Canon C200 10bit 4K MY ULTIMATE WORKFLOW!
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- čas přidán 21. 08. 2024
- This is my Canon C200 10bit 422 4K Workflow that I do in Adobe Media Encoder where I take my RAW files and convert them to 10bit 422.
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#canonc200 #cinemacamera #4kworflow
10bit is so much easier to work with on your PC it just flies during editing. This is the fastest way to get 10bit IMO from the C200 RAW files.
Hi Armando, thanks for the video !
I would like to know how long does it take to convert a full 128go ?
Thanks :)
I disagree. Premiere has a very modern and intuitive Proxy workflow that is superior in my view. I think it's much better to keep the full raw capabilities by not transcoding before import. Instead use the awesome proxy workflow in Premiere by either changing your import settings in the project or even after importing your footage. You can create those same Cineform files for smooth editing, Premiere automatically links them as proxies and by the click of just one button you can switch back to the full raw information for grading, I strongly recommend to give it a try.
what is the software name ?
I'm curious if you are doing this, why not use the full 12bit Cineform to take advantage of the full 12bits from your raw files?
Cant media encoder now do Prores on windows??
I just convert straight into ProRes with the Adobe Encoder. It's 10 bit, and you can choose 422 or 444 with a decent bitrate. It also looks exactly the same as the raw footage.
Was just womdering why wouldn't he convert to prores 444 or 422?
have you tested the file sizes between the transcoded prores and the original raw file? The pro res ends up being bigger than the pro res... seems pointless as I can edit the raw and the prores exactly the same
@@tomaszmachnik Prores 422 is a lot smaller than cine raw lite.
What is the point of shooting in RAW, if you converted everything to intermediate codec?
Easier to work with in post, smaller file size yet still a high quality file to be able to push your grade. TV broadcast companies demand a 10bit workflow, RAW is just too intense for many computers so taking this extra step makes it so much easier to work with in post.
Eh ada mas gun😂
Because the only other option on the c200 is a 420 8-bit MP4/XFAVC
I knew. Really sucks. Anyway, converting via Davinci Resolve seems faster to me.
Too bad the company is garbage, I won't support RED.
Hey Armando, Great Stuff. Here is a tip for you.
Just do Ctrl+A on the videos you have imported and just left click on any output location. Once you choose it, it will automatically do it for any number of videos.
And the same thing goes for presets too. You don't have to drag preset to the video one by one.
It's a 2 years old trick I found out accidentally. Cheers!
I was thinking this the whole video haha. Or just click on the top file, hold shift and click on the bottom file. all changes apply to all files
Not sure if this is new but With the c200 you can get 4k 10 bit internal by recording in RAW at 60fps. You can then export your 60fps video into a 24fps video or work in a 24fps timeline but it won't be as smooth as recording in camera 24fps. Not as ideal but its an option. The 60 fps files are still pretty massive tho.
This was what I was thinking. People keep saying you can’t record in 10 bit but I read the manual and seems you can at 60p
Man you're making me want a C200..
It's my favorite camera!
Same for me! And I can’t even afford a Canon M50 :/
i dont even make videos, dont have a camera and nothing but here i am watching this.
i watched five minutes and then i decided that i wanted a new keyboard so im on to the next video.
Appreciate the support 👊🏼
I don't even have the internet and yet here I am
Great video man the next time I rent this camera I’ll for sure have to try out this work flow. Still on the fence on buying it but it really is a great camera.
Hey bro thanks for stopping by, it's a great camera for sure!
Are you using GoPro CineForm because you are on a PC? If us Mac users transcode to ProRes 422 10bit it will work just as well correct? For that matter do you know if it is possible to transcode to ProRes Raw? I feel like that might be a long shot...
I second this question
Well, this video is more like a Tutorial how to use Media Encoder... :D There are some problems with your workflow that I know. Because your CF-Card isn´t always connected, the encoder won´t find your drive and maybe delets the watchfolder (no risk, but interupts). It works just with one card at a time, u manuallly have to start AME and Look for encoding-errors and so on.
What I would suggest is using the import-tool in premiere. In premiere you Import the Footage and premiere will show you any problems and anything else. You can use the same AME-preset (or a smaller one would be more rational) to use as a proxy to edit your video. For everything colour-related u can toggle the proxy-switch and premiere will use the original raw Files, also to encode the final video.
You can also change the encode and folder output settings for your files in bulk by just selecting them all before you click the dropdown.
Armando... I'm loving that shirt!
Thanks man!
This was awesome, thank you, Armando.
This was actually supper insightful. Such an interesting workflow, thanks for sharing!
WOW! This is amazing thank you :)
Thanks for this! I just found your channel and this is good stuff. My C200 and I thank you. :)
Good job man! Loved the detail in every step.
Where's the *Notification Squuaddd at?* 😁
I don’t know how I’m just seeing this now 🤦♂️
I’m going to do something similar with all my Dji footage. Gracias Armando!
Its me Rykko again.... #NOTIFICATIONSQUAD!
Video is crisp tho...
Thank you so very much for the tutorial Armando! It was extremely clear and helpful, and the best that I could find on CZcams. The only problem I'm having is the rendering speed. I'm using brand new custom built PC. It has an intel i7-8700k CPU, 32 GB RAM, 8GB graphic card. For a 5-minute long clip , it's taking an hour. What should I do to maximize rendering speed? Thanks
Imagine making everything you did in this video automated... That would be so cool
I don't think you should use the "maximum render quality" button in AME. What this switch actually does is a legacy version of CPU processing - rather than the GPU - so slower and no real improvement and I have seen it glitch with certain codecs (most notably skipping frames going to MPEG2). Basically when AME was limited to CPU only processing this would analyse more data for more accurate motion estimation and use a superior (but slower) scaling algorithm - really only useful for going from HD to SD. I would try the same file with Cuda and see if you can see any difference..
Great video! But why don't you compare the size of the RAW and 10bit file? Thats what the video is all about right? - Making smaller files.
dido, nice video I am curious the size difference
@@bobbypitts, very curious if you found the answer on this. I looked on the comments, but didn't see an answer. That would be the number one thing I'm curious about. Thanks!!
no i dont believe so :) @@sdm2
Saweeet! 👏
Quick question. Why did you choose GoPro Cineform over Apple ProRes 422? Doesn't ProRes also 422 10 bit and easier to work with on Apple machines.
maybe because he work with a PC? i don"t know... Pro Res will be my 1st choice even Apple Pro Res 444
I'm curious about the RAW...
1) Can you edit the raw in premiere?
2) What controls do you have in RAW video other than temperature/hue/exposure?
Yes you can edit in premiere.
You cam also change the gamma and color science along with the others in premiere.
In resolve you can also,change the highlights, shadows, gain, lift, mid and vibrance, but you loose the ability to change gamma and color science.
Thats about all you get in RAW - with the exception of Canon LUTS, but keep in mind - in RAW its non destructive to the image, so if you're recording mp4 or some other format you will see the footage break in color grading much sooner - at least in raw you can push your footage very hard and get pleasing results.
Maybe you've done one in the past, but do a video on your editing computer!
👍🏼
Can you do one working with proxies?
Thanks Armando for these video. Cristal clear :) From your experience, would you have an idea (approximate) how long it takes for a Macbook Pro M1 16GB ram to transcode a card of 256 GB (30 min of recording?) from Canon Raw LT to ProRes 422 10bit?
Awesome
Mr Ferreira: It seems to me that you are doing a ten bit conversion the hard way. Why make a conversion when the camera outputs 4:2:2 10 bit thru the sdi port? Use an external recorder. Its not cheaper but a lot less hassle.
SDI is 2K only not 4K
The camera shoots 10bit and 12bit 444 directly to the C-fast card, dont need any external recorders ;)
Armando, are you 100% sure that it is possible to get 10-bit 4:2:2 recording from the Canon C-200?
I am currently "up in the air" as to purchasing a 4K cinema camera: Canon C200 or Panasonic AU-EVA1.
Personally, I am a Canon enthusiast; however, it is a real bummer that I am not able to get 10-bit from C200.
Thank you in advance for your reply.
With the c200 you can get 4k 10 bit internal by recording in RAW at 60fps. The files are still pretty massive tho.
@@milumedia1852 only 60fps??
When you customize the export settings, what would be the ideal bit rate?
Would it be possible to record 10 bit 4K files on an external recorder like the Shogun Inferno or similar?
I know this video is part of the past and you are now on planet C500 :)
I think Shotgun Inferno only records 8-bit from 4K files
@@East87thStreetNYC oh fool me! sorry about that.
Love your videos thank you so much. How did you insert your SSD card? what brand do you use, and What dock works best, I am hearing a lot of negative reviews on ATOMOS usb c dock. does usbc make the transfer faster? or is an older generation more reliable?
Awesome stuff, thanks Armando. When you record RAW/RAW Lite from the C200 is it not already 10 or 12 bit??
Rory M. 12 bit
Amando, love you videos! Why choose Cineform over DNxHR? I've always thought that if you're PC, you do DNxHR/HD, just as if you're Mac, you do ProRes...
Great tip! Do you have a recommended work flow for the GH5 with transferring over the 8bit 60fps or would you just leave the file as is? I'm looking for smoother editing, yet keeping quality. Thank you!
Yes, I know a lot of people with GH5 that do this, in fact I learned it from someone who owns a GH5 and since has worked great! You should try it and let me know what you think?
I will have to give it a shot. Thanks!
#ArmandoFerreira Great video, a lot of content creators seem to be doing this for not just raw camera recordings, but it also seems to work great when converting from MKV to Go Pro Cineform as well. I think it's because the codec itself, keeps the quality of the recording.
Have you ever used an external recorder connected with SDI to capture 2K DCI 10-bit 422? I know the camera is capable, but I haven't seen any example footage.
Thanks!
Thanks for your great videos on the C200. I've been testing the raw conversion on my system and have question about file sizes. I'm using davinci to convert the raw file from the cfast card and outputting it as 10 bit cineform. The file this produces is twice the size of the original raw file. I've been under the assumption that you would get a significantly smaller file. What should my expectations be regarding this? Thanks!!
old man here in september 2022: pondering about buying a cine video camera (my first digital, as my 32-year old Canon SLR has died) I was wondering if, 2 years on, these issues have been fixed?
Why not convert to Cineform 12 bit, and keep everything 12 bit? Thanks.
Nowadays is there any reason to shoot RAW to then transcode to pro res or cineform? Seems like you’d be losing the raw editing latitude? Or I could be wrong.
Hi Armando, Thank you for the great video. I recently picked up a C200 and I'm looking for great workflow tips like this one. Just out of curiosity. Why don't you edit in the RAW 12 bit file so that you have more color space and then convert to 10 bit in the final export?
Doug Birnbaum I actually do edit in RAW I did this guide more for people who don't have the luxury to save a lot of RAW data
@@mondobytes Got it. Thanks again for all the great info.
Hi Armando thank you for the video! I edit with a mac pro laptop (mostly gh5 10 bit footage) and usually don't work with large files will this workflow help? I'll be shooting with a C200 soon and want to make sure I can edit smoothly on my laptop..! Thanks
Hello Armando Canon c200 its almost the same with panasonic GH5S ! THE ONLY BAD ON Panasonic is autofocus that so
Micro Doulo AF and Sensor size as well the lack of ports like native xlr in build in ND filter. A lot more than just the bad AF
Why not simply use a more standard codec like ProRes? Also isn't "use max render quality" only necessary when you have different resolutions?
FD this was recorded before you can export to Prores on a PC
@@mondobytes ah, remember those days - didn't check the timestamp
Hey Armando, whats the difference in file size between the RAW and exported 10 bit files? Thanks
brilliant video & explanation. How did you do the transition at 9:05, it's fantastic & are your log presets you show at 7:34 available for download / testing?
It's from a transition pack I bought a while ago, I'l have to look up the name, not in front of the computer. I'm working on releasing a LUT package soon, stay tuned for that.
@@mondobytes great video! thank you for sharing! can you share the transition pack you used for this video? thank you!
The color seems a tad different from RAW and Cineform. Not that it bothers be, I'm just wondering why? Is it because of the compression of the bit depth from 12bit to 10bit?
Because 12bit RAW has more information than 10Bit 4:2:2. It's so small that nobody will tell unless you're looking at it side by side and even then it's ever so slightly that it can be adjusted with color correction to match perfect.
I like the idea of doing this but I would really like to fix color temp and exposure before going to Cineform. How would I do this?
Honestly unless you severely over exposed or under exposed and your white balance is way off with 10bit you can really push the colors using your NLE of choice.
Thank you so much for sharing the video, this video made me to subscribe to your channel.
A quick but important question. Do you really think there's no difference in image quality when you place REC709ish LUT before or after the transcoding the RAW to ProRes?
I have an upcoming documentary project that I plan to buy C200 to shoot RAW but I can't handle the big file sizes. Should I just convert to clog2/3 as it is to Prores then to grade OR put basic LUT(e.g. clog to rec709) during the transcoding process?
I'd really appreciate if you could help me to answer the question. Thank you.
Any difference? I’m in your shoes now
Hi Armando when i try dropping the files in media encoder on my pc it comes up with an error message: File could not be imported. File format is not supported. Any clues how to get round this? Am using a PC and the files are CRM from my Cfast card. Many thanks
Hi! Does the 10 Bit via Hdmi afford the 60/120p high frame rate options?
So I just converted my raw files with your method to mov. But they are the same size, more or less (a lot). And the original raw-files are just as smooth playing back as the new mov-10bit-files in Premiere...remind me again...why am I doing this?
we like wasting your time
Can Also explain Best Color export setting for CZcams upload
Noman Khawaja I just use the default CZcams 4K in Premiere
What about ProRes on Mac, can you do this in the same manner?
what if its shot 8bit.. mp4 or other 8bit format ?? possible ?
the C200 records 8bit and RAW.
But is there a way to record 10bit with an external recorder?
Sadly no 🙁
@@mondobytes I dont get it ? I see 10 bit written all over the place here? c200 external recording. www.4kshooters.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Canon-C200-Output-Chart-e1496335001543.jpg
I just confirmed with a Canon Rep that indeed outputs a 2k and 1080 422 10bit signal from SDi and HDMI. The SDI can output a cropped 4k at 422 8bit. Sooo if you want 4k 10bit, yes you need to records Raw and render in post.
Hey is there anywhere to download raw files to play with?
Could you do this transcode with Apple Compressor? Cheers.
laughingboy9000 I don’t use compressor, but I doubt it because I know FCPX doesn’t support Canon RAW
how is this possible in resolve?
More important question, where'd you get that shirt???
LOL Wife got it for me, I think she bought it at Target.
So which has better image quality the C200 or the Sigma fp
C200
I just recently bought my C200 and have a totally noob question as it's the first time that I shoot in Light Raw format. So I apologize in advance if my question is stupid, but I really don't know the answer and there lies my true ignorance on the matter. She put, when transcoding the original Light Raw files from the C200 into another format for easier editing such as ProPes or 10 bit 4:2:2, are the actual properties of the Raw file lost (aka it's ability of high-latitude color grading and correction) or is the file still kept as an actual Raw with the same properties of the original file even though the size becomes much smaller after the transcoding? Thanks again for the info :)
Android you lose the RAW capabilities, however it's still highly flexible for editing. The key is as long as you shot everything properly you shouldn't have a problem.
Got it Armando, thanks so much for your prompt reply and the video tutorial. You rock! :)
I was just thinking, isn't that a little unsafe though? I don't know the technology behind cfast cards, but at least with SD cards they are a lot less reliable than a HDD or SSD, and the card failing during during transcode wouldn't be great. Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't it be better to simply copy the files to the local storage first?
Raeef Islam I was thinking the same thing. SSDs have WAY less read/rights in their life span than HDD, so I would off-put my CRM files to HDD first and do it from there. Because those C-Fast cards.... $$$$$$$$! More the, but less wear and tear on your pricier items.
You can copy them over, if it makes you feel better. I haven't experienced any issues at all, in fact sometimes I edit from the CFast card directly, I don't think it's as unsafe as you think, it's pretty reliable IMO.
Raeef Islam, what kind of bizarre logic are you using while attempting a thing called "thinking"? If you encode a file from the CFast card... or if you copy a file to your local drive from the CFast card, it does not make any difference because both of them have accomplished exactly the same thing. Both of them *read the file* from the CFast card. Oh no, god-forbid, reading the file from the card, could that be unsafe lol!?! Whether you re-encode the file to another location, or you copy the file to another location, the file *still has to be read from the card.* Reading a file from the card is not going to magically damage the card because the computer becomes aware that you're encoding a file. The heat from the CPU doesn't go out of the computer into the card, or something.
Zangeef Fangsteen lol no. When you copy the data from the card to another location you read it once and that's it. When you're editing off of the card you read the data on the card multiple times because you'll be scrubbing through or closing and opening the project over days, which necessarily puts extra strain on the card.
And that's not what I was talking about anyways, I was referring to the reliability of the cards. You don't want your storage to stop working halfway through an edit and the way that HDDs have a lower chance of failing than an SSD (or at least the older ones, new SSDs are really reliable), I was asking whether cfast cards pose a similar concern (seems like they don't)
He's not editing off the card, duh. Maybe try actually watching the video. I also did not say anything about editing off of the card, can you read? I said re-encode the file to another location which is what this CZcams video is about and which is what we're talking about in the first place. You are very confused.
👍
I know this video is 2 years old... But whenever I transcode C200 raw files to 4444 or 422 or gopro 10bit I end up with a bigger file size than the original Raw File. Anyone have any ideas on how to transcode to shrink the file size while maintaining a decent amount of information?
Any luck?
Anyone notice the ten bit was frozen on his playback. Lmao.
Convert from what? From 12-bit 422, or from the 8-bit?
From the 12bit RAW 444 ofcourse.
Do you have a link to the studio log 2 luts?
Why not just record prores 422 10bit out over the HDMI to an Atomos? That seems like the quickest & simplest solution.
Jamie Tannock the C200 doesn't support it! Only in 1080p.
Cause that outputs at 1080p not 4K
Because Canon doesn't let you 😡
@@mondobytes Thought I read you could do an external recorder at 2k 422 10bit with it.
Tony Boutwell right 2k but not 4K which is what I film with.
Has Adobe been able to recognize the raw light file on the c200, the last time I had some footage, it still didn't recognize the file type. And why not use proxies with the raw instead of down converting to 10 bit?
Yes, Adobe can recognize .CRM files. Because if you use proxies now you've trippled your storage. The purpose is to save storage while still maintaining a high quality easy to work with file that can still be pushed in post.
Armando Ferreira a very good point! And that's great to hear about Adobe, it was very difficult when it could not recognize.
Why Cineform? Why not ProRes 422HQ?
Matthew MacCarthy at the time of filming Premiere didn’t support Prores on a PC
Só por curiosidade. Você é brasileiro?
But is it really a 10 bit just because you unconverted it.
It is because you're taking a 12bit RAW file and converting it down into a 10bit format, the information is there.
However Cinema RAW Light already does 10 and 12 bit right ?
Armando Ferreira I forgot you were shooting in raw and that is a 12 bit file lol I was thinking you were trying to convert an 8 bit to 10 bit lol my bad.
What log are you recording in? I find that CLOG3 has odd colours? Yours looks really flat!
Is there a way to do something similar with Compressor and FCPX?
I'm pretty sure there is, I don't use FCPX or compressor but I'm certain they must have something similar, I'll ask to see if there is.
It happens automatically if you select "create optimised media" on import. Additionally, you can choose to create proxy media too, if you so choose. In both cases FCPX creates either a ProRes 422 file or a ProRes Proxy file (or both if both is selected).
@@AndreeMarkefors but in fcpx is that optimized pro res 8bit/422 or 10bit/422? thanks in advance. thumbs up.
smalltalk.productions There is no such thing as 8-bit ProRes-they are all 10 or 12 bit. But if you transcode 8-bit files they won’t magically become 10-bit, of course. They will be 8-bit files wrapped in a 10-bit codec. The file format is 10-bit for ProRes 422 and 422 HQ. in FCPX you can set your preferred ProRes flavor for optimized media. Default is ProRes 422.
Theres no difference in 8bit c200 4k and your10 bit when your going to youtube or BD or dvd, so why shoot RAW, although you would the color depth, unless you dont have a corasponding 10bit vid card and a 10 bit monitor which you prob, dont. But nice try...
Can he make hdr videos if he shoots 10 bit raw ?
i would say no i think you might need 12bit to output to hdr ive never had hdr in mind when i shoot because my final out is usually BD and my clients dont have hdr compatible TV's, also I think if your wanting to end up with an HDR like look, its best to shoot in raw 12bit 24 fps ( canon c200) that way you get the most color information, then edit.the more you compress your original raw video the less Dynamic range you end up with.
This was awesome, thank you, Armando.