy to use, but it hellish quick to set up.
I need to make an ER11 set also. Can you share your thoughts on materials and dimensions?
@@srrlrrmuseumphillipsFirstly, Thanks for watching. I think the important thing to consider is what you can handle and what you want from your blocks, you might want to make the blocks double ended, so you might want to consider this first. As for materials I would, if I had a choice, use a medium carbon material and finish grind all dimensions after hardening. Alas, I am restricted on the hardening and when I made these ER32 collet blocks, they where given to me as offcuts for a fraction the cost of buying the material from a stockist. hope this helps
@@srrlrrmuseumphillips I had some 19mm mild steel square bar stock (I have only made the square block so far), mild steel is ok enough for my model making but it will probably get dented and may need replacement at some point. The thread for ER11 depends a bit on the type of nut you're using, mine was 14mm with 0.75 pitch (ER11M) which seems to be a common size. I set the square stock in a 4 jaw chuck, got it as centered as I could, drilled an 8mm through hole, cut the 8 degree taper for the collet and test fitted it with one of my collets. After that I did the outside machining for the thread and used a nut that I already had to get the fit right. Quite similar actually as was shown here. The most tricky part for me was that the Chinese lathe that I have doesn't list the 0.75 thread pitch in the standard gearing table but it can still be made with the standard change gears. Not sure anymore which combination I had to use for that though.
Hi, I just found your channel an clicked on the bell. Great machining videos
Nice job!
Hi, thanks for watching.
If you change the order of some of your operations it will simply the process. I suggest that you cut the threads prior to boring the collet blocks. Then you would be able to use a center without having to put something in the void created during the boring operation.
Collet blocks + coaxial indicator can be used for edge-finding too. (Just clock up the internal taper). I think that mathematically this also tests for square (because of the taper), but whether it does so practically is something I haven't analysed.
Hi, I'd be interested to know.
@@Thesheddweller I think I have decided that the taper might be less useful than a cylindrical bore.
A cylindrical bore at a tilt will go + at two points. A taper bore will be + and -, so will look just like an offset, and can be compensated by an incorrect axis position.
Hi, Paul. I'm guessing you have made these 2 collet blocks extra long to give them some counterbalance and prevent them falling out when the pressure on vice jaws is undone. The standard length blocks are a pain in the ass for falling out the vice if you don't support them with one hand whilst loosening the machine vice.
Thanks for your comment Howard. It’s true, that is one reason, the other reasons are that if the material being cut is a long piece and is also able to pass through the blocks they should also support this material, to a degree. The back end at the moment is just an exit hole but, I may make another type of collet fit this end, clamped by a draw bolt through an adapted EN32 plug, giving me at least two methods of holding material.
Excellent. I'm curious about order of operations. It seems to me that if you had applied the thread before cutting the internal taper, you could have used the live center on a spot drill in the original material. Is there a reason you didn't do it this way?
Yeah. didn’t have my thinking cap on. thanks for watching.
Thanks Paul, I'm a new subscriber but find your simple descriptions refreshing in comparison to some of the "waffle" sites. Too much gab and not enough work and too much name dropping. I'll have to catch up on your other videos. Thanks for your efforts. Regards from Canada's banana belt.👍🇨🇦🤞
Thanks Ron
2.6k👍115 comments
Nice work
Ooooh I'm loving that threading tool retractor, that homemade? I don't own a lathe yet but if ever I do, one of those is gonna have to be top of the project list.
Just noticed you have a video on it, neat.
enjoy, regards
Excellent video thank you for sharing! Subscribed :) What is the make and model of lathe you are using?
I have a Warco WM250V it’s a chinese made lathe, it's very low on power (worse at low rpm). there are many things I am not happy with, but for the money I paid, it will have to do.
Nice set using a longer body you could make two er collet sizes like 20 + 32 or 32+4Like the idea of that myself at least the 20+32 size in one but i guess its up to the machinist doing the job.
Hi, thank you for your comments. I do intend at some time to modify these blocks I thought maybe R8 on the other end.
regards.
Good work. First video of yours that I've seen. I've subscribed.
Awesome, thank you!
I was hoping to see you make one from a round stock
Hi, I usually use what Ive got to hand but I must admit I did go out and buy this stuff. cheers
Hey Paul, your up there with the best CZcams engineers but only 121 subs!!!!! Have you got any info, or even a video, about your 'home made' surface plate? Thanks, Kieron. =D
Kieron Desmond Hi, thanks for your comment.
The home made surface plate is a mongrel marriage of concrete pavement (sidewalk) slab and 3 bits of Flat granite tile from a kitchen supplier.
I used one tile and bonded it to the concrete slab with concrete glue not cement.
Then used a concrete cutter to square the slab to the shape of the tile.
Next, I glued the two other tiles back to back with some scrap blocks and labelled them side B the other as C.
I stood the main block on three small feet on top of the worktop.(block A)
Initially using valve grinding paste, I used the A, B, C, method of match grinding each part together. eBay provided the diamond lapping paste to complete the lapping process.. Finished. Have fun.
@@Thesheddweller Thanks Paul, top info =D
What is the device you are using for threading retracter.
Hi Steviegtr , about the other device, see my video on prototype automatic thread retracting tool.
GJ)
very good
Thank you for your comment.
Fine!
Hi, thanks for watching.
Nice video. Like it a lot. Do you have drawings or dimensions of the work pieces? Greetings from Germany.
Hi Roman. I only have one drawing available at the moment. Find it on www.thesheddweller.com
Regards.
I am more interested in these things please do some more jobs like this let our generation learn a lot from this!!!
Thanks and regards,
Rahul Kashyap NTTF
Hi, thank you for watching. I will do my best.
The best way to get an uneven shaft as centre as possible is: To face one end and after using your 45° marking ruler find the approximate center. Then punch it, line up with the running centre on tailstock and make a centre hole. Then lath a gripping space for your 3-jaws. Turn the shaft around and repeat. You'll lose the least amount of material this way and probably save on cutting time too. Especially if it is a big piece of work.😊
hi, thanks for that. cheers
Nice! I might have to make one of those threading tools one day. Btw, Home-made surface plate? Care to expand?
Hi, I may have to do video on this next because I’ve been asked many times.
@@Thesheddweller Thanks, in advance.
bravo 👍👏👏
Hi, thank you.
Interesting video. I am wondering what the steel is. Bright mild steel would bruise easily. But you can be careful.
oh yes, it’ll bruse alright, but I like to think I’m careful.
JESUP CRAISP IS MUCIO KRIPA NGRUSHT TURIVE HO KE KENI????????????
@@MsALDARI sorry, I can’t translate Sesotho. But, I guess you are unhappy with something. regards.
@@Thesheddweller translate translate translate po dihe tbohet si gjalp i prem me thik vetem duhe materiali duhur^
@@MsALDARI Pershendetje Po keni të drejtë, por unë u kam shpjeguar të tjerëve se duhet të merrem me atë që mund të marr, kryesisht nga skrapi ose rryma, unë jam pensionist dhe nuk kam mundësi të dal dhe të blej atë që dua. Përkthyesi nuk ka punuar dje për ndonjë arsye. me falni
👍
Cracking video mate! I got here by way of Mr. Crispin, if you don't know who he is, I highly recommended him.
Scott K Hi, thanks for watching. I am subscribed to Mr Crispin he lives not too far from me.
Лайк.
воспользовался гуглом. хотя понятия не имею, что он там вам перевел. :)
Thanks. Liked the thread gripper. Witty. Now I’ll think about this.
Always wondering why do you, in the sense of the Americans, turn the small longitudinal carriage, at such an angle of 45 *? we usually all have a parallel surface to be treated. I am one of the few who have a 5 * carriage.
Nice job. 👍 And here I thought that ER collets were a 20° included angle. I seem to remember someone making combined ER and 5C collet blocks.
I made my own collet blocks years ago. They're 5C. Yes I full well understand that ER Collets have a greater gripping range and grip tighter. But there are things the 5C Collet system can do that the ER can't. But I went beyond the normal 4 and 6 sided collets. I made 5, 7, 8, 9 and 10 sided collet blocks. This describes the process I used.
bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/forum/general/9251-collets-blocks-redux-long-post
That was interesting, I thought I went a bit bonkers with the Gear cutter index plates, thats some work.
Мастер!
Здравствуй. Спасибо за ваш добрый комментарий.
How do you grind off a specific amount? Guess it is easy to grind off too much or too little? Is that a million of tries or something less effort consuming? Thanks
Hi, with a grinder, you only take off very small amounts with each pass, so you can monitor your progress. It's best to get the the material within 5thou of required size then finish with a grinder.
I did cheat to get the results I required by using cigarette papers and moving them around below the material to achieve the desired effect.
I don't understand. Surely you create a collet block to eliminate the runout of the chuck yet you use the chuck to turn said block. My lathe is the same one and the chuck is a few thou out of true. One can get unmachined or ready machined backplates from engineering supplies?
Hi, these collet blocks were made to be used in a milling vice not the lathe. I have a number 4 morse adapter with an ER32 collet that fits in the chuck centre hole for this purpose.
Question: why wouldn’t you true the cold rolled surfaces first ?
Cold roll has tension/stresses in it from it's forming process, and machining the other features may allow these to influence the final shape/outcome of the part. There are things you can do to relax those stresses from the material and minimize those influences before major machining, or you can make corrections after.
Some have been known to start a project, do the rough work, put it on a shelf for a year or more before machining to final sizes. Some will run the part through several heating/cooling cycles, to 'normalize' the stresses that may be in the material
Machine castings are often allowed to season outside for a time, because the heat/cold cycles relaxes them, and they are less prone to change (bow or warp) on you during machining, or during the first operations of the finished machine. That is the same reason why most truckers prefer a rebuilt (that includes crankshaft line boring) over a brand new engine. The casting has been seasoned and settled (stabilized), and corrected where needed, resulting in a free working assembly under all conditions.
That's my understanding of it, anyway ... hope it helps
I did it that way knowing that the tapered bore may end up slightly off centre to the outside flats, and its easier to true up the flats to the setting paths than the other way round.
@@Thesheddweller ^^^ that, too! Forgot about how doubleboost had to work on that set from BG. I was remembering the tool & die guy mentioning the stresses that are usually in cold roll stock, and how they can work against you in precision work.
@@Thesheddweller When grinding how do you ensure the hex angles were 60 degrees? When grinding all you did was ensure opposite faces were parallel, there's no way to tell if adjacent faces were actually 60 degrees apart
@@phranklyn Hi, I put the hex bar in my Kerney and Trecker universal head and you are right they weren't exactly 60deg but the largest error was less than 0.06mm per 25mm across the flat and that is good enough for me, at least until I get it hardened then I can regrind the flats and hopefully by then I can do internal grinding to get the taper reset to suit.
Hi paul. I see that you ground the faces whilst the unit was sitting on the unground face on the machine bed. Surely that just transfers the error from one side to the other side. Should you not have turned equal diameter rounds each end, sat them in identical "V" blocks & ground the faces which then referenced off the circular ends?
Many home hobbyists do not have a surface grinder. How would you suggest that one goes from there without one? Any guidance please
By the way- Enjoyed the vid- Thanks
Hi, Graham.
I have found that whatever system one uses, there is always potential for error. For me, I have found best way to keep the error to a minimum is to have as few components between the datum face and the guaging device as possible.
Machining two collars to precisely the same diameter is hard enough, you also need two inspection quality Vee blocks to ensure accuracy along the work piece lengh, but what about the rotational accuracy. I used the surface plate and DTI against a known diameter because it was easier to do and the result is more than good enough for any workshop. The hex shape has three sets of parallel sides, but I can't garantee that the three parallels are Identical, unless I keep an eye on the opposite corners as well. At the time I didn’t have a shadowgraph to make this comparison. However, having three parallel faces and three sets of edges that were less than 0.01mm out of true is good for my money anyday.
Not having a surface grinder is not a problem use a thick glass sheet with wet and dry of various grades of paper, applying more pressure to the area requiring more material removal, use figure of eight strokes. Scraping is another method but thats a whole different ball game.
I'd have done the internal taper near the end of the job, because, if you do it early, and then screw up, you've wasted all the work in cutting the taper.
wow never seen such a tool. retractable cutter? what is it
Hi, its a thread cutting tool that when triggered will retract out of the way without altering the hand wheel settings. see how I made it in one of my other videos.
@@Thesheddweller i have already found and watched it before your answer :) thanks.
If something is made to a standard, it doesn't matter where it is made, nor by whom. Importers and wholesalers don't want to pay for quality because consumers don't want to pay, they keep buying substandard merchandise because its cheap. You get what you pay for in this world. If folk stopped buying rubbish the price would go down and the quality will go up.
Stavros
Hi, Not everybody can afford to buy hi quality stuff, I for one. For me it is the difference between new cheap stuff or good old but worn stuff.
I am lucky in a way because the machines I first worked with were 40 or more years old and were for the most part well worn, as well as very big.
While I was getting used to the peculiarities and irregularities of these huge machines to produce to a standard, I was learning to cope with what I had to work with and make do, because the boss wasn’t going to buy a new 1£m machine because I couldn’t get it to produce to a standard. The only option I had was get it right or get another job...
But I must agree, I have bought some rubbish kit in the past and if I couldn’t fix it, which for the most part I would try to, I'd buy a better quality one next time. It still wouldn’t stop me trying to get the best out of what I've got. Thats how I believe many wannabes or shed dwellers seem to be.
Could you not have put round bar of the same diameter as a collet then use a live centre to push the collet it to give a truly centred item.
(Yes. But I would have had to mill them and paid more for the materials, I do have to watch my pennies.) sorry think I missunderstood the question… did you mean same profile as the collet, yes that is a good way of dealing with it, but I’ve only got one lathe. I’ve always worked on the principal of never take the material out of the machine until its finished because it never goes back to the same place. I didn’t make a fitted bung before I started these. Mind you I suppose with hindsight I could have simply used the smallest bore collet. regards
Chamfers are sexy !! You been watching blondihacks lol
Err.. probably. regards.
what was your mandelbrot set comment?
Hi, the comment was made because surface grinding can, although being a good finish, have a reflective appearance that looks very finely patterned, a bit like the edges of the Mandelbrot pattern, thats all.
Why not make an octagonal collet block, rather than the square one?
An octagonal one will be more useful, since it will do both 4-sided, and 8-sded work.
hi, if I put the square block between two Vee blocks that does the same thing. cheers
@@Thesheddweller That would work, except you would have to adjust the depth of cut, for every other side.
@@BedsitBob my vee blocks are narrower than the furthest two corners of my square collet block, no problem there. cheers
Q tanto pones el centrador...!! no es necesario
Hola, si se refiere al perno que coloqué en el orificio y luego lo centré, lo sentí necesario para ayudar a evitar que la pieza de trabajo se salga del portabrocas.
😅 why not just use an er 32 collet, and then support with the center?
Hi, I did look at using one but, I wasn’t sure how stable it would be..Cheers
Apakah kunci cucknya itu seharusnya dilepas
Hai, terima kasih telah menonton, saya kurang memahami pertanyaan Anda. Maaf
Use coolant brother. You are messing up the drills.
thanks bro.
Много лишних операций, шлифовка вообще лишняя
Спасибо за ваши комментарии.
Why are you characterizing the Chinese tool as cheep. Why are prejudicing China for no reason. Go and get yourself an expensive tool and leave the Chinese alone. I just do not understand this kind of thinking.
The Chinese do build lots of stuff lots of it is good stuff, but where quality really counts its not so good. but it will do, that's all. have a nice day.
Because Chinese tools have earned the reputation. Are we expected to buy a tool from China just to see if it will be satisfactory? I'm fairly certain that China has the ability to make quality products, but unfortunately they focus on price over quality. Being critical to the tools they produce is not unfounded criticism. The only people that have the power to change that reputation is the Chinese by improving the quality and workmanship put into their products.
@@buckinthetree1233 Hi. Yes, I agree they do have the ability to increase the quality, but I’m sure quality is mentioned somewhere in their manufacturing processes, but quality doesn’t seem to rank too highly.
You can get anything you like made in China, to any specification and tolerance, for the right price. The "low cost and low quality" reputation exists because most of the stuff we in the West import from China exists to supply the bottom end of the market.
Tl;Dr: if you want quality, you can get it almost anywhere if you pay, including China. If you want cheap, China has the market cornered.