Vairë and Míriel: Weavers of History | Tolkien Explained
Vložit
- čas přidán 29. 12. 2023
- Vairë is among the great Valar of Middle-earth. She weaves the history of Arda itself and would play a pivotal role in the re-embodiment of Míriel, the first wife of Finwë and mother of Fëanor. Míriel would go on to weave the history of her own people - the good and the bad.
Hit subscribe and the bell for great Tolkien content every week!
Nerd of the Rings on PATREON: / nerdoftherings
NOTR merch: nerdoftherings.creator-spring...
To purchase artist work, check out these amazing artists!
Tulikoura - www.deviantart.com/tulikoura
Matthew Stewart - www.matthew-stewart.com/
BellaBergolts - www.deviantart.com/bellabergolts
Magdalena Katanska - www.artstation.com/magdalenak... / qualiney
Jerry Vanderstelt - vandersteltstudio.com/store/
Anna Podedworna - www.artstation.com/akreon
Jenny Dolfen - goldseven.wordpress.com/
Kimberly80 - www.deviantart.com/kimberly80
Turner Mohan - turner_mohan
Ted Nasmith - www.tednasmith.com/shop/
Anke Eissmann - anke.edoras-art.de/anke_illust...
Aronja Art - / aronjaart
Ivan Cavini - / ivan_cavini
Sara Morello - www.artstation.com/saramorello
Matěj Čadil - www.etsy.com/people/matejcadil
Tulikoura - www.deviantart.com/tulikoura
Aegeri - www.deviantart.com/aegeri
Justyna Dura - www.artstation.com/justynadura
Sergio Botero - www.artstation.com/sboterod
Noe Leyva - / noeleyvart
Clemence Morisseau - www.artstation.com/kahirie
Edvige Faini - www.edvigefaini.com , edvige.faini edvige_faini
Miriam Ellis - www.miriamellis.com
Stevce Lazarevski - www.artstation.com/artofstevce
Álvaro González - / alvarofernag_art
MirachRavaia - www.deviantart.com/mirachravaia
Vaire the weaver - Šárka Škorpíková
feanor with his mother miriel in gardens of lorien - steamey
Valar - Vaire the Weaver - Anna Kulisz
Vaire and Miriel - Ralph Damiani
Miriel - Silver stars - Irsanna
Mandos - Ralph Damiani
valar, mandos - kuliszu
Vaire the Weaver - Anna Kulisz
Vaire - Daniel Dougherty
The Halls of Mandos - Ralph Damiani
Cuiviénen - Jenny Dolfen
Ingwe, Finwe and Elwe - Peter Xavier Price
Miriel Serinde - Anna Kulisz
Miriel and Feanaro - Tolman Cotton
Elves - steamey
miriel weaving - alystraea art
Aredhel - Aegeri
miriel - alystraea art
Manwe - Ralph Damiani
The death of Miriel - Anna Kulisz
finwe near his wife miriel serinde - steamey
The Court of the Valar - Ralph Damiani
The First Elves - Cuivienyarna - Alystraea
Finwe and Miriel - Alystraea
miriel weaving - alystraea art
Mandos - Anna Kulisz
feanor in valinor - anotherstranger_me
feanor - Jenny Dolfen
feanor with silmaril - steamey
feanor costume - Tolman Cotton
Mandos - Janka Latečková
finwe & indis - alystraea art
children of feanor - Jenny Dolfen
brothers, fire and ice - Matej Cadil
feanor and the silmarils - Bella Bergolts
Nienna - Ralph Damiani
Nienna - Janka Latečkov
Mandos - Daniel Dougherty
Nienna - Janka Latečková
nienna - Jenny Dolfen
Autumn in the forest of Lorien - Šárka Škorpíková
Feanor - Tolman Cotton
Morgoth - Ralph Damiani
Death of Finwe - Iosselen
thingol in mandos - alystraea
The Oath of Feanor - Jenny Dolfen
Finwe in Formenos - Irsanna
A Tapestry of Sorrows - Jenny Dolfen
#tolkien #valar #silmarillion - Zábava
Check out my other Valar videos here: czcams.com/play/PLLyHBx6FRJC3c-jUP_5QbBaMyRbyx1sHI.html
Where do you get your music
Your soundtrack please 🙏🏻
Pity must have a part in Justice - that really hit hard for me. So much wisdom and mercy in Tolkein's heart to be able to write something this simple yet so profound.
It’s interesting that Turin’s father, Hurin, is cursed with seeing the demise of his children, while Miriel chooses to view the demise of her children.
*grandchildren.
Hurin saw everything with Morgoth's eyes though, which corrupt and twist all that is seen to evil. Hurin's curse was indeed cruel. At least Miriel will be able to see with her own eyes until the end of Arda and then reunite with Finwe.
I honestly forgot that Miriel, being an elf could return from death with a new body and never questioned Finwe having a second wife. After this video I really see just how crazy it is, I imagine that didn't help with Feanor hating Fingolfin, a living reminder that his own mother was unwilling to return from death, not for him, not for his father and she was as dead as dead to him and he alone of all elves would suffer that.
The fact that finwe even gave his life just so miriel could return, Finwe was a great elf indeed
Some of Tolkien's relationships and depictions of love are absolutely stunning and so very pure. To have Miriel not say one bad word against Indis is a great insight into the values of Tolkien's Elves.
Is it? It feels more like the least decent thing she could do after abandoning her family, no? Condemming one you say you love - to an Eternity of solitude would be some Morgoth level evil.
Well, he had a wonderful relationship with his wife so there you are
How should I bear a grudge against one who received what I REJECTED, and cherished what I have ABANDONED.
That's..not something I would like to hear my mother/wife say. Also not sure it's a compliment.
I'm sure being pregnant with Feanor took a lot out of her, but it really, really sounds like Miriel was suffering from postpartum depression. We know elves can die/fade from sadness, so I wonder if that was why she died?
I assume from both her saying that the strenght of many has gone into the one and from Feanor being one if not the greatest elves really did mean it cost her a measure of her own spirit in giving him life. The implication that this one birth was like the difference between having lots of children over time or having triplets all at once except its just one baby.
Damn... Even while being born Fëanor was a jerk.
In the end, it speaks to Finwes love for Miriel after a very long time, that he chooses to stay with Mandos until the ending of the world just to set her free and choose a path for herself once again. He gave up any kind of future he might have had otherwise to make amends and set another free.
And it also shows that Mandos is as always maybe harsh, but he is fair. One has to remain, but who that is, that can be negotiated.
It's so cool to finally understand the lesser-known lore of Tolkien, after I finally read the Silmarillion. Now I actually know the characters, and remember the quoted passages.
One of the most interesting parts of the History of Middle-earth is reading about how the Catholic Tolkien worked and reworked the issue of Míriel's "divorce" from Finwë and its implications.
Vaire is like a Moirai of Greek mythology, but instead of personification of destiny, she's just an observer.
I think your way of reading and voice is so calm and the background music is soothing so if you could read long summaries from tolkien and his sons’ earlier works, I could listen to it before bedtime and it would be so nice
If Vaire is meant to know whats to come as she weaves the tapestry of history, perhaps that could be another thing the Numenoreans criticize the Valar for.
I can also imagine how Miriel must be in such a state given that she voluntarily left her life after giving birth to her son...with said son eternally pouting and stuck in the Halls of Mandos.
I would assume from the text that she only weaves after the fact or as it is happening at best. It is stated that not even Mandos, who of all the Valar does know most of the future, isn't prepared for all the little things that change the course of history, only Eru knows it all before hand.
@@melkhiordarkfell4354Agreed on that, though I get the feeling later Numenoreans wouldnt see it that way.
@@myriadmediamusings especially if Sauron had lied that Vairë can see the future.
This guy is literally my source of middle earth knowledge 😅
Yeah for real, I dont think I woulda gotten into lotr lore if not for channels like these breaking things down into consumable understandable servings.
Philopsopher's Games and Girl Next Gondor are also great!!
Informative and engaging, just like this channel.
Usually I know most things on this channel. This tale was new to me. Thank you
Same.
Definitely one of the most fascinating lesser-known tales. I do wonder though if the Elves did indeed have a future when Arda was remade in the Second Music of the Ainur, how the matter of the three Elves would have been resolved.
Maybe I am odd for this but I would hope that they all abide together, in love and understanding. There are far more ways to live and to love than the binaries we've learned as kids... And if the three of them really talk through the arrangement it COULD be done. Plus - in the Second Music, who knows just how much else may have changed, and what stakes or goals might be raised up?
@@Beryllahawk You're layering modern, humanistic, liberal ideas about relationships onto Tolkien's idea for Elven relationships. Please leave your non-binary, sexual perversions out of Tolkien's pure and beautiful creation.
@@moistmike4150 you're right, but that second part of your comment is rude and uncalled for.
@@moistmike4150 I think you're being unfair to @Beryllahawk. We don't know what will happen in the Second Music, because it will not occur until after the End, so this scenario is, by definition, non-canon. As such, it is open to conjecture. Who knows what standards and customs will apply? "Modern," "humanistic," and "liberal" are not dirty words and a loving, committed, and enduring relationship among three people (or elves) is not a "perversion."
@@johnopalko5223Woke gender ideology is perverse and delusional, and contaminates the discussion of Tolkien's work.
Could you make more Videos about the other dwarf clans and their Culture, love your content
Imagine having to weave your grandsons committing atrocities, because of the oath they have given to your life-consuming son.😔
Wow! I hadn't registered this story when I read the Silmarillion. Thanks for recounting it!
Most of it is not in the Silmarillion, but in the Morgoth's Ring, if I remember well.
I love the idea of recorder gods....Thoth is my favorite Egyptian deity.
Can we just give an stand up ovation to profesor Tolkien? And Cristopher too.
Video suggestion, if you're looking for them - a what if video exploring what would have happened if Sauron had connected with the Balrog in Moria. Two of Morgoth's generals together again.
Adore the channel; you've completely changed my understanding of Tolkien's world!
Thanks so much for the suggestion - and for enjoying the channel! I’ve been contemplating a “what if the balrog survived” video - I think it could very well end up with them teaming up in some form or fashion!
@@NerdoftheRings No one could do it better, for sure. Thanks for the reply! I’m a little star struck.
Omggggg you r the only one who covered this 😍😍 I was waiting for this from forever.
Wonderful tale!
Happy New Year, NOTR!
Always love these releases, you go in depth unlike any other channel, love your work. If you've got a team by now, love the research being done. It's so great to be able to learn along with your channel the deep, beautiful lore that the mind of Tolkien has laid before us🎉
AMAZING! I love brand new stories with recognizable names.
Great way you condensed this tale into a real fascinating story made from piece meal mentions. Great job!
Fascinating as always! Happy 2024 to the NotR community! 🎉
The greatest channel on CZcams uploads!!!!!!!
Such deep and unknown insights are so much appreciated.
Hel yeah. New video. Needed this this winter break
Nice work dude thanks
This is amazing. Míriel the first case of postpartum depression? Or just not wanting the confines of the life as spelled out by Illuvatar via the Valar? Does anyone know if Tolkien had any close relationships with women who had postpartum depression or were otherwise unwilling to comply with what society told them to be (even to the point of selfharm)? this particular story is such a gem in this regard in his whole lengendarium. Thanks NOTR!
The ending of the love story and change of places between Finwe and Miriel is a bittersweet awesome story that makes one feel sad it didn´t made into the classical Sillmarillion version after Tolkien´s deceasse.
This was a very interesting one. Thanks for taking it on. I did not realize there was this much info on Miriel.
Very clever video bro good stuff!!
Excellent job telling the story. I wish it was all in live action than still artworks.
Great vid. A very interesting dynamic
That was one of your best yet! :-)
There is true tragedy in her tale and that of her son. To be so burdened by his birth that her spirit abandons life itself must've been such a heavy thing for a young Feanor to understand and to bear. Then, to see his mother seemingly-replaced by Indis? I can only imagine how troubling such things were to him. But I think the truest tragedy is in her returning, in Miriel finally seeking her own reimbodiment just as the Flight of the Noldor would begin. That the mother Feanor so loved would return just at the moment his own Doom came forth is devastating. That she would be free from the Halls even as his spirit would enter them, even moreso. Or perhaps the Halls of Mandos were never to house Feanor. Perhaps he had been cast into the Void as his ill-fated Oath portended. Either way, he would never see his mother again. And she would see him only in her tapestries. Truly, a tragic tale.
A most important tale! Well said!😁🍻❤️🧝♂️🧝♀️🧙♂️
I would like to try weaving as a hobby sometime this year!
Very good!
I'd like to suggest a video covering Tar Palantír.
One of the most beautiful episode. ❤
This similarity between Vairë and Míriel is very interesting. The bond between Finwë and Míriel is both tragic and has huge implications for the history of Middle-earth.
You sure know alot more about Tolkien and his characters than I do. I'm going to need to learn as much as I can for my channel.
love the content could you make a video on avari elves if there is enough content pls ty
Watching this made me wonder: Melkor was supposed to have a share of every Valar's power. I can see Manwe (winds), Ulmo (waters) and Aule (land and crafts), I can see Yavanna (plants and animals- this is probably how he was able to twist things to create his monsters and creatures). I guess Varda (the stars) might be where he pushes his darkness from.
Mandos might be where he can curse people, I suppose Nienna's pity becomes Melkor's scorn and contempt. Lorien's dreams may become his fear and unrest.
Perhaps Vaire's recording of history is employed when Melkor forces Hurin to see the results of his curse?
Interesting topic.
Happy New Year 2024!
Bro I love your channel
Beautiful video! 😢
Beautiful
Miriel be like Weave Me Alone. As a fellow weaver I can commiserate
that was beautiful fam
The fact that Tolkien made it so that child's birth was the only thing that could cause someone to die in the undying lands is a level of respect for the dangers that it puts women through that I have scarcely seen from men
I'm curious, where do you get the music for your videos? They are really good!
From what source is the dialogue quoted in this video? I don't remember the story in the Silmarillion having this much detail.
Do a video on The Cottage of the Lost play or something. Might be interesting
What is the music in the video? and all your videos
Vaire has the most scientific rational scorpionic thinking of all the Valar. How accurate she is in her argument. 🔥🔥🔥 just makes me love her hail her all the more 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Clearly Feanor's nature comes more from his mother than his father
Tolkien amazes me by the beauty of these female characters. As a woman who loves the Lord of the Rings these characters are so relatable and have so much beauty and depth.
Have you done the travels of the rings or the one 💍 Ring?
And what about Indis?? Didn’t anyone ask what she wanted?
She wanted Finwe, so much so that she decided to remain celibate because he was already married to Miriel. That's one of the reasons Feanor hated Indis very much. In his eyes, she pretended to be Miriel's friend, where in fact she was lusting for her husband, his father.
so cool.
Hi you don't know me probably but I am Nathan's niece my uncle told me about you and I subscribed so have a nice day!!
Miriel personal will choice of not going back to fully live again as Elve, set the key-starting point of how Feänor will became and the events of the Silmarills and well all of Middle Earth thereafter regardless of Morgoth´s intervention too, a type of butterfly effect setting of events that kinda think she actually regret later on a bit!
Could you do a what if bilbo killed gollum?
Vairë & (V)Hôra of Greek Mythology. Vairë meaning Weaver in Quenya with Hôra meaning Hour in Ancient Greek. Hours weave the Time that is Mandos (Khronos).
What if the one Ring was destroyed at the end of the first age by isildur elrond and cirdan how would the events of the third age be effected
Hey can you do a what if saruman send his army to mordor
so if i only know it in German, so the read bock of the mark what is whiten first by Bilbo and than by frodo how white the silmarisleon and if noowne is know has the vale of writing down history an descendent?
ad the end i had one of my answer
So by weaving the world's history as time marches on ever after, Míriel would come to know of what would happen in Middle Earth, during the ensuing four ages since the Years of the Trees...
While Finwe may not have been a good father. He was a good husband.
Even that's debatable. I mean, he only married another to have children, and it doesn't seem like he cared about his second wife all that much.
@@valentinkambushev4968 true
He was great at both, it was miriel who err'd even she admits this, saying that she should have returned post haste or shouldn't have chosen death at all
She was the one giving birth. It's pretty obvious that this was no normal pregnancy. What she went through sounds very much like post partum depression which is a real thing @@johnisaacfelipe6357
Vairë interesting video.
Have you done the life and death of the one ring and it's powers and user's?
Or it's travel
05:49 - Mandos is very doom-y here...
Doomsman don’t debate.
And now it is time to watch Return of the King.
How exactly would Elves have the option of returning to life. I believe this was changed and the Elves would forever remain with Mandos till the ending of the world, but why return at all? What would be the point of death? Why would everyone grieve and be shocked at Miriel’s death if they knew she could return if she wished?
1. She was the first to "die"
2. While she could have returned, she choose not to
A bit tricky to call it dying, when we are talking about elves, especially the ones in the undying lands
Have you ever played Skyrim or the elder scrolls games
Which volume of the History of Middle Earth includes this tale?
Morgoth's Ring, mostly.
I wonder if Tolkien based these characters on the Norns, Norse deities who spin the threads of fate. 🤔
There's no doubt in my mind that that's the case.
Hold on hold on hold on you mean to tell me that miriel is responsible for giving birth to the absolute crack baby feanor
It sounds like miriel doenst like finwe very much
😢😢💔🥺
😭😭😭😭
And this is why immortal peeps need a) therapy, b) family councelling and c) a wider concept of healthy relationships than christianity beat into us.
Why wasn't Fëanor named with the elvish word for "Mother killer" ?
Maybe because it is a cruel thing to give to a child? Besides, miriel choose not to return
Because Miriel’s death wasn’t his fault. He didn’t choose to kill her, he was just born by her.
Because you'd have to be extremely morbid and cruel!? Elves should have more sense than that
😍😍😍👌
It would be interesting to see how this story would be portrayed in an adaptation of _The Silmarillion,_ if at all. You can't cover _everything._
What if melkor wassent given an second chance to do good in middle earth and instead was imprisoned again
What if the 7 father's of the awaked in mount cundabad part one
What if all the elves went to valinor the entire whole age part two
So, rather than Three Fates, like in Greek and Norse Myth, Tolkien created ONE Faith, with an assistant who was once a queen.
She sounds like the standard wife. Can't make up her mind on what she wants to do lol.
??? None of this is standard... You live in a parallel universe perhaps?
Worst mother in fiction?
Toiken's version of I’m sorry I died in child labor with your son. It was my fault for being the fairer, weaker, feeble sex. Could you ever forgive me, my lord?
stop it
@@coffeedrop122 No