Turbine Engine Heat Damage
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- čas přidán 19. 10. 2018
- Have a look at the parts of an engine that nearly blew itself to pieces.
This LM2500 is/was a 35 thousand Hp engine used to generate electricity, and it was pushed a bit too hard.
Too much fuel, too much power, too much heat!
Can we fix it?
You bet... that's what we do!
The test run after being repaired is here: • The Big Engine - the G... - Auta a dopravní prostředky
I like this guy. You can tell he genuinely loves what he does and wants to help others learn more about it.
@@bradenhuxley8922 spam...
"We have some of the pieces"
yeah, the rest flew out the back.
I'm 63 and still love to learn about jet engine's Thank you for your video's
I am 73 and also enjoy it
I gotta tell ya, this guy knows his chet. This guy is a true think tank technician
I really enjoyed the video and found it very informative in terms of what state an engine can be brought back from and a bit of information about the work that’s done to get a borderline engine back into service. Very worthwhile effort.
So glad you're still doing these videos. Utterly fascinating! Thanks!
I'm so excited I happened upon this channel! Fascinating stuff!
Looking forward to catching up on some awesome videos.
You are an endless wealth of knowledge and experience sir, i greatly appreciate and enjoy the content you create.
Wow great video. Thank you. Looks like somebody must have taped over the Check Engine light.
Enjoy the before and after videos. I’ve done a bit of restoration work and it always gives me a great amount of satisfaction turning a almost trashed project into a like new again item. Keep them coming.
Thank you. It is so rare to see something taken apart when it had been on the verge of blowing up. I sure can see how turbines can come apart so quickly when things go wrong. Great video.
One of your best videos - I always wondered what "damaged" looked like!
I worked for Garrett/Honeywell Engines for a lifetime. Put my hands on many engine parts. APUs & Engines, Combustors Mounts, housings Nozzle, Stators,etc. I started there as a Machinist, for many year's then into Quality. Seen so much. Love your channel
Excellent video, as always, thanks. Before and after shots are a great addition. Makes me marvel even more at after burner tests you've posted; screaming hot gas coming out the back, no parts flying out, no sneezing out the front, and it's meant to run that way. Wow, what an invention to work on.
How much kw/ hp does this engine make brand new vs end of service life?
Hello squidgysailor, answering for myself: I don't know, but interesting question. I'd send that question to the pros.
Amazing that this engine did not suffer a "rapid unscheduled disassembly".
I always enjoy your videos but this one was particularly interesting. It's satisfying to see the "before and after". Thanks.
That nozzle damage looked familiar & it gave me an awful flashback! Great video; nice tour. Thanks.
DD
I've seen a few overtemperature events, but only a very few, over the decades - but, yes, this gives me a flashback too.
Ouch!! That's going to leave a mark on the turbine blades and wallet!
You can just hear scotty yelling "She cannay take no more captain"..."push it harder!"
Cheers, it's nice to get an insight into something specialized that I would never get to see otherwise
Scotty - beam me up to this wonderful workshop. Very interesting video - as always. Great Thanks to you.
Enjoyed that, it's more interesting than the serviceable stuff! Saw a turbine nozzle on a TPE-331 that was chewed up like the nozzle you showed. Really makes you realize how hot things can get in there!
So many beautiful parts, every single one is high quality.
We use them on the DDG and CG program. I was sitting on top the running turbine nacell aboard a missile cruiser working above when one one spit a turbine blade. It was similar to sitting stop a giant handgrenade. Parts were scattered around.
Your videos are always magnificent and you're super cool!
very awesome to see this, i work in the tool room at an arconic facility and ive worked on the molds and fixtures for these parts. also see them in their raw cast form, pretty cool to see it assembled and destroyed!
Working in the shipbuilding industry, The LM2500's were used for the main propulsion on FFG's the Oliver Hazard Perry class of fast frigates. It was my understanding the the LM2500's were for marine use. I believe they were also used on the Ageis Cruiser program.
Great video. You make the complex understandable. Thank you for posting.
WOW! Your video sound quality has improved 1000%! Good stuff AJZ!
Thank you, starfleet officer.
Cool.
Great explanation of blade locking devices.
Great job.
wow, that has been thrashed. thanks for your show. always a pleasure to watch your machinations😁😁🚲👍
just praying for this videos never stop coming every week
... that will not help...
Pretty gnarly to think about the lifecycle of a chiclet, particularly the path from its mama to the free world. Would be one heck of a gopro video.
I didn't even think about the power turbine until you mentioned it at the end. This could seriously damage that too I suppose. What a (cool looking) mess.
One last rivulet in this stream of conciousness, a timelapse of a teardown might be a cool and low-impedance method to capture that first stage of the refurb process.
Cool.
Great video once again.
Loads of damage. Wow.
Good job.
Other than having the scrap in one convenient to manage heap, this wasn't that much of a save. Still significant savings over the price of a brand new one certainly, but what you did for the used parts market will likely be felt for years. Thanks for letting us tag along AgentJayZ. I waz here and I waz impressed.
Well they saved the entire compressor and combustor. Only the turbine section was a goner.
That was one slaughtered Engine lol. Its cool to see the actual possible carnage when over driven
crazy looking damage there. I’d hate to be near that thing the last time it was running! I’m sure you guys will work your turbine engine wizardry on it and make it as good as new again.
Lemme know if you need parts Jay, LM 2500 is our bread and butter. Talking stock, ill hit up Trevor. Cheers
"Nae Cap'n, she canna tek mooch moore" Scotty, probably, just before the LM2500 blew its dilithium crystals all over the floor.
Thanks Agent JayZ, this was a very interesting episode in your journey. How long do you think it was from the onset of the chunky emissions before they shut it down and how much longer would it have been if they'd waited for it to shut itself down?
Fascinating to see. An added benefit of such damage is that one gets to see how it's designed on the inside. Hope those blades become educational tools!
Now I have to see Star Trek again, from what I remember Engineering looked like NIF, but maybe that was just the second movie.
Newification. I'm stealing that. Love the video quality.
Live long and prosper AgentJayZ!
So much carnage! This thing was shut down? As-in- still running? Wowie.
"More POWAAAH!"
-Uhh Steve... have you looked at the ETG?
I do not know the history of this engine, but the scenario you describe has happened before...
Red dust on everything, I wonder if this engine lived in the West Texas oil fields.
Super cool video, thanks for sharing.
They say Mars is the red planet, but this fine red dust accumulates in every industrial engine that comes to the shop, from all different parts of the world...
AgentJayZ as much air that flows through that thing I’m sure it picks up whatever floats in the atmosphere including volcanic dust or smoke from fires. Hard to say
I don't know much about these things, but I am quite surprised that no thermal probes are incorporated to warn of over temperature and thus potential damage conditions being met....seems like a really simple and effective way to prevent a very expensive drama...
The EGT harness was destroyed.
Many years/decades ago, I recall seeing some Olympus combustion chambers, plus other stuff, in an early episode of Dr Who.
PS I was old enough not to have to hide behind the sofa - and I must have been working at R-R, as I was able to identify the bits.
My god, just imagine the noise that thing was making in its final moments...
We just had a TF34 come through our shop that over temped and blew out the last 4 stages of the compressor and stator assemblies. it looked gnarly.
You do a respectable job I like it
Super video thanks Jay
Wow, I wonder what the efficiency was right before it was taken out of service. After refurbishing, this engine should achieve around 38% efficiency?
Excellent vid.
12:40 Yea, you can have all the sophistication you want in vibrational analysis equipment, temperature monitoring etc. It still doesn't stop the one idiot worker from overriding/cancelling it when its halting production.
I work in industrial motors, alternators, etc... The worst I have seen was a 3.3KV 1000KW motor that came in for repair. When we took it apart, the balls in the bearings were literally welded to the inner race, nothing was salvageable, despite it having everything mentioned above. The balls in the bearings were about the size of a baseball for size comparison.
Great video!
Overheated and blown apart, very cool.
Hey, that looks like a compressor case from a LM 2500! Rad
Hey AgentJayZ, thanks as always - fascinating post-mortem. Interested in what considerations would you be providing the customer with for re-fitting the engine back into work? If shards of red hot steel were flying out the back and into a power turbine, what will the customer have to do there - do you overhaul power turbines? Dooes your company provide onsite services after repair? Little but aside from the norm, but presume you dont want the thing back next week for repairs again so is there any kind of onsite professional service to ensure success when put back to work?
Another dumb question: It looks like the first 6 sets of stator blades are variable pitch and the last however many are not. Whats with the 8th set that are so much wider than the first 7? I'm guessing the variable pitch stator blades have progressively less variability as they go from the inlet towards the compressor end and the 7th could be variable but the change would be so small it just doesnt make sense to add it. It looks like theres a larger gap between the 8th and 9th set of compressor blades but the blades themselves look similar. Gotta be something special about that 8th stator set (hope I counted right).
Balancing a disk is very important thing. I know of specialized equipment designed to do just that. Armored wall vessel containing all the drive motors spinning a disk well above maximum speed that it will ever experience in real life in partial vacuum. It took 24 hours for the disk to coast to complete stop after hitting an E-Stop. The one time when the disk came out of the test assembly and penetrated the armored enclosure, it exited through the concrete wall and traveled another 40 meters in dirt away from the building. The test room was located below ground level just in case that happened. It took a metal detector and a backhoe to dig it up. Another example of that piece of equipment blew out a disk last year in the one facility located in one of the northern states. I heard the damage was extensive.
DAMN. That's insane. What incredible power. Who even manufactures these powerful disk balancing test motors.
My God...never mind Star Trek-the metallurgy, construction techniques and just the sheer forces involved with these engines are astounding.
8:00 Those NGV'S are fine, nothing a little blending won't fix. 😏
Awesome video! Thanks for all of the information! I would love to get a blade if it is possible?! Thanks for making the videos
You have to tell the owner of that engine to not let the wild Canadian hamsters loose around the inlet. They like to chew metals and they are about 2X bigger than a moose.
As promised, I am reporting back on my visit to Brownsover Hall on 10th November for a presentation by Ian Whittle on his father's life and work. The event was held in the actual room that served as Frank Whittle's office during the war. It provided an entertaining and insightful glimpse into Whittle's life and, not surprisingly, reinforced the claim that he should be regarded as the sole inventor of the modern jet engine. That an RAF engineering apprentice from a working class background should produce such a revolutionary proposal in his final thesis, written in 1929 and based on self-study, continues to astound me.
What I also found astounding was my first ever view of a cross-sectional arrangement of his LR1 bypass engine project, which he was working on before the end of the war. I'd read about it but never seen a drawing of it before: had it not been cancelled, it would have been years ahead of its time. I bought two DVDs, made some years ago, one of which I intend to send to AgentJayZ: he should be able to find a way to play it. There is a clip of Whittle's Augmentor No.4 aft fan/reheat system running in around 1944, which AgentJayZ might find interesting.
Ty, awsome video.
Very interesting to see the damage and a bit more inner anatomy that usual of the parts.
1:25 The stators half way up are bigger and further apart than the stators on either side. What is the reason for that?
Great vlog, tnx!!!
This video took me back to a and p school years ago. My group had to disassemble the hot section on a timed out phantom engine. We were the first to take apart the engine since it was retired. Our first sign of carnage was melted metal particles in the exhaust. After going deeper, the turbine blades were as bad or worse than your blades. Thank goodness the phantom had dual engines for redundancy. Since then, I never sit inline with the hot section on a jet aircraft in case something were to let back there. Have you or your company ever worked on JT-8D engines? Those were the engines I worked on the most back in the day...
I've read that the engines in the MiG-25 would be severely damaged when they'd push it up around Mach 3. I've always wondered how they would fail. It's just thermal breakdown of the components and it starts destroying itself?
The hotter you run, the more power you get. Maybe that plane had a time limited rating, like takeoff power, that the pilot could engage and eventually burn things in the engine.
Dear AgentJayZ, I've watched several of your videos. Thank you for your superbly illuminating demos & explanations. Very nice personal delivery style as well. I was wondering if you could somehow increase the closeup zoom on surfaces and textures of handheld parts, by say a factor of 10 or 15. In "Turbine Engine Heat Damage", I would have benefited from being able to see the blade damage, discoloration, deposits, etc. in greater detail /higher resolution. This is by no means a complaint, but only a request. I enjoy the presentations very much. Thanks and please keep up the great work. Love it.
I reviewed the vid, and I agree. Some folks might want to see in super close detail. I will try to keep that in mind as I make vids from now on...
Hi guys,
I'm having a discussion at work regarding a dzus fastener ingested into one of our engines. There were no in-flight symptoms reported; the fastener was found to be missing and on inspection there was a small amount of damage to the first stage compressor, so the engine was replaced.
One of the younger pilots said "it was only a tiny amount of damage, surely it's fine". I explained to him that we don't know what's happened inside and potentially one of the turbines is damaged. I probably went a bit far and said there could be a blade missing.
It's an Allison 250 C30; how much damage do you think could be done to the turbines before the engine noticeably lost power? Is it possible for part of a blade to depart and the engine continue to produce power?
Thanks much
The C30 has no axial stages in the compressor, just that big ol' centrifugal, and it's pretty tough. The turbine blades spin at over 50 thousand rpm, but they are very solid. The Dzus fastener has some steel in it, and it;s a bad thing for any turbine engine to eat. You probably but some deep gouges in the compressor, some dents and possibly some tears in the combustor liner, and maybe some impact marks on the turbine inlet guide vanes. The turbine blades would likely be undamaged. All those parts will be replaced, so it's going to be a bit pricey. If it was an industrial engine, it would be returned to service as is, most likely.
Start up is probably one of the most dangerous times for a turbine. Pilots watch itt temps until the engine spools up completely. Primer1driver had his itt go out of range on start up due to some bees that decided to build their nest in the inlet area of his engine. He now has a decal of a bee 🐝 painted on his engines to remember the expense they cost him to have the engine overhauled. If a turbine is managed properly guys like agentz most of the parts get to stay and just have clean up done with minor repair or replacement of parts that are out of tolerance.
What do you think how much would the thrust of jet engine would be affected by using adulterated fuel? And do all jet engines have variable-geometry stator blades for compressor?
Adulterated with what?
Almost all modern ones do. Some of the old ones that don't are still flying.
Kinda a late reply, but generally jet engines only really care about how much energy is produced per unit of fuel, provided the fuel doesn't gunk anything up and the fuel delivery system is ok with it. It's not like a piston engine where the exact properties of how a fuel ignites and the speed of the gas expansion are closely monitored and controlled, if it burns well it burns well.
I seriously doubt there is anything remotely practical you can add to jet fuel to make it perform better, the US military dumped a lot of money into trying to find something during the 50s and 60s and never found anything that worked, and I doubt anything new has been invented since that could work.
Thanks for a fascinating video. Do the LM series engines contain any rhenium in the blade alloys? I read that the recovery of this metal from replaced parts is critical in the jet engine industry, due to its scarcity. I'd be curious to hear about this, if you have any dealings with parts containing super rare elements.
LM2500 is a derivative of an old CF6. So. No rhenium here. Anyway turbine blade superalloys are expensive even without rhenium.
An old timer told me those variable stators use to get stuck all the time and we're a pain in the ass
As usual excellent video. At 14:00, the tool you inserted in the combustor is for maintaining the concentricity of the turbine? Also, would you make a video for this turbine installation rig? Thanks for your valuable time.
That tool is a lifter. It allows the removal or installation of the combustor without causing any damage.
About ten years ago AW&ST Mag had an article about the aviation industry running out of Ni in 30 years. The article also mentioned that some Ni was not recyclable due to its alloy and was somehow toxic. Any idea what alloy they were talking about? And is there still a looming Ni shortage in the near future?
The detailed metallurgy of the components of the engines I work on is beyond my knowledge base, so I don't have an answer for you.
You are probably thinking of alloys that used beryllium. Ni-Be-Ti alloys are very strong and heat/corrosion resistant, but beryllium is toxic in all forms and very expensive due to the extra precautions associated with handling it. Improvements in ceramic coatings have allowed it to be phased out of general use.
Why is there a nonadjustable stator stage, somewhere around the middle of the compressor, which is more massive and even hollow? They almost look like blades from the early turbine section. Is that for a mounting or a bleed air or actually cooling purpose? One can see pressure piping on the outside of the casing, leading towards those stator blades. Thanks!
It is a bleed air takeoff point. The piping is not leading to the stators, it is leading away from them.
@@AgentJayZ Thank you very much!
When temperatures reach extreme level we do microstructure with a 1000x electro microscope for evidence of Solution of the Gama Prime.. do you do hardness checks on the face of the turbine disc?
We have done so in the past, but it's not a regular thing. Over temped parts... we throw them out.
great video. if you do contact the customer could you get the story of what happened ? i wonder if it was the result of a hot start
That's pretty neat.
Is there a fluid circulating solvent tank that can clean those, reducing the hands on labor?
There are parts cleaning machines like that, but removing all of the blades to run them through such a cleaner might be more labor-intensive than just cleaning everything while it’s on the engine.
Seems like there’d be sensors present to prevent those over heat failure events
The operator hires people to run the engine. Those people make decisions, to which there are consequences. The rules are written down. Most of the time they are followed.
Thank you!
35k HP... probably gave closer to 40 or more before it was shut down. (( Just a wild guess... stuff got a bit toasty. )) Thanks for sharing!
Show the damage of bird strike if you have chance,thanks for uploading these interesting videos.
question . why do the front struts have plates welded on to one surface ?
It's a fabricated structure, made by joining formed pieces of stainless steel sheet... by welding.
Some frames and cases are made by casting. Not this one.
is it possible to obtain one of these damaged blades? would fit perfectly on my desk as an engineer
Hello Jay, nice to greet you and to see your videos. I have a question: I need information about medium / small turbines (Turbofans will be much better) say, maximum thrust of five thousand horsepower. Could you show me/explain some details? I need to know how big, how heavy, how long/high and what diameter would it be?
Thanks for your information.
Sincerely tours,
Just-Thony.
" I need information about" means everything, which is a lot of work. You'd better get at it. Whatever you are looking for, your chances of finding it depends upon your resourcefulness.
Your request is so broad and so vague, it would require weeks of research. If you actually are interested, you will enjoy the journey.
@@AgentJayZ Thank you very much for the reply. clear and frank.
Do you ever see engines that have flown through volcanic ash? I’m curious how much damage that does to various internal components.
What type of material are the turbine blades and nozzles made from, you mentioned high percentage of nickel?
As it's a GE engine, it's unlikely to use an Inconel alloy for its turbine blades: GE has its own range of Rene superalloys.
Excellent informative video as always! I'm intrigued by the compressor stator vanes half way down the compressor stator.....they look too big and they are hollow.....what's the story with those?
They fit, and they function well. It's up to the engineers and their magic to come up with a combination of numbers and shapes of these little wings to do what needs to be done. They are hollow to provide a pathway for air to escape to a collection point on the outside of the cases. Bleed air is taken off at various stages of compression, depending on the pressure needed.
The farther back along the compressor, the higher the pressure and temperature.
@@AgentJayZThanks for the explanation - I did wonder if they were for air bleed....I'm more used to see a circumferential slot in the casing wall feed an annulus where the air is drawn off.
When I worked a a welder for GE we called them blades buckets
I am goin in LM2500 soon. Just wanted to clear my doubts about the connection of rotors with the disk, that fir tree connection, how that air cooling happens in rotor blades and what exactly is hub?
In a nutshell, can u show us the brief details of the gas flow in it?
In the beginning of the manual is a description section. You should read all of it. There is a part describing the air system.
This will explain the cooling air source for the turbine blades and nozzles.
In which scene of Star Trek was the LM2500 depicted? Thanks!
The first one 2009. I think it was at 1:45. It's on the engineering deck, You will instantly recognize it now that you have seen it here!
@@AgentJayZ I scrubbed the movie several times, and I finally found the scene with the LM2500.
It's actually on the ice planet in Scotty's lab. The LM2500's cameo occurs when Scotty is escorting Kirk and Old Spock to the shuttle, and Scotty speaking of the Enterprise, says _"She is one well-endowed lady."_ The time stamp is roughly 1 hour and 25 minutes into the movie.
The viewing angle at the end of your video here, in which you're sitting next to the engine, matches the angle in the movie. Thanks again for sharing! :-)
Great vid! Quick question about the fuel control: once you've put an engine together, do you have to do any sort of calibration to the fuel control before you test it? Or are they designed in such a way that they can only deliver the correct amount of fuel?
Also burner modes are mapped, sprint curves, acoustics etc.
Thank you so much
Horrible turbine buckets before. Beautiful.
Nice drawing on the pin board, at13:00, looks like the drawings I greate on the job. That Fidget Spinner pinned next to the drawing, were does that fit on the turbine assembly.
I tried for a minute to come up with something funny. I got nothing. I wonder what the next fad toy will be.. for a few months this summer.